We Just Discovered "Dark" Oxygen on Earth - Breakthrough Explained

[@DrBenMiles]

I loved reading into this. Infinite oxygen source or Baghdad Battery? Let me know what you think! And learn about science faster with Shortform. Don't miss out on 20% though www.shortform.com/drben

[@esecallum]

Another nail in the coffin of the fraudulent climate change models in addition to the photo-molecular effect discovered last year.

[@CathodeRayKobold]

You've got a voice people could sleep to. You go so low I can count the vibrations.

[@mbmurphy777]

@@DrBenMiles where does the energy come from for the ongoing oxygen production? Especially if we’re talking about significant oxygen production, a tremendous amount of energy has to come from somewhere. There’s not gonna be enough energy in “batteries” to run the process for more than minutes, probably. Hours at most. what recharges the batteries?

[@polymorphus1]

@@mbmurphy777 Yeah this is a riff on cold fusion and perpetual motion machines, anti-gravity, and other magic it doesn't make sense unless you really believe

[@sasasimunovic7709]

"Dr." Ben on his way to become a flat Earther. I expect the next video to be titled "Did aliens build the pyramids?"

[@davideyers9405]

I think that the sheer fact that the mined areas had not recovered and bacteria hadn't returned is enough to do a lot more study before possible devastation.

[@AlexHonger-fj3nx]

China has already started to strip mine, even if we make a devastating discovery like it could kill the ocean life almost entirely, trying to get China to give a single-f about the environment is like trying to get a paper plane to the moon... Just look at their "tar pits" produced by liquefying old tech down with chemicals that stretch on for MILES. They found out in the early 2000's it was causing cancer in all the people and animals in the area, not only have they not cleaned up but they are to this day still filling more pit's... Climate people wanna cry about carbon emissions, hunny China will put the planet in a death spin faster then any Hummer or steak dinner ever would. I guess the next big war is going to be happening under water. Black gold, now black oxygen? How fitting.

[@masterinico]

Literally this. The fact that mining has left the area unable to recover even bacteria for decades says a lot about the process and how much damage it’s doing

[@CheeseWheelEnthusiast]

@@droyal18able Stay on topic Droyal. We are talking about mining.

[@CheeseWheelEnthusiast]

@@droyal18able And you're crying like you're a baby. What's your point? Why do you care so much about what other people think?

[@lelgazelle]

@@droyal18able Thanks, easily the most brain dead thing I've read or heard this year.

[@Shogoeu]

Mining company disproving a study that could stop their business - shocking!

[@maranscandy9350]

Seems a bit reminiscent of Coca Cola funding studies showing that Coke is not detrimental to good health.

[@suzymatwetwe]

Go figure 😏. They're as corrupt as the pharmaceutical industry.

[@danbul5853]

The whole world is like this, I don't trust anything the private sector says

[@elvien1640]

Like any intellectual human being would take them seriously

[@maija-liisapiittari9618]

@@maranscandy9350 And cigarrette industry and WHO of C-shots.

[@divineinpurple9058]

Whether the battery theory accounts for the oxygen levels or not, the fact that areas that have been mined are not recovering even after 40 years is a very strong argument that these operations need to be stopped until we understand more about them.

[@daffydrunkv1659]

Too much greed

[@OrganicGreens]

I have a feeling we are just trying to use ecological arguments to stop the mining because the United States dose not have as good of access to these minerals as china does because of some international agreement

[@athelwulfgalland]

Much agreed!

[@white00joe]

Or we start dropping outdated supercapacitor material e-waste to the bottom to supplement the mining. Most supercapacitor material is carbon.

[@annanelson6830]

Oh, shall we just hasten the demise of life on this planet and scrape the sea floor…?

[@ikeeuler6299]

This reminds me a lot of the studies funded by tobacco companies that showed devastating health problems associated with smoking...that they buried and hid because it wasn't good for their short-term profits.

[@jadesouttakes]

I think about this a lot, I just went on a trip and on every plane there are still ashtrays and compartments to dispose of cigarettes despite it being illegal to smoke there, crazy how cigarettes will never ‘go out of style’ I guess bcus money

[@jadesouttakes]

Despite all the very indisputable health risks

[@syyneater]

The same can be said for the oil companies suppressing research about the effects of fossil fuels. I’d hope we’ve learned since then, but I know we haven’t.

[@1StanTheMan1]

Really? Did the Tobacco companies and their investors fund that research and development openly like this? Nope. Just stop.

[@duB420Grass]

Most science funding comes from major corporations looking to to improve profit by any means necessary. It's where the most if the money is. Independent research is very limited because of a lack of funding, unless you want to play ball with the military; the other place where most of our cash is. We live in a profit over people society and the resulting scientific research reflects that.

[@Merrsharr]

It actually makes perfect sense to call it Dark Oxygen, since it's synthesized in darkness (as opposed to photosynthesis which required light)

[@vex0854]

Photosynthesis= Written in light Skotosynthesis= Written in dark

[@жизненный_опыт]

Saka deez nuts thesis

[@peppermintnightmare4741]

Skoto? Thats pretty cool ​@@vex0854

[@ChikleSimmons-lh9hb]

A body of water is one. Sunlight hits the water regardless. Energy is spread through the entire body of water.

[@jac6548]

@@vex0854 skeetosynthesis = written across your mother's face

[@matchrocket1702]

I'm shocked, shocked I tell you, that metal mining companies dispute the findings of this study.

[@donnydarko7624]

It's like that new TV show that is a reboot of an old Tv show, that was also a reboot of an older TV show where the scientific community tells the world how they have conducted research on a subject, and the data suggests that the subject they studied is detrimental to humanity, but their is a lot of money involved and the ppl who stand to lose out on a lot of profit, well they know that it's cheaper to fund a misinformation propaganda campaign than it is to invest in an alternative or especially to pioneer a new industry. Especially since they know they can just pay off politicians to make sure no laws are passed to stop them from making boatloads of money at the expense of human life for 50 years. First was tabaco, then the oil industry, now this.

[@jemborg]

​@@donnydarko7624 sugar too...

[@codylay5346]

I’m shocked, shocked I tell you that asteroid mining meets the same level of resistance…

[@adamcravets5408]

They learned a great deal from the smoking industry.

[@corrob]

@@adamcravets5408 and the asbestos industry.

[@objective_psychology]

This could have HUGE implications for the history of life, such as the origins of eukaryotes and animals, with respect to how Earth's free oxygen levels have changed over time

[@MaximilianonMars]

Creation ex nihilo is the answer if you have a spine and consistency.

[@jimfortnite7810]

@@MaximilianonMars who invited the creationist dork

[@JBPazos]

Add electricity (hydrolisis) to the ingredients for the life-soup recipe. Mindblowing.

[@dirtpig02]

​@@MaximilianonMars creation ex nihilo is exclusively in religious texts and has no basis in science

[@Khann_2102]

​@@MaximilianonMarsWhat

[@AndrewZolnai]

As a geologist who studied proterozoic rocks at the cusp for oxygenated life (when O2 was 'poison' as a by-product of photosynthesis until life as we knkw it evolved) I find this finding not at all odd, however fascinating the work is and important it is to maintain such environs untouched.

[@a.karley4672]

Most people forget (or don't know) that there are around a dozen forms of photosynthesis that don't release oxygen - and indeed, some of the prokaryotes that do this are very deeply rooted in the genetic "tree of life", suggesting that the origin of photosynthesis itself is very deeply rooted, time wise. Life may have been around for hundreds of millions of years before symbiosis between an alpha-proteobacterium and [whatever, I forget] led to the first chloroplasts, and then the Great Poisoning. Personally, I'm pretty dubious about this "polymetallic electrolysis" explanation, because the "loop" is unclosed about how the metallic components of the nodules are generated. Becasue it's not as if there are grains of metal floating around on the seabed. I could envisage cycling between producing metals, then consuming metals and producing oxygen ... but then wouldn't you expect to see the metals and their decomposition products in concentric layers in the nodules - which is not something I've heard of. But nodule research isn't well publicised. I note that his circulation time for the thermohaline circulation loop is off by a factor of 20-odd. He cites "100 to 1000" years, when 20~40 thousand years is more like it (the exact length being subject to a lot of "known unknown").

[@AndrewZolnai]

@@a.karley4672 thx 4 ur explanation

[@bit-tuber8126]

Eureka moments in science can move science forward, but it's the "that's funny" moments by the observant that really moves things along.

[@williamyoung9401]

Every fossil fuel executive ever: "I don't care; we'll be dead long before our greedy actions destroy our species...heh, that's funny. 🤣"...

[@davidarvingumazon5024]

Click bait title. 😶

[@tunasandwich8049]

Don't forget the "bruh" moment, like when penicillin was discovered

[@Laocoon-8h32g]

Pretty sure the "that's funny" moment was when oxygen levels didn't decrease as expected.

[@SNOOPY_-]

yet they banged on how ''the science is settled'' and 99.999% agree with that the science IS settled''...i guess those who didnt were simpley killed for the sake of climate change,cuz goverments dont react well to opposition

[@almightytreegod]

What I got out of this is we need to stay tf away from mining the ocean floor. Very very far away.

[@haidara77]

Agree, but sadly most countries all they care about is MONEY

[@Ash_quacks]

I agree

[@micah.101]

@@haidara77 companies*

[@haidara77]

@@micah.101 both*

[@ForeverHobbit]

@@micah.101 countries have the power to stop companies, if they don't it means they want taxes being paid by those companies

[@theuzae_]

He spent 15 minutes to tell us that the researchers believe that this oxygen production is being driven by a geological process involving metallic nodules on the seabed. These nodules may be acting as a form of natural battery, splitting water molecules into hydrogen and oxygen. Edit: he could've said this in the start and then elaborate on the topic, atleast answer the title in the intro

[@JuanRanklin]

Finally a simple explanation, thanks man!

[@geoff7727]

Fr bro i had to skip like most of the video. Why are people like that?

[@Desecrator6]

​@geoff7727 some people like the smell of their own farts...or like to hear themselves talk... I skipped halfway through the word salad

[@enyalabanks8678]

@@geoff7727because he’s making a longer informative video, with thorough explanations and extra information? Not just a 15 second summary?

[@rottenmeat5934]

Thanks. These self-proclaimed science channels are insufferable.

[@monkeysquad11]

Literally everything we've learned about the deep ocean says we shouldn't be mining it. Researchers - "we need to keep studying to learn more about whether or not we should mine it"

[@a.karley4672]

You missed out the important step where metals-market traders say to various companies "we need *lots* more metals to sell high-value products to people who can barely afford to feed their children, so we can make more profit". Those companies then go off, read the literature, and spawn research branches to try to supply the metals demand for several decades hence - that being the timescale to develop a major mine. These events don't happen in a vacuum. Someone wants to buy those metals, otherwise the mining companies wouldn't fund development of new mines. (And for completeness, to bring the population of the Earth up to "western" levels of consumption will need several more Earth-size planets. Even with perfect recycling of already-mined metals.)

[@Sgt.chickens]

@@a.karley4672 its somewhat of a Cash grab, one of the main companies pushing for Deep ocean mining is pressing hard that it will "save the earth" (which yes is obviously bullshit) because the nodules can be aquired for Cobalt and nickel for batteries. but we wont be Using cobalt or nickel in batteries soon, Solid state batteries are fast developing, The guy knows he's got about 5 to 10 years to get that metal up before it becomes worthless by comparison to now,.

[@TurdBoi666]

​@@a.karley4672 what about Japan?

[@a.karley4672]

@@TurdBoi666 Maybe I should have used the phrase "first world" rather than "western". Japan is included in the "high consumption" part of the world. Besides, Japan is unimportant compared to China in resource-consumption potential.

[@CD-yr8tw]

Well, human's might as well destroy the ocean floor next.

[@Airsaber]

You know this is something huge the moment a representative of a mining company tries to form a rebuttal. Now let's see how many years must pass and how much of the ocean floor must still be destroyed before these findings stop being ignored (my guess is decades at the very least, considering the ongoing devastation of the environment by oil companies, among others).

[@andrice42]

Yeah, all you have to do is say your not convinced and have billion dollar investment firms hire some lobbyists to make sure it gets gutted and findings ignored for decades. I won't be surprised if protesters get arrested and jailed during those decades either. They've jailed stop oil protesters for 4-5 years in the UK.

[@jlrutube1312]

What is funny to me is a certain group is going to be in a catch-22. Stop destroying the environment on the ocean floor by stopping the mining they need to make batteries for EVs or stop making so many EVs and go back to making more ICE cars.

[@ezekielbreedlove7698]

Considering the fact that not all countries will ever agree either the findings and that our laws have no effect on what the other countries do means the problem will never end!

[@Jay-fl5yr]

Oil companies knew about climate change in the 1970s yet “drill baby drill” is going as strong as ever.

[@Chaisz3r0]

Irrespective of why it works, the fact that we know it does and how slow it is to recover and replenish means the only choice is to stop scraping the last layer of life off the face of the earth.

[@WayneBraack]

What layers of Life are you talking about? Trees? We have more of those than we did 40 yrs ago because we've been planting trees like crazy for decades.

[@cernunnos_lives]

No kidding. We still need that flimsy level.

[@Chaisz3r0]

@@WayneBraack We have been clearing ancient forests with generations and generations of trees, underbrush of varying height, lychen, moss, fungi and bacteria, providing support for countless forms of more complex life, forming an amazingly complex web, and replace them with sterile grids of tree mono-cultures. Equating them would be naïve, bordering malevolent.

[@robwi7369]

Nah, it’s ok Science will find a way.

[@olly2276]

You're absolutely right but good luck convincing Mr Monopoly!

[@PeterS-r4o]

As a scientist involved with research for the tobacco industry I have 'serious reservations' about studies suggesting smoking causes cancer etc etc

[@alexrogers777]

lmao yeah, that one scientist working for a deep sea mining company saying he thinks the study proving that deep sea mining is bad has the biggest conflict of interest of all time

[@JohnAvillaHerpetocultural]

Yup. Apply that logic to the pharmaceutical industry and consider the implications.

[@Kit-Ballou3664]

It's anecdotal but I'm old enough to remember the emphysema tents and lung cancer deaths of my grandparents and their siblings (smokers) in their 70s. The next generation who didn't smoke skipped all that.

[@derekladyga1716]

Now take the vaccine!

[@ishikawa9827]

@@Kit-Ballou3664 They couldve been exposed to some kind of hazardous work environment and then that disaster may have been blamed on cigarettes.

[@redarndiculous]

Rarely, if ever, have I seen B-roll (background) footage that is so accurate to what is actually being discussed. I'm impressed

[@standardannonymousguy]

No, it's not called "dark" because it is not known or understood, it is "dark" because it is created in a location that does not receive light - that is the very bottom of the ocean. All other oxygen has always been believed to be produced by sunlight. Having said that, I loved your video. Thank you for sharing this!

[@that1dude66]

Came here to say the same thing.

[@coreym162]

Not true. Cyanobacteria produces oxygen from carbon byproducts and hydrogen at the bottom of the ocean. There's a 2018 paper on it and publication in Nature magazine. Why few talk about how incredible they are is beyond me. It's also beyond me why blooms are destroyed after knowing they are "Major" contributors to global biogeochemical cycles and seen as a bad thing by Climate Alarmists... They also outnumber every organism on Earth.

[@jasonolson1593]

That is how I understood the term as well

[@Eagleeye-ve4ze]

he's just referring to the fact dark energy and dark matter are unknowns and the term dark is used for that reason

[@meloncrusher3316]

I dont understand how these scientists are able to publish outrageous titles in the first place. “Dark” already has a clear connotation in physical chemistry, that is the anti-matter of an element. Anti matter oxygen is a thing, theoretically. So imagine how excited I am when I see the video title. Sure the discovery is still interesting. But its highly misleading. Shameful that scientists resorts to tiktok tier equivalent of clickbaiting.

[@brbrbrbrbrbr8393]

What I don't quite understand is why they did not measure the Hydrogen levels. Shouldn't that give a clear indication of whether electrolysis is taking place or am I missing something?

[@tomholroyd7519]

They were originally only looking for a biosignature. Now that we know about this I'm sure people will be doing that.

[@jf3457]

They probably did, but they reserve it for another paper. In science, it is common to stretch the story's sausage.

[@pnxda]

@@jf3457 Im very intrested to see if that theory can be proven, because having that on deep sea level will surely change how we see the earth in some way.

[@keysersmoze]

How about measuring chlorine levels, as electrolysis of sea water produces chlorine not oxygen? I think these "scientists" are dumber than the rocks they study.

[@danielcurda3633]

This would be included. Increase of hydrogen levels might be what is killing the microbes. Exclusion of this makes me ask questions and stringing out the reader doesn't pass the sniff test. Unless you're doing the fake science thing where peers aren't actually reviewing papers. If so, then ok, that works.

[@fdavidmiller2]

Chemosynthesis of oxygen is not a novel phenomenon. It’s extremely rare. But it’s been seen before in deep caves.

[@coreym162]

Black Mold and Cyanobacteria already do it though. Black mold has been observed as eating radiation and converting it into energy in the Chernobyl Sarcophagus and Cyanobacteria eat hydrogen and carbon by-products turning them into Oxygen and Nitrogen. They are literally the first photosynthesizers.

[@Zaihanisme]

The black mold doesn't produce oxygen in the process of radiosynthesis though

[@robsonez]

​@@coreym162PHOTOsynthesis.

[@reeflab2221]

Couldn’t have said it better @fdavidmiller2

[@StandingTALL4now]

@@coreym162 Thats literally not what photosynthesizing is though

[@mimikurtz2162]

I was really exited for a minute - when I saw "dark oxygen" I thought you meant in the sense of dark matter.

[@bardsamok9221]

Yeah it's an amateur move to use the term "dark oxygen" because it confuses unrelated scientific concepts. Very 'un-science'

[@parfiteleporter]

Dark is a prefix to something we don’t yet understand how it happens in science

[@andremarques3317]

@@bardsamok9221 only amateurs get confuse past a few seconds with this terminology. So many things can be "dark" for several reasons

[@DiabloTheKingOfHell]

*The only thing you know about what this comment once was, is the absolute hell-storm it created in the replies.

[@edwardmacnab354]

it's better to share

[@seanhewitt603]

Machiavelli himself would be proud of that description...

[@thewb8329]

The basis of all conflict is the competition for limited and access to resources. We are no different from any other species but just more extreme due to our intelligence and technological development.

[@edwardmacnab354]

@@thewb8329 our intelligence lol. "GOOD ONE "

[@HermanVonPetri]

@@thewb8329 If you define "conflict" as actions including and adjacent to geopolitical or tribal warfare, then probably yes. But I don't see how violence stemming from homophobia or religious ideology is rooted in the competition for resources. Sometimes people just want to hurt other people.

[@sergioaragonrod8556]

Not the mining company CEO being immediately hesitant and diminishing the findings that go against his profits

[@Coverswithchords1]

Can't make someone understand something, if his profit depends on not understanding.

[@DAMfoxygrampa]

I'm absolutely sure there's no relationship there. Rich people always have the world's best interests at heart

[@stevepittman3770]

You either misunderstood or misstated the sediment argument from the paper. They weren't saying that the disruption of sediment from the bow wave of the ship was leading to an increased rate of nodule formation, but rather that it was exposing more of the surface area of the nodules and thus allowing them to electrolyze more water than they otherwise would, thus explaining the jump in oxygen production rates. The plateau would be explained by the sediment settling back down onto the nodules again.

[@David-yo5ws]

And your comment adds to my theoretical 'idea', that this phenomenon is seen in this area, because of what the environment is like. It is very still for one. This could mean that heavy atoms of metal in the sea, start to sink to the sea floor in this area and thus provide a microscopic supply of layers on to the surface of these 'stones' and as the electrolysis occurs, the metal oxide is turned back into a solid metal and the oxygen is released. Is this an area that has a high meteorite fallout? Is it in an area where there is little sea current flow? From the pictures of the channels left by the mined 'stones' on the previous mission, they look like they just did it yesterday. It's undisturbed. Which supports the 'idea' that the environment is still and stable.

[@DavidDrew-n6z]

Therefore if hypothetically these sea potatoes where rearranged into matrix allowing free flow of sea currents around them they could produce even for oxygen and support more life.

[@Lurkily_Esh]

I doubt this was misunderstood - knowing how long these take to form, and interpreting the paper to be saying "you can kick them to make it faster" isn't consistent. The plateau is of oxygen concentration, not of oxygen production, meaning when the oxygen level plateaus, oxygen production has stopped. Sediment deposit is likewise a long process. I'd be surprised if their sterilized test conditions accumulated sediment, during the span of their test, that would rival a rock that had been on the ocean floor for millenia. Something not quite understood is likely at play in a number of factors here. And being wrong isn't a problem for science - in fact, forming and disproving theories is necessary to the process.

[@eggymens]

i love seeing commensts correcting the video. it lets me know the audience is smart and informed, not just an audience of content consumers.

[@Lea_D.]

> "The plateau would be explained by the sediment settling back down onto the nodules again." Or maybe it simply reached the oxygen saturation point. We aren't told the exact measurements and conditions, but the samples contain a finite amount of water, so the concentration of oxygen would slow then plateau as it approached then reached the saturation point of oxygen in the water (i.e. water can only hold up to a certain amount of dissolved oxygen depending on T and P).

[@leblade499]

I am by no means a physicist or a chemist, I’m a physician but these kinds of research really touches a spot on my brain that excites me, I’m looking forward to more revelations in this field of study

[@beanybeanbag]

You don't have to be a chemist or physicist to understand, just plain studying and researching such topics individually will make you more qualified than many chemists or physicists, and i am speaking from experience as a chemistry major, my knowledge is under no means vast but i know many people that were with me only studied to pass exams and get a diploma, when you ask them basic questions about chemistry or physics they know absolutely nothing. I witnessed people in the last year of chemistry major right before getting the diploma still not knowing the position of an element in the periodic table nor its charge or whether it is metallic or non metallic.. Also witnessed basic information learned in high school completely unknown to some students in the 3rd year of chemistry. Let's just say that teachers weren't thrilled with my classmates.

[@CursedRaichu]

The fish at 5:13 looked so upset when you said that he looked weird. 😂

[@bontrom8]

Poor fish.

[@Zaihanisme]

So rude to him and for what?! He's the most beautiful in his deep sea kingdom okay lol

[@mantizshrimp]

​@@bontrom8not poor, but blob

[@DrBenMiles]

I'm sorry mr. fish!

[@DasJiggly]

Call me crazy, but that fish looked upset even before he said that :(

[@Damoinion]

I remember reading an article in the early 70's proponing the harvesting of these metallic nodules as a soon to be realised tech! Even as a kid I wondered about some issues related to this idea. I was already familiar with the damage caused by pair-trawling and deep trawling systems due to where I lived. Now it has been done, people are asking why the seafloor is still dead in those areas harvested. After all, it only took a few million years to develop those nodules, which, it now appears, may be part of the O2 cycle on the ocean bed.

[@Dojan5]

Humanity: It's amazing how an entire ecosystem can develop in such an extreme niche. Also humanity: Why hasn't this extremely fragile ecosystem recovered?

[@a.karley4672]

"I remember reading an article in the early 70's proponing the harvesting of these metallic nodules as a soon to be realised tech!" This was CIA misdirection-PR to cover up the development of equipment and techniques to investigate and recover a Soviet nuclear (or nuclear-armed, I forget. American problem.) from the seabed NW of Hawaii. They got parts of the sub or missiles ; whatever the CIA wanted, so it was a qualified success. What they did with the bodies I don't know - over the side at midnight would have been simplest, but probably illegal. It's worth remembering that this "black budget" operation leaked out within 10-15 years. The Faked Moon Landings operation was much bigger (allegedly) and had far fewer leaks. And if you believe that, I've got a bridge to sell to you.

[@Miata822]

This channel is new to me. I almost didn't click due to the click-baity "Dark Oxygen" title, but was surprised to find an excellent talk on the subject. Subbed.

[@suzuplaza]

hes still a pop scientist and not a real doctor so take everything he says with a giant grain of salt

[@randomperson4198]

​@@suzuplazahehe salt

[@HighBeanz]

​@@suzuplaza ❤🎉 fellow she ra enjoyer spotted in the wild !!

[@ChikleSimmons-lh9hb]

A body of water is one. Sunlight hits the water regardless. Energy is spread through the entire body of water. And since the water at the very bottom of the sea is not frozen, it is not completely absent of energy.

[@Boxygirl96]

I’m definitely subscribing because a man who can keep his skepticism capped until the after credits is the kind of journalist that’s a rare gem in this society of guided conclusions. It’s so rare nowadays to find someone giving all the current facts and hypotheses before adding on their own

[@gardengirl7258]

You would love The Why Files here on KZbin.

[@sgz222]

Andrew Huberman is the same. Listen to the Huberman Lab Podcast if you want to learn about science, usually related to human biology.

[@SUSANREEDER-l1b]

@@sgz222 I'm always looking for content that doesn't just rot my brain. Thanks for the suggestion!

[@switz008]

That's a great point!

[@AmiCapella]

You may factor in that showing skepticism toward the just of the video may fan the discussion in the commentary section prompting a simple way of promoting his video...

[@CWinterstorm]

One test that could lead to confirmation of this is, if hydrolysis is going on, there should be hydrogen released as well (or they'd need a good explanation as to where that's going) since water should be releasing twice as much hydrogen as oxygen when broken down. I'd be interested to know if they've repeated tests and looked at this aspect and, if so, what they've found.

[@pneumarian]

My thought as well! Of course, hydrogen build-up was not likely to be detected since it's so hard to keep contained, but it seems like they could plan for that now that they have a hypothesis for what's going on.

[@a.karley4672]

There are quite a number of microbe genera that can subsist on (or use, if available) hydrogen as an energy source. It's actually facultative (an available option, if the environment supplies it) in a lot more microbes than those that dominantly survive on it. Not seeing free hydrogen isn't _that_ surprising. (BTW, detecting hydrogen isn't a problem of the containment. It's that the simplest, most common detection sensors - FIDs on a chromatograph - either use hydrogen as a "carrier" gas", or aren't sensitive to hydrogen. If I were tasked with addressing the problem, I know where I'd go to get data sheets on relevant detection equipment, but the technicians who run it don't tend to understand their equipment very well, so it would need appreciable development work. Which would take several years.)

[@andremarques3317]

i think they are already sure about the oxygen presence. The main question is about how this process can be sustained without depleting for so many thousand years

[@a.karley4672]

@@andremarques3317 Ocean currents change. You need to *demonstrate* that it has been "sustained ... for thousands of years" before stressing greatly about how it has been sustained.

[@ccyuni6746]

would measuring the pH levels of the water in tests overtime help give an answer to that?

[@anand-menon]

1. It appears to be a localized phenomenon 2. It requires Oxygen to be produced by electrolysis 3. Electrolysis appears to be catalyzed by the nodules and sea water. 4. We don't know the temperature of the sea water 5. We don't know if there are local currents in circulation which help complete the circuit. 6. A good working theory should explain both the increase in production and the subsequent plateauing of production

[@PhilAndOr]

1. These nodules exist in very, very large areas of the deep ocean, we know this for a fact. Are you calling that "localized" or do you mean something more local? I don't think we can know for sure until more research is done. If it happens everywhere that these nodules are common then we're talking about a significant proportion of all the deep oceans. 2. That is the definition of electrolysis, yes. 3. The sea water is not the catalyst, it's the electrolyte. By the nodules, yes in part it seems that way, although also there's an observed voltage potential across the nodules i.e. it's powering the process, as well as catalyzing. 4. Yes we do! 5. The experiments were carried out in sealed tubes, not sure how "local currents" are relevant? 6. Yes, I agree with that part at least!

[@ISayNukem]

​@PhilAndOr For 5, he explained it in the question when he said, "Which complete the current."

[@YutaBLv]

Fart in the bathtub

[@dankmemes7658]

@@ISayNukem currents are irrelevant when the oxygen production increases inside a sealed tube.

[@Synergy31337]

Point 6 is tricky, remember we are talking about both in vitro and in vivo findings here. The in vitro studies were of course in a closed environment, with electrolysis producing both hydrogen, oxygen and pure water as products. You would have expected measurements not only of oxygen concentration within the experiment, but hydrogen concentration and salinity also. The plateau could be due to any of those factors in a closed environment, or something entirely else, but would/could not be seen in vivo. It could well be at the low voltages seen, and with these factors, electrolysis is impeded or halted after time in silo. More study neeeded it seems.

[@jacobrafaat1516]

I’m convinced we don’t understand the microbes on the sea floor level, because we don’t even have a full grasp on the complexity of soil microbes on the surface. I believe the oxygen is microbial in origin or based off some other life that interacts with the metals. I’m sure there’s a lot of electrical components as well since soil is basically a big battery IE and oxidation redox reaction and I believe something similar is going on here. I wonder what water samples from that depth near the metals reads. Fascinating video!

[@lorikingery]

I like your thought process but he does say the lab-based replication experiment involved sterilization to rule out anything living.

[@leonbwr]

the mining co's response is SO typical! "It is so because my money says so" - watch the funding dry up.

[@Bryophytan]

They can always make donations to political parties to get legislation changed. Just look at the publicly available donations and statistics and wider estimations from watchdog groups.

[@artmatthew1]

Hah, does funding actually dry up because a form of resource extraction was found to be extremely detrimental to the earth...usually not right?

[@Hisu0]

On the other hand, would YOU fund an investigation into your work?

[@telanos2492]

@leonbwr Typical! Another example of how evil mining companies are! There's no need to wait for them to actually do something, when we can just judge them anyway! Also, don't come knocking on my door for funding research, and don't get any ideas about raising taxes to support science! I got to have money to pay for the latest tech!

[@osakanone]

@PaxAlotin-j6r This however doesn't give everybody else carte-blanche to fuck up the ocean just because "the other guy" is doing it. I know you didn't say this, but this is the meaning many will take from what you said.

[@dtnicholls1]

Even if we have no idea at all as to what mechanism is producing the oxygen, demonstrating that it's there and the damage that mining does should be enough to hit the pause button on mining until we actually understand what we're doing to the environment.

[@mikeclarke952]

Well that they were able to reproduce the effect in the lab is pretty significant to prove their explanation.

[@Yora21]

The big issue is that it takes millions of years for one of these rocks to form, but they run out of energy in a few days. And to elevate oxygen levels on the deep sea floor, they would have to release energy to split water molecules constantly. I could see the minerals being an important component in the process that releases oxygen, but they can't be the energy source that powers the electrolysis. Something would have to constantly recharge them.

[@ENDESGA]

@@Yora21 I also feel we might be overlooking something: by themselves they deplete, but as a planar field of them there might be a mechanism which allows the cycle to continue. Like the depleted nodules recharge as the recharged ones start going again. It could be in waves/cascades. There's so many questions, it would be idiotic of us as a species to not seriously look into this because it could answer some hard questions

[@user-jq5bz4wp2e]

@@ENDESGA You will have to balance the energy. TANSTAAFL. Where ultimately is the energy coming from?

[@Onaterdem]

​@@Yora21Magnetic field, perhaps? No clue, just a guess

[@ENDESGA]

@@user-jq5bz4wp2e something in the water? magnetic fields? I honestly don't know! I'm eager to hear for more answers, because there's clearly something happening that we don't quite understand

[@JackTheRabbitMusic]

5:14 this fish said you look “a little weird”, too…😂

[@DrumFFx]

*farming underwater metals* “wow there’s oxygen coming from those metals!” *farming intensifies*

[@a.karley4672]

"farming" is not the appropriate analogy. It is strip-mining. That it isn't in daylight doesn't change the fact that it is strip mining.

[@DrumFFx]

*strip mining intensifies*

[@MrSchism]

Regardless of what may be causing it, the fact that mining these areas prevents recovery suggests that mining these areas probably depletes whatever generates the oxygen.

[@evanricard6468]

I've read articles about this but always appreciated the depth to which you explore your topics, especially making it easily digestible to the average watcher!

[@markmuir7338]

Pun intended 😂

[@hygri]

Topic has depth, comment checks out :)

[@justinfoster7699]

he was paid to sow doubts by that very deep sea mining company :(

[@DrBenMiles]

Glad you enjoyed! It's really fun to explore topics beyond the 'surface layer' 😉

[@ThePepzo]

The oceanic otherwise oxygen depleted water maybe reacting to the metallic surface of the nodules, and somehow, it can self-generate a weak current? pressure , salt, metals, galvanic current, moving water. It's a good start for producing something.

[@flakcannon722]

The heck? That is an old old discovery. There was even a mining test site, but it was found that removing it from the seabed killed the whole ecosystem in the area.

[@jamesh7469]

Source?

[@jackhynds175]

@@jamesh7469 It's literally in this video

[@5naxalotl]

imo the most important thing to note is that researchers hired by corporations will usually not act as researchers when reality conflicts with corporate goals. rather, they act as ADVOCATES: usually, lawyers paid to start with a conclusion and form arguments in favor of it. the other word for this is APOLOGISTS: usually, people who start with a religious claim and create reasons for why people should believe it. in both cases, there's a pretense of wanting to discover the truth, aka genuine research; but when you only "discover" things that agree with your biased assumptions, it's not really discovery

[@bjorndunderbeck]

not quite the whole story but yeah something to be aware of, most 'researchers' will be dancing with the providers of funding for their work. they will be trying to achieve several goals, their own and those of their masters.

[@englishsteve1465]

Absolutely right. There's huge problems involved with where the funding comes from and how much pressure those funders are prepared to put on researchers when the science doesn't go their way.

[@yarrlegap6940]

as if that's unique to corporations or "religions" ...

[@peopleseethis]

The only thing I think about this is that more, objective, science needs to be done on these rocks. Something interesting is happening, and we probably should know what since it is O2 related. The mining companies profits can suck it, however.

[@AmonTheWitch]

yeah this would be amazing for space exploration

[@ganjasage420]

Why should we know? Ever heard of some things are better left unknown?

[@AmonTheWitch]

@@ganjasage420 what are you waffling about, stop smoking

[@ganjasage420]

@@AmonTheWitch Says the one talking about space exploration like they've done any space exploration of their own. Using witchcraft doesn't count.

[@AmonTheWitch]

@@ganjasage420 ??? oxygen is kinda a big deal if we want to get humans anywhere also i just like RPGs 💀

[@jonbarnett9363]

A couple of observations. First, the fact that life did not recover in mined zones clearly makes a case that, regardless of HOW it happens, these bodies are important in sustaining deep sea life in the area. Second, the fact that the oxygen production decreases in the sealed containers doesn't mean that the nodules are depleted. It could be due to the depletion of another substance required. You would need to remove the water from the container and refill with an identical water sample and see if oxygen production resumes. It seems that it is perhaps functioning as a redox catalyst. Since it is a heterogeneous catalyst, if the mixture isn't constantly moving and replenished with appropriate cofactors, it would die as observed. In a natural environment with moving water and replenished electrolytes, there is no reason that a good catalyst would ever stop functioning. Also, heterogeneous catalysts work more efficiently with higher surface area. So...battery? Possibly not. But catalyst? I think that the possibility of heterogeneous catalysis is very likely.

[@OctorokSushi]

No doubt in my mind that if the money farmers could pull material out of the core of the planet they'd have done it yesterday without a second thought about what the effect would be. In their mind the effect is just "number get more bigger yippeeee!!"

[@TheRedRationalist]

.........what?

[@gerryjamesedwards1227]

I'm glad you covered this! I saw the release and was wondering just how impactful this discovery will turn out to be.

[@Hansulf]

Probably null... There is no energy source for that, so that oxigen is going to run out fast

[@justinfoster7699]

he got paid 12K to sow doubts from the deep sea mining company. he's a fraud

[@cybyrd9615]

@@Hansulf You're pretty dumb, cold water holds more oxygen is denser and stays at the bottom unless increased oxygen warms the water enough for it to rise to the surface the oxygen will stay down there. the oxygen is not consumed it is recycled.

[@AmonTheWitch]

​@@Hansulf these rocks are ancient

[@gordon1545]

@@Hansulf We have no way of knowing that yet. This will open a whole field of research and we obviously have a lot to learn.

[@deejannemeiurffnicht1791]

At approx' 13:00 we hear that the mining company guy refuted the claims of natural electrolisis, which reminded me of the tobaco companies, the makers of PTFE's (Teflon being the main criminal), and oil companies with regards to carbon emmisions and climate etc, , when even as far back as the 1950's found proof, themselves, of how dangerous these things were but buried and refuted the claims, and paid millions to keep it buried, and often ''buried' any legal competition and challenges. Profit to them, being more important than public and natural environmental health considerations.

[@CD-yr8tw]

Well, human's might as well destroy the ocean floor next.

[@STEVE_C_1369]

This is THE BEST scientific summary Ive ever heard on KZbin of any topic. It was in common,everyday terminology,where we can understand from A to Z. Bravo !!! Beyond the interest and science aspects ... I say , if this discovery is true, ( and,it seems to be) , shut down the min8ng. Period. If the mining ship continues in the open or discovered operating insecret ( if it can) , sink it after the crew has been evacuated. Why? Because if these findings are fact, no company has the right to jeopardize sea life on such a scale ,nor,ultimately , terrestrial life,including humanity.

[@thailandretromods]

This is probably something our generation will see as "devastating" in 30 years time... After the science has been dismantled as quick as the ocean floor will inevitably be mined.... 😢

[@vanzeralltheway8638]

Nah, we dont even need a month to know that any kind of "resources gathering" is going to harm the environment.

[@reivelt3715]

Agree. But deep sea mining is not yet permitted nor is it profitable. Currently. We must be concerned more on the shallower water mining (Less than 500m) as this is a known practice for a long time now.

[@Squant]

I think you've giving us too much credit if you think we can get the ocean floor mined within 30 years.

[@bananadane]

I'm really concerned about the mining considering the flawed structure of international sea regulation

[@BlackClaws]

Sadly, so long as profit is the driving impulse of society we will never advance as a species and in fact will regress/destroy ourselves.

[@joansparky4439]

profit is a signal by the consumer base that the supplied commodities are NOT meeting demand, so the few suppliers can earn MORE than it cost to make the commodity. If the market regulation does NOT prevent other suppliers to join on the supply side (being attracted by the profit), then the supply will raise until it meets demand AT COST, which means ZERO profit (for all involved). That our real existing economies require perpetual profit is because of a flaw in how our money works, a flaw that got copied from gold.

[@tomgroover1839]

What a cynical outlook. The driving impulse of human endeavor is the urge to create.

[@joansparky4439]

@@tomgroover1839 So (wild)life doesn't have this impulse? Interesting - considering a lot around us that we can't (re)create has been created by life on it's own - without "human endeavor" capabilities.

[@BlackClaws]

@@tomgroover1839 It is an earned cynicism, brought to a fine edge by the last, say ten years or so. Also, I expect I do not know the same people as you, who has the time or energy to create? No one in my circles. I hope you are right, and the creatives outnumber the greedy, the power hungry. My cynicism is reversible after all.

[@joansparky4439]

@@BlackClaws greed and power are just a means for living beings to survive (at the cost of others) and from the POV of nature absolutely fine.. cooperative societies made up of work sharing specializing living beings on the other hand CAN NOT WORK if such individuals can occupy positions of power - which our societies provide - still. This is what is unsustainable - esp from the POV of nature.

[@ozgemmo3445]

As an analytical chemist and geochemist, the fact that molecular hydrogen (H2) hasn't been observed (or reported?) together with the molecular oxygen (O2) indicates the observed O2 has not been produced by hydrolysis of water/seawater (pressure and temperature at these depths not withstanding) but instead is being produced by some other (as yet unknown?) process? Hydrolysis of water at standard temp & pressure, requires 1.5 Volts DC to split water apart! Additionally, if indeed hydrolysis was producing the observed O2 then you would also expect to see two molar equivalents of H2 for every molar equivalent of O2 produced and, as far as I understand, this has not (yet??) been observed? An extremely interesting phenomenon, nevertheless and one that could hold a great benefit for human-kind, once this process has been fully elucidated! Great video!! Cheers from Downunder.

[@dead-claudia]

this is my precise question about the study. obviously, the mining company doesn't want to be told to stop mining, but these very kinds of issues would be very good for the mining company to raise in their rebuttal

[@jimmurphy5355]

It takes energy - lots of energy - to split water into hydrogen and oxygen. If the nodules are acting as a battery, they would soon be used up and the reaction would stop. If they are acting as a catalyst, there still needs to be an energy source. I hope they go back and look for hydrogen. If water is being split, hydrogen should be present.

[@Aqoric]

Not only Hydrogen but as it’s sea water you would expect to see the production of halogens particularly chlorine. These are super easy to test for which makes me question why they didn’t.

[@jeryuen6563]

Perhaps they are planning on it yet. One metal acts as anode another as cathode, electric change provided by salt water

[@joki7352]

lots of energy also known as 1.5V?

[@Aqoric]

@@joki7352 Voltage isn’t a measure of energy. Don’t write a sarcastic reply if you don’t have a clue what you’re talking about.

[@brucestein988]

I agree. If water is being split, where is the hydrogen going? Could it be being adsorbed in some chemical reaction in/on the rock and the oxygen is just a waste product, as it is for plants?

[@MarkRLeach]

What concerned me when I read the paper was that there was no discussion of the chemistry OR the thermodynamics… Indeed, my experience is that batteries run down quite quickly. Keep up the good work!

[@damson3413]

we're talking about rocky lumps of material with all kinds of metals and things mixed in, there's this thing called internal resistance with batteries which limits the rate at which a battery's power can be drawn, in this instance the current and voltage draw is very low, and the nodules are a decent size, this battery effect is happening all across thousands of kilometers of seafloor in millions, billions, possibly trillions of metallic lumps of rock, they don't even necessarily "run out" the electrolysis will slowly break these nodules down over time, but there's events constantly producing new ones, these nodules are likely to have a volcanic origin considering their composition and location. they don't run out because they're not like a AA battery, this is more of an electrically assisted erosion process that also produces electrolysis, they just likely fall apart into smaller pieces until there's a dark inert powder left on the seafloor.

[@MarkRLeach]

@@damson3413 Where is the "dark inert powder left on the seafloor"? I see only nodules that have been there for millions of years (apparently). I am NOT disagreeing with the dark oxygen findings, I am just saying where was no discussion on any plausible mechanism in the paper. (I am an academic chemist, so I am interested in the chemistry...)

[@artmatthew1]

Perhaps the electrical forces at play are generating the nodules and building them up.

[@Vort_tm]

@@MarkRLeach Just copy-pasted my post elsewhere. Seems relevant since I haven't seen many others raising similar questions: Wouldn't the hydrogen atoms just ionize to hydronium and stay in solution? If so, then by measuring the pH they could tell where the hydrogen is going. Also, how do we not consider that the reason the O2 plateaus is because it hit an equilibrium point? You don't have to go too far in chemistry to find out that all reaction don't happen indefinitely. They all have an equilibrium point (and before you say something, that doesn't mean that reactions can't go to completion, it just means that one of the substrates was fully consumed before reaching equilibrium). EDIT: Just one additional thought I had. They mentioned that 1.5V is required to electrolyze water, but would I be wrong in assuming that that is what is required to "spontaneously" electrolyze water? If you applied a lower current to it, is it possible that that just shifts the equilibrium point of dissociated and undissociated h2o molecules? Electrochemistry was never my strong point; think I slept through some of those lectures. I was, admittedly, a bad student.

[@benmorris1657]

Maybe acting as a catalyst

[@QPRTokyo]

A week ago I saw a video saying that we must leave them alone.

[@justinfoster7699]

this "Dr" got paid 12K USD by the deep sea mining company to sow doubts about the oxygen producing capability of the modules

[@conradchester]

yeah that'd be for the best, seeing that the mined areas haven't recovered years later. I don't want to loose another source of oxygen :(

[@McSenkel]

That would be sensible thing to do. So of course, there will be some asshole who will mine them anyway.

[@coolwarfare]

@@conradchesteryeah let’s not do the Lorax but with destroying rocks as well

[@Unicron187]

@@conradchester we all know that if humanity gets to choose between oxygen and money, humans usually pick the money...

[@frostypotatos544]

I'm not into conspiracies, but its neat this was discovered immediately after mining those nodes was about to he greenlit.

[@omegahunter9]

It's possible that the oxygen production is related to the growth of the nodules. Since these deposits are growing over time from metal precipitation, it may be that the water used in the experiments was being depleted of metal ions as they attach to the nodules. Once the water was depleted of the materials, then the electrical production on the surface of the nodules could reduce. I would be interested to know if they did voltage checks before and after the oxygen peaked. Another possibility is that the reaction requires a lower oxygen environment. It would be interesting to find out if the conditions for producing oxygen and for growing the nodules were related.

[@doublepinger]

I would expect it's more like a catalytic converter reaction. We know the nodules have uncommon useful metals and rare earth material, useful in explicitly novel "enzyme" like materials. A "battery" theory would quickly corrode the materials, or dissolve them entirely. I'm glad you touched on it.

[@NathanWindsor-j7i]

I'm not sure about the definition of "quickly." electrolysis can be created with nothing more than a 9 volt battery in my sons bedroom. the scientists measured a little over a volt? the amount of oxygen created by one nodule is extremely low, and would be slow to corrode. very interesting point though. these rocks should be inspected for this corrosion over time

[@Aqoric]

@@NathanWindsor-j7i These things grow at a rate of 2-15 mm per million years almost any amount of corrosion would outstrip that. Obviously there’s the potential the growth rate is actually that low because of corrosion but it’s still extremely early to say anything definitive.

[@Aqoric]

@@doublepinger The issue with it being a catalyst is that the in-situ and ex-situ measurements were not massively different despite the temperatures being around 20x greater. It it were a catalyst you’d expect to see a large increase in production with that large of a temp increase

[@user-jq5bz4wp2e]

A catalyst can change the rate of chemical reactions but it cannot change the energy balance. You still need an energy source.

[@Aqoric]

@@user-jq5bz4wp2e Hypothetically a catalyst could reduce the activation energy enough that the temperature of the water would be a sufficient source of energy but it’s extremely unlikely.

[@ComeRee]

I'm so glad the algorithm suggested your channel. Thoughly edifying stuff - never fails to tickle the brain and get them juices going! Cariad a gefnogi fawr o Gymru - Much love and support from Cymru / Wales x

[@DrBenMiles]

Diolch yn fawr iawn!

[@noahbuhler9630]

Checking for the prevalence of chlorine could be an interesting test for this theory as the likely electrolyte utilized would be salt which would produce chlorine in the process of electrolysis as well.

[@CUUE24]

5:10 I’ve never seen a rendering of the earth like this! So cool to get a topographical mapping of the ocean!

[@a.karley4672]

I use GeoMapApp as my freeware source for bathymetry. I don't know what he was using - I was cooking breakfast and listening, and have since deleted the download.

[@ShireIO]

It seems to me that if oxygen is being produced but the nodules are not depleted then clearly they are acting in the role of a catalyst. If so, knowing the chemical mechanism behind it would be of immense value.

[@NickyD-99]

'When we can't explain it we call it dark.' *stares at cosmologists*

[@keirfarnum6811]

My name “Keir” means “dark”. I propose we call it “Keir oxygen”. And dark energy should be called “Keir energy”. Sound good? That will keep them guessing. As long as everyone knows it’s not named after Keir Starmer (we’ll have to put disclaimers on these terms when we use them; Starmer doesn’t deserve the recognition). 👍🏻

[@TimGent-p1x]

It's called dark because it doesn't use photosynthesis, rather in the video they state it's hypothesized to be a natural electrolysis. No light = dark... *stares in,,, did u actually watch the video*

[@BernardoMartins_]

If this natural, free electrolysis is generating oxygen in deep ocean, it is also generating hydrogen gas. Which would make it the first natural source of the most energetically dense combustible which also happens to be clean. Basically natural green hydrogen. However, we must assess its economical viability, which depends on how costly it is to mine it down there in deep ocean… Either way, a solution for The Metals Company could be mining it, as it would be analogous to finding petroleum (or perhaps better).

[@lorikingery]

something like trying to create a structure *far above* the life depending on the nodules, to capture extra hydrogen? seems a tricky business (for not disturbing the life there, nor the working module system), but an idea worth studying for sure.

[@SATERIYA-dp3wb]

It's a cooked oxide oxygen in prehistoric time's 👍🏼

[@williamjamesLMT]

the one thing everyone is neglecting is that the entire planet, metal nodules and all continuously moves through magnetic fields produced supossidly by the molton Iron core. Each of the stones would work like a single molecule within a wire and conduct electricity on a regular basis...therefore electrolosis. Its not rocket science, its basic magnetism and electricity.

[@a.karley4672]

No. Firstly, ignore the galactic, solar and intergalactic magnetic fields. They are pushed aside by the Earth's magnetic field as Earth orbits the Sun (and the Sun orbits the galaxy, and the Local Group of galaxies fly towards the "Great Attractor"). The only magnetic field detectable at the surface is that due to the Earth's geodynamo. As you learned in physics class, the voltage (hence, current) induced in a conductor by a magnetic field is proportional to the rate-of-change of magnetic field in the volume swept by the conductor. Since the ground (deep sea, or not) is not moving (much) relative to the core, the rate of change of magnetic field experienced is low. My compass needle works perfectly well day and night, and only significantly changes when I go to Ladhar Bheinn or the Cuillins (where the magnetic field from local rocks overwhelms the global field) - without me moving hundreds of km, the rate of change of the magnetic field is very slow. Plus, the metal fragments involved are very small (microscopic, literally) so the volume of (slowly changing ) magnetic field they sweep through is small. Small times small gives you a very small product - the oxygen you're looking for. Your physics is basically correct ; your geology is wrong.

[@irenehynes7536]

@@a.karley4672interesting rebuttal…..

[@WaaDoku]

6:03 This is EXACTLY what Graham Hancock has been talking about for decades: How elitist scientists just cannot think outside the box - ever - and blatantly dismiss obvious evidence as "failed instruments" or "unlikeliness". I can only imagine how much data was dismissed for the exact same reason and never revisited.

[@nicolasfiore]

What are you talking about? This video should be proof enough for you to realize that that's not how science works. Yes, instruments sometimes fail. That's why everything is revised and Ockham's razor is applied. You cannot see something unexpected and automatically the first thing you think is that you have found some new revolutionary thing. So you check and check again and then when you are satisfied that you are indeed in the presence of something new, you proceed. Besides, you seem to be implying that science is not advancing fast enough, when in actuality it is progressing faster than ever.

[@WaaDoku]

@@nicolasfiore You're implying and interpreting a bit much (which is ok) but let me explain again what I meant. I was referencing Graham Hancock's (journalist) arguments and evidence, that scientific institutions systematically suppressed empirical research-based ideas that are outside of certain realms of thinking which in turn created a culture of conformity within scientific institutions. I'm not suggesting that "science is not advancing fast enough" or that the scientific method shouldn't be applied or that Ockham's razor isn't a valid scientific philosophy to go by. I'm suggesting that this conservative conformity (or "orthodoxy" how Graham calls it) that was created within scientific institutions played a part in this phenomenal discovery not being recognized as such in 2013 despite functioning instruments and correctly measured oxygen levels. Instead, it has been dismissed as "bad data" (whatever that means) and only revisited over 10 years later. I attribute this to the orthodoxy that Graham has been talking about because dismissing such an incredible discovery because the correct data that you get is outside your realm of what you already know and dismissing it as "bad data" seems stupid at best and ideologically driven (meaning the "orthodoxy") at worst. This seems to have been bad science using faulty scientific methodology in 2013. Any scientist worth his or her salt would've reproduced the experiment to confirm or disprove the findings. Btw, where in the video did they say the instruments failed? He just said they interpreted the valid data as "bad data" suggesting, again, they couldn't even fathom a result outside of their conservative ideas what "correct scientific data" should or could look like. Nothing was said about a failing instrument or that they found the instruments to be faulty.

[@kanojo1969]

Ben mentioned that you need at least 1.4v or so to crack water and produce oxygen, and he also mentioned that the sea potatoes were producing about 0.9v each. But he didn't expand on this, so here's the logical conclusion: In order for this theory to be correct, these nodules must be connecting to each other in series in order to produce enough volts to crack the water. Just two sitting side-by-side and touching slightly would be enough to do it. But in situ, there's thousands of these thigns all sitting on top and next to each other. Wouldn't this produce thousands of volts overall? Surely that would be noticeable, and nobody has mentioned anything like that. It would be very weird if they connected in series by accident, but only enough to crack water, not enough to kill anything that touches the rocks by accident. Wouldn't the entire sea floor be a giant dead zone everywhere these rocks are touching? Seems far-fetched, but I'm probably misunderstanding something here.

[@jimmurphy5355]

The factor you are missing is that even if they are somehow randomly connecting in series an creating high enough voltage to split water, they would soon, in the blink of an eye in geologic time scales, be worn out.

[@lelanddyke8386]

not really how voltage works. It's a pressure differential same as anything else. Imagine a regular, soapy bubble. They have slightly differing pressures from eachother and from atmosphere. Now imagine a ton of them clumped together. Will they now explode? No. The pressures even out because they are not being sorted and combined in strategic ways. The nodules down there are not connected in series nor parallel, they are stochastic.

[@lelanddyke8386]

Now, if you separated all the bubbles with lower-than-atmospheric-pressure from the bubbles with higher-than-atmospheric-pressure, then combined each side and put them next to eachother, you'd have something like an anode and a cathode, and pressure would move from one side to the other. But this only happens in small segments of randomized systems, like flipping a coin to say heads X number of times in a row. It works in batteries because we are strategic about how we place the chemicals.

[@rdizzy1]

The voltage is higher in larger rocks with higher surface area. (And there are billions of them under that sediment as well, so on top of sitting next to another one side by side, they can be piled on top of each other as well). Also, the pressures involved effects the voltage required for electrolysis (and the voltage cited here is only "ideal conditions")

[@Vort_tm]

@@rdizzy1 Also, I believe the 1.4V or whatever is only the voltage to spontaneously electrolyze. Remember that all equilibrium reactions have a forward reaction and a reverse reaction constantly happening, and the equilibrium is where the forward is equal to the reverse. Applying a lower voltage may not spontaneously electrolyze, but it could give a boost to the forward reaction, shifting the equilibrium to the right, so to speak. Someone younger and more ambitious can run the math on that electrochemistry, but I'm pretty sure there's some logic there.

[@cuchulainkailen]

A basic guess..... The nodules (rocks) are sedimentary. There are molecule-size channels eroded between layers, transporting ions (from whatever mechanism) throughout, so voltage depends, as seen, on surface area. The gathering of charge would seem to drive an electrolysis that produces oxygen at some static rate that requires an equilibrium gradient at work. Isolating the rock in a volume then produces an increasing oxygen level that levels off over time because the measurement requires dissipation of charge (in order to measure it). It's kind of like a geologic capacitor: ionic gradient in conductive channels -> steady current -> electrolytic oxygen. Siphon some current and you reduce capacity.

[@KeifersIsAwesome]

Enormous appreciation for the Godzilla clip sir. :)

[@bowieinc]

Curious if when their sample’s oxygen levels raised, did hydrogen levels raise as well? This would point to electrolysis.

[@supme7558]

Nope thats the problem

[@TnT_F0X]

Plot Twist: That sea bed is all that's left of Atlantis rusting away into gasses and dust.

[@rendoesmath]

Fr

[@Timbo360]

Or the “aliens” or whatever they are who crashed their crafts in Italy and Roswell built these nodules. But, that same group could also be involved or from an ancient civilization like Atlantis

[@FuriousVixen82]

You could also theorise that the atlantians are the greys from area 51 and Japanese mythology. And they live under the bed of the sea floor in their own inner space 02 is seeping up from there 😅

[@Timbo360]

@@FuriousVixen82 what are they called in Japanese mythology? Sounds like a fun thing to read, I might have a book on Ancient Japanese mythology somewhere too

[@FuriousVixen82]

@@Timbo360 Ningen I believe.. Also check out Kappa which translates as River Child xxx

[@murderedcarrot9684]

Been known for a while. Companies and governments have tried mining the stuff but its absence creates dead zones.

[@christianmontagx8461]

No bit of information about CO2 level in this regions. We know that CO2 is slipping through gaps in the earth crust and is dispersed in water. We know that chemical reactions may reduce CO2 to CO + O or C + O2. So why do they think so complicated that it should be electrolysis?

[@Zadamanim]

Turning CO2 into C and O2 requires an input of energy. Electricity is one form of it. Plants use light to do it. It's possible there's a geothermal source, too. More tests are needed.

[@blankityblankblank2321]

They probably thought that might be it too, but did some tests to rule that out.

[@Aqoric]

That reaction is extremely energetically unfavourable requiring light, heat or electrolysis. To the best of my knowledge CO2 reduction only ever produces CO and H2O at best and usually things like methanol never straight oxygen.

[@Aqoric]

@@ZadamanimPlants don’t generate the oxygen from CO2 they do it via hydrolysis. Then the O2 from the CO2 is used to regenerate water. It’s more complicated than what is taught in schools.

[@MisterWillow]

Because there is not an energetically favorable pathway for that CO2 to C + O2. If you know something I do not, please elaborate

[@Laff700]

If it's the surface area that's important, then a fraction of the nodules could be ground up into chunks and still get the job done in terms of oxygen generation and hosting unique microbes. The process of mining would still be ecologically devastating though.

[@Aqoric]

Unfortunately if their theory is correct the physical structure of the nodule will be thing responsible for the voltage generation. Breaking it up would mean it not longer functioned

[@disposabull]

@@Aqoric If you read the research, multiple nodules touching were best at producing the required voltage for electrolysis. Water moving over a long chain of nodules would have enough of a saline gradient to provide the energy for electrolysis to occur and new water moving in would maintain an ever changing saline gradient that doesn't deplete. No magic perpetual energy rocks needed, just a variance in salinity in contact with a conductive collection of touching nodules.

[@alphagt62]

It took a billion years for them to grow! It does seem like a bad idea to screw them up, the planet won’t last long enough to replace them.

[@Aqoric]

@@disposabull I have read the research and am in the process of completing a masters thesis on the impacts of PMN mining. I’m not saying these are magic rocks, it could well be driven by electrolysis but there is not enough information to state that as a fact. Even if they connect in series they would still need to be regenerated and the mechanism for that is still completely unknown. The metallic compounds they are made of are not inert at all so will erode. Also the paper suggests that the surface structure of the nodules may reduce the voltage required by several hundred mV.

[@deanwellerassociates]

An excellent and informative piece on a fascinating topic. It would seem that repetition needs to follow this serendipitous finding...look forward to an update later in the year

[@timjones3893]

I appreciate that Dr. Strange took the time to educate us about how our planet. Wish that took stark guy put in the same amount of effort

[@EddyKorgo]

friction, pressure, magnetism, chemical reactions. everything together

[@southerndime333]

food chain, weather systems, sand dunes, everything as one.

[@artmatthew1]

Marshmallows, dog fights, apricots, nothing is separate.

[@oldschoolman1444]

The guy at the pizza place asked me what toppings I would like. I said make me one with everything.

[@EternalGaze8]

Wax on, wax off, grasshoppers, gobstoppers, it’s all one.

[@simhthmss]

@@oldschoolman1444 Did he give you a 5-MeO DMT pizza?

[@blankityblankblank2321]

This is fascinating. I hope this puts a halt to mining plans until more is understood.

[@AkaRyrye83]

First thing I thought when hearing this was: "how the heck are these 'batteries' not running out of juice after a couple years"? I have not heard a satisfactory explanation as of yet.

[@jeryuen6563]

any two metals in contact with an ion produces a battery. Even the cutlery in your dishwasher produces this effect. The salt water and touching metals create an electric charge differential, naturally electrolysis of water into oxygen and hydrogen, splitting the molecule of water.

[@kbag54943]

@@jeryuen6563 I agree... seems like it would be easy to test this hypothesis - just test for the production of hydrogen as well (should be 2.H for ever 1.O) Sea water is providing the electrolyte . Natural HHO generator.

[@BetterThanLife365]

@@jeryuen6563 That doesn''t explain why they haven't run out of juice

[@justinfoster7699]

this "Dr" got paid 12K USD by the deep sea mining company to sow doubts about the oxygen producing capability of the modules :/

[@guycampbell733]

​@@BetterThanLife365it does though. Read it again

[@tomdlc9321]

This should be studied extensively. This could help in future space missions that currently would take tears to complete. This process could ensure sufficient oxygen production for future Astronauts.

[@joshuakeys411]

Typical. Let’s destroy our oxygen supply before we allow anyone to know we’re destroying our oxygen supply?? Rich and Dead? SMH

[@DemonKing19951]

I have serious doubts that these rocks produce enough oxygen for surface dwellers and air breathers but... I would imagine they're incredibly important to deep sea life. The only good thing about this discovery is realistically one day it'll be both cheaper and easier to mine materials from space. Not just that but it wouldn't be too hard to take existing nuclear submarine technology and just sink it down to the depth of the ocean. Just anchor a few along the under sea current and let them handle any oxygen production needs we'll have for the next 1000 years. Maybe I'm making it it out to be too simple but we have no shortage of better energy production methods and we certainly have the money to spend when we want to.

[@mbmurphy777]

The amount has to be quantified for sure, but just thinking about reaction rates, and the amount of, it can’t be in anyway comparable to photosynthesis. Diffusion from the atmosphere and circulation is I’m guessing trillions of times more important.

[@itranscendencei7964]

It's discoveries like this that really make me wish that we still had Nikola Tesla around for his interpretations. I'd be very interested to hear his theories about this.

[@tomgroover1839]

Tesla dropped out of technical school before completing the third year. I'm not even sure he could apply calculus in his later work, or ever. At any rate there are armies of physicists , chemists and electrical engineers with PhD's alive right now who are proficient in vector calculus and there is no reason Tesla was possessed of mysterious powers that can be applied in today's world.

[@itranscendencei7964]

Idk where you're getting the whole "mysterious powers" bit from, so I don't see the point in bringing that up. I'm sure there are people now that are much smarter than Tesla was... 70 years ago..... That's such a pointless argument to make. Of course people are going to be more proficient in certain fields after 3/4 of a century of previous work being done. Most of Tesla's work was in discovering new technologies, not refining established processes, and that takes a far more brilliant person. That's all I was saying, and to insinuate that you need a high school diploma to be smart is beyond ignorant.

[@ivor000]

i am shocked, utterly shocked, to hear that mining the earth has the potential to cause harm, a revelation

[@allengrove1864]

Subnautica 2 should have a biome built around the idea of "dark oxygen" lifeforms

[@bmobasco]

Haha was just thinking about how much some of these look like the nickel deposits in the game

[@PainfullySubjective]

nice video! the cynic in me doubts that mining deep sea beds would be hampered by whatever discoveries are made about "dark oxygen" sources

[@ferchrissakes]

Omg an extractive industry might be bad for life and the planet? You don’t say. I know it’s all early days and unproven, but historically it’s not exactly a big leap.

[@gulliverplus8912]

Such a wonderful program! ❤Always learn a lot from your program! Thank you, Dr Ben Miles👍👍👍

[@Blink_____]

I really detest this new fad of slapping "dark" in front of everything

[@Roxxyie]

New? Fad?

[@chucklebutt4470]

dark fads

[@Blink_____]

@@Roxxyie is there an echo

[@keirfarnum6811]

My name “Keir” means “dark”. I propose we call it “Keir oxygen”. And dark energy should be called “Keir energy”. Sound good? That will keep them guessing. As long as everyone knows it’s not named after Keir Starmer (we’ll have to put disclaimers on these terms when we use them; Starmer doesn’t deserve the recognition). 👍🏻

[@Blink_____]

@@keirfarnum6811 you got my vote

[@mrfairsthename7470]

Great so some greedy corporate is going to lift these from the sea floor and decimate life down there.

[@nickmcdonald3083]

Extremeophiles like those at the bottom of the ocean are incredibly durable. New anaerobics will just fill any niche that goes away.

[@therinwhitten]

If they decimate life down there, they decimate it up here. I think the implications are there is a lot of the Oxygen in the atmosphere that has no clearly defined source....until now.

[@Ohm71]

thats who they are. always.

[@therinwhitten]

@@droyal18able It's not the oxygen they are going for, it the nickel and cobalt in the nodules that create the oxygen they would want.

[@Saltycrowofficial]

@@droyal18ableVery informative input to the conversation you said there. Good job. (Note the sarcasm)

[@SpaceWolf21]

This could be very useful for creating a fish tank that produces its own oxygen

[@springtrap_66pg66]

you know what else can produce its own oxygen in a fish tank?... Plants.... *facepalm*

[@SpaceWolf21]

@springtrap_66pg66 Yeah but you have to take care of plants. Rocks can sit there for millions of years undisturbed and be ok. I could layer the fishtank with these and leave and come back and not have to worry about suffocating fish so long as a friend stops by to feed them while im gone. And before anyone else comes for me I'm just your average Joe no a biology genious or (fish god) my life is not ponyo it's broke dude that likes beer and pizza and maybe wants a goldfish for a pet

[@brandonstrickland2742]

Maybe not so much a geo battery that depletes, but a geomagnetic source that generates a field which has a similar effect in that it facilitates a molecular separation of some kind.

[@brandonstrickland2742]

..hence, allowing oxygen to become separated from it's waterbased constituents. ..which, if not for the sediment being agitated, maybe just the still water surrounding the magnetic source being stimulated, could in effect facilitate a step of this separation process. This all said, I have little formal scientific background and would be interested in hearing feedback on this hypothesis from someone who has more in depth knowledge on the subject ***

[@glidershower]

Similar boat on experience, but I have a different hypothesis, posted it on the main comment section but I'll copypasta it here: [One of the most revolutionary happenings in the Cambrian explosion was the "Great Burrowing," when ancient creatures began to evolve the ability to burrow under the ocean floor. It has been theorized thus that the Great Burrowing was largely responsible for shifting the composition of the ocean floor, making it fertile and oxygenized over the eons. And while pretty much none of the world's shenanigans would affect the composition of marine soul, _human intervention could._ We could dig far deeper and profoundly disturb a lot more of anciently settled soil than almost any other natural disaster could. Leaving the chemical footprint of mining behind, the stirring of the deep soils alone would be more than enough to turn fertile and oxygenated soil into the dead dumps of sea clay that once made up our ocean's floors, _before life._ *We are lowkey the asbestos of the sea's lungs.* ]

[@patpozzuto4809]

We've learned to make diamonds in the lab, someday maybe we'll create those nodules in a lab.

[@ISayNukem]

Wow. You just gave me a bit of hope, thank you. 😅

[@caseytwill]

To what purpose? Diamonds are mined not because of their content, but because their structure makes them incredibly useful in industrial applications. It makes sense that we would figure out how to make them in a lab. The nodules are mined because of their mineral content, not because of their structure, so there's absolutely no reason to make them in a lab.

[@patpozzuto4809]

@@caseytwill To save the planet... we keep cutting down the forests, covering up millions of acres of green land with black solar panels. FYI, I'm not a "tree huger" or a hysterical climate change believer, just a practical rational open minded individual.

[@mqb3gofjzkko7nzx38]

Turning refined metal back into ore?

[@patpozzuto4809]

@@mqb3gofjzkko7nzx38 If it means saving earth, yes... I'm ok with not disturbing what is down there. Only because of that "oxygen" thing. I believe it's kinda of important😉

[@DM-kv9kj]

Stop calling it "dark oxygen"...it's just oxygen.

[@extinctreminant]

It’s called dark oxygen because it’s produced without sunlight my guy.

[@JohnVance]

Aw man, I was hoping seabed mining might be guilt-free.

[@justinfoster7699]

this "Dr" got paid 12K USD by the deep sea mining company to sow doubts about the oxygen producing capability of the modules... he is also hoping for it

[@googleyoutubechannel8554]

"a simple form of electrolysis' LOL. so you mean... electrolysis.

[@DamienThimons-rv1wj]

To me of all the elements To me you have all the elements there. Dissimilar metals, Acidic solution, Acidic solution, Magnetic lines of force. You could make a step down or step up Transformer/Ignition coil out of those materials right there

[@fluffyblue4006]

My theory is that the ocean floor is heated from within the earth. The nodules are directly in contact with this hot surface and surrounded by a heat insulating layer of sediment. On top, they're in contact with cold seawater. The Peltier effect could then charge that nodule like a battery, if it consists of the right layers. The stored electrical energy could then keep the electrolysis going for a while. But this process also creates hydrogen gas. One would expect that the researchers would find it. Or could another process immediately adsorb that? If that would happen, I'd expect the pH to change. Also something the researches probably would have noticed. Unless they were too much fixated on their dark oxygen. Interesting...

[@miamyos]

The difference between the isolated samples and the ocean floor is that the ocean floor has a constant flow of fresh seawater. Maybe that's what keeps the creation of dark oxygen going?