Why do Fire Engines respond to EMS calls?

[@gmctech]

a lot of thanks for firefighters and paramedics. they're all super heroes for sure!

[@jsldj]

Plus, it gives the firefighters something to do since EMS calls are more numerous than fire calls.

[@american236]

And that’s a waste of money. They should hire less people. Trust me there are many ways to save money and the United States government waste a lot of money.

[@Goober10584]

@@american236 While I don't disagree with the US government does waste a crap ton of money, hiring less firefighters will only worsen the 911 system. Please, do us all a favor and actually research how fire departments operate before saying they should hire less firefighters. I guarantee if it was your house on fire, you'd want 10 trained firefighters there instead of just 2. Yes, medical calls are more frequent than fires. But, when that fire does happen, you want the trained personnel there and ready to go.

[@scottbc31h22]

@@american236 I hope only two fire fighters show up when your house is on fire.

[@rhoonah5849]

@@american236 It isn't a waste of money. When you need additional personnel, they are already there instead of wasting time to call dispatch to send more people. I am sure that if your mother was in cardiac arrest that you'd prefer to have the proper number of personnel arrive on time to save her life and wouldn't count that as a waste of money. If you don't know what you are talking about then keep your opinion to yourself.

[@rhoonah5849]

Having "something to do" has nothing to do with it. First of all, fire fighters respond to a lot more than structure fires. Car accidents, smoke alarms, flooded basements, CO alarms, brush fires, drownings, lift assists, etc. They also go on medicals to make sure there is enough personnel on scene to assist. Sometimes it takes 6 or 8 people to extricate a patient from the 4th floor of a building or to do CPR on a patient.

[@cjeam9199]

In the UK there are Paramedics who respond in cars to some incidents to get there quicker but naturally don't transport patients. You would not have 5 of them attend a simple cardiac arrest. The cars are cheaper than a fire engine naturally. But we don't have the same degree of multi-skilled staff that you do either. Plenty of situations both Ambulance and Fire will attend of course.

[@Brady8480]

cjeam If I was going into cardiac arrest id rather have 5 people show up than 2

[@youcanthandlethetruth4781]

But, the weight of the patients is also, on average, more, requiring more assistance in lifting and maneuvering.

[@MrWhite-pn7ui]

+You Can't Handle The Truth Bullshit. Obesity rates in both countries are roughly the same.

[@SporkPlays212]

cjeam cardiac arrest is NOT simple and is an all hands on deck situstion

[@ffjsb]

cjeam, the UK also has MUCH smaller roads and clearances, not to mention traffic in London, thus the cars. It's not a problem for much of the US as it's easier to get trucks around. And as was said, cardiac arrests are NOT simple.

[@Decoyboy14]

He looks like lazo from GTA

[@BadCaseOfMunchies]

bruh at 0:32

[@jamesbulldogmiller]

Thank you for protecting our lives. Thank you for protecting our property.

[@seancampbell9896]

Twice as many fire trucks as ambulances, wow, in the UK we have way more ambulances, and of course ambulances are faster and easier to manoeuvre

[@cookiedough1355]

This is not a criticism but a desire to understand. If you do everything that the ambulances do, then why the redundancy? What's the point of having the expenses of both?

[@Rangerfan-gz1rx]

Susan Massey several reasons, 1st fire trucks can't transport someone to the hospital, 2nd fire trucks respond to medical calls because they often times are several minutes closer to the scene than an ambulance, 3rd fire trucks respond to deliver man power to the scene to assist the ambulance with lifting the patient, assist with medical care, forcible entry if the door or gate is locked the fire dept has the tools to open them, 4th this is just a bonus reason, the things I've listed before are the main reasons but a fire truck responds with the ambulance for safety reasons, paramedics are assaulted a lot nowadays, especially in bigger cities, the firefighters can assist with the medical care and if necessary they can protect the paramedics until police arrive, there was one incident in Chicago about a year ago where they loaded the patient in an ambulance and the patients high boyfriend attacked the medic in the back of the ambulance and the firefighters had to drag him out of the ambulance and hold him down until a cop arrived on scene. And in some cities the fire department does the ambulance service too, I hope that answers your question. Also a fire truck can block traffic if it's needed.

[@cookiedough1355]

Thanks for the response, and thanks for your excellent and brave service.

[@ffjsb]

Another reason is that on a Trauma or Advanced Life Support run (heart attack, stroke, etc) you need a LOT of hands. Someone for the airway, someone to start the IV and administer drugs, and someone to run the EKG. And you need guys to carry the cot, the bags, a driver for the ambulance, and someone that's recording the info. Ideally a minimum of 5, but 6 or 7 is really nice to have.

[@EnjoyFirefighting]

I'm happy that fire departments over here hardly respond to EMS calls with Engines or Rescue Engines; The ambulance carries its own tools to open locked apartment doors, in case we need help to lift a patient, carry him down from an upper floor, we get another ambulance on scene (probably just a BLS Transport Ambulance, but still with a crew of 2 or 3. For serious situations we get an Emergency Doctor Car with another paramedic and a M.D. on scene, so there are also more than enough hands on scene for e.g. a stroke, heart attack etc. When there are too many on scene for no reason I rather send them out of the room, I had that situation just two weeks ago: I was on a BLS Transport Ambulance with two more guys, a crew partner and a trainee; On scene I saw that I couldn't transport the patient downstairs because of his pain, called for an ALS Emergenyc Ambulance and Emergency Doctor Car right away, btoh of them usually with a crew of 2, but each one of them had a trainee on baord as well. As if that wasn't enough we later on called a Tower Ladder to get him out through the window, and the FD responded with 4 more units than just a Tower Ladder ... et voilà the scene was overcrowded

[@ffjsb]

It is ALWAYS better to have too much help than not enough. And there isn't much that a Doctor can do than a Paramedic can't if it's in their scope of practice. It's not like an MD has an operating room in his bag. Having an MD on scene is a complete waste of resources.

[@coover65]

Many thanks to Henrico Co. .F.D. for the upload. The U.S. certainly manages Emergency Services differently to us in Australia. Our Fire Services and Ambulance Services are state government entities. Fire are responsible for rescue as well (at least in my home state). They attend all except the most minor traffic crashes, and help with extrication, chemical spills, hazard reduction etc. Our ambulance service is not affiliated with Fire and Rescue, nor do we have paramedics riding in Fire Trucks. Thanks to commitment by the government, I think we have about the highest ratio of ambulances to population in the world. The city I live in has a population of 310,000; about the same as Henrico County according to Wikipedia). We have 5 Fire stations and 6 ambulance stations (with anywhere from 7 to 14 ambulance crews depending on time of day). Fire Service gets about 3-5 call outs a shift, ambulance about 8-10 cases per crew per shift. How does that compare to Henrico County? All property owners pay a "Fire Levy", a tax basically that helps fund Fire Services. I guess the biggest difference with US EMS and ours is the training. We don't have EMT levels, all paramedics nowadays have a University degree in Paramedicine (many have a double degree with nursing). Expecting a firefighter to spend three years at university just to be a paramedic is probably asking too much (pay cut etc.) I'm amazed how many US counties still have volunteer FD and EMS services. While we have volunteer firefighters in small towns, all paramedics are full time staff. Earning $85,000+ US as paramedic is not hard here. Is that similar in the U.S.? One thing that I guess knows no boundaries is the comradery and dedication. Whether you're a volunteer firefighter in the U.S., or a paramedic in Sydney or Seattle, you know you're working with a great bunch of like minded people. I reckon people who work in factories or offices don't know what they're missing.

[@znovosad555]

See my volunteer department has an ambulance but a lot of times we don't get a crew out, so the paid ambulance company that does mutual aid takes them sometimes. Theoretically we could roll the rescue truck as well if there's not a full crew for the ambulance but being volunteer were not guaranteed a driver. And it's a heavy rescue. We're working on implementing our service truck to have more uses including being an R-1. Even if we don't take the transport it's still better to get on scene, make a presence and most importantly get to the patients quicker so they receive the best care possible.

[@aviationdenver482]

Kinda funny I was thinking about this question in the car and then it was on my recommended...

[@causeoflava]

Aviation Denver sameeee

[@causeoflava]

One came yesterday to my work and I wondered why a fire truck for one person

[@nickbezdek2847]

I think what everyone is really saying is why do the truck show up at a ems call when it is expensive everytime a truck rolls out on a call it waists a lots of fuel costing cities to raise budgets and cutting salary in half for fire fighters. Plus on the other hand when there is a fire call there is no truck to go because of the ems call took over.

[@aweird1]

Nice video, but I really don't see why EMS in the United States is still seen as a secondary service to fire fighting. Fire-based EMS systems are antiquated systems that hold prehospital healthcare back. It's a massive disservice to the public and the profession. Study after study shows that third city service EMS is the only type of system that can provide the highest quality of care.

[@allegorx58]

I am confused by this comment. Could you elaborate and maybe provide some kind of data to substantiate this position? I am 100% genuinely curious and not meaning to sound argumentative one bit.

[@equine75]

Called 911 for my dad during a heart incident and a cop showed up, then the ambulance, then a DHS truck with a couple of young kids? 7 people total...what the heck?...especially the DHS truck?

[@GP9railfan]

Ancora Imparo ALS backup that's why.

[@losojosdehotspanish2162]

So do you get charged twice for the ambulance and fire truck :(

[@DarkSoldier0238]

How can the oxygen be the same

[@american236]

Waste of money you can use a smaller truck. Because the fire truck shows up and gets things started but then the ambulance shows up and takes the person to the hospital when the ambulance can just show up and do both of what the firetruck in the ambulance would do.

[@tommyflynnable]

this must be so expensive for the county that provides all of this equipment for these trucks

[@Chris-jv7im]

Henrico County has plenty of money coming in, this is the last thing they're thinking about

[@MrWhite-pn7ui]

Yes, god forbid the fire department has additional EMS supplies. That money would be much better spent on welfare handouts.

[@ThatDamnPandaKai]

rather than having to buy an extra ambulance with the same equipment for each station. It's cheaper because they already have fire engines. An ambulance costs around $80,000 PLUS a stretcher.

[@tommyflynnable]

an ambulance where i volunteer actually runs us around $200,000 but i do see your point

[@gchsbus]

I have always actually disagreed with this concept of firefighters in fire trucks responding to EMS Calls. I totally support all certified firefighters to also become an EMT-B. I just don't see the benefit of this. I would rather the jurisdiction hire First Responder level certified people who are placed in strategic locations of the jurisdiction. A library, a strip mall, etc. They have a small fuel efficient car fully equipped with first responder gear and oxygen and emergency lights and sirens. They respond to all EMS calls and could beat the Ambulance because of there is more of them in an area and are paid less money. Then the ambulance gets there and the first responders transfer care. Seems like a much cheaper alternative to paying 5 firefighters and the fuel cost of the fire truck to respond. My scenario would also create jobs while the fire fighter's jobs are still secure.

[@nicpaulson2282]

gchsbus I totally agree it's a waste of tax payers money

[@canoeguy]

gchsbus fire trucks carry all the gear to open just about anything up and if there is a fire, you don't need to wait for the truck to arrive. Tell me when you can fit all the gear on a fire truck into a SUV and have room for atleast 4 people.

[@gchsbus]

JJ Comet Cat, you do know what a first responder is, correct? It is a level under EMT-B that is also by US DOT guidelines. They can do less than an EMT-B but can do simple first aid and administer oxygen. All a first responder would need is a good trauma kit, and AED, general CPR tools, and oxygen. My scenario is not to replace a firefighter in any capacity. My scenario is for trained medical personnel to get to a scene faster than an ambulance or fire truck without the need of firefighters. You only need one person in this scenario, who is a first responder. First responders make much less than Firefighters or EMT-Bs and would be cost effective while still leaving the jobs of firefighters secure and available for fire related calls.

[@plasticdish4411]

What happens when someone cannot come to the door in their house to unlock it? (for instance, if an elderly patient falls and is having a heart attack and cannot open their door for the paramedics? generally the paramedics would have to then wait for the fire department to come for forcible entry which could end up being too late. Fire trucks don't run with ambulances on all calls, obviously, but different counties and cities and ems agencies have pre-plans set up so they know whether or not to include the fire department on the initial dispatch (ex. A certain type of call like a cardiac arrest or sometimes even a hemmorage, an elderly fall victim in their house, or sometimes with frequent calls to the same patient they know what the issue is and automatically include the fire department) please pm me if you wanna talk more about this

[@EnjoyFirefighting]

JJ Comet Cat I don't expect the patient being on fire when I know that he fell down a ladder; We have tools to open locked apartment doors on the Ambulance as well. I learned in an area where even for calls "opening of an apartment" the FD wasn't dispatched along with us, but we handeled it on our own

[@MrWhite-pn7ui]

Why not?

[@AllenPendleton]

Why not just have EMT's and paramedics in the Ambulance. What's the point of the truck also.

[@jonashemmersam4294]

EMTs and paramedics are the people in the ambulance ?

[@shawnmorse5770]

With medical calls, there is always a chance that there may be something else wrong, like a domestic disturbance you go to as a Police Officer, you never know what you're going to get; you could respond to a medical call and end up arriving to a structure fire and it wasn't dispatched because the primary call was for EMS, or you could arrive on scene and find the house full of Carbon Monoxide, most CO monitors are on fire apparatus, and not carried by EMTs or Paramedics unless in a larger city or their department can afford it

[@Coooopur]

Free of charge? Ha!

[@rhoonah5849]

You only get charged for a medical when you are transported to the hospital.

[@alexandersalarms5380]

Also for manpower

[@steveroxxjax]

Still doesn't answer why they both respond at the same time

[@PortersMob]

The point is to get trained medical personnel to you faster, because that ambulance you want might be 20 minuets out because their all nearby units are already on other calls, while the fire departments only 5 minuets away.

[@steveroxxjax]

Read first, comment after. I SAID that doesn't answer why the travel together from the station and arrive together at the scene

[@PortersMob]

You seem to be confused, they do not respond physically together in the same vehicle or convoy style. They respond at the same date and time but from different locations. Ambulance responds with its own EMT/Paramedic crew from wherever they happen to be at, in many places ambulances are owned and operated by independent company's not by the city/county. For example in my area, all ambulances are from one company who has a garage in the center of the county, and at any point in time they have 3-5 ambulances staffed with crew just sitting at different areas of the county waiting for calls. While at the same time the Firefighters themselves(the same people who put out your car/house/garage fire) are also trained as EMT/Paramedics and will respond from the fire station. The point in this redundancy is that the nearest ambulance could be 20 minuets out due to other active calls, while the fire station is only 5 minuets away, or can divert from the call the first ambulance is at once those have that call under control. The only exception is in some city's that run their own ambulances and let their crews stage at their local fire station.

[@steveroxxjax]

Wrong. I see it all the time. They do respond from the same station at the same time. Maybe not where YOU are, but they damn sure do here.

[@PortersMob]

You must live in one of the few areas that has city/county operated ambulances. The basic point of both of them responding is to provide extra hands to help with whatever medical issue is occurring, while at the same time if a fire call does come in, the crew on the truck can respond directly, rather then having to backtrack to the station for different equipment.

[@fernyfloresdrummer3568]

Well if a county geta more medical calls; maybe the county should invest in more ambulances....i mean an emgine and an ambulance in 1 call... No

[@sledgehammer4409]

They send fire trucks to EMS calls in order to increase call volumes and decrease the massive amount of down time that professional firefighters use to enjoy. It is a tactic to expand the relevance of the fire service at the urging of FF unions. With the number of fire calls rapidly decreasing, the fire service does not want to risk obsolescence or be faced with funding and staffing cuts. Many times fire responses are redundant and obtrusive to EMS agencies and are not needed, especially for non ALS assignments.

[@GP9railfan]

sledge hammer Not even close. Whenever our Rescue 1 is out of service, or on another call, we will send our Engine 2 to respond to EMS calls.

[@sledgehammer4409]

That's an exception to the industry standard.

[@cjgardin]

Bullshit, my paid department and the neighboring one ran 1,000 calls each last year with only 10% or less being primarily medical. We only respond to not breathings or to assist EMS if the patient is too large. Most of our calls are indeed fires, MVAs and alarms. Fire calls are not down, EMS calls are just going up with an aging population who is beyond obese and heavily relying on medications. Don't blame the fire service, blame society. You can't take away fire staffing because fires will never go away. And not all places have Union representation

[@RealDonLarson]

The Union/s was the WORST thing to ever happen to firefighting. They sold out to politics, and sold every VFD in the Nation out to NFPA "tree hugger rules".

[@shogged]

fire services have fire prevented themselves out of jobs, that is the only reason they respond to EMS calls. if they didnt have the extra stats from medical calls, their call logs would be so small they would see service cuts and reductions. instead, the fire trucks show up, 6 guys hop out, take a set of vitals, throw on some oxygen and then wait for EMS to show up 60 seconds later and finish the job.

[@sledgehammer4409]

100% correct. The fire service has fought hard to reinvent itself and will continue to worm it's way into the EMS role and any other related function that it can find in order to insure it's independent survival.

[@germandude5181]

Just wrong. First of all: The Fire Department gets dispatched to other alarms than simple fires. MVAs (car accidents), industrial accidents, technical incidents who require attention, broken waterlines in basements etc.. Most fire department calls aren't actually fire related but in technical and rescue matters. The FD takes a vital part in the EMS due to the fact that they can cut down the response time of emergency first responders on a scene. Especially during life or death situations (Myocardial infarction , Asystoles etc.) this help is needed fast. Due to the fact of the abuse of the 911 system (and EMS system) for small calls who require no emergency response the FD has to step in and provide a wide range of medical tasks which include more than taking vitals and "throwing on oxygen". They have the same training as the staff of ambulances and will do the same. Intubation of the patient (if needed), starting i.V.'s and fluid treatment, administering first drugs and medications ranging on the problem and other basic medical treatment on the scene.

[@rhoonah5849]

@@sledgehammer4409 100% garbage.

[@SporkPlays212]

Wow why not take patients to the hospital through engines and let ambulances go to fires

[@ZeroTwo-gd5nq]

Please Stop Because a engine doesn't have the space to carry the patient

[@jonashemmersam4294]

Because last time someone did that they got fired

[@waylon.001waltoshin2]

its a freakin waste of money....not putting fire fighters down but I have alot of friends that are fire fighters and even they know and say the same thing

[@ffjsb]

As a firefighter/paramedic, I can tell you that you're 100% WRONG. You've clearly never worked an arrest or a Trauma.

[@EnjoyFirefighting]

well, I'm a paramedic myself and during my entire first year on the ambulance I never ever had a FD on scene: not on scene of traffic accidents, not for serious trauma calls, not for barriatric patients, not to open locked apartment doors ...

[@ffjsb]

Evidently you never had an extrication on any of your "accidents"... Not having FD on scene with you is kind of a dumb thing to brag about.

[@EnjoyFirefighting]

Why do you say "accidents" - don't you think accidents on roads with NO speed limit are serious? Nevertheless we had them out of the vehicles before the FD arrived, in case they were dispatched at all. Many traffic accidents are covered by EMS and PD only. Sometimes we let the control center dispatch them due fuel leaking out of some vehicles. But in some areas,a t least at some departments, I can't really really on their help ... It's sad but true :/

[@EnjoyFirefighting]

Fox who do you mean?

[@tweaseq]

Firefight wouldn't be bored if it's only fire lets be real there is not a fire everyday every hour that means they would be bored as can be

[@waylon.001waltoshin2]

ive been ding this for 27 years.. i believe i have....just saying

[@nicksincredibleopinion]

Imagine the wasted fuel of every EMS call that gets a full fire truck. Ridiculous. Taxpayer money down the drain!

[@kingnut6855]

Two people are not enough to handle a medical emergency

[@rhoonah5849]

@@kingnut6855 Depends on the emergency.

[@rhoonah5849]

Then please make sure when you call 911 for your mother in cardiac arrest that you demand that the responding EMTs ride bicycles and that all other apparatus stay in quarters to save a few bucks on diesel. Idiot.