What's My Line? - G-T Game Show Hosts; PANEL: Sue Oakland, Mark Goodson (Jul 16, 1967)

MYSTERY GUEST: Allen Ludden, Gene Rayburn, Ed McMahon, & Bud Collyer
PANEL: Sue Oakland, Mark Goodson, Arlene Francis, Bennett Cerf
NOTE: The following week's program is considered lost (Jul 23, 1967).
Many thanks to Steve M. Russo for providing this episode in much higher quality than the version I had previously. Folks interested in high quality, well packaged, well-edited DVDs of WML (and other game shows) can contact him directly for more information at [e-mail].
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[@stevenjoyal6565]

Wonderful to see Johnny Olsen acknowledged, as well!

[@geraldkatz7986]

Nice to know he would continue on gloriously with The Price Is Right.

[@dcasper8514]

Mark Goodson had something against Johnny Olson.

[@cathyschlang8042]

😅😅😅😅😅😅 PPP your mom

[@robertsprouse9282]

@@dcasper8514, yes, Johnny put peanut butter in his chocolate.

[@scottpardee6303]

The Good Humor girl was a pre-Med student majoring economics. Two fields that don’t overlap.

[@VahanNisanian]

This is the last appearance of Sue Oakland on the panel, though she would continue to appear on the Syndicated revival (just unfortunate we can't see her green dress here). I really liked Sue Oakland. And like I said, she was kinda cute.

[@Juliaflo]

+Vahan Nisanian She worked as a television editorialist under the name Sue Cott.

[@jvcomedy]

+Vahan Nisanian On this particular show she is introduced as "beautiful and talented". She is beautiful, however, nobody seems to know what the hell her talent is.

[@neilmidkiff]

@@Juliaflo In fact, Mark Goodson calls her Miss Cott during the introductions.

[@preppysocks209]

@@neilmidkiff yes, and she quickly tells him to refer to her as Oakland

[@stevekru6518]

Vahan, if Sue is “kinda cute,” as opposed to drop-dead gorgeous, please let me know where you out!

[@dianemutchler9213]

I shake my head, where as usual, Bennett protests AFTER the octopus segment is over about the shell, since he's an expert in his mind on - everything. Amazing! Those two men were the experts. Here's the official Yes, they have a shell: "Its shell is inside of its body. Its shell has chambers and the shell has even evolved to protect its brain. That protection is an advantage. It's also an advantage for the octopus to have the shell inside of the body."

[@jacquelinebell6201]

I like Bennett but sometimes he was a bit stubborn/know all about some things.

[@gilliankew]

What was a good humor girl?

[@sandrageorge3488]

They are women and men who served good humor ice cream.

[@neilmidkiff]

In my opinion, Arlene herself is the real Good Humor Girl of all time.

[@loissimmons6558]

Unfortunately with the impending demise of the original version of WML, she would also be a Goodbye Girl. But she would return.

[@alexhu7939]

Neil Midkiff Agree!

[@watchman1178]

Arlene certainly brought the "star power" to this show. The other regulars were terrific, but they were primarily journalists (Daly, Kilgallen) and a businessman (Bennett Cerf). Arlene clearly provided the "star power" on WML, and imo she was the most special of the regular panelists on all of the G/T shows.

[@Lizbethswaner]

@@loissimmons6558 o hi hi hi

[@robertsprouse9282]

Droll, Flintstone, very droll..

[@Starrman69]

What a Show! Enjoyed watching...All of these great personalities are sadly missed....

[@TruckTaxiMoveIt]

A major wave of nostalgia seeing all of those game show hosts -- this shows gave me literal years of wholesome and intelligent enjoyment, thank you

[@robertdiotalevi285]

👍

[@savannahr3236]

Love these episodes! Always fun to watch WML before sleep. Thanks for uploading them!

[@WhatsMyLine]

Savannah R My pleasure-- glad you're enjoying the videos. :)

[@shirleyrombough8173]

Savannah R - How sad that the program came to an end, as all things must. Arleen remains beautiful as ever. How sad that Dorothy Kilgallen had to leave the way she did.

[@greggg2301]

I would have thought that signature laugh of Gene Rayburn & Ed McMahon wouldve given them away at 19:00

[@ericloiselle]

Mystery guest usually never makes it through all the questions. Great episode!

[@rayizard5687]

Johnny Olson also originated the famous "Come on down!"

[@deejay8403]

I wonder if Johnny ever trademarked that phrase (like Michael Buffer did with “Let’s get ready to rumble,” and Pat Riley with “threepeat.”).

[@billgreen1861]

This was a very special occasion because I got to see them all in one place. Thank you for sharing I try to watch at least one show a day it brings me back to my childhood. And it's so much fun to watch also feels like I'm watching for the first time. Thanks again.

[@wilkiecoco]

As the years role on, you could see the panel's gradual discomfort with modern culture, from the introduction of "that Rock and Roll" to their clear discomfort with miniskirts. If anyone asks for a definition of the term "Generation Gap" they should be referred to this show.

[@karenenderle532]

Everyone who had anything to do with this show were definitely part of the "greatest generation" and it showed exactly why we refer to them as that!

[@dinahbrown902]

And look what we’ve become in 2022😢

[@mtnman6557]

Given the date of this episode, rock-n-roll had been a round for a while & was nothing new. Of course fashions, etc. had changed, but that's true throughout time. People from earlier generations are usually not fond of the new ways, but that's only natural. As a 72 yr old, I think buying jeans w/ rips & holes already in them is stupid & I thought society would have dropped this fashion as it did the miniskirt. Both fashions are not practical. *also, to 1 degree or another, there's always a gap between generations

[@WhatsMyLine]

If there was any doubt at all how Bennett and John really felt about Henry Morgan's outburst in the prior show, their exchange during the goodnights in this episode should settle any doubt.

[@16Lizards]

Whoa! Right you are! All of it contained right in JCD's body language after Bennett's comment.

[@WhatsMyLine]

Jay Bee Well, I think it should be duly noted that all you heard was Henry Morgan's side of it. . . Presumably his ex wife would have had a very different story to tell.

[@royharris7299]

What's My Line? Well, you certainly got my curiosity piqued. What was there in the exchange, that was not on the "televised" version?

[@WhatsMyLine]

Roy Harris Sorry, I don't understand the question. I never made reference to anything that happened outside of the "televised version". Really don't know what you mean.

[@royharris7299]

What's My Line? Ok, I guess I should have watched the prior show, before I opened my mouth. I guess I still can.

[@alskndlaskndal]

It's really starting to feel like the end. I'm going to miss having a new WML waiting for me every day. I'm going to enjoy and appreciate every moment of the remaining shows.

[@bophreyhumgart2953]

Well, every time I go to KZbin, there's another show I haven't seen. IS there an end?? And by the way, I didn't realize that Ed McMahon had ever hosted a game show.

[@RikardPeterson]

This was the first time they referenced the end, wasn't it? (And to Bophrey - this channel has them all in playlists sorted by date, so you can watch them in order. That's what I'm doing, so soon I'll have seen them all. Not counting the "lost episodes" of course.)

[@loissimmons6558]

+Rikard Peterson Yes, this is the first time the end was directly referenced, although they skirted around it a bit for a few weeks now.

[@davidsanderson5918]

Bophrey Humgart If you go in chronological order, there is. I'm in the home straight now having started at 1950.

[@jacquelinebell6201]

I only up to 62 in my watching. I just watch the occasional one further ahead occasionally.

[@megamanj2004X]

I noticed how Johnny Olsen mentions that he couldn't announce on Password with Allen Ludden due to conflicting schedules with already being tied to the other three hosts' shows (Collyer on Truth, Rayburn on Match Game and Ed Mc Mahon on Snap Judgment). Although Johnny Olsen would finally get to work with Allen Ludden on a few weeks of Password Plus in 1979 and 1980, subbing for Gene Wood.

[@galileocan]

One thing I have to say about Bennett is that he was very worldly. Whenever he would learn of where a contestant came from, it would often cause him to ask a question about something specific to their home city or area. He was very knowledgeable about business and products and where they come from

[@ivangranger8494]

z 🤔

[@jackkomisar458]

He was certainly worldly. He did a lot of traveling for business and pleasure. When he was introduced, he would often be described as having just returned from somewhere or about to go somewhere.

[@lynettepalecek3141]

Yes. He was very intelligent and witty. He wrote a book 📖 and he wrote a dictionary. They were both published.

[@GOLDVIOLINbowofdeath]

He was an idiot trying to show off his knowledge from traveling everywhere to get paid for speaking. His hunches of occupation based on where they came from were always wrong.

[@GOLDVIOLINbowofdeath]

@@lynettepalecek3141 of course his books were published. He was a book publisher.

[@jacquelinebell6201]

This is the first time Ive heard them say on air that it was finishing. Sad. At least well be able to go back and watch them again and again.

[@termtech1]

Sue oakland smokin!!!!

[@VahanNisanian]

Johnny Olson made one more cameo on the original WML on the series finale.

[@dcasper8514]

Vahan Nisanian. Johnny. Olsen & Mark Goodson. were not friendly

[@danielyoung6630]

LONGEST PRIME TIME GAME SHOW 1949 - 1967 WOW !

[@VahanNisanian]

I cannot stress enough how much I love Goodson-Todman Productions. Even when Mark Goodson was slowly winding down in the 80's (following Bill Todman's death), many of his games were still great, despite most of them being revivals. My favorites were "Body Language" (revival of "Showoffs"), "Super Password" (revival of "Password" and "Password Plus"), "Card Sharks" (w/Bob Eubanks on daytime and Bill Rafferty in Syndication), "The Price is Right" (Syndication w/Tom Kennedy), "Classic Concentration" (revival of "Concentration"), "Family Feud" (w/Ray Combs), and "To Tell The Truth" (Originally with Gordon Elliott, and then with Lynn Swann, and then eventually with Alex Trebek). "Blockbusters" (w/Bill Rafferty) was alright, but I didn't like how they got rid of the player vs. solo player gimmick.

[@allenjones3130]

I've enjoyed the Goodson/Todman game shows over the years. I particularly enjoyed "Match Game" and "Showoffs". Joyce Bulifant appeared on both shows, and she was a great comedienne.

[@robertsprouse9282]

Ed McMahon was not on SNAP JUDGMENT very long. It did not last long, just two seasons on NBC DAYTIME. ED was too busy with CARSON and the ratings fizzled after a solid start. In the end the format was changed and SNAP J. was more like PASSWORD than S.JUDGMENT was in its original form. As a kid back then, I never watched it. In fact, until now, I never knew it was on. I don't think they showed it in Houston.

[@alanh.3494]

Thank you for uploading this show. RIP everyone seen on camera.

[@comedyshorts2]

I was overseas 1967-9. Glad to see what I missed

[@usermikes]

Bud Collyer's ..TV Show was " Beat The Clock"..back in the early 1950's...I remember having the game as a kid..Good old days..

[@VahanNisanian]

The Mystery Guest segment is a must see for any game show fan. The four top Game Show hosts on Goodson-Todman programs, outside of WML. Steve Allen isn't there, probably because "I've Got a Secret" had been cancelled.

[@rmelin13231]

AND do not omit the legendary Johnny Olson.

[@jacquelinebell6201]

They'll probably be saving Steve for later shows too. He was a permanent panellist for quite a long time, and a regular visitor.

[@Beson-SE]

Too bad Bennett didn't finish his joke about the nearsighted octopus who fell in love with a scotch bagpipe.... 11:23

[@savethetpc6406]

Johan Bengtsson I think that was pretty much it! (*Edit:* I thought he was giving the punchline ahead of the joke, but upon rewatching that clip, perhaps you're right that there was more to it.)

[@savethetpc6406]

Johan Bengtsson Here ya go, Johan. If any variation of these is what Bennett was thinking of, I think it's just as well that John stopped him. Even the *least* crude tellings I came across with this quick search don't quite seem suitable for 1960s television -- especially not "What's My Line"! ;) search.yahoo.com/search;_ylt=A0LEV1oQggdVOj0A66NXNyoA;_ylc=X1MDMjc2NjY3OQRfcgMyBGZyA3VzaC1tYWlsbl8wMgRncHJpZANxc25MMkRSWFRyeThSMm84RUxsS0FBBG5fcnNsdAMwBG5fc3VnZwM0BG9yaWdpbgNzZWFyY2gueWFob28uY29tBHBvcwMwBHBxc3RyAwRwcXN0cmwDBHFzdHJsAzM0BHF1ZXJ5A2pva2Ugb2N0b3B1cyBpbiBsb3ZlIHdpdGggYmFncGlwZXMEdF9zdG1wAzE0MjY1ODIwMDE-?p=joke+octopus+in+love+with+bagpipes&fr2=sb-top-search&fr=ush-mailn_02

[@Beson-SE]

SaveThe TPC Thanks! Imagine there are web sites with octopus jokes! :) Some jokes were quite funny. :)

[@maynardsmoreland]

When I was a teen in the late 70s, I started listening to old radio shows broadcast nightly on a local station. One of the first comedies I listened to was a 1946 ABC episode of The Henry Morgan Show. I enjoyed it very much...it offered a contrast to his WML behavior. He became widely known for jabs at sponsors...here are examples... kzbin.info/www/bejne/jXvVl5J3npJ9qJI

[@4UStevePerry]

Ed has such a distinctive laugh. I thought they would get it when he did that.

[@andysiegel6131]

Although Bennet is old enough to be Great Grandfather he is my favorite.

[@16Lizards]

I hate seeing this all the time: NOTE: The following week's program is considered lost (Jul 23, 1967).

[@jacquelinebell6201]

There's been a few lost in 1967.

[@MusicMan-dv7jg]

24:10. Bennet and John are still angry about Henry Morgan who was on the previous week. Henry was rude to Bennet. kzbin.info/www/bejne/eKiYoYmghMtja8k

[@bjmajor]

One of my favorite game shows, ever!

[@tjbnyc76]

We know that Arlene was on the board of directors of Bonwit Teller, so it makes sense that she gets a plug in for the store during the closing credits; but I wonder what deal Sue Oakland had going on with Oscar de la Renta. I wonder if she got her gorgeous gowns discounted or gratis in exchange for the plug.

[@kelloggs5473]

I didn’t notice Arlene Francis mentioning Bonwit Teller. On another episode she might have. Indeed, she was on the board of directors.

[@maureengauvin1768]

Most likely the couture gowns were “loaned” to the panelist in exchange for the mention of the designer. Even in the late ‘60’s couture gowns sold for several thousand dollars each, making the “gifting” of the item unsustainable week to week.

[@orzelgryf]

So... Only a couple episodes left and then what? Uploading old episodes? The revival? The end of uploading? I'm addicted I love seeing one new ep before go to bed :(

[@WhatsMyLine]

I'll be posting the last remaining missing episode, from 1963, then the WML at 25 special, and then April will be a month of WML-related extras. After that, I'll be replacing videos with a/v problems, or that are incomplete, or to add back in original commercials. There should be new daily uploads through at least May, but well before that, I plan on launching a channel for the nighttime "To Tell the Truth".

[@orzelgryf]

What's My Line? Thanks for the answer. I stiil have a few older shows to watch, and then maybe To Tell the Truth will be as good as WML. I don't know, I know almost nothing about your older TV shows, cause I'm from Europe.

[@dancelli714]

Bud Collier is the original Superman on radio.

[@soulierinvestments]

Years before, another resident of Victoria BC perplexed the panel. He was in his 80s and caddied at a golf course.

[@VahanNisanian]

"Snap Judgment" is by far the rarest Goodson-Todman game. No tapes, or even kinescopes, exist of that. And virtually nobody remembers how the game was played. There are a few audio fragments, as well as tons of great pictures of it, but that's about it. This game felt like a variation of "Password", from what little known there is about it. markgoodson.wikia.com/wiki/Snap_Judgment

[@savethetpc6406]

***** Thanks for the info on "Snap Judgment." I don't remember it at all. The bonus round format, as described in the linked article, reminds me a little bit of the bonus round (is that what they call it?) in "Family Feud."

[@bluebear1985]

I think the Encyclopedia of TV Game Shows has a couple of pictures from the set of that show. In one picture it shows McMahon alongside a good friend of his named Johnny Carson. I think I've heard of him before. :)

[@balconi89]

There are lots of color pictures of the set on Getty images.

[@maynardsmoreland]

Almost as rare as "Snap Judgment" are the NYC-based episodes of McMahon's "Tonight Show starring Johnny Carson."

[@Bigbadwhitecracker]

Yes, and I can't think of anything sadder than that, as far as tv history goes

[@musicom67]

24:15 - "I just wish he'd gone to Tilton School - he'd be much better a man". For you publically-schooled j*rkoffs (like Morgan probably was), Daly's elitist quip refers to a upper-crusty boarding school in NH for 9th-12grade Richie Rich kids. In 2015 money, that drains Daddy's Schwab account $47K a school year. I don't think they still teach that Daly-sophisticated dialect there, however.

[@1jamyc]

Over the years, Daly often mentioned the school, which I always thought was a little pompous. This comment was the first time I ever heard JCD say anything nasty about anyone (which was also rather pompous IMO)..

[@richatlarge462]

Bennett: "Could it be used by human beings? ... Might it also be used by children?"

[@rmelin13231]

I caught that too.

[@ToddSF]

Only on what's my line is an octopus a "fish". As to a "shell", well, it doesn't have one. The only hard part of an octopus's body is its beak, made of chitin. A squid has an internal hard structure, known as a cuttlebone, but an octopus doesn't even have that. I think the panel was very much misled here and you'd think the two brothers who fish for octopi would know that it's not a "fish" and it has no shell of anykind. By the way, an octopus is a mollusk -- specifically a cephalopod mollusk.

[@savethetpc6406]

ToddSF 94109 While I agree that the panel was misled about both the nature of octopi and their classification, I also feel a somewhat satisfied sense of closure regarding the whole "crustacean controversy" that has had several commenters on this channel in an uproar for months. I know it's not accurate, but at least we finally have an explanation, from the mouth of John Charles Daly himself, of the WML "terms of reference" that allow them to include crustaceans, mollusks, cephalopods, etc. in the general "fish" category. What a relief! ;) Of course, I just *had* to do some additional research about the Octopus on my own and found this web page: animals.about.com/od/molluscs/a/octopus-facts.htm, which includes the following information (and much more): "There are about 300 species of octopuses (Octopoda) alive today. Theses species are are divided into two groups, the Cirrina and the Incirrina. *The Cirrina (also known as the finned, deep-sea octopuses) are characterized by having two fins on their head and a small internal shell.*" I don't know if the McGuire brothers worked with Cirrina or not, but apparently there are some octopi that have some type of shell.

[@loissimmons6558]

This was also one of a number of times that the panel would seize upon one of the least important elements of someone's service or product and go down a rabbit trail, despite John's best efforts to steer them away from it. In the early years of the program he was quite content to lead them down the trail, but in later years he generally stayed away from that except for the Mystery Guest segments where the panel usually had an advantage going into the round of knowing who was in town, etc.

[@VahanNisanian]

This is the first time Gene Rayburn, Ed McMahon, and Bud Collyer have been on this show. Gene Rayburn made two appearances on the panel, and was also seen frequently on the Syndicated era of WML, including the first taping day in July 1968, along with Soupy Sales, Arlene Francis, and Meredith MacRae.

[@dizzyology7514]

Don't you mean Allen Ludden who appeared on the panel?

[@VahanNisanian]

dizzyology No, the first taping day of the new WML had Gene Rayburn on the panel.

[@dizzyology7514]

***** Oops -- sorry, missed the word Syndicated.

[@RikardPeterson]

Interesting about the octopus' shell! I didn't know that their ancestors had shells, that they still have remnants of. I've learnt something today!

[@BrettCrawfordTransgirl1984]

Yes, they did. Orthocones did.

[@preppysocks209]

Everything I have read says that an octopus does not have a shell. Bennett was right for once -- he really was misled. You would think John's research for each guest would bring him up to speed on something like this.

[@nancymilawski1048]

@@preppysocks209 the original question was phrased to ask something hard on them and they have a horn. John tried to steer them away from assuming shell.

[@georgemurphy2579]

Respectable applause...perhaps an occasional whistle ... but none of the classless hoots and screams from an obstreperous trashy audience. Great days!

[@soulierinvestments]

Wow. "Try and STop Me" in 600 newspapers. Boggles the mind what that did to humor and on such a big scale.

[@manidig]

"Try And Stop Me" was also the title of a book Bennett Cerf wrote-- a collection of anecdotes-- mostly humorous. He also wrote "The Life Of The Party" and "Shake Well Before Using."

[@veronicaguido7790]

So miss that era. When people actually cared for one another. And technology had not taken hold.

[@veronicaguido7790]

Z, not gullible. This program was bring in a new era, and during this time, there was NOT all this hate and turmoil in and out of the streets.

[@davidsoulier6375]

The second to last live broadcast of Sunday night WML. This accounts for Goodson''s appearance . The episodes of 23 July to last week of August were videotaped earlier in 1967.

[@googoo-gjoob]

Mr. Goodson said there were 8 more shows...

[@benfranklin9292]

@@googoo-gjoob He didn't say they were live shows though.

[@googoo-gjoob]

@@benfranklin9292 pretty certain they were ALL live.

[@benfranklin9292]

@@googoo-gjoob Not all the shows were live. The show taped some episodes to air so the crew could take part of the summer off.

[@adamodeo9320]

class and elegance- Arlene was a real lady

[@ChrisHansonCanada]

*_OCTOPUS FISHERMEN_* *_GOOD HUMOR MAN_*

[@lucyflorey9152]

What always made me laugh was that if there were two guests they had to share one chair

[@jmccracken1963]

One last item: "Snap Judgment," which was hosted by Ed McMahon (with Gene Rayburn as occasional substitute), was a new Goodson-Todman game show. It led off NBC's morning line-up of game shows for almost 2 years, airing at 9:00 CT/10:00 AM ET on NBC from 3 April 1967 to 28 March 1968, right after "The Today Show" and before "Concentration." The show ran only 25 minutes, because NBC had a regular 5-minute newscast beginning at 9:25 AM CT/10:25 AM ET during those years. "Password" would continue to run on CBS in daytime until 15 September 1967 - but the weekly prime-time show on CBS had already been cancelled (last aired on 22 May 1967). The original show ran almost 6 years in daytime (first aired on 2 October 1961) and had two separate stints in prime time (2 January 1962 to 9 September 1965 and 25 December 1966 to 22 May 1967) on CBS. "The Match Game" (which premiered on 31 December 1962; the first two celebrity contestants were Arlene Francis and Skitch Henderson) would continue to run in daytime on NBC (weekdays, beginning at 3:00 PM CT/4:00 PM ET) through 26 September 1969. It also ran only 25 minutes, because of - you guessed it! - another NBC 5-minute newscast. The prime time version of "To Tell The Truth" (which premiered on CBS on 18 December 1956) had already been cancelled; the last episode aired on 22 May 1967. The show continued its Monday-through-Friday daytime incarnation (which had premiered on CBS on 18 June 1962, and which aired at 2:00 PM CT/3:00 PM ET); its final daytime episode on CBS aired on 6 September 1968. (Gee: It was on right after "The Art Linkletter Show" and before "The Edge - of Night.")

[@Amolibros]

I think Bud Collyer was the kindest man on tv. I always admired the way he had with the panelists and the guests. He was also a minister I think.

[@Walterwhiterocks]

Not sure about the minister part, but he did have a law degree.

[@RayNDeere]

Not a minister, but was a Sunday school teacher. One time during a snowstorm, a parishioner called and asked Bud if there would be services that day. Bud answered "Oh, yes. God and I are here."

[@jacquelinebell6201]

He was Presbyterian.

[@soulierinvestments]

There it is again. What is it with Mark Goodson's complexion?

[@battlegirldeb]

For the first time since watching the last episodes in the 1967 season I realized that they knew the show would be ending soon. Yes, I'm going back to see the first few seasons again. Really miss Dorothy and her little weenies.

[@soulierinvestments]

Very end. Yeah. Bad feelings between Henry Morgan, John Daly, and Bennett Cerf. Too bad those scenes never got recorded for posterity.

[@savethetpc6406]

soulierinvestments What do you mean? Are there additional scenes from this incident that are missing? Or are you referring to what might have gone on backstage?

[@Bigbadwhitecracker]

you mean What's my Line - The reality show? ;)

[@watchman1178]

Henry Morgan was definitely a curmudgeon of the highest order, but also a very sharp guy. He once went on "To Tell the Truth" as some sort of foreign spy who had defected to America, and he did such a good job that he received all 4 votes. The contestants were wearing a bag over their head, so the panel had no idea it was Henry.

[@bullwilliams6859]

I have heard that octopi have a flexible internal chambered shell to protect their brain

[@gooshala]

Watching old WML's today I came across this episode featuring Sue Oakland who I recognized immediately as Sue Cott who did editorials on WCBS-TV in the 70's. At the time, I thought she was one of the most beautiful women I had ever seen but wondered where the hell she came from!? Looked her up on IMDB today and found out a little more about her but no date of birth. She had a very superior attitude which I found incredibly sexy and actually looked forward to her editorials. It was like God gave her all the intelligence and youthful good looks and she knew it. She had five children with her first husband Mr. Cott who died and she married Mr. Wundermann who I would be willing to bet was the Wundermann of Wundermann, Ricotta and Klein a big advertising agency in New York.

[@garyzerr8134]

This is the best explanation of “Sue Oakland” we’ve heard yet!

[@dizzyology7514]

I have never understood why, throughout the whole run of the show, when there were 2 contestants, they had to share one chair. I would have thought it would be simple for a stagehand to bring out another chair during the sign in procedure. Anybody have any idea why that was never done?

[@WhatsMyLine]

dizzyology It's mentioned in the "WML at 25" special that director Franklin Heller had a special chair made up for the times when there were two contestants at once, in order to keep them within the camera range and properly lit. It does seem really odd, though. How difficult would it really have been to put two chairs right next to each other and pull the camera back a foot?

[@dizzyology7514]

What's My Line? Very strange, especially since the contestants sometimes looked quite unconfortable. I would think that by moving John's chair a bit to his left there would be room to fit two chairs in without significantly affecting the camera range or the lighting. But if Heller went to the trouble of having a special chair made, he was clearly aware of the problem, so there must have been technical factors involved that aren't apparent to us. I'll watch for that discussion on the WML at 25 special.

[@HelloooThere]

By this point, one was able to just sense that the show was losing its steam and ending its run.

[@bluebear1985]

I read something once that Mr. Cerf heard about the show's cancelation in the newspapers, just like everyone else did. The decision must have been made pretty quietly if that was the case.

[@HelloooThere]

@@bluebear1985 Very true and a solemn response, indeed. The sense of depression seemingly set in and it really was a matter of time...until the cancellation...set in ultimately...

[@woodykelleher9253]

Bud Collyer, I believe he was Superman on the radio in the 1940s?

[@soulierinvestments]

You would think G-T would have sprung for six color videotapes of 1967 WML episodes. This one has Mark Goodson, Johnny Olsen, and the last G-T game show moderators and hosts of that period. Arlene and Sue look luscious. You would think G-T would have preserved this in color because of the history of it.

[@musicom67]

Color Quad was costly back in those days - and these were primarily 'safety' copies (as were the kinescopes) - not necessarily meant for replay. G-T wouldn't think something called GSN would surface years later. Don't forget how lots of tapes were erased in this time period (59-75)... Besides, Papa Goodson needed a new pair of shoes after having them figuratively kissed by four men (with Daly it's five).

[@jmccracken1963]

Hindsight is always 20/20, isn't it?

[@mikevanriel7573]

MUSICOM PRODUCTIONS I think even if cable tv and GSN existed in those days, they would still destroy all those Game Shows! Most of them had no value after they aired.

[@neilmidkiff]

Not only was the tape expensive ... the recorder/player machine was a big expensive unit found only in TV studios. VCRs were not yet home or office gear. Why archive in a format for which you couldn't afford a player? Kinescopes were just 16mm film (run at 30fps, I think) so a kine projector would have been a reasonable thing for G-T to own.

[@cor-z8m]

Why weren’t women ever hosts of game shows?

[@VahanNisanian]

A little background on the Goodson-Todman hosts after this episode: The original "Password" came to an end shortly after, but Allen Ludden went on to host other shows, including a 1971-1975 ABC revival, and "Password Plus" for NBC, from 1979 to 1980, when Tom Kennedy took over for him (Ludden died in 1981). Gene Rayburn hosted the original, simplistic "Match Game" for 2 more years on NBC. Then for 9 years, from 1973 to 1982, he hosted the better-known 70's era for CBS and Syndication. He didn't have much success after that, and he eventually retired. Rayburn died in 1999. Bud Collyer hosted "To Tell The Truth" on CBS for one more year, in which a brand new set was used. His final television appearance was on the Syndie WML in January 1969; Collyer died in September. Ed McMahon hosted the VERY rare "Snap Judgment" for 2 whole years from 1967 to 1969 on NBC. He briefly replaced Bob Clayton on "Concentration", but then Clayton returned; McMahon, perhaps better known as the host of "Star Search" in the 80's and 90's, died in 2009.

[@savethetpc6406]

***** Thanks for the info. Ed McMahon may be better known as the host of "Star Search" than as the host of any G-T game shows, but certainly he's best known as Johnny Carson's "sidekick" on the "Tonight Show" from 1962-1992. What amazes me is how he managed to be involved in so many other projects while working on the "Tonight Show" at the same time! I also looked up Bud Collyer for clarification that you meant that he died in September of 1969. For a minute I thought you might have meant that he died just last September I don't think I've ever seen the original version of "Match Game." Was it any less "raunchy" than the 70s-80s version?

[@alskndlaskndal]

SaveThe TPC Yes, the original "Match Game" was played very straight and frankly kind of boring. This was one case where the revival was much better than the original (IMO).

[@savethetpc6406]

Reluctant Dragon I always found the constant innuendos a bit too much for me on "Match Game" when I watched it, but to each his own. :) There is apparently very little footage available from the original "Match Game," so I don't know if I would have preferred it or not, but there were a few clips from it and a lot of interesting background information about every incarnation of the show in this video, which I found after reading your reply a couple of weeks ago: kzbin.info/www/bejne/mpzOqX1qr9Nmp7s.

[@jmccracken1963]

Another tidbit about Ed McMahon: He made his film debut in 1967, at the age of 45, as Bill Wilks in the excellent film THE INCIDENT, which was shot entirely in New York City. The film was directed by Larry Peerce. The rest of the ensemble cast is Tony Musante, Martin Sheen, Diana van der Vlis (who played McMahon's wife), Brock Peters, Ruby Dee, Thelma Ritter, Jack Gilford, Mike Kellin, Jan Sterling, Gary Merrill, Robert Fields, Donna Mills, Victor Arnold, Robert Bannard, Beau Bridges, and Kathleen Smith. (The story (about two punks who terrorize a New York elevated train) and screenplay, both by Nicholas E. Baehr, had already been shown as a drama on TV in 1963.) If you can find this movie anywhere, by all means watch it; I can't say enough positive about it!

[@epaddon]

Allen was already playing out the string on "Password" and his "For a while" crack after Gene says, "Keep those checks coming" is clearly a reference to the fact that he's soon going to be out of work!

[@charlesmeadows6285]

I recalled that before Allen Ludden became Password host,he moderated GE College Bowl and its radio forerunner,something that’ll turn 65 in October.

[@rmelin13231]

Yes he moderated GE college Bowl, an amazing show! Catch a few episodes, if you can.

[@kentetalman9008]

We watched it every week. Great show!

[@watchman1178]

I always had the impression that Bud Collyer was a really nice guy. I'd be surprised if that had not been the case with him.

[@banjochris]

There's an episode of the syndicated WML with Bud Collyer as the mystery guest where that really comes across.

[@watchman1178]

I wonder if it was a coincidence that Bud Collyer was the one to sit next to John Daly? Imo, Bud was the best host of them all (along with John, of course). PS - A little surprised that Garry Moore wasn't there, though. From that era, I think the Top 3 Goodson/Todman game shows were WML, TTTT, and IGAS.

[@banjochris]

Garry was temporarily retired at this time and had stopped hosting IGAS in 1964, and Steve Allen took over. Garry came back to TV in 1969 with the syndicated TTTT.

[@tinat9486]

I Loved Allen Ludden. I loved to look at how perfect he looked and seemed. Confirmed by Betty White. As for the best... WML, Password, Tattle Tales, TTTT, Newlywed Game and Match Game.

[@rmelin13231]

@@tinat9486 I like your list of favorites, and especially that you included Tattle Tales, which is often overlooked. However, I would remove Match Game from my list, at least post-1970 episodes.

[@googoo-gjoob]

i was hoping Mark Goodson was going to introduce Bill Todman.

[@Paul71H]

After having seen many episodes of the Tonight Show with Johnny Carson, I thought that Ed McMahon's laugh at 18:54 and 18:58 would surely be recognized. I can only guess that in 1967, Johnny and Ed had not been on long enough for Ed's laugh to reach that iconic status.

[@salvatorecollura2692]

I’ve always thought I heard a voice that sounds like Mark Goodson’s shouting a warning ‘John….’ after Bennett sets him up to burn Henry Morgan.

[@16Lizards]

After Marty McFly arrives in his time machine later this year, I'm going back to Jul 16, 1967 and hanging out in Lindenhurst, NY!! Good day for some ice cream...

[@4UStevePerry]

I'm amazed that she made the trip over there from Queens. But have been a better neighborhood

[@MsStarbright84]

Ed McMahon before Star Search!!!!

[@Kille483]

Can someone explain that Henry Morgan comment in the end?

[@deborahd.7281]

Henry Morgan was on the previous show, that might give you a clue, kzbin.info/www/bejne/eKiYoYmghMtja8k What's My Line? - Senator Everett M. Dirksen; PANEL: Phyllis Newman, Henry Morgan (Jul 9, 1967)

[@deborahd.7281]

You might also want to see the comment @salvatorecollura2692 3 weeks ago I’ve always thought I heard a voice that sounds like Mark Goodson’s shouting a warning ‘John….’ after Bennett sets him up to burn Henry Morgan.

[@timglende8869]

All 4 hosts would somehow appear as Mystery Guests on SYN WML.

[@jayrice5156]

God, I love Sue's dress! Wish I had it!

[@henrygrove100]

Sue who??

[@GOLDVIOLINbowofdeath]

Loved the way Arlene made it clear she was reading a script when she introduced Cerf with her usual compliments

[@therealhawkeyeii7888]

What a dumb decision on the part of CBS to cancel the show. Ratings were still as high as ever.

[@VahanNisanian]

Mark Goodson says that there are 8 more shows left. Of course, in terms of production order, there were really 3 more left. 2 on July 23 (the taped one aired on August 27), and 1 on September 3.

[@savethetpc6406]

John and the panel are beginning to wax nostalgic as the reality of the show's cancellation begins to sink in -- me, too! I know it's kind of ridiculous, as this is a show which was canceled so many years ago, but it's sort of like it's about to be canceled on this channel too -- at least in "first-run." We'll still be able to watch any or all of the posted shows as "reruns," but Gary won't be posting them daily anymore, and it won't be quite the same... :( (On the bright side, I'm glad Gary has decided to begin posting "To Tell the Truth," which may prove to be just as much fun as WML!)

[@jayrice5156]

Omg! I wish I had Sue's DRESS!!!!

[@stevekru6518]

Jay Rice You can have the dress. I prefer Sue.

[@kd6836]

@@stevekru6518Not sure Jay does

[@nickdepanfilis7895]

They misled the panelists on the octopus. Per google, no shells per se. they can live in a shell.

[@yeshualionofjudah7107]

I never knew some of these were in color. Strange why we are not seeing the last two years in color here.

[@jacquelinebell6201]

Yeah. Password was in colour from 1957 on.

[@dondaniels4119]

Pure entertainers,not thus electrinuc age of nonsense today.

[@ericgoldfarb4870]

Bud collier was a voice actor on radio and cartoon he was superman.

[@beadyeyedbrat]

Cerf sure likes the word "aggregation."

[@peternagy-im4be]

Why did it all end?

[@tugginalong]

Bud Collyer was a class act and a super man.

[@Noone58319]

That episode was great fun!!!

[@maxnullifidian]

Sounded like the game show hosts had the hiccups!

[@rrp1996]

Ed and Gene were so young.

[@neilmidkiff]

Not to excuse Henry Morgan's rude interruption in the July 9 program, but there's a clue that his selfish brusqueness was a deliberate act. Someone has uploaded a video birthday tribute to Mark Goodson made in 1992, at kzbin.info/www/bejne/fGLCnGSuiMRmoLM -- Henry's segment, at 21:02, is a neat self-parody of his own TV persona. I've only seen the opening part of this program so far, but it's a fascinating look at the range of Goodson's game shows, with clips of intros of hosts and panels and opening graphics and theme tunes.

[@Dharmon1]

Why was Arlene counting to 10 at the end?

[@nancymilawski1048]

There was an old saying ( or adage) to count to ten before speaking so that your brain has time reconsider and prevent you from saying something you will immediately regret. You could apply it to email but wait for 1 day before reviewing and sending or deleting. 😃😃😃

[@hizgrase]

Being polite and classy.

[@henrygrove100]

Oh God Bud collyer a God

[@BrettCrawfordTransgirl1984]

What is a good humor man? I am confused. Never heard of that job before now.

[@scotwirth6228]

Sells Good Humor ice cream from an ice cream truck.

[@BrettCrawfordTransgirl1984]

Scot Wirth oh okay thanks

[@garyrosato2405]

Ed McMahon should have been replaced with Garry Moore

[@banjochris]

Garry was retired between 1964, when he left I've Got a Secret, and 1969, when he began hosting the syndicated To Tell the Truth.

[@kenjohannessen9908]

@@banjochris He came out of retirement in 1966 to reboot his variety show, but CBS slotted it against "Bonanza," and it was cancelled quickly.

[@briane173]

Good -- Bennett and Daly slammed Henry Morgan, in the presence of Goodman no less. I'm sure at that point Goodman didn't need a shot across his bow; Morgan wasn't coming back to WML in any way, shape or form.

[@GodsFavoriteBassPlyr]

You almost get the feeling that John Daly would have happily forfeited the $50 from his own pocket, just to make sure that everyone walked away happy. In the comment section of another episode, someone had made reference to Sue Oakland and that no one had seen much of her before of since, and that she was quite possibly 'friendly' with a producer or someone of that nature. Then lo and behold, here she is sitting Right Next to Mr. Goodson... Perhaps a close friend trying to gain her a bit of exposure?

[@drumbum3.142]

At first I thought mr daley said "Two .." 😄😂😂

[@hizgrase]

What specifically is the comment about Henry Morgan at end.