Why Advance a Horse Past the Snaffle?

Check out my book "The Started Colt: Horsemanship as an Art" on Amazon, Barnes and Noble or ReaderHouse.com
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[@mrssuperschmidty]

I really soaked this up. I often bridle my horse in privacy as many of the gals I ride with with don’t understand my efforts toward the spade bit. I especially see how happy and proud my horse is feels the bridle. I have a long way to go. Thank you for all of these videos. Nice to hear connected ideas related to my trials, errors and efforts!🙏

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

you bet

[@fortsecondchance5551]

The Prince is indeed a great book providing valuable insights into the ways of the world.

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

For sure

[@yawyobwoc]

The hammer comment reminds me this: "If the only tool you have is a hammer, it is tempting to treat everything as if it were a nail." --- Abraham Maslow

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

That is a great line. Im stealing it.

[@dannonya8783]

Thanks for all the effort you guys put into these videos. Appreciate it very much. learn something every time. Thank you.

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

Im sure glad

[@fortsecondchance5551]

I’ve looked at hundreds of pieces of artwork of medieval horses, more specifically soldiers/knights on their war steeds, and I have yet to see a knight go to war in a snaffle bit.

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

I love it! Absolutely right.

[@kalubcurran8365]

If a shovel is working why would you need an excavator. First thing that came to mind😂

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

Well that isn't really on par with what is going on. A shovel is a good tool that can only do one thing, an excavator is a different tool that can do a lot of other things.

[@wildaterrile5160]

Thanks, always good info. I used to think it was good I could run my barrel horses at full tilt in a snaffle..... I owed them more.❤️

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

glad you enjoyed

[@sethlarson5110]

I'd be interested in here a detailed explanation how the hackmore works and communicates with a horse. What you expect out of it and how you use it in the progression. Thanks.

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

Check out the patrion channel I go into some detail there. Also check through the archives of this channel I talk about the hackamore a lot. Thank you.

[@nadinehulbig5582]

Interesting thoughts 😊

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

Im glad you think so

[@comesahorseman]

Well, 94.5 percent of my horse experience is with on track Standardbreds, who (almost) never drive in a leverage bit. So, I'll take your word on snaffle bits but keep using them. 😄

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

Lol I dont think you need to worry about leverage bits on cart horses. That kinda makes me smile to think about though

[@CarvellFenton]

My money is ready for as soon as book 2 is ready! ;) Great explanation. Thank you again!

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@jeffdunn9865]

Hi Brett. Really enjoying your videos and just finished your book…excellent! Waiting for a video of you tying the head to the tail as part of your program.

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

I dont have one? well heck that's an easy fix, ill get on it.

[@economyrvandtrailerrepair9059]

I'm sure you won't mind if I refer this video to many at the barn. As I get older it's getting harder to walk by someone using a snaffle poorly and not say nut'n. it'll save me time and friends. Thanks good job!

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

please do

[@paulacorso7954]

Started my 2yr old gelding in the Dr Cooks bitless (that's a cross under like an Indian bosal) then full cheek snaffle as a 6-7 yr old. He is 18 now (and I'm old and busted and still an amature). He has been ridden in that snaffle for 12 years now. I recently wanted to go back to bitless, well because I use more treats now and it seems like he's getting old. I got another Dr Cooks bitless and realized they maybe don't release very well as they are made of neoprene or biothane. (So I may try a rope cross under, the Indian bosal to see if it releases better, kinda for fun.) In the meantime i have had trouble on the right circle. He's gotten in the habit, even before I reintroduced bitless, of coming out of a nice bend and leading in with his right shoulder. I feel like an acrobat exaggerating my seat to clue him in! My questions; what bit or bitless would help him understand best. I don't know how I got him into that habit. He does better sometimes than others. Something in me wants to try a bridle bit? Q #2 will I mix him the heck all up trying dif stuff at this point? (He is a double stacked whorl, in relation to a recent video u made.) The trainer I have couldn't remedy and didn't mention changing up any tack.

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

At his age and your level I dont think swapping to a bit will really help anything at all. No it won't hurt anything to try other tack but I dont think it will help much. Dropping the shoulder has more to do with balance that the bit or lack of bit. Check his teeth as well

[@paulacorso7954]

@@HorsemanshipAsAnArt hey thank you so much for your answer! I'm gonna study some circling videos and move the mounting steps, in case his shoulder is heading in toward that. One piece of tack I will switch to is using lighter reins so I can feel how much I'm affecting the bit better. He's up on his dentals but his front left is missing. I treat with pillow mints or I soak small horse cookies in a water when he is wearing his bit. Still may try an Indian bosal. We are in it for the fun! I did order your book, & a big thanks!

[@balancedhorsemanshipllc8339]

Awesome discussion topic and well developed! Thank you and keep up the good work 😁

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

Thank you.

[@user-mb1hg4qu9f]

On the other hand, how do you know whether or not you need that advanced level of communication until you achieve it?? 😊

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

True and I guess that is as much a part of the process as anything.

[@thiesenteam]

Excellent video again. I love your thoughts on how and why you do what you do. Some horsemen think you can’t/shouldn’t make a spade horse out of a typically built quarterhorse saying their wither isn’t high enough money their throat latch is too thick, and their neck doesn’t come up at a high enough angle. I’ve been thinking that if I found the right bit for my quarterhorse I don’t see a reason we couldn’t progress our horsemanship to be worthy of a spade bit. I’m thinking that a well-balanced Santa Barbara cheek, and a spoon with an angle back would work well for her (she’s built almost equal hip to wither height). She already listens to my pauses I leave in my requests (training for a pre-signal). Thoughts?

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

You can most defiantly make a spade bit horse out of a modern quarter horse. On a flat horse(hip and wither equal) I like a Santa Susana or a Nevada cheek and a small narrow Spanish spade with some angle in it. No reason you can't ride anything in a spade.

[@thiesenteam]

@@HorsemanshipAsAnArt thank you so much. I will look into it. I appreciate your advice very much. I’ll start my research on finding an excellent bit per your advice.

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

@@thiesenteam My advice plus a dollar and a half and you can buy a cup of coffee lol

[@sagebrush4573]

Do you ever take any of your horses straight from the hackamore to the two rein, or do you always throw a snaffle bit in there for a time? Genuinely curious, I love hearing this discussion! Looking forward to this new book that you're writing.

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

yes I have gone strait through from hackamore to two rein to bridle a few times, I think it is a good way. Anymore I rarely get to put in the ranch miles to pull it off. It takes more time on the desert, in the arena or shorter ranch days a guy can get a lot done with a snaffle. Im not really traditional, I think making it home at night to kiss my wife and babies is the oldest part of the tradition and the only part I care about

[@sagebrush4573]

@@HorsemanshipAsAnArt thank you!

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

@@sagebrush4573 thank you

[@epona9166]

Bret, how is a soft rawhide hackamore a leverage device? You're talking about a bosal?

[@myearthlytreasures3]

Excellent!

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

Thank you

[@elgallorojo]

thanks as always!

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

you bet

[@raeganstegmeier9131]

What’s your opinion on starting a horse in the hackamore and then transitioning to a snaffle?

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

That is what I do, I go to the snaffle within ten rides.

[@johnjacobs4207]

A snaffle is for teaching the principle of bend. If you aren't understanding this you will never advance yourself

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

I do understand that. I have trained a lot of Snaffle bit horses

[@epona9166]

A Jen Psaki thing where you go back to where you started and probably didn't tell us anything?? Cute. Just what I wanted, some political snark mixed in with my horse video. Will I find some in your book, which I received yesterday?

[@marcgingras9135]

First Happy Xmas to you and your family ! Another great great video. You finished with the question I was about to ask. I was riding this 10 years old horse with the snaffle. That was the only bit he was used to. He was doing ok but i always felt like he was fighting a little with the bit. I transitioned to the bosal and in two session i saw a good difference in the horse. He seems more relaxed and the communication is somewhat better! Should i continue to just ride him with that? thanks buddy!

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

Sure and advance him from that when its time

[@TheOldManRip]

Actually, I believe it is 1:1 ratio, not zero. Of course, we may be defining the system differently but I don't see how we could be. On your other video regarding leverage bits, the shank increases the force and decreases the speed. It is the same concept as low gear on a car, high torque, low speed.

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

you mean on a ring snaffle? It is a zero ration because there is no leverage. A 1:1 would be a sea saw. At least that is what the engineers tell me

[@TheOldManRip]

You cannot practically ever have a force ratio of 1:0 since that would result in division by zero (1/0 = infinity). Still don't know if we are defining things the same but a snaffle is 1:1, i.e., one pound of pull on the reins = one pound of force on the horses mouth. The leverage bits are force multipliers and provide more force with reduced speed as mentioned before. A snaffle bit could be considered a leverage bit with equal length shanks of length zero so it has no rotational torque but has strictly linear force. The forces in a leverage bit can be solved by finding the equilibrium of two torque equations. I'm interested in making sure that I haven't missed something obvious here. Send me your email and I'll sketch out a couple of force diagrams for your consideration.

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

@@TheOldManRip davistraining83@gmail. I know exactly what you are saying, I understand perfectly. What I am say is that a snaffle is a zero ratio bit not 1:0 just zero because there is no leverage so therein be no ratio. Non ratio would be saying the same as zero ratio. But please do send the sketches because Im guessing we are both missing something in our definitions

[@TheOldManRip]

@@HorsemanshipAsAnArt Don't know why but email is rejected as undeliverable.

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

@@TheOldManRip im computer illiterate so I dont know what to say. I didn't know things could be undeliverable

[@allanwhittaker3950]

When is your book on biting available and how do i order 1

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

Im not finished with it yet, getting close, Ill announce it when its finished so people can pre order.

[@outfitr9703]

I used to ride some of our better mountain horses with just a halter in the cold snowy weather. Guess they weren't bridle horses eh?

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

I had to rewatch the video and as far as I can tell I never said anything at all about riding in a halter or by doing so that would make a horse not be a bridle horse. Im sorry I dont understand the question. If this is sarcasm or a light hearted joke you will have to forgive me, I dont get most jokes.

[@outfitr9703]

@adavis1989 sorry man, I guess I worded it all wrong, I see your point. I was jokingly just trying to point out opposites, your refined training and myself riding up switchbacks with a halter. I'll just shut up.

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

Oh no worries, I dont mind, I just get a little worried when I dont understand kinda like a colt. I am high functioning Autistic so I dont really get jokes and I can't always tell in text or in person if someone is joking or making a point or disagreeing. Anyway no big deal keep rocking on. @@outfitr9703

[@mattdoyle509]

I enjoyed the started colt but can’t find the other two. Are you still writing those?

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

yep still writing those, you are on the cutting edge

[@Inca1122]

Hi, i have a 12 y/o. My goal is to ride off seat & leg. I had him in a D ring snaffle but was told by a reiner he was ready for a curb. I had him in that and he seemed more responsive & more relaxed neck reining than direct but a other trainer said to soften him more, put him back in the D ring and work on flexion. I ride for pleasure only but my end goal is to have a balanced & soft feel. Is it better to then go back to the D ring? As u can prob tell, i am not the most experienced. I just want to do right by my horse

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

pic one trainer or the other and stick with what they say

[@racenail9086]

Thanks " Elliot" for this video. I do not use spurs and have used a snaffle on my horse because I am not a good rider. By the same token I feel I need a bit in my horses mouth for security since my horse is still learning too ( I know, "a bad combination"). What do you think of a straight steel or mullen mouth bit for "kindness" for the horse yet still some greater control than a rope halter?

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

I have seen those types of bits but have never used one, I find that the hackamore is the best tool around once I am out of the snaffle. A snaffle is a great tool and can be great for a young horse or an inexperienced rider be carful but dont forget they will forgive you.

[@None-hk1bi]

Looking to find somebody to train this 4 year old grade qh that i cant get to quit bucking near douglas, asking because you seem to know what you are talking about and are familiar with agua prieta.

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

Well that's a heck of a thing for a resume lol. Pablo Tapia would know somebody but I dont know how to get a hold of him. The manager at the three t ranch. in Douglas is named Sheridan, if you stop in there and told him I sent you he might know someone, maybe one of his Cowboys.

[@None-hk1bi]

@adavis1989 Thanks didn't mean to offend you or nothing just looking for options at this point.

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

No offense taken, I thought it was funny. Like I said I know a few guys around there and I reckon if you go out to the TTT and ask you can find somebody to ride for you. It is right on the border next to the areonotics school. Just drive into HQ and start asking. Hope you speak Spanish @@None-hk1bi

[@southernforestgypsy]

Can i ask, at what point in a horses education is he ready to transition from snaffle to a western bit? Really getting a lot out of your videos, thank you.

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

Sort of a tough question to answer. I will transition the horse when it responds quickly, lightly and accurately to all my ques and is operating more off my other aids than the bit. That is fairly broad and assumes a lot but its a readers digest version. Im not sure if readers digest still exsistes so depending on your age that may be irrelevant. Anyway I am very pleased that you like the videos and I am happy to be part of your education with horses.

[@frankjensen6428]

Good shit Bret

[@HorsemanshipAsAnArt]

Thanks Frank