Why Season of Discovery Isn't Great | Xaryu Reacts

[@hwlbausch]

The player base ruined this game. Demanding logs for puggable bosses... its like fuck it.

[@andrecardoso6941]

Exactly this!

[@thiccroman]

To them… It’s an automatic waste of time if it isn’t smooth and easy.

[@ejlorbz]

Exactly. Blizz can make all the right moves but the player base just isn't the same anymore

[@オレンジと殺人鬼]

And then making fun of "wotlk kids" who wanted gearscore. Wow playerbase is so lost

[@mramisuzuki6962]

The gatekeepers has kept my 15 bucks in my pocket.

[@bawfuls]

Back In The Day, we'd keep raiding after getting BiS because we enjoyed raiding with our friends and wanted to help them gear up too. Or we started doing more challenges within the raid for achievements. Or we didn't even get BiS before the next raid tier was released.

[@AdjustSZN]

To be fair, Asmon is making it seem like most scenarios involved getting “fully geared” after one or two raids. Even in guild run with SR, I got full BiS just before P2 and when P3 launched I still didn’t have full BiS on my main. Super unlucky with a couple of items.

[@calzord]

@@AdjustSZN Well, he gets gear funneled to him. I like Asmon but these takes are... I agree with @bawfuls I like to keep raiding to help my guild and to grow as a team.

[@eodyn7]

Back in the day? Millions of people still do that every season.

[@FeralKobold]

​@eodyn7 was gonna say this is still the norm lol. Even in the deadest season a couple week from prepatch my guild is still doing chill reclears on alts and helping new people

[@RadarFinsR]

@@AdjustSZN You being serious? with the amount of tier and the lack of upgrade in P3 I was literally full bis on 4th raid every single raid member had full set of tier, and the few upgrades we were chasing were minor. Most of my guild was full bis far before p3 even on alts for gnomer loot maybe minus one single minor item like mechanists gloves or the trinkets. With ST most classes had tier set + 3 items to even upgrade lmao acting like it was hard to gear in P3 is just fucking hilarious to me

[@Bullystout]

People complained about how few tanks and healers were around, blizz makes lock, rogue tanks and adds a mage healer... now some are complaining about having rogue tanks and mage healers.

[@HamHamT]

Tanking sucks no matter the class

[@ATDF1]

making more classes able to tank isn't the solution to that. it just muddles class identity. more people just like dpsing than tanking or healing. especially with parsing being so popular.

[@Voltairus30]

Because everyone wants other people to tank so they don't have to. Making other classes able to tank or heal doesn't mean those people now want to tank or heal. People want access to the easiest path possible and the most rewards possible, which is stupid. Lol

[@jaymzOG]

There were few tanks and healers because the existing classes that filled those roles were limited/broken (and not in a strong way). If they had just improved those classes, things would've been fine.

[@lilbusy94]

tbh classic andy's were saying it was weird and not what they were asking for with classic+ the day it was announced. obv people have always complained about looking for tanks and healers but did you rly ever see that suggested that said idrc im playing cata over sod. sod looks pretty good i just prefer focusing on one.

[@FeralKobold]

Asmon doesn't want to join a loot council guild because unless he's the guild lead he isn't good enough of a player to have loot prio. He likes GDKP because people give himself thousands of gold and he can just buy it all out. Also he's nostalgic from running scam GDKPs

[@derlamba]

Asmon is a model of a player i hate everything about.

[@pxkdrake]

This, asmon talking like he's even close to a good player is laughable. Everybody except actual noobs is aware of how painfully mediocre/almost legit bad he is

[@Xx666hellbound666xX]

Agreed 100%, if it wasn't for everyone giving him gold,he wouldnt get gear from gdkp either lol

[@Yashtcm]

Man if only they did what Turtlewow did with their servers, new quests in all zones, new dungeons, new raids, new leveling zones, new race/class combos, new profession recipes, hundreds of new gear items and making sure all the new content make sense Lore-wise. They basically a "Classic Era continued" kinda server. It's brilliant. Low-key Blizzard should hire their staff and make this come true.

[@ejlorbz]

I still think that Blizzard can do this route with a permanent server. People forget that SoD is temporary so theyre just dipping their toes on Classic+ content and can go crazy with it without much repercussions. Id love if they pick all the good content of SoD and add that to a permanent classic+ server and build it from there

[@Krulfar]

​@@ejlorbzthat was the idea from the begining, they said it many times. SoD is basically a PTR for Classic+ and that's why I'm not very mad about stupid decisions, like let them make mistakes so they know those are mistakes. I just hope SoD dies fast so Classic+ comes earlier.

[@ejlorbz]

@@Krulfar But if it "dies fast" means theres no demand for classic+ and they probably wont be doing it in permanent servers if theres no on interested in it. So I hope they fix it up, add good content that people love and just put those in a permanent server.

[@Krulfar]

@@ejlorbz it doesn't mean that at all lol

[@derlamba]

​@@ejlorbz if what dies fast? Sod? Sod is retail, people that like vanilla does in no shape or form think sod is classic+. People asking for classic+ are those who played on private servers, those that signed the petition. Classic+ is vanilla with some minor tweaks, minoooor tweaks and more dungeons, raids, zones, gear. Not mage tanking and rogue jerking off in his retail mouth.

[@gonnaw1n]

The worst thing that ever happened to WoW was it becoming super serious through the years. Back in the day if you wanted to be hardcore you joined that type of guild. These days even random groups act like you have to have this gear score and this type of experience....For the casual it has killed the enjoyment of having fun with people around the world and connecting. Having to be a good player to get gear is just wrong, it should always be a roll system to make it fair to everyone who is involved. I don't care if the tank or the healer are better than the others....the worst player in the group is just as important as you wouldn't be raiding otherwise! It is a computer game...no one else's time is more important than anyone else's!

[@kyleroads3244]

I quit sod when economy was completely destroyed in phase 3 by blizzard being a dumbass.

[@AaronVanAlstine-f7y]

It wasn't though. They did huge bot ban waves and made new accounts can trade gold. You have no idea how much that actually helped the economy. I am a gold buyer and I won't buy again on sod because I got banned 4 different times. All the gold is gone. I personally new the farmer who didn't bot the gold and still got banned.

[@Snxgur]

@@AaronVanAlstine-f7y weird, ive bought over 15k gold on SoD in total and have recieved 0 BANS!. not sure whats up with you

[@wowreddion]

Same. P3 Completely ruined the experience for me

[@KHConnect]

Same and a shame

[@RadarFinsR]

@@AaronVanAlstine-f7y Brother you're so unaware it's hilarious. They made incursions so overtuned on the first day that I know people who farmed 2k in 2 hours, then through all the "tweaking" of it there's plenty of people who sat there for the 2 days they had it at 50% of that value and farmed literally 10s of thousands of gold. It's why a lot of the materials are literally more expensive than they are on cataclysm lmao. Also if you trade large sums of gold in SOD you'll be banned there's plenty of easy ways to get around this which people have been doing like, the auction house. Worse than the economy for me the game is just dogshit boring raid specs have basically all been the same since P2 and PVP is literally dead on arrival because blizzard can't be fucked working on it.

[@polybius9089]

14:32 100% this. NO SOUL on Earth thinks "tank" whenever they hear the word "Rogue". I bet most of them would usually think of these words instead: - Assassin - Ninja - Thief - Pirate(?) - Outlaws - Criminals - Cutthroats - Shadow - Poisons - Stealth - Charlatans ... you know? "Assholes" who never care about fighting dirty as long as long as they win, they always do things "from the shadow" or "from behind" with "dirty tricks"... The word "tank" has NOTHING to do with Rogues imo. What's next? Healer Warrior? From these Gigachad berserkers/weapons masters who'd always be in the front-lines, you somehow turn them into "healing b*tches"? How would that make sense?

[@Ridgeman0628]

45:10 talking about taking time. I can remember spending 8 hours in MC back in vanilla trying to figure that shit out. Me and 39 other people. We did that several times. I can’t imagine doing that now.

[@Lurreable]

The player base is older, people have jobs, kids, families. More and better content is what's needed, not time consuming grind.

[@bathsalts666]

i stopped playing sod cause of the incursions, saw my guildies were making 1k-5k gold the first 30 minutes they were released then they hotfixed it. completely ruined the economy

[@cod-the-creator]

sucks to suck

[@brandonwilson4740]

Nobody made 1k gold in 30 minutes. You're a liar

[@Ohhelmno]

Yeah, part of the reason I quit as well as I missed the boat on them cause I was sick the first few days

[@jasonlohbauer6749]

This is a lie. I did incursions from 17 minutes after p3 launch until the gold was hot fixed. I made a little over 1k. People at the very extreme end of things made 1500. That was like 3 months ago tho, so yeah it also did not kill the economy. You’re just a salty sad boy who’s looking to blame shit on your inability to stick to anything. Glad you quit

[@jonk9293]

Pretty much. Missed out on this, now I can't afford anything, gg.

[@WingTzu343]

Loved this convo, and the differing opinions from both of these guys was incredibly insightful. THIS is the great kind of reaction content! Anyway one thought about Raid ID vs Boss ID. I think a slight compromise between the two is the best option. Ultimately, keep Raid ID, however you can still enter other raid IDs and help out while just not being eligible for loot. The way this would work would be when you enter a raid and are NOT saved to a raid ID, a dialogue window pops up and asks if you want to save to the raid, making you eligible for loot, but locked for the rest of the week. If you decline this window you can stay and just not get loot. When you're SAVED and you enter another raid ID, a window pops up and lets you know that you are saved to a different ID and can't get loot. This keeps the "stick it out together" social contract that classic is famous for while still letting friends play together. Win Win imho. Only real downside I can think of off the top of my head is potential issues with "boost selling".

[@mcfarvo]

Good idea 💡

[@lostheboss7938]

Remember when people just had fun with things

[@Ben-ek6pj]

play Turtle WoW, people just have fun there :)

[@antonkokic]

@@Ben-ek6pj enough

[@joelhodoborgas]

These private server andys are the vegans of wow. shut up already. private servers is for clowns anyway

[@TreesPlease42]

It's like an AA meeting

[@eodyn7]

@@Ben-ek6pj Nobody wants to play private servers. Have fun getting your identity stolen.

[@selwrynn6702]

Yeah, on difficulty in WoW, its like the Overjustification effect studies, if you don't know they'd basically bring children into a room and one group would be rewarded for each picture they drew while the other group was just told that they could draw. The study found that providing rewards would keep the kids drawing longer, but as soon as the rewards stopped they would stop drawing. Retail is designed to give rewards for drawing pictures (doing content) that is their loot philosophy, their designers have said so. Classic is designed to give you all the paper & crayons they can and let you draw the pictures as long as you'd like, the rewards are there but they aren't the purpose of the game

[@DoomBringerDANTE]

This isn't even true? The loot is a bigger chase in Classic than it is in retail. Thats the main reason people do stuff in classic. After a certain point PVP and M+ are completely useless for gear and rewards. Going above 2100 and going above +10 is pointless. Yet people will and do.

[@ripedroxx]

So loot isn't the incentive yet people crave gdkp's which sole purpose is the reward Leveling is great yet people keep buying boosts and rushing to endgame At this point the game design could be whatever because the community plays in a completely different way that they used to back in the day and there is no coming back to it in a grand scale, just find a community that plays the way that you want to play and enjoy

[@zacharyklewin3603]

The raid id system, more than anything, builds resentment amongst players from every experience I've had in the game. If anything, boss id actually builds more community because you can afford to bring bad players to the bosses in 2 different groups until you get stuck and then finish the raid with the players that care enough to learn their class. This also applies well to pugs in regards to boss id

[@KHConnect]

Yup

[@Kngofkngs]

Blizzard doesn’t ban gold buyers. If they do, they might catch a 3 Day and MAYBE lose the gold they bought if they haven’t already invested it. Banning GDKP was a lazy way to lessen gold buying, which is still running rampant regardless.

[@RadarFinsR]

SOD gold buyer banning is actually their most thorough, you get a 14 day ban and you usually lose the gold if you didn't spend it yet. However they had to make the new player experience literally unplayable for your average solo player since new accounts are locked out from any kind of trading of items or gold to others for a month. the real problem is it's easy to not get caught buying gold in any version of the game as long as you wash it enough and have enough burner accounts. My guild had 6 people get banned for gold buying in SOD which was a smaller guild than our classic2019 and through tbc we only had 2 people get banned. The real problem is blizzard just can't balance a good game tbh.

[@kylehofmeister6906]

Asmon is wrong, what do you do when you're fulling geared. You pvp. I know he hates pvp in mmo's but thats literally what everyone used to do. Max out your gear and show to superiority over everyone. PVP is endgame not game ruining GDKP's. PvP is what keeps an MMO going when the PVE stuffs gets boring, which after a couple of clears, happens pretty quick.

[@EvLch3dd4r]

Pretty bad take. I love PvE and even after getting fully geared in retail, there'd be days I'd queue LFR as a healer just for fun (and the challenge of healing LFR players...). That being said, when a group does wipe over and over, I leave. If GDKPs were still a thing, I'd rather do that and get paid. I don't care about the loot, I still want to raid though. Why would I join a bad raid?

[@kylehofmeister6906]

@@EvLch3dd4r That's fine but GDKP insentivises gold buying, selling and botting. You can still raid and do what you like. I like pve too but it just gets boring after a while. In fact if a player likes to be topping the dps or hps meters, they are in a sense, pvping other players for that top spot.

[@Kurnhelios]

Yeah idk about that, even as a PvP main there’s only so many alterac valley’s you can run in Classic before it gets a bit stale, and GDKP gives me a way to make gold easily without the snooze fest of having to run around picking herbs or standing in the city flipping items on the AH. If classic+ was developed I’d love to see some better detection of botting/gold selling/buying etc along with readding GDKP’s back into the game - I shouldn’t be punished because Blizzard can’t maintain the integrity of their game, and don’t even get me started on the WoW token… Also, some kind of cosmetics introduced for pvp end-game to keep it interesting for longer could be neat too.

[@DaltonSavage-f3u]

😂asmon is a weird person he hates pvp but he's put his heart&soul into getting a full elite set during cataclysm then went and got gladiator in WOD and then got 3s comp 2700 in legion and his single warrior has over 350k honorable kills he literally got the bloodthirsty achievement on that 1 character

[@parkerfrode5101]

@@kylehofmeister6906just as many people buy gold after the gdkp ban. People buy gold so they don’t have to farm gold with there limited time. They want to do what they enjoy with there time.

[@og_ktg]

I fully disagree with the idea that GDKPs were a big thing back in the day. They just weren't. I dont know a single person who actually did a GDKP run before ICC. Back in the day when you got fully geared, you helped your friends get gear, you did PVP, and most of the time you started playing an alt and doing it again.

[@Chaoticsaur]

Gdkps were popularized in ~2008, the Asian guilds were doing it, and it slowly moved over to the us, however prior to that, loot style auctions took place as far back as EverQuest, just because you never took part in them, doesn’t suddenly make them non existent. There was 12 million people playing wow, the MAYBE and im being super generous here, 50-60 people you knew, just didn’t participate in them, that isn’t really that strange given the amount of players. Anyways, now you cant use your argument that you don’t know a single person, because now you know one 😂

[@og_ktg]

​@Chaoticsaur so exactly like I said, they gained popularity during Wrath of the Lich King. I dont care if they existed in everquest, that's completely irrelevant. They weren't "commonplace" in wow until WOTLK. We're talking about what happened for the first 4 years of the games existence, where people had plenty to do despite no gdkps. Specifically in vanilla since this is a classic wow issue. Also, I dont know you.

[@trillnye9128]

The last time I raided seriously was in wotlk and I never once did a raid with gdkp. It was 100% master loot rolls.

[@ripedroxx]

So having multiple difficulties and different lockouts are bad because it segments the community Yet gdkp runs which are filled mostly by people who only do gdkp which are essentially carries with no real community sense are ok because if you don't wanna do them just go to other raids Also people keep complaining about retail being full of FOMO but you can't make a raid reset twice a week because you HAVE to clear every reset because otherwise you will be permanently behind (and that can be applied to literally any content implemented that has a lockout) I swear every classic take the community has contradicts the last one

[@jasonlohbauer6749]

Preach brother. It’s so fucking annoying listen to these children bitch at every single chance they can.

[@Draux.]

The problem is not GDKP by itself, the problem is everything around GDKP, GDKP make people buy gold, that gold doesnt go away after the GDKP it stay there then inflation comes and everything goes up then what happend? AH prices goes up consumable goes up, random items goes up, mats goes up and at that point you reach a level where people that are casual cannot play the game cause they can't continue unless they spent money to get gold, cause otherwise they can't raid they don't have the gold for consumable, then you think i guess i'll farm gold, when farming the gold for your consumable would take your entire time. the point of Asmon saying losing your roll to a bad player is tilting, imagine being top dps and little timmy at the bottom of the chart is a gold buyer and out bid you, i would alt+f4 right away. The real problem of wow is the community is pure dog shit they complain about everything. My only real complain about SoD so far is incursion. On paper it really nice but again the community decided to just do loop for 15 hours and then saying omg it dog shit then when they change incursion people still complain about not being fare for people that couldnt abuse it.

[@zooleebest]

in phase 2, blizzard kill pugging. GDKP is already killed long before phase 2 arrived.

[@shoyupacket5572]

@@Draux. nah GDKP is the problem, but raid loot has always been the sole biggest cause for drama in wow in one way or another. there's always some shitty fuck face that's going to ruin it.

[@dalkri5546]

The 20+ raid size system was a great way of adding a difficulty slider for casuals that should be in all SoD raids going forward. If a raid is too hard don't ask for nerfs just bring more people!

[@ByteAImusic]

GDKP keeps high end players running groups = more groups = more players playing since they're able to raid and get loot. GDKP is big.

[@FF7Cloud]

alexstrasza scorches bolvar alive to save him and no one questions anything but let an arcane mage rewind wounds on someone and suddenly it makes no sense

[@Tagerrun]

Except blizzard doesn’t perma ban the buyers so it never fixes the problem?

[@Regularguy2nd]

Well it doesn't matter how long you ban someone for if they just keep on coming back with new accounts

[@chrisjones658]

@@Regularguy2nd If you spent 50$ on gold and had a character you'd sunk weeks into banned a few times you'd stop buying gold. If that account was also tied to your retail account(s) and they also got banned and any account linked to your billing card also got yeeted then I'm pretty sure that'd stop a fuck tonne of people buying gold. People need to fear buying gold. The fear of being punished isn't there and the fear of the punishment in the highly unlikely event you do get caught also isn't there because they don't ban you for gold buying. The worst punishment I've seen is a months ban. This whole hour long video had Xaryu and Asmon talking about player psychology. Putting the fear of god (in this case Blizzard) into people would stop most people buying gold.

[@Loolix]

1:02:00 your character persists but all your gear is worthless so its basically the same since the only thing you don't have to do is level, which in retail is more of a formality than anything.

[@stuffinyrmuffin8447]

20:12 I quit SoD because half my guild was gold buyers and they only got banned for 3 days to 2 weeks. Half of them weren't even that mad because they didn't lose the gold. If someone purchases thousands of gold, they need a perma ban not a 2 week.

[@andrecardoso6941]

That’s a lie. I bought gold once in SOD got a 2 weeks ban cause it was my first time and they removed the gold I bought.

[@andrecardoso6941]

Also I bought a small amount of gold not an huge amount. And they told me if I bought gold again I could get perma banned.

[@blacksquirtle9119]

I only played phase 1, but bought gold every week just like 20-100g never got a ban or anything

[@johnstetak1731]

Exactly to the original post and forget about the length of the band...None of you guys got perma banned. People that break tos need to be perma banned.

[@WoWcruids]

@@andrecardoso6941 bought gold wrath classic got 2week ban. got to keep all the gear i bought with the gold and the 4k that was left over. even though the email said id lose everything. blizzard is inconsistent with their punishments. i still have friends that buy gold on SoD and cata no bans.

[@ahetzel9054]

i was excited for sod but quit in phase 1 because i was tainted by how a small indie dev team can make a private server free and 10x better.

[@Lurreable]

I never raided back in vanilla and won't in SoD either. It's such a huge shift in time requirement going from leveling and dungeons to raiding, and I especially don't have that time now that I'm older. Raiding is a time sink to keep people around, and GDPK sounds like more of the same. A much better solution than grind would be to add more and better content, flesh out unfinished zones, add more races etc.

[@tomasnovellino5980]

I agreed with SOD having normal levelling spped for the current phase. Then when a new phase (level bracket) unlocks, add some XP speed boost to the previous bracket. To catch-up and focus play current phase. And I only consider that an option for SOD because it is seasonal.

[@austinb5656]

Turtle Wow is currently creating a true classic +, was watching all of the videos of their server after Asmon watched a trailer. Classic wow but added high elf and goblin with custom starting zones and quests with lore true to the era. And much more lore finished and added in-game. And a small amount of spells/abilities that were really needed for classes in classic added

[@antonkokic]

turtle wow is phantasma, fantasy... object of desire, it's not fucking real... when sod was released all this people who praising turtle left, new pvp realm was/is completly dead...

[@Wolfyyy]

@@antonkokic lol right now there are 5000 players playin... and the new patch has not even dropped the pvp realm is dead because NO ONE (apart from 3 loud players) wants pvp servers anymore

[@antonkokic]

@@Wolfyyy ni hao

[@Lohmatiyshmel]

Turtle wow is literally dead already even more dead than sod

[@Wolfyyy]

@@Lohmatiyshmel 5000 players is not dead lol... Once they drop their new patch it will be even more crowded

[@ronsutton4853]

Soft res is a great system. Perhaps one of the best loot systems I've ever used. Its a nice feeling when only you soft ressed a piece of gear, and it drops, so you get it. On top of that, anything that isn't ressed, you get to open roll on...great system

[@potatocakeful]

I do think that GDKP's filled a necessary part of pug raiding. GDKP was both incentive for geared players to keep playing and smoothed out (for those with gold) the process of gearing out alts/new characters. The issue is that when you remove the incentive for the geared players there are less geared people helping to carry runs and as a result people become even more picky for who they invite because they don't want to wipe and waste time. Its not that GDKP itself is great, it just is something that helped maintained player pop in the raiding environment. The issue is Blizz removing it without having anything to fill the void of what it did for the scene. Parsing isn't an answer as someone who wants to parse won't join the groups that GDKP filled in a pug environment.

[@Toonamik]

dunno, for me finally without GDKP people pugging is nice, you need actualy to learn mechanics instead of beeing boosted for money

[@rosemorningstar5368]

My big issue with GDKP is it took away the social element of guilds for me at least. People in my guild preferred pugging gdkp’s so they can make gold and just outright buy an item instead of engaging with a loot council, essentially removing a large social element of the game which is the entire point of classic.

[@steadychasingmoneybands6213]

@@rosemorningstar5368 yeh now you have dead game... amazing how that works

[@6ghastlyghoul9]

@@steadychasingmoneybands6213 if the game has a lower population because gold buyers have no incentive on playing the game then that's a sacrifice the game needs to make but it won't. I disagree that GDKP is a minor issue. I think it's one of the largest flaws. There should be a replacement sure, but not something that incentivizes gold buying, boosting, etc. It's such a loser pastime. You're literally being carried and barely playing the game. It's the antithesis of what a game should be about. You're obviously addicted if you GDKP.

[@victorfrederiks4367]

​@@6ghastlyghoul9totally agree with you. And to add to the GDKP issue. Even if a player chooses not to participate in GDKP it will still effect them. Because it f*cks the complete economy of the game due to the gold buyers.

[@bren3233]

Can we just appreciate this new meta between (WoW) KZbinrs reacting to each other in genuinely mature and respectful ways while generating some awesome conversations?

[@josipmarasovic2436]

U mean they dont know to make content so react on each other hahahahhaha

[@APprojection]

59:00 stop thinking it is waste of time, you must enjoy the journey and the time spent, not the end result, you don't play for end result, you play for the sake of it, otherwise nothing is worth your time

[@Sco777owel1]

At least you get bunch of gold and next time youre one step closer of getting it in SR you could lose it 20 times and still be as far as ever of getting your item

[@18lolable]

Mythic ilvl gear being the same ilvl as LFR in the next tier is what's crazy to me. The seasonal feeling comes in large parts from these massive jumps in ilvl every content patch.

[@OldmanwithGlock]

i said this in the original asmon video, and saying it here... THE CHARACTER IN SEASON OF DISCOVERY WILL NOOOOOT BE ERASED. Devs already said this

[@josefniederer5039]

GDKP conceptually isn't a problem. The problem is when you introduce gold from bots/farmers/server transfers. I think you might be able to remove a lot of those problems if you cap servers at a population. If you cap a server at lets say 3000-5000 players then you limit the ability of gold sellers to recognize a potential buyer server. Locking servers also prevents people from transfering goods (black lotus) from other low pop servers and jacking the price up. At the end of the day we just don't like gold from illegitimate sources and when you play a game it's not good to play with people who treat this like a job and it ruins the economy. Again GDKP's conceptually are fine provided the gold was obtained legitimately such as selling stuff to vendors or quest rewards. Everything outside of that is a transaction of gold that you now have to another player, but the gold has to originate from a player that put in time to obtain it legit and not from botting, farming, or the same from other servers. Keep economies server specific.

[@delornegg]

During SoD's announcement at Blizzcon the devs/panel SAID they are going to be very aggressive with runes and changes to the game in general to get a feel for what people do and don't like. Hoping this is all an actual Classic+ beta.

[@chance0257]

I've never done GDKPs, but if they were around in SoD i might've stuck around longer. Got my full BiS, 99 parses on most bosses and then it just felt like there was nothing to do. I used to be against GDKP until i realized that it really is the most fair loot system, AND it adds content to people who no longer have content to do.

[@josipmarasovic2436]

How its fair if u dont have gold u dont get items. How does that make any sense

[@chance0257]

@@josipmarasovic2436 if you don't have enough gold to outbid the next person, you're still walking away with gold in your pockets from that person's bid. If you get zero loot, you atleast come out the raid with ALOT of gold from all the bids.

[@xommby]

badtakemongold

[@nauk244]

GDKP made people play 6 characters, even the same classes! You could fit in a really badass parse group, as a buyer and learn better this way too because you're a part of the run. For the very first time i agree with Asmond. If you're not the guy who has mountains of gold but you want x item he also need it's a win/win, you get your item or the gold split gets massive and you double your currency. I barely had time to do GDKP before they removed them but i had all kinds of fun experiences, many laughs too. You could be new, clueless and even afk half the run or get paid for your performance on a decent character... in the same exact content depending on how you feel today!

[@Voltairus30]

Also, people that want to get parses aren't going to be trying to do that in pug groups, period, regardless of loot rules. The only way you can parse is if you are in a group that has taken the time to get full buffs, stacked good players/classes, and planned out how to approach boss strats. That requires coordinated guild groups.

[@skarb5797]

You drastically underestimate how organized GDKPs are. Even buyers are required to come fully buffed and consumed.

[@luthermercedes]

Weird specs is one of the best parts of SOD. It makes grouping woth friends easier and has allowed for much greater class viability vs classic

[@jaymzOG]

Weird specs weren't needed to solve that issue. Fixing existing classes would've been fine.

[@anyroad5455]

@@jaymzOGI don’t understand why people have a problem with weird specs. If you don’t like them don’t play them.

[@ripedroxx]

@@jaymzOG but they also did that, more variety is not a bad thing

[@Zelgadiss1984]

Most loot councils funnel gear to officers. Free roll raids are all well and good until some someone decides to ninja an item, and the group falls apart halfway thru the raid. Atleast in GDKPs you're incentivized to try to preform to get a cut, and if you dont get the item you want you atleast don't leave empty handed.

[@messybuttons7525]

Removing GDKP was a major deal. It killed PUG grouping. Guilds formed and all fell apart rapidly because of drama, and then the rapid decline began. Same with how they messed up PvP. Horde have insanely long queues unless grouped, which makes alliance face more partial Premades, and they did nothing to stop people from spamming AV end game (run to boss simulator), and MC is the same except it’s the SoM version. Final rant is some runes are so hard to get it’s beyond ridiculous. The phase 1 runes were mostly fun to find .. after that it got silly. They hit the sweet spot with phase 1 and should have never left it. Every area of the game was thriving.

[@Malix2238]

SoD struggling is just asmon using it as an excuse to say "i told you i was right because of these reasons" and he cant really prove those are the reasons at all.

[@Matsudiro]

Banning of GDKPs absolutely had a massive negative impact on the pug scene in SoD. It's one of the biggest mistakes of the season for sure.

[@emansfield2017]

What i dont like, is like what really defines a bad player? Numbers or how they use their abilities? For the most part its how they use their abilities, along with raid mechanics. But a lot of people just look at the dps and see if someone's low. They could be doing their rotations right, they just dont have that good of gear yet to do higher numbers hence why they are in the raid

[@legendofmirr]

The fact that most peoples response to asmons "I was a great player" rant was talking about gladiator and pvp is the exact reason why asmon is right. Wow as a whole and its systems, social interactions and everything that makes up the phenomenon of the game is FAR bigger than pvp or being able to execute pvp properly. Its not all about execution knowledge is everything. Its like even if your the star player you better respect the coaches knowledge because hes great at the game in a different way. I dont think a single one of you reading or watching this could recall as much information about this game with chronology and context in a way thats even close to as comprehensive as asmongold. Love him or hate him you have to give him his flowers.

[@josipmarasovic2436]

Nope he is wrong man

[@steadychasingmoneybands6213]

he knows where pve armors are thats it...

[@EatableBread]

The problem with gold buyers and gold sellers, is that gold buyers just get a slap on the wrist for buying gold. Most of these people have X amount of accounts to funnel gold through, when they see one of their accounts get a 2 week ban, there's not a worry in their head at all. If it got you a perma ban, you'd most likely see a drastic decrease in gold buying. Blizz also needs to hire GMs to ban bots/gold seller more consistently, as opposed to what? Every 6 months when they've made enough money to get more bots up and running without it stinging a little bit. If Blizz actually hired GMs and banned buyers/sellers, GDKP would 100% be the best pugging method. Blizzard's reason for removing it in SoD was even more funny because people have TBC amounts of gold in just 9 months of not even being at level 60 and GDKPs haven't been a thing since what January? And the social fabric excuse just turned into gate keeping with log checks.

[@싸넬동지-7성담배]

And no, you cannot compare PvP rating and M+ to SoD Parsing. Because both have incremental difficulty as opposed to SoD parsing.

[@bojnebojnebojne]

Difficulty as a concept is subjective. Meaning what is hard for one player can be extremely easy for another. What the result of that becomes is: We have 2 camps feuding over what is Easy vs Hard, when in reality all versions of WoW, Classic, SoD and Retail are all Easy AND Hard simultaneously, depending on where across the spectrum of skill, understanding and knowledge about the game the player stating the claim "Easy" or "Hard" lands. Raid ID: Raid ID is more uniform to what Blizzard aim for with a Guild system, so in that aspect it makes total sense for WoW Classic. But the modern retail version of BOSS ID is the better version for all players in isolation. People who are not in a tight guild group or are just bad at the game, can with the BOSS ID model now get kicked out of the Guild or Raid if they are not good enough or are just fooling around dragging the rest of the Guild / Raid down without progression or loot lockout penalty. But it also create what Xaryu described an easer "fk off" mentality with the playerbase, because it is so easy to just get rid of a player or just leave mid raid without consequence.

[@KyleHart_pixsym]

@ ~21:00 you hear Asmon say something like : Players that don't deserve gear can win gear with a roll system. -- This might be a sore spot for Asmon. He might have done a dungeon 100 times to even see the piece he wanted for his DK only to have it rolled on and won by a Warlock or something. Or --- by another DK who contributed .0001% of the parse, Or --- whatever Asmon's excuse is. He sounds like he's turning the UBER RARE gear is the trophy, instead of Completion of the Raid is the trophy. The gear that drops can be seen two different ways ... as random chance to get or as the reason you're there at all. Asmon is the latter perspective and feels a certain type of way about who 'deserves' that gear and who does not. I have no doubt, he'd control who gets what in a Guild run in a similar fashion. Gear the A1 Tank, Healer, DPS first. Gear the A2 Tank, Healer, DPS second. Gear the B1 T,H,D third, and so on. This is the story of socialism turning communist, everyone joins sold on a narrative that they're equals only to participate in the system and have the top tell the rest that what they've earned needs to support the leader class or else there will be no organization for the rest. How quickly socialism turns communist authoritarian once you get the buy-in of the majority. It sounds like Asmon has been burned by honor system roll mechanics and now he wants more control to ensure his odds are ever in his favor. I'm in favor of a roll system with many options decided before the Raid can even be formed by the raid organizer, made clear to all participants who browse available raids. If the participants want to join a raid with those settings for rolls, then so be it. If that style roll system attracts zero help, then folks like Asmon will need to modify their standards or be prepared to wait a long time to find just the right participants to agree. IMO, this resolves the issues entirely AND teaches people with obtuse roll standards that their standards are obtuse (at least with the average players eligible to raid when they typically play).

[@黒歌-d3m]

Dumb take, forcing your way of tinking is insane way of balacing the game, if you enjoy raiding/doing dungeons good for you, but you can't say everyone should enjoy it and they shouldn't do it just for gear. What if I don't enjoy PvE content at all, but still need to do it for my PvP offparts or whatever? Should I be forced to sit through hundreds of hours of unenjoyable gameplay because it's fun for you and I shouldn't do it solely for the gear?

[@KyleHart_pixsym]

@@黒歌-d3m Your comment sounds like it's from a person that didn't read what was said. There is no force whatsoever in the format of roll system I proposed. The terms of the raid loot would be determined beforehand and unchangeable throughout the raid. If you're attempting a raid at all, you'd be doing so with the full knowledge and expectation of how the loot will be rolled upon. If you don't like those terms you're not forced to participate, you can find another raid with favorable loot terms. Nobody is 'balancing the game' with this measure, they'd be making the loot expectations associated with a raid more clear up front. That's it. Find a place in what was written that suggested all players had to raid to balance the game. I'll wait. If you think you have the rights to a piece of gear, start your own raid with loot permissions favoring yourself. That would be entirely your prerogative and an option available to you in the system I proposed. If nobody wanted to join your terms for loot, that's something you'd need to learn from, or wait a really long time until folks come around to your way of thinking. It's quite simple. This system is entirely opt-in. The opposite of force or coercion.

[@kylesmith987]

I mostly agree with the take that classes each had their things they were good at and their things that required other classes to prop them up. I will however say i don't believe this identity fits with every single class in the game. I think there are genuinely classes in classic that just fall between the cracks and that there are other classes that are just generally better then they are at pretty much everything. A prime example of this is Enhance Shaman. There really isn't a single situation in the game for both PvE or PvP that an Enhance Shaman excels at or does better then any other class. You could maybe say that they bring windfury totem but any spec of shaman does that and it's not really a thing that benefits you or boosts you at all it just boosts all the melee around you to preform better. You could even argue that its a negative to their identity because the thing you think about with shaman is windfury its the most iconic thing they have in classic and windfury just gives their iconic thing away to other classes. Now I'm not entirely sold on this position as it is a bit subjective but my main point is that some classes have REALLY strong identities and benefits and other classes identities or benefits aren't really that beneficial at all. Not sure what a fix to this is that would actually make people happy just a thing worth noticing. For the leveling speed topic i agree for the most part except i do genuinely think classic was a bit too slow and it caused pacing and burnout issues. I enjoyed leveling in SoD with the 50% xp buff as that felt just about right to me where i still needed to dedicated time and effort to leveling but it felt better paced. The XP buffs past 50% and all the crazy xp from events like incursions and stuff were WAY too much and actually hurt people going out into the world and leveling, It just funneled everyone into the game into 1 specific zone to speed leveling and caused significant issues with the game. For the points of friction topic i agree that it is part of what makes classic great however i do not subscribe to the idea that all points of friction are good or an over all benefit for the game. There are absolutely many points of friction that have just caused people to quit the game or are just genuinely bad for the over all health of the game. The really hard part is figuring out which points of friction are good for the health of the game and which ones are bad. A prime example is world pvp, i know people that play the game entirely for world pvp and i know people that have flat out quit the game because of it. Its a very subjective point of friction.

[@Joshboyes1]

I never completed a single raid from vanilla-BC because I was a ret paladin. I logged in to explore the world and pvp with my friends. Gaming was different back then. Min maxing wasn’t at the forefront, fun was.

[@FortisUrsus]

Fair is everyone pays the monthly subscription and has an equal chance at rolls. Might as well add a feature where you can buy a dice that goes to 200 if GDKP is OK.

[@wildtejasxd]

low leveling with friends was fun for me! Doing the same quests for alts got stale after awhile for me. When character boosting became a thing and large xp buffs became a regular event. The journey to reach end game became dull for me personally because like okay what is there to do now beside mythic + dungeons and raids?

[@_faythene]

Saying gold is fair when you popularized having people opening trade and accepting all gold offerings is hilarious

[@gg_necro]

Crazy that the assumption is that people are buying gold for GDKPs when most of the people I know who have bought gold usually do it for raid upkeep and better riding training.

[@FMA_Arlandar-1]

It was clear from the very start that SoD was a strategic blunder. The reason is that they focus on endgame content, but if what you enjoy is instancied content, every version of WoW is better than Vanilla. SoD is competing against WotLK, Cata, retail - and raiding in SoD is the worst by a huge margin. Trying to "take the best of each version of the game" can only lead to a duller version of the game. What they should do is focus on expanding the strong points of Vanilla : leveling, immersion, world PvP, social interaction - and the first thing they should do is move away from instancied content. Hardcore was fun because it forces the player to be fully focused - and being focused is a way to immerse the players but it’s also clear that this isn’t a viable option for a MMORPG. Loss of Xp or items, more World bosses, world PvP events is what they should focus on.

[@bananacoon2986]

I recently joined a guild this last season to have fun/a consistent group of people to play with. I was consistently top 3 dps of every single boss fight in Amidrassil. Pip's trinket dropped and it was my 3rd bis trinket from that raid for ass rogue. I had 2 from m+ not a single one from raid. I was not allowed to roll on it because it was not my 2 bis trinkets, they instead let someone doing under 100k dps every single boss pull win the trinket that shit pissed me off so hard. Loot rules pug or in a community are dumb af. This was also a progression guild too you would think they would want top parsing guildies get better gear before other people.

[@Hopesedge]

Asmon saying that GDKP's are fairer than normal runs, I'm pretty sure cheating is the definition of the word 'unfairly', people who cheat by buying gold get priority over everyone else, people who scam others get priority, people who have thousands of fans dispensing gold into their inventories get priority, it's the unfairest loot system there is as the only way to compete is to cheat.

[@aaronhall4520]

The problem here is the focus on gear and fair distribution. What is fair or not fair doesn't actually matter to most of the player base. Most of the player base just wants to have fun playing the game with the people they like and the chance at gear and gold and stuff is secondary. GDKP ruins a part of the game that those players need to enjoy playing; the economy.

[@TreKaufPL]

(G)DKP is more fair than rolling in the sense you get DKP or gold even if you "lose" an item, or even if your item does not drop at all. Having bad luck with rolls makes it quite likely that you dont even gain anything from a raid. Also that it is pointless to join a raid with rolls if you have all the items already, which will make all raids slower and possibly fail since only somewhat geared and undergeared players will be raiding.

[@eboethrasher]

Facilitating classes with specs that were underutilized like pally tank/dps and the same with druid specs, etc - those are 100% fine. Make those viable with runes. Maybe don't go crazy with some of the other specs. But I think they were looking at the private servers and trying to capture some of that flavor on a retail server. But I think that we need to remember that this is still a testing ground. They can take all this feedback and drop a true vanilla plus that is scaled back from how over the top SOD is right now. That's the TRUE hope at the end of the day, remember. This isn't going to be permanent. It is a petri dish.

[@Zordiestreams]

GDKP's even if you don't buy gold are great because no matter what you walk away with something. Even if you get outbid, guess what you get a percentage of the pot and you walk away with more gold and you have more gold to work with. If you do GDKP's regularly then you don't have to buy gold.

[@kurokamiotaku]

asmon filled with l takes recently

[@SurpriseMechanics]

Asmon’s talked about GDKP for like 20 minutes and he made a lot of great points. Don’t know why the clip was that short. Basically, banning GDKP instead of gold buying was just lazy and doesn’t actually solve the problem. He said that Blizzard should bring back GDKP and actually do something about gold buying instead.

[@4NT1N008]

Asmon going "SoD isn't as good as it could be because:" and then listing every single reason why its better than era is a bold move.

[@sunderwire]

Sod is dead

[@mariusquam2410]

sod is atm the worst version of wow, cata, retail and era are all better then sod atm.

[@jasonlohbauer6749]

@@mariusquam2410it’s like you morons don’t realize that’s due to p3 being out for like 4 months now. You won’t be saying this on Thursday, fact.

[@eboethrasher]

@@mariusquam2410 it is awesome that you have an opinion, lots of other people have them too. They are not the same as yours all of the time.

[@thewones]

I strongly believe that OS-WoW is coming and SoD is just the voting process to let them know how to make it. Vanilla+ or Classic+ will be built on the foundations of Classic and add the "modern" twists and turns that we are developing in SoD. Bypassing leveling just allows the development team to have the players experience changes and the final build will encompass Classic + SoD Changes for a new long term play style.

[@chainclaw07]

14:20 I disagree wholeheartedly - just because 2004 wow was a certain way with certain specs shouldn't mean that SoD has to be as restraining as that. arguably - to have a more integrated population, every class SHOULD have two specs out of the three. that way - some dps can fill in for the healers or the tanks when PEOPLE GET TIRED OF DOING THE NOT FUN JOBS REQUIRED FOR MULTIPLAYER ENCOUNTERS. I play a paladin because magic and swinging a big ass sword is my fantasy I want to play in the warcraft universe - I end up wearing dresses and mallets and healing others, not doing anything to the enemy.... and all that experience is for me is - look at health bars and top off the ones that gets low hp...... THAT'S NOT FUN GAMEPLAY - I'M NOT EVEN HITTING THE STUPID DRAGON IN THE FACE!!! I'M JUST SPAMMING LIGHT IN THE ASS OF MY "FRIEND" ..... SO YES - I think asking the rogue if he could tank when it's been 30 minutes and no one is joining for the last spot is still reasonable - MORE reasonable than asking ME the Ret pally to use some lvl 50 dungeon gear and babysit you through a dungeon healing .... It's not as fun when the situation is reversed, now is it??

[@Wiltings]

I like how asmond says GDKP is fair, but its a plague in retail with people buying runs and titles left and right. Only for them to be invited outside of their bought runs, and turns out they're dogwater and can barely play the class they spend hundreds if not thousands of dollars gearing up.

[@ZapatosVibes]

Literally nothing vanilla left about SoD. Crazy fast XP, no journey, overpowered with skills and gear from the get-go, etc. etc. Only thing missing is the cash shop now.

[@sathdk79]

The raiding scene died without GDKP. All my friends quit. GDKP is just DKP in a tangible form that you can spend on other things in game.

[@Tiiimo7]

Imo, they should have just brought the other tank classes up to the warriors level and just given people dual spec or removed the respec cost. Allowing the healers and tanks to solo play instead of dumping their gold every week to respec.

[@alexb9566]

A single person hired to monitor the chats for gold spam would all but remove it entirely in a couple of weeks. Screenshot, right-click, ban. Rinse and repeat every day.

[@Dooferification]

I think GDKP is a bigger factor than he thinks but less than asmon. People are pugging still but are going to quit once they hit that 'i only need x and y'. Where as with gold runs i always leave with at least gold

[@lildrinks]

GDKP are good because you can go get gear from regular raids then go to GDKP after you get the gear you want and get gold for consumes.

[@Saiku]

Asmon never said GDKPs were necessary for people to enjoy a MMO, nor did he say it was the main reason SoD sucks. He simply brought it up as a contributing factor because a lot of the geared players who would have kept raiding to run GDKPs dont go carry groups and reduces the pool of available groups. He spends a lot of time talking about the game going away from the classic design. Also, its not just about banning sellers. Banning gold buyers consistently will discourage players from buying because they dont want to lose their account. Back in the day, most people were pretty scared to buy gold because the fear of being banned.

[@BrianKern]

If they do anything like this again they should just do a Classic+ without the leveling phases. Just release it with the ability to start leveling to 60 from the get go. And create actual new content. They should be looking at Turtle Wow and Project Epoch and get some ideas from them. The seasonal phases with boosted XP just makes people get to the end and burn out faster. I'm more or less done with putting tons of time into SoD. I'll go ahead and hit 60 and I'll probably just do dungeons and get tier 0.5 and then PUG MC/Ony when folks have them on farm and just need fillers. But I have no desire to be on a raid schedule and be spending tons of time farming for consumables and getting all the damn world buffs every week, multiple times a week.

[@tenaciousle0606]

Yikes, I kind of feel bad for Asmond, that multi minute rant about how he is (was) the fucking best and knows more than literally anyone else is giving huge, guy who peaked and is way beyond that peak and can't let go or accept he's not that guy anymore. That was a sad few minutes. Anyways, I feel like class need isn't completely erased like people like to act like it is, mage healer makes sense to me, it's crazy to me no one has ever seen a mage class heal in another game before? GDKP is whatever, I can see both sides of the argument. Raids being too hard was like a one or two week issue, and then fixed. and they were not at all difficult after that. The only reason I don't dislike the Discovers Delight is because it's a season and won't be here forever, with no PTR they would want us to his the cap level changes to test them out. Now if they relaunch and have DD in it, then I would have an issue, but also the idea of the slow leveling is dead, lets be real, even with Classic launch people just did nothing but dungeons until 60. I think SoD has been great, just for the fact that they are trying something new, that they have finally seen that the core of classic people love and are doing something with that. It's not all homeruns, but I appreciate them doing something.

[@alexlemaster9526]

The whole idea of discovery is discovering new things, but it doesn't fundamentally make sense to completely change classes in those ways. Classic was far from balanced, but you played what you wanted and found a guild who wanted you. I don't mind them trying these things out but these things in particular do not make sense. I think what it really comes down to is the playerbase of SoD isn't as much as they expected so they need to have classes more balanced and be able to solo content

[@lunaticmode638]

42:25 correction: he got carried in cutting edge content at the end of a content cycle and he only was a raidlead so he could give himself all the loot.

[@黒歌-d3m]

Really not true is it? Only content he did get carried in was PvP, stop being a cringe lord.

[@lunaticmode638]

@@黒歌-d3m He literally got carried live on stream for sanctum during shadowlands

[@bluntman3180]

They put skills already in the game behind a mechanic. They made a mechanic to provide you work to get the reward that was already in the game for no work. That's my main issue. They made SoD with as little effort as possible and it shows. People ate it up in the beginning, even calling it classic+, which is hilarious. How did classic+ work out for ya'll professional dyck eaters.

[@jasonlohbauer6749]

lol shut up you dork

[@SpencerBelanger]

1000% asmon never has this opinion if he didnt have streamer privilege. However, gdkp ban hasnt removed a huge problem with gold sinks at max level. Buying gold will still allow you to progress much faster than if you dont. Time sink just will never equate to swipping.

[@rafakauza9913]

Blizzard doesn't allow new players to use AH, mail between own characters or trade in person for a month. Great model for expanding player base.

[@adamhenry3928]

I don't buy that argument about people not willing to put in time for seasonal characters vs persistent - if a season lasts for 1-2 years how is that even seasonal anymore. You slap people on ERA fresh servers and 95% of them will quit before 2 years pass. 2 years is sooo much time, you can do every grind classic offers 20 times over in that time. Not to mention that "persistence" of your character is an illusion when new expansion hits - with new level cap, new skills, new borrowed powers - its not same character anymore save the nick. The more believable explanation for me is - SoD grinds and time sinks aren't interesting/different enough from regular classic to really lure people in. I have a friend that says the same "yeah i can't be arsed if its seasonal" and I get how people can feel like that but reason is not because its seasonal actually. What do you actually get from "persistence" of your character across the expansions - reps you grinded in vanilla mean nothing in wotlk, gear you grinded in vanilla means nothing in wotlk... Think people should start putting effort in focusing on playing and creating memories to cherish, that was and is the only thing that truly persists. All other talk is BS. It's like people are afraid to say "man I wish I had time to play this hardcore like old days but I can't because I'm 30 now and I have to deal with other shit". That's fine to say that. Instead they invent shit excuses like "oh I would but its seasonal so whatever..."

[@Eyeshadow11]

Xaryu I have so much respect for the amount of restraint and levelheadedness you showed while viewing certain parts of this video. For example the insanely narcissistic egomaniacal rant beginning around 39:00. Asmon is a great content creator, one of the best ever perhaps, but this dude is completely out of touch and a victim of his own success. The close up blinks said it all lol. Your a legend bro keep up the great work.

[@priapus1337]

Bad take - gdkp is good for people that are geared, or people that want to make gold or people that like the reward if they don’t win gear. Not every gdkp involves gold buyers…depends on who you raid with.

[@싸넬동지-7성담배]

Everyone focused on GDKP when you have Incursions that fucked the economy and the people who bought golds prior Incursions. Would be nice if *Warcraft logs* tracked gold incomes and invalidate parses of guilds that had a gold buyer.

[@cochila91]

I will say that you are saying Asmon prefers a loot council system. I think he prefers the same style as me which is a loot council system but not a schedule that I have to show up every week. A system that is the same as loot council but not a work schedule where I have to show up 4 days out of the week for 4 hours. And if my class isn't the best, I'm not going to get the gear in a loot council even if I'm performing better than other players who are playing the better class.

[@mwhitee]

He's arguing for GDKP's from a Loot Council mindset. To say a bad player doesn't deserve gear is wrong but it does suck when a player who doesn't raid regularly wins loot rolls. Like for me in Cata Classic, I've been raid logging the last few months and miss raids occasionally, i find myself passing on gear that I might need to let other guildies get the gear because they are still maining their cata toons. Maybe that's a me thing, but I don't think I should take gear knowing the next time I'll use it is on the next raid day.

[@meowcheeses9870]

Streamers in osrs 1000% influence their viewers voting heavily and anyone who says otherwise is insane tbh

[@chaosi17]

This is what im saying… Asmon’s take on gold buyers is so disjointed from reality. They will ALWAYS make new accs, thats kinda why cybersecurity and hackers exist bro…. Like what. How is blizzard gonna permanently stop them lmao…. 😅

[@anyroad5455]

He’s just ignorant.

[@pieter2664]

hmm GDKP thing was huuuge, me and many other mature players left SOD After P1 cuz of the GDKP ban. They banned the one and only good loot system in the game haha. GDKP is simply the best because it allows someone to work towards an item. No one goes home empty-handed because even those who don't get an item still receive gold. After raiding a few times, you have enough gold to buy an item. It’s straightforward. You don't have to worry about some newbie with a lot of luck taking your desired item for the fifth time. Loot Council also sucks; they are just as corrupt as they were 20 years ago, with the council and their friends grabbing all the items while regular raiders, who don't kiss ass 24/7, leave empty-handed. GDKP can also be done with randoms, it's always fair. In WoW Classic, it is a misconception that you needed all classes for raids. If you look at the top-performing raid groups in Naxxramas, you'll notice many "sweaty" combinations. As many Warriors were brought along as possible because they were simply the best.

[@maxsvensson6919]

The moment i realized No Arena, they couldnt even add ruins of Lordaeron map...... For example one thing that made Vanilla good was classes could do 1 thing forcing ppl together an working together. And first thing I hear is healing Mage, Tank lock. They are going the complete wrong way, its narcassist that have seen the money and power in Blizzard and for the Last 15 years now taken up the the posisions that Me and 3 other RANDOM players could make a better game in 24h with

[@spardzy1]

GDKPs are totally not necessary lmao. What do you do when you’re max geared even quicker via GDKP? Just farm gold and then what you’re already BiS geared. This just leads to more gold selling. You also don’t need guilds to do raids in classic, GDKPs are just pugs of random players most of the time, still works for them

[@shadowviruz]

At this point I legitimately want a new Warcraft game that isn't a remaster of something that came before. I want WoW2 or Warcraft 4 or a souls like rpg based in Warcraft lore (Broxigar)

[@sunder2936]

SoD effectively killed off the whole point of why vanilla and later classic is so cherished and fun and despite lacking the sheer content compared to retail and even the progressive classic servers it has a charm which still has people rerolling and playing the same content 1-60 through to naxx and HWL. SoD came along and phase 1 was really quite fun and felt great and the anticipation was there for what was to come. IMO they shouldn't have given us anymore new abilities until 60 after the first wave, they gave us just enough where classes immediately felt great without being completely broken, i would have been happy with those and carried on to 60. Instead not only did they add more and more abilities, but they made the gear from the raids so good that their was literally no reason to do any content besides the raids only you are stuck at levels where there was is nothing else to do in the game. And a vanilla server stuck at 40 and 50 is just boring. Like what is the point to even log on at that point. The incursions and world pvp events never play out like blizzard intends when they design them, they are always unfair to the weaker side and it becomes "how can i efficiently grind this event for whatever currency/rep i can get every couple hours". So now instead of people grinding out the world and dungeons naturally as intended in classic because that was all we had, but the gear was relevant all the way from 15-60. you just raid a raid which doesn't have any of the depth of a retail raid, and then you log off. Hence why you see lots of people returning to era servers and HC servers or stick to retail and cata. Its interesting but, we pretty much got to see a fast tracked version of how wow changed from vanilla to modern in the space of a few months and why so many people grow tired of it.

[@Saiku]

The only role/class change I like is tank warlocks. They were always giga strong solo levelers, tons of interesting utility, but meh dps. Demon form tank lock is the one exception imo, but tank rogues and especially healer mages is stupid.

[@jaei6680]

He goes on a crusade on gacha games for them having p2w, then complains about WoW not being f2w enough.