Why SSF is better than Trade League.

[@Zizaran]

Keep in mind this is Ziz's personal opinion. You should play wherever you find the most fun!

[@Bymen]

The title should reflect that in some way and not sound like a definite statement. Just my personal opinion. :)

[@Phendoxia]

Keep in mind Ziz gets paid to play PoE and can play 12 up to 10 hrs on average.

[@tylerschuler6853]

It's still a clickbait title? Just cause you make a comment, doesn't make it less scummy.

[@razhyel_]

I wish there would be a party self found mode and only these people with their accounts could group and trade with u. I love to play with my girlfriend, but i cant stand another trade league season because of that. It is so annoying.

[@MrElvisNilsson]

@@tylerschuler6853 The video is about Ziz explaining why he finds SSF better then trade and also giving counter examples... What more do you need.

[@camarada1996]

On SSF, dropping an exalt: "Oh! Nice" On SSF, dropiing a build-enabling unique worth 1alch in trade league: "Oh shit!! WTF?! I needed this"

[@ciphereal]

Fr, got a unique I just traded to a vendor since it wouldn't be worth it in trade but then I got it in ssf and made a build around it

[@schtauffen-plays]

0:55 "The only way to play a video game wrong is to not have fun. Anyone who tells you otherwise is dumb." -Ziz 2021

[@Roquer1]

Can you please do a video on 'reading the screen' for dangerous ground effects, monster attacks, status effects etc.? I feel that most of the times i died it was due to not having a clue of what was going on on screen

[@Roquer1]

@Bing Bong Barry Oh, thanks that helped

[@Gromtall]

@Bing Bong Barry yea its super protip for everything. I did not learn anything new until i discover that i just need to not be stupid 4Head

[@fancydeeldo]

@Bing Bong Barry there's a reason people like you don't have friends

[@dukeofnuke2446]

turn of sounds and ambient effects and keep voices and chat alerts on high. Allows you to hear i.e. Sirus "Die" better and your brain can focus just on the visuals

[@erikb4407]

Your comment makes it seem like PoE doesn't already have perfect visual clarity. As a definite non-GGG employee, I can say with confidence that there's tons of visual clarity in PoE, especially on summoner builds, so you should be able to see exactly what's killed you. However, if you're still having trouble, try using the new kill replay feature to see which enemy's ability dealt the largest amount of damage to you :^ )

[@DaJodad]

I think SSF is the best way to play the game as well, 6k hours in and it was where I had the most fun. Now that I lost an arm though? I have no choice but to play trade just to get the basic uniques required to use builds based around a single hand.

[@enlightendbel]

The problem with trade is that as you become more experienced with the game, trade makes everything pretty much useless. You start making a lot of currency which makes just buying items trivial, which makes every build just a matter of grinding currency and buying the items you want. This devalues every item from priceless to sometimes 5 minutes of currency grinding. In SSF, you have to make due with what you get and what you are able to craft. Sometimes luck isn't on your side and you still figure a way to make things work. Currency also turns from the main focus of the game to being worthless beyond it's crafting use. This makes higher value currency next to useless in SSF while lower currency becomes more and more important.

[@tacticiana3437]

@@enlightendbel as a totally non-objective counter to this: I hate gearing my character through drops/crafting. My favorite part of this game is running content. I enjoy the loop of playing maps (and sometimes delve or heists) Being able to just engage with maps or the gameplay I enjoy, and buy all my gear is why I love this game. I think if I had to play ssf I wouldnt play the game.

[@AlanGurling]

I've found playing PoE with one hand using the Logitech G604 to be somewhat doable. Probably won't scale well all the way to the end game though.

[@whocalms8504]

man I didn't realize trading was like that lol. I play soft core (cause I am new and I die way more than ziz) I never msg anyone more than once, I always say TY after a trade, I've waited 10 min before for someone to finish something and I've never gotten mad from waiting or someone not responding I always just move on to the next seller. I can't believe people are actually like that. lol

[@whocalms8504]

@David Powell I've had nothing but good experiences so far but then again I only play solo or with friends from my discord and only deal with other players via trading but so far it's been ok

[@skrishna3]

I'm a new player and I just got a character to tier 2 maps. Not sure if it's the general mood of the playerbase or just the server I had joined, some people got super toxic at me for asking about crafting tips from the other players in the server.

[@kvahlman]

SSF really emphasises the best part of PoE, progression. Character, gear or the Atlas; you don't get to shortcut any of those through other people. The game feels more rewarding, suddenly rares on floor become interesting and getting really good gear occupies you for much longer. But it is indeed very limiting when it comes to build selection and the amount of build that is easy to do.

[@patrickbayr8244]

Ive started to play SSF HC after i play trade league this season and now all ladies are so attracted to me , that i cant progress anymore- do you have any tips for me ziz?

[@majinanti6]

xd

[@sipsix]

Lol relatable

[@Rhodur]

dunno if youll see this, but if so, do you think you could make an SSF guide at some point ziz? like how you cap res, how to hunt for gear, what filter to use, good things to farm for certain resources, e.t.c.

[@RoGa766]

it would be great, I think i'll try ssf next league, rly want to watch it

[@SaigenSyndrome]

I think an introductionary guide and more advanced strategies for SSF would be great

[@wykettou]

This video would be great but that SSF chat is super useful as well, 773, like SSF on phone keyboard. SSF chat is gold!

[@destroyermaker]

He has a SSFHC guide that has some of what you'd want

[@Dawid-hr6bi]

I like playing on sc to buy *only* the build enabling shit, the rest im pretty much ssf. And on hc angle, i dont have the time to relevel when my pc decides to drop my fps for a few seconds

[@webbike]

this ^

[@at_]

I have the same issue, I’ll get a 1-2 second freeze client side and when my pc decides to finally display everything again I’m dead

[@sebastianholsclaw]

Right, this game isn’t stable enough for me to be interested in hard core.

[@destroyermaker]

Best of both for sure

[@minstorm]

The shock collar would be particularly effective when you price an item too cheap and get about 100 messages in 1 minute. Electrocute time!

[@GigaChadJecht]

Collar plus doryani prototype

[@LoveOneSV]

Don't fetish shame me.

[@dukeofnuke2446]

I try to always to respond to trade requests when I sell something, even if it is sold already I always reply with "sorry sold"

[@imadeyoureadthis1]

Real mvp

[@schmockonaut4843]

/autoreplay sorry sold xd

[@anotherks7297]

I try to but sometimes when I I underprice it gets too crazy.

[@pwnnr13]

Same, and by using a trade macro/program like poe companion it's just 1 click away, that's the least I can do so the person don't need to wait or whatever, and I hope atleast sometimes people do the same towards me ^^

[@mokopium9094]

You can also just decide to play SSF in trade league .. if you trust yourself

[@Xirpzy]

Ye im not spending 200 hours just to get decent gear. Rather buy it after 10 and enjoy endgame SSF.

[@somethingneeddoing021]

@@DamienBaka so like 99.9% of softcore trade players?

[@velaxibaldy932]

@@somethingneeddoing021 What? You guys don't have a team where 1 guys dedicated himself for trading only while the other just mapping the juicest map ever making 1ex/min?

[@Meitti]

@@Xirpzy So you get all your gear from trade, you no longer can play "SSF" no matter what because you didnt find your gear yourself. You're just playing "S" (Solo).

[@Xirpzy]

@@Meitti I dont get all my gear from trade... I know what SSF means.

[@Inkaflare7]

Personally, I don't think SSF is viable at all for anyone who doesn't play as much as you do, Ziz, be it because they get burned out or because they just don't have the time, unless they don't mind never seeing the endgame. I'm a softcore trade player, who can play 1-2 hours per weekday tops, and 4-5 on the weekend - unless I'm busy with something else, of course, which also happens frequently. It already takes me nearly the entire league to fill out my Atlas (by which I mean collecting all the watchstones and most/all Maven passives in the current endgame) and get a crack at the final endgame content (currently the Maven fight). If I was playing SSF I'd probably reach my first Sirus by the end of the league. Aside from that, the amount of builds I'm locked out of in SSF is another factor but that's more of a personal preference thing than anything else, imo. The actually insane timesink PoE is becoming to get anything done and see all content before the league ends is a huge barrier of entry to SSF, imo. You definitely have a point in trading being annoying and stressful these days. That's one of the reasons why I trade as little as possible in general as well, and one of the reasons I'm miffed about how badly Harvest was nerfed. Another advantage of SSF is that you actually engage with mechanics and items and builds you wouldnt consider otherwise because they're the only way to get something specific that you need, or because it's simply the only option you have at the time, and I consider that a good thing because of extra variety. But overall I can't see myself ever going into SSF and locking myself out of most content because of the sheer time investment needed being amplified by several levels of amgnitude due to completely losing access to trading as well.

[@72dimi15]

ziz makes this vid so less ppl could succumb to the accursed fate that is trading with him

[@sober667]

There is multiple reasons i dont play SSF - i play fair share with friends - i love to play realy outlandish wierd builds wich are extremaly hard to pull off( thou that may be for or against) -i dont play THAT much even so i wana play SSF HC i always say Maby next leuge on top of that i dont trade that muhc - usualy get one or two pieces wich i NEED craft rest

[@toxicrengar7572]

thats basicly one of the best and most fun ways to play poe

[@stenlundrikard]

Me and a couple of friends create our own league every launch. Then we get to play "friendly SSF" without any third party trade, and also play with each other. However it does cost some points but I find it great.

[@daviewaviee6079]

The second point! 💯💯💯💯 I'd be absolutely *MISERABLE* trying out some of the builds I've got rolling now if I had to FARM every individual build-defining unique... 🥲🤢🤮

[@sebastianholsclaw]

“The amount of time you waste trading is insane”. That’s entirely because GGG has chosen to intentionally bork trade. You listed a bunch of things that are entirely under GGGs complete control. Especially for currency and maps (the two area most likely to make you have to message 50 people) they could easily make a trade system that is automatic even if item trading needed to be in person.

[@JosephOfTheJungle]

They have that exact idea on Xbox.

[@sebastianholsclaw]

Joseph Peterson right which makes it so frustrating that they refuse to implement something they are clearly 100% able to do.

[@Ycesugho]

A well-designed Auction House > SSF > Trade system in its current state

[@Gorden121]

I understand you added "well-designed" to appease haters of the concept, but in reality any Auction House would do. There is really no way to fuck up an Action House in PoE that would make trade even worse than it is.

[@kevinkk111]

I would agree on that order honestly. Also: the only thing I would change on the current trade system is to make trades instant.. like.. add some post office shit to the hideout that gets triggered by the whispers that takes currency from your public stashes and exchanges it with the item in the public tab you want to buy. Both send to the mailbox npc or seperate stash or whatever. Just a personal opinion tho.

[@madsealion3863]

3 doritos later (or about 3 years to be precise) boom

[@ProblmSolvd]

I like SSF because I get to use all my currency. I feel bad slamming or multicrafting an item that isn't all max rolled t1s when I can just buy something perfect. In SSF if I don't make it, I can't rely on ever having the item, feels great when you finally finish that one perfect rare.

[@Isndar]

I play Trade league but I only buy from people if I need certain item from them but I never sell my items to people All of my loots I received simply became Alterations so I can convert it into Chaoses

[@technosmiley]

"if your not having fun your playing wrong" love the start. keep it up Ziz. i usually play trade (what ruins it is complainers) but might switch to SSF since i've got a lot more experience in the game

[@paulamblard3836]

"if you play POE 200-400 hours per month"

[@azarlgor]

Meanwhile me and probably plenty of others play PoE like 20-50 hours a month

[@TamsuO]

My thought was "shit, is that what counts as playing a lot? I might actually have a problem"

[@TheKalabu]

at 200 hours a day that is 7 hours a day every day....so u know if u support yourself like a responsible adult 40 hours a week job lul have like 1 or 2 days where u can have a few hours to do grocery shopping, eating, seeing friends etc.... at 400 u are at 14 hours a day soooo every day is eat sleep poe and buy lottery ticket that gets you millions so you can pay to do that?!?!? How the fuck does this relate to people? even 200 hours a month shouldn't relate to people....

[@TamsuO]

@@TheKalabu You're only counting in the weekdays thou mate. Also we have the rona right now so most people aren't seeing their friends as much as usually. How many hours per week do you need for grocery shopping anyways?

[@szilardtoth5642]

@@TamsuO That's still ~13 hours a day. Pretty crazy if you think about it. Not the 13 hour-per-day, but doing it a month or two. That's borderline insane. As a normal and social adult, you can only do that, if your friends also play POE and your GF and/or you are a streamer. Even 7-8 hours/day is a lot, you need time for tiding your house, cleaning, groceries, cook, gym, worse if you have pets... No problem with playing a day or two or maybe a week for 6 hours or more per day, but anything more than that is unhealthy and leads to burnout, eventually.

[@anthonydevincent6287]

I started my first ssfhc character a couple days ago after playing over 2000 hours in trade league. It's really crazy how different the experience is. Ssfhc has been super enjoyable to the point I'm really thinking about doing it for the start of the next league. :)

[@wykettou]

As a player who barely understand mapping but 0 understandings in crafting, I still gave a try to SSF some leagues ago. Man, it changed my vision on PoE. You finally farm for reasons. You get objectives to do. No more "Just do maps as quick as possible to get currencies" Now it's more D2 mindset where you get to farm what you need for your build

[@blarley]

playing my second league ever in the form of a faux group self found with a buddy - would love to see it formally implemented. It's forced me to actually learn the game's many mechanics and be flexible with my build. Definitely an all around more rewarding experience. An exalt actually means something to me now - rather than just an item collected to buy upgrades.

[@karg134]

For players that share the issue shown in the intro, there are several chat commands that can reduce your exposure to spam. /dnd 'message' = blocks all messages, u don't see anything and the sender receives the set autoreply /autoreply 'message'= if you usually sell less items, but at higher prices you might want to use autoreply instead, for example 'give me minute, ultimatum/blight/heist etc' You won't have to rush the map, or risk dying just to type reply and the buyer at least knows u are active so he can hope for some deal. Alternatively trade macros like awakened poe trade allows you to set up individual replies and hotkeys, like invite to hideout, trade, type message, kick from party or invite to party etc.

[@oddmann8875]

I played dominating blow on ssf this league and somehow managed to find The scourge (got it from an inscribed ultimatum for a lori's lantern). That was such a big rush!

[@camarada1996]

Exactly, some worthless uniques in trade are literally build-enabling on SSF

[@Bathmman]

Play trade league + never trade = SSF So if you dont feel like playing SSF any longer you can start trading, so never have to feel forced into trading or not trading

[@KeKNine]

you can migrate your ssf character to trade league whenever you want. If you don't want to play ssf or if you drop something insane, you can migrate either one or all your character s

[@scullyxd]

I play like this , avoid trading as much as possible without trading. Sometimes theres a crazy hard unqiue to get

[@Bathmman]

@@KeKNine extra work...

[@Scyrella]

I really think you need to make a SSF guide about the basics and what to expect and what are the approaches you can take! Maybe co host it with another ssf streamers like Raiz or someone else.

[@KYLDA]

Did my first SSF league for Ulti and it really encouraged me to learn the crafting systems. I'd say its worth doing for a league even if you decide you don't like it, personally I'm going to stick with it from now on

[@PowerfulVillain]

Wish you can confirm and close a full trade directly from anywhere and everywhere. When the trade whisper comes to you, the same chat message should also have a [yes] / [no] option. If the other person has the required currency in their inv/bank, it'll finish the deal then and there. Items bought that way will go to a remove-only stash.

[@HundredSpear]

I usually played SC trade at the beginning of a league. Mid league I played a few HCSSF characters to around maps(they mostly die there) and have fun with the gauntlet later in the league (made to maps last time for the first time). But this league i decided with my friend that we both start in SCSSF just to not feel the "pressure" of needing to be effecient to make the most ex/h and we both really loved it. When I achieved everything I wanted (killing Sirus , Shaper, Elder and Cortex) I switched to trade league to just throw in my currency and have fun with builds that I couldn't play because of SFF. Best decicion I ever made. No stress in league start and a fun "finish/mid league" to play around in trade. And from league to league I enjoy my occasional HC trips more and more since I'm getting farther and farther (also because of you and your videos).

[@theluo652]

I think one thing that might be lost on you in this video is your own advice "Hideout is lava". Sure I have the item listed for trade but it was posted in the first week of the league when i was desperately trying to sell something. Early in the league "meh" stuff can indeed sell for 1-5 chaos and if you sell a few of those items you can get enough currency to begin your trade flipping to make the currency you need for your actual build. (i.e. flipping div decks, or spam splitting astral plates etc) For that reason TONS of people have 1, 3, 5, 10, 20 chaos dump tabs they just fill with anything that MIGHT sell. but later in the league it's not worth it to take those trades if you're doing a juiced map (which in SC most people are) and it's also not worth to clean those tabs out (H/O is lava). From personal experience I won't take those low value trades unless I'm already in my h/o looking something up or trying to trade someone else. It's just not worth. It's one of the reasons SC players want a AH.

[@LoDaFTA]

Trade league would be fixed if they made a Trade Tab. This tab should automatically send-receive trade items based on the specifications set by the seller. So you want to sell an item. You put the item on the tab, set the price, and when someone wants to trade, they need to put the exact amount of currency in the tab to make the trade possible. After the trade is made, the received items go to a separate tab that you can choose. You would do the same as today with premium tabs, but instead of receiving a message from a rando, the game takes care of everything.

[@ivanr.1005]

That would be called Trade Market and u r right, this will fix waiting and pricefixers (i hate them).

[@maxnibler6090]

I'm trying ssf for the first time this league. I finally understand the struggles of getting a six link. I'm still having tons of fun tho. I just need to commit to a foothills grind for the imperial legacy cards

[@judgedredd8750]

Dispassionately observing Zizaran's slow transition into a garden gnome.

[@ChubbyPOE]

Why can't we make trading automatic? If you list something for 20 chaos and someone wants to buy it, then he can just click one button and the item will automatically transport from your stash to his, and his 20 c will transport to your stash. Ain't that awesome?

[@Althissian]

I've played SSF for three leagues and I just don't get anywhere in time. I came back to trade this league and I love it. There are plenty high end goals for me, like crafting perfect items. This just isn't an option on SSF.

[@Max-tg1cv]

i'm usually playing together with a friend and would really enjoy an SSF mode where i can only play and trade with them but noone else.

[@yoyodragons]

it's a private league

[@wesso27]

thats the concepts of a private league

[@AnitaPOE2]

Just dont trade and play with anybody else?!

[@coachfrank8831]

Do you think there is a way GGG could change sale tabs? Maybe make it so when you put an item in for whatever price you choose and somebody wants that item they could pull up some kind of in game window and browse your sale tab and buy the item from it so nobody got scammed/had to dig through the afk players to buy what they wanted. If there was a way to do that you could even buy things from offline players. Maybe even pop up a notification for the seller giving them a small window of time to deny the sale in case they priced the item wrong or something if they are online. And if it was possible to do that they could even put in a notification window when you logged into a character that would tell you what sold and how much you made while you were offline. Idk if that would be possible or even a reasonable request considering how much work they would have to do to overhaul the stash system and trade site but I think something like that would completely remove all the annoying parts of trade. Edit: Maybe instead of reworking stash tabs they could just put in a secondary stash through some kind of courier npc and have all transactions go through it instead so no reworks to stash would be required.

[@2501kb]

I've been playing SSF this league, and my problem is I do not know which items "opens up" which builds. Is there a good resource where you can look up items and such?

[@carnaedy]

Great video. I personally have played SC-Trade up until now, but I have grown somewhat disillusioned by it, and I trade extremely rarely anyway. Maybe I would reconsider if we got a proper implementation of an Auction House, but for now, SC-SSF seems increasingly tempting, and I might even give HC a shot on a throwaway character.

[@solriver267]

is there a need to keep any influenced items that is not part of my build? like a hunter influenced one hand mace? could i draw the influence mod out of it? thanks.

[@LHMov]

There's an orb for that.

[@danievdw]

Could have named the video " Why Path of Exile need a Auction House " .

[@lifereturned]

I would definitely play SSF if you were able to trade with people in your guild or something to take effect. I play with my friends (less than 10 people) and we dont trade for items outside of our guild. It makes it interesting and fun to help each other out.

[@rizzocsgo8189]

That would rather defeat the purpose of SOLO self found, wouldn't it? :p

[@Unitos_]

I play self-imposed SSF, so me and my buddies can trade together, but we restrict no trading outside of the boys.

[@sagiezov3969]

Hi Zizaran! as a fairly inexperienced player I have a problem on SSF where I don't really know what to do with the items I get and how to get what I need. How can I get into SSF?

[@omega1231]

Milestones, it gets harder once you want to min/max your character for end-game, but to start out with, you can for example say that you want this amount of health before this point, like 1200 roughly for act 5 kitava, you want to be rescapped before innocence in act 5. Personally i think the foundation of SSF is setting goals for yourself, and then what SSF is becomes the things you have to do or get, to achieve the goal you set for yourself, like a certain build, or killing a certain boss (like you need reflect immunity for Atzhiri), completing the Atlas, as in doing all bonus objectives etc. Now, and this is the part of why people say that even if you have several hundred hours in the game, you're still probably fairly new to the game, because there is a lot to learn that can only be learned through playing the game, like is it worth using alterations on a pair of lvl 8 slippers for movement speed? Yes it is, to get into SSF you really have to be willing to chance your currency, because all currency is crafting, i don't think twice about spending 20 chaos on what would be worth less than 20 chaos on trade league, like spending 20 chaos on a cluster jewel just to get 2 notables (as in the notes on cluster jewels that does more than just "10% increased elemental damage"). Often on SSF you start out with a build that doesn't rely heavily on gear to get to maps, and then you use that to farm the gear you need to make the build you take to end game. To get into SSF, you really need to be able to enjoy the journey more so than the end result, because you might never actually reach the end, if your goal was to have a certain item drop for a certain build, the item might never drop, and that's fine, because the journey is what mattered in the end, and that's where milestones matter more than setting goals, because you might not reach your goal, but perfecting the milestones inbetween means that you will be more likely to reach your goal next time because you are more efficient and now you know what to do. Your first character might not even make it to maps, but your second character might, your third character definently will etc. and more specifically about milestones, you want to account for the res penalties for act 5 and 10 kitava, and you want to make sure that you have around 3k health when you start in maps - that is probably the most basic forms of milestones for learning SSF and in terms of what good gear looks like in SSF, because a high rolled dual-res, 80 life and 25% movement speed boots on SSF is poggers, while meh on trade league.

[@levitastic]

I like SSF more because its based on ur own gameplay not someone elses, BUT when i get to a certain level and i dont do enough dmg anymore it does feel tedious that u cant upgrade

[@hiddenmaster6062]

Why is it that nobody says if the drop rates are different or not? Like OK you like it. Is disabling trade all there is to it?

[@Woodyyz]

The real problem is that the trade site doesnt update the items delisting fast enough. People get bored to replay that the item is sold. I usualy replay sold 2 3 4 times then i dont bother. Got mesages even after 1 hour after the item sold.

[@KingOfBlades27]

Poe is already a massive timesink. So no thanks to ssf 😂

[@KotauFPS]

Facts. Ive been playing trade league softcore for many leagues and have never killed any final league bosses (think sirus, oshabi, chayula, shaper, etc...). Specially if they require plenty of farming to access them; I have battled some of them like oshabi but never managed to kill them. For me the game in ssf and hc would be basically getting to maps without dying.

[@daviewaviee6079]

100%. There's so much s**t to do, I'll never have enough time. That long uphill slog every league is bad enough. Excacerbating this via SSF sounds like agony to me, personally.

[@RFlairPC]

You just suck then

[@Nimroc]

I had been effectively been playing SSF all along even in trade league, so I figured I might as well switch over to actual SSF during Heist. Even if it doesn't technically change anything it feels like I enjoy it more now simply because there is less of a feeling for me that I'm missing out by not trading when I simply can't. Hardcore is a whole different matter though, I want to try it at some point but I fear I'm not good enough to avoid dying yet for me to actually enjoy it. lol

[@mhall5148]

I think that part of the reason trading etiquette is different in HC is that a lot of times there isn't another item to buy. A different rare with those stats isn't for sale, or the next option is significantly more expensive. Also, HC tends to foster a more patient gamer in general.

[@matthewlenard8346]

I mostly play ssf myself. Something I thought would help trade League is set price Trading. I have an item that I wish to sell, I have a set price with no bargaining and I don't care who gets it. In this scenario there is an option where I click a little button that says Auto Sale to the first buyer, ASFB. This would be up to the discretion of the seller and then there could be a whole new meta argument over which way can make more currency faster. 🤓🤓🤓🤯🤓

[@xaviawolf]

yeah im a trade league guy, trying out ssf like last week after being so burnt out on playing trade league for a hefty amount of time, the first few days was hard since raw currency was dropping on me and the urge of me just buying my gear just slips into my head, either way with playing ssf im so grateful with uniques dropping that I know that can either help me gear my current character or help out levelling my "future" character

[@ilyktosk8]

i mean cant you just treat any trade-core league as SSF *with a bonus to trade at will when you really need it*?

[@daviewaviee6079]

This. I understand the irritation with trade spam but I feel absolutely *zero* desire to target farm for items that might be miserable to find. No thank you. I like planning a build ahead, and the way most decent builds (or creative off-meta builds) are set up, there's too many *necessary* uniques. I'm not about to spend a billion hours looking for *one* item that legitimately makes or breaks said build. Just don't trade if you don't like trading, whilst leaving yourself the choice to get that sexy item on Trade Market if RNGesus screws you like it's your honeymoon.

[@balldont_lie9684]

I feel the same , I got interested in SSFHC since the last gauntlet, I trained a lot for the next one on a modded league, and since then I started SSFHC for the pleasure, the pleasure to realize everything by myself, the pleasure to rediscover the game under another angle, and a certain exhilarating and gratifying challenge. Thx for the Gauntlet, thx for all Ziz

[@isumir]

and what is different for ssf and playing without internet?

[@Geist1337]

To me, why SSF is better than Trade league is literally because you're not just BUYING your character. If you're on trade you're buying twink gear, leveling gear, mid game tweaking items, and then the end-game drops, the majority of the time.

[@TheDonGladiator]

Is SCSSF a good way to start for beginners (200h igt)? or should I stay in Trade?

[@GibsonPrime]

Fair opinion, especially if you have many hours to play. This league I have spent 30+ex on gear and grinding that currency out, be it through sales or otherwise, feels like an achievement for me. I've also had 2 trades just this week where people have been happy to wait. Granted, one I replied to the guy I was in uber lab and the second one I was running simulacrum, but they both waited 10-15mins for me to finish. I messaged them when I was done and made the trade.

[@Gromtall]

I did play ssf few leagues and this time i tried private league (conflux) and for me its perfectly balanced. Most of the time its ssf vibe if you not play in group but you have acces to small trading system (~1000 players). I recommend it to anyone who like ssf and trade also. Perfect balance.

[@aaronmcleod387]

I played SSF this league, first time since trying it in Harvest. WIth my starter (chieftan Bladeblast) i did kill Awakener 8. However it was getting difficult to get upgrades without excellent bases and good rolls of dmg & defenses. Ultimatums were rough in t14+. I switched to a glad bleed EQ build. Had an easier time in high maps, but failed awakener 8 twice. My ultimate goal is to kill Maven, but after my second failure with awakener this weekend, even after some nice dps upgrades, i migrated to trade this morning. Both a good feeling and a bad one is that i doubled my gladiator's dps by spending about 4 exalts. Getting an awakened gem, getting a second cluster jewel to craft, a unique jewel to round out block, and an essence worm that i couldnt find in SSF. I agree with not having to trade is awesome, I love the feeling of finding good drops. IDing an item and getting some high resistence rolls, or a good unique is great. But sometimes I just felt so stuck. I tried a lot of things to get the essence worm, but RNG did not shine upon me there. I could see myself giving SSF another shot down the road. For now ill enjoy being much stronger in trade for a bit :)

[@nicolasnikopol7946]

I perfectly agree on the trade system. It's so bad and there so many scammers, like those who cancel the 6l trade and then try to sell the same object but as a 4l-2l. Those who sell two pages of the same item to lower the prices, and those who sell 1 alt item and will NEVER answer you. I play softcore SSF and the game is soooo relaxing. Never again you will say "oh no, in this league my unique jewel is 8 exas, I will never be able to buy it".

[@ukaszkotowicz6601]

5:50 in the video on my second screen and guy pm'd me on softcore to buy an item i insta invite him go to hideout and he never came... i feel like finish map then trade is the way

[@MarkoVuckovic32]

I always enjoyed SSF more even when I didn't have it unlocked yet I completely ignored trading with other players, I only used items I found or bought from NPC shops

[@Yomush]

I don't play SSF but I don't trade a lot either because it disrupts my gameplay and I also play alone. I just don't like when people do everything for me and I feel more accomplished when I kill a difficult boss all by myself and I use trading pretty much just to skip grinding some stuff and get to the fun part (for example buying contracts to do heists)

[@ludzo2347]

I tried SSf for half of ritual and at one point I needed a glorious vanity for a build I was seting up, I tried to chase it for 3 days and gave up. Trade is so much better for me since I can play the content I enjoy the most and get item quickly without burning myself out of the game. And I really enjoy the fact that there is so much currency farming method that no matter what you do, you can progress quite easily.

[@Ellybisa]

I still really want groupfound in the game. One of the reasons I play trade league it to play with my friends and interact with them, I can't really do that in SSF. Groupfound would fix that problem though, I would instantly jump in to that.

[@ksyhan3h]

same.. me and my friend actually used an alt account with no additional stashes. we made a rule that we arent allowed to trade with other players and it's been fun so far. we made it to lvl92 in 1 week and done many of the stuff

[@yoyodragons]

play private league

[@zacharyschreiber6382]

private league is literally that

[@Ellybisa]

@@zacharyschreiber6382 While that is true, I just don't feel like spending that money on a temporary thing thats not the whole three months. I'm not being picky here, i just feel like it's not worth it in the end, therefore im still playing Trade. Maybe im wrong here, but hell, I might never know.

[@rizzocsgo8189]

@@Ellybisa what would be the benefit of a dedicated group/guild found game mode? Leaderboards?

[@jasonchiang251]

I like trade because I can test new builds out constantly. And I can just buy bases if I want to craft something instead of hoping the elder/shaper base will drop

[@WillSindra]

I'm burning out real hard on the game, more and more every league (about 8 years in). I've gone in and out of SSF for absolutely every reason you spoke of, the main one being to drag out the game more because you build on the fly; the loot dictates your build, where in trade, the build dictates the loot. But it's getting harder for me to play. This time around I tried to just not play for the first month. By doing this it would make for a 2 month break since Ritual, I'd be refreshed, and I'd be going in blind. The problem I had though was being aware of how much I'm burning out of the game, and decided to go trade league, as to avoid frustration of not dropping a certain item or currency and being soft locked in progression. I played with the discipline of being SSF in trade until I reached such a point on my character. It worked really well until I broke the notion and purchased a Tabula. This was late into my league starter, but having it made me reroll. Then liquidate. And purchase a few items (the prophecy was locked behind a t15 map and I was at yellow tier). Tldr; I burnt out before red maps. SSF might have been better despite being locked to my loot. The actual reason I'm commenting though is because of the tangent you made on trading. It is fucking trash. I ran out of chaos orbs and wanted to trade just ONE ex. You get annoyed in asking 2 people? I messaged close to 15 people. I deliberately avoided messaging people with a bank of chaos in the thousands, because more often than not they're bots. After 15 people I cracked it, scrolled down to a lower price, messaged the guy with 9k chaos, got the instant invite from the level 11 witch and got my trade. Botting is supposed to be illegal, if it was my game I'd have it like that. Because it's cheating. But without it, casual players can't even trade (in softcore). Idk if it's ego of "only" selling 1ex, but if you list to sale, you commit to it. What a horrible problem in a game designed around player interaction via currency.

[@Gloriankithsanus]

I actually like the trading system. The website is amazing. Yea, the API could respond faster to change, but then again, it's processing an amazing amount of data - live. Sometimes players also do not refresh the website when browsing 200h before actually going to text someone. The only real responding problems you have are on items that are available in masses. Like orbs. But if you wanna exchange currency, you can usually just bulk-sell them instead of texting someone, so it's easier on you, or if you really wanna buy something - like scarabs, fragments or cards, you can hit "live-search" with your currency range in the filter and wait for new offers - you are likely gonna be the very first one to text them and usually get the reply. I spend quite a lot of time trading, cuz this is my first league, but it was never really that annoying to me. I think it's pretty cool that they're not automating the process. This is still very minimal interaction, but it's still supporting the currency system itself. Like, people trade valuable items, instead of a globalized universal single currency, like gold.

[@schtauffen-plays]

Guild Private League is best compromise. We play with a solid 3 and a few extras that play quite a bit less. Between our playgroup we get access to a fair amount of rare items

[@888kloc]

I would like to play SSF but sadly there is none co-op mode since i always play with mine brother, we dont trade that much so it wouldnt matter, if there be SSF co-op mode that would be great.

[@hellojace]

"solo"

[@sidian4257]

Private league is something like that. You'll have trading and coop but only with players you invite to your private league.

[@StormCloudGenerator]

I think the main difference between trade and ssf that I found was that in ssf I was actually using stuff like stacked decks and void cards, the small gamble items. In trade that shiz gets sold immediately because I honestly don't have enough time to gamble in games anymore. That being said, I wish trading was better in PoE... you mentioned only messages two people in HC trade but honestly its exactly the same in HC, sometimes even worse than SC where at least there are more players. Sometimes in HC you are playing SSF because you can't even get hold of that one peep who has the thing you want, and its so overpriced in HC that you might as well farm it yourself.

[@jimmyd694]

I also spend most of my life wearing pyjama pants so Ziz is my hero.

[@harshit233]

I have been wearing them since 2013. They are the best 👍

[@WillyTung]

Know the shopping method I really enjoy in MMORPG's? It's having a ton of players in one location with a merchant stall. I enjoy going from stall to stall to see what they have for sale.

[@Dorkstorm]

Easy solution, play trade league as SSF, and only sell high cost items / trade for build enabling items. Once somethings price is less than 5c, vendor it. When buying, look down the page, pay 1 - 5 c more. get an Instant buy. Most people dont have enough time to play SSF.

[@gubzs]

It's the same reason I play ironman / no trade in other games. I hate feeling that the best use of my time is farming something boring over and over and selling it to someone else. Feels like actually having fun makes me fall behind and I can't take it, so I just play no trade modes.

[@hellowill]

This is why I play trade like SSF... basically keep trading to a minimum, to get the items I need, but don't play 100% efficient because it ruins the fun.

[@imadeyoureadthis1]

I believe the trade system needs a revamp. Something like auction house or market board would really help. You can either trade or play. And if you have to trade with many people, you can male mistakes or not sure if you sold it. It's a bit anxiety inducing.

[@mrnice4434]

I think the main treason for GGG to not do a auction house is that people would be less likely to see micro transaction stuff on other people and there for buy less stuff.

[@imadeyoureadthis1]

@@mrnice4434 this makes some sense.

[@sebastianholsclaw]

Mr Nice they could make an AH for currency and maps (the 2 super annoying trade areas) while leaving item trading to in person.

[@mrnice4434]

@@sebastianholsclaw yeah or maybe make the AH a public place where you can see other like chapter hubs but yeah some change to the current system would be nice

[@Luzarioth]

Alex Jaffe put it best: Trade and ARPGs do not fit, it is a "cursed problem". On the one side, you promise exciting item drops and on the other, thanks to the trade, you degrade everything that drops to an equivalent of buying power... gold (Chaos in this case). On top of that, after having tryed SSF, trade league feels like easy mode poe. "I need X, i buy it", "I want to do Y, i buy entrance", "I need Z to enable the build... i buy it".

[@thealarm7057]

The problem starts when you classify playing the game as "wasting time" in any instance. Like you said, just play and have fun, ignore trying to be the best and most efficient over having fun.

[@Dofahh]

Gonna try playing SCSSF next league, but im scared cause it will remind of of how little i know about the game every second of the way (played about 400-500 hours). However, its also exciting to be forced to learn.

[@doomzx8284]

Imo i prefer playing SSF mid league, cause it doesn't matter when u start anyways most likely if u are not a racer...and on trade its difference between being rich or poor depending how fast you are :)

[@nicholaskillmeier4895]

What are the benefits to playing SSF vs Trade League and just not trading? Wouldn't it make sense to play like SSF on Trade League, but at least have the option to trade if you ever chose to.

[@IIIUNKZ]

Problem with trade that I have is that soon as a ex or couple drop I want to re roll then I am bored then I quit never got to shaper or elder or even situs 5 I play 2 hours during weekdays and 6/8 hours weekends

[@MrKampfwurst]

Over the last years, I played a couple of leagues off and on, but only recently started to learn about many mechanics in crafting etc. Definitely starting SSF next league, because all the crafting aspects really interest me, but never really had to actually get into it in trade league before

[@omega1231]

That to me is the great big draw of SSF, it really forces you to learn the systems too complex in a multiplayer environment to not just go "meh, screw it, i'll just buy it for 5ex"

[@danndach]

and if someone is playing non-SSF league without trading, is it still that bad?

[@Scoundrill00235]

Still ran in trade league, however, tried something different and only traded when absolutely needed for specific things to progress otherwise the league provided 95% of everything I needed to at least comfortably play for the most part. It really did feel a ton better than constantly scouring the trade site for something when I could easily find/bench craft something to get by

[@runslinganOG]

I also switched to SSF, i have more fun, so sick of trade trade spam spam spam and getting spammed for items, feels horrible

[@fr0zeNstriKe]

Honnestlt i play softcore and the thing "i finnish my map" never bothering my buyer.

[@madziuch6034]

I wish there were different league rewards for SSF, not better, not more, just different, like a slightly different color or something :( still playing ssf tho

[@tekkaoz]

It's a different strokes for different folks thing. I personally really enjoy trade because I play with a group of other players, we rarely team up, we're mostly just sitting in discord chatting, but being able to throw something into the guild stash if someone needs something, or share completion on something, or help someone out with a boss is important to me. Without that interaction I might look at SSF, but yeah I'd rather trade honestly. Yes there are private leagues but paying that kind of money for a half dozen people? Yeah nah.

[@casualsinner]

I've been playing SSF only ever since it was added to the game. For me its just not satisfying to have any rare item on a trade league, if you can just grind irrelevant content to build up currency and buy the item. If you see a headhunter on trade league you know there is a 99.9% chance the player grinded enough currency to buy it in order to then grind more currency faster. But if you see the same headhunter on SSF you immediately be like 'what? how? whats the story of getting THAT thing?' i guess its just the urgency of a competitive mindset to achieve everything on your own without help or shortcuts.

[@t1nytim]

I hate trade, but love playing with my friends. So I play trade, but actively play as if it's SSF, other than trading between friends. Though I did have 1 friends come over from D3 for the first time this league. And he's a very competent person, so is fine doing T16 juiced maps, done A8 Sirius, Shaper, etc this league having never really played before. And he said he does regret partipating in trade, as he feels like he missed a large portion of the game, basically going from T5 -> T14+ in a matter of hours because of trade. Whereas he's seen me progress slower, but seemingly having more fun with the league, having to actually play my way through to the end game.

[@btarczy5067]

Finally my opinion is now confirmed objectively true! Whenever I will get bullied for bringing up that I play SSF in a conversation I can point to this video. It might still get awkward when they ask me what the fuck Path of Exile is or just to move away from them but at least I‘ll know I‘m right.

[@curcubitator]

For a new player like me it was easier to learn the nightmare of trading than learn the poe crafting system for which I personally feel like I need a university degree.

[@DiHickman]

so much this! Ultimatum is my third league, and I only just started trading in this league (besides with my husband). Crafting is a whole other thing!

[@SYG_Aegis]

I only have a few hundred hours into the game. And 300 hours into it, i switched to SSF and finally started enjoying the game. Sure it was harder especially since I'm still rather now, but the gameplay fits me better. Good stuff Ziz.

[@majestrix8792]

sometimes i get like messages 3hrs after the item beeing sold, the api is just riddicules sometimes

[@destroyermaker]

I had a lot of fun playing SSF for the first time in Ritual. Beat Sirus 8 (first time also) and a bunch of other bosses. With harvest nerfed I'm kind of turned off it now (even though I wasn't close to making gg items). That and I value my time too much to spend two days farming div cards. So now I play trade and price/sell little or not at all - I just buy the things that would take me a long time to get in SSF. I will try again in POE2 or maybe before if they implement smart loot before it launches.