Why Are Race Tracks Banked? | Neil deGrasse Tyson Explains...

Why do they bank race tracks? On this explainer, Neil deGrasse Tyson and co-hosts Chuck Nice and Gary O’Reilly explore banked turns and angular momentum in race car driving. How hard is it to steer?
Why are race track’s turns banked? How steep are they sloped? Can you race an oval track without turning? What happens if the car goes too slow on the banked track? We discuss Mario Andretti’s racing philosophy and how does air pressure impact the weight of the car. All that, plus, Neil shares an at-home experiment with moving air.
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Science meets pop culture on StarTalk! Astrophysicist & Hayden Planetarium director Neil deGrasse Tyson, his comic co-hosts, guest celebrities & scientists discuss astronomy, physics, and everything else about life in the universe. Keep Looking Up!
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[@ashafaghi]

Neil has to be one of the most valuable individuals providing knowledge and fun

[@AZ4N4774]

Mario Andretti’s quote is actually “If everything seems under control, you're not fast enough”. Similar meaning but better. Thanks for the great videos!

[@KevinS47]

This was a blast, so funny to listen to! My dad actually is a friend and fan of Mario Andretti, they talk on the phone every now and then to catch up (since we live in Italy), so when I heard Neil knows the guy, I got really really excited as Neil is one of my personal idols hahah! I essentially embarked on the journey in Theoretical Physics thanks to Neil, so the slight chance of getting a message through really got me jumping around =)

[@silentracer911]

Racing is a beautiful display of engineering, if you could do explainers on the engines/drivetrains themselves, one on aero modifications. Or do a cosmic queries with an expert, they can really get into the known stuff and some maybe lesser known things about the sport. But it’s still a big left turn

[@StarTalk]

Loved the joke

[@kenqb5450]

Daytona's turns are banked at 31 degrees and Talladega's tuns are at 33 degrees. I heard that Talladega was built with this banking because concrete or blacktop cannot be laid at any steeper incline. F1 and Indy have reduced the number of races on high banked ovals because their speeds can get too high. Texas motor speedway is probably at the highest banking, 20 and 22 degrees. Another experiment for the Bernulli effect, is to tie a ping pong ball to a light string move it closer and closer to a hair dryer, at full speed, or a faucet completely opened, the ping pong ball will be pulled into the stream of air, or water.

[@necrobrewer838]

That's why in racing terms its called "being on the limit" the limit of traction and space, you're often fastest right at the edge of losing control of the car. The driver wants to get everything they can from the physical ability of the car itself without going over the limit.

[@ChromeCobra420]

Of course youre fastest at the edge of losing control. Thanks, Captain Obvious.

[@necrobrewer838]

@@ChromeCobra420 Hey! I super love your channel! Lots of great retro stuff! You're an excellent gamer! Stick with it! 😀

[@ericparrish1515]

U from Rutherfordton?

[@gnarthdarkanen7464]

Definitely looking forward to all the future racing physics talks!!! I'm also glad we got to touch on flat-tracks and formula 1, because one should define "high speed" when discussing race tracks and banking. I'll give you that rally and some flat dirt-tracks are definitely slower than Nascar, but Formula 1 and F-zero aren't so much... Worth a tickle on asphalt and tarmac versus concrete. Asphalt is going to have a grit coarseness similar to a sheet of sand paper, and it physically "bites into" tires to add to friction/traction. Heating the rubber actually makes it softer, not necessarily sticky or gummy, since that would take a bit more heat than you want on a pressurized tire supporting a ton or two of vehicle with a living driver inside. Softer tires "stick" better than harder/colder tires. The same is true for motorcycles, though we don't really have enough rubber to want to get out and spin them to heat them up, preferring to ride gently or even find a good spot for some figure-8's to practice before hitting a road with any "real speed" in the design... Racing Bikes will have the wheels artificially heated up with what are essentially electric blankets wrapped around them before races to get them ready to run hard right out of the pits... ;o)

[@NickB1121]

Dale Earnhardt used to always talk about the "dip" coming out of turn 2 at Daytona......it would cause a brief loss of traction as the air flow below the car would increase once you went over that small dip in the track. He told Terry Bradshaw during a ride along about this, and said you had to be really careful out of turn 2 with that sudden drop of friction due to the track dip, and said he usually tried to avoid it, or else you would spin out. You should watch the video of Earnhardt taking Terry Bradshaw on that trip around the track just before he died in 2001.

[@michaelallen2501]

There's so many more things that circle track race teams are doing to cheat the physics in their favor. Like running a larger diameter tire on the outside of the car than the inside. Running a rear suspension design that changes the wheelbase of the car in the turn, making the inside tires closer to each other than the outside tires. Running lots of camber to maximize tire contact patch. Running aero down force to push the car harder into the track than it's own mass would otherwise do etc. This is just the tip of the iceberg.

[@sambereket8141]

Don’t forget the flux capacitor and the blinker fluid!

[@sambereket8141]

Don’t forget the flux capacitor and the blinker fluid!

[@Meddling-Martian]

My StarTalk… Neil Tyson is on National Geographic lol

[@Meddling-Martian]

Toshiba laptop is a satellite

[@Meddling-Martian]

@@timothyp.southwick6542 false my friend very false

[@kirandeepchakraborty7921]

We want a whole new Star Talk series all about Racing Cars

[@car-nivores]

I'm not surprised Chuck is a drifting fan lol. More racing physics please!

[@InsaneMetalSoldier]

The friction Joke had me dying 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[@jeffgantz4385]

The suspension is set up for that speed as well. A friend did the NASCAR Experience in Las Vegas, below 130 the car wanted to turn to the left. He maxed out at 160 he had to make only slight steering adjustments. Although he admitted to having a death grip on the wheel the entire time.

[@gnarthdarkanen7464]

From day one of any legitimate riding course on a motorcycle, we have to get drilled about "loosening up" our grip so our hands don't get cramped or go numb... haha... LOTS of people struggle with that for years before they can over-come it, and just about everybody has to deal with it. Hard not to have a "death grip" on any control in or on a "dangerous machine" when you start feeling that danger or risk go up. I've ridden most of my life, and I still occasionally have to flap my elbows and remind myself "Piano hands"... SO your friend's instincts are understandable. ;o)

[@ginamcdonald7854]

Great explanation! My uncle used to race on local dirt tracks way back in the day. The tracks were slightly oval, no banking. It was a regular occurrence for cars to run off the track in the first or second turn the get back on the track in the third turn after running around the outside of the track! There was no seating on the back of the track just flat ground for the drivers to travel on until they could get back on track!!! Good times!!!😂😂😂

[@alecwhatshisname5170]

The dirt cars with massive wings? Sprint cars, I think? Those cars look wild

[@raymondjmetcalfe2927]

thank you for another very interesting video. For anyone living in the UK or visiting there is a the remains of a banked track at Brooklands transport museum. The track is mostly gone but there is enough left to see what Neal was talking about also it is a fantastic day out for anyone interested in science, engineering or transport well worth a day of your time.

[@Familylawgroup]

The more I watch Dr. Tyson’s videos, the more I want Architectural Digest to do a home tour. I love what I see in his backgrounds.

[@TessAcostaWilliams]

My granddaughter is a member of Phoenix Children's Choir, they sang the SSB at Nascar last December for a big race....our first time...it was INSANELY exhilarating...love the hat Neil!

[@undeadnation6585]

I've walked the bank at Daytona, Neil's description is very accurate haha

[@redoxideeternal23]

Kenitic energy in racing is very important as well.. We need an explainer on it..

[@mattmiano0622]

Needed a much longer show

[@jiversteve]

No, it’s about NASCAR.

[@troys6965]

I moved from a mountainous U.S. state that banked it's turns for the posted speed limits, to a flat state that slopes the roadways to both sides to shed water even in turns. Turns are not comfortable without banking for speed.

[@Workstarfish798]

Almost at 2M subs congratulations guys 😁👍

[@ellobo1326]

Excellent video. The lift of a wing or downforce of a spoiler is produced by the Bernoulli effect. Fluid dynamics. But air behaves as a fluid in some instances.

[@SakaGames]

This year's NextGen car in NASCAR had a complete overhaul under the car. Last year, the drive shaft, transmission, rear end gear, and axle was exposed. This year there's a "cap" that covers the entire underside and funnels the air through the rear diffuser, allowing it to go under the car much faster like Dr. Tyson is referring to.

[@Bnio]

One of the things I find fascinating about modern F1 cars is that all the power in the engine is not just for straightline speed, but to help the car get pushed down as it takes corners -- that F1 cars actually have more grip and control on corners the faster they are, which is the opposite of the reason for banked turns. And, fun bonus, tracks like Zandvort have banking, which adds to the variety of racing lines the drivers can take as they try to balance banking with speed and downforce.

[@F_L_U_X]

8:12 I remember a friction episode. I remembered it when you said, "we wouldn't have life without friction."

[@mattevans-koch9353]

If there had been more discussions like this in school, physics and dynamics wold have been a lot more fun. The closest we got was what was the maximum rotational force on the rear wheels of a dragster so that it would not lift its front wheels off the ground. Thank you gentlemen, always the most enjoyable time spent with you.

[@louisrobitaille5810]

The problem is that in school you actually have to apply the formulas and do the maths properly. Trust me, if they actually started to talk about the equations and stuff, they'd easily lose 70% of the audience if not more.

[@mattevans-koch9353]

@@louisrobitaille5810 That would be true. However, when I was studying engineering it always seemed that the problems where you would use the math and develop the techniques for solving the problems were dull and uninteresting. That issue made the classes a labor to attend rather than a joy.

[@EmpyreanLightASMR]

Isn't this what's happening on a road bike (and motorcycles)? As you attain higher speeds, you steer less, but you'll bank your bike more. Intuitively, you'll actually begin steering in the opposite direction to where you want to go, and your bike will turn for you in the direction you need to go. I hit 42 mph on my bike today and love feeling how solid my bike is at those speeds. It does not want to tip over. You are sitting on a rolling wall 😂 It's an incredible feeling.

[@garyowens1284]

Really loving these videos guys thanks 👍😊

[@fazilmuhammed5410]

Neil covering insane tech of Formula 1 on startalk would be my two favourite worlds colliding😍😍😍

[@mycelianotyours1980]

I learned a lot from this video. Thank you guys!

[@anzaborrego123]

Neil, could you do an explainer on adiabatic expansion - I asked my self this question and found the answer fascinating “If hot air rises then why Is it not hot on top mountains” I also read the data centers use adiabatic expansion to cool there facilities.

[@Where_is_Waldo]

13:03 FYI what you're describing is not called a spoiler, it's actually just called a wing. A spoiler doesn't add downforce, it directs airflow to reduce drag. That's a common misnomer.

[@timothyansah]

Amazing yet again. Will love an episode for Formula 1

[@shakon1618]

I'm with Chuck on this one. My high-school physics teacher helped us remember a basic friction formula by saying friction is fun. With the force of friction represented with F, friction coefficient being a Greek u looking thing, and force normal/force perpendicular with an n

[@chullotm1970]

@00:07:30 two things are incorrect... 1. There are two banked curves in F1 at the Dutch Grand Prix in Zandvoort, Turns 3 and 14 - named after former circuit director John Hugenholtz and two-time Indianapolis 500 winner Arie Luyendyk respectively - they have corners banked at around 19 degrees. 2. Neil said that in F1 in corners the cars must slow down, that is also incorrect..there are several corners in F1 that you can take 'flat out' with speeds above 300km/h.

[@jonathonpoloski917]

Its a good explanation of how the track is, and how you can set the car up to take the turns without "turning". But, the "high siding" he's talking about is called being loose, where the back tires loose grip relative to the front tires, the back end comes around as if it where on a dirt track. Although most NASCAR racers like their car's to be as loose as possible without the back end (tires) loosing their grip, while also having the car tight enough for the front tires to keep their grip without them sliding up the track. When this happens, it's called 'being tight'. The front end feels like it wants to go toward the outside wall, like the tires in the front aren't turning at all. There's so many things the NASCAR chassis has to set the whole car up to handle the way they need it. Most good drivers, set their cars up to race the track and not the other cars around them. Then, the bodies and bottom are shaped and designed to create downforce, the bottom is flat, the top is curved, so, air thats going under the car is faster than the air going over, and that creates the suction that pulls the cars into the track surface. But, too much downforce can bottom out the cars, and create a lift sensation, that can be enough of a lift to lose the tires grip and be in a car wreck, so, the newest cars have a slight opening at the front of the racecar at the piece called the splitter, than the sides connect as close to the racing surface as possible, this allows the cars to be as low as possible to have air push the sides down, have air under the car and air over the top to create that total downforce. They can make the springs stiffer so that when the right side of the car settles into the turn, the spring rate pushes the tires into the surface even further, than, tire pressures are also essential to the total grip. Weight adjustments, tape, spoilers brake bias. So many things that these cars have that you can do a whole scientific series on. That would actually be pretty cool.

[@wajisaleem]

That's pretty cool. .. probably makes it more interesting for the drivers, too. .. kind of like flying instead of just driving.

[@bbrewer68]

@StarTalk It's called a "Burnout". When they spin the tires to warm them up or to increase their friction coefficient.

[@official_marcorn]

I love the way the number of subscribers is increasing every time I click to watch a video. More people in the startalk community.2 million soon.

[@jonathanryals9934]

I think a helpful exercise is thinking of driving along a straight road that is at an angle. You would tend to drift to the bottom of the hill, and the force of the friction caused by gravity would be reduced.

[@Ta_nuz]

neatly explained.

[@thesunnynationg]

5:44 Thats absolutely correct! when you dont drive on the edge you are not Racing. thats where another famous quote comes from. (Michael Schumacher) To finish 1st, first you have to finish. bc if you drive on the edge you can end up in the wall.

[@paykm]

Can we have several Star talk episodes on this. May be with an expert too to shed more light.

[@jeffcooke4213]

Among all the other aspects you realized. You could also do an Explainer about where NASCAR originated, during the prohibition of alcohol.

[@thearthurmigliazza]

Always love startalk

[@mx5_enigma308]

I sometimes wonder if Neil ever dulls his understanding of topics by simplifing ideas in order for normal people to understand.... or if it improves his overall understanding. I'd love to see Neil conversate with his peers without the conversation dumbed down for us non-scientist.

[@dascherofficial]

It's both.

[@EmpyreanLightASMR]

That's a good question. We know he gets stuff wrong or his explanations can be incomplete, and people will point it out in the comments lol but that's precisely because he's probably so used to dumbing stuff down. On the other hand, he's acting as a tutor, and one of the greatest strengths in learning a topic is to teach it right back (tutoring). So having this podcast could have invariably made him smarter, though having started the podcast from the very first episode a couple years ago, it's obvious he's not someone who needs to "tutor" to "get it" lol. But he does learn. Sometimes you watch him learning really really quickly on these shows.

[@nicholasgardiner9601]

@Mx5_enigma A reply in response to your reply. The word converse is necessary and sufficient conversate is incorrect.

[@Teo117]

I hope you will offer me your time once more, to answer this question. My thirst for knowledge has driven me to viewing all 151 explainer episodes you have created this far. Thank you for offering me your wisdom. I am 19 y/o I have learned well. What was the process you took to become so educated? I am determined to learn, I spend a minimum of 6 hours daily viewing information I'm yet to see, to understand ideas I'm yet to interact with. Are there other people you recommend learning from? I view Crash Course and have seen about 700 of the 1.4k, I will watch them all. Though I must find more to understand.

[@feralbluee]

This was fascinating! And I think I may have finally, maybe gotten what mass is. But how is it measured? Yeah, so this why I watched this episode, too! 😊

[@katemcclain8405]

I love you guys but talk more about the Indy cars. That is where some of us learned about aerodynamics, down force and tires, the track there is banked around 11 degrees.

[@stephensmith3111]

There are probably earlier examples of which I am unaware, but perhaps the archetypal banked curve was the high speed curve at the Autodromo Nazionale di Monza in Italy, This one goes back to the ancient and arcane days of upright cars with skinny tires: 'Aerodynamic downforce, what's that?"

[@smartignorance847]

Anything science related I just love it

[@lordtnarg1085]

Good video as usual! But I have to say, somebody must get a good camera mount for Neil 😅

[@josephdonais3436]

I find it strange that our minds are so ingrained words that many of us fail to realize that a star is only a star because we have dubbed it so. Neil, Chuck, Gary and Joe are names and words existing only betwixt our ears and nowhere else. The entire Cosmos is in point of fact devoid of our tags.

[@viewfromthehighchair9391]

Chuck's "putting your thumb on the scale" is incorrect. It is more like hanging weights from the bottom of the car literally pulling the car down, not pressing it down. By the way, there is one other part of the down force you haven't covered and that is "diffusion" which is an added down force at the back of a car produced by the increasing height of the body away from the road from the back tire to the back end of the car (couldn't think of a better description at the moment). Anyway, the air flows under the car in a very confined space and then, at the back end of the car suddenly widens which causes a vacuum effect pulling the car down into the track. Again, it is called "diffusion". I realized this might be a thing while watching CART racing and asked a team engineer at race in the garage area. He let me know I was correct and what the correct term was. I was pretty chuffed that I got it right on my own. Pretty cool!

[@bhuvanbharatht]

hey Neil, lookin forward for you breaking down the f1 physics.

[@murtazarangwala1517]

Yes,we want all of it

[@AceSpadeThePikachu]

I'd love to see a video about those loop-de-loop tracks on old Hotwheels track sets.

[@Flame304]

I want more!!

[@vj.joseph]

In some race tracks there is a short flat track inside the banked one too.

[@Meddling-Martian]

Thanks!

[@cheesycarrotsoup]

So much science that goes into race cars

[@jdogg5639]

There's a bit of misunderstanding or oversimplification here. The drivers are absolutely turning the steering wheel through the banked turns - race cars always go faster than the bank's "equilibrium" speed, even at steep banks like Daytona. The bank helps so they don't have to turn the wheel nearly as much as they otherwise would have to, and then less turned wheels means a higher speed before the tires lose traction. Aka - higher banked turns let you go faster before skidding compared to lower banked turns of the same radius.

[@mathieulessard404]

2:01 hahahahaha the guy's reaction after that 🤣

[@WHYNKO]

Can't wait for an explainer on friction, and i hope we are not disappointed...

[@PHlXIUS]

SIDE DRAFT!!!! please i've seen it and how its applied ...i've watched it, i know when it happens... but, explanation on how the flow of aroe works and Do you think Dale Earnhardt could "See the Air"?

[@BernalVSimRacing]

Physics and motor racing, I love when my 2 favorite subjects merge 🥰❤️

[@yasasmaddumage]

Can we talk more on formula 1?

[@user-ss8lb1ur6i]

Hello Neil deGrasse Tyson.. I hope you can explain the phenomenon of tides through the general theory of relativity.. If the force of gravity is an illusion, how does tides happen..? Thank you Neil for all you do for us...

[@mimicampbell4220]

amazing!!!

[@GenX1964]

This is good and it explains why in 1987 Bill Elliot was really risking everything when he, in qualifying for the Talladega 500, set the all time record for a lap of 212.8 mph average speed and he never lifted off the gas. That's getting outside that equilibrium of grip and angle and speed and radius. Bill Elliot holds the track record for fastest qualifying speed at Talladega at 212.809 miles per hour (342.483 km/h) and Daytona International Speedway at 210.364 miles per hour (338.548 km/h), both of which were set in 1987; the mark at Talladega is the fastest qualifying speed for any NASCAR race ever. Talledega has 33° banking, Daytona has 31° banking.

[@sadakotube]

i remember some racing games still don't get this right, where even when you are driving at the correct speed, letting the car steer itself on the banking will put it in the wall.

[@xPoN3dx]

You really see the momentum of the car as it leaves the corner and has less of the lip to help. They "suck" to the outside wall. Also in drag racing those tires squash and flatten out to provide a larger footprint at launch, and again stand up at speed minimizing the amount of friction with the ground to minimize drag. For those who do not understand racing, it all physics and an endless amount of information to know. I've been doing automotive for more than 15 years and I still barely know about 10% of it

[@00kt86]

NASCAR accident explainer would be a fun video. (With clips if possible)

[@PatriciaOConnorBonsaiBalcony]

Add to this how they do it in Formula one. Their cars could run on the ceiling with all the downforce they generate using their front and rear wings-spoilers at speeds little more than 50 mph

[@santanamauricio]

not true the down force doesn't actually have any real 'weight' until you hit 150kph

[@PatriciaOConnorBonsaiBalcony]

@@santanamauricio That's 93 mph and I said at a little more than 50 mph so yes. Also, that figure changes somewhat from year to year with regulation changes. So it is closer to 90 than 50 perhaps(I'llll take your word that you googled it) But otherwise, I stand by my statement. It is mostly true as stated.

[@yorguibeltran]

@2:26 Disappointed at Chuck for not interrupting Neil and saying “Then I can stop at the ATM and get some cash on my way to the finish line”

[@howardb4601]

May have been mentioned before but the geometry of the chassis setups help the turn in the banks. Nothing new but very interesting.

[@robertcampomizzi7988]

My dad designed rubber. It was like having a converstaion with him again. Thanks guys ❤️

[@Rob-eg8qc]

Daytona Bank angle is 31 degree.

[@michaelccopelandsr7120]

Neil and Chuck for 2024

[@sgottoboni]

Great vid. FYI Neil's video has a problem with the frame rate.

[@aymenmekhilef9544]

You had me with the thumbnail

[@theduder2617]

Excellent explanation! Now to tackle for the people: How are posted speed limits determined. FAR TOO MANY SIMPLY HAVE ZERO EDUCATION when it comes to driving. They should understand WHY it is say 55mph instead of 75mph. Should also tackle the term RECKLESS DRIVING. Explain WHY when a person refuses to do anything above 20mph BELOW the posted limit, it is considered reckless driving and can get a person one heck of an expensive ticket.

[@nicholasgardiner9601]

I just wanted to start at the beginning. The track is a loop and it's flat. A car going fast and straight comes to a turn and because it's a race prefers not to brake and slow down much for the turn. You need enough friction to follow the radius of curvature of the turn. Without enough friction you can't make the turn the track is making. You'll slide off the outside of the track or into the wall. The banking is to add to the normal (down) force, traction patch against the road surface. I had thought the banking was to keep you from slipping not that it meant you didn't have to steer to negotiate a turn. That part was intuitively non-obvious, at least to me. I thought Dr. Tyson was going to parse mass versus weight.

[@knuckles1006]

The downforce of a Formula 1 race car above 120 mph can theoretically be driven upside down. Also, many years ago a new racetrack had banks so steep that drivers were in fear of passing out and refused to race on it because blood was rushing out of their heads dew to the high g-forces. Just my 2 cents.

[@EmpyreanLightASMR]

Ok someone needs to build a barrel roll race track. A corkscrew racetrack, I mean, so we can see those cars drive upside down. That's amazing.

[@kwamefelton3621]

Chuck was in form today lol

[@jacquelineayala7532]

Finally I understand why airplanes fly! Please keep doing f1 episodes!

[@joemiller8482]

Just learned alot. . However even though I understand competition.....I wish it was less cars on the track per'race.....

[@ohioref64]

I'm just curious, will someone lead me to math of how the forces are figured into the equation(s)? I may suck at math but seeing those equations help me understand it better

[@TheExplorer90]

Love the physics you talk about. But I do NOT agree with the sentiment that anyone participating in some kind of race involving motorized cars or bikes “should not have to thing about how to drive to BOTH adapt to different turns and overtake other drivers”. I think having to deal with both is a bigger challenge for both the engineers and the drivers and is a testament to their skills!

[@lindalane1166]

Come to Australia to our ultimate race track Mount Panorama in Bathurst. We don't have angled tracks.

[@123Hacksaw]

Look up "superelevation" to see how this is applied to highways.

[@xPhen]

Tokyo drift baby! I watch these for mostly knowledge. Finally gave me laugh! He's now worth 10 buck.

[@michaelg6686]

you gotta talk about the shutters built on the cars to prevent them from flipping.

[@jeffdavis5723]

*Thanks **#Neil_deGrasse_Tyson** for this informative video.* 🇺🇸 👍🏼👍🏼

[@jgbains]

Need to talk about downforce as well

[@Taylor1err]

Chuck really can't help himself sometimes 😂

[@charlesperera9656]

I will meditate on that

[@manandatractor]

This is why the motorcyclists at the county fair can ride the "Death Ball" (or whatever they call it) upside down.

[@TheMerriell]

Chuck is talking about the dynamics of a Nascar crash..I got you Chuck