Why Formula Vee is Better than FF1600 (for Development)

A quick discussion on the pros of Formula Vee for beginning iRacers!
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[@michaelkiewiet1022]

I love the Vee's exactly for the same reasons you bring up. In a few races in the Vee I had so many good and close battles, I really enjoy it a lot. Despite not being a rookie anymore, I still often pick a race in the Vee for the nice experience...

[@RedHeadRacing45]

Yes usually great racing and the draft is so insane so you can’t run away like you can in 1600. I’m B class. I still race it 😂

[@somethingcellular1981]

I started in iRacing just this weekend past and had the complete opposite experience. Four awesome races in FF1600 and two Vee nightmares. Summit Point too, just like in the video.

[@RenanBecker]

me too

[@RedHeadRacing45]

Interesting I’ve noticed recently the Vee crowd has been aggressssssiveeeee. Last few races have been the same in Vee vs 1600. Both can be terrible but 1600 I feel is easier to run away. Vee you can go 3-4 wide😂 different type of intense when the racing is good

[@cAtzcs]

Dude I agree, I got my first wheel and iracing around 2 weeks ago and found the FF1600 so hard to drive, it would slip and slide around really easily. I decided to race the Vee and Mazda and it's like you said in the video - after a lap heating up the tires, the vee was easy to control and drive so I could focus more on a proper racing line, nailing trail braking, rotation and exit. I raced a few hours per day for a few days and learned a ton, after that I went to do some Mazda again and significantly improved my best times just by learning from the Vee. The Mazda was a different story on rudskogen though, when I kinda learned the track (+3s off the top pace yikes) I would always skip qualifying and start 9-10th, just kept it smooth and would almost always finish top 3 since everyone tries to go fast on that track and spins out on lap 1 lol..

[@sampic_]

Personally to me the formula ford is easier. I do tend to prefer faster and twitchier cars

[@miatafunrun3078]

You make some valid points. I get the lower power momentum car for development. IRL I went from Porsche Boxster-S to a 2012 MX-5 and now a 2017 MX-5 track car. Best thing I did for my development and such fun handling cars. I am 2 weeks into SIM/iRacing with the advantage being I know driving fundamentals. Been driving the MX-5 Cup Car as that was a natural choice. Practiced on the Vee and FF1600 for a few hours because I am deciding what Formula Car to start with. I suspect it will be the FF1600 since that is more similar to the MX-5 Cup Car than the Vee and if I am going to run two series in a season I think the transfer between cars will be easier. Well, at least that is my thinking right now. Your point about safety in Vee is a great one to think about though!

[@RedHeadRacing45]

My question to you, how does the MX5 feel handling wise? As you’ve driven them irl. And is your real life experience, feel and skill translating so far to iRacing? Very curious

[@miatafunrun3078]

@@RedHeadRacing45 My 2017 ND is more twitchy than most cars due to the small wheelbase. But nowhere like in iRacing. But the gearing and speed on tracks I have driven like Laguna Seca are quite similar. Real life experience definitely translates. All the fundamentals - looking ahead, using the entire width of the track including kerbs, threshold braking, trail braking, car control are all there. The hardest thing still is judging the corner entry speed because in SIM, you lose the feeling of speed. It is coming along though, just more practice... If I knew SIM racing was this good, I would have got into it earlier. It certainly scratches the itch between track days and I can drive different cars and tracks which I would not be able to afford in real life.

[@chrisjvales2]

Kerfuffle!

[@johnelectric933]

VW of that era had a swing axle rear which means you affect the rear camber with your pedals.

[@Jack96993]

Yes best way to learn is in a momentum track car My first track car was a 1987 944S Porsche Not much power but great suspension and brakes I wish rookies would just back off a bit and learn the track and racing line And remember smooth is fast I can't tell how many times I've been hit from behind I'm not the fastest, but my laps are consistent and if another person is faster that me I let them past in a safe section of the track

[@RedHeadRacing45]

That’s the best way to do it!! Smooth is fast took me a while to understand. But for my driving style it’s the only way to get the job done

[@henriquesimoes4959]

i just found f1600 so hard for some reason, basically undrivable for me, and im at c class rn

[@RedHeadRacing45]

I hear you! Same for me at first with the braking. I think for 70% of the short rookie races the tires feel like they’re on ice. Usually after lap 5-7 they come in tho and it can be fun. Just so easy to have an incident and crash out. I’d recommend Super Formula Lights. Good participation and still low powered enough to keep under control. Solid racing too.

[@Luis-fh8cv]

Ngl if you struggle with the FF, you need to not go any further, I.e. avoid F4 or SFL, you’re not ready. The FF is not only easier, it’s also heaps of fun. And the FF is a necessary step. On the Vee because of how oversteery it is off-throttle you spend little time under braking and in many tracks you end up just lifting instead of braking. And that is going to create a MASSIVE gap in your skillset. Braking is by far the most important skill you’ll need to be fast. The FF will teach you how to handle your braking and trail braking much better than the Vee ever could. Don’t get me wrong I love the Vee and still race it at times. I started out with the Vee and won my first race in it, and at first I would struggle with the FF too. Now the FF is my go to car to learn a track. I think the progression for beginners from Vee to FF is as perfect as it could ever be. You can learn how to find the racing line, tons of racecraft and throttle management with the Vee. Then you hop on the FF to learn how to set up your references better and improve your ability under braking without fostering bad habits. I think one of the biggest mistakes beginners make (and I made myself) is going on to quicker cars too early. I jumped on the SFL way too early and even though I loved the car (and still do) the fact of the matter is that you end up with bad trail braking habits in a much quicker car where it becomes a lot harder to fix them because you have much less time to think. Some corners in the FF can take you 1-2 seconds where in the SFL may only take 0.5s. So now you have a little bit over a blink of an eye to try and figure out if you’re extracting as much rotation as possible, and to try and figure out if you’re under the limit and by how much and to try and figure out what braking pressure you used, where, when did you start trailing, when did you start turning in, did you turn in too aggressively or the opposite, etc. My biggest frustration in the SFL was practicing for hours to still be 2s of the pace in top split and not understanding why. I only ever did once I went back to the FF and could be more conscious about my inputs. If you can be truly fast in the FF (eg winning a top split in which Sam Devantier is not participating) you’ll be fast in most cars . If you can beat Sam then… damn what are you doing watching this video?