Why The Allies Were ALWAYS Going to Win the Battle of the Bulge

[@TheIntelReport]

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[@timf2279]

Thank you for a legitimate sponsor. Goat guns is very popular.

[@atakorkut5110]

I have always wondered this: what exactly is synthetic oil? How do you make it exactly and I assume it’s not as efficient as gasoline or oil derived from natural carbon fuels?

[@timf2279]

Made from coal, natural gas. The modern synthetic oils same deal.

[@Suprsim]

14:08 there is a typo on the screen, the T and I are switched

[@austinsmallwood4601]

W

[@Dreadhead02productions]

The horse drawn cart refueling the Bf109 at 16:25 really sums up the German war effort at this stage...

[@Jimbotheone]

Despite the German propaganda about their mechanized army, horses were always a large part of their logistical support.

[@floydvaughn9666]

At every stage. That photo could just as well have been taken in 1939.

[@kurtwoods9789]

@@Jimbotheone allied troops remarked that you could tell Germans were nearby from the smell of horse sweat and leather.

[@streetgato9697]

Looking at the bright side, at least the Germans could and did slaughter their pack animals when cutoff and faced with starvation.

[@kurtwoods9789]

@@streetgato9697 eat to live today only to get caught by the Russians tomorrow

[@MaxwellAerialPhotography]

If your offensive plan relies on capturing anything from the enemy asides from roads and bridges, its probably a bad plan.

[@richardsawyer5428]

Absolutely. Japanese tactics in Burma were similar. Slim's forces were able to stand, fight and deny their supplies to the Japanese and they were defeated as a result.

[@razinabbas4551]

That does sound familiar to Operation Market Garden.

[@wisconsinfarmer4742]

that was a big concept in Bush's Iraq-2, that the USA would have cheap oil for decades.

[@MaxwellAerialPhotography]

@@wisconsinfarmer4742 that’s not even remotely correct.

[@wisconsinfarmer4742]

@@MaxwellAerialPhotography Yeah I realized it after I wrote it. But left it up anyway was a demo of the folly of war thinking.

[@andrewklang809]

I find it hilarious to hear World War 2 being described as "a fantastic waste of everyone's time."

[@AlechiaTheWitch]

That was the first wotld war. That war did not need to happen. It was a bunch of old men with egos figbting for pride

[@hinz1]

Also lots of research, atomic bomb, jet engine, liquid fueled rockets/ballistic missiles, cruise missiles, radar, first real electric submarine... So not total waste of time, IMO. Atomic bomb combined with good jet/missile delivery system would basically win the war for anyone who got it right first. War was decided by strategic bombing, though

[@cjthebeesknees]

@@AlechiaTheWitch Sounds like most wars in general.

[@ADogNamedStay]

@@hinz1 all of that would have happened anyways.

[@ADogNamedStay]

@@hinz1 either way, all that for a fantastic waste of everybody's time and effort.

[@Kevin-mx1vi]

As the old military adage says "Amateurs talk tactics, professionals talk logistics".

[@zachmdful]

Was going to comment nearly the same thing!

[@BeingFireRetardant]

Which is hilarious considering nearly all US logistics are outsourced to China, etc. The very manufacturing capacity that won the war for the allies is now in the hands of its enemies... ahem, near-peer adversaries. Largely because people are stupid, have short memories, and think with their wallet. Welcome to the brave new world. Time to learn Cantonese.

[@looinrims]

It’s not old to begin with, but I have to ask why all you armchair amateurs always say this when you don’t know either? Or the reasons either are needed in any situation Your logistics are pointless if the enemy rolls over you and takes your shit, and vice versa

[@looinrims]

@@menwithven8114 no, Russia has faltered in assuming the Ukrainians wouldn’t put up organized resistance

[@Marin3r101]

@@looinrims organized guerrilla resistance. They are not fighting conventionally.

[@TexasAnlaShok]

The ultimate lesson of WWII is don’t go to war. Failing that, don’t go to war with nations that have more resources than yours. And whatever you do, don’t go to war with TWO of them!

[@Arizona-ex5yt]

An interesting alternative history is what if the Germans and Japanese did everything to keep the US out of the war, obsessively maintaining neutrality at all costs. I'm convinced the US would not have fought for Dutch or British colonies in Southeast Asia unless Japan directly attacked US holdings. Germany would have had to simply tolerate Lend Lease shipments to Britain. Would the UK, China, the USSR, and the miscellaneous other Allies have been able to win eventually? And what year would that have been? The Soviets didn't develop the A-bomb until 1949 and it's unlikely they would have developed one that early with out the US using using them first.

[@Dethfeast]

I can only imagine what was going through Hitler's mind in Dec '41. Your big Russian offensive has stalled out, and you were counting on a Blitzkrieg victory in '41 which obviously wasn't happening by then. You were still at war with England, who was bombing you. Japan, who hasn't lifted a finger to help you with your war in Russia like you thought they would, starts a war with America. So what sort of stupidity compelled Hitler to declare war on America when Japan hadn't declared war on Russia? It was so absurd. There was literally nothing in it for Germany but a guaranteed loss.

[@QueenAleenaFan]

@@Arizona-ex5yt if Japan had just stuck to attacking China, odds are China would have folded and we'd be dealing with the Japanese empire today rather than the Democratic Japanese Nation. They had planned very well for their War in China, but no nation was ready to invade across the Pacific. Given how many purple hearts we made for the invasion of Kyushu, I think we wouldn't have been able to get more than an Armistice out of the Japanese. Personal opinion is that if the US wasn't brought in to the Western War, a lack of Lend Lease would have crippled the Soviets as long as Hitler didn't completely mismanage that front. The US sent food and other supplies to the Soviets after all

[@genxer1]

You could almost say three. The UK was an island nation with a world spanning empire that had a huge navy and and a top notch air force and air defense system. The UK alone outproduced Germany in aircraft and naval production during the war and a third of merchant shipping in the world was British. Without a land border with Britain it's debatable whether Germany could have even beaten them, let alone the U.S. and the U.S.S.R. as well. kzbin.info/www/bejne/gJC2aZ17g6yjh6c

[@westpointsnell4167]

@@Arizona-ex5yt had the US not entered the war at all ,very good chance the German and Japanese would have hooked up which is why Roosevelt shut the oil supply off on Japan

[@williamashbless7904]

It was a desperate gamble that relied on capturing allied fuel dumps. Also, a pipe dream that expected Western Allies to sue for a separate peace if Antwerp was seized. In my opinion ‘Watch on the Rhine’ never came close to success. It did surprise Western Allies because they were arrogant in thinking Germany was incapable of mounting such a large offensive. Biggest takeaway: everything hinged on capturing Elsenborn ridge in the first 24 hrs. They failed and everything after was just drawing out the inevitable.

[@andrewholdaway813]

Underestimated but I wouldn't go so far as to call it arrogance. And of course events proved them right.

[@greystash1750]

Were they arrogant to think that? Apart from the very initial shock the attack was a shambles in everybway

[@danielmocsny5066]

The Allies were less arrogant than they were too generous in assuming the Germans were sane. As Patton observed on learning the full scale of the German offensive, the Germans had stuck their head into a meat grinder and Patton had his hand on the handle. Since the casualty ratio generally favors the defense, a relatively sane Hitler would have spent his last remaining strength on a defensive action to bleed the Allies as much as possible. But of course a sane Hitler would never have declared war on the world's three largest nations/empires and taken things to this point.

[@marneus]

More like they all considered a German attack on the Ardennes sector a military stupidity. And it was, thus why the Germans were defeated.

[@hkiller57]

turns out Germany WAS incapable of mounting such a large offensive

[@22yhjjjj]

about 50 thousand armchair generals after watching: Okay, but here's how Germany could have won WW2...

[@imtiredtiredtired]

B-but what if germany mass produced the maus tank

[@MarcosElMalo2]

@@imtiredtiredtired What if they cloned Steiner? Imagine an Army Corps of Steiners, from top to bottom.

[@Kou-bz4kb]

BUT BUTTT WHAT ABOUT PLAN Z BEING ABLE TO BEAT THE ROYAL NAVY?

[@Dracorex235]

@@Kou-bz4kb What i find out to be more hilarious about Plan Z is the fact that it does not take in consideration the fact that it was designed to have a fleet capable of challenging 1939 RN fleet in 1948, asuming that the Royal Navy would stand still and no produce any new ship at all that would throw german plans overboat. That, and the fact that while Z plan was an imposible economic and resource nighmare that would let germany closer to an economic collapse than to have a fleet cappable of challenging any allied fleet, british naval construction plans were not.

[@Alex13501]

If only Germans invaded Britain... :D

[@sirthedave]

Even if Antwerp was somehow captured, I find it absolutely absurd that the Allies would’ve even considered surrendering after all the momentum of Operation Overlord and the Soviets almost at the gates of Berlin, especially with moral at an all-time high. The Ardennes Offensive was dead on arrival.

[@stevepowell6503]

Yeah. The Allies would have dispersed the supply line to other ports. Even if they captured Antwerp they couldn't hold it. The Allies would have bombed the hell out of their positions, and gone in with a force many times what the Germans had.

[@stevepowell6503]

Yeah. The Allies would have dispersed the supply line to other ports. Even if they captured Antwerp they couldn't hold it. The Allies would have bombed the hell out of their positions, and gone in with a force many times what the Germans had.

[@stevek8829]

The extended bulge would have been ripe for snipping at the base.

[@sirpuffball6366]

Hitler isn't exactly renowned for his critical thinking abilities

[@Noodle_7607]

If Antwerp was captured the only thing that would do is massively overextend german lines And they would have been cut off plus then Hitler would have to take forces from the western front bring them back to the east which they didn't have enough fuel to do where they would just get swallowed up by the red army plus allied air power would have destroyed the german lines and then the soliders in Antwerp would have been trapped it would be Stalingrad on the western front

[@Desertrat87]

This same mismatch in war economies played out against Japan as well. With that war having a much larger naval component to it, if you look at US ship production versus Japan's, the numbers are staggering. Add to that aircraft production, and the fact that the allies actually improved their aircraft over the course of the war, whereas Japan did not significantly improve theirs, it was a foregone conclusion that the allies were going to beat Japan. Yamamoto knew it. It's not clear whether he actually said his iconic quote about awakening a sleeping giant, but it is known that he warned the Japanese high command that they could not win against the US due to their incredible industrial capacity. Once it really got going by 1943 or so, it was all over.

[@ohger1]

Even more astounding is that the U.S. was isolationist at the time Pearl was attacked and didn't start spending a lot of money on aircraft until the war started. By 1945, the U.S. was turning out many many times more high quality aircraft than they were losing every month.

[@watchthe1369]

They knew that the attack at Pearl Harbor was only a temporary effect. What screwed everything up was the delivery of the declaration of war. The Japanese embassy delivered it too late making Pearl Harbor a dishonorable surprise attack. Yet another error in messages being delivered that might have made China a Japanese colony instead of the mess it is today.

[@kkeelty64]

Similar to Germany's reliance on animal powered logistics, the Japanese aircraft industry relied upon pack animals to drag aircraft from their assembly point to the airfield towards the end. Even fodder for these animals was in short supply due to the Allied naval blockade of Japan.

[@Harrier42861]

The USN produced more aircraft carriers of all types during WW2 than the IJN produced destroyers of all types during its entire history. Says it all.

[@DogKacique]

It's worse when you consider that, by Tonnage, Japan was producing less ships than even Germany It's says a lot that the axis nation focused a land war and navally blockaded as early as 1941 was outproducing the ally fighting major naval fleet battles

[@LC-dc7ec]

This video reminds me of that one scene from Band of Brothers where one of the paratroopers yells at a column of raggedy German POWs marching past them. The Germans were beat by General Winter, General Motors, and General Incompetence.

[@BobSmith-dk8nw]

_"You've got horses!!!!!"_ kzbin.info/www/bejne/gqq9fGuhacytr8k .

[@frankhassle9366]

Ha! Ha! If only that arrogant American could see the fruits of his labor. Imagine what he would think of what America has turned into?

[@Aqueox]

@@frankhassle9366 The Wehrmacht and SS men sitting next to him in Heaven looking down on us are doing that "sad laugh" some people do and saying one thing: "Was it worth it? We told you this would happen."

[@jarredingersoll2772]

​@@AqueoxI'm sorry, did you say that the SS man is in heaven...

[@Aqueox]

@@jarredingersoll2772 Yeah. Problem?

[@internetquickie]

What I love about the picture at 16:22 is that the fuel container for the aircraft was being pulled by a horse

[@Admiral_Jezza]

Spotted that too, if you need horse drawn fuel containers, you just might be running out a little bit.

[@deanpd3402]

A bit like using diesel powered generators to charge up electric cars.

[@MotoroidARFC]

It had been like that since the beginning. They weren't totally mechanized like many of today's military forces of many countries. They still used horses and when railroads were used, they still had to set aside space for horse feed and replacement horses. Overall I don't think they would have had enough fuel to go fully mechanized and go east and west like they did.

[@CJB-]

Germany used huge head of horses right through ww2. Far more than other western combatants.

[@grapeape7284]

I have never seen someone who actually knows a lot about the 2nd world war genuinely hold the opinion that Germany could have won. It's mostly amateur tank fans and unrepentant wehraboos

[@dudududu1926]

*take a bite off panzerschokolade* if Hitler made more Stugs, the war could've been won.

[@greystash1750]

Fought to a stalemate by the British Empire (and subsequently blitzed much more efficiently) threw themselves on the sword of the USSR backed by US production

[@grapeape7284]

@@greystash1750 yes, and?

[@deanpd3402]

@@grapeape7284 and their focus should have been Russia only, and that's it. Either he was honestly against communism or he wasn't. The fact that he went on vengeance trips against Poland, France and England showed that he was not serious when he claimed to be opposed to communism.

[@imgvillasrc1608]

@@deanpd3402 Except France and the UK declared war on Germany first while the Soviets signed a non-aggression pact. It's not like Germany could afford to leave their western front open while invading the east for idealic reasons. What Hitler and the OKW did was common sense, destroy the enemy on the west while the east is at peace.

[@sirdavidoftor3413]

I just subscribed. Not many KZbinrs, who do WW2 videos, mentions the contributions of Canada. Rather they often put Canada in the British category. I learned that Canada did indeed produce tanks, and a lot more aircraft than I had thought. While not like our southern neighbour with huge industrial might, Canada did pull it weight in the war. I am sure it’s natural resources, like nickel and iron ore, and aluminum were in big demand. Thank you for making the distinction. I hope you do it for all the commonwealth countries, as their veterans deserve respect for what they sacrificed! Stay safe, stay sane, stay Strong Ukraine 🇺🇦

[@deaks25]

Canada does often get unfairly forgotten, despite being the third largest of all the Western Allies (Ie not including the USSR). While not strictly relevant to this video, Canada was arguably the best at U-Boat hunting. The RCN was mainly a destroyer and escort-based force and so refined the tactics of hunting and defeating the U-Boat campaign, and both the Royal and US Navies took a lot of learning from the Canadians in terms of tactics and technological development.

[@dennisswaim8210]

We Americans who study such things are well aware of the great sacrifices of our Canadian friends and all of the British and the commonwealth nations during WW II. After the fall of France you guys were the stalwart wall that the Axis wave broke upon. I salute you. I don't think Germany really had a change of successfully invading Britain and as long as Churchill was PM they would have never surrendered. Then Hitler invaded the USSR game over, Declaring war on the US as well insane.

[@dennisswaim8210]

Further it was a huge undertaking that required a team effort. And what a team United Kingdom, including Canada Australia, New Zealand, India, many more plus Free French, Polish, resistance forces in occupied areas as well as the USSR and the US. You could study this war for a thousand years and never learn it all.

[@ericatkinson9285]

At that stage of the war no matter what the Germans attempted was always going to fail.

[@danlorett2184]

Canada MORE than pulled its weight during WWII.

[@ryanelliott71698]

Considering Germanys economy, even if they won the battle of the bulge and forced the allies to the negotiating table, Germany still would’ve lost due to the Soviets. All that would’ve changed is the iron curtain would’ve moved to Frances borders

[@MarcosElMalo2]

The battle of the what now? You might want to fix that typo.

[@USSCYT]

I dont think so. Allies would still get Italy and more than likely parts of Eastern Germany. I doubt it would be such a washout

[@maisonraider4593]

@@USSCYT After the destruction of the German army in the most decisive battles of operation bagration, it was a washout, for the Germans. The only reason the russians didn’t take Berlin in February 1945 was supply problems.

[@Spinikar]

@@maisonraider4593 So, what you're saying is Russia still hasn't worked out logistics after all this time later?

[@oldfrend]

the allies were never going to negotiate. they were out for blood and they had the resources to get it. reaching antwerp would've just prolonged the war by maybe six months. the americans were battle planning to lose millions of men to force japan to surrender unconditionally. germany would've suffered the same fate.

[@Hillbilly001]

Whoever came up with the idea of blending the two channels is absolutely bloody brilliant! Love both. Cheers from Tennessee

[@sid2112]

Two field goals and a touchdown against my Dawgs. You did good! I don't know what I'm gonna do when I retire to my land up by the Hiwassee!

[@Hillbilly001]

@@sid2112 That's in East TN. Try West TN, you'll be able to see the sun before noon. LoL. Go Vols! Cheers from Tennessee

[@sid2112]

@@Hillbilly001 Yeah up by Farner and the Dam. I got some good acreage to build on and a bunch of conservation land. I don't really know a lot about West Tennessee, tell me more! Gotta get to know the neighbors!

[@Hillbilly001]

@@sid2112 They call us The Tristate, because there are 3 states in one. East, Middle and West. The East is mountainous and is different culturally from the others. Middle Tennessee is the capital and is more urbanized, but still has rural areas. While in West Tennessee, farms and farming are king. Cotton, corn, wheat and the like. The West is way more conservative than the others even with Memphis in the mix. I prefer the West, but my kin live outside Tellico. I also have them near Nashville, but mostly here in the West. In the East, they'll put things in a "poke", but here we put things in a "bag" or a "sack". Them ridgerunners talk funny. LOL!

[@sid2112]

@@Hillbilly001 Ha! My grandpa used to say poke!

[@CocoaBeachLiving]

This presentation is well written and presented. Thank you

[@rochrich1223]

"Impassible terrain" is ground that can be defended with a smaller force and where the defender can be reinforced faster than the attacker. In 1940, the French underestimated the minimum defender needed and reinforced slowly. Ardennes was correctly identified as "impassible terrain."

[@Gaelic-Spirit]

Very interesting, thank you

[@WatcherMovie008]

It always funny hearing the Ardennes being called impassible when the French developed a highway road in the Ardennes to do essentially make the Ardennes passable.

[@rochrich1223]

If a smaller force can still delay an attack down the highway and then get reinforced faster than the attackers(both probably down the highway) then the terrain is still "impassible" according to the military definition of the word. The difference between the simple definition and the military definition strikes my ear sideways too, but it was bound to happen when enough jargon is translated to a foreign language(English) then passed through time.

[@kylejohns2288]

Yes impassable doesn’t mean insurmountable obstacle it means not tactically viable

[@blore]

For anyone curious, Victor Davis Hanson has a book titled "The Second World Wars", which covers this aspect of WWII (industrial output, training, etc...)

[@ericericson3535]

That was perhaps the best explanation of the background of the battle yet. The same can be said of the submarine war against Japan in WWII. ADM Lockwood' s insistence that the subs go after the merchant shipping, instead of ships of the line, proved him right. As we torpedomen say, "the atom bomb ended WWII, the Mark 14 torpedo won it!" Might be a new video for you.

[@recoil53]

They main Japanese fleet had to anchor at Brunei because it was their fuel source and they wouldn't have enough of it in the home islands.

[@Rusty_Gold85]

another History channel has done a full blown expose on the Type 14 kzbin.info/www/bejne/m4KYg6htj9qSZ6s&ab_channel=Drachinifel

[@zaleost]

Regarding the whole matter of whether Germany could have ever won the war to begin with. Its probably worth considering that initially they never expected it to reach the scale that it did. Believing that the conflict was basically won after France was taken and that Britain was just being fussy after the fact not excepting a peace treaty so things could just enter a new form of normal in that region.

[@nicholashollis1522]

Which is just blinding arrogance, par for the course for Nazi leadership. Britain's foreign policy for the last... Oh... Five hundred years? Had always been to keep continental European powers from reaching hegemony on the continent.

[@grumblesa10]

True, but leaving a potential threat in one's rear while opening ANOTHER front and bringing another nation into the war is not good strategy, to put it very politely.

[@zaleost]

@@grumblesa10 By this point though Germany had pretty much become high on its own success. Mistaking the luck they'd had during the invasion of France where everything just happened to go their way for the notion that their armies are unmatched. Although the invasion of the Soviet Union certainly was the tipping point where they were biting off far more than they could chew and these early success simply made them too blind to see it.

[@QueenAleenaFan]

Well I believe the Germans could have won the war, I believe much like the American Civil War it was lost early where the economic Advantage can't be brought to bear the same way. I have the belief that if Dunkirk was a Slaughter rather than a heroic rescue, the Brits might have bent the knee to avoid another war to end all wars

[@zaleost]

@@QueenAleenaFan Had Britain lost most of its forces at Dunkirk it would have reduced their ability to fight more ground battle later but it would be unlikely they would have made peace, and no chance in hell they would have surrendered. At this point the Royal Navy was still far more powerful than the Kreigsmarine so Germany would have struggled with and even then there was no serious plan on their end to do so.

[@tophat2115]

The German coal to oil to plane fuel produced a low octane fuel compared to light sweet crude oil produced in Texas which yielded high octane plane fuel, it made a difference in performance.

[@knoll9812]

Main difference was allies had additives to greatly increase octane

[@robertalonzo5725]

I’m starting to enjoy these briefs more than the tactical breakdowns

[@beaubenoit.]

My favorite video of the series. So much useful and well-thought-out information. Well done guys

[@martintaylor9356]

Given the importance of the battle of the Atlantic, would you consider an Operations Room/Intel Report mini series like this one (which has been brilliant btw)?

[@TheIntelReport]

We've covered some key engagements in the Battle of the Atlantic - Bismarck, Tirpitz, Channel Dash, but never really anything on the grinding cat and mouse between U-Boats, Convoys, and Coastal Command. Keen to do so.

[@lawrencedockery9032]

@The Intel Report Would really be interested in a breakdown of the convoy battles in early March of 1943 when the U-Boats virtually annihilated three convoys. Think even Churchill said that was when he was most worried about the Germans cutting the shipping lanes across the Atlantic

[@malickfan7461]

7:05 Free men have always outproduced slaves. In fact, slavery has always been inefficient and economically detrimental.

[@wymple09]

Tell that to the Southern US states that engaged in slavery. They built a huge agricultural empire, very profitable. Black slaves were neither inefficient nor unprofitable.

[@malickfan7461]

@@wymple09 If it were really that simple, then the Southern states would have won their civil war against the north. Slavery is an economic dead end whereas industry and labor from free men build on itself. This is why the north ended up having much more economic upside from investing in industry than the south did from investing in slaves. This is also why industry and infrastructure in the south was (and still largely is) awful when compared to the north and west. Even agriculture was more valuable in the northern states than in the south. The hay and potato industry in the north alone was more than enough to give “king cotton” a run for its money.

[@sammybeutlin2763]

Well most people just work for a roof and food ... not that much changed, except direct workers abue. But if you abuse your worker, the income will be smaller, so we wont be abused ... but we aint free, except a few, who got richt enough to dont need to work, only if they choose too. US democracy is an exploiting oligarchy, mostly plutocracy

[@wymple09]

@@malickfan7461 The North was focused on industry AND agriculture. The South was built on agriculture mostly. The North had more capacity for war.

[@malickfan7461]

@@wymple09 “The north was focused on industry and agriculture.” I know. I said as much myself. “The south was built on agriculture mostly.” And the agriculture it got from slavery was still less valuable than that of the north. “The north had more capacity for war.” Yes because they invested in industry and labor from free men.

[@exharkhun5605]

Great and comprehensive video. Since you touch on inefficiencies so much in the video, the inefficiencies of synthetic oil should be mentioned. It cost a lot of units of coal to produce a unit of synthetic oil, not only in the process itself but also in transport to and from synthetic oil refineries. Running it also wore out engines and gear faster, because there's issues with lubrication (aren't there always 🙂) contributing to the maintenance and logistics burden.

[@kurtwoods9789]

Like the assassins of Cesar who left Mark Antony alive and had no plan for succeeding Caesar, the Germans failed to ask “what’s next?” Sure, drive to Antwerp and bag the allied forces in the north, but no accounting for the massive logistical needs that would require. This is not to mention that that second phase was even more ambitious and would therefore be even more taxing. A goal without a plan.

[@etherealbolweevil6268]

Hence Montgomery utterly annihilating the attack in that direction.

[@kurtwoods9789]

@@etherealbolweevil6268 nice of them to politely place their heads in Monty’s noose

[@pimpompoom93726]

The shortage of fuel was the Achilles Heel of the Wehrmacht-they never had enough and especially for aircraft they lacked the higher octane fuel needed for high compression engines. Coal gasification could produce petrol, but not the high octane fuel needed for fighter aircraft. And it couldn't produce lubricating fluids at all. Germany still needed petroleum and it was increasingly hard to get by mid 1944 and beyond.

[@JeepWranglerIslander]

If you want a resource that covers American industrialization, especially the all important pre-war struggle by Roosevelt to convince the US to prepare, "A Call to Arms" by Murray Klein is 900 pages of empirical data and wartime production. I'll say here that the major point in winning an industrialization war rests on the backs of the toolmakers. Everybody knows that US factories were able to turn out thousands upon thousands of planes tanks and weapons, but most of that stuff didn't really start coming online until late 42/43 because somebody had to build those factories and equip those factories with the machinery required to stamp out the parts in the first place!

[@seminolewarrior1626]

I absolutely love History and as an American I truly love our History both good and bad. I'm so happy I found your channel!

[@Dee-nonamnamrson8718]

Compared to every other nation in history, it's far more good than bad.

[@seminolewarrior1626]

@@Dee-nonamnamrson8718 absolutely agree with this! I'm proud to be an American.

[@Hillbilly001]

I agree. Cheers from Tennessee

[@koc988]

@@Dee-nonamnamrson8718 wanna bet

[@Zamandu]

@@Dee-nonamnamrson8718 Bit excessive

[@JDFloyd]

This series, The Intel Report, is great.

[@milfordphoto3989]

One of the best summations of the impact of industry and eco situation during the war I’ve seen. Thank you!

[@paauggie]

Fantastic as always - thankyou for posting. I've always found it strange that even intelligent individuals in the German military never seemed to grasp the simple truth that seemed to elude them in both world wars and was recognised by the third most senior ranked officer in the American Marine Corps early in the Vietnam war as making it impossible for them to attain victory - it is not possible to win a war of attrition when the other side controls its own rate of attrition. As Germany lacked any landing craft in both world wars (let alone the other enormous amount of military equipment necessary for a succesful amphibious invasion) it could only ever draw or lose a war against the united kingdom.

[@knoll9812]

First world war was different. If France had crashed the UK would have made a deal with germa.

[@everythingsalright1121]

One important thing to note about the synthetic fuel industry at 4:54, is that it took around 3 tons of coal to make 1 ton of usable oil at the time. This wasnt exactly a great trade and it put more even more strain on supplies of coal since germany didnt have great access to fuel Also the Ploesti bombing raid (8:34) wasnt as successful as it needed to be. The lack of up to date intel combined with radio silence meant the bombers sustained massive losses while most of the plant remained intact (theyd done scouting on the area before the raid and found the defenses to be lacking, but in the time leading up to the raid germany massively reinforced the defenses around ploesti to the point it was one of the most heavily defended areas in german control)

[@hirnlos9462]

A few graphs would have helped visualise some of these production values. otherwise greate video!

[@screddot7074]

I don't think they told that to my father when they came to get him out of a hospital bed in England, after being blown out of his tank. He returned to Patton's Army and fought in the Battle of the Bulge and to the end of the war. Eventually he would be diagnosed with "battle fatigue" or PTSD in today's terms. For him, the war never ended.

[@glenchapman3899]

Yeah the human wreckage these conflicts leave behind is horrendous and very deep. In my local area there was a project years ago to record the experiences of surviving WW2 veterans. The interviews were so jarring and the obvious mental strain these veterans were under during the interviews caused the decision to never release the interviews until the last veteran interviewed had passed away.

[@unclefester6501]

The German army was never even 50% mechanized. Horse power. Literally.

[@NokotanFanCentral]

That’s what I love, everyone portrays Germany as tanks and trucks.

[@nicolomarangoni1781]

What I would love to see next is a series on the ancient world, like the Punic wars or Gaugamela just to name a couple.

[@JHenrySmith2]

Check out the channel Kings & Generals

[@Macrochenia]

The German plans for winning the Battle of the Bulge remind me of some of the reported Japanese Imperial Navy's plans for beating the American Navy in the late part of the war, which reportedly involved all the American ships running out of fuel and ammunition simultaneously.

[@glenchapman3899]

As the Japanese were preparing for the invasion of the Home Islands one of the things they had decided was not to waste assets on fighting the US fleet. Their plan was to go after the tankers and supply ships travelling with the fleet. The Japanese had enough aircraft to possibly pull this off, but the quality of their pilots was very doubtful

[@Macrochenia]

@@glenchapman3899 This was less about turning things into a war of attrition (which the US had been successfully doing to them the whole time) and more an admission that they didn't have a way to actually stop the Americans by that point without a deus ex machina.

[@glenchapman3899]

@@Macrochenia Well by that point all the Japanese were fighting for was a favorable peace and try to avoid the unconditional surrender the Allies were calling for.

[@firestxrmrev]

the Americans had dedicated barges for ice cream to boost morale. the Japanese had to ration supplies. guess who won

[@pthomson9736]

Wonderful explanation and presentation. Thank you very much.

[@huskergator9479]

Excellent video! Please do a similar video about Japan’s war economy from the early 30’s forward. Extremely well done. Thanks!

[@timf2279]

Become a member and you get to vote and give imput on future series.

[@paulp1276]

This was absolutely excellent, thank you.

[@FunwithCaleb22]

I love both channels I am a fan of history, specially of World War II Thank you to The Operation room and The Intel Room for these videos ❤

[@christopherchilders1049]

Great video! Very well made and and easy to follow along

[@georgeparris8293]

Intel Report would likely benefit fro reading "Memiors of Foggia" This is the third book in the series Memoirs of Foggia. The first book covered the pre-war years. The second book covered 1942 and early 1943, which includes stateside training and the battles of North Africa. At the end of book 2, the 99th Bomb Group had just been formed in Tunisia and transferred to Tortorella airfield near Foggia, Italy. The two main protagonists Roy C. Parris and Robert A, Duffy were both in the bomb group. In this book which picks up in December 1943, we cover one of the deadliest parts of the war for this bomb group: December 1943-September 1944. During this period, they faced the Luftwaffe over German, Austria and Romania as they attacked the airplane and ball bearing factories that were out of range of the 8th Airforce and took on the critical reduction of the Ploesti petroleum refining complex. They also provided tactical support to the advance of the Soviet Union into Eastern Europe.We see the progress of this personal lives and romances.To put all this into context, particular effort is made in this book to explain the importance, difficulties and risks of these missions. Why was Ploesti so important? I go into substantial detail regarding the attack and defense of the B-17 which is referred to in many books but never explained. I follow the progress of the 8th and 15th Air Forces as they slowly and painfully attrit the Luftwaffe in 1944.Again, these stories are as historically accurate as I can make them. Where is elaborate dialogue or events, I clearly identify the fabrication and speculation and explain why. A large part of this book focuses on the general aspects of the war which is forms the essential context for the human stories, which reemerge in the next book. 1944 was clearly the transition year in which American material productivity came to fruition in experienced military hands. The first thoughts of what will happen after we win come to the surface and the competing interests of the Allies start to appear.

[@geordie1032]

The Intel Report and Operations Room are 'top drawer' channels. Thank your hard work

[@diedertspijkerboer]

The Battle of the Bulge is sometimes referred to as Hitler's last throw of the dice in the west. But it's no use to throw the dice when the game is already up.

[@SpottoBotto]

Loved this vid. The best explanation of the war economy I've seen 👏

[@antonhengst8667]

They often say nations are always preparing to win the last war. It's a criticism that's frequently levied at the Western allies, France in particular-especially in contrast to the Axis belligerents, who demonstrated effective forward-thinking on the tactical and technological level. However, I'd like to argue that economically, the Axis had been preparing to win World War 1.

[@WoodenFloorsRock]

How so? That's an interesting take I'd like to hear more!

[@antonhengst8667]

@@WoodenFloorsRock idk I just made it up

[@WoodenFloorsRock]

@@antonhengst8667 Lol bro what

[@davestier6247]

​@@antonhengst8667strong take lol

[@duckey00123]

This is the first Intel Report that I thought really outshone the complementary video on The Operations Room. You've outdone yourself guys. Cheers.

[@mikearmstrong8483]

There was only a moment's mention of the Lend Lease effect upon the Eastern Front, but despite Russian nationalistic denial, the Soviet Union would have fallen without it. Not because of any planes or tanks that were sent; those were insignificant compared to the Soviets own production. But without millions of tons of bauxite ore (from which comes aluminum) shipped from the US, there would have been no Red Air Force. 90% of the aluminum used by the Soviets came from US supplied ore. Without millions of vacuum tubes sent by Britain, the Red Army would have been unable to communicate in the field. Soviet radios were short ranged, inflexible in frequency selection, unreliable, and scarce to begin with. Without tens of thousands of trucks sent from the US, the great Soviet offensives would have been limited to how far a tank can go in combat on a single load of fuel. Without hundreds of thousands of miles of telephone wire from the US, the Red Army would have had to rely on motorcycle messengers just as they did in the early days of the war. Without locomotives (of which the Soviets were woefully short) from the US, no supplies or reinforcements would get near the front lines. Without the direction of several unsung American civil engineers, the factories packed up and moved beyond the Urals would have been useless; those reassembled by the Soviets themselves were laughably inefficient and unreliable. Manpower they had in abundance. Colorful propaganda posters they had in abundance. But dubiously motivated screaming hordes don't get very far against modern armies without effective communications and supply and air cover, all of which were made possible by Lend Lease from the west.

[@thurbine2411]

Weren’t a lot of the Russian planes made by wood? I still think you are correct but maybe the Bauxite wasn’t a thing that would have lost them the war

[@scottgiles7546]

You're thinking of the British. (Mosquitose Rule!)

[@mikearmstrong8483]

@@thurbine2411 Some were partially clad in wood skins, but all had aluminum frames, and most had mainly aluminum skins.

[@mikearmstrong8483]

@@thurbine2411 Also bear in mind that the main reason Japan went to war was to obtain the oil, rubber, tin, and bauxite that were in abundance in the East Indies. Along with iron, coal, and wheat or rice, those are the primary resources needed to sustain a war economy at that time. Any aircraft production relied heavily on aluminum, and the Soviets only had access to 10% of their needs from their own mines.

[@MarcosElMalo2]

You left out machine tools, which allowed Soviet armament production to increase and improve. 😊 The Russian Great Patriotic War myth is what allows them to see themselves as both victors and victims simultaneously. It’s the closest thing they have to a national ideology-Putin’s weird imperial fascistic ideology isn’t widely held among the general population. There’s one more thing that the Russians don’t like remembered: the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact, which enabled the war to start. Russia was instrumental in starting WWII and acted as an undeclared ally in the destruction of Poland.

[@rfletch62]

Clear and concise! Subscribed!

[@occhamite]

if you're not planning it already, a logical sequel might be a "whatif" video, re the Allied response if somehow Germany did win the battle. It's hard to imagine the Allies feeling themselves forced to "negotiate" with the Nazis. Supply through northern and even southern France could have been used & I think Hitler would have been surprised by how little things actually changed.

[@davestier6247]

Or you could just read the man in the high castle

[@whatsreal7506]

Best content I've seen on KZbin! Excellent! Keep up the good work 👏

[@michaeltelson9798]

I would suggest reading “A Time for Trumpets” by Charles McDonald as it is considered the definitive book on this battle.

[@importantname]

excellent report. That you for the effort.

[@TunnelSnakesrule13]

Worst case scenario: the Germans obliterate the division they ran into instead of getting stuck. There are a dozen more divisions behind it.

[@Vuk_Stajic]

This was so deeply detailed, insane. Thank you!

[@firebanner6424]

Two of my great grandfathers fought in the Battle of the Bulge. Kinda cool.

[@davestier6247]

My grandfathers as well. One was an m18 Hellcat gunner in the 10th AD and the other was 101 airborne. Crazy they both made it home.

[@stuartb9194]

Brilliant work, Bravo!

[@chumbawumba1959]

How ironic that: For Battle of the Bulge, German High Command waited for bad weather to set in; For Normandy Invasion ... Allied High Command waited for bad weather to lift. The two last great battles in WWII Europe theatre of operations, both depending on a weather forecast.

[@RonaldReaganRocks1]

Excellent video!

[@malickfan7461]

And even if they had won the battle of the bulge, they still would have lost to the USSR in the East at that point.

[@pickle_soup160]

They also assumed that US and GB would just sue for peace after the defeat. They were irrationally gambling.

[@genxer1]

Even if they had 'won' the Battle of the Bulge so many U.S., British, Dominion, French and Polish troops and so much war material was pouring into the Western front it wouldn't have mattered in the long run. The Western Allies would never have surrendered. They would have recovered fairly quickly. The Germans would have had a long salient into the Allied lines that the Allies would have pounded to pieces with overwhelming air superiority, cut off and destroyed. The results of the Battle of the Bulge would have been the same even if the Germans had 'won' and achieved their goals, it would have just taken longer. It definitely wouldn't have been the end of the war in the West.

[@oneshotme]

Enjoyed your video and I gave it a Thumbs Up as I always do for your channel!!

[@aidanproy1484]

An important thing to understand about ww2 is that the axis would never win the war, Quite literally no change in strategy could have ever ended in a German win. Only after barb did the Germans truly understand the inevitable

[@anglishbookcraft1516]

That’s BS. As there was a point in which Germany had too many foes but they got to that point as they accepted new ones one by one and then got overwhelmed. Had they went balls to the wall on Britain first and refused to go to war with the US on behalf of Japan then they would have won. Even in the current timeline if the Baku oil fields were taken the fuel would have been a game changer and as the only true thing holding Germany back was the fuel. They had the manpower, the Air Force and the weapons, the production might of Russia didn’t shift the balance of power until 1943.

[@isaiahkayode6526]

@@anglishbookcraft1516that’s the point dumbass.

[@matthewjones39]

@@anglishbookcraft1516You know what the Battle of Britain was, right?

[@rainunderscore]

@@anglishbookcraft1516germany would never have won in any scenario, cope and seethe

[@counterfeit1148]

@@anglishbookcraft1516 Don't you think they tried to take those oil fields?

[@0Zolrender0]

A great video. Well presented and thought out. I loved it.

[@brandonihde4879]

Will you guys be doing anything on the Korean war?

[@rring44]

Listen to the Podcast "Blowback" season 3 while you wait for the videos. It is one of the best history podcasts I have heard.

[@timf2279]

Become a member and you get to vote and give imput on future series.

[@eliasmiguelfreire8965]

Great video, really put things on a strategically level in perspective, but two informations on this doesn't add up: "Messerschmitt estimated that dispersal caused a 50 percent drop in production for 1944 alone" "German industry in 1944 had produced 28.926 fighters, a 150% increase over the previous year." If anyone could clarify it, I would appreciate.

[@Mr9Guns]

The war was realistically a lost cause for the axis after 1943. By the end of 43' they had lost ground on every front and the Allies were vastly outproducing them. Not to mention all of it's big strategic assets like the U-boat war had been effectively countered to a great degree by this point. The Allied powers had also become far more effective in the field as well with the hard won experience of the war to that point.

[@AP27081]

My dad was a Polish refugee from the Nazi invasion. He would have loved your videos. Thanks and cheers!

[@brett4264]

I've always said the same. A little country like that could never take over the world. It would be destroyed trying. How anyone could think differently is just crazy.

[@oldman9642]

What about China?? They have already started the march toward global, and if not stopped very very soon, they are big enough. As long as men dream of empire, control, and power we will remain constantly imperiled.

[@malickfan7461]

They weren’t trying to take over the world, but I understand what your getting at.

[@rudeboy8112]

the Brits took over a lot back in the day for such a tiny island.

[@danmitchell8165]

@@rudeboy8112 lots of which was done through clever use of diplomacy and politics, as well as efficienct warmaking. Nazi germany was much less tact in their approach

[@Mofers4k]

@@rudeboy8112 Natives

[@AgentGB1]

Great video, reels, and context!

[@binaway]

In 1940 the Germany army knew were all the French military and civilian fuel stocks were located and all carrier a German version of the Michelin guide to France which pinpointed the location of every domestic fuel retailer. Once in France the 1940 German army vehicles rode across France using French fuel. In 1944 this sauce no longer existed and they didn't know the location of allied fuel dumps. They actually bypassed one intact fuel dump which was only a short distance up a side road and then had to abandoned their vehicles as their fuel tanks ran try.

[@4urluvjones155]

Wow. Dude bringing the receipts. We'll done and thanks.

[@QuizmasterLaw]

Unrealistic objectives, inadequate supply, and this in the face of overwhelming air superiority. Maybe if they ONLY took fast well armed vehicles like Puma 75mm, all the armed halftracks with reliable tanks for break through? Even panther is too unreliable for a 300km AT LEAST thunder run.

[@aslamnurfikri7640]

Pumas and Panthers are equally weak against Typhoons and Thunderbolts

[@QuizmasterLaw]

@@aslamnurfikri7640 yeah, but at least they will be able to cross bridges and won't burn out their engines or transmissions.

[@MarcosElMalo2]

You’re too hung up on the gear. You sound like a videogamer. I bet you think the A-10 would be useful in Ukraine.

[@QuizmasterLaw]

@@MarcosElMalo2 No I am not; as the videos point out they were unable to advance because of vehicles too heavy for bridges and also because of a lack of fuel and due to unreliability of engines and transmission. Taking tigers along for this ride was dumb. Even panthers shouldn't be there (too heavy for bridges, transmissions tended to burn out).

[@grantdelosangeles5357]

The puma is too lightly armored for the German doctrine of heavy vehicles and heavy guns, and a squad of soldiers with a bazooka or anti-tank guns could easily take the thing out, but it could work if they made a mad dash for the river, but that'll be it before the allies figured it out and probably encircled the pumas

[@jtadevich]

Boy do i love these videos.

[@bartonstano9327]

This video is an excellent rebuttal to those who said Allied bombing of Germany did not work.

[@watch-Dominion-2018]

will you please make a playlist of all your Battle of the Bulge videos in order?

[@liambrown8447]

Well done for not ignoring Canada’s contributions during the war! Excellent video as always.

[@westpointsnell4167]

Yeah I know because everyone gets tired of you cryin a river about ,but nevermind at the same time you were up under the British crown so all Canadian victories get claimed by the British anyway..but battle of the bulge is an American victory

[@homerboy91]

All these points really showcase the insane importance of logistics in war.

[@NickJohnCoop]

Relying on luck in war is a thing you can do I suppose,it’s just that when your luck turns it can be catastrophic.

[@TonyC2328]

Been watching too much weird shit and read it as, "Why the Aliens...." Lmaooo

[@GeneralCormy]

Who'd have thought economic conditions would have made the outcome of the war so one sided

[@hillbilly4895]

Moral: Fuhrer's are terrible war managers and should be avoided in the future. Conversely: The Intel Report is a valuable content provider in the KZbin-telling-of-History space and should be subscribed to, liked, notified and shared early and often. Last, any and all of The Intel Report sponsers should be patronized with equal enthusiasm.

[@chriswarburtonbrown1566]

A key factor was German focus on prestige projects and womder weapons. Huge resources were wasted on battleships, rockets, complex tanks and jet experiments instead of basic tanks, uboats and planes.

[@glenchapman3899]

Yeah Germans love precision and cutting edge engineering, so they really could not help themselves lol

[@Aredel]

They tried to make a Battleship that was 3 times the size of the Yamato…

[@anglishbookcraft1516]

Things like the Tiger tank and the Stg44 were game changers. But much like the Stg44 things like the v1/v2 rockets and jet fighters came too late. Time and materials is what held them back, I wouldn’t say the lack of basic stuff halted anything.

[@bigburd875]

"Were gonna attack, and we will be so awesome they wont even fight back!"

[@foxhoundms9051]

The "Pieper pocket" woulda been the alt history if they did break through 😅

[@jameskerr3258]

Yet another fantastic video!

[@timf2279]

Great series well done!

[@hardtimespass9401]

Would love to see an Intel Report analysis of the "Decision at Strasbourg", when Eisenhower halted the Sixth Army Group's crossing of the Rhine in Alsace in November, 1944.

[@TheBigExclusive]

Thank you for going into detail about the German War economy. I always wondered why Germany could not leverage the vast resources of France. No other KZbin videos Ive seen mention that Germany's train industry was not big enough to use France's large natural resources. May I ask why Germany couldn't build more rail lines or build more train cars? Or even employ the French railway system and it's French workers to support the German war effort? It seems like within thr capabilities of German industry to do given they were pumping out planes and tanks and submarines. Building simple rail lines and box cars seems like a much easier task.

[@Aredel]

My guess would be the French resistances and the Allied bombing campaigns were causing too much damage across the country for the rail lines to be sustainable. Either the rail yards were being turned to dust, or the railways themselves were magically snapping every 50 yards. That… and maintaining proper logistics was never the Reich’s forte.

[@richardmcgowan1651]

Think of a world after WW2 were the Germans didnt waste troops in the battle of the Bulge and ended up delaying the allies push towards Berlin. Because against the USSR they had totally collapsed. The "Iron curtain" would have looked very different after WW2. To the point the USSR wouldn't have given up most of Germany so no East or West Gemany.

[@aslamnurfikri7640]

Offensive on the eastern front would simply be absorbed by Red Army and ended up with Operation Bagration part 2

[@albow4oops5]

Imagine if the U.S. had done what Patton wanted..wouldn't have been an iron curtain at all.

[@jasondouglas6755]

Unlikely, they had already settled on how Germany would be carved up at Tehran

[@MarcosElMalo2]

@@jasondouglas6755 Yalta, but point taken. Tehran was the start of those negotiations.

[@MarcosElMalo2]

If the German forces hadn’t been wasted on the Ardennes Offensive, they would have defended Germany, no? That defense would also have delayed the Allied push in Western Europe, especially given Montgomery’s plodding offensive style. If anything, the failure of the Ardennes Offensive allowed the Western Allies to push into Germany faster because the offensive depleted German capabilities.

[@petersanmiguel1164]

Very interesting. Thank you.

[@shannonkohl68]

One thing we see repeatedly from dictatorships is that they believe that democracies are weak and will fold quickly. Even though this is mostly anti-factual. Democracies don't like fighting "optional" wars like Vietnam. But if their existence is threatened they will fight as hard or harder than authoritarian societies. And given their greater wealth and competence, they will fight better and therefore win.

[@cramster3495]

These videos are so interesting from someone like me who has a passing interest in WW2 strategy and huge respect for our fighting men and women. Having watched this video I wonder what the current economic supply/military capability/financial balance looks like in respect of Russia versus Ukraine and supported by the West?

[@tonygumbrell22]

A waste of raw materials, a waste of cities destroyed, a waste of infrastructure destroyed, a waste of human effort and intelligence employed in developing, and utilizing new weapons of mass destruction, a waste of human life both civilian and military, a waste in the maiming and disabling of human beings, etc

[@johnparsons1573]

Fantastic video

[@TallDude73]

Well thought out and put together. Great video. And sad, in a strange way, since it was all a foregone conclusion. And we didn't get into the Russians producing tens of thousands T-34s.

[@lordgarion514]

The Soviet tanks were made with American steel. Soviet planes were made with American aluminum. About 80% of copper came from America. And almost 100% of everything that went boom, came from America. The USSR had barely enough to survive the initial attack from Germany. Without lend-lease, the USSR wouldn't have survived.

[@3dcomrade]

@@lordgarion514 im pretty sure the Soviets still uses domestic bombs and are only reliant on copper lend lease for raw materials

[@3dcomrade]

@@lordgarion514 the one whose statement of "everything that goes boom from USA to USSR" that is 47% too much is you I have said USSR STILL USES DOMESTIC BOMBS and only relies fully on western allies FOR COPPER. The data you gave confirm that

[@lordgarion514]

@@3dcomrade You might be "pretty sure" , but you're still wrong.... This isn't even a complete list of the finished goods Americans sent to the USSR. "The United States delivered to the Soviet Union from October 1, 1941, to May 31, 1945, the following: 427,284 trucks 13,303 combat vehicles 35,170 motorcycles 2,328 ordnance service vehicles, 2,670,371 tons of petroleum products (gasoline and oil) or 57.8 percent of the aviation fuel including nearly 90 percent of high-octane fuel used. 4,478,116 tons of foodstuffs (canned meats, sugar, flour, salt, etc.) 1,911 steam locomotives 66 diesel locomotives 9,920 flat cars 1,000 dump cars 120 tank cars 35 heavy machinery cars Provided ordnance goods (ammunition, artillery shells, mines, assorted explosives) amounted to *53 percent of total domestic consumption* (Over half of everything that went boom, came from America) 38,000 lathes and other metal working equipment A tire plant that was lifted bodily from the Ford Company's River Rouge Plant and transferred to the USSR."

[@lordgarion514]

@@3dcomrade And no, you did not say "fully relies" on nothing but cooper, in your deleted comment. (You realize that when you delete a post, who you posted to can still see it. And BTW, we only supplied 80% of the copper.

[@Xeper-I-Set]

Please never stop making content