Why Raid Finder is actually a GOOD thing for Cataclysm Classic

[@Scottejaye]

Get your Classic Fresh and Hardcore levelling guides (Obviously Cata/Retail also!) You can grab them here. Use Code Scottejayefresh at checkout for 15% off! - www.restedxp.com/ref/scottejaye/

[@Kelvryn]

raid finder is great for those of us who don't like raiding but still want to see the content.

[@nexusobserve]

never clicking any links on youtube to support creators. you get money for filming for 4 seconds

[@Nyaxish]

i have no probs with Raid Finder but with the loot system.... Raid Finder NEEDS personal loot so i hope they atleast change this with the start of Raid Finder

[@BillieSebastian]

Maybe wow is not for you then...

[@drakes4471]

100% agreed. During retail cataclysm people were queuing up with guilds and friends and "needing" on all gear and trading it amongst themselves.

[@Nyaxish]

@@BillieSebastian because i say personal loot is needed if they bring Raid Finder? I played back then in Cata aswell and when RF came out we went in with 15-20 ppl with our guild so we can need on everything and have a higher chance of getting gear for others... Sure not so n1 but everyone did this so u had to be VERY VERY VERY lucky or do it aswell... Personal loot would change this to the better... Learn about WoW then talk

[@kreaturekie6753]

Personal loot is cancer

[@Nyaxish]

@kreaturekie6753 for raid finder? Not rly

[@Spotnick2]

The problem with LFR is always the same problem, it's a terrible introduction to raiding and it killed the casual guilds. They introduced normal mode later (and flexible raids) and that is a much better experience. It would be much better to not do LFR and introduced normal/flex raids instead.

[@healmist5721]

Love to see that come true but 12yrs adter LFR says It haven't worked on Practice.

[@steveclews]

Casual dad here, LFR is a double edged sword, on one hand you have quick, easy content that can be done at any time, on the other hand it removes a layer of community, getting on disc, with a pug, or guildies and knowing certain characters. Community is more WoW than LFR

[@talmbout7779]

AGRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRREEEEEEEEEEE

[@imlazydude5144]

You know that LFR and actual DS have different IDs? You wanna just do both

[@steveclews]

@imlazydude5144 I know man, it's just another layer removed

[@andreaskarlsson5251]

​@@imlazydude5144doesnt change that with every little change like this slowly kills the MMO aspect of the game.

[@patrickstrasser9736]

I personally used RF for every expansion I raided mostly to gear alts. That being said, I was always one of those raiders in a "casual guild" and raid finder helped us all to get enough gear to be able to continue through normal modes and into heroics. My group didn't down a single heroic end boss.... until dragon soul. As for people complaining about raid finder destroying social interactions... some of us can't do social interactions very well and forcing us to participate by locking all decent gear (and legendary quests in MoP) behind being social so that the people who are naturally good at socializing have someone to complain about in discord feels bad. To be honest, if I have to "do the bare minimum" of responding to an LFG and joining discord and trying my best to not make a single mistake ever.... yeah, I'll find something else to do.

[@CapOfXav]

I swear... every "bad" implementation that has ever happend to WoW since its release, classic KZbinrs are adamant to make a video about how its actually not that bad :P

[@treijhen]

It should be in for one of exactly what you say in the video and remain for the casuals to raid. It also has a third set of gear with different colored visuals from normal and heroic gear for transmog. It’s literally a place to get your feet wet and teach you the raid to get you confident to try normal and heroic, As a hardcore player it can be useful if you’re battling the roster boss and you see someone from your server doing excellent in the raid finder, you might be able to hype them up to join your guild.

[@henrybustos6974]

Little off topic but this made me think of in game gdkp. Gear is bid off by ui (can only bid what you have and gold is auto taken when you win). Then after last item is bid off you just get the gold in your bag.

[@colby-wankenobi2940]

I like raid finder. It let me raid when I hadn't previously experienced that part of the game. I won't die on this hill because I'm happy on my own pro-raid finder hill.

[@BTG514]

When they added dungeon finder in WotLK I figured LFR would be an inevitability. In MoP, RF was essential for farming the legendary cloak quest chain items long after the guild had ceased running the older raids to focus on SoO. As a catchup mechanic it's ok because the experience is often very 'zug zug, win or quit'.

[@gliboperuta9213]

as a casual guildless (most guild quit after wotlk) cata player i would love raid finder since i havent done a single raid in cata yet because i didnt feel motivation to invest myself into the expansion. but i am still very curious how the cata raiding is like. and from doing 5 man heroics often i think i could test my class to its full potential and enjoy game more and maybe even get an upgrade and become motivated to find a raiding guild if i would enjoy the raiding experience.

[@Crossfade1625]

Couldn’t you find/make some normal pugs though? Why specifically would LFR motivate you to try raiding

[@gliboperuta9213]

@Crossfade1625 its easier to click button. i never raided in cata so i am clueless where to even begin. i have like 360 itemlevel from heroics or something like that and the color of my number is purple in that addon. also i usually play after midnight so chat is not as active then. they use some weird abbreviations i am unfamiliar with.

[@Xzola]

I mean if just reading chat channels and whispering a dude trying to fill a normal Firelands run is too much for you already, do we need to cater the experience to that really?

[@DominickDecocko]

then you will quit and alt f4

[@adigis17]

I'm semi-casual (already did full FL NM and trying heroics) and I'd love to have this instead of finding a guild that already have solid stacks for raiding or waiting for pugs to group for hours. + muc more ppl would actually see and touch raiding content which is a good thing IMO.

[@Shiirow]

the only people against tools like LFR and LFG have main character syndrome who believe themselves to have some imaginary social standing. the ones who used to sit in major cities afk imaging that people were drooling over their 'cool gear'. if everyone can get similar looking 'cool gear', its makes theirs less special and unique. a very small and very very vocal minority of people.

[@Crossfade1625]

I mean I’m against them because of the general lack of any social factor (in LFR’s case it also means people won’t be forces to find a guild and therefore friends) and the fact that now people can play the whole game sitting in their capital

[@noob2gosu]

Transmog is already a thing , you could have great gear or shit gear no one would know and few would care. Reason why lfr is bad its People toxic nature.. and the fact it would be another "chore" to do for people with multiple characters and "fomo"

[@c2thewick]

I want LFR in all versions of wow, I'm 42 and I just don't have the time to spend 9 hours a week listening to strangers complain in discord

[@viniciusilvaborges]

Im already giving up bc of this ... I dont have time to make friends bc i dont play too much

[@NickPlays95]

Same here

[@ejt2038]

I found a really good team but my schedule sucks so I need to bail every other week on them and they leave me in the dust and I end up leeching and missing out on gear cause of a lack of dkp pts

[@nexusobserve]

100% when people get along and chat, nothing gets done and people play runescape or FPS's because 2 guildies learned they play the same games. when people are focussed and downing bosses, someone will cause drama. Either because of loot or personal issues.

[@Tainted0ne1138]

You can easily pug most forms of content in both retail and classic. Normal and heroic aren't hard in classic and Normal and heroic are easily puggable in retail. Even pugging half of the mythic raid is easy without discord.

[@Lucitt13]

I work nights. So trying to find a guild that raids between 08:00 and is finished by 14:00 is dang near impossible.

[@Mirceabalea]

I agree. I'm 45 working a full time job and I don't have the time to progress with a bunch of neckbeards that complain in discord about green or blue parses. I'd rather do a chill raid in LFR where you can just ignore mechanics and get free loot. I use video games as a tool to chill, not as tool to get validation from strangers that I managed to kill the X boss 5 sec faster than another dude.

[@timobr0]

ok boomer

[@healmist5721]

Can get completly curried on LFR, ingoring mechanics or failing hard on dps? Not the first 1-2 months of the LFR.

[@SaarimaaSauli]

I remember when LFR came with Dragon Soul, I was actually very excited for this feature since my guild had quit during original cata. However, I remember how horrible the whole experience was compared to the raids I had been used to. It was very chaotic, people were rude to each other, or left constantly, not great content for anyone.

[@Zook1373]

I see the pros and cons. For the casual dads it would be a good addition but I don’t like feeling forced to do it otherwise I’ll feel like I’m behind.

[@mr.blizzy4101]

honestly I like the idea of raid finder, its another way to play other toons without having to worry about not being selected because another class has a higher gs then you an its another way to get alts geared faster without having to spend days where you don't have enough time to grind dungeons all day an night lol, especially when your main is in a committed run an cant find other runs that can at least clear the whole raid reliably

[@ethelion5000]

Idk personally can't imagine anything worst for a casual pug than queing into a hardcore group, probably die to a simple mechanic and flamed, have floor pov of them killing the boss then having all items needed by the group to be traded among themselves. I say this as a hardcore player who'll enjoy RF cause I got no life but that's just me.

[@MSnow-pu4qs]

RF is necessary evil if anything tbh. With the change to how you get your tier in t13 you can spend months without 4pt13. By that I mean that in t12 you can literally buy 3 out of 5 pieces of your set. In t13 you need to loot all 5 of them from the raid. IF they're gonna change the way you acquire your tier set, I don't see a reason why you should add RF at all.

[@rubenloza1920]

People are going to be mega crying over this one, Mr. Jaye, but you are right. Currently, classic Cara is bleeding the more normalish level players, and LFR adds retention. Not to mention asking to cut content... who does that??

[@Iggybart05]

that last part is the part i find hilarious... "I'LL BE FORCED TO DO IT!!!" while at the same time whining "THERE'S NUTHIN TO DOOOOOO"

[@darrenstringer2211]

I found the only issue with raid finder was the mechanics being removed, either totally or so much they could just be ignored. This meant you didnt learn anything about how a boss works. If they did do raid finder then add the mechanics so they give ppl the chance to learn the mechanics, this allows casuals to possibly enter a normal/hc run and not feel like a noob.

[@DominickDecocko]

dragon soul had full mechanic.

[@homehomehome2]

I don't think raidfinder should be included in the game, mainly because i am concerned about how much of the social interactions would disappear. I like that i get to talk with a lot of different people when setting up / joining a raid, i like that i get to recognize people on my realm from across multiple pugs, and i think that the way things currently work - on my realm atleast - there seems to be plenty of opportuinity for casual players aswell. I don't think raidfinder would add anything valueable to the game besides catering to the people who have less than an hour during the week to organize their raid reset. While i agree that RF would enable more ppl to play, I 100% don't think there is anything wrong with having some minimum criteria in terms of engagement with the game in order to see the end game content. This is something most players would be able to do, and if not, they don't have time to play the end-game of an MMO which is completely fair. However, raiding is just not for them to begin with then, since it will never be just "plug-and-play", even in RF.

[@dfcd1432]

Just make it share a lockout with normal and heroic. Easy fix that solves the issues regular raiders had with it originally in Cata.

[@drakes4471]

You need the raiders with good gear to carry the grp and provide directions on what to use. Many people just afk auto attack in lfr

[@rochellepaws]

The difference between being not being able to complete a 4-set and having access to raid level weapons and trinkets is huge and part of the incentive for players to try raiding at a normal casual level. It's the fundamental bridge between casual solo content you click on a button for and organised group content where you actually have to interact with people and form connections. LFR destroys that bridge and turns WoW into a completely different game where casuals and hardcore never really interact.

[@greenmachineb6528]

Scottie u think they will keep going with ech expan?

[@UhChart]

LFR isnt the problem. They can add it for casuals without a lot of time. I think its a good way for them to see the content. But give it the same ID like normal Raids or make the gear so bad, that the average Raider dont have to do it in the first weeks for Set-pieces, trinkets or sth.

[@01jaredg]

I think raid finder will be great for me because I like having my guilds main raid where we are progging rag now. But I’d also like to raid on my alts but don’t wanna give up my nights to a set schedule

[@nexusobserve]

i play 10 toons at lvl 85 and still think of myself as casual. RFD would be amazing. but they are still going to kick you for low ilvl. I've even been turned away from FL trash farms at 360 because people just dont want to waste ANY time

[@healmist5721]

The only downside LFR has for Wow is that People does not like it to have so many dificulties. From when I left my last guild 10 yrs ago, my wow playstyle is only leveling tons of alts and, geting them to top meters at LFR.

[@DominickDecocko]

Let's accelerate the death of Cata and onward version of "Classic". They will see.

[@supra4lif3]

You always find a way to convince me to play expansions that I didn't want to play! See you in MoP

[@ujustgotpwnd3454]

We are 10000% getting Raid Finder when DS comes out. They said same thing about RDF and it came right on schedule with ICC patch. Plus when legendary cloak questline in MoP without LFR alot of players that don't raid won't be able to finish questline so they obviously gonna add it.

[@user-ss1oc4lq2y]

What is going to happen is semi hardcore guilds are going to have hard time because people quitting raiding for more casual form of raid finder. I think thats what im going to do. Dont realy have time or interest to progress raids 2x4hours when content will only get more difficulty now on. Ofcourse there is normal mode from raids but lets be honest those trade chat normal runs are straight up demon runs. Or hey maybe its just me or burn out from wow but time will tell 😅

[@elie195]

Sorry I got distracted by the clip of the mage CLICKING blink lol

[@DrewAmongTheFence78]

I think they should make sure it is watched by the developers after launch. Don't let a bunch of bad LFR raids from blizzard internal logs happen outside week 1. They just need to make sure it is not a bad experience for people and make the valor reward on the Cata Version WORTH doing for geared characters to give us alternate content and help out the community!

[@ant3181]

I didn't even watch yet, but I think raid rinder is good. I use it because I can't have a set schedule to play and I hate the job interview for pugs. All I want is to play the content. Should have been included on release. They also need warband for factions. Best idea ever.

[@Mapasheeto_]

With MoP coming, I think we should get the end MoP version of LFR, so we could get the good version of flex raiding through all MoP when it releases (the wod prepatch one). Imo, Flex raiding was one of the best raiding modes they could have ever added to wow for most of the semi committed player base. Being able to do N or H not tied to an specific number of raiders, while still doing Mythic with just 20 made it so easy to beat the roster boss lots of small guilds had.

[@56Bagels]

And here we are, at the end of the full circle.

[@TomJoeSHOW]

I genuinely expected lfr for Firelands.

[@drakes4471]

Original LFR started from dragon soul raid onwards

[@jarral9861]

I'm not opposed to raid finder itself, but it should give little or nothing of value for players raiding the current content in normal or heroic. If the rewards were like from the inferno dungeons, meaning items you didn't get when they were current content, cool. Otherwise, assuming you want to get the best out of your char (and that can be true for both casual and progress raiders), you're basically forced to do something you don't enjoy (as Raid finder isn't fun if you're doing regular raids, at least for me).

[@vh9129]

I want firelands lfr now, got some guildies who need the easier way to see all fights and get used to it

[@sreid7886]

They really need to do something, because if they dont implement some new things alot of servers will die. I know mine has since "classic classic" realeased.

[@henrybustos6974]

Im own with rf. Not my fav but w/e.If people want to see the content in eze mode go for it. And like you said it’s content.

[@ZetErjch]

The only problem with raidfinder back in the day was you could waste hours of time because no one is in disc. Mostly no one knows what to do. And lot of people leave after one wipe. Maybe the first one will be not the problem anymore if guys Post discord at the start. And we be random pugs thru lfr

[@mariusquam2410]

its the same still on retail.

[@tamasnagy9235]

LFR is tuned for these special people who wouldnt fit in a normal raid group. The mechanics are very forgiving and it actually takes more effort to die than not to. Bosses will die in LFR even if you play at the very basic level because if there are atleast a few players who can pres their buttons they will kill the boss

[@ZetErjch]

@@tamasnagy9235thats sad. Cause a lot of ppl will then not even try or go AFK i think.

[@tamasnagy9235]

@@ZetErjch Votekicking was still a thing, people can kick AFKs. Also about not trying, that can be said for basically any part of the game. Believe it or not I have more positive experience from LFR than negative ones and I only played it back in mop for legendary questline

[@ZetErjch]

@tamasnagy9235 hm Sounds ok. I Hope they add the wipebuff in cata. So eventually every Boss is killable. Deathwing spine will be fun 😂

[@TwistedSMF]

I think that they should bring back the "Flex" raids. Meaning, Its basically LFR? You just can't Q for it. Totally puggable. And of course, Personal loot. May as well just nip that in the bud before all that happens yet again.... LOL

[@johneibert8328]

well obviously raid finder is good bc you can't find anyone to play with in cata...

[@inplxf]

THISSSS SHOULD BE PINNED HOLY SHIT

[@johneibert8328]

@@inplxf game literally had to launch firelands to gain more players than the seasonal vanilla server...lmao

[@darylsdog9521]

Based.

[@noob2gosu]

​@@johneibert8328 no they launched firelands according to schedule, it was a planned release. Where are you getting your informasion because the roadmap for cata had been on the blizzard site since before launch of cata lol

[@tamasnagy9235]

@@johneibert8328 Fresh is always crowded, Id like to see the actual playerbase anniversary servers have 1 month later when most players will find out that vanilla is super bland and boring lol

[@snacks404]

So basically Blizzard plans to walk back what they said about not putting Raid Finder in Cata Classic, are going to drop 4.3 in the most barebones state possible, and have told the usual suspects to start paving the way for that with KZbin videos about why this is a good thing.

[@vog5197]

you are missing a big advantage of raid finder. DPSers can use it to practise their parses, thats what I used to do in MoP to get high parses.

[@seangraham184]

Don't neg yourself, man -- you aren't tubby, you're fluffy!

[@theoutlander1411]

I'm not going to pretend I know anything, I appreciate the controversial video. We've gone from RDF and Raid Finder bad 5 years ago to RDF and Raid Finder good. Don't worry about what people say Scott, everyone's going to have this opinion a year or two from now. I just find the situation funny going back and watching old videos.

[@PinkkRosey]

LFR would be nice for tmog if anything+ valor

[@NickPlays95]

As someone who raided a lot in 2019 classic / TBC classic, I just can’t find the time these days and I’m really hoping they add raid finder because I haven’t gotten to raid at all in cata

[@albinb4018]

Lfr is fine for the most part,on some bosses it can be frustrating with people with super low dps,and if you get a lot of people that no idea what to do.most bosses you blow right through them.

[@justin9080]

Wouldn't it just be better to make it share a lockout? I'd love to just do raid finder on my alts, but I don't want to HAVE to do it on my main that is raiding with my guild.

[@timcole5055]

I like it for gear alts and having a bit of fun ... so I will raid HC on my main and flick around on a alt or 2 in LFR

[@DrewAmongTheFence78]

LFR only got super horrible once you could not kill bosses until 10 determination stacks. This was mostly a Legion problem from my memory. Could be a few WoD bosses got tuned.

[@drakes4471]

I still remember wiping for an hour on the scorpion boss in seige of orgrimmar raid in mop on lfr

[@nicholasmatassa4684]

Raid finder isn’t bad per se. I just think it failed to do what its original intent was. Which is to make raids more accessible to more people. Certainly it succeeds in just allowing you in the door but it doesn’t do anything to teach mechanics or create meaningful incentives to graduate a “casual afraid to raid in an organized group” player out of it. In its many iterations raid finder was either overtuned for pugs with no organization or so undertuned that you may as well just be killing boars in the forest. Raid finder should have been a sort of tutorial tool to raiding. Blizzard should use it to teach mechanics with visual effects vfx or what have you. Also its reward structure should be completely independent of the normal and heroic modes of the raid. Either by awarding a currency that could be used for gear or completely separate ilvl appropriate gear such that it does not become a “requirement” for people already doing organized raids.

[@jitzu7147]

It should have been introduced as shared lockout with normal.and hero back then... but EVEN with that. The casual player who can only raid 1-2 nights a week will just stick to that, and will give guilds less reason to exist for those players, will be the final nail in the coffin for alliance in cata especially. Due to dwindling numbers and faction imbalance. Also raid burnout happens more frequently. In cata DS specificly it was mandatory to have each and every guildy do it for 4 sets asap casual or not. It doesnt actually give you a sense of accomplishment to beat bosses in this mode, just the gear, and if you dont get the gear its just not fun. You go in and slam your face into a boss by facepulling till you get it down because it is "story-mode" even pugs doing normal mode require a little communication, and you can "choose" the player, and class.

[@Basemon_]

If i were blizzard i wouldn't drop LFR, and at that point then you will have too many raid difficulties. the part of LFR i remember hating the most was using it as second chances at tokens to complete my set pieces. It just became a chore that i had to complete until i didn't have to do it anymore. Your already hitting points of content burnout with having to do heroic/heroic+ dungeons multiple time to get point cap and adding clearing the same raid twice on two difficulties might be too much.

[@vtxshiva]

I would argue it's the opposite. The biggest mistake for WoW historically IS the introduction of variable difficulties like normal/heroic and later LFR/Mythic. With one difficulty, you know you can't make it too hard because not everyone is as capable which means you need room for carrying to balance things off. Likewise through the lower difficulty and the overall slower pace of all content, including crafting, it meant you could bring almost anyone along as long as they were even marginally capable. The first mistake was Naxx 40/Sunwell Plateau which were way too hard compared to everything else. Their answer to that was introducing another difficulty in Wrath which segmented the population. Once that Pandora's box was opened, LFR/Mythic were more or less inevitable. The only way to remove LFR from WoW is to reduce the difficulty of raids and unify it into a single difficulty setting. Anything short of that is pointless. And even then I'd argue it's too late for that since the cat's already out of the bag and you're not putting it back in.

[@gfgbfn]

Just make raid finder share a lockout with normal/heroic. That way nobody actually raiding will feel the need to do it

[@PedroPaulo-if6pq]

No problem with LFR if they dont drop tier nor trinkets or even weapons. Or else, just keep LFR out of classic.

[@ВладиславОстрейко-н7и]

BDW idk how some casual ppl gona do legendary cloac chain if Raid Founder will be unavailable in MOP...

[@drakes4471]

Yeah not just casual players but also alts. Not everyone has time to raid on multiple alts. LFR helps a lot with this.

[@onakaxy]

If you need a reason why lfr is giga shit and still if around: remove the loot rewards from it. Have it be a "introduction" to raiding. It will be dead with the next patch. Because have you ever heard someone say "oh man! I had such a good time in LFR today!" Or rather "mother fucker! No loot this week either, better come here next week so i can get a crappy piece of loot while wanting to claw my eyes out!"?

[@gamingedition5165]

LFR should not rly have its own tier level it should give normal gear at the very least. Offering lower than that means not many will opt for it as its aimed specifically for noobs and anyone geared in lfr gear is automatically looked at as such.

[@noob2gosu]

Lfr is for noobs, if u dont wanna be a noob then dont do lfr.. i dont see the problem here, the reason the gear is bad is because the content is easy, if u want better gear do harder content is the whole purpose to the game...

[@xpotion7686]

If we are gonna say that the target audience of LFR is true casuals then you need to tune the content for true casuals. With Wrath Naxx being arguably the peak for casuals in classic, LFR should be tuned accordingly to support that player base by striping every fight down to 1 simple mechanic + tank n spank, determination should never be needed. This should allow the casuals to get through raids in a very timely manner since the argument is they don't have time to find a group and prog.

[@van7915]

You are literally describing what LFR is

[@FryGuy1013]

I hated how obligated it felt to do raid finder every week for a very low chance at a single item that was good and everything else was complete junk and a waste of time. Maybe if it were like a gdkp raid finder where I could at least get gold if I get nothing useful it would be fine.

[@sargemajorlee]

Love you Scotty, my only problem with this vid, is you mention that LFR is a good way for more casual players to get introduced or experience raid content. But I would argue LFR is not a raiding experience. It's a big dungeon experience. What separates raids from raiding is the connection you have with the other raiders. Buffs, comps, strategies, etc. also determination is atrocious. It's like Blizzard apologizing for you being terrible. You mention in older videos that tier sets and trinkets are insane at any ilvl. Why reward someone for being bad?. I'm not even sweaty, it just feels like it makes the game cheap. The inferno/alpha/gammas really fixed a lot of issues for casual gamers I feel. Keep LFR out 🥴

[@sargemajorlee]

Raid from dungeons*

[@robwojo]

Beta/Alpha/Inferno dungeons are a better catch up mechanic than raidfinder ever was. For me RF was like the soul leaving the game entirely, so when it comes out ill prob just quit cata.

[@shevilwow3396]

Warforging/Titanforging made LFR the worst it ever was. I hope they NEVER bring that back. Thats why they were forced to do it every single week. lfr, normal and heroic as well as mythic, because of the rng chance on WF/TF. lfr on its own is completely fine. its good for currency farming etc.

[@MethSloth]

Why do people get so triggered by a feature that nobody is forcing them to use? You can still group up with people normally.

[@WcSuka]

Remember how you said classic needed LFG it had to have it, then you made a video after it released talking about how people where just auto needing all the loot that dropped to boost their Ilvl? Better get a video que'd up for how bad LFR is going to be.

[@Racerguardguy]

I thought they already said it was NOT going to be added.

[@Blubking1]

No

[@williamcronshaw5262]

@@Racerguardguy didn't the say the same thing about the dungeon finder in wrath?

[@martinboulet7532]

im not gonna be rdy to see lfr Spine of DW and seeing the boss just barrel roll and boom 8+ people are dead happened everytime :P

[@DrewAmongTheFence78]

BEST COMMENT INCOMING: LFR IN MOP IS LITERALLY GREAT. NOT JUST FOR LEGENDARY CLOAK FOR ALTS. IT IS THE MOST FUN PLACE TO GO AND PLAY YOUR CLASS FOR PRACTICE. IT IS SO FUN TO GO BE THE HUGE CARRY DPS PUMPER or TO BE THE TANK THAT SOLO TANKS. MOP LFR as a tank or dps is SO MUCH FUN especially because on high pop Blizzard active realms you can queue in with 10+ people and make people so delighted for a fast LFR clear. I can't say this about expansions after MoP/WoD as much, but I love it in those two expansions. Yes I know I typed that in caps

[@MadProgger]

well MOP lfr is really great, especially things like Durumu/Elegon/Garrosh when it's a full group of ppl who don't know what to do

[@Blubking1]

@@MadProggersiegecrafter

[@Heinous_tv]

NO LFR. If you don’t have enough time to raid in classic cata just play retail. If you don’t like retail then figure out a way to find time to raid normal ( which is super fucking EZ ). If you don’t want to do either then I’d suggest picking up a different game for awhile.

[@stevenursiny]

Can we talk about the lack of rep you get in firelands! its gonna take you 10 weeks just to go from revered to exalted! with the fast expansion this we might be in the next phase before we are even exalted!

[@gamingedition5165]

This!

[@Blubking1]

This

[@chrisgentry4427]

I agree another set of content for people is ok, but the level of toxicity in raid finder is HORRIBLE.

[@daqimber]

@scottejaye i have never had more opposite opinion on a feature in classic LFR should not come to classic , LFR ruins raiding. Argument that casual people can learn the fight/mechanics is not valid , casuals that do not raid will ignore mechanics , die in most fight (because standing in fire is good for them) and then just get loot. I remember it back in original Cata or MoP. Half of the raid were people who had no idea about any of the fight , they did almost no dmg/heal, other half were people who are actually raiding (with their main or atl) and they did carry the first half. IMO , raiding in general is NOT for EVEYONE. Raiding is about puting some effort into it. Read/Watch a guide , get in a casual guild and do normals. Normal mode are really easy, if you put some effort into it.

[@Blubking1]

Raiding is for everyone in classic.

[@vtxshiva]

Raiding was ruined the moment they added a second difficulty to it in Wrath. The whole point used to be you were either into raiding or you weren't. You could beat almost every raid with half the raid being competent, and the other half just barely so. The moment they added heroic mode, is the moment raiding ceased to be a thing. Now it was you were a normal "scrub" raider, or a heroic "elite" raider. Then later it was mythic. LFR does no more damage to the raiding scene than what Heroic, and later mythic, already do to it. And that's not even touching on the community aspect, and how newer wow players approach playing the game, with things like GDKP and other "choices" that erode the integrity and sanctity of the raiding scene.

[@minimohoha]

i did quit cata classic becsoe there was a 0% chanse of me getting the staff since i only pugged raids, if i wanted it i had to pay for it and that was out of the question. if raid finder culd help here idk, i remember i did alot of Raid finder to get my cload. Raid finder is a good thing for the game if you ask me. just 1 problem with it tho alot of people who joins it dont want to lissen if people trying to help them, and that some people kick for beeing new to the game.

[@homehomehome2]

So far i am on the last quest in the chain and i have only pugged it, made a couple of friends in the process aswell. However, i do understand the feeling because i didn't think i could have done it this fast with pugging, but you can do it if you setup your own pugs.

[@hunter-24533]

​@homehomehome2 op is just lazy and doesn't wanna put the small amount of time in to pug 9 people and blow through normals and have his staff in no time

[@Avelek1]

If there is 0 effort from you to actually make your own pug do not be surprised you don't get staff.

[@powerlolzz]

I think it could be extremely fun if Blizzard modifies Determination to be baseline regardless of wiping (and of course maxed-out from the get go). It's trash anyway, who cares.

[@graceybfrg]

People will always strive to do all or nothing. Don’t make budget versions of raids of gear….

[@fen0mem15]

Lfr is good cos everyone is doing gdkp to rmt and 1-2 ppl do sr raids of ruild run,so for thouse who dont pay to this rmt this is solution

[@gnke]

I feel like it leads to more people becoming casuals than casuals coming into WoW. People who clear Firelands HC already probably won't feel any difference, because people in those guilds (or really good pugs) are not interested in going to normal, let alone with god knows who. For people who now raid in casual guilds and pugs though it may change significantly. Right now they are clearing normals and maybe a few hc bosses, if (when) Raid Finder is available, what's the point getting into guild anymore? Or even into pug that, most likely, requires discord? Just slap yourself into queue, go get some food, wait for half an hour and get into the raid with people, who are, at best, just like you simply casuals, at worst are massive hinderance for everyone to drag on. Now, without Raid Finder, you still NEED to go check some guide just to know what the hell is going on so that you are not kicked after the first wipe because you ran into the spiders when Drone is fixated on you (Beth'ilac) or some other shit, with Raid FInder you have ZERO incentive to learn anything, to prepare food/flask/pots etc. and over time this will lead to miserable experience for current casuals (who are still learning the fights, minimally prepare to raid and all that stuff), if anything it might incentivise NOT to prepare because you are not "wasting" time, because someone will probably prepare and tell you what you need to do inside the raid. This way someone else has resonsibility to do all the work and all you do is show up and click a button, whilst having more time to play some other game. That being said, idc if they implement it, as stated, probably nothing would change for me...

[@samdonald741]

Rested XP adds recommence

[@joncfollowell]

It's easy enough. Have LFR be available but you can't run a raid finder raid as well as a standard raid ID. You can choose one or the other but not both. Then there isn't the self imposed 'I must clear LFR' nonsense for normal raiders.

[@drakes4471]

You need the geared raiders in there to compensate for afk auto attacking LFR players and provide instructions on what to do for each boss. Without that LFR will become more painful than what it was.

[@DanielCruzer679]

Yea population dead af since classic re re launch. Bring this asap

[@bobthydead]

Raid finder isn't raiding. It's rolling your face over your keyboard to kill the loot pinata. People can still want that, but don't call it something it's not.

[@seagull7414]

Please add RBG blitz

[@jamaldavis2480]

I disagree! but I'm open minded so I'll watch the vid.

[@Evadar]

Raid finder eleminates guilds. Guilds are what keep the game going. If you want LFR... there needs to be a reason to exist in a guild outside of raiding raid finder.... Example better gear level when in a guild group as opposed to raid finder AFK gearing up.

[@sarphog]

I don't really care what happens in Cataclysm, I don't play it, but this is how you end up with retail You accept a slew of values with the introduction of raid difficulties and conveniences, to the extent that the logical conclusion is basically what retail is. If you advocate for this, your only valid critique of retail will be that it was rushed, not that the ideas behind its systems were wrong. Glad we ironed this out, and I hope you get the Cataclysm/MoP/whatever you want, and that you can make peace with retail. I just hope you don't come crawling to whatever version of Classic we get (hopefully the mythical Classic+) and shove these ideas down our throat

[@chris92like1]

Bad Boomer Gamers always want the path of least resistance 🎉

[@Forbidden_0ne]

Now that the popularity of Cataclysm has peaked, you're suggesting LFR? Yall were perfectly fine with not having Dungeon Finder until near the end of Wrath but now you want Raid finder? ROFLMAO

[@MikeyJ232]

I’m always confused by people who complain about LFR because it’s always the people that don’t ever raid.

[@Shiirow]

no, its always the people that do raid but higher difficulties who complain the loudest. its too easy, the gear is too good, they feel forced to raid LFR for 'tier sets'.

[@MadProgger]

@@Shiirow well the last part though is partially true, since some tier bonuses/trinkets are too good. But at some point blizzard removed tier gear from lfr (but i believe it returned it back in later)

[@joesilveira8468]

I'll come back to play if raid finder is put into the game. Otherwise can't be bothered. No time to commit to a real guild and am over running 5 man's for eternity.

[@BillieSebastian]

That'll be good for the social aspects of the game.. >.>

[@samhain3709]

Wrong. The casual playerbase should atleast be pushed to do normals - because normals are casual. If people think LFR has anything to do with raiding they wont even bother since its shit - the experience for the casual player is shit. Its either a pushover and they think they've "beat the game" = false experience and have no incentive to actually play the game or its a wipefest with noone knowing what they are doing = bad experience except if theres enough non-casual players forced to do that content. I dont want to be forced to do shit content to push casual players through shit content. That was always the problem with them not only with "high end" raiders but all raiders.

[@danielmoroyoqui3298]

LFR kills the social aspect of the game nobody wants to raid lead let alone talk or join a discord for a LFR raid.