Why is Alex Thomson’s Hugo Boss Often Under Water?!?!?

Have you every wondered why Alex Thomson's Hugo Boss is often under water, or why he has that upside-down bow, or whether he'd be faster with a traditional bow and less water on deck?
In today’s video we are going to answer all of these questions.
You might be more familiar with a traditional raked bow, which is the most common design found on sailing yachts. They provide lots of space inside the boat, for V-berths or anchor storage, they provide for a relatively dry ride because they deflect spray away from the deck and back down towards the water, and they provide a convenient place to mount and launch an anchor, without having to worry about the anchor or rode banging against the hull.
The most notable downside is speed. The ability for a sailing boat to go faster is directly proportional to the waterline length. But with a flared bow you have boat length that isn’t in the water, not contributing to your speed, but you still have to pay for it with your annual moorage, because the marina typically charges for overall length, regardless of what the length is used for.
To maximize waterline length and speed many racing boats use plumb bows. A plumb bow is straight up and down, the way a plumb bob would hang from the front of the boat. For a given boat length, and all other things being equal, a boat with a plumb bow would faster than the same boat with a flared bow. But the builders also need to be a bit more creative in providing places to launch and store the anchor, because it can hit the bow on the way down. Plumb bows also aren’t as good at deflecting spray back down into the water, so you might wind up with more spray in the air, more water on the deck, and a slightly wetter crew, but for racers a bit of wetness is worth the speed.
Most boats will punch their bows through waves going upwind, and it’s not really a big deal because the boat and waves are going in opposite directions, the wave passes fairly quickly, and the water on the deck spills back into the ocean.
But downwind is another matter. A fast boat will climb up the backside of a wave, ride over the top, and accelerate down the face. Depending on the steepness of the wave the bows will submerge a bit when they encounter the back of the next wave. A little bit is not a problem, but if the bow fully submerges, the deck can act like a scoop and slow the boat dramatically. This causes the apparent wind to swing aft at the same time the wave behind catches up with the boat, which can cause the boat to capsize or pitchpole, which you really don't want.
Instead you want a bow that is shaped more like an inverted knife, which can easily slice its way back up to the surface when it submerges.
Disclaimer:
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- There are no warranties, expressed or implicit, about any content or its fitness for a particular purpose.
- There are risks of injury, death, drunkenness, and financial hardship involved in sailing.
- The skipper is always responsible for the safety of their vessel and crew.
- Sailing Tips is not responsible or liable in any way for anything that happens on or anywhere near your boat or any boat that we are not in command of.
#sailing #invertedbow #howtosail #learntosail #sailingtips

[@sucapizda]

So, what they really need then are small winglets on the bow that can quickly adjust to the diving nose and prevent deep diving. Like on the Eurofighter Typhoon for example.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Yes and with variable trim so they prevent deep diving but don’t introduce pitching! I think Wild Oats might have tried something like that and it looked a bit like a Swiss Army Knife for a while!

[@danoyes1]

HB is a old design, similar rig on a scow hull of similar waterline length would be faster than HB!

[@debouvette]

Imoca rules don’t allow for it. That’s why they always fly ‘poorly’

[@andreashabeck1155]

They would cause a lot of drag

[@teeanahera8949]

On a plane they’re called canards.

[@syx3s]

the last decade has really seen some basic but astonishing fundamentals in ship hulls being realized. some of the larger ships with the longship type leading edges are pretty incredible as well.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Technology is really advancing at an amazing pace, and advances in computer-aided design (CAD) and materials are making lots of interesting things possible!

[@DIYNauticalDream]

That wood model is almost an exact replica of our boat. What a coincidence. About the same as our budget. I like the Hugo BOSS mast walk trick.

[@SailingTipsCa]

LOL it has lots of flotation and is very cost effective!!! Yes the mast walk was pretty cool!

[@CrackedCandy]

@@SailingTipsCa mast walk? What's that

[@sebastianpeheim8851]

@@CrackedCandy just search for alex thomson mast walk. and enjoy the crazy video

[@TheGeoblue]

In this particular video of Hugo boss, his right foiling arm was broken and that is why he has no enough lift. He could lift the pedal off a bit, but its Alex.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Yes is right foil was broken and amazing he still came in second! This boat (2016) wasn't designed to be full foiling though, so some expectation that it will still be in the water sometimes. This will be a topic for another video!

[@danoyes1]

Fun video! Since HB was designed the latest thinking has evolved away from the wave piercing bow to the scow bow, which deals with the same issue in a completely different way, rather than providing minimal resistance when submerged the scow hull has so much buoyancy that it does not submerge... and incidentally provides more righting power so the hull can carry more sail through a higher wind range 😃

[@SailingTipsCa]

Yes the scow bows seemed to first garner broader attention when they showed up in the Mini Transat 6.5 class and did quite well! Any idea how they perform upwind?

[@danoyes1]

@@SailingTipsCa much rougher ride and harder on rig and spars, but these offshore speed machines make a point of sailing off the wind as much as possible.

[@paulgush]

I think some classes like the Volvo 70 have rules against scow bows. The Mini Transat scows have bulbous bows, but a scow bow can be sharp like a horizontal knoge blade. The Y-Flyer dinghy is am example of that

[@SailingTipsCa]

@@paulgush I haven't read all the box class rules but you're probably right. The HB iteration in this video was from 2016/17. I think HB from 2020/21 had a slightly more bulbous bow, but not quite as bulbous as the Mini Transats!

[@oogalook]

This was an excellent video. You didn't waste an instant of my time. That's worth a subscription right there.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Thanks - glad you liked it!!! And thanks for subscribing!

[@sweater7630]

Keep up the good content! I'd love to see a longer format on more In depth subjects

[@SailingTipsCa]

Thanks for the feedback! I do have a couple of longer videos with this one being the longest so far: Real Life Person Overboard Lessons kzbin.info/www/bejne/n5S5opmAa9KYe6c

[@fbrwn6950]

Super clear and very interesting ! I learnt a lot !! Thanks 🙏🏻

[@SailingTipsCa]

Glad you liked it!

[@Frank-E]

Thanks for the explanation 👍

[@SailingTipsCa]

Glad you liked it!

[@broughtonchris]

Clearly explained. Thank you

[@SailingTipsCa]

Glad it made sense!

[@Hojiii]

That was a great explanation. Thank you.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Glad it made sense!

[@douglasmaxwell6547]

Good explanation. Thanks

[@SailingTipsCa]

Glad you liked it!

[@whitecap308]

Very interesting and informative. Thanks.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Glad it made sense!

[@oliverclothesoff5397]

This was very interesting, thanks for sharing.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Glad you liked it!

[@bobboberson2024]

Great stuff. I just learned something!

[@SailingTipsCa]

Glad you liked it!

[@polepole9066]

Great explanation… nice woodworking too 😂. Cheers from 🇨🇦

[@SailingTipsCa]

Thanks! It’s hard to know how things will land when you’re looking into a camera with a block of wood in your hands!!! Real Canadian to use wood eh?

[@walterbishop477]

well that squared me away. Great explanatory video.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Glad you liked it!

[@robertmills4606]

the "knife" shape you are discussing is called an inverted bow, often referred to as a dreadnought bow (harkening back to older vessels) or Xbow in modern commercial vessel design. Even though this HB's right foil was damaged in this scene he is still getting some lift from it and he probably even has the foil articulated to do such, much like you can do on Fig3s, and you can actually find older videos of this HB and especially of Figaro 3s where the foils are lifting the bow section of the boat out of the water. Nothing like we see with Charral (and other newer IMOCAs) or any of the true foiling boats though. The wandering of the apparent wind is a huge deal with faster planning hull boats and you'll see drivers sail S turns as we surf down waves and the apparent moves forward rapidly, then turn down as the apparent wind drifts aft as we slow down going up the next wave, these aren't big adjustments but they can be seen. At that point even sailing "slower" boats like Class 40s or Minis becomes more like a cross between surfing and skiing moguls than short course racing. This is also why a lot of time on shorthanded boats some downwind sails may be solid luffed (like a Code 0/55 or an even A3) so that the sail will maintain shape while the autopilot steers based on other data inputs.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Thanks for your added insights!!!

[@patrickradcliffe3837]

Not dreadnaught bow sir, but it is called a ram bow it predates Dreadnaught.

[@robertmills4606]

@patrickradcliffe3837 dreadnought is a coloquialism as appearance is similar to that of larger early 20th warships. ram bows are very different, like that of the CSS Alabama or some large modern commercial vessel that have a separate protrusion forward like that of rams on greco roman warships. If you were to look at design tables of other simmilarly purposed vessels like those of class 40s, VOR70s, or MiniTransats, you'll see my previous statement holds true.

[@patrickradcliffe3837]

@@robertmills4606 the Ironclad battleship Hoche was built with a ram bow. You may refer to it as colloquialism but it is not accurate. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_ironclad_Hoche?wprov=sfla1

[@robertmills4606]

@patrickradcliffe3837 yeah but this isn't a 19th century french warship, this is a modern oceangoing sailing vessel and in modern design terms its referenced as a dreadnaught bow, wave pericing bow, inverted bow, or xbow, it is not called a ram bow as that references something more akin to a bulbous bow, which wouldn't work well with current design paradigms for the vandee.

[@gefginn3699]

Great post my friend. Very interesting and helpful for the design of my own Trimaran. 🌞🌴⛵️

[@SailingTipsCa]

Glad you found it helpful! My trimaran (F-82R) has plumb bows, however the floats have very rounded tops which shed water very easily when submerged.

[@EasyTigerII]

The othe advantage of HB's design is better airflow over the lower part of the jib. Nice vid

[@SailingTipsCa]

Good point - thanks!!!

[@timwhiting6721]

Sailing is so kool , i grew up boating on lake erie. No sailboats, but it is fun to sail on 1 .

[@SailingTipsCa]

I’ve sailed on Lake Huron so there’s at least one sailboat on the Great Lakes!

[@tentwo6350]

So rarely does one find a video with clear explanation like this.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Glad you liked it!!!

[@adventureswithfrodo2721]

Really interesting. Cheers

[@SailingTipsCa]

Glad you liked it!

[@ufukozbir649]

excellent, again.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Thanks! I personally prefer succinct videos so glad others like them too!

[@rogerelzenga4465]

Well that just answered my question while designing a all weather enclosed sailboat...

[@SailingTipsCa]

LOL and you’re in luck there’s one for sale!!! www.bernard-gallay.com/news-imoca-60-hugo-boss-new-listing-for-sale

[@zatgeye7320]

Great vid. Something about Hugo Boss, Mercedes’ and all black livery gives me a 1930’s feel.

[@SailingTipsCa]

LOL thanks! Some have decried the Hugo Boss of the ‘30s and hopefully we’re in a better place now!

[@normanfawley7379]

Very interesting.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Glad you liked it!

[@paulgush]

Another reason for chamfers at the hull-deck sheer is to reduce aero drag. I first noticed it on the America's Cup IACC yachts, but I think some dinghies, like the Vanguard 15 had it before then

[@SailingTipsCa]

Aerodynamic drag is definitely a factor at the speeds these boats are going!

[@tinolino58]

@@SailingTipsCa you mean true airspeed?

[@SailingTipsCa]

@@tinolino58 These boats are sailing in up to 100km/h of apparent wind, so the designers and engineers also put lots of effort into ensuring that the above-water portions of the boats (e.g. beams) are as aerodynamic as possible to not slow the boat down.

[@tinolino58]

@@SailingTipsCa I remember the deck on the T830 while we did win the Centomiglia on lake Garda about 15 years ago.

[@waterboy8999]

Interesting, thanks.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Glad you liked it!

[@thefinalkayakboss]

Tied this thing up when i was a dockboy at mitchell park, greenport, LI when i was probably 17. That boat is absolutely insane looking up close.

[@SailingTipsCa]

That must have been cool to see!

[@thefinalkayakboss]

@@SailingTipsCa it was. The amount of lines running back to the cockpit is nuts. Never seen a sailboat laid out anything like that. It looked like an old ribbon cable from a 90s computer, all different colors, running down the center of the doghouse back towards the helm. I dont know if its still rigged that way.

[@SailingTipsCa]

@@thefinalkayakboss Wow! The latest Hugo Boss is sailed from the inside, but probably still the “ribbon cable” of lines below decks!

[@mikegrant8490]

Isn't it also a function of the stability of the down wings that create an up force as the overall displacement begins the "pop up" and recovery? That this functionality is part of the survivability paradigm for such seas as the Southern Ocean. That the design was dedicated to the ability to survive and go really, really fast. On the opener of the video view it appeared from the forward angle that she was a bit overcanvassed. It's a balance to keep a tremendously fast pace over ground, seakeeping and safety AND constant attention to the weather and winds and sails aloft. Good explanations for the hull shape.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Alex did also have a broken foil in this video which did result in more water on the deck than usual. I think their rule of thumb for sail selection is to size for the average conditions and the boat will “self depower” in gusts by spilling wind.

[@isaaco5679]

That's how my dad's racing canoe bow is shaped. Real sketchy in bad weather when the waves almost go over the top.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Yes you really want predictability when waves are going over the top!

[@Alastair510]

That pitchpole snippet is really terrifying!

[@SailingTipsCa]

I know - best to avoid that!!!

[@markhenry2826]

Well done...

[@SailingTipsCa]

Thanks!

[@alx-vla4986]

Each class has different measurement factors (rules), IOR...IMS are measuring the hull on the waterline, so the design allows to ad length forward to have a larger headsail or backwards with juppette and other artefacts, for IMOCAS and the like, has total length fixed (box rule) so, the bow becomes vertical, so it is the stern. before all other considerations, the class rules are shaping our boats.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Yes the class rules definitely play a significant role!!!

[@rydenkaye9735]

One thing I’ll add is classes that measure by the waterline get additional benefit from overhang because it actually increases waterline when healed. This is huge in the design of older meter class boats with their massive overhanging bows and sterns

[@mhgscrubadub9917]

No I am not asking any of those questions but im glad to listen

[@SailingTipsCa]

The strong silent type!

[@johnyan3328]

@Sailling, this tech I called " #Active real-time attack angle regulation" technology. It can be used in next generation wind turbine. The core tech of next generation wind turbine is that the blades angle of each blades always can be adjusted according to the position of blade, moving speed, wind direction and wind speed.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Yes the technology definitely exists, it’s just a matter of whether the class rules of a given type of boat allow it. Basically the more automation they allow the more it benefits the teams with the most money, so there tend to be rules limiting what can actively be controlled to manage costs and allow the teams with less money to still be competitive.

[@johnmiranda2307]

Who knew? That was fantastic

[@SailingTipsCa]

Glad you liked it - thanks for watching!

[@m4rvinmartian]

I have no interest in sailing, but YT algo threw this in my feed. Interesting since I have a fluid dynamics background. 👍

[@SailingTipsCa]

Cool! Definitely lots of fluid dynamics involved in sailing!!! You might also enjoy the Sailrocket video! How Did Vestas Sailrocket 2 Smash the Sailing Speed Record?!?! kzbin.info/www/bejne/gWTQYWltaJZ1h7s

[@Batmanananana]

thnx

[@geob0324]

The "upside-down bow" is also featured on the DDG-X ships.

[@SailingTipsCa]

And the Zumwalt-class destroyers, although I think they use it more for reducing their radar signature…

[@rydenkaye9735]

Disappointed you didn’t mention l’occitan’s scow bow I think it would have been super relevant to this conversation

[@SailingTipsCa]

That's a great topic for another video - scow bows! I wanted to focus this video on reverse-sheer bows because they are also appearing in more mainstream production boats.

[@AuzFrog]

Dunno about winglets.. But always thought about deflectors near the deck line with a positive angle of attack. Creating resistance to the dive, and lift to get out ..Outwardly curved as well ..redirecting the water laterally and downward to add thrust so that it generate more lift to come back out of the water.!? think about a combination of a wing with a waterjet deflector.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Do you mean kind of like lifting strakes?

[@AuzFrog]

@@SailingTipsCa Yes for the idea! But smaller and on the front.. And much more sophisticated..

[@tinolino58]

That was my first thought as well. Regards from aviation

[@SailingTipsCa]

@@tinolino58 I’m a closet aviation buff as well, and the concept of lift on airplane wings was one of the things that attracted me to sailing! Plus boats are slightly more practical (e.g. you can camp on them) and cheaper than planes!

[@agustincastellano6794]

What would be good to see, i think are some schemes or sketches, drawings, that explain wwath you are talking about along with the images and videos, i like te video

[@SailingTipsCa]

Thanks - I’ll try to incorporate your feedback into future videos!

[@ghostindamachine]

cool !

[@SailingTipsCa]

Glad you liked it!

[@roberts.wilson1848]

Imagine having boats like these made like 1000 or 2000 years ago. Imagine the mighty naval empires seeing some crazy stuff like this and then receiving some small but highly potent flammable chemical fires shots that don't extinguish with water. ^_^ The black pearl from pirates of the carribean , rising from beneath the waves ^_^

[@SailingTipsCa]

I’m sure they wouldn’t believe their eyes!!!

[@peterjohnstaples]

Hugo Boss was missing the starboard Foil in those shots.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Yes it was - still did very well in the race!!!

[@thekinginyellow1744]

Military Naval architects knew all this bow stuff more than 100 years ago. I think the reason we're only seeing it now in sailing craft is because only now has sail design made sailing vessels fast enough for it to matter.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Yes and construction techniques have also contributed by making boats light enough to sail fast!

[@jerrykinnin7941]

I'm fascinated by sailboats but I'm inland so not many around.

[@SailingTipsCa]

You’ll just have to get one of these then! www.blokart.com

[@brettnaugher2176]

A displacement hull always will work it's way down into the water because of the hydro vacume that has a hull speed that it can't overcome. I sailed a Morgan 40' in a 20 kt wind under full sail and it made a hole in the water the faster it went ( keel boats won't get up and plane away AT ALL). I bet that by theory a keel boat would eventually be swallowed whole by the water if pushed hard enough.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Yes you’re right about displacement boats digging a big hole in the water and not being able to go any faster. The mechanism is more due to the waves generated by the boat than vacuum though. Once a displacement boat is a hull speed the rigging is likely to break because the loads increase exponentially once the boat is at hull speed. If the rigging doesn’t break the boat would likely be knocked over and possibly swamp. There are also semi-displacement keelboats that can exceed hull speed by a few knots and planing hull designs like Hugo Boss that can go even faster. Most sport boats (e.g. Melges, Flying Tiger) have planing hulls and can easily exceed the hull speed without digging a big hole in the water. They are generally light and have flat bottoms that can climb up onto the water like a ski boat.

[@rykehuss3435]

0:50 there's some exceptions like hydrofoils which constantly break speed records and beat any sailing yacht on speed, easily. The best hydrofoil cats are hitting speeds in excess of 50 knots, try doing that on your yacht.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Except that the around the world and 24 hours speed records are still held by non-foiling boats. The foiling boats that are hitting 50 knots are doing it for very short periods in very controlled conditions. Check out this video: How Fast Can a Foiling Sailboat Actually Go?!?!? kzbin.info/www/bejne/iYiqc5qIlLOjaac

[@rykehuss3435]

@@SailingTipsCa Obviously around the world and 24 hour sailing for records as well as 50 knot foiling cats are not what the average sailer is doing. Theyre all extreme examples of sailing. It'd be nice to compare some average speeds of some more reasonably sized vessels, perhaps in the 30-40 feet range.

[@SailingTipsCa]

I personally know of two 8-10M trimarans with lifting foils and the owners of them do say there are more effective ways to improve boat speed, like canting rigs and rotating wing masts. The Australian OMR rating system also doesn’t rate foils (i.e. you can add foils to your boat with no rating change) and yet the foiling boats aren’t stealing the podium. There is a foiling kit available for my F-82R, but it adds about 10% to the weight of the boat, which is significant when I can feel a performance difference with the weight of each additional crew member. So my point with this video was that foiling is hard, and not always faster, contrary to what lots of people think, and initially myself included!

[@rykehuss3435]

@@SailingTipsCa Thanks for the insights!

[@rykehuss3435]

3:41 look at that angle, thats crazy

[@SailingTipsCa]

I know, need to ensure everything is lashed down and you’re holding on tight!

[@morethan3756]

An X Bow or inverted bow sailboat would be interesting.

[@SailingTipsCa]

That would certainly be efficient for sailing in a straight line but deep submerged bows can make it difficult to tack!

[@poly_hexamethyl]

Maybe they ought to try a sailboat designed like a submarine, with the entire hull submerged and only the sails above the water. That might have less drag and be less affected by waves. How the sailor would control the sails is another question though... :-)

[@SailingTipsCa]

I think it might be hard to tack with all that resistance under water! ;-)

[@IsaacKuo]

Maybe the sailor could stand on a small raised disc around the mast? Think something like sailboarding, but the board is a tiny disc and buoyancy is provided by the submarine hull? Edit added: For basic stability, I think a submarine hull would need outriggers. So, a long bar for the outriggers is attached to the mast. Basically, it's a trimiran, but the main center hull is underwater. Superficially, it looks like a cat with bizarrely small outriggers.

[@sam1812seal]

Bit confused - I get the different bow shapes. All of them were tried on boats big and small in the early 20th century, but I thought the whole reason for foil boats was that they break the 1.34 x √waterline length rule so that waterline length is less of a limiting factor for boat speed?

[@SailingTipsCa]

Boats that plane like waterski boats and multihulls with long skinny hulls can also easily surpass the 1.34 x waterline length rule without foils. The main reason for foils is to reduce hull drag and gain performance in moderate winds, expected to be about 10-20% by designers of the IMOCAs and Ultimes. So an IMOCA that can do 22 knots planing in a given wind at a given point of sail should be able to do 26-27 with foils. But the benefits of foils are reduced in lighter and heavier winds.

[@sam1812seal]

@@SailingTipsCa thank you so much for replying

[@SailingTipsCa]

@@sam1812seal You’re welcome, and thanks for watching! If you haven’t already seen it you should check out this video which explains more about foiling boats: How Fast Can a Foiling Sailboat Actually Go?!?!? kzbin.info/www/bejne/iYiqc5qIlLOjaac

[@ryanjohnson3615]

I think you are just showing off your awesome plumb bow boat model...

[@SailingTipsCa]

LOL you’re exactly right!!!

[@thebentley71]

How come they haven't built a true SWATH sailboat yet. I hope you can answer this question or maybe even make a video about it.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Interesting question! I think the primary benefit of a SWATH boat (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small-waterplane-area_twin_hull) is to mimimize the impact of small or moderate waves on the motion of the vessel, so it would solve the pitching problem. However, catamarans are fastest when they can lift the windward hull out of the water and reduce wetted surface and drag, whereby a SWATH always has both hulls in the water, so would be slower due to increased wetted surface. A sailboat also needs to be able to pivot relatively quickly about its center of lateral resistance (e.g. daggerboard, keel) in order to tack, so sailboat bows are typically not submerged very much at rest. I suspect a SWATH would be too slow to turn with all that underwater surface and would wind up head to wind in irons if it had sails. It would also be more expensive to build!

[@staguar]

The video of the boat flipping forward is terrifying

[@SailingTipsCa]

I know - best to avoid that!

[@seadog686]

Can't say that I'm a big fan of the all black sails & hull.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Would definitely be hot on the feet in the sun!!!

[@malin5468]

I think it partially depends on the rules. Most racing yachts, whether multihull or monohull, are designed to fit a box rule which limits overall length, but not waterline length. If there was a rule that limited waterline length but not overall length, as in the radio controlled 10 Rater model yachts, they might look rather different. Imagine the IMOCA class with a rule that only limited waterline length. I suspect that they would have bow overhangs. It is interesting that the ill-fated Team Philips had modest overhangs. I think that Larry Ellison’s Oracle BMW trimaran in the America’s Cup also had overhangs, since the rule limited waterline length, not overall length. I would submit (humbly, since I only sail rc multihulls) that a class that limits mast height or sail area and does not restrict length will produce a faster and safer boat than the current “box” rules. I would be interested in your thoughts.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Yes it does partly depend on the rules, but plumb bows or those with a slight reverse sheer do behave far more predictably when submerged. Bow overhangs create a very noticeable and sometimes dangerous increase in drag when submerged, which rapidly slows the boat and can lead to pitchpole. My F-82R trimaran has plumb bows with a very rounded top surface and are perfectly smooth all the way around (i.e. no flange) so they submerge and come right back up without slowing the boat. Production Farrier designs like the F-24 or F-27 have slight bow overhangs and a noticeable flange at the deck/hull joint which by comparison creates considerable drag when submerged compared to my bows. When Ian Farrier designed the F-85SR to maximize performance under the New Zealand 8.5M rule (multihull.org.nz/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/Open-8pt5-Class-Rule.pdf) he designed a slight reverse sheer bow to create a boat that was as fast as possible and could be pushed hard without any bad habits. I really like my plumb bows, especially when we’re sailing hard and overtaking waves, because they behave very well.

[@ktaylor9095]

is it normal for the Hugo Boss to look like it's getting massively overpowered, as in 3:41? Isn't that a really aggressive heel? Is spilling that much wind a deliberate substitute for reefing in this design?

[@SailingTipsCa]

Making sail changes on large singlehanded boats like this is both time-consuming and dangerous, having only one person on board, so there’s a tendency to rig for the average forecasted conditions, and put up with spilling wind in gusts. I suspect if Alex expected the conditions to stay like that for a while he would reef, but if it were just a temporary gust he’d probably just hold on and let it pass.

[@ktaylor9095]

@@SailingTipsCa Thanks for the explanation. I think I missed the single handed context. The thought of doing a sail change under those conditions single handed scares the heck out of me.

[@SailingTipsCa]

@@ktaylor9095 I know me too!!!

[@gshaindrich]

1:33 That just doesn´t add up, take a close look! Here the wood block model is in a much more realistic position than flat. And then you gonna tell everyone about the upsides of a plumb bow, when they ACTUALLY mostly drive (at their highest speed) strongly leaning to one side and therefore creating a very much more exaggerated bow overhang than on traditional raked bows.

[@SailingTipsCa]

The block is actually a poor model because the bow angle when looking down from the top is 90 degrees with sharp 45 degree hard transition to the sides of the “boat” which would actually lift the bow out of the water when heeled over. In actual fact it probably should have been more like 30 degrees at the bow and transitioning seamlessly into the rest of the boat, so the bow wouldn’t be lifted out of the water!

[@gshaindrich]

@@SailingTipsCa a simplified model yes, but regardless of the angle and transitions, the point was when partly on its side it has a completely different shape that interacts with the water and NO more plump bow! SO why falsely claim that that "wouldn’t" lift the bow out of the water? Of course it DOES! Also anytime and any distance the hull submerges further than necessary it DOES (other than falsely claimed in the video) strongly slow the vessels forward momentum because simple physics: Water is about 800 times MORE dense than air! 800 times! So in any case when going for speed you wouldn´t want to be farther into the water when you can avoid it.

[@SailingTipsCa]

@@gshaindrich There are two kinds of “friction” the hull encounters with the water - surface friction and wave friction. The former is more of an issue at lower speeds, so yes you want more of the hull out of the water, but as the boat goes faster the wave friction becomes the predominant factor in slowing the boat, and this is where a longer immersed hull goes faster. Probably a better explanation here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hull_speed

[@mjstrzelecki7207]

Tak jakby lekko nieświeże wiadomości i wnioski. O puntach (pustakach) jeszcze nie słyszałeś?

[@trivialinsignific]

always check your plug before backing down the ramp "capt mastbeam"

[@SailingTipsCa]

Good suggestion!

[@hamidrezakhosroabadi3290]

Well I had no idea.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Hopefully now you do!

[@zcrazyg9114]

That was my boat in boyscouts.

[@SailingTipsCa]

That must have been a cool boy scout troop!!!

[@zcrazyg9114]

@@SailingTipsCa 🤣😂 i hope someone got a chuckle outa that.

[@SailingTipsCa]

@@zcrazyg9114 There’s also a land-based version for those who aren’t into water: wiki.scouts.ca/en/Kub_Kars

[@kiereluurs1243]

The boat seems to tilt more than 45 degrees. Hard to hang on to!

[@SailingTipsCa]

Yes they trim for the average forecast conditions but do get knocked over a bit in gusts!

[@MrGuarf]

Me, who’s never sailed a day in my life: Interesting. 🤔

[@SailingTipsCa]

Cool - you should try it sometime!

[@robertcain3426]

Because the bow is not full enough. The future is full and slim in height - thickness. When the boat is under full power and is healed over the bow point will be engaged less and not slow the speed of the boat.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Yes newer bow shapes for monohulls are much fuller, although multihulls still use the “knife edge” approach.

[@vyrusnationgaming1999]

My girlfriend call me Hugo Boss because I cut through that moisture like a pro.

[@SailingTipsCa]

LOL that's funny!!!

[@renaykung3542]

AWESOME

[@SailingTipsCa]

Thanks for watching!

[@Sl4yerkid]

ok so the problem is that there is not enough boyancy in the front of the boat then, that would solve all the problems, and allow you to have the traditional more efficient front bow

[@SailingTipsCa]

More buoyancy might lead to more pitching which would slow the boat down, so a balancing act!!!

[@wordreet]

It's much calmer under water, less bouncing up and down from those annoying waves. Unless it's kinda shallow!

[@stingtheweimaraner]

Just don’t go too deep with a carbon fibre boat!!!

[@SailingTipsCa]

That sounds so much nicer below the surface!

[@TheScience69]

I did Nat see that coming.

[@SailingTipsCa]

The pitchpole?

[@trivialinsignific]

because its on the verge of sinking - you see, it has to do with the fundamentals of dragging the anchor, shipboard clarity and the galley, they have to really work together in unison you must have enough money and think of your self highly enough to stand on the bridge yelling "stroke" stroke" stroke" then and only then do you become a true matey - you see, one doesnt race yachts, the yachts race one, pushing you to your limits trying your sea bound prowess and extraordinary skills that keeps you in your own wind, and never seizing to amaze yourself -

[@SailingTipsCa]

That’s profound!

[@cortleyjames]

Submarining fun

[@SailingTipsCa]

Definitely a wet ride, unless you're inside!

[@cortleyjames]

I have a New York 32

[@SailingTipsCa]

Wow - I admire people who put the time into looking after boats like that!!!

[@Sittin.]

2:44 What you mean is: You wanna really, really, really wanna zigazig ah

[@SailingTipsCa]

LOL!!!

[@markbailey6051]

Put wings on it and fly over the waves

[@SailingTipsCa]

Like one of those wing in ground effect (WIG) aircraft!

[@paracite187]

because its an U-go Boss?

[@SailingTipsCa]

LOL that’s a good one!

[@tomaszjachymekedukacja5407]

Prawda korespondencyjną, dotarła, ale teorii prawd znam tylko 10 i wariacje 😉

[@ShannanLynes]

Length at the waterline is only helpful for speed for displacement vessels like a typical monohull. Hugo Boss is a planning vessel and diving under the waves in no way helps them go faster. Even you say they go slower at one point. Here is a current video (kzbin.info/www/bejne/qZa1iIV3o6qdbsU) from The Ocean Race 2023 with two boats fighting out this very point. They boat that keeps it's bow out of the water, the boat that stays above the waves and even shortens it's length at the waterline by more than 50% is much faster than the boat with additional drag. AKA Maritiza beats 11-hour for this exact reason. Maximizing the waterline length is exactly backwards of what Boss would choose to do. More water = more drag. Many of your other statements are correct about pitching but your main point seems off the mark IMO. Love most of your other videos.

[@SailingTipsCa]

The IMOCAs in the 2023 Ocean Race have lifting foils which keep the bow out of the water at speed and completely change the design parameters. They don’t have T-foil rudders so the stern still planes, but as you noted the goal with these boats is to keep the hull out of the water as much as possible. Malizia also has more of a scow bow than 11th hour which excels in certain conditions. Alex Thomson’s 2016 Hugo Boss from this video was an earlier generation which also had foils, but wasn’t designed to fly with the bow above the water full time at speed like the current boats, so waterline was important for that boat, and still is for the current boats when they are below foiling speed. So while you don’t see them so much on IMOCAs anymore, wave-piercing reverse-sheer bows are still the current design trend for fast non-foiling multihulls.

[@chandrasekharlimit4547]

The boat cutting through the water is cool af lol

[@SailingTipsCa]

I agree it does look pretty cool! Good thing Alex is inside otherwise he’d be wet and cold!

[@HippasosofMetapontum]

we should go back to ancient boats xD

[@SailingTipsCa]

Some say sailing is one of the oldest human professions!

[@robertlaird6746]

Might not have enough positive bouncy

[@SailingTipsCa]

I think there's a balancing act with positive buoyancy - you want enough to keep the bows up but not so much as to introduce excessive pitching. I think the scow bow which maximizes buoyancy is a good topic for another video!

[@R00RAL]

The shear weight of sails up front ..

[@SailingTipsCa]

Definitely some weight from those!

[@R00RAL]

@@SailingTipsCa Get your crew to sit up near the Helm on the Gunwale.

[@SailingTipsCa]

@@R00RAL Only one crew on HB in this video so I’m sure he’d rather stay dry and not get swept overboard!

[@R00RAL]

@@SailingTipsCa Hi, yes I realised I made that mistake when I realised which yacht you were talking about. Take care.

[@SailingTipsCa]

@@R00RAL They do sail crewed sometimes too!

[@trivialinsignific]

yo ho ho, never forget the cotter pin on the propeller shaft nut if you wish to reverse you current situation " capt caveman"

[@SailingTipsCa]

That’s assuming you have an engine!

[@samaipata4756]

Because it is a sailing submarine!

[@SailingTipsCa]

LOL that’s definitely what it looks like at times!!!

[@eligebrown8998]

I've never seen a sail boat take a face plant befor

[@SailingTipsCa]

Good thing I made this video then!!!

[@Milo_Estobar]

The chances of me getting lightning strikes are 100x higher than the chance for me getting into sailing...

[@SailingTipsCa]

You’ll be safe on both accounts then!

[@YouTubePurgetheblackplague]

It wanted to be a coral reef

[@SailingTipsCa]

LOL!!!

[@tjstone5623]

Nice

[@SailingTipsCa]

Thanks!

[@thekinginyellow1744]

Do racing yachts use mass dampers? If not, why not? Should work well for stabilizing the vessel in the pitch axis. They worked so well in Formula One that they outlawed. Totally passive so shouldn't come afoul of most rules. The only reason they outlawed in F1 is because Ferrari didn't invent them.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Interesting question! These boats have canting keels which they can move laterally beneath the boat with a hydraulic ram to counter the heeling forces of the sails, but I don’t think it’s quite the same thing as the mass dampers in F1 because canting keels are typically static unless moved deliberately by the crew.

[@Cypher7765]

“Budget wouldn’t allow” - bro, next time, let me know what you want. I’ll model it out and 3d print it for you. Seriously, just message me.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Nice - I might take you up on that!!! I guess a full-scale model of Hugo Boss is out of the question ;-)

[@Cypher7765]

@@SailingTipsCa do so mate. If you DM me now (not sure how on here) I can give you my email and can see about sending stuff whenever 👍

[@SailingTipsCa]

@@Cypher7765 I haven’t figured out DM-ing either on this platform! At some point I’ll add an email address to my “About” section which should make things easier…

[@Cypher7765]

@@SailingTipsCa yep you do that and I’ll drop you an email on it 👍👍

[@SailingTipsCa]

@@Cypher7765 Sounds good!

[@scottklandl488]

You want performance. Solve the roll. That boat is 28 degrees to starboard. Talk a out power losses

[@SailingTipsCa]

Definitely want to minimize that! The issue faced by Alex (and other singlehanders) on these powerful boats is that sail changes are time consuming and dangerous, so they put up what they think is the right amount of sail for the forecast conditions, and just let the boat heel and spill wind for those moments it’s overpowered. If it was forecast to be like this for the next few hours he’d probably reef or reduce sail, but not for momentary puffs.

[@seththebeatmxchine]

"The most notable downside of a flared bow is speed because as many of you know..." Ahhh sir...little do you know how little do I know.

[@SailingTipsCa]

LOL - targeting videos at audiences is tricky because you really can’t many any assumptions which I clearly did!!!

[@seththebeatmxchine]

@@SailingTipsCa No I was just trying to be funny dude you're video was awesome. It popped in my recommendeds I have no idea why but it was really interesting.

[@SailingTipsCa]

@@seththebeatmxchine LOL - glad you found it interesting!!!

[@mini696]

Also his foil was broken.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Yes and it’s amazing he still managed the second fasted IMOCA time ever having sailed 2/3 the distance with only one foil!

[@matthewlabadie9614]

It is not very clear what you mean by an “upside down knife”. There are literally thousands of knives and ways to view a knife and I do not know what you are trying to say. Can you explain with another example?

[@SailingTipsCa]

A good early example of inverted water-shedding bows were those on the America’s Cup AC72 boats, so if you Google “AC72 Bow” and look at images you will see they look kind of like inverted steak knives. Does this help?

[@crapisnice]

keel boats are WHALE KILLERS and you forgot scow bow or rounded bow and balanced bow-stern buoyancy design

[@SailingTipsCa]

Scow bows would be a great topic for another video! I’ve never know of a keel boat killing a whale although we’ve come uncomfortably close (unintentionally) a few times so I suppose it’s possible. The seem to be pretty good at staying out of the way…unless they’re sleeping…

[@kiereluurs1243]

I don't get the knife story. It doesn't make sense to me. I expect it to make things worse.

[@SailingTipsCa]

Think of it this way: the boat “wants” to float above the water, but has a harder time doing that with several tons of water holding it down. The inverted knife edge bow allows those tons of water to roll off much more easily, which in turn allows the boat to float back up to the surface.