Where Is Calving Heimburg on Your GOAT List? | Debate Night

Trevor is joined by Dustin, Matt, Jack, and Brodie for this week's Debate Night!
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[@Aether_Paradox]

I was actually enjoying Jack without the script. Then he said Calvin was "just another player" on tour because he doesn't have a Major yet. That's a WILD take.

[@bobbyshizz2138]

Props to Jack for bringing it off the dome this episode.

[@thomasbrovont4114]

He just needs to learn what a bullet point is. It's ok to make some notes on the points you want to bring up. "I want to talk about A, B and C" and leave it at that.

[@sexualfarts4783]

Jack is cringe

[@sweetvigil]

When it's all said and done Calvin will be remembered as one of the greatest to throw a disc. His consistency and competition he's playing against solidifies his standing among the greats.

[@rman713]

Why is Matt basically Trevor ten years younger

[@matthewmarsh8793]

This is not true I met Trevor three weeks ago I am significantly shorter, perhaps I’ll grow though.

[@rman713]

@@matthewmarsh8793 😂

[@rman713]

2 minutes in and it’s already tense between Jack and Brodie… I’m here for it

[@bsmithhammer]

I'm only hear for the carnage and crying.

[@rman713]

@@bsmithhammer it’s not a real debate if a friendship doesn’t get ruined

[@daftdolfing8712]

Get other pros on here. This will avoid the cringe clowning Brodie gives these young guys. He’d never talk to another pro like he talks to these guys. Feedback should be off camera. “No I’ll will” then “go to another show no one watches”. Wish Trevor had more moderator control.

[@mijo5964]

I would hope you’re in the minority on not enjoying the childish drama tho 🤷

[@birdinflight3861]

The Q series shouldn’t be about the fans and the product of itself, it should be about finding the best players who aren’t currently on tour to make it on tour, thus making the big picture product better. Eventually people will pay attention to it if people are getting relegated, and other people are coming up.

[@BrendanHodgens]

Trevor is the host, not Brodie... The lag is only a problem for him because he can't cut in and interject during someone elses turn... Which should be disallowed for everyone except the host. Brodie, please let us hear the other's uninterupted during THEIR turn!

[@thumberlife]

While I agree that panelists should be allowed to make their points uninterrupted, one thing I will say as someone who has been on the show 5 times is that the lag makes the recording very difficult. It really hinders the banter and conversation between the rounds and can be just as frustrating as Brodie makes it seem.

[@nickowns55]

Calvin is a clear top 10 all time.

[@bsmithhammer]

I don't know how anyone could argue otherwise. Unless they're clueless or delusional.

[@fallenshane19]

GOAT is about legacy, and he’s the best player to have never won a major. Probably goes to 8th with a USDGC, 7th with a world title 1. Paul McBeth x17 2. Ken Climo x18 3. Ricky wysocki x6 4. Barry Shultz x5 5. Will Schustrick x4 6. Dave Feldberg x7 7. Nate Doss x4 8. Eagle McMahon x2 9. James Conrad x2 10. Chris Dickerson x2

[@leastselfawarepotassium]

Jack straight off the dome! Let’s see how it goes. Respect for fronting up.

[@toughguy1125]

Boy that sentence is laden with sekshul innuendo..

[@leastselfawarepotassium]

@@toughguy1125haha oops.

[@frowgbat]

In pro golf, PGA tour is the PGA tour...but USGA has 1 major ...thats what needs to happen in pro disc golf....theres the DGPT....and then PDGA's big major for the year that has an open qualifier

[@epheezee313]

It isn't a foundation podcast without Brodie making whatever technical difficulty they're dealing with 10X worse by bringing it up every 2 minutes.

[@BrucekyPlush]

This is nothing like around the horn. Brodie needs to be muted more if he just is going to run over people while they give their takes.

[@DiscGolfKyle]

The lag wrecking Brodie’s timing 😂

[@myvidaloka]

Why not just put Champions Cup at Eagles Crossing?

[@jacksonlee2101]

Owner won’t allow signage all over the property Without sponsorship money pro tour can’t go anywhere, let alone make the most expensive prize purse

[@EricCalhoun]

@@jacksonlee2101 That's kind of insane considering that he's sunk well over a million into the property (for just the main course before they added the 2nd), even at $40 per round that's a long time to make your money back... maybe he's rich enough to not really care...

[@myvidaloka]

@@jacksonlee2101 that’s stupid. Because he’s said in the past he would like to have Worlds be there. So if he wants worlds, he’s going to HAVE to have signage there, REGARDLESS. I doubt it’s that. I’m thinking it has to do with the PDGA not wanting us to have it. Plain and simple.

[@michaeldailey9845]

Brodie immediately contradicted what he was saying on the podcast he did with Paul. On that podcast he and Paul were saying they didn't like swenson specifically because if you wanted to go for the birdie you had to risk the bogie. On this podcast he does a full 180°. So which is it? Is Swenson too hard or too easy? Are risk reward shots good or bad? Yesterday brodie specifically said risk reward shots were bad for disc golf.

[@thumberlife]

Keep in mind that this show is recorded before Brodie does his Tour Life podcast with Uli. Like, literally right before that podcast.

[@lukeflorea]

This episode was painful to watch. It’d be nice to get guests with different backgrounds on here. I’d love to watch more pros and others who work in the dg industry.

[@douggiefreshdg]

Let’s go boys!

[@tml7189]

Here are some facts: Brodie's style of argumenting consists of yelling and generally just winging it, which is fine because it is entertaining. However, what is ALSO entertaining is listening to someone deliver a prepared answer, since in most cases prepared answers are better thought out. Nothing wrong with having both styles present in these debates.

[@leastselfawarepotassium]

Couldn’t agree more.

[@DiscGolfKyle]

I think we’ve already seen the drawing on screen during live coverage when they do form analysis. It should be an option they use more often, just not sure if they’ve thought to utilize it more.

[@613cjt]

Holy crap…can we please hear everyone’s answer to a question before Brodie starts going back and forth with people?!? Mute everyone’s mics until all answers have been given then you can rebuttal after.

[@thomasbrovont4114]

As far as coverage goes. All they said sounds great. Add graphics. Add more cameras. Do this do that. That all takes time and money. If you want more cameramen that's more money. If you want graphics, it either takes longer to release a video or it takes more people doing the graphics etc. Which takes more money.

[@DiscAbledGolfer]

Sounds like Brodie has it all figured out except when he's switching to commentary 😂

[@Footfaultguy]

HALF THE ISSUE ON LIVE IS THE PLAYERS STAND IN THE CAMERA VIEW and them having to cut to catch cam to early

[@FormerAmericanIdol]

You realize that is still an issue with the CAMERA GUY & EDITING BOOTH not the players right? The cams aren't stationary but the teepads sure are. Having different camera angles is great! Switching angles MID FLIGHT simply to see the exact blade of grass it lands on is not great. That's what replays are for. Imagine watching basketball and every time they pass the ball it cuts to a new angle because that cam is closer to the ball 😵‍💫

[@Footfaultguy]

Next time you watch LIVE….take notice of how many times the player just stands in the middle of the cameras view

[@Falcon888]

This is correct. And it’s not as simple as stand in the right spot. It’s tricky to get a good angle that also won’t be blocked by the player. The people who say show one angle always seem to ignore this part of it.

[@81GTUN4]

Calvin’s the goat

[@ryandoherty7994]

Major’s do effect notoriety, but Conrad with a worlds title and holy shot…idt he’s on anyone’s goat list.

[@cirkuslizard8697]

He also has a USDGC win.

[@Koa1989]

I just need to win that Powerball then I'll go buy both the PDGA and dgpt outright and then have the touring pros come in and figure out how to set up the tour which courses to play for which events

[@martycoplea8697]

The PDGA subsides the DGPT a ton. A lot of the membership $ is given to DGN to offset the discounts offered to PDGA Members.

[@ransomA.]

Great show from our guy Jack. Honestly fire today

[@Koa1989]

The Q series should allow the pros to play in them but they get a set amount they do some autographs and sell some merch on top of the set rate but that way the prize pool stays with the ppl trying to get the tour card and they can still see where they truly stand against a touring pro.

[@ZeJester]

I feel like the perspective piece could be much easier to solve just through the use of graphics. Not to discredit the fact that better/more cameras would be great, but ultimately if a graphic were to come up that showed 3-4 key stats: Distance thrown Distance to basket The spot of the disc on a birds eye map of the hole And maybe a keyword such as fairway, rough, heavy rough, ob. Again, it's not an end-all fix that's perfect, but it helps clarify the important information. If the camera work on the hole was confusing, at least your questions would mostly be answered by this graphic. Great thoughts today btw.

[@gamerincorpor8]

Add triple Mandos for every ideal landing zone or flight path on every hole on tour. If disc golf ever wants to grow to the next step and really challenge pros, it’s gotta embrace what pros can do with a disc uniquely. Yes it’s gimmicky on paper. In reality some of the best and most entertaining holes on tour do this already. Really think about it from the viewer and player perspective.

[@johnbailey4626]

What about a split-screen of each tee shot with two different perspectives in real-time?

[@jumbo8673]

Exactly what I was thinking.

[@jumbo8673]

I can't believe I'm saying this but maybe switch it up and make Brodie the host. Trevor would be a great debater and since Brodie is pretty much the only one that rebuttals, he can after someone has their time and maybe the explanation of his rebuttals can help or hurt their score. Seeing Dustin have no idea how to answer Brodie's question about the PDGA made me think he would ask the right questions and get people to explain their point more.

[@ohNONOky]

What about stationary cameras on remote control from a booth?

[@DiscGolfKyle]

Topic idea: What does it take to change the World Championships from “just another tournament” and make it a truly prestigious event?

[@donkarnage6032]

Probably wouldn’t be preferred to have 3 major tournaments in one area but if the PDGA was really set on keeping Champions Cup a wooded major then why not go a few hours up the road to Charlotte. Move Champions Cup to Nevin and the DGPT final back to Hornets Nest. This is a temporary move. Just thinking of how many wooded courses are major tested and there aren’t many. Charlotte seems like a good option with its proximity to the PDGA headquarters.

[@ryandeininger822]

Champions cup idea: Change Pin Positions each round. Make a big deal about it. Also - flip mandos on holes where it would work after the cut.

[@ryandeininger822]

OTB doesn't have many holes that audiences want to watch played 4 times (3 is pushing it for most of them). So let's solve that. New pins make it so that every hole is different (even slightly) each round.

[@Leroyjenkins90]

Thought that was Danny Lyndahl in the thumbnail. Highly disappointed.

[@DiscGolfWithSig]

He would be such a good guest!

[@brianh553]

Major league players go back down to the minors all the time. Injury rehabs, performance issues, etc. Aaron should still be allowed to play his local event he's been playing for years.

[@devonwatt2194]

That’s out of those players control though. There’s a difference between a baseball player being sent to the minors for poor performance and choosing to go play in the minors because the competition is worse.

[@michaelmaniloff9297]

​@devonwatt2194 what if A tiers are OK but no B and C tiers?

[@brianh553]

@@devonwatt2194 The 303 Open has been around for over a decade in the local Colorado scene. Most players could care less about the Q series. They like the tournament and want to play it for the 10th year in a row like Joe Revere. Get over it guppy.

[@devonwatt2194]

@@brianh553 touring professionals should not be playing in a series designed for people who want to qualify to be a touring professional. It’s not that hard to understand. How long the specific tournament has been going on is irrelevant.

[@bg5148]

This show needs a dedicated host, with how involved Trevor gets he should just be a guest 😂

[@jasondunnewold4946]

Commenting every week until Uli is on the show

[@bsmithhammer]

It would be great to get more touring pros on Debate Night. And Uli would be excellent.

[@stephenloch3214]

Do people not listen to Philo break down holes on live coverage? He does that so well, especially when someone throws an amazing shot that just looks mundane. It is difficult to see live, but I think the catch camera's can be better placed.

[@stephenloch3214]

Matt is totally on track. All of the camera operators are on foot, in most cases. Which makes perspective really hard. Wisely placed camera towers, especially on open courses. Woods is another question.

[@Windwalker3120]

I liked matt

[@aarontwitchell3633]

Pdga current members should be able to vote on the policies that they are considering and rules Maybe even elections of some sort

[@Cspeck10]

I might be wrong, but I believe the PDGA owns the majors. So I believe that is one of the biggest reasons that they merged. But essentially the Pro Tour does what it wants already.

[@EricCalhoun]

I dislike the change from Silver Series to Q Series. Pros outside the top 20 need to make $$$ on off weeks from the tour, it's inevitable that they'll play.

[@DiscAbledGolfer]

The difference between golf and disc golf is that ball golf has more variables 🤔 using a ball and club vrs just throwing a disc. Do the math a ball and club is just more challenging 😳

[@jumbo8673]

Exactly! Hitting something where you want it is alot harder than throwing something where you want it. That's why I hate comparing the 2 because other than scoring, it's a different sport. It's not like pickleball to tennis.

[@FormerAmericanIdol]

I don't think that math quite checks out. Pretty obvious that golf is very difficult with a very steep learning curve, but not too many variables. Clean contact, correct club, reading a green. Not a whole lot different than disc golf, but the possibilities in disc golf are nearly endless.

[@cirkuslizard8697]

@@FormerAmericanIdolYou unfortunately forgot the most difficult part of golf…the lie. Where you are hitting from, fairway, rough, sand, above or below the ball is infinitely more difficult than anything in disc golf, save maybe throwing 450 ft.

[@jameswisegarver3120]

I have never liked that the PDGA requires the amateur players to pay to participate in the sport.

[@Footfaultguy]

Dustin, the pros obscure the flight of the disc by standing in the camera view, making it hard to track.

[@Grannyknockers]

Switching camera angles mid flight should be a misdemeanor

[@jonathanritenour6563]

Can Trevor give points while people are talking. Just like they did in around the horn.

[@jeff.nyerges]

Champions Cup needs a permanent home. Otherwise it is the same as World's. World's is basically a moving event that goes to various locations, has extended holes and has 4 rounds. The only difference is Title.

[@Norruu]

If you needed someone to shoot -10 on a random pro tour course on a random day to save your life... Calvin would be a great pick.

[@mikesurvant6730]

why r u not talking about brodie taking time off tour he won't come back he's done this in every sport he plays 😂😂 like becoming a pro golfer 😂😂

[@stevenhorne5941]

NFL does what the Owners want them to do..

[@Leroyjenkins90]

Jack, I see you reading them notes brother.

[@leastselfawarepotassium]

They all have notes. The point is to not read straight off a script. You guys had a whine, he listened.

[@Leroyjenkins90]

@@leastselfawarepotassium I was making a joke. I never had a whine about it actually😘

[@leastselfawarepotassium]

@@Leroyjenkins90your joke might give Jack PTSD haha.

[@rman713]

😂 watching his eyes darting down when he wasn’t talking was hilarious… but at least he didn’t read a script this time

[@toughguy1125]

@@leastselfawarepotassium100

[@darwin325]

Brodie, if throwing a disc to 2 feet from a basket from 300 feet away is so easy, why can't you do it? You are a weak player because the game is tough and you can't compete with most pros on tour.

[@claycarroll6804]

Calving

[@jvladcliff4083]

I wish a competing tour would come along, I think it would be good for driving the sport forward and developing what players and spectators really want

[@Flanfam]

Fireworks out the gate!

[@TheLoamFather]

put a 1020 ratings cap on q-series, problem solved.

[@samuelmurphy9396]

Brodie looks like he's ready to self exit from life in general...... lol

[@Christopherdavey1]

Wow

[@zacharywoodford8530]

Disc golf shouldn’t be played on golf courses, and if it is the holes need to be almost entirely in the wooded areas of the course.

[@denniscomeau5190]

Just give me a little camera icon on the hole map or have a man holding a camera during the hole preview to act as a "you are here"

[@itsbrandonbush]

How can we talk about the DGPT's hypothetical split, and what they gain from the PDGA, without mentioning the Majors? Does the PDGA not own all of the prestigious Majors, minus the laughing stock that is the DGPT Championship? Oh, and let's not forget how the DGPT was struggling in business negotiations with uDisc in 2023 and now the PDGA is "letting" the DGPT use their platform for free. I understand PDGA Live is a worse platform, but free is free. It's a mutually beneficial relationship and free's up hundreds of thousands of dollars for the DGPT.

[@cirkuslizard8697]

The PDGA has nothing to do with USDGC. That event is owned and run by Innova. Heck the rounds aren’t even rated as they use stroke and distance on 17. Because of that separation it is the best major in my opinion.

[@mondaysinthecosmos]

Brodie is not an elite player who is dropping off the tour. And its sad to see his amateur brodie bros continue to push a toxic, negative, unprofessional, MID player, because he has asshole takes and they feel validated. Brodie sucks. When people say "get real pros" on here, we mean someone who is not Brodie Smith. Je should --- drop a tier, get better, win some tournaments, and EARN his status. Or become a commentator and admit its because you couldn't be an elite pro, and then youd be worthy of respect.

[@relaxationstation2237]

The whole this is the most competitive field is such a copout and bad excuse. Calvin isn’t close in goat talk. It’s climo and mcbeth end of discussion. And let’s go Brodie! Bring the heat🔥

[@ryandoherty7994]

If you think prime Climo would have that many world titles in todays field…you’ve lost your mind.

[@johngalt1234]

feelgood cake & ice cream weren't served in this episode

[@whorchatasoto]

“Calving”

[@lynch42o]

Calvin is better than everyone Dustin mentioned.

[@joeyb.8613]

Sorry, but Jack just seems like he should be part of a different show or something.....

[@Fatherbaja]

What about the use of drones like they do in distance competitions?

[@chrissmith5177]

Funny these dudes don't know Joe Rovere! That dude is a beast, and top 25 in the world talent. Bringing up Colton as a tour pro, gross. Nane the last time that doesn't rhyme with Waco he was relevant.

[@cirkuslizard8697]

Probably because like most sports, unless you are competing week in and week out with the best, most aren’t going to care. I’m not slandering his talent, but until we see him on tour, no one is going to think of him.

[@chrissmith5177]

@cirkuslizard8697 1035 rated 161 wins I guarantee if he shows up at a tour event, the players know when he is.

[@cirkuslizard8697]

@@chrissmith5177 I hope he does and maybe it’s too bad that there isn’t enough money in the sport for more to tour. But until he decides to do that, he probably won’t be mentioned in any talk of all time bests.

[@chrissmith5177]

@cirkuslizard8697 This wasn't GOAT talk. This was card holders shouldn't play Q. Joe is better than any of the 3 that played. All 3 would likely agree.

[@tdkempton]

I wish so bad I was on the panel for that last question. The issue is the lens mm they are using and the camera positioning. The problem is so easy to solve. They need to stop using these old cameras with fixed wide lenses and digital zoom. How are youtubers using a tripod and we know exactly where the shot is landing but the pro-tour can't do it? Such a joke.

[@helpsomeoneelse]

Exciting start to the show that didn't deliver. No more last minute average shmoes with their opinions plz. Let's get some real pros on here and fix the lag ffs...Long time listener, disappointed disc golfer.

[@kingchuckfinley]

I agree with Jack on the lay up point. Whether people are watching or not, you know that’s the thought that could be had in that scenario. It’s like “I could beat a good touring pro with this putt, but if I miss I might come in third and not get my card” so they lay up and take second and get their card no matter how b!tch made that decision is, because their goal is to become a pro. Whether nobody is watching or everyone is, that’s a bad scenario. Like, they can say “but no one is watching,” but if I’m watching that I’d be so putt off. But yeah Aaron won, but who came in second? Don’t look. Who’s the guy that finally made his goal come true?

[@kingchuckfinley]

And then it’s like “who cares who won it, we wouldn’t know anyway” but you know who won it and didn’t even mention who came in second and got their tour card. If you think it’s a joke, then that’s fine, but at least give the person a little credit

[@d3icid4l65]

These guest suck man ngl. Very hard to watch the debate. L take on Calvin aswell.

[@bowsttv5498]

Lets just admit that the pdga is not the man of the people and doesnt love us like brody does

[@Holycow723]

Has Matt gone through puberty yet?

[@matthewmarsh8793]

Hey man, I’m in the middle of it

[@zachburridge6462]

reading guy is still reading

[@kingchuckfinley]

Big ups jack

[@toughguy1125]

The spice an aggression of Brodie is absolutely welcome! Nobody gives a damn about listening to a mutual admiration society, the people want the smoke!!

[@chrissmith5177]

The GOAT argument from Jack is laughable. Only 2 males even in the Debate. Kenny and Paul. There can only be ONE GOAT. GREATEST

[@Veggamattic]

Trees = luck...there is already way more luck in Disc Golf than almost every other sport so using Northwoods is a problem.

[@itsshrike1237]

Disc golf belongs in the woods

[@Luffy-rf5yc]

Northwood has no S at the end.

[@rman713]

Trees don’t equal luck… trees are unique obstacles that make disc golf interesting. And it takes skill to avoid them. It’s not very fun to watch the pros just rip hyzers into open fields.

[@Veggamattic]

@@rman713 Trees totally = luck!

[@ryandoherty7994]

lol What’s the ratio for luck/treenied in your playing experience?

[@ETXB]

I don't like Jack. 👍 if you agree.

[@tinncan]

Most of the people probably got sick of Brody and stopped listening long ago...

[@mikesurvant6730]

Calvin is not on the list he hasn't even won a major

[@nickcowan4147]

Commenting every week till Brodie is off the show weekly!

[@Leroyjenkins90]

You’d be a happy, lonely man watching this if Brodie wasn’t on here. He’s for the people!

[@leastselfawarepotassium]

I really don’t see how this show would work without Brodie.

[@jamesonklein9363]

No one would watch without Brodie, me included. It would just be a circle jerk and no edgy takes, which is boring.

[@teukka623]

Calvin isn’t on my goat list at all until he wins some majors

[@Luffy-rf5yc]

Disliked for bringing Jack back.