Why I Don't Recommend Project: Gorgon

Find a game run by people that care about you. You'll be much happier.
steamcommunity...
Steam review.

[@caim1337]

Now they just pro-actively scammed me, (and a few other backers). Giving away a high tier perk from kickstarter for the fraction of the price on their website. Fuck me and everyone else who donated for the grand duke package.

[@ProPandaPlays]

this, think im banned now too idk, but as soon as i downvoted changed my vote from upvote to down the steam forums says banned LOL even though i had just logged in previous... honestly i gotta be honest i wanst gonna play anymore theres not much more to do having 1300 hours but MAN the devs are crybabys

[@ProPandaPlays]

had backed for 500 plus bought the game twice, so about 600 total almost not a huge deal to me retired early but man they kinda shady af, also i remember talking to citan or i think it was one of the 2 devs about what about "custom armor" they basically scrapped that but i had backed at 500 and there was this thing that you got 1 piece of custom armor... all in all, pretty fun but the backing system was basically a scam LOL

[@caim1337]

@@Lan-14941 Yeah, sucky for the personal situation for all that, and sucky for the game too.

[@The70sDiscoKing]

Hey Caim! I remember your name from in game. Sasho here but I stopped playing in 2019 or so after +120 days in game. I also jumped ship when I saw the game sinking from poor management. The community was going to garbage and they tried to mask the smell by piling a small handful of content paired with hundreds of needed hours of mindless grinding. The patches hardly gave anything new and were mainly just moving the same food around to a different side of the plate - which like you said, frustrated the long time players. There's only so many times a player, in addition to going from level 70 to 80 to 90 etc., want to keep redoing their gear set. That aside, many of us veteran players would still keep playing even with little to no extra content if it weren't for the bad leadership. I also don't think Jack really understands how much his forced community events divided the players by causing lag spikes, crashes and feelings of exclusion from the "good ol' boys club." The feeling of division was palpable as around 2018 when those who were made admins/mods/guides were starting assert their authority over others. The hypocrisy of how mods in game would dominate general chat with their political or downright obnoxious conversations, only to decide to "stop having political topics in general because it's against ToS" once they started to feel offended was sadly hilarious. I considered myself a long time player who stayed neutral when it came to drama. I enjoyed playing all the content of the game, but during my downtime I'd also like to both publicly and more often privately, make someone else's game experience fun and exciting. The mood of the game wasn't going to able to sustain a longer term positive environment, and I feel I can say that having spent as much time as I did around the community - both with the larger groups and the even more time 1 on 1 with various new or generally solo-playing players who would welcome me to join them. I spent so much time with players, joining discords and such and questing, who would only play for 1-2 months and then leave the game. I got pretty good insight into what made people stay and leave, but any feedback I'd give about it was met with animosity. This game just doesn't have a large enough community to start fresh when drama happens, so when the devs see drama they try to quash it knowing it will spread to everyone. But the double edge sword is because they handle drama so poorly they can't help everyone from seeing it, and it's an embarrassment to both the game and to us committed players who want to see the game grow. I personally have voiced complaints on the forum and had Citan shut me down publicly, only to later delete his response a half an hour later because I imagine even he found his response embarrassing. Greyfyn if I remember correctly was really nice in game, always randomly flying up to someone and just bobbing up and down. It made me laugh a ton, so it's sad to see him/her caught up in the politics. There was some other mod whose name started with "G" and that person was an unprovoked bully so I hope I'm not confusing the two. I think the other "G" mod have even been removed. Ever since Jack was made admit I'd only heard sad stories of his involvement in at first doing the dev's bidding to, what I feel, unjustly ban people, but I guess now that's his own personal mantle. I supposed it was inevitable he'd be sour after collecting all of those lemons. I've talked to a half dozen people who were banned in game, and only one person said that they understand they deserved it. The others had similar stories about the dev's poking them with a stick through the jail cell, egging them on to get themselves banned. The reality is that new players are going to join, they are going to have fun and get emersed in the content, then a few months go by and they start to get hand cramps, take a break, and start getting curious about the community. Then once they start seeing what's happening around them, they are going to leave. Hopefully they can see your video first and at least be warned that if they are looking a solid community they should look elsewhere.

[@Dragone04]

I bought pocket gear from you Sasho years ago, still wearing it !

[@FatherMalice]

Was gonna play but saw this. ty

[@goldenbatz]

A completely civil discussion of this video was posted on r/projectgorgon and almost immediately deleted by moderators for no clear reason... amusingly supporting your claims of criticism being silenced.

[@caim1337]

Yeah, I found out about the post after the fact lol, but yeah they want very filtered posts on just about anything, even reviews you see them responding from time to time. I did see some of the comments, and there was a lot of people agreeing, and like the 2 typical people, trying to debunk my argument, one of them missed the whole point of the kur bit being about leveling, and mentioned nothing relating to it, and another person saying I'm whining? It really just goes to show that's what the remaining community at large is like.

[@TravailKittin]

It's a game for adults but their maturity level is child like. It has a lot of promise but like you said, so much dead content that if you do try and address it and help them with suggestions, you're shut down or made fun of for thinking that opinion.

[@caim1337]

wish I had screenshotted it but I saw someone talking about just begging for casino daily runs all day and that's why they quit cause nobody would help, think it was a steam review, but it's honestly true, you're at the mercy of people that have grandfathered toons to give you handouts.

[@mtweldon]

@@caim1337 Unfortunately this is quite true. I spent days trying to get someone to run AM's with, but had no luck, unless you get lucky and can get a group of guild mates, or the typical friends group who does it has a free spot, you're at the mercy of the bored higher people. I've been 85/85 for like 7+ months and tried for a full 2 weeks to get an invite to a gauntlet run posting in discord and in game daily, had no success; there are a few 2-4 groups of people who run gauntlet constantly and that's about it, if you're not really in their circle, only hope is if one of them can't make it and they make a post asking for 1 more. I've randomly gotten invites from guildies over the past month for gauntlet, but it's usually during the work day so I unfortunately can't escape for an hour or so to do it. I love PG for the most part, but outside of grinding a few more classes up to max level, or grinding the ungodly amount of ingredients to push cooking or other crafts past 70s, etc.. I'm losing motivation.. Grinding the same old content so I can get enough money just to unlock my 10+ combat skills stuck at mid-70's that I probably won't play long term anyways.. meh.

[@Plaximos]

@@caim1337 It's hard to get casino daily runs if your not in a popular or active guild. So I agree here but I urge everyone to join an active guild so you don't have this issue. My guild alone does all the content every day and we are always helping people.

[@caim1337]

@@Tall_Order Yup, I would typically just start groups for things I wasn't even needing to do, cause I wanted to help people, rare you'll find that.

[@ProPandaPlays]

this. shame sadly. hope the mmo lives another 5 years... but wont be surprised if it doesnt. 1300 hours here i had played

[@infradig696]

Everyone played it because the dev worked on Asheron's Call, and they advertised that it would be and old school grinding game like Asheron's Call. I haven't played in a couple years, but from what I gather, it seems they've totally done away with that concept and are making more like every other mmorpg out there.

[@caim1337]

yup newest updates are basically forcing the game into being another wow-clone, the modern era mmorpg template if you will. Slowly taking away all the legitimate old school elements and making everything a theme park instead of a sandbox.

[@jenkims1953]

Yeah this annoys me too you mentioned the adult themes in the game its like a double standard like they are ok to do things but players get banned for the dumbest shit. Steam is a good example of the sort of corruption, some of the porn games on their platform are pretty graphic now like there is a couple that are really graphic and have good graphics i don't own them lol but i have seen them. What i mean is they are ok to do these things with only a age filter which is easy to bypass, but yet we cannot just go and upload porn pictures on the community right? and we get banned on there for saying some pretty innocent things not even adult related just in general. Massive double standards one set of rules for them and a different set of rules for the players and Steam is not the only one doing it its in many places online.

[@stelios_ser]

Hey I was wondering if you still don't recommend the game and if so what game would you recommend that I can play on Mac

[@caim1337]

No, it's actually gotten worse, even people that agreed with me and stuck it out are mostly all banned now, and they ruined the game even more, basically almost dead. Not much I would recommend right now, project ascension, guild wars 2, and maybe monster & memories, but those all kinda meh

[@superhetoric]

I'm watching this after looking up the game bc after a few years of not playing mmorpgs I was in the mood to start one and holy shit. I truly can't believe staff treats its playerbase like this. this is beyond surprising and unprofessional.

[@cla3452]

Staff of one person?

[@Athalfuns]

I don't know a single niche game that doesn't this sort of shit...it's hard to find good games with good ppl developing them nowadays.

[@cosput]

Thanks for saving me some time, unfortunately too late for a refund

[@robbie4239]

I had a thought about trying the game out, thanks for this. Absolute waste of time clearly, dev team sounds like they are coasting on the money from early investment instead of working with a community to make an enjoyable game

[@MuscleTeamOfficial]

Thanks for bringing this to light. I was gonna get back into Gorgon as a noob

[@caim1337]

Yeah, it's a sad case :(

[@BrandonS-lk2qc]

So, as a gamer in 2023 who started with UO and EQ...I know I have choices. This game is sub optimal in graphics and mechanics to start...after watching this I'm refunding. I visited the Discord and can confirm these are not opinions, these are observations. What a shame.

[@caim1337]

Yup, anyone that's remotely skeptical about my video, can easily do a recreation of what happened to me, by just talking negative, genuinely even, about a update feature you didn't like in the GENERAL chat in the offical discord, or in world chat. You might get away with one message, but you try to discuss / rant / vent about your dislike, good luck.

[@c-jhughes2481]

100% agree - All i was doing was joking about hammer animations and locks. I was a backer, too. Was warned in global, I didn't wait for a ban, I just quit. -Romruise

[@c-jhughes2481]

​@@Tall_Order yep! I remember - I prided myself on my unique AOE and single target high DPS build that stole all the aggro in dungeons - making me the last resort for a group lol. Now, from what I read, my perfect legendary crafted is nerfed... and I never had any intention of moving away from my build

[@ProPandaPlays]

this is insane yea i got a 1 year ban for joking about penis. (the boomers in the closet didnt like that,only half joking here lol) which is insane as i wwas in serbile and the npcs right there talk about orgies and make jokes about sex with elves.. jacks such a crybaby lol and then others can say slurs and shi which I WOULDNT EVEN MIND if EVERYONE could say them.. they either need to have rules what can be said and cant OR STOP CRYING if others use the words like "fa*" ect... if i call you a f** and you cry like a bi*** then thats fine, noone should say it, but if you want to call people bad ppppp pooo poo words and then be like mehh dont cry then dont cry if others use the words too. HOW IS ANYONE SUPPOSED TO KNOW WHOS JOKING THEN? lol the joke im retired, retired at age 25 and i didnt mind i took it as like mmm were all just joking humor. like thats how guys talk sometimes. but they get SO butthurt LOL its kinda hilarious

[@lust3390]

We played/talked together a few times during 2019-2020 but I doubt you'd remember me, Lustalia the fairie Bard. I can back up everything you've brought up here between jackndochebag being a psycho, his moderator friends allowed to insult and harass people but you'll get the ban hammer for complaining or reacting. One of jackndouchebag's friend's coglin used to sexually harass me (and the several other women that were in that guild that Seya ran) in his guild's discord. After bringing it up jackndouchebag banned me for 30 days in game and permenantly on the Steam forums and I have not played since. This happened because coglin is friends with jackoff/seya and ran in the same guild together so they all step in to cover each other's asses constantly. He went as far as to threaten to shoot me in the face irl but because I wasn't recording the voice chat I was made out to be a liar when there was 10 people present at the time that heard it yet not one stood up for me. I even made a post on Reddit about the situation a couple years ago and coglin came into the thread to insult and harass me and the mods ended up locking the post because of his psychotic stalking behaviour. Several people even called him out for proving my point correct so much so that he ended up deleting his reddit account. I joined Seya's guild and within the first 5 days all the other women in the guild left due to coglin's creepy sexual harassment but everyone but me was too scared of saying anything about it out of fear of getting banned because he's friend's with seya and jackoff. I'm sad it took so many years for other people to start seeing the truth but the signs were always there. I honestly don't know how anyone would want to play a game with a dev that is so mentally unstable and antagonistic to literally everyone that doesn't lick his hole. I had a lot of fun in the 300+ hours I got out of the game but that psycho dev and his chat mod friends wielding their power with an iron fist made playing the game unbearable once you get that "touble maker" tag from jackoff. At that point the entire playerbase turns on you and you either stop being invited to dungeon runs or get ran out of the game entirely if you're "lucky" enough to not get the ban hammer by that man-baby dev.

[@caim1337]

Sorry to hear all that, I heard some sexual harassment stuff regarding another player that wasn't you, also. This is pretty rampant it seems. I also heard about the trouble maker title thing very very briefly, I didn't realize it was a legit thing, thought it was more of a sort of account note thing, not a literal title, yikes talk about literal character assassination, lynching, and witch hunting, holy cow. They also just recently screwed over my big backer package by making a very high tier thing a very low cost + other shit given to them, while I get no accommodation for my package now deprecating in "value". I was thinking the community could be redeemed if apologizes were legitimately given, but it seems at this point that it's irredeemable. An actual shame.

[@lust3390]

From what I've been reading lately, I think all that money was mainly used for Citan's cancer treatments which is why there's been very little work done on the game as a whole. I honestly don't think the game was ever made for an actual playerbase just a playground for dev and friends to have some sort of power fantasy where they get to pretend to be dictators. I honestly wish some big game jounalist would do an expose on jackoff and the stolen money because he deserves to be publicly embarassed and shamed over his psychotic power tripping behaviour.

[@keblin86]

Oh this is so disappointing to hear. I just got into it and I am addicted but I feel like I should stop now before my addiction gets worse lol. I've not seen anything bad so far mind you. Only a few people online and everyones been nice and welcoming so far

[@caim1337]

Yeah, once you look passed the facade and behind the curtains you'll realize everyone's very snakeish, and don't actually care about you.

[@Ravynheart]

If you are having a good time with a game why would you stop playing because you learned about someone's criticisms on youtube

[@caim1337]

@@Ravynheart This isn't an isolated incident

[@keblin86]

@@Ravynheart I'm at the point in my life with mmorpgs where I don't want to invest a lot of time if that game might not be around much longer, supported or just generally loses all it's player base. I only look for mmorpgs now that I can call "home" really and always go back to. I'm sure this will still be around mind you

[@Shauma_llama]

I haven't seen what he's talking about. I do agree with his take on this zone he mentioned called Kur Mountains. They revamped it to make it look "better", and be a home for an Orc race, and players did not like the changes, and asked to just roll ot back and throw those changes away. They didn't take that well. But look how long it was for Blizzard to wake up that no, official Classic WoW will make you money.

[@davidpak271]

This game is a low key scam now

[@chudyie]

Everything you've said is completely valid. Please make an update. if they ban you for making this video, I'll leave too. +5,000 hours

[@caim1337]

I have a hunch they won't ban me outright for the video, but they'll pull what they did in the discord on me, where they'll stalk and monitor me, and try to manifest and come up with any tiny reason to ban me and play it off as something else. Basically egg you on, and subtly harass you, and if you call it out then ban you, with all their mod/admin buddies having their back and turning a blind eye.

[@TheDrachenwolf]

They banned me for civil, friendly disobedience. Many thousands of hours of gameplay. Might as well just quit yourself.

[@caim1337]

@@TheDrachenwolf Yeah games fine if you never talk, and if you do talk, toe the line, games no worth it anymore.

[@ProPandaPlays]

i had a year ban for laughing at jacks rules he cried when i didnt take it seriouly that i said pp poo poo when the npcs talk about sex and orgies.. so i got a temp ban then later someone was named "fagageddon" or something HORRIBLY discriminatory, not sure if it was towards people of color or gays, im gay. but i called it out and I WAS THE ONE who got a year ban. its just downright childish boomers sucking each other off. i even have the screenshots but im over it lol the game itself is SO FUN but yea they need to know people WILL blast this shi all over social media and iv been slowly calling out the degenerate boomer behavior so nice to see its also spreading here and people see it.

[@ProPandaPlays]

@@TheDrachenwolf yea they even say they dont need a reason to ban. if you question the ban or post about it online they can perm ban its in the rules. pretty nutty and insane how they all suck each others dicks LOL creepy boomers

[@An.Unsought.Thought]

Wow..... hearing you call this close to if not your favorite game while also giving up on it because of the devs and community is so sad. I was looking at how unique the "skill" were designed and I was thinking about giving the game a try. I'm so used to mmorpgs where you pick a class and maybe a specialization and the skills/abilities come as you level. This reminded me of Runescape but with so much more character building. Hearing about this leaves a pit in my stomach, as I'm sure you also felt while going through this yourself. I almost want to say the WoW community and Devs care a thousand times more than these devs, mods, etc... That may be an extremely low bar though. At least WoW devs talk professionally towards their players. And they dont seem to stifle criticism. They may ignore it unless it gets way too big to ignore. But they never delete sincere comments or tell people to shut up or stop talking about something. Sad to see that story that seemingly came from humble beginnings, a husband and wife developing a game together, could end up so sour. Now it just seems like a passion project with a cult following. Which is fine if you accept it, but it makes it ridiculous for them to ask anyone to give them money for it. Like an mmorpg should be getting regular updates to bring the best possible game to the players. Sounds like they are just doing whatever they want. If the game isnt being made for the players, why should any gamer support them and play their game?

[@caim1337]

Wow's pretty soulless with their automated, easily abused report system, and automated support responses. Why I quit that game. (captain grim did a great example video on this) And yeah they basically are making a game for themselves at this point, actively scamming huge supports, and spitting on dedicated fans giving passionate feedback.

[@af1762]

crap, i played this when it cost a fiver for beta or so and really liked it. pig character. was hoping to come back if my char was transferable from that era. but i also remember lot of OG people banned on forums... and now this. no buy for me. oh well.

[@lydium5712]

Glad to see I wasn't the only one. I can't say I didn't get any enjoyment out of the game however after several hundred hours in game, it was extremely obvious that this game has a core group of users/staff that run the game, almost like a cult. I never got very vocal (despite the meriad of reasons to do so) but on the rare occasion I did, it was so obvious that feedback was not welcome.

[@Reservist]

Thanks for the video, it looked interesting but now I'll avoid it after seeing this.

[@vyrmx4815]

Gosh I regret buying this game recently so much. I never saw that unprofessional developers and moderation in game and on discord. Banning for reviews, banning for using capslocks in game (the unwritten rules are cringe as hell), banning for a different opinions. Banning in game for discord things or steam things. They took so much $$ from people and treat them like worst shit and block the ability to play for nothing in most cases. And banning for reviews? Why this garbage game are still on steam? Why valve allows this type of practice? This is below any standards. Its like going to shop and be kicked out for buying apples instead oranges lmao. Steam is their only source of publishing game to others and devs are are not authorized to decide how this platform may be used lmao and I am most interested in what complexes they are trying to compensate for. Instead of developing the game, they use it to put themselves above other people and feel power or something. How sad that is. Making a game is one thing, managing a community is another, and they can't do that. This is due to the lack of professionalism and respect for their customers. How can they treat people like this when the whole game was built on financial requests, kickstarter, $500 bundles, they are literally nobody without others thanks to which they owed everything was build WTF Private servers of other games have more players, what a shame. This game is about to close because the developers only see their ego and there is not too much players. I just wasted money for garbage cash-grab because developers treat players like cash cows and im really mad about it ech @edit They even made 3x times kickstarters for their game xDDDD Just imagine begging for money that many times for one title just to treat playerbase like that XDDDDDD they don't even respect themselves lmao www.kickstarter.com/projects/1045484633/project-gorgon-an-indie-mmo-by-industry-veterans?ref=users www.kickstarter.com/projects/1045484633/project-gorgon-a-new-approach-to-mmos www.kickstarter.com/projects/projectgorgon/project-gorgon-pc-mmo

[@caim1337]

All they had to do was keep updating the game and they would've had a loyal fanbase, cult classic. Instead they gave power to a handful of not-well-off people to moderate a community so small it doesn't actually need moderating, so in turn they have to make up their own boogiemans and arbitrary rules, in order to have something to have control / moderation over.

[@dico3557]

I remember being a new player ( around 50 hours ) and got portalled around to the boss runs by other players and at the end got portalled to some ice zone. I tried asking for help getting out and the admin just told me maybe you shouldn't be trying to do that content. Like wtf? I was asked to come this is retarded. I quit shortly after.

[@caim1337]

Sounds about right, they said the same type of shit to me, being a hardcore fae dying in a labyrinth, which made it impossible to get my stuff back without having to wait a minimum of 30 minutes, to upwards of hours, to being able to get my shit back, clearly a oversight on development. The community's response was "Maybe I should disable hardcore" or "I shouldn't got into the labyrinth as hardcore". Instead of the logical approach that they should fix the damn game.

[@jenkims1953]

Yeah its fked up how it works i have had these sorts of dealings online in a a few spaces like one discord server i was on for a game i play, the main admin asked for suggestions so i gave some and then they turned around and told me to go play somewhere else and like straight away after i posted just for voicing my suggestions because they thought i was overriding "their" vision for the server. The poll they had was going to bring in changes that totally undermined the theme for that server so i voiced this oversight. I guess if you don't like what people say then don't ask? pretty simple logic right. I was accommodating in a sense of i could tell instantly that they thought i was trying to overide them or something so i mentioned that it was just a suggestion/s. if they could comprehend what that actually entails then they would know i was not trying to talk over them right? I even said after they got salty like its your server you can do what ever you want but don't ask for suggestions and then get all crumby when you don't like what someone suggests otherwise remove that ability for people to voice things. Basically it was for a project zomboid server that was vanilla and set to pretty reasonable authentic settings but they wanted to introduce all these mods all of a sudden which breaks the immersion of the game like zombie cure etc which totally ruins immersion. Also when most of that servers player base which was small is playing there because they are looking for that sort rule set. I just suggested to them that most of us are here because of that and that if we wanted to play a heavily modded server then we can just go play any of the 1000s of carbon copies out there already. The transcript was pretty lengthy and i did have saved initially but i deleted it just recently anybody with a sound mind would read it and be like wtf this admin is delusional i even called him out as such for trying to paint me a certain way because i knew straight away he was looking to ban me by making false claims and accusations against me. They tried to say that i was being aggressive and actually tried to say that i was abusing others by name calling which i wasn't and not even anywhere even close to that. I don't get it i mean i do and i know why they do it but, its like some people are missing a chromosome or something and they attract others with that same deficit because they all flood in attack you all of a sudden like wtf when no one said anything previously. I can see from the log you posted and the way you talk that you are pretty reasonable and also a realist. I just tell myself that some of these people are not mentally sound online and some of them are pretty dumb in some cases as well and many of them are not responsible enough to be in a administrator or moderator role.

[@mesmorrow]

I been following the development of this game a long while, and I was always interested in the game’s freedom aspect, but seeing what it has turned into, yeah, I'll stick to Mabinogi, It might be a free to play grind fest at times but at least I won't get banned by a mod getting their underwear in a twist and has the freedom I always enjoyed.

[@jenkims1953]

yep just a classic example of kids at the wheel any admin who says something like "I want to be able to put people in prison" in open chat is not very professional and also not really sound to be in that role. I have played the game for a while like maybe 5 years or more and i have always disliked him in global i have never really said anything to him but he says a lot of stuff and i have always saw right through him since i started playing. Polishing the hammer what a loser.

[@caim1337]

Yeah he always came off as "Check out what I can do 😏", and "you better watch out" type mannerisms, I dunno when I think of game mods and admins, I expect very humble people, not the watch guard. What's the saying? "Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?"

[@jenkims1953]

@@caim1337 yeah, if i was an admin i would play an actual character that is forward facing to the community for community relations but has no god powers. and then only admin on an unknown character that nobody knows and cannot even see because its invisible. I have admin servers before in self hosted games and i am always responsible i don't use it to cheat or ban people for no reason. I guess some people just want the fame of having god powers in the game it goes to their head. Some people are just not responsible enough.

[@ILLSmak]

@@caim1337 It's probably not as bad as you think to have some eager mods. IF their whole thing was to police stuff. Like games have hacking and stuff, put these dudes on that, y'know, not speech. Cuz that's a big deal. As someone who came from chat rooms and believe that MMOs are KINDA like that at the core, the expression of player base is absolutely vital. I wouldn't last a few seconds in this game haha. They'd take my 9.99 and I'd be like yooo. Cuz those kinda power trip people, they legit know when I enter the room in life. On games, I promise you they are like aha this dude is gonna be a problem. I have sooo much respect for the forums/communities that I have been grandfathered in, but I still call stuff out. I've been a part of enough online communities to know what's good and bad, and yeah what you say about this game is... more than just bad. It's some 'make a KZbin video telling people not to play' level. Haha, and I think that's what... oh wait. But for real, like I said in the other comment, IT'S WORKING/IT WORKED. So well played. You got this coming up high in KZbin search. It's something anyone should know before going in.

[@ProPandaPlays]

@@ILLSmak this haha and its insane in a game like gorgon where the npcs in the STARTING TOWN serbule LITERALLY talk about orgies and sex and all manner of stuff, but you cant get the admins upset about penis and pp cause thats a nono word :P

[@ILLSmak]

@@ProPandaPlays all I can say is I'm glad I saw this vid before I bought it haha.

[@xbon1]

u gotta fix ur audio balancing, it's all mostly isolated in the right ear lol.

[@caim1337]

Yeah was the mic and stuff sorry bout that

[@deitus1375]

Well I only played this a bit when there was a demo a few years ago but lately I’ve been itching for an mmo of this type. Would you still recommend to play this game?

[@caim1337]

Nope. There's sadly still hasn't been a redemption ark for any of the people that work for the game. I would however recommend guild wars 2, I'm currently maining that.

[@deitus1375]

@@caim1337 ah well that’s too bad. Will check out guild wars instead then.

[@xxrfmxx]

your right no one cares if you leave a game like project gorgon or most mmorpg way it is i been like playing mmo for years people drop out all the time i hate it a lot out them are good players help me i miss them i understand why they quit what you are saying in this video

[@Dragone04]

The game needs a really good PR to address the masses, Eric is not cut out for it, Jackencola is a tool. Instead of doing damage control they add fuel to the fire.

[@caim1337]

Very much so, though I'm sure they just hope everything will fix itself socially on game release, but that won't be the case.

[@jenkims1953]

I have not heard about these changes either i have not really played since before the new skybox in Elt like i just left as it came in need a break etc. I logged in a few times since then just to see guild but that is it. That end game changes to enchanting sounds dumb and the dev response to backlash sounds dumb that is not how you retain players or bring players in.

[@caim1337]

Yup, they asked for 0 player feedback, until damage was already done, perhaps it's a lessoned learned? (doubt it)

[@Joshualvl99]

you saved me a ton of time and money, thank you.

[@ShadoMoosess]

Agree 100% actually. I took a long break beginning around Christmas and was considering coming back soon, but then after seeing everything happen the way it did, I'm kind've considering never playing again. PG will always have a place in my heart though for I've met my girl in the game. Seems we were brought together by fate, who knows. But in all honesty, there's still a lot of great people playing that I miss. It's hard to support such a mess. I've even heard many long-time players quitting entirely. These were players that, were so built up, that now the game will struggle even more because players that haven't achieved adequate gear and skills yet, can't simply just get help anymore. It was hard enough to get help with dailies before I stopped playing in December. Frankly, I got to the point where I could just solo dailies, but it's still much faster and better for everyone if they participated.

[@caim1337]

Lucky man. Yeah, there was some player that was giving all their stuff away in game cause they were quitting, heard some other people doing it, the community isn't as helpful as people play it up to be, and the few that may be helpful, the rest are rather unhelpful with the way they respond and act to people.

[@ProPandaPlays]

@@caim1337 for real i cant even type in global if they get that upset seeing my name its just not worth it for me to try to help new players sadly.

[@danieltilson4053]

Not trying to take away from your experience, but, every person I've seen who got banned for "criticizing the game" worded their "criticism" the way you did in parts of this video. "This system is $%%$!" "Fix your f%&*ing game!" I have never seen anyone banned for constructive criticism. "This could be better if ___" etc. Regarding the XP diminishing for going high or low, that's every MMO I've ever even looked at. heck, in Wow, if the mobs are too low, you get no xp at all. As for Kur, there's a small tax for farming there. no question. but keeping the fires going, or making your own is hilariously cheap compared to what you make even just selling random drops to a vendor, nevermind what you can get from players. Lastly. I don't care if someone spent $5, or $5,000 on the game, if they do something to deserve being banned, they should be banned.

[@caim1337]

First I aint been banned - yet. I left because the community is ran by a toxic echo chamber. Also the devs allow cussing in the game, so that's a non argument, plus I rarely constructed my criticism by just pure vulgar means, if you think that, you're cherry picking. this isn't wow, there is no way of getting gear, no quests, no streamlined gearing, mods are rng, drops are rng, quality of drops are rng, leveling by keeping in bracket is impossible unless you get hand outs. Nobodies farming in kur The people that have been banned despite being large backers weren't justly banned, look at them threating to ban me because I didn't talk in a thread, mind you, threads just became even relevant in the discord, aren't used, and I was talking in a general chat.

[@danieltilson4053]

@@caim1337 I can only go by what you showed in this video, where you did in fact present your criticism in a vulgar manner multiple times. That's not constructive in any way. Anyone can say they were unjustly banned. If you want people to believe it, you need to provide proof.

[@caim1337]

@@danieltilson4053 I knew the people, xgodx, and propandaplays, I'm not going to exactly go ask a admin for ban logs, but I assure you xgodx for sure was a pretty chill dude, he probably just argued with a admin and got banned for it, because they're sensitive egomaniacs. Propanda is clearly on a pretty strong spectrum, you have to give the guy some leniency for how he acts, perhaps mute his account, not ban the poor guy, jesus. Go read the steam reviews, all the negatives, apart from 2 which were bans from someone hacking the game, are legit. I'm also not seeing the bit where you said I was being vulgar in the video.

[@c-jhughes2481]

Sorry, I don't know the right way to comment in subcomments as I don't comment much... but, me personally, I play a clown and joke and make fun of myself in-game - it's what I was known for. I had a running joke about Surveying when people complained about something... where I would say "at least it's not surveying" where people would laugh. Admins felt I was knocking Surveying, which I was, but nobody got all butt-hurt about it, everyone would laugh and a few would say "I like Surveying!" to which I would reply "Nobody's Perfect" or something... nothing bad. It was a running joke. I also poked fun at Hammer all the time, but everyone knew I was* hammer exclusively. It was all jokes, but I got threatened by the Admin in Global chat that the devs' patience was running out with my Hammer criticisms, and it was my first/last warning... in Global chat. I never thought I would care, but when that happened, I really felt hurt because I had helped tons of people, got people to buy the game, and backed the game, as well as placed down Cauldrons all the time and alcohol and got community involvement/fun going. (My character is RomRuise). When I left the discord server, i had an in-game Guide DM me and say 'hey I noticed you left - you leaving? please don't, you're one of the veterans and impact the game' to which I said 'yeah probably quitting, Jack's being an a*hole, to which he warned me to watch what I say in this DM because they monitor them. That was the last straw, knowing that if I say stuff they don't like in even a Direct Message, I could be banned... also the fact that they monitor direct messages in the first place.

[@caim1337]

@@c-jhughes2481 Yeah reminds me of the ongoing joke I say that the raffles are rigged, nobody got on me about that - yet anyways. Nobody messaged me when I left, guess I wasn't apart of the crowd. Despite literally being the #1 content creator for the game lul. I don't think they can fix attitudes, so the game is a lost cause, too small of a community, and not to mention their mod power, can't just ignore them. They either need to a do a overwhelmingly loud apology and reach out to people for forgiveness, or the game can just die out with their egos. Plus reporting them is setting yourself up to be harassed because the reports will just go to the people you're reporting, and they'll get vindictive about it. Just like greyfyn did with me, stalked me around discord, and tried to find any reason to try and action me cause I hurt their little fee-fee's.

[@caim1337]

If ya'll know of any other upcoming mmorpgs I can get a early foot it let me know.

[@MaritimGamer]

Embers Adrift, Monsters and Memories, Pax Dai, Genfanad, Ethyrial Echoes of Yore, Galaxies of Eden, Corepunk, to name a few

[@ILLSmak]

I def am intrigued by Pax Dei, but who knows when it's gonna release. I read a lot of people mad at Yore on steam, so not sure what to think about that... Being MMO-less is pretty sad. Sometimes it's ok, but as someone who is consistently filled with more energy than I know what to do with, in those times, even if it's like I jump out of bed at 2am and can't sleep... I need something to do. I'm glad this vid woke me up though. Was gonna give 'em a good shot. Peace!

[@ProPandaPlays]

who are you and why do i have you blocked on the steam project gorgon reviews LOL you posted this link in response to a bad review calling out the pissy admins LOL

[@ProPandaPlays]

just kinda strange place to advertise your youtube LOL anywho not sure if you got pissy at me but i had you blocked on steam LOL but yea its a shame to see how far gorgons community has fallen into toxicity. reallly pissy crybaby boomers. they flame way to much. games great honestly tho.

[@jenkims1953]

so are you actually banned from the game or just stopped playing?

[@caim1337]

not banned yet, though if I would've kept hammering my criticism they would've banned me, as you can see at 4:50. at that point I just decided to jump ship before they could kick me off.

[@ILLSmak]

Wat up, boye. Haha. I was looking into trying this. I had played the demo a bit but it's like ??? I think I need something way out there and 'deep' as this game seems to be. I am psyching myself out because it's like... this game was so wonky looking and played so wonky, yet people like it, there must be something I'm missing? Anyway, I just wanted to say never let anyone silence you. Keep doing your thing. People can do something on a small scale, but they can never suppress you. Take it to another platform like this. I am gonna sit the game out, too, even at 9.99 after watching this vid. It's that real. I honestly have been a part of other games where people got banned for stuff, and yeah FIX UR GAM generally doesn't go well, but reading thru this people are saying they monitor DMs and stuff. It's like hmmm. Anyone w/ eyes can tell this game is absolute jank (lol sorry for saying it, but let's be real, and I ain't mad cuz I played good jank games before, like Mortal Online 1, tons of memes,) so you'd expect there to be lots of depth, lots of community love, and all, and it DOESN'T SEEM LIKE THAT'S THE CASE. Sucks, but glad I was searching around and this came up. You got this vid pretty high on the Project Gorgon 2023 search, and that's big, so keep it up! Much love. I dunno if I'd ever get along with you as a person, or what kind of gamer you are, but I support just... the real, you know? Maybe it doesn't makes sense, but that's all you need to know. If nothing in this post makes sense: I support it and it's working. haha. In the most simple terms.

[@caim1337]

It's a very good game all things considered, surface level it doesn't seem that way, but the more deep mechanics that play parts are what make it really unique. It's just a good portion (not all) of the community are toxic and wrongly gatekeepy, and the guides / admins / devs don't give 2 fucks about anyone not in their immediate circle, and honestly openly cynical even. Citan the lead dev had a outburst once on people using reactions to his messages on discord, which I completely agree can be seen as toxic in some regards, but he immediately assumed the worst first, then back peddled later. One of many examples.

[@ILLSmak]

@@caim1337 sucks I didn't see this, I am trying Embers instead, haha, oh well.

[@user-bi6eg1lo7v]

Have you played Guildwars 2? It is a very good game.

[@caim1337]

Yeah its one of my favorite, it just gets kind of dull after awhile for me, all I like to do is wvwvw lol

[@user-bi6eg1lo7v]

@@caim1337 Nice! I'm waiting on Throne and Liberty with fingers crossed that it will be good.

[@caim1337]

@@user-bi6eg1lo7v Yeah I'm just going to invest in eden eternal, game I played a long time ago, it was pretty good.

[@Plaximos]

I love this game man, have over 7,000 hours and will still play it. However, I agree with your points here.

[@caim1337]

Yeah it's sad that the game is good, but you have to pretty much turn a blind eye to all the overwhelming negatives to not give up hope on it.

[@sehvendusk6612]

Hey Plaximos you are a hypocrite. You come here and say you agree with all his points but just a couple days ago you went like 3 hours straight on global dunking on every single new player feedback and explaining to everyone how they are wrong. You are what is wrong with PG. You act as a gatekeeper and explode like a child and its sad as hell to watch. Grow up.

[@caim1337]

Yo my stream died, tell me what happened im live agian

[@ProPandaPlays]

yooo its plax haha yea the boomers get SO PISSY, its kinda insane but also carthardic to see others voiced it here. jack gets so mad lolol he needs to grow up fr

[@ProPandaPlays]

@@caim1337 RIGHT! like its not even from haters, the game play itself is SO FUN and its obviously hitting a very VERY certain niche so like i get, you want to apeal to the people who might donate ect. but like this isnt even new... the toxicity has grown WAY OUT of control. to people making usernames like "fagnation" or i think it was "fagagetton" not sure if thats a slur towards blacks or gays, im gay myself but its just soo bad. thats not even good for the game. but i was the one who got banned insteaad for bringing that to the devs attention lol its just so sad cause the game is fun, grindy, htis that niche but if they keep this up im not sure it will survive.

[@undertyped1]

I am extremely extremely shocked you weren't banned the first time you argued with a moderator. You said they don't care about you, but clearly they do, most people don't get a 1 hour ban like you do, it's just straight to permanent. As someone who has been banned for submitting too many bug reports, and my friend for rping in global chat, I can give people in the comments some tips to avoid it. First, never type in global chat under any circumstances. Second, do not submit bug reports, the gms and devs don't want to see any reports, and won't take them into consideration anyways. All you achieve is getting a ban. Thirdly, don't type to other players, and lastly, don't type on their discord. Just pretend you are playing a single player game, and then I am 99% confident you probably won't be banned. Although this isn't guaranteed. If you have ever played very bad gmod servers, you will know the kind of administrators you are dealing with. Don't risk your progress because every time you type, no matter how seemingly mundane, you are putting a target on your back, and giving the gm's the ability to have a little fun at your expense.

[@The70sDiscoKing]

banned for too many bug reports? I remember something like this back in 2017 or so. Did you play as a pig character and was it something about a bug in Gazluk Keep? Rysco or something like that was the name? It's been a long time sorry lol

[@undertyped1]

@@The70sDiscoKing Nah, this was 2 years ago.

[@johnc2674]

I played the game for a long time but stopped probably 2 years ago. Like all games it had run its course with me and there were several new games to try. Met some really nice ppl in Gorgon and the guild I joined. The game itself, other than graphics really grew on me, and I enjoyed it for a long time. I never get involved with developers, drama...on any games so to me I had zero issues/complaints. His comments nobody farming here and there to cold, mobs to close ... on and on I never had trouble with those areas and found they were fun game mechanics that you could easily deal with once you figured out how. Yes, it could be challenging at times but who wants an unchallenging game. I think the developers have done a great job. Like all games you can't satisfy everyone. The guy that made this video sounds like he hated so much about the game then says he loved the game. If the staff, moderators, developers aren't doing things the way you like then go to another game or show us all the way it really should be done and create your own game. EVERY game has people praising it to high heaven and others crapping all over it for one reason or another. DO yourself a favor and try the game and judge for yourself.

[@caim1337]

Did you even watch the video, the cold bit wasn't even an argument on why the game was bad, it was because of the way people would just defend anything and attack the character of the person over giving criticism on a subject, like you're doing now. It was only brought up to point out the toxicity within the game, and you're helping prove my point. Also this is a video about on why I don't recommend it, not a review.

[@MrPuml]

I left 2 years ago. I used to make fun of people who said the devs and mods are toxic and unfair and that they ban and censor wherever they can, even mocking the people affected. That they are misogynistic. What professional company would do that? Fun fact they actually do all of that. I got a ban only for 24 hours but after that I decided I would never rely on those people to have control over when and how I can play. A MMORG is too much of a commitment when you think how much time you invest and just because you say or do something the mods don't like you could lose it all. Thanks but no thanks. Another fun fact. I complained to other players at this time and everyone was mocking me that a professional company wouldn't do that, that whatever I and other players got was deserved without even knowing my situation. I'm entertained but not too surprised that a number of long time players have this experience now too. It's not about the game changes but what the devs and mods think and say which makes this game a waste of time. The game itself was decent for what it was but it was overpriced, from base price to AAA costly subscription. Stay away....

[@caim1337]

A bad game with a good community can make all the difference, a good game with bad company is a no go. It's just too much of a tradeoff. You would literally need a game so groundbreaking that the community being bad is a afterthought. But It's not the case here. Yeah I used to think the people being actioned were to blame, though a little inkling feeling I had told me it wasn't the case, grew and grew, until I just couldn't ignore it anymore, I let it all play out on the discord before I left. The games doomed unless they do some serious head-rolling and sincere apologies, but we know they're too egocentric for that.

[@ProPandaPlays]

its truely crazy... not perm banned here but not sure if i can support a game like this. i backed at 500 dollers too and its not llike i dont enjoy the game but the toxicity is insane. i dont even read the chats in game and havnt touched the discord for years but yet they still act like this.not even a new thing