Why the Voice to Parliament Lost | John Anderson & Douglas Murray

Douglas Murray and john discuss why the recent Voice to Parliament Referendum failed.
#douglasmurray #Thevoice #waronthewest
Douglas Murray is a prolific British author
and journalist. He has been contributor to The Spectator since 2000 and has been associate editor of the magazine since 2012. He has also written regularly for numerous other outlets, including: the Wall Street Journal, The Times, The Sunday Times, The Sun, The Evening Standard, and the New Criterion. He is a regular contributor to National Review and has been a columnist for Standpoint Magazine since its founding. His latest book, 'The War on the West', was published in May 2022.
See their full interview here: • Israel, Immigration & ...
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Douglas Murray
/ douglaskmurray
douglasmurray.net
www.spectator....

[@francishooper9548]

I voted no because to incorporate a special privilege for a racial group is clearly racist.

[@banta-pd8zj]

How did you think the white Australia policy existed? There is nothing racist about identifying first peoples in the constitution. It is virtually universal. The first people in Australia have a special place in the heart of Australians. The general principle is to identify that special place as the racism it is. I have never heard such a chorus of utter contempt accompanied by a mixture of latent and open hatred towards a people in my life. These two featured here are bigots.

[@paulinebartle8810]

John Anderson - exactly right. That is why I voted NO.

[@williamzk9083]

I had friends who voted no but we were all very quiet. You could tell that many of Yes proponents were so over bearing and intolerant and unable to look at a another point of view they were going to get surprised but it was unsafe to express a no point of view. I had some friends that wanted to vote yes but they were nice tolerant people that could tolerate alternative points of view.

[@rogeralsop3479]

Excellent news.

[@deanpd3402]

I live in a part of Australia where bringing up the topic of voting no was easy. It's about 8 to 2 conservative around here.

[@rogeralsop3479]

@@deanpd3402 Same thing where I was brought up in the Fens in England.

[@fizzybubblech2128]

Douglas's views are of a hypocrite. Why support Jews for an indigenous Israel when you can't support any other indigenous group.

[@leealan6416]

I'll give simple account of my feelings. I am 54 years old. I was born in Australia. I have no other country that I am indigenous to. I am not English, German, Italian or any other background. Nor Aboriginal. I am Australian. What happened before I was born in my country has terrible history that I owe no apology for. I feel bad about the things done by people who landed here, but I did not commit any terrible acts, so therefore all I owe is myself to the country I love, and the people within it.

[@markferguson7563]

The indefatigable reason as to why the Voice got SMASHED out of the park and, indeed, never to be raised again is irrefutably due to NINETY percent of voters from non-Anglo/European cradles voted NO. The reality of affairs is that, the collect of 4.5 million voters, who are either immigrants or are the offspring of immigrants from China, India, the Middle East or wherever, DON’T consider themselves to be invaders or descendants of invaders. And to verify that reality, merely requires examining the ethnocultural breakdown of the voters in seats in metropolitan areas where the NO vote was at least 60 percent against. However, what Anglo/Europeans should also take heed of is that, all of the millions of people from non-Anglo/European cradles who voted NO for the Voice will, in the not-too-distant future, dispossess Australians of AE heritages from this country, too. So, when it happens don’t complain that you weren’t warned. To sustain that pending horror of being dispossessed from your country and culture played out in recent weeks - most particularly so in Britain - when these ethnoreligious groups staged huge anti-western and anti-Israel rallies.

[@melaniemacgregor4784]

Amen

[@jezza669]

What about trying to address ongoing historically based disadvantage through government policy, even if you’re not personally responsible for what happened hundreds of years ago?

[@brianmorris8045]

@@jezza669 Re government policy...then Australians of both 'white' and 'black' suffer disadvantages. Wherever there is a government, the citizens are going to end up in the financial excretia one way or another. I was born here too. Proud Aussie. But as I said, I won't atone for something I had no control of a couple of hundred years ago plus. We just have to make sure those things don't happen again. If you are a legal citizen of this country, you are an Aussie. If you have just arrived, make a genuine effort to assimilate into our society. Leave your bad habits of your own country behind, join us and we can teach you some of our bad habits instead and we can all have a good laugh.😁

[@peterpiper831]

​@@jezza669 As stated in this clip, the governments don't want a solution, the grievance industry must keep going to keep the $$$ flowing.

[@parqld]

To call the No voters racist is a lazy argument and totally disconnected from the real issue, Australia by and large chose wisely 🇦🇺

[@fizzybubblech2128]

Douglas's views are of a hypocrite. Why support Jews for an indigenous Israel when you can't support any other indigenous group.

[@fizzybubblech2128]

Also, majority of indigenous voters voted yes to the voice.

[@izzyplant8428]

Mud flinging is their strength, ridicule of opponents a key weapon intimidate the voice of truth.

[@brianmorris8045]

@@fizzybubblech2128 But there were a good percentage of aboriginals, sensibly voted no. The voice lost because of a couple of things: And I'll say it again, but in this vid, Albo was mistakenly confident that all aboriginals would fall for it all. And one of the other things, was Thomas Mayo and Co., demanding retribution and treaty of some kind. He should have known that we, by law who own our house and land, were not going to start paying rent on something we own. We need an audit of the money going to the various agencies to find out where the money is going to, and why it isn't getting to where it is supposed to end up. Then when the money eventually gets through, there is no need whatsover to ask for retribution. But even if the money finally get to said destination, blokes like Mayo will still demaned retribution which he isn't getting anyway.

[@fizzybubblech2128]

@@brianmorris8045 I see. Makes sense.

[@wilshirestrasse2220]

"You can't run a society on regret..." Well said.

[@banta-pd8zj]

Regret what? That Anderson's ancestors stole aboriginal land which is at the core of his personal wealth and privilege? Well said indeed.

[@user-sj5lq8uz5j]

It lost, because Australians would not accept a racial pecking order in the constitution!!!!

[@banta-pd8zj]

We'll keep the racial pecking order that exists in the constitution already thank you very much. Thank god the provisions laid out for a white Australia policy are still in place.

[@cspace1234nz]

..yep, Australia dodged a bullet with this 'Voice' business, unlike in New Zealand where the moaris got their snouts in the treough decades ago and have been pigging out ever since. The ever growing division and a whole new form of racism we have in NZ has been avoided for now in Aussie. Well done !

[@Azraiel213]

Terribly sad to see New Zealand become infamous for race communism, of all things.

[@markferguson7563]

The indefatigable reason as to why the Voice got SMASHED out of the park and, indeed, never to be raised again is irrefutably due to NINETY percent of voters from non-Anglo/European cradles voted NO. The reality of affairs is that, the collect of 4.5 million voters, who are either immigrants or are the offspring of immigrants from China, India, the Middle East or wherever, DON’T consider themselves to be invaders or descendants of invaders. And to verify that reality, merely requires examining the ethnocultural breakdown of the voters in seats in metropolitan areas where the NO vote was at least 60 percent against. However, what Anglo/Europeans should also take heed of is that, all of the millions of people from non-Anglo/European cradles who voted NO for the Voice will, in the not-too-distant future, dispossess Australians of AE heritages from this country, too. So, when it happens don’t complain that you weren’t warned. To sustain that pending horror of being dispossessed from your country and culture played out in recent weeks - most particularly so in Britain - when these ethnoreligious groups staged huge anti-western and anti-Israel rallies.

[@fatherburning358]

Quite derogatory, dare I say racist language there fulla. Snouts pigging out? Or is it just resentment? You come across as racist and resentful as some of my family, and I'm maori. So who's racist attitude won seems to be your problem.

[@cspace1234nz]

@@fatherburning358 ....it's however you imagine it to be but only the typical maori victim mentality sees resentment. Let's call it white priviledge for good measure too shall we ? My maori mates I grew up with, went to school with, played footy with, now our kids are growing up with theirs too, they're the ones I listen to, they can't stand what the radicals and elite maoris have done with the country and they are the ones who have brought about an ever increasing division. Hey that's just a fact, it is what it is now, the country has gone and my point was that Australia have so far avoided going down the same track.

[@fatherburning358]

@cspace1234nz oh I understood your point and agree. It's your use of language I was highlighting. And I said that's how you come across, I didn't say you were. Your a bit triggerd mate. Going to great lengths to defend gutter language, which detracts from your point, so as to win. I'm of the same opinion as your mates mate. Get a grip and speak like an adult and maybe you'll be respected as one.

[@caro1ns]

To use a common Australian parlance, we said 'Yeah, nah.'

[@banta-pd8zj]

How Australian. It's about time you bit the bullet and like any true Australian tell those aborigines to go back to Africa or Asia or wherever they came from in that other great Australian tradition of telling others that they are not wanted with their unAustralian ways with their unwanted customs and unwanted foods and their jibber jabber and expecting things they didn't work hard for because we represent the pinnacle of human achievement cast like pearls before the swine they are who are rolling in money and sponge off the public purse in jails and oh, I can go on and on forever just like Johnno because we are born free and true.

[@juliedunne2726]

You hit the nail on the head Douglas!

[@williamzk9083]

-I recently flew from Sydney to Port Headland via Perth. I endured 8 "Welcome to Country" type rituals. Arrival and Departure on each leg plus several times on the entertainment systems. The amount of bandwidth it took was vile and over bearing. It distracted from the safety message. Australian Movies and Entertainment also have become over bearing. I had two migrant parents. I never liked standing for the queen (but we did it) at every showing of a movie and neither did Australian as they got rid of it. This is far worse as the Queen actually didn't want racial conflict but harmony. -Over 50% of the country is under Native Title. Some 220 Land councils quoth little to no accounting oversight to ensure the money gets spent goes back to the community. Dubious definition of what it takes to be Aboriginal. (Being embraced by an elder). Some 40 billion spend on aboriginal welfare with barely 50% of it getting through. Billions go from mining and grazing companies to Land councils.

[@briananderson7285]

Ridiculous isn't it...tell me it's not a racist money grab .

[@vivianhull3317]

The states are trying to shove it all through anyway. No means No

[@tyrejuan8]

Exactly and they say they don't have a "voice"! But you hear about them all day long.

[@banta-pd8zj]

Not another welcome. No wonder you're as mad as they come. The gall of these people.

[@christinac3929]

Every missive from my public housing NGO includes the message (the NGO) "is committed to honouring Australian Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples unique cultural and spiritual relationships to the land, waters and seas and their rich contribution to society." I can't think of a single practice that has been adopted by other Australians. We are being gaslighted and I hope Marcia Langton's promise of no more welcome ceremonies was sincere.

[@nikitaw1982]

sacred land they happily sell to chinese who have no respect for land or people.

[@simongross3122]

Because you can't adopt any practices. That would be called cultural appropriation.

[@markferguson7563]

The indefatigable reason as to why the Voice got SMASHED out of the park and, indeed, never to be raised again is irrefutably due to NINETY percent of voters from non-Anglo/European cradles voted NO. The reality of affairs is that, the collect of 4.5 million voters, who are either immigrants or are the offspring of immigrants from China, India, the Middle East or wherever, DON’T consider themselves to be invaders or descendants of invaders. And to verify that reality, merely requires examining the ethnocultural breakdown of the voters in seats in metropolitan areas where the NO vote was at least 60 percent against. However, what Anglo/Europeans should also take heed of is that, all of the millions of people from non-Anglo/European cradles who voted NO for the Voice will, in the not-too-distant future, dispossess Australians of AE heritages from this country, too. So, when it happens don’t complain that you weren’t warned. To sustain that pending horror of being dispossessed from your country and culture played out in recent weeks - most particularly so in Britain - when these ethnoreligious groups staged huge anti-western and anti-Israel rallies.

[@banta-pd8zj]

The welcome to country ceremony reminds the colonisers that sovereignty was never ceded. That's a tad awkward what?

[@nikitaw1982]

@@banta-pd8zj after ANZACS sacrificed fending off the japanese in WW2 colonizers became native. Aboriginals completely thankless and really don't bring anything to society. I really can't think of anything. Aboriginal culture shoved down our throats so don't think I'm missing anything and yet nothing is of any interest or value. No i don't think Witchetty grubs, didgeridoos or boomerangs are that amazing. I bet 99% of aboriginals couldn't spell didgeridoo

[@MrGeorge514131]

Great interview John, I am thankful that people saw this divisive attempt by this government. Hopefully people will see and understand what is happening in the world today, all I will say is “beware of the Puppet Masters “ !!!!

[@robharris5467]

What interested me as a non-Australian was the Albo-led approach which in essence was 'all we have to do to get 'yes' across the line is call the opposing voices "RACIST"' Gradually that call is losing traction.

[@banta-pd8zj]

That'll teach those aborigines to know their place. Imagine the gall of those people assuming astonishing poverty might require astonishing remedies. The idea!

[@MrGeorge514131]

@@banta-pd8zj give them an inch …..

[@Raven44453]

Well done Australia, here in the UK we dont get to vote on things like this , we are just told that some sections of our society will be treated better than others , for us its the indigenous population who are 2nd class now and the divide is evident and causing resentment

[@carolyndarragh1891]

I was just there in July 2023 and am gobsmacked at how the wokeraty are taking over the UK. You are utterly correct and sadly it will be the country's downfall. Indigenous Londoners for example are now considered second/third class in their own city. It is utterly unbelievable. Go well.

[@banta-pd8zj]

Just imagine Johnno and Douglas might have had their plush leather chairs forcefully taken off them by the ungrateful unwashed. But thankfully another bullet dodged. Phew!

[@trg9765]

The majority of Australians woke up and said NO TO DIVIDING AUSTRALIA BY RACE. ONE COUNTRY ONE PEOPLE ONE FLAG OR BE TORN APART AND SUFFER UNTOLD TURMOIL IN THIS GREAT COUNRTY.

[@banta-pd8zj]

Jeezuz, now there's a good example of not being racist. Beauty.

[@chugmah]

I've listened to many of your interviews John. You have done a great service in bringing common sense, pragmatic, compassionate and sensible discussions to light. Thank you, from an everyday Aussie battler!

[@warwickkinscher5986]

“:You can’t run a society on that - regret”. One simple sentence explains why the Voice campaign failed.

[@banta-pd8zj]

That and a ton of misinformation and scare tactics. Don't forget the misinformation and scare tactics.

[@rogeralsop3479]

Two excellent men.

[@josephconte3824]

I can listen to John Anderson all day long, and never tired of hearing him

[@lieshtmeiser5542]

Very well articulated John.

[@markferguson7563]

The indefatigable reason as to why the Voice got SMASHED out of the park and, indeed, never to be raised again is irrefutably due to NINETY percent of voters from non-Anglo/European cradles voted NO. The reality of affairs is that, the collect of 4.5 million voters, who are either immigrants or are the offspring of immigrants from China, India, the Middle East or wherever, DON’T consider themselves to be invaders or descendants of invaders. And to verify that reality, merely requires examining the ethnocultural breakdown of the voters in seats in metropolitan areas where the NO vote was at least 60 percent against. However, what Anglo/Europeans should also take heed of is that, all of the millions of people from non-Anglo/European cradles who voted NO for the Voice will, in the not-too-distant future, dispossess Australians of AE heritages from this country, too. So, when it happens don’t complain that you weren’t warned. To sustain that pending horror of being dispossessed from your country and culture played out in recent weeks - most particularly so in Britain - when these ethnoreligious groups staged huge anti-western and anti-Israel rallies.

[@cheddar2648]

What does "indigenous peoples" mean when I was born here?

[@samparkes2477]

“A person of Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islander descent who identifies as Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islander and is accepted as such by the community in which he or she lives.”

[@banta-pd8zj]

Oh, and what brand of cheddar are you?

[@samparkes2477]

@@OO-DownUnder Indigenous, in this context, refers to the people who lived on the land before colonial settlers arrived. It’s the same in the US. It doesn’t make the majority of Americans “foreigners”. But neither are they indigenous. There’s a difference.

[@bluegoblet7672]

Native means your grandparent's bones are buried in the soil you stand on. Indigenous means super native, a person's continuous uninterrupted ancestry to a soil goes back thousands of years. Aboriginal people are super native i.e. indigenous First fleeter descendants, etc, are 'just' natives. Both belong here though.

[@marktanska6331]

My faith in Australian population has been vindicated. We are full of strange groups, but when things are desperate, we know what to do.

[@rogermouton2273]

This clarified for me the key arguments against the Voice: that it would have placed Aboriginal people as a special class, above all others in Australian society. Of course, governments have always given special help to Aboriginal people, because they are obviously, in many ways, disadvantaged as a group. But there is equality in this, inasmuch as governments will generally devote resources to assisting particular disadvantaged groups - they do not elevate one particular group above all others, as this would have done - in a way that would have been entrenched as part of the Federal parliamentary system. Strangely enough, it also assumed that there would forever be a need for such a body - the implication being that the gap will never be closed. So, paradoxically, the 'yes' argument was that we need this body to close the gap, but on the other hand the gap will never be closed.

[@omahhumvajragurupadmasiddhihum]

Very interesting comment, coming from someone who doesn't know much about it. I did read the yes and no pamphlet and yes seemed very idealistic and almost guilt shaming you in doing "the right thing", whereas the "no" had a long and detailed list of practical concerns...

[@axle.australian.patriot]

"... Aboriginal people, because they are obviously, in many ways, disadvantaged as a group." Nah, I reject that. grown up with and lived along side of peoples with both Aboriginal and Island heritage and they are just as capable as I am in most things. Unfortunately some people "Choose" disadvantage and this exists in all cultural demographics.

[@rogermouton2273]

@@axle.australian.patriot It's not a question of how 'capable' a few individuals you might have met are. It's common knowledge that, on average, they have shorter life expectancy, higher rates of incarceration, higher rates of domestic violence, etc., etc. Does that help you?

[@axle.australian.patriot]

@@rogermouton2273 Not really, Negative choices equal negative outcomes. That's just a fact. If they choose to do crime, live in squealer, do drugs and then beat each other while they are smashed.. What do you expect is going to happen. I know lots of people who die young because of bad choices like above.

[@axle.australian.patriot]

@@rogermouton2273 P.S. I take exception to your "few individuals" BS too. Do you think I say that because I seen 1 or 2 aboriginal people in the street once? Lived my entire life with them as a community. emphasis on the word "community", not 1 or 2 people.

[@thewholls7176]

Perhaps the referendum is also another example of inter-sectionalism……. Because the aboriginals were saying we are oppressed, and we need rights in the constitution to unlock that oppression And then other groups, such as the LGBTQ’s came along, and said we want to be in the constitution as well - because we too are a minority group that’s being oppressed… And other groups who are immigrants from Vietnam and Greece, and Italy said we came here with Nothing as immigrants we got nothing - why do the aboriginals get that considering all the other stuff they also get currently that we don’t….. So unlocking one supposedly oppressed group led to a chain reaction, which started to unlock all of them, and you just end up with a train crash ……!!!!

[@banta-pd8zj]

Can't have everyone treated with respect now can we. NO.

[@thewholls7176]

@@banta-pd8zj well….. its not about respect it’s about “me too” combined with a comparative assessment of who’s worse off and what did they get compared to me……??!! All the best from Melbourne Australia

[@Simon-nv5zj]

My reasons for voting no was quite simply because I think we are ALL Australians. It quite literally was the first step towards 'treaty' (land and money grab) a idea that can only increase the divide. Im not going to be welcomed to a country my ancestors were on over 200 years ago.

[@banta-pd8zj]

Where in the voice did it say anything about only a few of us are Australian?

[@Simon-nv5zj]

@@banta-pd8zj have you read the entire uluru statement?

[@banta-pd8zj]

Please enlighten me Simon.

[@Simon-nv5zj]

@@banta-pd8zj Clearly you need to 'enlighten' yourself. Do your own research, Im not doing the hard work for you.

[@Azraiel213]

"If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it."

[@banta-pd8zj]

And if you don't know, then good!

[@whatbrigiddid6492]

Australians knew division would not heal old wounds. We are a young country, but we knew division was not the answer. The language of the Australian government was completely despicable. “The Voice” was the campaign name. Implying the indigenous population have no voice. However, under the constitution EVERYONE has a voice and can be elected to parliament. Unfortunately, the indigenous community was used by the yes campaigners. It was manipulative and cruel. Average Australians have had enough of being told how to behave or think and they are waking up. In the words of Malcolm Turnbull it’s the “quiet Australian”, who is not to be underestimated.

[@brontepetropoulos4755]

Luv these two men i hope ARC picks up a huge momentum and people will get behind it🇭🇲

[@markferguson7563]

The indefatigable reason as to why the Voice got SMASHED out of the park and, indeed, never to be raised again is irrefutably due to NINETY percent of voters from non-Anglo/European cradles voted NO. The reality of affairs is that, the collect of 4.5 million voters, who are either immigrants or are the offspring of immigrants from China, India, the Middle East or wherever, DON’T consider themselves to be invaders or descendants of invaders. And to verify that reality, merely requires examining the ethnocultural breakdown of the voters in seats in metropolitan areas where the NO vote was at least 60 percent against. However, what Anglo/Europeans should also take heed of is that, all of the millions of people from non-Anglo/European cradles who voted NO for the Voice will, in the not-too-distant future, dispossess Australians of AE heritages from this country, too. So, when it happens don’t complain that you weren’t warned. To sustain that pending horror of being dispossessed from your country and culture played out in recent weeks - most particularly so in Britain - when these ethnoreligious groups staged huge anti-western and anti-Israel rallies.

[@MrMattias87]

I suppose that the voice was kinda similar to the referendum in the UK for Scottish Independence many years ago (led by that dreaded SNP) with similar reasons (that is 'England did this, England did that' etc) which also met with the same result.....a complete failure.

[@markferguson7563]

The indefatigable reason as to why the Voice got SMASHED out of the park and, indeed, never to be raised again is irrefutably due to NINETY percent of voters from non-Anglo/European cradles voted NO. The reality of affairs is that, the collect of 4.5 million voters, who are either immigrants or are the offspring of immigrants from China, India, the Middle East or wherever, DON’T consider themselves to be invaders or descendants of invaders. And to verify that reality, merely requires examining the ethnocultural breakdown of the voters in seats in metropolitan areas where the NO vote was at least 60 percent against. However, what Anglo/Europeans should also take heed of is that, all of the millions of people from non-Anglo/European cradles who voted NO for the Voice will, in the not-too-distant future, dispossess Australians of AE heritages from this country, too. So, when it happens don’t complain that you weren’t warned. To sustain that pending horror of being dispossessed from your country and culture played out in recent weeks - most particularly so in Britain - when these ethnoreligious groups staged huge anti-western and anti-Israel rallies.

[@baz3575]

The difference is Scotland and Ireland should be independent.

[@banta-pd8zj]

Kinda similar? Were the aborigines pushing for their own country. Well I hope that someone told them in no uncertain terms to go back where they come from.

[@carolyndarragh1891]

When fairness is at the heart of one's culture, which it really is in Australia, you were always going to get this outcome. No one in Australia is above anyone else and if you try to be, Australians will ultimately cut you off at the knees. The tall poppy syndrome is central to Australian culture and raising one group against another and enshrining that in the Constitution was never going to fly. Modern/European society in Australia was started organically on this principle due to the types of people who did and continue to arrive and is the antithesis of Britain on that score. On the contrary, raising one group above another is central to British culture and the UK is utterly held back by its class system which is completely intact, alive and well. The class system in Britain holds the country back in every facet of life and stifles the majority of people's aspirations and ability to improve their lifestyle. Unless you own land in the UK, or are a professional it is pretty hard to have any type of lifestyle comparable with the wonderful one we have here in Australia. Of course there are exceptions but I figuratively kiss the ground daily and give thanks my forebears left Britain two centuries ago. Love the place (UK) in Summer for a few weeks but thank the universe daily that Australia is home and doesn't the rest of the world know it? So on that basis why would we elevate the status of one group above another and enshrine it in perpetuity in our founding document? Clearly we wouldn't. End of.

[@davidjohn9006]

Australia was potentially "a force for good in the world" … unfortunately that potential has not been fulfilled nor that opportunity. Australia is now, and has been for some decades passed, a lap-dog, lackey, deputy dawg, "colony" at the beck-n-call of "others" influences and dictates, not of the best interests and needs of this country. Perhaps not Australia per se, but more its leadership-govt and those in positions of power & privilege & political/policy influence.

[@bernie8987]

Because of all the free stuff aboriginal people are the fastest growing population though mainly in cities and not the outback

[@banta-pd8zj]

Racist free comment.

[@timsmith1125]

History, regardless of the nation, has shown that elevating one group of individuals over others has disastrous consequences. Even here in the USA, we have plenty of examples including a Civil War. Orwell warned us about the dangers of such things.

[@lynlavelle8042]

BRAVO!!!

[@marklivingstone3710]

The best comment I heard came from Senator Pocock from the ACT. We’ve tried doing nothing new for fifty years and nothings changed. Perhaps it’s time to try something else. What disappointed me was the ‘conservative’ no vote campaign dug up all the tropes that did the rounds after the Mabo and Wik decisions made in the High Court. The National Party gobbed off that Aboriginals could just say they object to Australia Day or ANZAC Day or Christmas or Easter and we’d lose those public holidays which was just the same old rascist clap trap we’ve seen in the Murdoch dominated press for the last 50 odd years. The no campaign simply said no but offered no alternative to the status quo. I guess they’re hoping we’ll just choose to do nothing for another 50 years and see if anything changes. I’m an old white guy and I think it was a sad day that we will regret in time. As Paul Keating said at Redfern in 1996. We continue to let this happen because we lack the ability and the empathy to consider how we would feel if we or our families were treated the same way First Nations People are treated. We know what he meant, we know we don’t want to be treated the same way, it astounds me that we are ok with standing there doing nothing when we see it happening to someone else. I also do not understand the push by some for a treaty. I’m yet to find a single treaty between a government and First Nation people that has ever been honoured (English, French, Dutch, Spanish , Portuguese, American…. Not one)

[@baz3575]

No matter how much you give Aboriginal people, they will not help themselves. Why? They have no unity as a people, they are made up of small kin groups who look out for each other. Putting that in the Constitution would have ensured a small handful had the control at the expense of them as a whole. We dodged a bullet.

[@derekcostello1016]

If everybody is racist - Then nobody is racist.

[@AS-rx4tp]

I voted no because the Australian government already has the constitutional power to create the proposed voice. There is absolutely no doubt about this. This power already rests within the ambit of the Australian government. There had been an earlier version of the voice in the 1980s called the Aboriginal and Torres Straight Islander Commission (ATSIC). This was created using the already existing constitutional powers of the Australian government. One of ATSIC’s purposes was to advise the federal government on issues affecting indigenous Australians. This is what the proposed voice was going to do. ATSIC ended up being a disaster and the legislation was later repealed. If the PM really though this was a good idea he should have simply legislated for it and Australians could see if it was in fact a good idea. If it transpired to be a good idea (doubtful) then he could have asked Australians to entrench it in our Constitution. He didn’t do that and presented a half-baked idea that Australians right rejected, and resoundingly so.

[@davidgillies620]

When the gross iniquities of the past have been ameliorated, the agitators must seize on ever-less important issues to maintain their grip on power.

[@vizveebee]

I started reading the transcript to see if I could understand what the conversation was about, and it was so meandering and missing actual sticking to the point, but I'm presuming it's about giving one group of people more privilege in the land than not.

[@claregray7296]

Thank you Australia commonsense rules. Australians have respect for all we are not to be divided.

[@MOONBASE_Stereo_Side_Touchdown]

Where is "Welcome to Country" now ? Am I going deaf ? Haven't heard it once anywhere ! t was making me anxious, sick and I felt victimised each time I didn't acknowledge it. My son couldn't even receive his UNI diploma in peace, without them guilt shaming into standing and listening to their satanic chants.

[@deanpd3402]

and satanic, pagan it is.

[@banta-pd8zj]

Their Satanic chants. No racism expressed here.

[@MicMc539]

Why the Voice Lost? Because we're not America. Yet. Peace.

[@cheddar2648]

That wounded this American, but as we say, "it is what it is."

[@peterwebb8732]

Apparently, even in America, 93% of the citizens believe tgat the polarisation of their country is a bad thing. The division is being pushed and promoted by the same self-anointed “elites” who were pushing the “Yes” campaign here. It will be interesting to watch.

[@Nylon_riot]

What does this even mean?

[@MDCDiGiPiCs]

​​@@Nylon_riotit means that Australia is not beholden to the BLM victimhood ideology that has eroded both the US and the UK. Having said that, Australia is not out of the woods yet.

[@peterwebb8732]

@@Nylon_riot I assume you are asking what this “Voice” means? It means than in spite of the Federal Government and every State Government having a Cabinet Minister whose job it to attend to Aboriginal matters and welfare. In spite of having a multi-billion dollar government Department tasked with assessing aboriginal needs and distributing taxpayer funds… In spite of having 60 “Peak” representative bodies and 1200 other organisations all claiming to represent Aboriginal groups, concerns and issues….. In spite of all this, some self-satisfied elitists decided that Australia wasn’t “listening” to Aboriginals and that this could only be solved by having a NON-ELECTED Aboriginal “Parliament” to “advise” the Australian Government - and that this race-based body exercising a race-based privilege of special access to Government should be written into our Constitution. We voted No by a margin of nearly 2:1. Because it’s racist. Because we are already pouring $Billions into the Aboriginal industry. Because there is nothing stopping the Government which was proposing this, from LISTENING RIGHT BLOODY NOW without requiring a referendum or race-based changes to our national Constitution. In other words, the majority decided that it was a fraud, a fake and a farce.

[@iaincook5835]

The gap is a deliberate social construct. Up until a few decades ago, Aborigines were integrating steadily into western society, intermarrying, working, going to school, all the usual stuff that millions of migrants also did. No gap there. Somehow, the left persuaded 20-30% of Aborigines to remain "on country", far from jobs, school, services, facilities. Completely obvious result? A huge gap with everyone else, including most integrated Aborigines. The solution to the gap is also completely obvious: sideline the separatists and allow the rest to integrate into regional and urban centres.

[@where_is_my_slippers]

We all inherited our past and although I feel privileged to be Australian, I also have immense heartache for what happened to our first nations people. Their culture is incredible and they are a beautiful mob of people. They belong to this land, we don't. I 5hink its important to acknowledge that. What I was hoping for from the voice was to follow indigenous practices of caring for the land and their culture. Thats the one thing we are united on - our love for country.

[@hp-cs7mx]

There’s nothing to stop those who want to to live the original Aboriginal lifestyle, free and unencumbered by housing and western medicine. You can walk everywhere and catch your own food too.

[@bluegoblet7672]

Bullcrap: They belong to this land, we don't. We all belong to this land! I don't care who came here before.

[@azza0575]

If we keep living in the past, how are we ever going to move forward.

[@peterpiper831]

albosleazy was in a Catch 22 situation. If he'd told the truth, people would have been disgusted by the intentions of the voice. But by lying, people saw through him and rejected it anyway.

[@mazellehealth]

Our education system here in Australia has lost the plot once you have given over to it you can’t go back

[@markferguson7563]

The indefatigable reason as to why the Voice got SMASHED out of the park and, indeed, never to be raised again is irrefutably due to NINETY percent of voters from non-Anglo/European cradles voted NO. The reality of affairs is that, the collect of 4.5 million voters, who are either immigrants or are the offspring of immigrants from China, India, the Middle East or wherever, DON’T consider themselves to be invaders or descendants of invaders. And to verify that reality, merely requires examining the ethnocultural breakdown of the voters in seats in metropolitan areas where the NO vote was at least 60 percent against. However, what Anglo/Europeans should also take heed of is that, all of the millions of people from non-Anglo/European cradles who voted NO for the Voice will, in the not-too-distant future, dispossess Australians of AE heritages from this country, too. So, when it happens don’t complain that you weren’t warned. To sustain that pending horror of being dispossessed from your country and culture played out in recent weeks - most particularly so in Britain - when these ethnoreligious groups staged huge anti-western and anti-Israel rallies.

[@andrewkennedy4075]

Well said, it's been hard to make honest conversation about this as the haters hate and don't discuss

[@banta-pd8zj]

How was voting yes to the Voice an expression of hate?

[@samparkes2477]

Let's discuss it. What is not being discussed?

[@metaspacecrownedbytime4579]

Here in Australia, an Aboriginal person is able to adopt their traditional culture and live out in the wilderness in some of the most beautiful spaces in the world, self-sufficient. But they won't. They would rather complain receive gov. benefits ,be violent to others, and hate.

[@samparkes2477]

What an idiotic, pig-ignorant thing to say.

[@banta-pd8zj]

Not a shred of racism displayed here.

[@mikegalvin9801]

Good to see Australians still the sensible lot we thought they were. I think Murray has it right that the charge of racism no longer has the power it had in not just Australia but throughout the Anglosphere ten or even five years ago.

[@banta-pd8zj]

Yes. Like magic he waved the spectre of racism away. And away it went! Dougie is brilliant!

[@mikegalvin9801]

@@banta-pd8zj Not what I said. What I said was left has so wildly exaggerated and overused the Charge of "Racism!" eg. "Algebra is Racist!" "Everybody who Disagrees with Me is Racist!" that it has lost its power. It is the "Boy Who Cried Wolf" story from childhood only this time it's the "Activist Who Cried Racist!"

[@jimig6442]

I voted no, for the exact reasons outlined here by John. But to hear Douglas state that England has been a force for good and dismiss the Idea that Australians are not racist, is a tad too much. England has done some good, but huge amounts of bad. Australians are not all racists, but many are.

[@baz3575]

If I am completely honest, the most overwhelmingly racist demographic I have encountered in Australia are Arabs, specifically Muslims. Sure, you will meet people with biases in all cultural groups but I have experienced nothing like what I have experienced with Muslims. They hate the very country that has given them and their descendants a good, prosperous life.

[@banta-pd8zj]

Not an iota of racism expressed i this thread.

[@1258-Eckhart]

Well, here's some wisdom along the same lines: The public expression of any "deep society" is genuine humility. The knowledge of depth in this sense enables not only an articulation of proposed racial "preferment" legislation as mere institutionalised resentment (my paraphrase of John Anderson's words) but also an articulation of one's own past failures. Getting an admission of failure past a hostile press is an expression of national "deep character" which Winston Churchill eventually came to master, or indeed Douglas" example, Charles de Gaulle could deliver. My point is that the knowledge of this depth eliminates any need to dissemble, as so many politicians do. On a national level, it enables close cultural and political cooperation with neighbouring states in the knowledge that one's own depth is self-evidently secure.

[@jenniferbate9682]

England, Scotland, wales and Northern Ireland 😊

[@user-ld1dy3yc8j]

Information is not necessarily knowledge and certainly not common sense

[@axle.australian.patriot]

I have the knowledge to create a fission device capable of removing the center of a city... Just because I can doesn't necessarily mean I should.

[@banta-pd8zj]

Vote No to information. Vote Yes to misinformation. Vote I don't know means No to information.

[@royboy4571]

DM, with his rancid arguement at 1.38-1.50, that some how the first nations should be grateful for everthing the Europeans have done. European settlement and progress were never intended to improve the life of the indigenous people, in fact they were made for the welfare of us immigrants and in some cases made their life worse. Ever heard of the stolen generation, there was a change introduced by our government which tore the heart out of the indigenous people. WA will pay $200m to indigenous people for lost wages between 1936 and 1972 based on a state policy to withhold 75% of their wages, never paid. Geez just imagine those fellas had the wages to pay for those shiny homes during after WW2, and enjoy all the infrastructer that comes with that. Oops, they didn't get there money, couldn't afford those houses. And as you would know intergenerational wealth is largely due to home ownership. Now there's some inter-generational disadvantage for you. Not to mention the enslavement, massacre and expulsion of indigenous peoples Point being, infrastructure over the past 200 years, was accompanied by horrible policies that harmed and continue to harm the indigenous. As usual DM, is ignorant of real Australian history.

[@banta-pd8zj]

He's a toffee nosed upper class privileged bigot.

[@fizzybubblech2128]

Wow thanks for this information.

[@royboy4571]

@@fizzybubblech2128 Glad to help the ignorant people who don’t know our history, like DM.

[@BarryOvers-kd5rd]

Anderson . Didn't he leave Parliament to a directorship of a coal company?

[@GregMoylan-pn6sr]

There appears to be an inverse relationship between education level and common sense. This theory was strongly validated during the fractious campaigns of the Voice referendum.

[@bethoumyvision6946]

Of course it was divisive. And it was also a definite gravy train.

[@noneofyoubusiness4895]

The advert for this clip is longer than the clip : - )

[@chrisherne6454]

To explain the 'elites', have a read of Sowell's 'The Vision of the Anointed: Self-Congratulation as a Basis for Social Policy'. They foist solutions on us for problems that don't actually exist.

[@markferguson7563]

The indefatigable reason as to why the Voice got SMASHED out of the park and, indeed, never to be raised again is irrefutably due to NINETY percent of voters from non-Anglo/European cradles voted NO. The reality of affairs is that, the collect of 4.5 million voters, who are either immigrants or are the offspring of immigrants from China, India, the Middle East or wherever, DON’T consider themselves to be invaders or descendants of invaders. And to verify that reality, merely requires examining the ethnocultural breakdown of the voters in seats in metropolitan areas where the NO vote was at least 60 percent against. However, what Anglo/Europeans should also take heed of is that, all of the millions of people from non-Anglo/European cradles who voted NO for the Voice will, in the not-too-distant future, dispossess Australians of AE heritages from this country, too. So, when it happens don’t complain that you weren’t warned. To sustain that pending horror of being dispossessed from your country and culture played out in recent weeks - most particularly so in Britain - when these ethnoreligious groups staged huge anti-western and anti-Israel rallies.

[@banta-pd8zj]

If I picture elites, the sight of Johnno and Dougie fits the bill exactly. What a wonder that Anderson can fly frequently between his huge money spinner of a station and Oxford to expose the evil elitism that Australia just recently vanquished. Another bullet dodged by our man of the people.

[@RyanSymons]

The post-mortem is evidence in my view that it was indeed divisive.

[@banta-pd8zj]

Thank god we maintained our unity. Another dodged bullet.

[@Baldric1600]

May I have an opinion, will it be posted?

[@greenbank4800]

Well this multi-degree, professional woman with indigenous neices and nephews said no, certainly dont feel "elite" . During the horrible years of the Joh era in Qld, I and others were physically assaulted protesting the then all white South African government's womens national squash team's presence at international games.Joh's special branch police were shocking and had no restraint on the day. To embed difference and exceptional potential political power in the ultimate governing legal document of any nation is dangerous historically.Good call Australians!

[@banta-pd8zj]

What have we become as a nation. What have you become.

[@RabidWombatz]

Yep.

[@francesblabey3055]

❤👏👏👏👏👏👏👏

[@oldtimers6460]

The yes vote ran a dishonest campaign. The Aboriginals were a stone age people when the British arrived and the opportunities that have come their way and rejected proves that you cannot take a primitive people and hope they advance beyond their means or understanding in only a few hundred tears. Now as to accountability of were 40 billion dollars a year goes ? The Aboriginals have 3,500 Aboriginal and Torres Strait islander depts ,240 land councils and another 140+ Aboriginal affairs depts as well as 11 ministers in parliament of Aboriginal descent. Dam well represented for less than a million people

[@howardwarren7683]

John, the majority voted no because we are struggling to pay our mortgages let alone fund yet another token beaurocratic money-go-round. If our focus was to raise productivity, reduce poverty, the equalization of racial disparity will naturally follow. I would challenge any government to prove me wrong.

[@chapmansbg]

I think you got it wrong when you say 'Australians' want to honour Aboriginals. I think Australians want to get rid of terms that separate us as a nation, that means get rid of the idea of indigenous, first nations and these terms mean anything more than a description of somebodies ancestry. No rights or privileges should be given for any racial, cultural or ancestry based identifiers.

[@markferguson7563]

The indefatigable reason as to why the Voice got SMASHED out of the park and, indeed, never to be raised again is irrefutably due to NINETY percent of voters from non-Anglo/European cradles voted NO. The reality of affairs is that, the collect of 4.5 million voters, who are either immigrants or are the offspring of immigrants from China, India, the Middle East or wherever, DON’T consider themselves to be invaders or descendants of invaders. And to verify that reality, merely requires examining the ethnocultural breakdown of the voters in seats in metropolitan areas where the NO vote was at least 60 percent against. However, what Anglo/Europeans should also take heed of is that, all of the millions of people from non-Anglo/European cradles who voted NO for the Voice will, in the not-too-distant future, dispossess Australians of AE heritages from this country, too. So, when it happens don’t complain that you weren’t warned. To sustain that pending horror of being dispossessed from your country and culture played out in recent weeks - most particularly so in Britain - when these ethnoreligious groups staged huge anti-western and anti-Israel rallies.

[@DGM-uf3ny]

I just didn't trust Albanese.

[@Xplora213]

Straight up… it would have been far more useful to say “if 60% of the country is racist, then you are welcome to leave and if you aren’t leaving, accept you are a minority”. It’s the most painful part…. The indigenous people lost the battle and never will win (because they will never be a majority or a forceful minority) and the rest are free to leave because it’s a free country. The most sad accusation is racism as a minority because it is toothless if you are a minority as Hilary C found out. Too bad. You lost.

[@banta-pd8zj]

No racism expressed here.

[@antonroux6737]

...the special class you talked about would then be called for by large ethnic groups ie the Chinese Voice, the Indian Voice, the Muslim Voice, the LGBT Voice; then the Big Business Voice - no wait, Big Business already have their own Voice, perhaps the Indigenous Voice was going to be a good cover for what already exists!

[@Bertie22222]

It's essential that there is plenty of racism in society in order for the 'racism police' to be required.

[@iaincook5835]

Given that "conservatives" are, by and large, against inserting race into the Constitution, dislike the trend to the separation of Aborigines from the rest of society, support Israel against right-wing Palestinian terror groups, and know what a woman is and don't seek to erase them from the English language, I suggest we are actually the progressive side of politics!

[@donicagiorgio]

Its true..you can run a sociaty ..regret...Platon On Republice..said. teach your young generation carefull ..will be your socity in future..after generation .. Politics..like or not will regret% ..value its not money ..hipocricy..hate..are theatre..its a culture * transformation on what you teach every passt and future..gen..❤

[@deniseorourke7235]

It failed because it wasn’t a voice but a in-voice

[@kbrown5218]

Japan doesn't run their country on regret. They just stick to their nationalism.

[@martinjurovic8314]

Anyone with a brain said noooo!

[@banta-pd8zj]

It's obviously mooo. Use your spell checker.

[@chinogambino9375]

I don't think it's that deep. Most people did not know what the voice was or why it should exist. The advocates didn't make a strong case and relied on shame. When 25% of Australians have foreign parents or are migrants you can't shame them for racism. The white people here need to watch out for themselves as well, official discrimination like BAME in hiring like the UK isn't here yet but it's the next step.

[@peterg4944]

STOP THE BS. IT WAS NEVER A VOICE. IT WAS A VETO AND PEOPLE SAW THIS. END OF STORY.

[@banta-pd8zj]

In your dreams. Having exposed the racism so evident in this country its back to the drawing board. You can't quite understand that the status quo is not particularly good for anybody.

[@user-mu1ul9my9s]

Mosar Yousaf should be given a platform. He is the Son of Hamas founder and works for Israel.

[@nickgood8166]

Wing back chairs are different. John's is higher, with a taller back. Not a good look, because this suggests to an observant viewer that John may be seeking to subtly boost his status relative to that of the guest's using psychological techniques. 4:56

[@banta-pd8zj]

I loved the backhanders John was giving Doug. Everytime he pretended to be a yes voting elite, Johnno sounded exactly like Dougie. Oh ... the laughs.

[@Min61449]

It lost because the LNP and One Nation spread disinformation about it… and you helped them.

[@AquaMarine1000]

Being able to recall facts and figures can get you through university, unfortunately your degree is no qualification of common sense.

[@banta-pd8zj]

Just imagine that knuckle dragging Abbott was a Rhodes Scholar. It's hard isn't it. Imagining that Abbott could have been a poster boy for the benefit of a good education. You do understand that Anderson was a member of a government that stated that public schools could not teach moral values and embarked on a program shifting enormous amounts of our tax wealth to private schools at a time when many public schools in poorer suburbs could not supply adequate computer hardware to their students. Anderson. The avowed enemy of elites. You're not very bright are you. Is that due to poor educational standards in your upbringing?

[@crapmalls]

Or would you have preferred colonial rule by France the following weekend? Youre lucky the british got here first

[@banta-pd8zj]

That's right. I demand not only no more welcomes to country but NO MORE CROISSANTS NOW!

[@gondwanatravels8834]

It lost because we were treated as mugs.

[@gerardbuckley6955]

If the No vote arguments were valid, why the need to misrepresent the arguments for the Yes vote? List of massacres of Indigenous Australians - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_massacres_of_Indigenous_Australians