When the Americans brought Shotguns to WWI..

[@lolspolant5383]

Germans: No! You can’t bring a gun that can clear out trenches. Americans: skill issue

[@fardman7310]

@@italianatedrake3621 if you cant use something easy to use, that is a major skill issue

[@HanzOrHans]

the fact that you didnt use nein instead of no tells me everything i need to know about you

[@francisjohnoca5710]

​@@italianatedrake3621 copium

[@italianatedrake3621]

@@fardman7310 I agree with you

[@italianatedrake3621]

@@francisjohnoca5710 you are the one bringing up coping, so you’re the one coping here.

[@michaelusmc9322]

A shotgun with a bayonet is a scary thing

[@angieolli5022]

Are you american? I read an intresting study, where you guys are more scared of knives then guns. And that confirms it. Cant imagine anything scarier then a 12gauge Shotgun in close range and a bajonet wouldnt really play a role at all

[@michaelusmc9322]

@@angieolli5022 I am an American but I'm also a veteran and had the experience of being shot at by automatic weapons before. I'm no longer afraid of knives

[@Entschuldigung14]

@@angieolli5022knifes are easily concealed and can work fast. Guns are better suited for long range. Out in the country the most feared weapon is a high caliber precision hunting rifle as you can hide anywhere and no one could find you. In big city’s knifes are more of a threat because of how easily you can get one and how deadly they are

[@TheMrJizzus]

This weapon is just overpowered, if the soldiers ran out off gut spilling shells he could use the shotguns as a club with a gut spilling knife at the end

[@da_plasma_catto1801]

Stab+buckshot blank range+usable body shield

[@Jerry_Fried]

The ‘97 also doesn’t have a disconnector, so if you keep the trigger pressed back, it will fire as fast as you can pump it.

[@aguaaqua6343]

🥵

[@Exodus20.7KJV]

Thanks, didn't know that.

[@99thJediWarrior]

Almost like a precursor to the SPAS-12

[@stephenlawrence554]

@@99thJediWarrior not quite, the SPAS does have a disconnector so you can't slamfire it, it just has a separate firing mode allowing it to fire in semi auto

[@danikaflorence444]

It DOES have a disconnector, it’s just that when you fire and rack the action, the disconnector is depressed out of the way so slam fire becomes possible

[@christopherhughes8402]

My great grandfather was a soldier in the Great War. I was lucky enough to listen to his stories about the war to end all wars. He often spoke of the effectiveness of the “trench broom”. He also told me how the French women would just hike their skirts on the streets when they needed to relieve themselves! My great grandfather wore his WW1 uniform every Sunday to church until he passed in 1993. My great grandparents were able to meet their great great grandparents, something I am still so grateful for. My great grandfather told me he watched the now old union soldiers parade on the 4th of July in remembrance of the revolutionary war and the wining of the civil war by union troops. What my great grandfather witnessed in his long life is just mind boggling.

[@christopherhughes8402]

Sorry, they meet their great great grandchildren, my children.

[@roderickstockdale1678]

@@christopherhughes8402how was he and how old were your children when he passed?

[@bubbaballer88]

I was gonna check you until I read your comment. I actually counted how many generations that was and got to 7. And I was gonna say, there’s no way there were four generations between WWI and Civil war (50 years). At most that’s 2. Haha glad you cleared it up and that’s so awesome that he got to meet your kids. My grandfather served in WWII in the battle of Leyte Gulf but passed when my mom was a teenager. My uncle went to West Point and was a ranger and green beret. He takes his grandkids to Gettysburg and gives a tour off the top of his head. He’ll be like your great grandfather. Thanks for sharing!

[@orlandorodriguez4387]

You should see SanDiego in 2024 they just squat in the middle of the sidewalk to drop a deuce or pee into the gutter middle of the day .....

[@roderickstockdale1678]

@@bubbaballer88 more like 3, grandfather civil war, father Indian wars/Spanish-American war, son ww1. So that’s three generations.

[@jasonpye4887]

A shotgun with a bayonet is a sign that sh** is about to real.

[@michaelc9256]

Sh** is now real 💀

[@diligentsun1154]

Nothing says 'COMBAT!!!', like a shotgun with a gatdam bayonet on it. Isht is realer than Real Deal Holyfield.

[@Vapourwear]

Anything with a bayonet...

[@DuhYaThink]

@@michaelc9256 Some things are for sure. Media 🤷‍♂️ can’t trust it.

[@Theomite]

"AAAH! He's got a board with a nail in it!"

[@johncuomo-fp6vj]

John Moses Browning just casually invented America’s entire WW1 arsenal

[@timd729]

Lol so true. America loved that guy and still does.

[@ethakis]

John Moses Browning is a fucking patriot and should be canonized a Saint.

[@PaulGuy]

1911 is still a super popular handgun, and is still used by police and military around the world, including the US. The M2 Browning .50 cal is still used extensively by the US military and many others. The Browning Hi-Power is another extremely popular design. He might be the most prolific single firearm designer in history. Mikhail Kalashnikov designed a bunch of guns, but they're all basically just various AKs.

[@That-Will-Do-It]

​​@@timd729 So do Europeans. His tilting barrel locked breech design has been the go to for most handguns ever to have been made.

[@hannesromhild8532]

So is that why the US paid the german company Mauser royalties, while at war with germany at the same time?

[@KingofJ95]

Fun fact: since many soldiers were from rural areas that engaged in bird hunting to feed themselves, many soldiers would regularly shoot thrown grenades out of the air.

[@Kade_The_Gamer]

Bro I need to see that

[@Spikeelsucko]

@@Kade_The_Gamer they even had (sometimes) special shot loads specifically for deflecting explosive devices, it was basically steel duckshot overloaded to increase shotpattern coverage, but would have limited effectiveness for actual combat.

[@honkykong7389]

Watch a couple pewview videos. That dude shoots fist sized objects thrown in the air like trap shooting. But with everything! Pistols, lever actions, Ars, Pcc's. It's all on KZbin. I would never believe it if I hadn't seen them. Amazing shooter from Iowa.

[@NateC.]

​@honkykong7389 yep. It's insane..would not want to make him mad or be his enemy in a fire fight lol

[@TC38Cole]

And skeet shooting was invented....

[@Tango_Hendrix]

I'd love to commission an oil painting of John Moses Browning and Eugene Stoner standing back to back like Lethal Weapon 3 holding their iconic weapons.

[@JacobE-23]

I'd buy a copy 😂

[@DLo336]

Browning holding a BAR and Stoner with a 63 in LMG configuration

[@kevmoful]

I’d prefer a an oil painting of those two taking a deuce in the ATF lobby

[@dads_diy]

That makes sense lmao I always wondered why it was called the “stoner mg”

[@crimson-foxtwitch2581]

Browning would have ten arms then

[@chimelxatrindad1516]

And it's Winchester.

[@SovietsbetterthanrussiaALT]

Yep 👍

[@cheesedoesgaming6088]

Not to mention most firearms in the time we’re brownings made in Europe since they wanted American schematics

[@paleoph6168]

The Americans also used the Remington Model 10, though the Winchester Model 1897 was more well-known.

[@langbo9999]

A high quality brand.

[@mrwheeljack7274]

no way Sherlock 😂

[@PhoenixT70]

Additionally, it was slam fire, meaning there is no trigger disconnect. If the gun is racked with the trigger depressed, the hammer will follow the bolt home and trigger the next round. Imagine this: you’re a German in some trench in 1918. You’re shooting at a bunch of Yankees in the open when some 19 year old from Wisconsin jumps into your trench, cranks off six 12 gauge shells in under three seconds, and then comes after you with the 17 inch long bayonet on the end of his shotgun. Nightmare fuel, that.

[@LegendStormcrow]

I'd deserve it for calling that corn shucker a yank.

[@skubz81]

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥

[@qparxiii]

No time to even think about surrender

[@bain69]

He gonna be one sauer Kraut

[@Arcane740]

OH SAY CAN YOU SEE?!

[@Overlord277]

Germans: You can't use shotguns! USA: Stop using GAS Germany: Nein

[@Ienteredmynamecorrectly-lt3nu]

That is an actual butchery of ww1

[@Overlord277]

@@Ienteredmynamecorrectly-lt3nu Don't care. My country won.

[@francrcg]

​@@Ienteredmynamecorrectly-lt3nuwomp womp

[@arashinoakumyo3535]

A friend’s family still has the shotgun and bayonet issued to his great grandfather. Kept in great condition and still works perfectly. His grandfather even took it to France during WW2, where the stock got cracked and he raided a furniture shop for glue.

[@gunsforevery1]

Great story.

[@427max]

@@gunsforevery1it’s not true but still great story

[@roderickstockdale1678]

Who was the grandfather with if it’s true?

[@OMGitzpeyton]

@@427maxand you know this how?

[@427max]

@@OMGitzpeyton because you don’t get to keep your weapons from the military and you definitely do not get to bro g your own when deploying that’s a fact, I served and so did my family and it’s just not a thing but a common lie or misconception

[@mylastaccountgotdeletedtha6936]

Germans coping about the war crime stick after they used chlorine gas, flamethrowers, and aerial bombings:

[@karpfenenjoyer]

Well the first gas use was french, and they also used flamethrowers. Both sides commited a lot of war crimes.

[@PALACIO254]

​@@karpfenenjoyerbut the Germans took the fall

[@haziqfahmi8716]

​@@karpfenenjoyerit's considered as war crimes if you are on the losing side. It doesn't apply to the victors.

[@bulkyturnip]

​@karpfenenjoyer yeah but the French used a more tear gas like chemical while Germany used straight up mustard gas

[@karpfenenjoyer]

@@PALACIO254 i am not native english. Can you say that in simpler terms?

[@CasualKillZz]

Forgot to mention that they were slamfire capable, a HUGE reason they were so hated and feared by the enemy

[@LIONTAMER3D]

Also, Americans were familiar & handy with those shotguns having used them for everything; from hunting to law enforcement. Europeans wouldn't have been able to use them as effectively. Slam fire, long range accuracy, rapid reloading; Americans were apparently monsters with those things.

[@verdant2215]

​@@LIONTAMER3D The NRA and Boy scouts of America were very popular back then. Young men learned how to use rifles and shotguns from an early age.

[@user-op8fg3ny3j]

@@LIONTAMER3D But experienced shooters tell me that they can fire quicker without slamfire?

[@ZudinGodofWar]

?

[@HaydenLau.]

Slamfire is an unintended bug

[@mgaamerica9185]

“We got a shotgun, a rifle, and a 4 wheel drive”

[@MadFox-jr6by]

and a concealed carry pistol for when we have to visit the city. . .

[@levigoodwin3522]

​@@MadFox-jr6by...so you don't lose your life for $43.

[@nathancraig4480]

@@levigoodwin3522 due to switch-blade knife stabbing.

[@-INSERT_FUNNY_HERE-]

This reads like your local redneck friend inviting you to go hunting on his 50 acre property out in Montana

[@liquidrockaquatics3900]

@@nathancraig4480in New York they just push you in front of a subway

[@dartfather]

The Philipine-American war really gave a good lesson. The .38 failed the soldiers, hence the decision for the 1911 and shotgun.

[@tophatminion.7558]

The only downside to the shotgun was the trash ammo.

[@AngryProtoBoi]

Paper shells were, admittedly, terrible for wet muddy areas. I think the shotguns would have to be retooled for brass shells though.

[@adivtayudhatama3926]

@@AngryProtoBoi Brass shells were indeed issued to the military at that time, but in limited quantities

[@joe1071]

When you design a shotgun so it doesn’t overheat and burn you, you know the lead is going to fly

[@gunsforevery1]

They all overheat. The heat shield just prevents you from getting burned. I took a Winchester 1897 dove hunting last September. It definitely got hot and burned my hand after 15 or so shots.

[@mgonzo3881]

The only problem was that the 1897 would have accidental discharges if you even moved the slide hard enough, or if the butt-stop got hit just right.

[@bigroxxor420]

​@@gunsforevery1"hunting"

[@gunsforevery1]

@@bigroxxor420 ok

[@TR13400]

​@@mgonzo3881 that's a feature. Not a bug. 🗿

[@jacobzehner2004]

Americans: We Americans bring these shotguns to fight you Germans. Germans: Nein Nein Nein that is a war crime.

[@blackout6403]

Americans; Shame.

[@haziqamsyar2009]

Meanwhile Germans : wow cool gas

[@vilneil]

@@haziqamsyar2009also german : haha flamethrown go bruhhhhhhhhhh

[@mr.v1442]

Nice pfp

[@cristsan4171]

*Decades later* Germsmany: shotgun is wunder invention of Gersmany Grand Reich

[@robinblackmoor8732]

Shotguns are still used to this very day by the military. The different rounds that are available make the shotgun very useful in combat. They are good for zombie apocalypse too.

[@christophercoupe5006]

Drones too!

[@ericolsen5592]

They wouldn't be very good against zombies. Limited range, limited capacity and the ammo itself is bigger so you can't carry as many shells. Rifles, carbines and pistols would probably be better but shotguns definitely play a role in modern tactical situations.

[@vault_dwelIer]

​​@@ericolsen5592 Shotguns have much better range than handguns. Rifles beat shotguns, but shotguns beat pistols. Gimme an m4 over a shotgun any day, but I'd take a rusted out shotgun over the nicest pistol in the world. The modern tactical use of shotguns is largely limited to door breaching. Exploding a zombie's head at 50 yards would be a nice capability. The biggest utility of a shotgun in a zombie apocalypse would be the diversity of roles. Slugs to take down large game, birdshot for small game, buckshot for zombies. I'd still rather have a rifle, but you're underselling the mighty 12 gauge.

[@metalclawsteelheart]

Don't forget! Germany tried to get shotguns nerfed IRL, and everyone else just laughed.

[@Ace2002]

“Shotguns are too much” *Uses Flamethrower and gas*

[@oliverpohlproductions8291]

The French had flamethrowers.

[@burnttoast26]

@@oliverpohlproductions8291They weren't whining about shotguns though. Bringing up the french continually just makes the germans look worse.

[@oliverpohlproductions8291]

@@burnttoast26 I disagree.

[@burnttoast26]

@@oliverpohlproductions8291 It doesn't matter that the french did it first when the germans are the ones hypocritically whining

[@Romanticalman]

@@oliverpohlproductions8291 But Germany used them more

[@chromabeatz1080]

“Hey you got any shotguns with a cheese grater on em?”

[@jonjacobjingleheimerschmid3798]

phhh! that's a bacon grill!

[@tachyon8317]

I know that reference!!!!

[@bluephoenix7565]

Its form the treasure panda guy! 🦝

[@tylersoto7465]

Lol 😂

[@georgewhitworth9742]

OG's will get it

[@herbertbrown119]

It’s one big weakness was the paper shot shells were subject to water damage.

[@bobsmoothie6445]

Imagine getting stabbed with the shotgun bayonet, and then getting shot with it still inside.

[@chaosinc.382]

I believe that is what one would call 'an ensured kill'.

[@gunsgalore7571]

Taking a civilian gun you hunt or defend yourself with, putting some military mods on it, and taking it to war with you is probably the most American idea of all times. The fact that it was absolutely badass on the battlefield just makes it even more American.

[@hulmad]

I've always said. Buy American is a weird nativist policy. Except when you need a gun or a knife. Then you should buy American because your life truly depends on it

[@sexistspaghettios]

​@hulmad why would that "policy" be weird? Genuine question btw. Not throwing shade!

[@gunsgalore7571]

@@sexistspaghettios Got to agree with you. I buy American whenever I can, regardless of what it is. Especially because if it's not made in America, it's probably made in China, and they are not very friendly to American interests over there.

[@lordsergal8783]

We also hired professional skeet shooters to blast incoming grenades before they could reach trench lines and our grenade shape differed from the then-popular Potato Mashers because our soldiers grew up with Baseball.

[@gunsgalore7571]

@@lordsergal8783 Nice

[@BeefWellington1]

Most important part of this gun was the fact you could just hold the trigger down and pump and it would shoot after each pump.

[@jemlesvideo]

However the firing occurs only when the pump is foward and it would have been far more convenient, if possible, that firing would happen when the pump is downward instead !

[@MikeJRosenthal]

Badass

[@ramtharthegreat]

Slamfire. My dad has owned one since he was a kid. He thought it was old and worn out, took it to a gun smith, they told him it is supposed to do that.

[@MeMyself_andAI]

​@@jemlesvideo when you pull the slide back it ejects the shell, how you gonna fire it with the breech open? And pulling it backwards would give you way less control of the shotgun. Thats why you hold a rifle as far as you can down the barrel if you dont have a vertical grip

[@jemlesvideo]

@@MeMyself_andAI Yeah that's why maybe if they had opportunity to invert the mechanism, I don't know. Well that's a shotgun and you could hipfiring it so I don't think that control is more important than ergonomy in that case. For the brain it's way more easy if it would had fired pump backward and ejecting foward.

[@joewoodchuck3824]

Buckshot is like a machine gun, only a shotgun delivers the projectiles all at the same time. Shh. Don't tell ATF.

[@peternorton5648]

Don’t sweat the AFT, smoking joe thinks we should all have a shotgun. 😂

[@chris9270]

I can't believe I never thought of that shotgun with a bayonet that's awesome

[@googleisevil3072]

Imagine being a German in the WW1 trenches, cold, tired, sick, etc. then all of the sudden you hear clackity-clack and the guy next to you gets sawed in half. Then you hear another clackity-clack. 😳😨

[@justinroux1610]

Then a sudden sound of shells hitting ground your friend Hans now has a body full of lead and pure American made love

[@got2kittys]

They were slam- fire also. Boom boom boom, as fast as they can pump. It took 2 or 3 seconds for a full mag dump.

[@jackcohen4931]

more like🤯

[@jjcoola998]

@@got2kittysdidn't know this! Very smart!

[@jjcoola998]

In reality they had been watching their boys get misted by field artillery so I'm sure it was horrifying in a new way

[@sirtofbaggins4270]

Shotgun diplomacy. Bringing peace to your door since the 1800's.

[@DragnSly]

You know a weapon is ungodly effective when it becomes a war crime to use it

[@JohnJohnson-ze1gg]

No no no. When the enemy wants it to be a war crime. Huge difference

[@DragnSly]

@@JohnJohnson-ze1gg Fair point, good sir

[@Josh-bq6rm]

BF 1 Memories flashing, good times

[@treborcivsop7356]

In 1970-71 in Vietnam I was issued a Model 1897 Trench Gun while conducting boarding parties looking for arms and munitions being infiltrated into South Vietnam.

[@roderickstockdale1678]

Patrol boater or something?

[@treborcivsop7356]

Something.....@@roderickstockdale1678

[@Cam-im8io]

You better have taken it home

[@TheXxshadowkillzxx]

Yo when those 2 soldiers got blown away with that first shotgun blast, pure comedy.

[@sagittarius3363]

South Park vibes on that one

[@the1andonlybelac]

Brooo the trench cleaner is so iconic

[@seanhorgan6774]

This must be why anything The Browning releases hits so hard.

[@sasin2715]

US: "Check this out, we made a gun for clearing trenches!" Germany: "Hans, hide der flammenwerfer, we can complain about warcrimes."

[@Nova11435]

IT IS DE FLAMMENWERFER! IT WERFS FLAMMEN!

[@rhinosaur.]

Another iconic design by the greatest firearm designer of all time--John Moses Browning.

[@jurassicsmackdown6359]

Was his last name Browning because his designs made the enemy brown their pants?

[@riyaansheikh7470]

​@@jurassicsmackdown6359 i guess 😂😂😂

[@andrebartels1690]

You forgot to depict that these shotguns were capable of pump fire. The soldier could hold the trigger depressed and with every loading pump, the shotgun would fire at once.

[@nigel900]

The most reliable, effective and devastating home defense weapon you could own…

[@MrCharlesFox]

The original "nerf shotguns" users

[@Deadleaf01]

they be the mfs with the speed build running around with the meta smg beaming people from 100 meters

[@roderickstockdale1678]

@@Deadleaf01no this ain’t Call Of Duty lol!

[@davemiller638]

​​@@roderickstockdale1678You obviously don't know that this _is_ cod, you just didn't notice because you have voice chat muted

[@roderickstockdale1678]

@@davemiller638 this is way more sane and stable than that as it’s narrated and depicted and thank god cause we don’t need no multiplayer shooting fest everywhere we see something about guns online or on apps!

[@joemo1033]

No, these were REAL shotguns. Not nerf darts. These shotguns loaded 00 Buck. Nasty stuff.

[@legendofman12]

I used to own an 1897 inherited from my grandpa who fought in WWII. Such a fantastic and beautifully engineered shotgun. I should get another.

[@skubz81]

What happened to the original?

[@legendofman12]

@@skubz81I had to give it to my beep-hole half-brother. My grandfather descended 2 guns and I opted to keep the double barrel 20 gauge instead because it was worth more and I use it more since I hunt. I knew he'd pawn the double barrel if he found out it was worth 2k so I gave him the 1897 which had a lot of mechanical problems with ejection. It was a really great hunting gun while I had it. Fun fact: I got stopped by a game warden with the 1897 and he went to check my firearm but he got scared since it has no safety and told me he's not going to touch the thing and to be careful with it haha.

[@billpetersen298]

@@legendofman12What do you hunt, with the 20? My granny, used to get rabbits with hers.

[@noahgonyea8866]

I actually just bought one a few months ago, matching numbers stock and barrel. Thing is a beauty

[@skubz81]

@@legendofman12 Sounds like a good move.

[@eadgbe13]

And Germany called War Crime over a shotgun. America wasn’t playing.

[@brdyn4547]

I love that the germans wanted to make the trench gun a war crime but they used mustard gas, flammenwerfers, etc

[@BrentDelong1253]

Winchester and Browning were mad geniuses.

[@gunsforevery1]

After browning started designing firearms, Winchester just started manufacturing them

[@AgentWashington28]

I propose we change americas mascot from Uncle Sam to john moses browning, because Uncle browning gave us the Winchester model 1897, the m2 browning 50cal machine gun and the colt 1911, he had single-handedly given America it’s most well known historical and modern weapons, which yes the m2 browning is still in use today

[@ralphalvarez5465]

Don't forget the Browning Automatic Rifle and don't forget the 1911 is still being used by many SWAT units in the US.

[@AgentWashington28]

@@ralphalvarez5465 damn right

[@ronaldschild157]

Not to mention later founding his own arms manufacturing company.

[@dragonseatcheese8727]

Don't forget the M1919, which saw extensive use in WW2, and was quite lethal in its own right.

[@friday13michael]

Shotguns in life > shotguns in video games

[@jonduggan7433]

The problem was with the waxed cardboard shotgun shells. After time the cardboard swelled from moisture making the gunpowder not fire and/ or hard to load or extract. All brass shells were developed but went into production too late to be of much use. There are LOTS of KZbin videos on just this subject.

[@buglerplayz7497]

Bro jumpscared me with the different voice

[@jamesbradford480]

fr bro

[@Emil_Stoltz]

What? Am I missing something? His voice was the same the whole video

[@davemiller638]

​@@Emil_StoltzNew voice actor

[@josh5dude]

American dude: *click-clack* German soldier: lol I’m in danger.

[@Mattnoble80]

My grandfather didn’t talk very much about the Second World War, it seriously impacted his life. I asked once did you know if you killed someone? He said I know I killed one, did it with a shotgun…now don’t ever ask me another question like that. It was right after that he gave me the swastika metal pin, that was the pin he wore so you keep that as a reminder you won’t ask me again

[@roderickstockdale1678]

Who was he with in Europe?

[@Mattnoble80]

He was with the Thirtieth Division made up of North Carolina, South Carolina and Tennessee volunteers. The division began in the 1st WW then was a reserve group re-organized in 1940 and became part of the Normandy Invasion. My grandfather was from Boston and went to the University of North Carolina Chapel Hill that’s why he served with the others from NC. He had graduated college and signed up to fight, he was more brave than I think I could be. They moved on further inland through southern Germany so he was there from Normandy until the end. He would talk about the beauty of the countryside during their movements but never the engagements that happened along the way

[@sethr.9349]

Americans: bring shotguns to France. Germans: "We are filing a formal complaint against their use. It is barbaric and immoral!" Americans: *gestures towards poison gas and flamethrowers* Germans: "We withdraw our objections."

[@castleanthrax1833]

Everyone used poison gas in WWI.

[@Mr.Murica1776]

@@castleanthrax1833the Germans used it the most tho. That’s why they are like the only ones acknowledged for it

[@castleanthrax1833]

@Southern_Hostpitality I just searched "who used poison gas the most in WWI, and got the following answer from Google. Since the French and English were allies, the amounts are pretty close on both sides. By the end of the war the Germans produced the most poison gas with 68,000 tons, the French second with approximately 36,000 tons and the British produced approximately 25,000 tons. About three percent of gas casualties were fatal, but hundreds of thousands suffered temporary or permanent injuries.

[@sethr.9349]

@@castleanthrax1833 More importantly, the Germans were the first ones to start using it in direct violation of multiple codes of war.

[@castleanthrax1833]

@@sethr.9349 I guess you haven't heard the phrase "2 wrongs don't make a right"?

[@mattcrowden1262]

When the Americans entered the war the Germans found out just how devastating a 19 year old slam firing a Winchester Model 1897 with 00 buckshot was. I’ve read multiple stories from German soldiers describing the wounds and effectiveness of them. One of my favorites is from a U.S. Captain J.H. Hoskins, who fought at Belleau Wood, “Every time that shotgun fired three or four Germans would go down. The more the surprise gripped them, the closer they would huddle and the deadlier was the fire, That shotgun was new to them.”

[@ahseaton8353]

Firing one shot of 00 buck is the equivalent of dumping an entire clip from a Luger. Then the American has 5 more shells left and a 22" bayonet if there's anyone left.

[@hannesromhild8532]

you know that thing was absolut crap right? It rarely worked and most stories are just made up for selling guns postwar. That thing was a very rare guard weapon that simply never worked well enough for the trenches. but every guard equiped with one would free up a realy usefull gun.

[@mattcrowden1262]

@@hannesromhild8532 I’ve heard quite the opposite. From my studies and research of weapons of WW1 the Winchester Model 1897 was a more than superb shotgun for the time and the use in which it was being fielded for. You also have to take a look at the conditions of which they had to endure (lots of mud and dirt) at that time smalls arms weapon technology was not like it is today so just about every weapon on the front had its problems, none where perfect all around in all conditions. Back to the reliability of the Model 1897, the problem was not the gun itself but the paper shells they where issued with back then. The shells would get wet and when they where damp they would not cycle, tearing and jamming the action. It was recommended that they use brass shells but due to the US supplying the Allies with raw materials in mass that was never done. They planned to issue it in masses my 1919 but as we know the war ended in 1918. It was favored enough to almost have been mass issued and it mutilated enough Germans for them to try and ban it so to say that it was “absolute crap” is a little far fetched

[@johnarmstrong6403]

My maternal grandfather was a shotgunner in WWI. He was a Kentucky moonshiner before and after the war. He considered the 97 the best gun ever made. My dad had a civilian model that his older brother bought during the depression. We both grieved the loss of that gun in a burglary like the death of an old friend. I've known, and owned many fine shotguns in my life, but never met the equal to the Winchester 97.

[@NobodyNeedstoknow-bq5px]

@@hannesromhild8532 Germans would beg to disagree since they literally tried to get them banned. Call me stupid, but I can't see any intelligent reason to ban an enemies weapon that doesn't work and never got used. Try again.

[@TheColosiss]

According to some war-journals. Shotgunners would spend their spare time making custom speed loaders or pouches to improve time. Many would make them and then discard them. My master for gunsmithing inherited some of his uncle's equipment. He has one of those custom wooden loaders from his grandfather. He also has a few of his custom made shell holders. Not many survived the war. Few brought those things back. He also has his war journal. I've asked about it. What my master is willing to relay some to this: His uncle described how they would storm certain locations. Machine-gun fire on both sides would make a small distraction and a tiny angle for the shotgunners to run forward on. Sometimes double file, they ran forward dumping rounds and rotating men forward. The man up front rotating down, load, and up and would be in file at the rear ready. They would hit the trench and then separate depending on circumstances and orders. Apparently they were all excellent shots with a scatter gun, and they were ruthless. Sometimes, they would shoot for target incapacitation instead of verified kills. The object being that they have precious seconds to gather certain key objectives in a very small window of time. WW1 was brutal...

[@skibidisigmaaa]

Imagine adding a gas port on its side and making it push a piston to automatically pump it, remove the wood and put a bigger hollow handle over it that's fixed, and maybe making the trigger shoot full auto

[@robertboros4429]

Ah yes the war crime stick

[@TheREPPIX]

Affectionately known as the soup gun

[@ccggenius]

That's not a stick, it's a broom.

[@robertboros4429]

@@TheREPPIX Yes

[@robertboros4429]

The broom gun I know I just like it when it is called a stick@@ccggenius

[@alexanderrahl7034]

Imagine getting stabbed with that bayonet, only to have your attacker realize he still had a shell in the chamber 💀

[@lockdownfan9853]

Got me thinking stab em with the bayonet and then pump the shotgun

[@brett324]

Imagine getting stabbed with a bayonet and then getting fucking blasted 5 times with a 12 Guage in quick succession

[@SouplexSouffle]

@@brett324 I dont wanna imagine that. Lol

[@ChristianChavarria-zo7fq]

​@@brett324I'm pretty sure I wouldn't be able to imagine anything past the first 2.

[@tachyon8317]

Realizing he still has 1 left, then a smile grows on his face

[@Baldbutstillhuman]

I’m a firm believer that a shotgun is one of the best firearms ever. Despite its short range, there isn’t much a shotgun can’t do.

[@ZSmith-yy4lv]

They suffer in ammo capacity and as you mentioned, distance. The ammo is large and heavy too. 7 rounds of 12ga take up about the same amount of space as a 30 round mag of 5.56. Great for a civilian who can hunt bird, rabbit, deer, elk, and bear in the same day and go home where it then becomes one of the best home defense weapons, but aside from room clearing in urban environments, its use in combat is limited. Still, as a civilian, a shotgun is definitely my first choice of long gun.

[@marshallwebb7050]

Rock Island armory has a new model of these. Not sure how similar they are, but they look alike, sort of.

[@Yodie208]

I was actually issued that shotgun while pulling guard duty at the airfield in the 1970's. I was also issued 3 rounds of birdshot...lol

[@TheVillainInGlasses]

Sounds about right lmao.

[@Luckmorne]

As they say, at very close range "an ounce of lead is an ounce of lead"

[@BeetleBuns]

​@@Luckmorneyou need to be REALLY damn close though, those pellets don't stay close enough together for long enough to be reliably lethal to humans

[@RM-cm8hz]

youre not going to want to fight after getting hit with birdshot from 30 yards. guaranteed. @@BeetleBuns

[@BeetleBuns]

@@RM-cm8hz I never said you would. What I DID say is that it's not reliably lethal. Maybe address THAT instead of setting up a strawman.

[@nadagainagain4987]

Over 100 years old and still the best shotgun money can buy

[@Andrew-dd1fr]

Binelli has entered the chat

[@nadagainagain4987]

@@Andrew-dd1fr I said best not nicest.

[@romanfields7900]

870

[@zacharyjacobs7233]

Best by what measure?

[@mike7652]

​@@nadagainagain4987That's a matter of opinion, of course.

[@Toon_Lucario]

As a certain Russian Badger once said: “Trench Gun go chk chk”

[@user-tn6ph3ve3u]

Ww3 all these people be yelling "200 pumped!" Like 😭

[@Knighty416]

Gun manufacturers: How long do you want the Barrel? America: Yes.

[@tachyon8317]

"America sized!"

[@ptorq]

Americans: About a year and a half ought to be enough to larn 'em.

[@grayman556]

When I was in Military Police School at Ft Leonard Wood MO in 2000 we used these shotguns. When I deployed to Iraq I was issued the Benelli. Talk about two different words.

[@FundyisleLegacy]

Like swapping sandpaper for silk lol

[@ExtrovertedIntrovert123]

Trench gun go Brrrrt

[@eriknewman5288]

It's called a trench sweeper because you could hold the trigger down and pump it and unload fast.

[@John-gr4td]

Ok boys, let’s show them how we do this back home!

[@PatrickMJr]

I can hear the YEEEEHAAAAA battle cries now lol

[@Dafuq-is-going-on]

America perfected trench warfare, then WW1 happened.

[@Adrianfytr46]

I don't think they did this stuff at home😂. Unless those sneaky Germans infiltrated the Midwest.

[@abeedhal6519]

Ironically the Germans helped to decide the american civil war. Should have never done that, america has been nothing but a cancer to the world. @@Adrianfytr46

[@roderickstockdale1678]

@@Dafuq-is-going-onwhen did they ever use it before?

[@rxrfun9198]

That's the most goddamn American thing I've seen this hour.

[@C.Jr12]

You can hold a machine gun and a WWI veteran would still find a way to end your chapter with a mere shotgun💀

[@Chillllllbruh]

"Whatever I was doing dude...it was unhealthy for me." "I was conducting electricity so..."

[@XxMacexX04]

They forgot the "hidden feature" slam fire! LOL

[@johnneal7155]

Yet another great firearm designed by John Browning.

[@blaine1234]

Germany: nerf pls USA: skill issue

[@L3FT2BURN]

It was effective when properly ammoed. Problems came due to plastic shortages, many soldiers were issued paper cartridges which got wet and gunked up receivers, making them damn near useless.

[@pvzfan1260]

"Oh god what happened!" " I HAVE A SHOTGUN!"

[@justsomeone8837]

(Cool shotgun transition)

[@Vikingr4Jesus5919]

LazyPurple reference I see

[@Reb32573]

Just goes to show that a shotgun really has stood the test of time… its flat badassness and effectiveness make it a true favorite in all types of war and situations requiring use of a firearm.

[@TheREPPIX]

It's about as close as you can get to a rail gun

[@gunsgalore7571]

Well, all situations requiring the use of a firearm at under 50 yards. The Springfield m1903 bolt-action rifle was the main U.S. weapon of the war; the shotgun was just used in certain close-range situations like night raids in the trenches.

[@robertdevito5001]

Yeah, like sniping.

[@Reb32573]

@@robertdevito5001 uses within reason/close combat.

[@Dafuq-is-going-on]

Have rifled barrels with slug shot.

[@dragonseatcheese8727]

The Colt M1911, the Browning HP, the Browning M1919 heavy machine gun, the M1918 BAR SSW, and the 1897 Trench Gun. All of them were designed by Browning. Two of those are still used by militaries around the world after a century. Browning was a beast.

[@mcpig3240]

The 1897 also had a slam fire feature. IF you hold the trigger back, the gun fires on each time you slam the slide forward. Marines referred to it as a "Trench Broom." The Germans called it a war crime. LOL.

[@yugoslavball1945]

Germany: NOOOO!!! YOU CAN’T USE SHOTGUNS!!!!!! IT’S A VIOLATION OF WAR!!!!” America: “Hehe, shotgun go boom.”

[@justinroux1610]

Meanwhile German using posionus gas and flamethrower

[@Ienteredmynamecorrectly-lt3nu]

this is just 99% of the comments, overplaying America's role in the war.

[@brantleythomas3941]

Germans: this will be our century!! Winchester M1897: I don’t believe we’ve met

[@tachyon8317]

Shotguns - "you must be this 'jerry' I've heard so much about! A pleasure, a REAL pleasure to meet you! Allow me and my friends to introduce ourselves..."

[@Theomite]

Germans: this will be our century! *19th century enters the battlefield* Also Germans: ...Zen again...

[@abeedhal6519]

Jews in new york brainwashing the amerimutt public : Don't think so.

[@josefhuber8531]

Dude, if you believe that one weapon decided two world wars, it would do you good to read.

[@abeedhal6519]

you are perverted@@tachyon8317

[@gamerguyAnticensor]

At close range this gun is so effective, hardly miss targets

[@AlphaDog482]

Looks like a throwback is needed

[@aaronkenney4769]

Slam firing this thing into a bunker must’ve been the greatest rush but also the most terrifying sound depending who you were. Primary weaponry was still bolt action rifles so this was really effective

[@Miyamoto8Musashi]

Probably the most important and fun fact about it you didn’t even mention… ITS SLAM FIRE!😍 just hold down the trigger and pump and your sending tons of lead down range

[@ragalthor]

Next step: machine shotgun belt fed.

[@PICKLEFLOW]

Now that’s American

[@Romanticalman]

Indeed

[@_bumky_3053]

You know it's dangerous when the shotgun has a bayonet

[@NobodyNeedstoknow-bq5px]

US Army - "Slam fire buckshot...hmm, that's nice and all, but can't we make it deadlier somehow?" Designer -"No, not really." US Army - "What if we stuck a knife on the end?" Designer -"Well, if you really must, but honestly, 5 hits of buckshot won't leave anything large enough to stab..." US Army - "Have you not heard that we don't believe there is such a thing as overkill?

[@turibamweivan6083]

Atleast we still got some commedy in these skits😂😂😂

[@brkbtjunkie]

My FFL was refurbing a 1917 trench gun last time I was there. Awesome piece of history complete with the cheese grater on top.

[@justinmaxwell4925]

Having one, they’re pretty damn solid. Also, slam firing as fast as you can is pretty fun/devastating.

[@TheDootSlayer]

Americans carrying shotguns into war have been a thing since the Revolution, but the Winchester brought a whole new ball game to WW1.

[@ahseaton8353]

The shotgun used to be called the smoothbore musket, widely used up to and through the American Civil War.

[@TheDootSlayer]

@@ahseaton8353 Muskets and shotguns were two completely different weapons. The musket typically had a much longer barrel and fired either balls or "grape shot" (one large ball and three smaller shot) while the shotgun tended to be much shorter, usually having two barrels, and fired smaller buck shot. Both were widely used in the Civil War, particularly in the Confederacy.

[@NixxyNixon]

🇩🇪: wahhh you can’t use that it’s inhumane. 🇺🇸: what’s that cloud of gas over the Russians?

[@Goalcrusher1000]

I love my semi auto 12 gauge breach barrel, it’s the most fun to shoot, reload, and less recoil than anything else I’ve ever shot. Versatility of ammunition, and devastating power of destruction.

[@nobody2132]

gotta love shotguns, especially the newer Remington 870

[@LegendStormcrow]

I got a FEAR-17. Well, I did before I got on that boat. Sucker was mag fed.

[@noahtackett6264]

Well idk, I'd take a trenchgun over an 870 anyday. Not only is it more valuable, I like slamfire a lot more and the option of mounting a sword to my shotgun

[@davidyetter5409]

The 97 was and is the ultimate shotgun. I have 6 of them in both 12 and 16.

[@LegendStormcrow]

@@davidyetter5409 I dunno dude. Mag fed is fun

[@davidyetter5409]

@@LegendStormcrow you gotta do slam fire. You can make it sound like a straight roar.

[@carlambroson8872]

The Lord is my shotgun! 😂

[@user-ft9ys1qb9k]

WHAT. MADE THE 1897. SO EFFECTIVE...WAS THE ABILITY TO HOLD. THE TRIGGER DOWN. AND AS FAST AS YOU COULD PUMP.....IT FIRED......LIKE A MACHINE GUN

[@westcoastseattleboy784]

Paper shells did not like the weather in Europe. In the dry these were great. In the wet…the bayonet probably got used a lot in the rain

[@Easy-Eight]

The US Army issued brass shot gun shells. You knew that, right? Civilians can't afford full brass shot gun shells.

[@westcoastseattleboy784]

@@Easy-Eight they issued brass at the end of the war in response to issues with the earlier paper shells

[@hannesromhild8532]

@@Easy-Eight Brass shells never made it into Europe. Also that was far from the only issue with that thing.

[@tecraman8100]

Would waxed paper remedy that issue?

[@Easy-Eight]

@@tecraman8100 no. The joint between the brass-of-the-powder and the paper (more like cardboard) body containing the shot would eventually leak. Also, where the round is crimped it would leak. I collect paper shotgun shells, own hundreds, and store them in sealed plastic bags.

[@MrDrew1]

The old trench sweeper. Plus you could slam fire it. I want one

[@brianallison1913]

I know a guy who has one. It was his grandfathers who fought in ww1. They're pretty valuable also