What's So Great About M390?

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**DISCLAIMER** This channel's content is meant for educational purposes only, and encourages the proper/safe use, handling, and understanding of tools. #everydaycarry #edc

[@metal_complex]

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[@Ian-qf5ny]

Hahah this is wild man! Im just learning about fancy knives, but i am the worst of the 20%! Construction worker living in rural coastal Canada im not even half a mile from the pacific ocean, living in a damp forrest haha! My main knife is currently a 1045 chinese folder hahaha! And its honestly the best ive had! Had it a few years and no rust, i even take it in the woods and up the mountain, ive gutted fish with it in a pinch! I hardly maintain it! My axes are both nice swedish carbon steel, just with the forge scale still on them. I oil them about once a year and i mean, the one that lives in the box of my pickup gets a little surface rust now and then if i dont use it for a while but always cleans up haha! Anyways hope that was a neat perspective for you, this video was for me! Going to get a real knife finally, dont think itll be m390 for me though hahahah! Probably go with good ole 1095 hahaha. Cheers from Canada!

[@billychampy316]

Do you want to sell the Kershaw Bare knuckle?

[@williamborland871]

Man, I don't know. I'm a user, and that vg-10/154CM/cpm154 range is what I go to. Doesn't matter if its hip, it just strops real nice and stays sharp even with "work" use.

[@rangerjonoutdoors6429]

I agree

[@TechieTard]

VG10 all day.

[@JustIn-op6oy]

Acuto+ is a great steel along the same lines. I would also put ats-34 in that list. They're all quite capable steels at reasonable prices.

[@iceman5117]

Bohler n690 and Sandvik 14c28n as well.

[@DinoNucci]

CPM154 ftw @ daily edc

[@fritzgeisseder1019]

Böhler M390 is made by Böhler Edelstahl GmbH & Co KG in Kapfenberg (Austria). Greetings from Vienna 😜

[@metal_complex]

Spoke with someone else about this. They are merged companies. One actually did originate in Sweden 😊 but yes, you're correct.

[@northernninety7]

I have knives with these super steels such as 20CV, M390 and even RWL34. But my primary edc knife is S35VN and is the most prominent steel in my collection.

[@MetalRush666]

S35vn is prob the best edc steel out there.

[@ryanoconnell4938]

Northern Ninety7 after this quarantine and when I’m able to make some more money I will try to pick one up

[@KnifeCursed]

I’ve got or had quite a few m390, 20cv, 204p knives. For normal carry use it’s pretty decent. For use on my job though it takes damage pretty easy on the edge. I tend to prefer tool/carbon steels on my knives for overall performance.

[@krisrhebergen]

Over all my favorite edc steel is s30v. I find it holds an edge among the best and is still easy enough to sharpen without losing my mind. My spyderco ceramic stones have been a game changer for sharpening these harder premium steels though.

[@z33thr33]

Vanax for me, I see saltwater fairly regularly

[@manifestgtr]

My favorite M390 model is the Manix 2 in brown G10. That thing is a PERFECT example of every element coming together into a package. The blade geometry is spot on, Spyderco processes their steel well, the ergonomics are fantastic and it’s a “user knife” that you’re not afraid to throw in your pocket. The Manix is a great platform for pretty much any steel and the ones I have are truly top tier.

[@maxschechterman7460]

Do u prefer the option in m390 or s30v

[@manifestgtr]

@@maxschechterman7460 I like em both but the m390 version is highly weight relieved…so if there’s anything that’s gonna make a real, tangible difference in your day to day use, it’s probably that imo

[@Rime0ne]

I find myself gravitating toward premium steels for sure. And if I'm being honest with myself, with the way that I am, it's not all that necessary. The reason being is that I prefer starting my day off with a really sharp edge. And regardless of the steel, I have to touch up the edge at the end of the day. Even if I only cut 1 cardboard box. I gotta have that initial sharpness.

[@ohiogarbageman9507]

Good video. The best line in to me was " there is no best steel" they all have there place from 8cr 13mov to d2 to m4 or m390. Different steels for different price points/ uses. 8cr is a fine steel for edc and learning how to sharpen. D2 is tough as nails, but can rust a little easier. S35vn is probably the best all round. Its good for edge holding, toughness,sharpenability, and corrosion resistance. But not fantastic for any of those.

[@truthlight2816]

Finally a little 8cr13mov love. And paired with a pocket sharpener is a great beater. I personally use the camillus brand and a diamond rod.

[@JakeLH22]

Great video!! I started laughing when you said you just purchased another knife in 20CV, I bought a WE knives Deacon 901E 4 days ago and I was seeking M390 when I bought it haha! I knew it would be comparable to my Native 5 S110v in edge retention so I pulled the trigger on a $245 knife. Everything you said is really on point about choosing a blade steel and style of knife for specific uses and applications. I’ve been into folders for about 12 years, it all started with my BM Griptilian (154CM) and that grip is now my official glove box knife in my car. My tastes have changed in that time and I’ve learned a lot about different steels and lock types and which knife to use for what task. I have a spyderco sharpmaker and it was like banging my head against a brick wall trying to get my s110v back to its factory edge so I sent it off in the mail to a friend for sharpening. One of my all time favorites that I carry at least a couple days a week is my green micarta Steel Will gekko mini in N690co It’s a killer steel, it holds a nice edge and it’s super easy to touch up/sharpen. The ergos of that knife are amazing too. After buying/selling/trading knives since 2008 I’ve settled on 3 keepers that I rotate in and out of my pocket. Native 5 LW S110v Steel will gekko mini N690co ZT 0808 S35vn The WE Deacon will get into that rotation also, I’ve been carrying it for a day and a half and it’s super nice, the fit and finish and QC is worth the price tag and I know it’ll hold its edge for a long time, I just need to buy a strop, everyone on the various FB knife groups keeps telling me that. Oh and my 6 year old daughter keeps wanting me to take the WE out of my pocket so she can touch the carbon fiber!! 😂 Cool video, you’ve got a new subscriber! Cheers and stay safe out there.

[@tankcrowe5417]

My favorite steel is f 150 coil spring, especially if I'm going to be opening packages. I've only seen one though specifically custom made for said task....it's probably priceless, money means nothing when a goal that lofty is pursued.

[@dimmacommunication]

f-150 ... the truck ?

[@thaknobodi]

5160 steel.

[@michaelvoorhees5978]

@@dimmacommunication yes

[@pateralus9]

20:56 Never say never; apparently a lot of people, from what I've heard, seem to think CPM MagnaCut might actually be the "best" steel. I have no idea though, because I've never seen it or used, nothing. But people definitely seem stoked about it after Blade Show 2021. Wish I could've been there! Someday I'd love to attend for the first time! 😃

[@windowbreezes]

its near end of 2022, have you had a change of opinion on cpm magnacut?

[@everythingsharp]

It’s 2024, magnacut maybe the best pocket knife steel :)

[@RAID5_Aesthetic]

@@everythingsharpand becoming more widely available and even standardized.

[@Mcfly0856]

I don't mind sharpening 20cv but S110v is an absolute nightmare, I took my XM-18 down to 36deg inclusive and it really didn't take as long as I thought it would

[@arupian666]

2:22 M390 is made in Austria. Not Sweden. Bohler is a part Swedish company, but the plant that produces M390 is in Austria.

[@metal_complex]

Ya this is an old goof on my part

[@chrispotter2948]

I knew an old custom blade smith who studied under Gil Hibben and Harvey Draper decades ago. They used to love 440c because it was stainless and easy to sharpen. He later embraced 154cm also, those were his 2 blade steels, and by the time I met him and had a couple knives made I went that direction, 154cm that is. His opinion was like "yeah 154cm is great, it stays sharp longer than 440c but when you do have to sharpen it, it's harder to sharpen. Feels like the s30v vs m390 debate in a nutshell. BTW I want to buy a Shirogorov that runs on washers with s30v steel and use it to dress out an elk.

[@dark_gravity_edc]

For me it's all about how cool the name of the steel is. Maxamet, Rex, Elmax, Cru Wear all sound really badass. Lol I enjoyed the video and found it very entertaining. I love your weekend videos where you delve into the madness of us enthusiasts.

[@pandatobi5897]

idk man, elmax kinda sounds like elmo to me

[@spammcgee9893]

Ginsu

[@manifestgtr]

Cruwear is awesome, especially if you’re a freehand sharpener. It takes an unbelievably keen edge and feels great on the stones.

[@YukonJack]

I like tool steel given I'm an absolute unit.

[@TheBootyWrangler]

Magnacut tho

[@michaelbonade4667]

I am part of the collector/enthusiast boom in the knife industry....I was buying sub $100 knives around 2011-2013 when I committed to buying Benchmades Spydercos Microtech......and then Vintage Microtech.....and SOG GerberAl Mar.....I went through the fit and finish school and was driven to buy every new steel out there.....NOW all I want is a 2006 D-2 Socom Elite...manual, not a auto....I have a serratedexample but I NEED a p/e.......Microtech heat treat on D-2,🥰

[@barkingspider2007]

Well put! It depends upon who you are... I went for the M390 for a while and found that the hard steel like ZDP189 was more to my liking for use day in and out. LC200N is my favorite for fishing in the ocean or food prep. (Spidie Cheif) People who use the knives as tools have more of a intended use perspective. I like 154CM and VG10. It just depends on what the use for the blade will be. I like to experiment with thinning out the blade and generally like to keep my knives super sharp. All the discussion is just about having fun with the hobby. Thank you for taking the time to make the video. : )

[@bennyc409]

barkingspider2007 for food prep I prefer a chefs knife.

[@everydaycarry1328]

barkingspider2007 Well said. I have a ZT0450cf in zdp189 and it gets incredibly sharp! Different steels for different tasks.

[@iceman5117]

@@bennyc409 this. I don't understand people trying to do food prep with a 3" folder. That's like making a dish with nothing but a paring knife, but worse. A servicable 6" chefs knife and a filet knife can be had for $40 together, and should be all you need in the field, and both will prep food better than the best folder

[@michaelvoorhees5978]

I prefer a good for fishing

[@peen2804]

@@iceman5117 cool story

[@E_G_E51]

Great video! I would love to see this in a series of something. Talk about why everyone love D2 or how s35vn is better than S30v. I love these rambling informational videos to basically podcast

[@CSLFiero]

A perfect kitchen set Chef, boning, santoku -- M390 Paring -- ZDP Shears and cleaver -- XHP

[@appalachiangunman9589]

I got a Microtech Ultratech a couple of days ago in M390. It’s my first with that steel, up until then S35VN is the highest grade steel I have owned. The M390 has saw little use so far. I have an ESEE 5 with 1095 carbon steel and I’m a huge fan, it holds an edge pretty good despite being used fairly hard, but honestly I think splitting wood isn’t as hard on the edge as repetitive cutting of paper for example.

[@bayouboys5008]

I mean once you get the wood started splitting the pressure moves from the edge to the sides of the blade like a wedge so yeah I’d agree with your statement aside from knots….

[@appalachiangunman9589]

@@bayouboys5008 yeah I suspected the same thing.

[@abc456f]

Is there a better value than that bareknuckle in 20cv? When I got mine it was $110 and I thought it was a good price. Then today i see it on Smokey Mountain Knife Works for $78! They are still in stock so if you're looking for an excellent edc knife, I'd go and grab one quick. One of Kershaw's best imo.

[@azhawk516]

mr. jinks totally agree the Bareknuckle 20cv is hard to beat for the $’s.

[@everydaycarry1328]

Right now? No! It’s THE best value as an American made KVT bearing flipper in 20cv!

[@jslaughterofthesoul4939]

Wow, Bless Kershaw. I got a 3V Blur for a bill, I will jump on the Dividend.

[@jamesharris1493]

One thing I like about this channel is that you are not biased with the knife designers u mention.

[@robertm8401]

It retains an edge while not being that hard to sharpen with today's wide availability of pro level sharpening kits, and it sounds coooool. M390 sounds way better than 420HC 😂

[@bodombeastmode]

@Emerald Lx Exactly! It has that broad crossover appeal 😊

[@TwitchRadio]

I really like 14C28N... Looking at other steel and been eyeballing Elmax, m390, and Magna cut.... I wanted to get one good knife that was premium... But wanted to put some logic behind it before deciding and right now Elmax looks pretty good for the price.. been eyeballing giant mouse and LionSTEEL knives.... (fixed blade wise)... But joker has some great one's in 14C28N sandvik stainless steel... because it's pretty close to what I need and I live in a very wet environment thusly, Stainless is at tge top of my list but still don't want to over pay for something like Magna cut... And already have a few knives in 14C28N, which is a great balance of all the different things you talked about here in the video, but the edge retention is a little sucky, but I make it easy peasy with my work Sharp Field version😎✌️

[@12deathguard]

Kershaw bareknuckle is not a m390 steel. Everywhere I've looked they use Sandvik 14C28N.

[@michaelbonade4667]

OMG...☺️.....I want to pick up a new CTS204P Socom Elite to round out 3 other Socoms I have.... Those being 1. 2011 Duratech 20-CV SCElite 2. 2012 CTS204P SCElite, Microtech made a run of about 50-100 of them only I n drop point, but satin, stonewash (I think) and blk coated blades....I think they serrated a few...I’ve only seen plain edge🤔 3. 2019 M390 SCElite A few years back I figured hunting for the original 20-CV Elites would be tough...but over time I’ve accumulated 3, never paying over $475 for any one piece. The 2012 CTS204P model was one that I didn’t even know existed until I saw the one I bought for sale on Arizona Custom Knives, $345, a very good price... One thing Microtech did in the past was use a variety of steels during a run of one particular model ...ATS-34 still popped up in runs in 2014....

[@oinnsheathen5684]

Technically if one is looking for a “hard” steel then I would suggest a fixed blade with something like 3V

[@metal_complex]

Hard? You mean "tough". Optimal hardness on 3V is 62ish. Same as m390. ZDP 189 would be a "hard" steel (optimally). But ya, 3v would be my choice for fixed 👍

[@oinnsheathen5684]

Metal Complex yes

[@oinnsheathen5684]

Metal Complex I miswrote 😂 love my ranch

[@patricksmatrick6193]

@@oinnsheathen5684 I prefer blue cheese

[@eggersm.r.5752]

I'd say that all depends, for a fixed blade with a 4" to 5", maybe 6" blade that I plan to do hard work with I'd go with 3V, for over 6" to 9" I stick to 80CrV2, honestly 80CrV2 is great for 4" to 6" hard used blades also.. For a fixed under 4" it will be more an EDC knife and M390 or S35VN will be fine for 99.9% of what I'll use it for. V3 is great steel but for such a short blade it would almost never be needed.

[@jeddediajohnson9179]

I have the Benchmade bugout in M390. It definitely takes a nice polished edge and keeps it pretty well. The aluminum handle is very nice as well.

[@whalehands]

Im still stuck back here in s30v and s35vn steel...then i purchased a Super Freek. Then i purchase a Maxamet Para 3. What the hell did I get myself into?

[@jessejames4774]

I love my super freek! M4 isn’t terrible to sharpen if you keep it touched up often!

[@B.Man18]

Me personally I prefer the edge retention all while having good corrosion resistance, I work in a place where I am constantly putting my knife in contact with ice and frozen cardboard, so when I need to grab grab food from a box In The freezer and the boxes are stacked to where it makes it time consuming to unstick them in a rush I need to be able to cut through that cardboard consistently throughout the day without worrying about the ice damaging the blade, the corrosion resistance comes into play because I don’t always have the time to dry my knife off if I’m in the lunch or dinner rush so I need to be able to put it in my pocket and not rust over time. For my use m390 is ideal keeps a sharp edge so I can cut through the ice and cardboard without damaging the blade and resistant enough so I don’t have to dry it off after every use.

[@justbob242]

My favorite daily carry knife is my ZT 0450 in S35VN. I don't mind sharpening it. I recently got a Smock but I haven't had to touch up that lightsaber of a knife just yet.

[@rjblank2003]

I'd like to see someone test maxamet on rusting. With all the tungsten in it I don't think rust will get into the blade other than surface discoloration. I could be wrong but I'd like to see a test

[@nschepis]

Good point. It’s a very interesting steel. I have a maxamet native 5. Very cool knife and heavy steel with all of that tungsten.

[@david111davies]

Its interesting in a small fixed blade about 4mm thick. I have a lionsteel M4 in m390 and as long as you keep in mind its not for hard use then its amazing as a general user. 3V is the beater steel

[@krustysurfer]

Most of the ”three sisters” are under baked. That trio needs 62hrc to perform well as a cutting edge that lasts more than average midrange steel. To heat treat M390 to 62+ takes more energy, more focus and more time... Time spent machining/finishing when a great steel is taken into its sweet spot. *K390 supposedly fixes some of the three sisters weaknesses/flaws (edge retention when soft) and truly gives *magnacut a run for its money. If the price of m390 comes down and its heat treated properly then I will try some, however I own a Kershaw 'Link' in 20cv so maybe K390 Spyderco Police will be the one however I dont like the cheap looking scales and we should be offered a micarta option in a knife that costs $200. Great video thanks for sharing.👍

[@marckydasaint8730]

Recently, I've seen some reputable Blade Testers stunned by LC200N's and Vanax's edge retention ( Steels known for corrosion resistance but not edge retention/ hardness).

[@brewman6218]

My Spydiechef has been prepping dinner for a year and only been sharpened once. It’s still super sharp. I’m astonished.

[@jonathanbormann5077]

Been learning a bit after being underwhelmed by my Benchmade Freed in S30V. Not a bad knife by any means, just didn't meet my expectations. Mind you it's my EDC so for that purpose I prefer higher edge retention. Looking at a fixed blade this time around. Considering the Bradford Guardian 3 in M390

[@ashleycarey3190]

Great choice but personally I'd choose cpm 3v instead as its a tough steel as it was made for competition

[@brewman6218]

The Bradford guardian 3.2 is better.

[@johnbillings4947]

All steel aside, that Microtech hellhound in the middle is sick!!! I want that!

[@j0s3phfranc1s5]

That’s a combat troodon

[@frankdefranco9436]

I'd say it's like 95% people, not 80%. Most people don't use these 3.5 inch blade pocket folders to bash wood and cut trees. They use them for cutting ropes, tape, thin wire, boxes, paper, fruits and veges, meats etc. If you want to cut trees they people would go to fix blade large military style knives. For EDC folders these trio of steels are the best. They prioritize edge retention more while also maintain good corrosion resistance and toughness. It's a well balanced combo. They even outperform MAGNACUT (all new super steel) in terms of edge retention.

[@joshhuwhyte3988]

I just retired my benchmade in 154cm, picked up a MT Hera 2 in m390mk, week in my pocket, its already been through its share of london broil and NY strips.

[@just-inedc2381]

Very cool! I love hearing your perspective on this! I also really like 154cm and cpm. But one of my absolute favorites atm is 14c28n!

[@abc456f]

14c28n...my favorite "budget" steel. Bats above its pay grade.

[@mikefiles2087]

Agreed

[@fvazquez64]

It's like if you own a Porsche 911 and a chevelle 95, I wouldn't drive the 911 to go for the groceries... Let's be honest if I own a 200+ dls knife I wouldn't use it to cut some cables, cardboard or stuff, for that I'll use a 20 dls blade... it's more to impress, to show off or start a conversation than to work with a M390, 20CV or S35VN blade, at least that's what I thnk... Great review as always, thanks!!

[@JulioRegis]

I have a Benchmade 555-1 20cv... It's my fav and most used EDC ... I literally use it for everything from cooking to work(wearhouse ton of cardboard)... I have a fallkniven fine stone and ultrafine stone ... I never understood why people hate sharpening 20cv I sharpen once a month for like 5 min and my knife is razor sharp ... I will admit it is easier to chip then my esee 4 1095

[@cfltitan]

I’m the same way. As long as you stay on top of it and don’t let it get full blown dull none of them are that bad with a good sharpener (I personally use a Spyderco sharpmaker). Don’t be lazy and just touch them up often and keep them razor sharp

[@DuecegreggII]

While you might be standing on the shoulders of giants with the info, you have condensed it nicely within one video. I’m inclined to agree with everything you said here.

[@nofunallowed3382]

M390PM is pretty expensive as raw stock. The PM stands for Powder Metallurgical, which means that is compressed as a powder. It's also rather difficult to machine, it eats specialized tools for tough material for breakfast. Great material, tough but great

[@jslaughterofthesoul4939]

I have knives in supposedly much lesser steels and the geometry is kicking their asses in tasks of any sort without dullling based on geometry, and perhaps coating. Also certain serration types have their own ideal steels. I am seeing legit VG-10 and 154CM or its CPM counterpart and insane Damascus versions of some badass blades for $40 to $60 compared to the same models in M390 over $200. I am on the same steel snob pathology without anywhere near the money to have these knives in front of me. I had to have some M390, and got an Artisan Cobra for 80, M4 Blur for $100 and will jump on the Dividend for 80. Knife goals drive me toward a Rike M3, want that M390 4" beast with wave opening for treasure, but their 154CM has exceeded parameters at at least $100 less, and it makes way more sense combatively if necessary and to fidget and marvel at and use on basic everyday. I know this, but get caught up in all of these games and dissenting charts. The 440C Lansky world legal blade that came with a field sharpenr for $20 and l can't let go without, but it's the only knife I have that has such an ultra practical versatility for anything, it serms made for martial and defense use, and the ONLY blade shape I've not quite lot fully seen ripped off by all

[@brewman6218]

Spy27 has the sharpest edge, most sharpenability, and the best sticky sharp edge retention, though it only has mediocre working edge retention. So if you like sharp sharp sharp, Spy27 is the best.

[@carmelotansengco4605]

The two knives that I have with M390 blades are my Viper Storm and my Real Steel Puukko Skandi.

[@cosmiccharlie8294]

What steel holds up best to cardboard? That is the question.

[@theone76779]

Great informative video. I was worried I had screwed the pooch with my s35vn knives cuz I started to hear all about m390 being so much better. But now I know that s35vn is perfectly fine for what I use it for. Great content

[@iceman5117]

For 90% of people, 8cr13mov is perfectly fine for what they use it for. Opening letter, cutting tags off, maybe cutting some food in the field

[@theone76779]

@@iceman5117 yeah, I’ve got several in that steel now. I just didn’t understand the difference in the steels but I’ve done a lot more reading in there 11 months

[@DanielRichardKiy]

7:53 - what ...30?

[@DavidM-lj5yv]

I have a Chris Reeves Sebenza with S35VN that costs as much as any of my other folders, some of which have M390. My Chris Reeves is my favorite folder and love the blade. Also have a Reate Horizon D w M390 that I do love but my CR is my favorite. Thanks for the presentation.

[@Mr.CdLeon176]

I love my Para 3 LW M390 DLT Trading Exclusive. I was about to get a Manix 2 M390 Brown G-10. But now, I don’t know if I will still go for it or the Para 3 CPM S35VN Brown G-10. Need your help sir. **By the way sir, I sweat a lot 🤣.

[@brewman6218]

I got the manix m390 with brown g10. There’s a little play in the blade and with a manix you can’t get rid of blade play by tightening the pivot.

[@Killlerbee]

Thanks for some metal talk from Metal Complex... Always enjoy you "rambling" LOL!

[@HPAcustomriflesandcerakote]

I sharpen knives for people on whetstones. No knife steel is that difficult depending on you are using the proper abrasive stone. You arent going to get anywhere fast sharpening s90v, elmax, maxamet, m390, ect on a ceramic stone. If you use diamond plates or Diamond Resin bond stones like i prefer you make short work of sharpening those super steels. For standard carbon steels like 5160, 1095, and skandvik stainless steels like 14c28m, 12c27m, ect i use ceramic water stones and will not use diamonds on those steels. Its not good to use diamonds on regular carbon steels

[@frankdefranco9436]

M390, 20CV ans 204P are the premium steels that are most ideal steels for EDC knives imo. Holds the edge longer, stainless steel and tough within reason. S30V or 35VN don't hold the edge as long as that premium class of steels.

[@sirsir9665]

And then CPM 3V stepped into the ring.

[@rossi4382]

And then Magnacut stepped into the ring.

[@WVFAN1958]

Is microtech M390 Blades good blades ? And which is the one thanks for sharing your videos

[@greekveteran2715]

There is no "Best steel" because nothing is perfect in nature. However, I consider ballbearing steel, to be the best steel for an outdoor fixed blade knife, AEB-L for the same and IFit has to be more stain resistant. As for these kind of folders, I would agree, that CPM 154 , is a better choice than any super hard steel.

[@brandonroberts6815]

Funny thing is I finally bought a socom in 204p and the reason I held off is steel toughness but it's STEEL, this things a beast

[@Prosecute-fauci]

All of this talk about super steels yet Buck still uses 420 and the 110 is the sharpest knife I have ever experienced right out of the box.

[@MetalRush666]

I can appreciate all the super steels but in my opinion S35vn and s110v are prob the best edc steels out there.

[@REDNECKROOTS]

S110v is a nightmare to sharpen. Idk bout that but s35vn makes sense

[@brewman6218]

S90v is better than s110v in almost all situations. S110v just has a slight edge in corrosion resistance, but s90v has great corrosion resistance too.

[@amunderdog]

So how do they achieve $600 for a knife with D2 blade? Is the heat treat that good?

[@metal_complex]

Its exactly like I explained. The steel isn't anywhere near the main thing you're paying for. Most of it is the human time and effort (not all machine work) that goes into each knife, and the fact that it's done in the USA. This is beside the point, but if you're talking about Medford, theirs are actually CPM D2.

[@KnifeCursed]

jake legg I have one very expensive knife in CPM-D2. It’s a Medford Praetorian T. It was a gift from my wife and $850 🤪. I carry it every single workday as a repairman and honestly it has performed great for 7+ months. Most of the cost of that knife though is in the hand fitting, sculpting, ano, etc. It’s literally the only knife I’ve beat on that still has zero blade play. The edge Medford puts on is absolutely ridiculous too. Best factory edge I’ve seen. So in a roundabout, rambling way, D2 can be a perfectly useful steel when done well.

[@revolvermaster4939]

The Least of my concerns is corrosion resistance. EVERYTHING where I live and work corrodes and must be properly cared for. Ramble on brother!

[@schlooonginator1227]

Aren't most steels plenty tough for nearly all knife duties even batoning? Even M390? Seems to me that toughness is a feature that rarely gfets pushed to the limit until you start prying and doing non cutting type activities. I have seen pretrty impressive tests of steels not considered tough. Failures tend to be more from bad heat treats, anomolies in the steel and bad geometry/design such as sharp transitions, jimping where energy is concentrated to a tiny spot or a combination of any of these. This may be controversial but I think steel toughness is much more used for marketing than real world benefit 90% of usersIts still steel, the stuff is pretty tough regardless otherwise we would be seeing busted blades. Just look at the Dutch Knives guys breaking that Magnacut, the trendiest steel , failed due to inclusion in steel.

[@metal_complex]

The issue is that a "bad" heat treat can mean different things to different people using knives for various tasks. For example: M390 in terms of composition is not tough. Its shining attribute is the ratio of corrosion resistance to edge retention. In order to achieve this optimum ratio, M390 usually needs to be heat treated to around 62 rockwell. This makes it great for continuous cutting with light/medium materials like cardboard, but trash for tasks like choping/batoning due to low toughness. Lowering the rockwell hardness will yield better toughness, but that takes away from its intended purpose. Not every steel is meant to baton/pry. It depends on the composition and optimal heat treat. Geometry will also play a huge role in how any blade performs.

[@thaknobodi]

Toughness also means thinner edge angle possibilities.

[@REDNECKROOTS]

Spartan blades has it right, they use s45vn all there knife models. It's a great steel that can be worked in the field

[@diezelvh4133]

I don't know.. s35vn is pretty sweet too. .

[@REDNECKROOTS]

@@diezelvh4133 it is. Just 45 is just slightly better

[@zaa2892]

I have mpr benchmade sibert m390. If to sharp and strop at leather with compound vandium ..i try to slice meat and its blunt ...due to no toothty edge ...

[@CarlosEduardo-qf5gr]

The Bareknuckle in 20CV is nowhere to be found anymore, and the 14C28N variant also costs $70+...

[@kb9oak749]

I have an M390 Para 3 and a M390 Spyopra. Great knives. Great steel. That said, super steel can be executed poorly and average everyday steel can be executed very well.

[@FancyPrimate]

I'm here because I really want a Lionsteel M4. I do use my knife and m390 doesn't give me butterflies. Doesn't necessarily sound like the steel for me but I suppose I can make do and not destroy it too bad.

[@Abby_Normal_1969]

it is 100% accurate to say that there is no best steel. Too many variables. Can you imagine a Cold Steel SRK in S110V? Somebody would ask, why did you get it serrated and I would say, I didn't. But I also think that is accurate to say that preferences are a real thing and for knife enthusiasts, I can guess that a lot of thought and research and some trial and error goes into developing a preferred blade steel. Of course, then the knife enthusiast is likely to come across a Cedric and Ada vid that says the blade steel is less important than the heat treat and the blade geometry. Then...that knife enthusiast will be devastated and question all of reality as nothing makes sense any more. Is nothing sacred?!? (there is a small chance I am not talking about me). (Sorry, I am on vacation and I have been drinking). (shit, my wife might read this).

[@chrisorr4087]

I have the paramilitary2 in m390 with blue g-10

[@nikkoataylar6486]

What is better overall m390 or elmax?

[@hatrez4285]

What’s a cheap alternative to M390. Is there any? I own a M390 and it was quite expensive. But I like the blade very much. Is there a cheaper steel similar to M390?

[@thaknobodi]

S30V at 60 hrc is just as good as meh M390

[@CAborn1112]

Can you change the Cage from plastic to aluminum or something else on a Manix 2 LW since it’s riveted?

[@iceman5117]

You have to drill out the rivets and try to do the screw replacement. If you're going to get a manix, just get the g10. It's a better knife

[@Treeguy-ny6vb]

You can get titanium ball cage to replace the plastic one but only on the G10 model (not the LW). I think Flytanium makes them.

[@giovanny1998arg]

Hey I just bought a Kershaw bareknuckle in 20cv is Kershaws 20cv on par with other companies 20cv

[@metal_complex]

I believe so! You can always have your knife sent off to be tested. Ask SuperSteel Steve about it 👍

[@jlogue751]

There is the factor of knowing you have the best...whatever it may be..whether it makes a difference or not.

[@aaronl8609]

Could you review the Dark Star by:Vespa? Its around 180$ titanium with 390 steel blade. Not sure if the internals are premium also

[@jamesharris1493]

I have a steel question? Can a completely titanium knife get constructed?

[@metal_complex]

Titanium makes a great frame/lock, but it's terrible for a blade. Titanium is strong, but soft. Even when treated, it can't perform the same way high end steel does. It's been done before. Titanium blades are functional, but nothing compared to properly heat treated steel blades.

[@TomasLomba]

Not to mention that titanium machinability is really bad and requieres a lot of time and specialized tools so that knife would be really expensive

[@reasonablenamehere]

Unfortunately M390 is highly, highly variable with its heat treatment. There are M390 knives on the market with less edge retention than AUS-8 and there are M390 knives on the market that will blow the pants off of S110V. Toughness is not all that important in the "average EDC use" you were referring to. You'll never chip a 63 RC M390 on an Amazon bubblewrap package or from taking a picture of it sticking in a log. Spyderco's Maxamet is run at about 68 and is one of the most brittle pocket knife steels of all time, yet we all love it. Paying premium extra prices for M390 (such as buying a particular model with "upgraded" steel) is a loss for the end user even if you are not utilizing it. M390 is really badass when done well.

[@metal_complex]

I mean... any steel that's properly heat treated will blow the pants of a lot of steels that are poorly heat treated. It's the way of steel.

[@reasonablenamehere]

@@metal_complex I agree, but my point is M390 and 20CV are by far the ones that we are seeing the most variance in. D2 is probably a close second in how variable it has been in the production market. Also I do not necessarily say "bad" heat treat. You will get a very tough steel when it is that soft. It is just not very conducive to EDC tasks - i.e. what it is used for. People who are new to this topic will come here and watch this video. I won't ever say M390 is bad or overrated, but the variance that we have right now on production knives is great enough that it merits being a significant talking point. I don't want to detract anything from what you were saying, but to add to it.

[@ryanguldbrandsen7672]

I personally think your taking compared toughness out of context. When compared to 3v, 4v, m4 ect....m390 seems like it's not very tough. But it is... M390 is held up there due to how well rounded is it. It has high edge retention, high corrosion resistance and is pretty dam tough(just as much as s35vn if both are perfectly heat treated per manufacturer guidelines). But it sucks to sharpen for most. I use diamond to sharpen it and it's a breeze. Hap40 and REX45 are harder to sharpen...but on diamond plates... not really. Anyways, basically there is nothing else out there as well rounded. S45VN is also a super well rounded steel from the looks of it. But it'll have better toughness at the cost of edge retention(probably). It is going to make a great fixed blade steel (maybe). In many ways steel has a balancing act. Maxamet is SUPER hard, but has low toughness and isn't stainless. Rex45/hap40(same steel) is not as hard as Maxamet, but is slightly tougher and slightly more stainless(but still not stainless) M390(20cv/204p) I think is the best ALL around steel for a folding knife. Are all of my folding knives m390? Nope. I have some hap40, rex45, zdp189, maxamet...ect. The knife I bought my girl is zdp-189(ladybug on her keys). Why? Because she's only using it to cut boxes. I won't need to sharpen it for like 5 years. They knife she has in her purse for just in case oh shit moments....20cv. why? Because it's exposed to all sorts of crap in there. It's not going to rust(I did treat it with tuff glide) and I trust her life with it. There's always a steel for the job. My hiking knife is s35vn because...it's a great steel and cost(would I like a 4v, or V4E knife? Hell yes, but cost comes into the factor.) As with most things, you have to pay 50-200% more for that extra 10% in performance. That Kershaw you have... unfortunately it's been proven it's heat treatment is....poor. sorry... The Kershaw link 1776 comes in 390 and 20cv. I was all sorts of excited. But Kershaw isn't heat treating the blades as well as they are with the zero tolerance blades. 56-57 is where I think I saw it at. Which is far too soft for that steel. Anyways. When it comes to the top tier super steels. M390 is the ONLY steel that is well rounded. All of the other steels give up something. Ultra tough, but low edge retention (even though now a days it's still really good edge retention) and isn't stainless. Ultra hard, but will chip and will rust. There is no comparable steel to a let's say m390 @ 59-61 HRC. S30vn no, S35VN no, s90v very close no, s110v no ect... Ect... Then you have to add on top of this, the steel company's just renaming steels. IE hap40 is the same steel as the newest and greatest REX45. So this causes massive confusion. For m390/20cv/204p. Heat treat is 100% king. Not only heat treat, but cryo treatment as well. 60-61hrc is where it's the most well rounded and earns it's rep. If not properly heated I believe I read(on a manufacturer site(one of the 3) basically EVERYTHING drops(edge retention, corrosion resistance, and toughness), I believe while being at a higher hardness, the toughness is actually higher as well. It has its place. I personally think it is the best EDC pocket knife steel(for under 4 inches). But some will swear Maxamet is. Well, the human body sweats and if your carrying it in your pocket, the evaporated sweat is going to coat the blade. So you will eventually get rust on a non stainless knife. In a pocket knife under 4 inches, I don't think you'll be able to exert enough force to need that toughness to break it without being really really really stupid. As a side note. I have a xm-183 3.5 skinny in m390 with a slicer blade. It's my EDC and it's great. It's done everything I've asked for it. But...I bought a slicer blade for a reason. One steel I truly believe is....over priced and over hyped for pocket knives is s35vn. Especially in Chris Reeves knives. His heat treatment imo is too low @58hrc. But I wouldn't pick s35vn over m390 in a pocket knife. From what I've come across, S35VN is used SO MUCH is due to is being significantly easier to grind(easier on the belts, so reduced cost to manufacture) vs other powder steel, even s30v. It's one of the reasons it was compounded the it was. S45VN, will slowly trickle out. It has the edge retention (maybe better) of s30v, the toughness (probably better) of s35vn with even higher corrosion resistance. Will s45vn out do m390. Who knows. It'll always depend on the heat treatment. I personally own alot of Spyderco knives. Why? Because I believe they are 100% on point with their heat treatment. With Spyderco, I 100% believe your paying for their steel(you know it's on point with heat treatment). Look at their light weight models. Good to...decent ergos(plastic ass handle), but with in most cases high end steel. I have a pm2, pm3 lw, smock and Manix 2 in m390. I use most of them quite a bit. I've never sharpened(I have stroped them) them and they can still shave the hair on my arm off and have no chips). I had a microtech utx 85 in m390 that I used the hell out! It was my only knife.(btw...if it gets cold, the lube freezes and won't deploy) So... That knife saw some crazy action I'm embarrassed to say. Someone stole it. So....my....knife buying started look for the perfect knife! Can a perfectly heat treated d2 steel....para 2 out perform a poorly treated para 2 in m390 in every way? No...d2 still isn't stainless... So it would depend on your environment.... Sorry for this book. As I said....I have many knifes in all sorts of steel. I have many many Spyderco spirit runs in many many types of steel. I still choose m390 as my EDC. I don't really have to take care of it besides stropping the blade now and them(plain leather strap with 5k grit diamond paste works great for touch ups on....ANY steel very quickly) We aren't in a war zone, so sharpening shouldn't come into play. Don't want to sharpen your Maxamet? Send it to Spyderco with some pocket change and save yourself 2-3 hours of anger. Hell, I recently reprofiled my spyderco Manix 2 with rex45 to 10degrees(per side), with a 15 degree micro bevel. Why? Because it's duty is to sit by the front door and open packages. So why not? It glides through everything like nothing is there. It's inside so rust will never be a problem(I also tuff coated it). I kinda purchased it for that task. Anywho, there's always a correct steel for a job. I wouldnt buy m390 on a fixed blade. I would get 4V, V4E or something of the like if my funds allow and I would have it Cerakoted. BTW dont buy a non stainless steel knife with a DLC coating. It will protect it from scratches, but it doesn't protect from rust. It will eventually rust under the DLC, Cerakote is king in this area. Your xm-24 will do GREAT in 20cv. It's thick enough to...not need to worry...at all. That blade will will hold your body weight without an issue. Will the rest of the knife? Being a Hinderer...yeah...but it may be more chippy vs s35vn. BTW the 20% chromium in the m390 doesn't mean it's SUPER corrosion resistant, it is very very corrosion resistant. But there's something in it, that bonds to chromium, reducing it's effective resistance, while increasing it's toughness. It's more corrosion resistant vs s90v. Which is why I choose it over s90v. My BM 940-2001 is 90v. But...it was a present from my girl and she did good. Anywho.... Have a good day sir. Let me know your opinion if you read this far! 😁

[@metal_complex]

Yep. Its circumstantial. Depends on what you use the knife for, and how often you use it. Some people will prefer one steel over another for numerous reasons. 👍

[@Amirul_Zahin]

I read thru all ur comment, i'm about to get the new benchmade bugout 535bk-4 with their new m390 steel. Been searchin thru out the internet whether m390 is a great steel or not. I was hoping this knife could last 5-10 years for me. I'm not a collector myself. I just want one edc knife for life. After reading ur opinion on m390 based on ur experience. I can conclude that m390 is a well rounded steel for edc. I dont do any bushcraft or whatsoever. Just a normal cutting task. I have a few question in mind actually if u dont mind, What kind of sharpening tools u use to sharpen m390 & do you think it would be a great purchase for me? Yeah its on a pricey side. But i was hopinh it could last for years. I would appreciate if u could leave ur comment on it. Have a nice day sir.

[@ryanguldbrandsen7672]

@@Amirul_Zahin that'll be a great knife. You can always send it to Benchmade for sharpening. But, you'd want something with diamond stones. Anything else will take forever to sharpen it with.

[@iluvj00]

My man, in each hobby there’s a guy that knows a lot of it and speaks reasonably,knowledgeable and honest. Without worrying if he’s catering for the status quo. You are that person of the knife world. The asmongold of knives. Even though I disagree with you on some stuff like you not liking the spyderco pattadese system but not criticizing the awful cold steel ad-15 heinous locking monstrosity.

[@jamesharris1493]

What steel is used on the Benchmade Bailout knife?

[@DiegoGarcia-hz8ki]

Do you still have that brass sigil

[@ScottieG59]

Sorry... I'm sure others have mentioned it: Bohler (BÖHLER Edelstahl GmbH & Co KG) is Austrian, not Swedish. Also, the Microtech Troodon is named after the dinosaur: Troodon (/ˈtroʊ. ədɒn/ TROH-ə-don; Troödon in older sources). That is like: Troh-odon

[@metal_complex]

ACTUALLY... since we're talking about M390 steel and not just BOHLER as an individual company... "Bohler-Uddeholm was formed in 1991 as a result of a merger between the Austrian parastatal Böhler and of Uddeholms AB of Sweden. The company has production sites in Austria, Germany, Sweden, Brazil, Belgium, Turkey, China, United States and Mexico" And I know how Troodon is pronounced. I just choose to say it the way I say it 👍

[@ScottieG59]

@@metal_complex Yes, I figured pronunciation was a choice. As for Bohler, they are incorporated in Austria. Is VW a Mexican company due to having some production there?

[@knickly]

The big thing is that Microclean steel is only made in Kapfenberg, Austria, at the Böhler Microclean plant (as far as I know). Superclean steel is made in Sweden.

[@ScottieG59]

@@knickly The wonders of a global economy..

[@ScottieG59]

@@knickly I think there is a possible error in zknives.com. They seem to show M390 Microclean in Sweden rather than Austria. In 1991, both Uddeholm and Bohler bacame subsidiaries of voestalpine.

[@suttonmatthew]

You can send it back to the OEM for sharpening.

[@mcl40000]

all these supersteels do make sense in edc folders. i really dont wanna sharpen them and therefore em being sharp "forever" is a good thing...tool knives like outdoor, bushcraft or survival knives is where they make no sense

[@luceatlux7087]

i love the look of that Benchmade... man, i wish i had money... if i had tons of cash, i would buy: 1 car, basic food, 1 awesome guitar, and a sht ton of knives... just the bare necessities.

[@Phlfwlr]

It’s probably my next Benchmade. I love it

[@liahfox5840]

For the obvious reason of having zero mechanical parts a fixed blade such as a mora is a far better choice for those who are going to "beat" their knives. As for the knives you've got there, they're more for utility and personal protection which a great steal is perfect for.

[@metal_complex]

You're just saying words here. Sounds more like your own preferences. Define "beat on" first, then you can determine what you need. Laying out a blanket statement like this is super misleading and mostly incorrect. The only truth here is that fixed blades are usually more durable than folders. Also steel choice is important no matter what you're going to use blade for. Fixed or folder. The composition, heat treat, and geometry will determine how well any blade performs in any setting. I'm not the person you want to give your lecture to.

[@patricksmatrick6193]

If 154cm or cmp154 is good enough for a $3k custom, then I feel it's still plenty relevant in my favorite brands that know how to hear treat.

[@carolinawoodsmith]

You are exactly right, it all depends on what you intend to use the knife for.

[@cfrost87]

the only difference between the m390 and cpm 20cv is the m390 has a bit more silicon.

[@abc456f]

How do cts-xhp and elmax rank against m390? I have a couple of cold steel's in cts-xhp and my ultratech and zt 0562 in elmax. Seems these two steels are being used less and less.

[@metal_complex]

Less edge retentative and less stainless, but tougher. Especially Elmax. Both great!

[@abc456f]

@@metal_complex Thanks!

[@MightyRude]

mr. jinks Well hardened elmax that has a lower HRC compared to well hardened m390 will outperform it in real life a cut test It acts a lot like cpm 20cv in that aspect

[@Outpost_76]

There are way too many variables to say one way or the other. Example, Shirogorov Elmax tested better than most M390 and equal to their own M390 in testing. Heat treat protocol, the specific steel batch, the place in the oven when talking production heat treat where hundreds or thousands of blades are done at a time. Why, in a production setting it's rare you will get an optimally treated steel if ever. Look at variance just in small run knives and you can see it. On top of that how its ground makes a huge difference, not geometry but the actual process to get a finished blade. I've had many instances where XHP out performed M390, 20CV and 204P so there is not one fit answer to this.

[@chadwallace3598]

What strop would you use for 20cv or 390? Honing tool?

[@Treeguy-ny6vb]

Sharpmaker

[@Nohkral]

Any advice on s90v. Or 20cv for benchmade 940? I have a worksharp so not worried about sharpening just want the better one

[@metal_complex]

20cv would be my preference. Less chippy

[@patrickvanovermeeren4513]

Unless made in small batches....and without the right heat-treat ... nothing. Great video though 👌👍

[@brewman6218]

I think M390’s toughness is a little higher than s30v. Maybe between s30v and s35vn.

[@spyhunter6411]

I dislike most steels I cannot sharpen easily. I think the s35 and s45vn is the sweet spot for me. I basically can't stand s90v lol. M390 is fine, but mostly I'd prefer something softer.

[@teemohnay]

I bought the ZT 0562cf m390 when it came out too. Lol the hype was real! Also just bought a Troodon Combat Tactical m390. m390 is definitely not a tough steel compared to some of my other heavier purposed knives. And it is definitely not easy to sharpen. But I have been able to keep a mirror edge with it. And I do enjoy showing my m390 blades off when I carry them. It certainly makes a great edc long as you dont plan on beating the shit out of the blade.

[@ivysorgue6660]

Can u make a video about n690, there’s not much Ernest reviews about it on KZbin, and European knife makers really like to use this steel.