Why I Don't Care About Cents Per Point (and Why You Shouldn't Either)

[@gottabe884]

I haven't seen anyone talk about CPP this way and it is very refreshing to hear this point of view.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Thanks! I hope that it helps normalize these types of redemptions since all we typically see are the aspirational first/business class outsized redemptions! We all should try to get the best value we can, but there are other factors that can be more important.

[@IonicTechYT]

This is me 99% of the time. Especially when I travel with my kid. A lot of times it’s a choice between spending 2x worth in points to get a high CPP or stick to moderate to average CPP and get a decent property and not burn all your points. High CPP is only valuable when making YT videos documenting everything, making everyone else jealous, if that’s your jam. 😅

[@TheCreditFrog]

Yeah, I think I wanted to point out in this video that it's ok to make a so-so redemption depending on your use-case. I think there are a lot of videos out there that document outsized redemptions - which is great by the way since it puts things into perspective - but not everyone is going to want to do that. I'd love to go to the Maldives twice a month, but I can't.

[@IonicTechYT]

@@TheCreditFrog lol. Well-said. I think for majority of the people watching credit card videos in YT, the goal is still to save $ and “travel hack”, not blow thousand dollars worth of points in one trip.

[@jpknowledge8852]

It can be annoying when the award availability or prices don't work out in our favor, but even the best people in the points and miles world redeem points the way you did to not have to pay the high price out of pocket. And this is a True Saving of $1,000! When it is a trip that you would pay out of pocket if need be it becomes what I consider True Savings. The convenience factor is also very important. The hotel property example was great.

[@TheCreditFrog]

That's for sure JP! Spontaneous trips are harder because we can't optimize for those really great redemptions with high CPPs, but you definitely have to make do with what you have in those situations. It definitely feels great to save that much money - even if the CPP wasn't as "high" as it should have been. Appreciate your perspective bro - and thanks for helping us navigate the complexities of redemptions!

[@elliottnixon-wq6sp]

Thinking about this literally this morning. If you can’t redeem, what’s the point (no pun intended). That said, devalues are real. So figuring out how to earn tons of points without breaking the bank is the new challenge for credit card KZbin

[@TheCreditFrog]

For sure Elliott! Gotta earn and burn if you can since devaluations are real, like you mentioned! Redemptions will keep getting tighter and tighter so we got to redeem early and often.

[@paulstein916]

Stan, completely agree that maximizing CPP is not everything. Convenience is important too. I prefer nonstop flights and flights that get me to my destination around the desired arrival time. I once stayed at the Hyatt in Bethesda which is over the Metro station. I was there for a business meeting and extended my stay to do sightseeing. I walked out the front door and the escalator down to the Metro was right there. I was able to take the Metro to/from DCA too. I hope you are not going in summer because the heat/humidity is brutal in DC.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Yeah, nonstop flights are my preferred way too, if I can help it. I'd much rather just do one leg than multiple legs where I may miss my flight/lose luggage, etc. That sounds like a great Hyatt to stay at - it's super nice when the hotel is close to public transit - especially those east-coast cities where it actually works well, hah! Nah, this trip was recently before summer - you're totally right though - DC is super humid then!

[@drchrisheidelberg]

​@@TheCreditFrogI used to love using that 🏨 in Bethesda

[@Nanchara_Kanchara]

You touched on this, but the biggest issue with CPP is that it implicitly assumes you’d actually pay the cash price or that all cash prices are created equal. If a first class flight ticket costs $10k cash you might be getting great CPP but if you could book economy for $500 would you really pay 20x as much if point currencies didn’t exist? And if they decided to raise the cash price you were never going to pay in the first place from $10k to $20k, did you really get twice as much value as before? The only way that really makes sense for an apples to apples comparison is to think about what you’d actually pay in cash for a given redemption (not the cash price it’s listed for). Then you can decide if you’re getting good enough value and move on with your life.

[@TheCreditFrog]

I think that's another point that I for sure should have touched on more (it would have probably come up if I did an international redemption) so thanks for bringing it up! I think a lot of us will agree that we would never actually pay $10k or $20k for a flight so in those situations, getting a high CPP is probably going to happen, but the specific value is probably irrelevant after like 2-5cpp. Ultra-maximizers would disagree, but the point is your getting a general "outsized value" on something you never would have paid for in the first place. In this example, I definitely would have paid cash for it if I didn't have points, so by using points, it was true value. So like you said, two different situations, but my view on both is similar: make the redemption you want to do, to better your own life, in whatever form that may be!

[@PingPingTravel]

Very true. I agree. Most people would never pay such prices, especially people making YT videos. It is just a virtual flex.

[@todddavis9426]

Great video! The first time I redeemed Chase UR points was so that my wife and I could have a free round trip to Hawaii from the Midwest. We planned our trip near her birthday in February. She HATES flying through Denver or Chicago (especially in the winter). I wound up just buying our tickets through the Chase travel portal for 1.5 CCP. We flew Where we wanted, when we wanted, and my wife was happy because we flew through AZ. I was happy with my redemption. If I had done some great transfer point redemption, but we had to fly at a different time or go through an airport my wife hates, that would have been a terrible redemption from a personal perspective. There’s more to point redemption than just CPP, agree 100%!

[@TheCreditFrog]

That's so awesome that you were able to make the redemption you wanted and were able to travel on your terms! That really should be the goal of points is to use them and redeem them for what you want to do. Also, 1.5cpp is a pretty nice redemption for a domestic trip! Glad you were able to do that and make great memories with your wife for her birthday! Thanks for sharing your experience and mindset. I'm with you all the way!

[@harryshinrx]

Such a reasonable take on CPP. Thank you for your personal examples and sharing your logical thoughts as always.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Of course Harry! I think it's important to keep things realistic. We all want aspirational travel, but using points for typical trips can be ok too!

[@JacobsPointsAndProfit]

It's important to remember that if we want to have specific experiences, we should be willing to take a lower cents per point to make it happen. I often find a lot of Marriott redemptions to be extremely low around 0.4-0.6 CPP so 0.67 isn't that bad in my opinion for someone in your position with status

[@TheCreditFrog]

Definitely Jacob! Yeah, that's been my experience as well. I try to aim for 1cpp if I can, but sometimes, there are Marriotts that can be redeemed for 1.5cpp, of course, if you use the 5th night free benefit! Titanium Elite does make the stay better. I appreciate it!

[@Ljberkow]

Great video Stan. Clearly one of your best. People with hard and fast rules on using points miss the forest for the trees. You can’t let points and points Ivalue control your behavior. 5,000 points in the grand scheme of things is $50 and not a big deal. Choose your ideal location, dates of travel, and time and then see what makes sense. The $50 you didn’t save is time and convenience you did save.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Thanks so much Len! Yeah, it's really important to see the forest through the trees like you said! It's so important to take that trip using points and not focus too much on the cents per points redemption. While I do think understanding what a truly bad redemption is, and to avoid those, taking the trip with points, as long as the redemption is reasonable will certainly save you time, which is a currency that isn't talked about enough!

[@BY-ib9ew]

Appreciate you keeping it real in your videos. A lot of KZbinrs just like to quote the math behind optimal redemptions but the math doesn’t always work out in reality. In fact it rarely does

[@TheCreditFrog]

Of course B Y! I like to keep it real. Points should be used for the trip you want to take! The redemption value is still important, but secondary IMO.

[@JuanGarcia-hr1wf]

Great video Stan. Redemptions for life experiences much more important than CPP

[@TheCreditFrog]

Thanks Juan! The experience is what makes the redemption great - I agree!

[@krajacic21]

Great video and a refreshing take among other YT videos. The time it takes to maximize every CPP just to end up somewhere you don't even want to go isn't worth it.

[@TheCreditFrog]

I totally agree. I love getting deal just like everyone else, but sometimes getting those flashy redemptions take a lot of time to get it, and for big international trips, it’s worth it, but some other regular trips, it’s nice to just to prioritize the experience!

[@WealthOfOpportunity]

Hands down one of my favorite videos I’ve seen in this space. Sharing your approach and how YOU value them is what makes your redemptions unique to you. Combinations of status has a $ amount one could attribute to it as well. Thanks Stan!

[@TheCreditFrog]

Thanks so much Ninja! I wanted to tell you that I recently used a Hilton FNC to book the Oceana in Santa Monica on a holiday weekend valued at $1,500 that night! Such an amazing property, and can't wait to get back there (for free + breakfast credit for two from Hilton Gold 🤩)

[@krs1905]

What about transferring Marriott points to United? Isn’t Amex running a transfer bonus on Marriott?

[@TheCreditFrog]

I generally don't even look at Marriott to United because the rates are so terrible, but a great idea if I had excess and an abundance of Bonvoy points - but not enough to justify a 3-to-1 transfer ratio!!

[@MattWelterOfficial]

Completely agree with you in that YOU should control how you utilize your Points/Miles and not fall into the Cent/Point trap. For me, Latin America redemptions are typically going to get less of a Cent/Point than trips to Europe or Asia just due to less of a $ cost, and less availability for great First/Business Class flight opportunities, but it is still very worth it to use Points since I would have gone on those trips & used cash anyway! Totally fair that you valued that convenience of being able to book a spontaneous trip on the airline you wanted vs just getting the highest cent/point! Still saving over $1,000 for a trip that you really wanted to go is still the #1 thing like you said! Great video Stan!

[@TheCreditFrog]

Thanks Matt! Yeah, it's hard when the actual cost is lower because then the CPP is going to just calculate lower, like you mentioned, but as someone on Team Travel, I know you want to go as many places as you can. You've definitely made it clear that you want to travel on a budget to stretch those points out as far as possible - and that's definitely a great way to do it! Ultimately, it's about using those points, so you don't have to spend money on travel. Looking forward to seeing what kind of redemptions you come up with in the future!

[@krs1905]

It just feels so much better when you have a great trip and you didn’t need to spend cash to fly or stay there. Any chance that you’d get a CIP in the near future? The SUB on that would have paid for your trip.

[@krs1905]

Unfortunately some people get very defensive with this CPP thing. It’s the last thing on my mind when I’m traveling. I want to go where I want to go and I want to enjoy myself; the CPP is meaningless to me. Stan, I got the SavorOne card via a product change yesterday!!!!

[@TheCreditFrog]

I agree Keith! Just saving on the expenses was awesome enough! I hope to get the CIP in the near future. Would have been nice to have access to my Chase UR points for transfers (or even have the CSR for this use-case).

[@TheCreditFrog]

Yes, I know! Everyone's a little different, but I'm like you! When I'm there, I don't even think about CPP. I just think how I got there using points and miles and the redemption was worth it because I redeemed it for the factors that were important to me! Congrats on the Savor One!! Such a powerful card. Now you have a solid international grocery card.

[@krs1905]

@@TheCreditFrog one more nail the coffin for my Amex Gold Card; I’m looking forward to pairing the S1 with my Bilt Card for groceries.

[@TheCreditFrog]

@@krs1905 Oh dang, that Gold card is done for 🤣

[@thejokerspeaks]

This makes sense, especially for those who earn about what they need for travel. Absolutely don't alter your travel for cpp! I would say that if you only earn enough for 1 trip, but vacation 3 times per year, then you should be maxing the most useful redemptions. The person that earns 3 vacation worth of points, but only takes 1 trip a year, should alwsys pay with points, and could use some cash back credit cards. Based on my spending with BILT and Alaska, I already see that I am going to need to be far more liberal with redemption than I originally thought.

[@TheCreditFrog]

For sure! I'm glad Alaska is working out well for you (and you'll be able to get that 3X on rent soon). I completely agree with those situations. If it's just one trip, then certainly maximize CPP for that trip to get the most value out of it, but if you have points laying around and not being used - just use it and try to get the best redemption that you can! Sounds like you have a lot of Alaska points to use - a great problem to have!

[@thejokerspeaks]

@@TheCreditFrog Absolutely, I'll be redeeming for Hyatt and Alaska directly, not just international business class. I've learned my lesson in over earning and being too greedy with CPP with Wyndham Rewards. One day I noticed that all the mid-tier hotels had doubled from 15K points to 30K, most timeshare resorts were unavailable, as we no longer cared for the brand. I'm now halfway through transferring $2K in points into Ceasars Rewards for Las Vegas dining. Splurgy waste, where that 0.8 CPP redemption that I skipped in the past, doesn't sound so bad now!

[@grogu_2003]

Since you've been in the credit card game for long, I have a concern/question. I got a question about Capital One. They closed my account while I had an ongoing balance I was going to pay in summer (after internship cuz I dont have a job), and because payments I was doing weren't going through, and with rent, the card ended up going slightly above the limit. Will this affect my chances of getting credit cards with other issuers if my score barely stays affected (after I pay the balance of the closed account in full)?

[@TheCreditFrog]

It depends if you had a late payment on your credit report. If you did, then yes, it will affect your ability to get cards with other issuers, but as long as you keep making the minimum payments on your closed account until it's paid off in pull, you should have no problem. The highest factor in your credit score is your payment history. Going above the limit affects utilization, but once it's paid off, it shouldn't affect your score anymore.

[@grogu_2003]

@@TheCreditFrog nope, I have never had any late payment neither on my Discover It and the SavorOne that got closed. And wouldn't it appear that my account got closed for × behavior on my credit report, or should I not worry about that too much regarding chances of getting approved for credit cards?

[@TheCreditFrog]

@grogu_2003 I wouldn’t worry about that, it shouldn’t affect your applications for other issuers but as with anything YMMV!

[@grogu_2003]

@@TheCreditFrog thank you so much for the help!

[@grogu_2003]

@@TheCreditFrog I just got a letter that says that it got closed for not following their agreements (called fraud letter) (which means that it got closed because of the payments that were returned I assume), should I still not worry about my chances with other credit card issuers?

[@theinternationalist1357]

How do you calculate cpp?

[@TheCreditFrog]

Like I explained in the video, it's the cost of your airline/hotel divided by the points/miles you used, multiplied by 100. With airlines, you can subtract the taxes and fees from the numerator since that's what you were going to pay anyways.

[@DugrozReports]

Here's where something like the Altitude Reserve or Aeroplan card with PYB shines. One of those can be the fallback option if you can't get at least ~ 1.5 cpp with transfer partners! Same with CSR and the Chase portal (with all the "portal" disclaimers)

[@TheCreditFrog]

Yes, the USBAR would have been the best way to go here is what I'm realizing. The thing is I never really would earn enough points to make that redemption since I use the USBAR as a true "earn and burn" card and activate any 1.5X RTR redemption so as I earn points they get redeemed just as fast! This experience made me wish I had a CSR, though TBH, I don't think I need yet another $500+ AF card, haha!

[@rmknicks]

When it comes to flights, I book what works best for me then do the CPP calculation. I just came back from Belgium where I used a combo of UR points and C1 miles. After the booking was done I calculated my biz class seats from JFK to BRU was 4.55 CPP. I look at this as a bonus.

[@TheCreditFrog]

That's an awesome redemption! It's great when the redemption works out that way! Personally, I would have too much curiosity not to check when booking travel! Congrats on the great value and hope you had a great trip!

[@AnthonyVenture]

This is my favorite video on this topic Stan, you articulated it perfectly and really, it’s exactly my feelings on the topic as well. Everyone knows we want a floor, not lighting money on fire, but convenience + time is something you have taught me and others, to be a valuable currency as well. It was an amazing trip and I think a great redemption at that!! Thank you Stan!

[@TheCreditFrog]

Of course, Tony! Yeah, everyone is going to have a different take on this, but it's important to have a balance between CPP value and the way you want to travel! Having a baseline CPP to start out with helps with putting things into perspective, but after that the important factors are up to you. It was a great trip indeed!

[@AnthonyFinAtlanta]

Do you come up with your Cents Per Point value based on the cash price when you book or when you take your flight or hotel stay? If the cash price on the day of travel is higher than when you booked it, does that mean you got a higher CPP? Also do you monitor the cash price after booking and will you change your plans based on the updated CPP value? Sorry for the long question!

[@TheCreditFrog]

I come up with the CPP value at the time of booking. Most prices will increase as you get closer to the date of departure/stay, but so does the number of points/miles needed for a redemption. Not sure if the CPP increases linearly with time, but that would be an interesting experiment! I personally don't monitor cash prices and adjust booking depending on the CPP, BUT I will say that I do this a LOT with Southwest flights specifically, which I primarily buy with cash. I typically purchase the SW flight usually as far out in advance as possible, and the constantly check for sales and then change my flights accordingly to get SW flight credit back to use on future flights!

[@densnow4816]

IAD instead of DCA cost you a lot of $. Taxi is super expensive while DCA to your hotel merely a metro ticket.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Yeah, that Uber trip frome DC to IAD was expensive, but luckily, USBAR covered it since I had points for that! Luckily going to DC, I had a friend drive me so that was free. I wish I could have flown into DCA, but it didn't work out with my travel plans.

[@densnow4816]

@@TheCreditFrog Good explanation. The only time I fly into IAD is if friend drives or company pays. Taking Metro to DCA is one of the greatest conveniences to living in DC.

[@SolidLiquidFox]

Good move using United miles over Alaska. I recently made a similar choice when booking Aer Lingus.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Thanks! Yeah, it's a harder decision, but the Premier Silver allowed me to get a checked bag each way, and I can upgrade my seats to Economy Plus at check-in which will be another couple hundred dollars in value too! Airline status is pretty nice if you have access to it!

[@SolidLiquidFox]

@@TheCreditFrog yes it is!

[@jwil4286]

Minor nitpick: there's actually a third airport for the DC area: Baltimore/Washington International

[@TheCreditFrog]

That's true! Although for my purposes, I wasn't planning on BWI, but it could definitely still count!

[@CalbyNg]

I think too, we forget that the cash price can be inflated for seemingly no reason. So yes the CPP looks greater but is it really worth it? Eh. Thanks for coming out to meet with us Stan! Had a great time with you in DC!! Also you should have told the Grand Hyatt it was your anniversary instant upgrade, haha

[@TheCreditFrog]

Yeah, that's kind of what I see with Hyatts. Their prices just tend to be higher than an equivalent Marriott, but of course, the points needed to make a redemption are also much lower than what's needed with Marriott so it ends up being in Marriott's favor. It was great to see you Calby!

[@ctrushfan8575]

Well said, Stan. I'm with you on this.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Awesome! Glad that we're on the same page 😀

[@alyssabenshoff1012]

This is how I roll most of the time... always juggling school and work schedules and I just usually want the flight that I want, and the hotel I want and don't want to have to pay for it. Appreciated the thoughts!

[@TheCreditFrog]

Of course! Thanks for your data point Alyssa! I think we all want to get the best deal we can get, but time is also a precious resource like you said so as long as you get the redemption you want - you win!

[@OperationNonsense]

DC is fun. lots of museums and monuments, also tons of great bars and restaurants. always a good time, just avoid going there in the hot humid summer months and you'll be ok.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Definitely! It’s one of my favorite cities to visit! It’s definitely hot in the summer time so won’t be going there during that time, hah!

[@donaldrobertson5747]

Can understand the flight redemption, really no "great option" so take the one where you have some benefits. The hotel though, the Westin is a demonstrably better hotel (not just more expensive) and cheaper redemption, to avoid a two block walk to Gallery Place/Chinatown and 2 extra stops on metro. In dead of winter, maybe could justify it, but not late spring. And yes Grand Hyatt would have been "best" but agree your status is likely worth the difference. Would have taken Westin in this instance.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Yeah, I tend to stay at a lot of Westins because they actually generate some good CPP redemptions, and their hotels are all pretty comfortable. I can see where you're coming from. But this hotel was one that made sense for me for this particular trip. I guess that means I have to come back again at some point to see what that Westin is all about 🤣

[@zyzzuschrist3410]

Always look forward to noon on Mondays for your uploads 🤪

[@TheCreditFrog]

Appreciate that bro! Hope you enjoyed this one!

[@jimmyjames6492]

Great way to look at redeeming points & miles! Thanks for the info + video!

[@TheCreditFrog]

Of course, Jimmy James!

[@mlodyme3675]

Good video and agree with some of the points you made, but the thing is, nothing is free. Those points, still have $ value assigned to them at the base rate. 30,000 chase points is still at min worth $300 for statement redemption. I feel that paying with US BAR and getting 4.5% RTR would have netted you a better savings, but then I would have probably done someting similar if I had an excess of points to burn thru.

[@TheCreditFrog]

I agree with you actually - having the USBAR, I could have just paid for the flight out of pocket and then get 4.5X RTR redemption in the future. My experience is what you described though - I have a lot of points and nowhere to use them - and in this circumstance, using the points was acceptable to me since points sitting in an account doing nothing have no value at all.

[@_iErik]

I appreciate the honesty here that CPP doesn’t really matter. It should also be pointed out that most content creators calculate CPP very… optimistically. TPG valuations are based on incentivizing you to sign up for cards that pay affiliate revenue to TPG. I don’t trust them as far as I can throw them, which is not far at all since they lack physical form. I do wish that you had specifically talked about spending $300 in points plus $11.20 in cash for taxes and fees on the booking, rather than talking about booking for “only” $11.20. Credit Card points, as a rebate on your spend, represent a real monetary value and come at a real monetary cost.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Of course! Yeah, CPPs are definitely more subjective than we think, especially since prices fluctuate so much with airline and hotel bookings. TPG has their own methodology for determining CPP, but it's definitely far from being objective. Still - it's a good baseline to work from. I agree that points have inherent value, just like cash, but I think one point I was trying to emphasize that with point redemptions (just like cash), everyone is going to value the raw value differently when adding in other things like time, convenience, and location (with hotel redemptions). So yes, there is a cost, but like you discussed, it's more subjective depending on the individual!

[@pastalu5254]

Totally agree. I am also a big fan of convenience.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Very cool!

[@wilfredpapaya4739]

Hope to see more of these spontaneous trips with not so crazy CPP redemption. Your time is valuable at the end of the day.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Thanks! Yeah, spontaneous trips are fun, and I'd rather go on trips and experience fun things then spend lots of time trying to get a crazy CPP and/or doing a bunch of connecting flights to make the CPP higher or something.

[@gainesville323]

Great video Stan! I agree that CPP isn’t the end all be all, especially in your case since you have elite statuses that you factor in, but I think CPP comes into play when you want to make multiple award trips throughout the year. Personally it’s less about getting outsized value on an intentional long-haul flight and more about seeing how many travel bookings I can make while not burning through all my points.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Of course Tariq! Yeah, if you're goal is non-luxury stays and focusing on the number of nights you can fit in with your points - definitely important to get the most CPP you can possible out of those redemptions. Also seeing if you can get that 4th night free with IHG or 5th night with Marriott/Hilton will help out with that. Wish Hyatt had something like that, but their CPPs are already pretty good!

[@qcman2000]

I think the key point you made is that you didn’t have a bunch of travel lined up after this. I could see just paying cash for this trip & saving the points for a better redemption if you had lots of future travel lined up, but if you only travel a few times a year, I don’t think you should obsess over CPP when booking your itinerary. The money saved is the real value. Great info as always 👍🏽.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Exactly QCman! If I had other travel, maybe it would be worth it to save for that too, but yeah, I for sure could have just paid cash, (but ouch $1,000), but if that was to save a lot more on another international trip or something, then I could see myself doing that. Obsessing over CPP is silly IMO, just get the best redemption you can and go enjoy it!

[@beaunoonan510]

Great callout on the CPP valuations being somewhat overhyped. I’m with you - convenience, quality and status are just as important. Great vid!

[@TheCreditFrog]

Of course! Yea, it’s going to depend on the person, but I value convenience very highly, usually over CPP for most redemptions!

[@YanLuo]

My family constantly need flights to china and economy award is reasonable easy to score by so I personally won’t redeem my points at less than 2cpp. That said, why not use your USB points at 1.5 cpp on those flights?

[@TheCreditFrog]

That's awesome you can score at least 2cpp back on your redemptions! I wish I did more international travel to get that type of value consistently! I wish I could have used my USBAR for this trip, but I didn't have enough points to make the redemption. My USBAR really isn't for that purpose though - every time I get a 1.5X RTR (generally it's for Uber/taxi or some kind of small travel/transit purchase), I redeem it right away so my USBAR points are being earned and used constantly - a true earn and burn paradigm!

[@lesleyegbert4807]

Thanks for breaking down each of your decision points for this trip. I'm fairly new to this community, but so far as I can tell, there are some rather strident maximizers around who could use this video as a readme to understand the rest of us. Cheers

[@TheCreditFrog]

Of course Lesley! Yes, there are certainly those who are much more into ultra-maximizing, but some of us (like me) value different factors depending on the trip. Maximizing the redemption value is important for sure, but it’s important not to lose sight of the forest through the trees, and figuring out what is really the most important to you.

[@DYoon007]

Thank you. This was refreshing to hear.

[@TheCreditFrog]

You're welcome! Glad you enjoyed it!

[@DYoon007]

@TheCreditFrog I also have the CSR and recently received the CFU and just got approved for Bilt. I think that could be a good combinations thoughts?

[@TheCreditFrog]

@@DYoon007 Definitely a great trio you got there! The only major category that's missing is the grocery category so if you spend money on that, I recommend getting a card for that category. Otherwise Bilt and Chase are a good combo since they have similar transfer partners, namely Hyatt, which is one that can get you a lot of value!

[@thomaswu2373]

Hi Stan, love your videos. I feel like especially for the Marriott property being less than 1 cent per point, it would be better to just cash out your points and book with cash. This way you not only get better value with your points at 1 cent per point but you also earn extra bonvoy points from the booking

[@TheCreditFrog]

Thanks for the advice, Thomas! To get the best value, you're totally right. Especially, if I could book a stay with that 5th night free. Right now, I'm at the point where I had a lot of Bonvoy points (recently made a 500k redemption so I had like 250k-ish points left over). The problem is that if I continue to follow that methodology, I'd continue to get points (at a great value as you said), but I'll never use those points up. I'm trying to earn and burn so it's definitely a balance! But if I only had 100k points just for this redemption only, I'd probably book with cash like you recommended to grow that bank to make a better redemption!

[@kaina732]

I use my Chase points for Southwest flights as I qualified for the Companion Pass. So for the next two years I am trying to earn as many Chase points as I can for Southwest flights.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Very nice Kaina! I'm hoping to get the Companion Pass in 2025 as well, and might be adopting a similar strategy!

[@kaina732]

@@TheCreditFrog I have the Chase Freedom Unlimited and Chase Ink Business Cash to earn Chase points.

[@Bush_Goremen]

Maybe it depends? If you have points in United or Marriott then I guess this video is valid. Their points are less flexible, so it would be best to spend it before the airline or hotel chain devalues it. However, if you have points in Chase or MX, then there is an argument to be made for holding these points and paying the trip via cash. Since MX and Chase points are so flexible and hold their values better, burning these points on low CPP options seems like a waste.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Yeah, it definitely depends! With these flexible point currencies, it's important to not get a "bad" redemption like a cash back at 0.6cpp with Amex MRs, for example, but I think it's also true that if you want to take a trip using points, and it's not the absolute highest CPP, I would still say go for it! That's just my take anyways.

[@tower07]

Personally, I’ll pay cash instead of points cuz I’ll got a lot more value. Domestic I’ll redeem at least 2cpp if not I’ll pay cash and redeem for international business. The money I save for domestic won’t be enough for booking intl business

[@TheCreditFrog]

I think from a mathematical standpoint, that's definitely the way to go! I find it hard to find a 2cpp domestic redemption, unless you're talking about Hyatt so 1cpp is usually what I'm looking for. If you find that you have surplus of points though without any plans to make an international business trip, using the points on a redemption is better than not using them at all!

[@JKPham23]

Great video and perspective, CPP is more of what i lean towards but thats because my trips are more aspirational and don't occur often

[@TheCreditFrog]

Oh yeah, then for sure you should maximize your CPP, if it's for one aspirational trip! I think it'll be interesting to see what would happen if you had the option of a 10cpp redemption vs. a 20cpp redemption, but the 20cpp redemption was much more "inconvenient," which one would you go for? It's hard to tell without details, but fun food for thought! Appreciate it!

[@JKPham23]

@@TheCreditFrog Initially i'd be stoked about the 20CPP find but after logic enters the chat I would value convenience, distance more and likely elect the 10CPP route. End of the day be honest with your goals and just remember to take the trip you want no matter what a spreadsheet or social media says

[@boy_named_niel]

ATM I am prioritizing quantity of nights and flights > quality . That’s because of my travel habits, but if i was only traveling once a year, yes I would value CPP

[@TheCreditFrog]

Nice! Yeah in that case, CPP is still pretty important to stretch those points as far as they can go, but it also depends on what you value most!

[@PackSox]

This was a really great video to think about CCP in a more holistic way.

[@TheCreditFrog]

I appreciate that RJ! I think you meant to say CPP though 🤣

[@Foriegn684]

Alot of the high CPP offers are on overpriced flights so its kind of fools gold sometimes

[@TheCreditFrog]

Yeah, I can definitely see that. It really would inflate the CPP depending on the day.

[@MontyTheCardNerd]

Awesome redemptions Stan! I agree that things like having status or a more convenient location justify taking a cpp haircut. Hope you also got/get that complimentary upgrade with your United status.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Thanks Monty! Yeah, there's a lot of moving parts when it comes to redemptions so CPP is not going to be everything (at least for me). And yes! United Premier Silver lets you upgrade your seat 24 hours before your flight when you check-in online and so I was able to move from Economy to Economy Plus on both legs of my flights, which was already a couple hundred of dollars in savings!

[@docsays]

Excellent points about points Stan! I agree with you, as you stated in a prior video, credit cards should make our lives easier not more complex or guided by a certain cpp! Now, having said that, i just did my first points transfer and got a $250 room at a hyatt hotel for on 9000 URs, which is a bout a 2.8 cpp!!!! 😁

[@TheCreditFrog]

Thanks Doc! For sure, we need to use points the way we want them too (as long as the redemption is reasonable that is). That's an amazing redemption, way to go! Hyatt always has those nice sweet spots! I'm sure this first transfer won't be your last!

[@docsays]

@@TheCreditFrog - thank you sir ! Appreciate it.

[@nubianpwr]

The intrinsic value of a redemption is always a significant factor for me too Stan - thanks👍🏾

[@TheCreditFrog]

Of course Nkosi! Everyone’s priorities are going to be different so as long as you know your own, that’s all that’s important.

[@PingPingTravel]

I also don't care. I recently came back from a 22 night vacation (well, 11 nights but needed 2 rooms per night) and covered most of my stay using points. I needed to cover as many free nights as possible, so I didnt care about getting 2-3 cpp or whatever people get. Also, I dislike it when people say that they saved $1000 on their hotel stay when they would never even pay $1000 to stay at said hotel.

[@TheCreditFrog]

For sure Ping Ping! Covering a stay of that length with points is pretty incredible since I'm sure it took a lot of points to do so! And yeah, everyone has a different way of interpreting "getting value back!"

[@grogu_2003]

How do you have 40 nights already? Wouldn't that mean you've used millions of Mariott points or is there some strategy I don't know?

[@TheCreditFrog]

The Amex Brilliant adds 25 nights and the Amex Business adds 15 nights, so total 40. I haven't even stayed at a Marriott one time this year! At 50 elite nights (10 actual nights), I'll redeem my bonus gift for a 5 additional elite night credits. Since it takes 75 elite nights to be Titanium, with this setup I only need to stay 30 nights to do so!

[@grogu_2003]

@@TheCreditFrog and how would you do the 30 free nights? Will you use hundreds of thousands if not millions for that?

[@TheCreditFrog]

@@grogu_2003 No, you could use award stays or paid stays, up to you!

[@grogu_2003]

@@TheCreditFrog so there is no other strategy to cover those 30 nights except actually staying 30 nights?

[@TheCreditFrog]

@grogu_2003 Nope, you’re already over halfway there so you gotta put in the work for the other half! Better 30 nights than 75 nights!

[@Rolando-SE]

Yup, the point for most normal people is to save money. Gamefying things to maximize point value and you always run the risk of overspending and getting an itinerary you really dont want.

[@TheCreditFrog]

I agree. While maximizing points should be the goal, it shouldn't be the only goal, especially when it comes to spontaneous trips that require a specific itinerary. When you make those aspirational trips, they tend to come with higher expenses too, which is a great point you make, and very important to point out!

[@JesseMeacham-n6v]

Maximalist here! It's actually criminal that you don't have either Sapphire card.... I would have used the CSR for the 1.5 CPP flight redemption and transferred to Hyatt for easily a 2 CPP hotel redemption. This being said, I don't expect the average person to have the CSR just for the sake of securing 1.5CPP redemptions when the opportunity presents itself and I can appreciate your preference to stay with Marriot due to your status; Overall an acceptable redemption, my inner maximalist will never recover from the horrid BILT redemption, might as well light $600 on fire...

[@TheCreditFrog]

I hear you, Jesse! I should have gotten a Sapphire card a long time ago, but I was over Chase 5/24 before I knew it, and then that was it, and I never had a chance to get it again with the strategies I was running! It would have been awesome to have the CSR for 1.5CPP for the flight. Sorry I caused the feels with the 30k Bilt transfer to United ... I did actually get about $400 in value from it so really, I only lit $200 on fire. Not sure if that makes you feel any better or not, but just wanted to point that out 😅

[@randomsonmymind6919]

Here's my thinking: if a hotel or resort typically doesn't offer points reservations, and all of a sudden has pockets of availability or potentially weeks, then look for the lowest cost in points and reserve that. I rather book something that isn't typically bookable than calculate the value of my points.

[@TheCreditFrog]

That's a nice easy way to do it! You probably save a lot of time using that method as well!

[@tbark87]

I’d recommend just walking to the National Mall from the Marriott. You’re less than a half mile out and from memory the Metro is a bit deep at that point. Metro Center is also huge. That area of the city is pretty relaxed. More likely to get solicited by vegan activists than mugged.

[@TheCreditFrog]

I could definitely walk, but the National Mall is huge! Especially if I wanted to visit a museum and then walk to the Lincoln Memorial! Haha, I'll have to keep an eye out for my friendly neighborhood vegan!

[@gottabe884]

I was thinking about staying by the Wharf and I think there is a metro stop around there.

[@TheCreditFrog]

@@gottabe884 It's a really nice area!

[@balertriton26]

Refreshing discussion!

[@TheCreditFrog]

Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it!

[@balertriton26]

@@TheCreditFrog random thought, would you consider making a video on the travel insurance policies offered by cards and which you recommend using when booking a costly trip? Maybe comparing the Reserve, USBAR, platinum, etc.

[@TheCreditFrog]

@balertriton26 I’ll consider it! It’s definitely something that’s been brought up before so there’s certainly a need. I’ll add it to my list!

[@balertriton26]

@@TheCreditFrog awesome! Appreciate your videos, you really have a gift of explaining things well. Thank you for your work in this space!

[@ChrisD1865]

Convenience over CPP all day!!

[@TheCreditFrog]

Very nice! I'm the same way! 👍

[@jacobfain6504]

Great video!

[@TheCreditFrog]

Thank you!

[@habeshafinance1710]

I have a million point never use waiting the good redemption value. Regret it

[@TheCreditFrog]

That's amazing! Definitely start using them and make some great travel memories!

[@MattMcGrathOfficial]

Great video Stan. I am moving towards being Team Marriott!

[@TheCreditFrog]

Thanks Matt! Marriott has some great properties. Come on over!

[@evangibson8020]

The Credit Frog speaks, and his word is law.

[@TheCreditFrog]

🤣🤣. Thanks Evan! I appreciate the support.

[@banderson1979]

I wish all the vloggers would realize TPG valuations are world wide, Bonvoy above 0.7 domestically is generally considered a miracle.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Hah! Thats so true. I’ve seen some Marriotts for higher than 1cpp, but it’s super hard to find.

[@BonVoyageMiles]

I got lucky and was able to redeem for 1.4 at the Talbott Hotel in Chicago a few weeks ago

[@TheCreditFrog]

@@BonVoyageMiles That's a great redemption for Marriott! Nice job!

[@L_____E_______IT]

Well said Stan! Welcome to the matrix, the multiverse is open.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Of course! Uhhh, I wonder what I will find in there!

[@YumDex]

It’s all convenience, it’s almost like having a jr savings account lol

[@TheCreditFrog]

I agree. If your points were obtained with spend you were already doing - it's just another nice pool of funds to use when trying to book that trip!

[@jwil4286]

*Shaun Lane has left the chat*

[@TheCreditFrog]

Yeah, he would not enjoy this video. He’s got great info for those who want to ultra-maximize though!

[@jwil4286]

@@TheCreditFrog the funniest part? the most recent episode of his podcast had him talking about "bad" redemptions (imo, the only "bad" redemptions are ones that are significantly less than 1CPP [and where you're not just topping off an existing points balance]).

[@TheUsflow]

Says the credit card youtuber. Haha those of us with mere mortal points balances need to consider c/p more than referral-rich content creators!

[@TheCreditFrog]

I’m not going to deny that. If you don’t have a lot of points, it’s important to get the best CPP value you can with what you have!

[@ItsMeCJ]

First!!!

[@TheCreditFrog]

Ooh!! CJ putting in the work! Nice! You have earned this one today! 🥇🏆

[@AnthonyVenture]

Wowwwwww!! He finally worked for it! 😂

[@ItsMeCJ]

@@AnthonyVenture Anthony.... 😒

[@ronaldhu3zo]

💯💯💯

[@TheCreditFrog]

👍👍👍

[@billlyl3725]

Ninth!

[@TheCreditFrog]

Much better than that Billly! 🥉

[@luismunoz1213]

👍🏻

[@TheCreditFrog]

🙌

[@AhmadKhwajazada]

First

[@TheCreditFrog]

Almost Ahmad! CJ got you today!🥈

[@ItsMeCJ]

What’s up with this “today” business?! I’m ALWAYS getting him and everyone else who thinks they’ve beaten me 😂😂😂😂😂

[@TheCreditFrog]

@@ItsMeCJ You've won the battle. But you need to keep fighting to win the war!

[@ItsMeCJ]

@@TheCreditFrog 😂😂

[@AboveAllBeOriginal]

1000000%

[@TheCreditFrog]

💯💯💯

[@dragone7e]

While I like (and agree) the content of the video, I feel like the title is very clickbait-y. You clearly still care about CCP, but just not the end all be all.

[@TheCreditFrog]

Yeah, the title is more of a tongue-in-cheek commentary where you’re exactly right! I do care bout CPP, just not as much as a lot of others do!