Why TPOT NEEDS to Switch to Contestant Vote (BFDI Discussion Video)

[@superradicalsquad6617]

I don’t think TPOT should do contestant vote since viewer voting is the reason a lot of people love the show and it’s going to alienate a lot of viewers.

[@white_tiger2669]

respectfully, this is a horrible idea and i disagree with nearly every single point in no particular order, some of the issues you blame on vote to save are just... writing issues that are fully independent of vote to save? for one, screentime. the writers could just...not put the team ufe until they gave them attention? like imagine if everything in BFB 2 was the same except free food suddenly loses. that would just be plain bad writing, compared to BEEP's loss being built up through the episode (excluding gripes with singling out a single contestant, which i will get back to later). even if they have to put the team up...its still on the writers to give them screentime. regardless of the amount of teams it's still on the writers (small amount of teams = more focus on each one, more teams = more time between eliminations). i guess merge is an exception but if you're going into the merge with a mostly undeveloped cast then that's a way bigger problem and on people being pit up against fan favorites... there's two ways you can approach this. one; is it even a problem? that's how viewer voting goes, people will like some contestants more than others. a lot of the community needs to get over the mindset that there are times a character "deserves" to go when they don't, as not only does it come off as people complaining about others having opinions (which it is), but it also overshadows actual discussion about these characters, like marker, whose role in the DPA arc is severely underappreciated (i will not return to this point but i can elaborate if asked) and second; the disparity in popularities can be used interestingly. take fanny in TPOT for an example. while she was good in BFB, in early TPOT she struggled due to losing most her characterization. some writers would continue on without paying attention, but TPOT did something special, in that they actually paid attention to the characters position in the game. while it does make sense for fanny as a character to lash out against the pact, the main driving factor was the fact that she was next on the chopping block. think about it; the previous episode, TPOT 6, showed everyone was pro pact, so theoretically anybody could've been chosen for that role. but it would've been magnitudes less impactful if it was marker or tree who rebelled against the pact. also, as a side note, the fact that her character arc focused on her (and BH)'s character is why they get so many votes while basketball got out with half the votes of the GOAT (name one thing we learn about basketball's character after TPOT 7. now do the same with winner or BH and notice how it's so much easier) and also; blaming the early boots on VtS is...stupid. like, theoretically they all could've been these amazing characters who win seasons...but they aren't. they're just OK. theorizing about a character's potential is fun, but eventually this community has to remember that a character can't be defined by their potential. take foldy. people always say she could be great IF whatever or WHEN whatever, but the truth is that she has several years of competition up on some characters like bracelety or 8-ball but has a fraction of the characterization of those two, not even counting tpot 11. sometimes a character who doesn't do much gets out, and id much prefer that over "character who is mean or threw the challenge" being the first boots of every single team. sure you could argue they should stay to be characterized, but if they were characterized we wouldn't be having this discussion would we also please elaborate more on vote to eliminate. i for one think it's decent, but VTS eclipses it both in making votes count (the % of votes that actually affect the show in VTS is all of them except for the eliminated contestant, which is the opposite of VTE) and also getting to the more interesting parts faster; eliminations that are down to the wire, where you don't see the result coming away from another galaxy. like, name a single elimination in pre split that wasn't incredibly predictable besides maybe bracelety on account of TIC not doing much BFB 3. you talked alot about wanting unpredictability near the end, but a lot of your arguments against VTS seem to want your favorites to all stay in longer...which is the opposite of unpredictability and for contestant voting... no. just no. starting simply with the most obvious fact; BFDI's popularity would start to plateu. the show's identity is entirely reliant on the viewers investments in seeing these characters safe. while you could still accomplish this with contestant vote, there's no getting rid of the preestablished investment already in these characters. imagine if they contestant voted out BH or grassy despite them almost always being first safe. the main hook of BFDI is thay you can affect the show, and such a blatant disregard for the audience would severely harm the show also, viewer voting can create narratives that i don't believe most writers in the OSC would attempt otherwise. the DPA arc was mentioned, but in another object show, team room 125, the entirey of one team except for one were ALL voted out before the other lost their second member. of course, TR125's comedic tone makes this not lingered on for too long, but it's a fantastic example of making compelling underdogs... especially when the character in question uses gen z slang also telling writers to "contestant vote out" potential finalists they don't like is just stupid. see previous point on audience investment, but also forcing writers to write characters in positions they normally wouldn't be in is the whole point of viewer vote. reminder that if rocky survived in season one and got the final immunity (which of course he would've it's too funny to pass up) he potentially could've WON BFDI. that is not only fascinating but incredibly hilarious and that would not be possible with contestant vote i think comparing to II is kinda missing the point. II is about pre planned stories + having contestant vote play a dominant role in season 1 especially compared to BFDI's season 1. BFDI is about hijinks with the characters who are there also also; showing characters and calling them amazing doesn't really count for good evidence unless everyone is on the same page about every character. which, considering the media literacy of the fandom ranges from "hasn't written even a middle school english essay" to "actual college graduate" is kinda impossible as a closing statement i think the increasing prevelance of contestant vote is making people forget about the unique experiences made only by viewer voting. yes, contestant vote has its place in shows made around it, but you're trying to cram it into a show where it just doesn't belong

[@rtmkr1523]

Thanks for the detailed comment, you made some good points and this is a fair argument but unfortunately, in all honesty, while I respect your opinion, I disagree overall, on one hand, yes, writers should give teams build up and decent screentime in the episode they are put UFE, and Jacknjellify did a good job of that in BFB, with the exception of bleh in bfb 14 tho. I think generic characters going up against fan-favorites is a problem but I already talked enough about that in the video, I just don't like how Viewer Voting goes to be honest, especially VTS, it's favored towards popular characters, nuff said. But I can see your point when you said the community needs to get over the fact certain characters deserves to leave, I agree with some characters who got this treatment like Foldy & Eggy (Not listing them specifically because I like them) but I disagree with Marker, I see Marker getting extra votes for being Green, people just want more Marker the Green, If fans actually like Marker for being goofy and having a good arc with DPA, I disagree but I can get over that, but not when the writers decide to make Marker Green so he can get extra votes, not gonna say Marker deserves to go, I just want Marker out is all, but it just makes me angry because that's like saying I'm going to change my channel pfp and I get a billion extra subscribers, I understand there are people who like Marker and I can see the reasons behind it, but if someone comes up to me and says they like Marker because he turned from Purple to Green, opinion respected but I'm not buying that sh!t, and before you ask how I know all this, I've seen Marker perform so well in other people's polls lately, and I see people saying "Save Marker the Green" or "Vote Marker the Green" that makes it clear to me that Marker is getting more fans for being Green, I'm done with Marker for now so I hope I'm clear about all that. As for the Disparity between characters, I agree with everything you said about Fanny, and I'm happy it was proven not all rookies with underdevelopment will be the ones to get cooked next time their team loses, but that is still the case with so many characters like Cake as an example, Fanny is just lucky the writers noticed that Fanny was not doing well in characterization the first few episodes of TPOT, now I know Cake was not in the bottom 2 several times unlike Fanny, but that's because DPA lost 3 times in a span of 6 episodes, writers were not concerned about Cake and he was overshadowed, maybe if Cake got the bottom 2 in TPOT 5 instead of Book, writers may have paid more attention on Cake, and that's kind of a trend with TPOT at the moment, characters end up in the bottom 2, they survive, and then they get the most screentime same episode or next few episodes, that has happened to Fanny, Book, Robot Flower, Golf Ball, Needle etc. But I disagree with your point about Basketball, Basketball had a great arc with Robot Flower across TPOT 7-13 and when the arc concluded in TPOT 13, the following episode, Basketball & even Robot Flower didn't get jacksh!t, they were just completely forgotten, I know you may argue both Basketball and Robot Flower's characters are completed, but Basketball could have still been a really interesting character, what I mean is Basketball could spill the beans to all the contestants, even the host about her incident with one, that would of made for a really important scene and a great character boom for Basketball as she might have become the most important character in TPOT, Basketball seriously had so much potential, I'm sorry but I can't get over TV surviving over Basketball, please convince me why TV is a good character, I do not get the love for TV I really don't, but as for Basketball, I can see why you compared her arc to Winner & Black Hole's, but in my opinion, Basketball had the best arc with Robot Flower after TPOT 7. Maybe it was a stretch when I said Balloony could've won because I agree that Balloony was just OK, but there still could have been so much done with Balloony's character, Balloony's first boot in BFB post-split was a plain set up, but when comparing Balloony to Pie (the 2 first VTS boots) at least I can say Pie is just unlucky, Because Pie was just your Typical Average contestant with not a lot of fans, but even if TPOT was a VTE Pie would've still probably have been the first boot of TPOT, and you could put Pie in any team of TPOT and she would still probably be the first boot of the team, Pie is not popular, and Pie would probably be targeted as she does not stand out compared to other TPOT contestants, Pie did have potential for character development, maybe if Pie was on a team who did not lose for 13 episodes straight like bleh from BFB, Pie could have gotten her character development, and this could also be applied to Foldy aswell. Nowadays I'm not the biggest fan of mean characters being the first boot (I used like mean character first boots tho) I'll elaborate if asked, as for characters who threw away the challenge I can somewhat agree (maybe not as first boots but rather if they threw the challenge mid-season) Clock is a good example of this, Clock was really bad in TPOT 3, not just for throwing away the challenge, but he just had a stupid absession over Winner, that gave Clock the opportunity to have a redemption arc and well... he got it, at least he was eventually punished by being eliminated in TPOT 7, so the writers did a great job concluding the Clock and Winner arc and Clock's character felt completed, but I think having the arc start at the first episode would be too soon of a climax, there needs to be build up, so Clock's elimination was executed well, compared to Puffball where her elimination seemed out of nowhere and did not fit in with the story at all. I can say that VTE is at least better than VTS, although VTE has issues, if TPOT were to switch to VTE then characters still competing in TPOT like Pillow are cooked, as half the community hates Pillow, while at the same time half the community loves Pillow (As a side note, I'd be interested to see anybody who is neutral with Pillow) but in terms on being on the team CloudYay this could also bite Pencil and Golf Ball for that matter, also Yellow Face but I think VTS is still a problem for him so does not really bite him all that much, but if Pillow makes it to the merge after somehow surviving eliminations against all the characters I previously mentioned, Pillow could face against any other character and how do I put this? Oh yeah... she's gone faster than Golf Ball gaining 1 new fan every second, and this is also the opportunity for writers to set up eliminations, like make one character mean or make one character lose the challenge for their team, if writers want to set up eliminations so bad, then they might aswell switch to contestant vote, the only thing I would be thankful for TPOT switching to contestant vote is that Grassy, TV & Marker are more likely to get out, but you know what? I'd rather TPOT switch to VTE than stay as a VTS because at least characters have reasons for getting out, unless fans want to vote characters for no reason like Liy in BFB 5, sure VTE can be unpredictable if everyone on the team has an equal hatebase, but it will bite certain characters I won't mention again as I already talked about them. Now I've heard a lot of people mention this after I uploaded this video that BFDI is known for Viewer Voting and getting rid of it will alienate viewers, so here is my solution: Switch to Contestant Vote, but have viewers vote for 2 contestants UFE, one they like and one they dislike, Likes would give a contestant one vote, and Dislikes subtracts one vote, whoever has the most votes is immune, now I think that is balanced, take Golf Ball as an example, Golf Ball has way too many fans (I really mean it) but lots of people don't like Golf Ball, so Golf Ball may recieve the most likes, but the amount of dislikes she receives could cost her winning immunity, now sure, it may be favored towards characters who are popular and don't have a lot of haters like Tennis Ball & Pen, so if that does not work out, every single contestant should have a limit on how often they are allowed to win immunity, so the limit is 3, if Tennis Ball decides to pull of a Yin-Yang from III, at least immunities won't be as predictable because contestants can only win immunity up to 3 times, and I would keep those 3 lives so that I don't become a target, and I could win immunity at a key crucial part of the game, instead of just winning immunity the first 3 times I'm put UFE, kinda took some inspiration to come up with this solution, but I thought of the immunity limit. As a Rocky fan myself, of course if it would be that funny to pass up the immunity, that's clearly the writer's choice, so if it is funny, it can still be done in contestant vote but only at the Endgame, now as for the finale, if Viewer vote is still needed, I would let the viewers vote for one contestant to win the advantage for the final challenge (Ik it's basically the same as voting someone to win) But considering Rocky has fans, he could still potentially win the vote, and because Jacknjellify likes listening to viewers (AnimationEpic not really but that's ok) Rocky could have still won despite the show being a contestant vote, but sadly very unlikely to happen as Rocky has to Rejoin, maybe Jacknjellify could do a Rejoin challenge and make Rocky win, and before you say anything, Rejoin and the elimination would happen same episode so viewers would still vote for someone to stay if VTS continues that is which I hope is not the case, wouldn't hurt for viewers not voting for something for once as the Rejoin for TPOT is too predictable, even I'm one of those people who wants Remote to Rejoin. (Bare with me, I'm adding another comment because YT won't let me upload everything in one reply)

[@rtmkr1523]

Reason I compared this to II is because II2 started as a Viewer Vote and, plot twist... it switched to contestant vote, this would be the same pattern if TPOT does decide to go down the path of switching to contestant vote, and II works really well with contestant so I thought mentioning it was relevant, now I know BFDI and II have different writing styles and they plan their stories differently, but Inanimate Insanity's is better imo, and last thing from me, I'm not saying TPOT should switch contestant vote because it is best suited for them, I made this video because this is what I feel TPOT needs the most at the moment, right now the eliminations are the biggest problem in TPOT, and I feel like something has to be done about it, so thanks for sharing your opinion, but overall, TPOT needs this the most, not saying this because I want viewers to be alienated, I'm saying this because every show needs to fix something because not every show is perfect, and so, this is what TPOT needs to fix

[@white_tiger2669]

​@rtmkr1523 -i feel like your points against marker aren't really...problems?? people ARE allowed to have their own opinions on characters, including liking them because of a nonsensical joke. i'd argue this would even fall into the camp of 'disliking character for doing things', as marker WOULD be the kind of character to have something like this randomly happen to them. people liking marker has no direct affect on the character or the things he does. i've always seen disliking a character not for their actions, but because they have fans is really stupid. like oh no, we didn't get our perfect elimination order, what a shame. now we have to be surprised that we can't predict the winner from episode 1 -just not just suffered from a general writing issue overall. literally EVERYONE on the team had bottomed two except for price tag, and they never recieved individual attention to their characters until TPOT 10, sans pillow. and guess the only members of the team who survived? it's the characters who were actually developed. no amount of contestant voting or vote to eliminate would change the writers just didn't wanna write them for 9 episodes -you're misinterpreting my point about basketball. what i'm saying is that basketball's CHARACTER arc didn't show anything new from basketball's character after TPOT 7. in that episode, we learn robot flower doesn't like herself and basketball wants to help robot flower, even if it goes wrong. and then from TPOT 8 all the way to TPOT 13, it's just robot flower does violence and basketball yells at her. and in the end? the issues brought up at the beginning are barely brought up and hardly resolved. tell me, what does robot flower learn in the end? that basketball wants to help her and is her friend? you know, the exact same things we know at the beginning? and the issues she had were entirely glossed over by "basketball i'm glad you were there for me when i was evil :)". why wasn't that enough at the beginning of the arc? it's not like robot flower had any time to reflect; it's heavily implied she didn't know anything after turning evil. and it's not like they HAD to write the arc in a way were neither character were able to develop. we could see evil robot flower ALSO struggle with self-identity, or better yet, just fix her earlier and have her realize she's still not happy?? there's so many ways this could've shown a deeper side to robot flower and basketball, but all we got was all style no substance. compare this to black hole, where during his arc we get to learn exactly WHY the pact is so important to him in the span of FOUR episodes. basketball's arc took SIX episodes (not count 11) and we don't learn a single new thing about RF or basketball. and notice a common link between everything you said basketball had potential for--they're both not unique to her and not unique to her character. she doesn't have any dynamics outside of robot flower besides a mostly neglected negative relationship with TV, so what would her telling the others about one change about her character? obviously they don't like one because she's manipulative, but what PERSONAL reason does basketball have to chase one? fanny stands for justice, and ice cube is a very vengeful person. on those characters, they're a much better fit for the one arc on account of having...actual character and flaws? basketball's character is that she's a moral person who likes her friends. while TECHNICALLY serviceable, she would not be able to carry the one arc as well as fanny and ice cube, who both have strong personalities that could influence the plot uniquely (fanny goes out of her way for what she believes is right, ice cube has unresolved issues regarding the alliance). basically, what would make her exposing one different from if donut or tennis ball or anybody who is just "reasonable guy" exposed one. i'll tell you, it wouldn't be half as interesting as if someone who was a mess exposed one (like half of cloudYAY) -i like TV because he's entirely unique in the cast for the way he can tell jokes. while TV definitely has some room for character growth, unlike repetitive messes like basketball and puffball, he doesn't take up an obnoxious screentime from his fellow teammates. while he's never the star of a scene, he always make them more enjoyable to watch and i don't understand why people think that's some kind of unacceptable reason for liking a character. crowdthink am i right -pie could've developed just by giving her more interactions. it could happen in a single episode, just like how TPOT 9 made pin like an actual character for like the first time in the season by focusing in on the traits unique to her (like her attachment to coiny). it just so happened that pie just didn't get the attention she needed. this isn't a flaw, this is just how things work when people have to be eliminated -i do agree on clock's arc being good and there needing to be buildup...but i heavily disagree with like everything you said regarding it. for starters; it's not a redemption arc. his obsession with winner is not a 'flaw in the writing', but like a character flaw. while it's not a straight or expected progression from how he was in BFB 15, it made sense for his character as someone who heavily idolized loser but had been forgotten about. and wanting characters to be eliminated for "throwing" challenges is just dumb. if you don't let character actions have consequences, you either have to resort to characters who don't do wrong (BORING) or characters who get bailed out by dumb luck. the S SHOULD'VE lost in TPOT 3 because of clock. that doesn't mean he should be first out though. them losing would motivate clock to at least start changing, which could've slowly moved the arc into full gear. unfortunately because it was tpot 3-6 writing it didn't go anywhere until TPOT 7 but what can you do -puffball deserved to go even sooner tbh. her story was CONCLUDED in tpot 6, and it sucked, just like the rest of the arc (for similar reasons to basketball; we don't learn anything new about puffball's character after the introductory episode). and afterwards all she did was basically make her and golf ball the same character. not to mention that she hogged up screentime from the rest of the team who REALLY needed it -VTE is not better than VTS. sure you can get the characters you hate out. then what? you still have 20-something contestants remaining assuming TPOT suddenly switches to VTE. all it does is encourage dogpiling onto one character for petty reasons like "they were mean" or "they threw the challenge" meaning the cast quickly dwindles down to characters who aren't allowed to have negative relationships outside for comedic reasons. sure you can say there's a more definite reason for characters getting out, but does that really matter when it'll ALWAYS come down to "they were mean" until final single-digits? -please do NOT encourage set-up eliminations. just plain bad writing. see previous comment's point on audience investment. -your suggestion would be the worst of both worlds. you get both the unpredictability of viewer voting while ensuring that the least offensive characters are always winning, while having the non-interactivity of contestant vote combined with not being able to fully plan out an elimination order (you know, the MAIN strength of contestant vote) -to conclude, i feel like the eliminations in TPOT so far have not been a problem. good even. most characters that people like are still in, while still having a few curveballs. it's far from being a problem so big that you have to uproot the entire show's identity to ''''''fix''''''''. most of the arguments seem to stem from having your favorites out and least favorites still in which...is at no fault of the showrunners really? there's a community of several thousands that ALSO have opinions on these characters, and this really feels more like suggesting control be taken away from the viewers because you aren't liking what other viewers like.

[@rtmkr1523]

​@white_tiger2669 Well, I can at least tolerate people who like Marker, though I strongly disagree that Marker is a good character, there are good random characters in the osc but Marker is just not one of them, you can tell me that Marker has a good arc with his team, I could at least see your point but I strongly disagree and you can tell me Marker being random is fitting to his character, basically what I just said. In my eyes, there is no doubt that Marker is such an overatted character, why do I hate him so much? He is really good at testing my patience in many TPOT episodes, his only good episode was TPOT 8 and that's it, Marker has had some really annoying scenes, some of the lines by Marker pushes me through the ceiling, and Marker is just a cringe, poorly written (say whatever you want but it won't change my mind) and weird character, and the reason why Marker is so popular is because he attracts a lot of kid voters, and I know TPOT is a show intended for kids, so that basically means Marker and Grassy will make it really far in the game, and to nobody's surprise, they have and that's just sad, but Grassy is just as bad, he consistently uses the annoying iconic line "I'm Grassy!" And it's so annoying, Grassy's only saving grace is his friendship with Snowball but that's the only good thing I can say about Grassy, who should have been the first eliminated on TSTOE back in TPOT 3, and the fact Grassy has been the first safe EVERYTIME he has been put ufe is scary, and it's not because of Grassy's arc and characterization, kids just find Grassy cute, now I know kids may have saved Rocky because he's cute, but it's different here and Rocky actually deserves the attention here, because he's a funny joke character, he is iconic to me, his "bleh" gag may get old after a while but that's what makes him a unique character, because it is such an interesting concept for a joke character, and Rocky is just a charming character and Rocky deserves so much better, and Rocky is a better executed character for being cute, NOT GRASSY. I can see your argument for Just Not, TPOT 10 was such a big episode for them (Specifically for Book & Price Tag) but the writers should have honestly gave Just Not more screentime in earlier episodes of Tpot honestly, but what can you do with TPOT 3-6 style writing. Now listen to what I have to say about Basketball, she was a masterpiece in TPOT and we actually learned more about that character in TPOT 1, Basketball went from a boring 8-Ball follower in BFB, to being a great team leader in tpot, and having a great character dynamic with lots of characters, not just with Robot Flower or Grassy, but also with Snowball, Bell & Eggy, and even had rivalry with ONE, and the entire scene with Basketball & ONE is ONE new thing we learned about Basketball, because we found out Basketball is interestingly willing to sacrifice herself to save her friends while signing a contract, even though she is probably going to suffer the consequences we will see in future tpot, so we have learned something about the BB & RF arc and we are probably going to learn more about Basketball in upcoming episodes and Basketball still has so much potential in TPOT, especially because of her rivalry with ONE which can escalate as BB is probably going to get captured by ONE again, and the BB & RF arc was really entertaining imo, and I can also agree we have learned a lot about RF's character which is interesting, but BB in particular is more interesting, BB clearly knows that she messed up RF after she attempted to change RF's personality, in other words, BB was the reason RF turned violent, that's why BB wanted to help RF even though she was evil, because BB wanted to desperately set things right, as BB clearly regrets making one simple mistake which just goes to show how much BB cares about RF and that's another thing we learned about BB & RF, back in BFB we only really saw them as regular freinds, in TPOT we got to learn more about their freindship and I really enjoyed it, and RF also learned in the end that she disliked (at least in her point of view) so she appreciates BB for being one of the few characters who appreciates her, and RF does not really understand why she is disliked because like you said, she could not see the time she was a mean character and thats why i think BB & RF's friendship was handled so well imo. (More replies coming)

[@rtmkr1523]

​@@white_tiger2669 I'm not convinced TV is a good character I do agree that TV should get more character development, maybe play a role as an intelligent mastermind of the team, maybe be an interesting character who can give statistics helpful for challenges a bit like GB, but TV just standing in the background being a waste of fin air and giving TV avsolutely no purpose to the show, and causing so many important characters getting eliminated, yeah... no. Pie did have some interactions with certain characters in TPOT 1, but I don't think that really matters development or not, Pie is so forgettable within the community, it's not the writer's fault whatsoever Pie got the first boot. As for the Clock arc, Clock's absession with Winner & Loser was one of the main reasons I didn't like Clock, he was just a boring Loser follower, then went on to be a Winner follower, that's what made Clock so underdeveloped, but then TPOT 3 happened, I hated Clock even more, thank god the writers actually used common sence whe writing TPOT 7 & 10, unlike TPOT 3-6 when Winner and Clock casually talked without referencing the performance drama like wtf? There was clearly no motivation for Clock to be better, but in my personal opinion, I think this is a redemption arc, Clock was bad before TPOT 7, but he does seem to be a character who favors his idles, and that character personality did take over in bfb, that's what mads him bland and forgettable, but baring in mind, Loser made so many characters bland and forgettable as many characters liked idolizing him, Clock, Cake & Eggy are the characters I think of who started of really bland in TPOT and had to recover in tpot, did they recover? Really depends who you ask but if you ask me, yes, that's also one of the major reasons Loser is my least favorite character in the BFDI franchise and one of the worst in the osc imo, but Clock was so much well written from tpot 7-10 I don't hate him as much now, already said this but his character now feels complete, I say this is a redemption arc because I did not like Clock at first, but with the help of his arc with Winner, I'm starting to grow on Clock a bit, me saying this is not a redemption arc is like saying Loser never existed in bfb, in other words, Clock was never bland or bad in BFB or in early episodes of TPOT but I guess that just depends on your opinion on Clock, but I do see your point, redemption arc started at tpot 7 but should've started at TPOT 3 As for Puffball, I must say, you have really interesting opinions but I STRONGLY disagree with absolutely everything you said about Puffball, I almost burst into tears after her incredibly unfair bullsh!t elimination, but let me just get this out of the way, Puffball's elimination in BFDIA was understandable, pretty sure it does not need an explanation here, but Puffball getting out early again in TPOT was f#cked, especially considering both of Puffball's eliminations were only 3 months apart, Puffball had her time in BFDIA and it didn't really needed to be expanded, so tpot was a great opportunity to see Puffball's interesting character dynamic, amazing rivalry with other teams, INCLUDING TPOT 8 WITH TEAR DROP BTW, and don't bother giving me the excuse we did not learn anything about Puffball after TPOT 6, she went from the punching bag of AYO to actually being valued tpby the leader GB for once, and it was such a sudden yet fun character arc plot twist that could've and should've been expanded upon, and TPOT 7 was one of the few episodes I actually liked Golf Ball (If you say any episode between TPOT 12-15 is Golf Ball's best episode, it's not because of GB, it's because of the writers btw, don't really want to elaborate too much as I'm gonna do a character analysis video on Golf Ball, it's not a character rant tho) and I can't even blame screentime, because Puffball got so much screentime deserved in tpot, and you are saying Puffball takes up too much screentime from the rest of the team, so please tell me how did Puffball still got the least save votes? It's because she just so happened to lost the vote war, I already briefly talked about vote wars in the video and thank God the issue is fixed but can I just say, it would have NEVER been an issue if VTS became a new voting method, and other characters on AYO who you stated really need screentime, they did in tpot 8 for god sake! TB & Pen started to bond, and where credit is due for Eraser, had a rivalry with Teardrop, but that was an early TPOT thing and not really a major TPOT 8 moment, and for Puffball to just finish her character because of 3 lousy votes (I still respect GB fans) is sad, I did not feel like PB's character ended, writers could have done so much more with PB, real smart move for the writers to allow VTS and let vote wars happen, and if not vote wars, just predictable eliminations Yes VTE has problems but they are nowhere near as bad as VTS, but I can see your point and that is honestly another issue with VTE, I'm not really a fan of mean characters always being targeted, it does sometimes work if executed well but not always, I can agree with reasoning, but VTE can be good for giving us the opportunity to get rid of bland overatted characters like TV or Grassy, with VTS it's impossible, in VTE anyone could get out depending on their actions on a certain episode, and it could be a generic or mean character, but this could come into the "characters throwing away the challenge" way of characters getting voted out, and this is not the way it should be handled, but anything for tpot to get rid of VTS ig Set-up eliminations are a problem in contestant votes and Viewer Voting, makes no difference, want to know what I mean, just take a look at Puffball from BFDIA, Balloony from BFB, & Flower from BFB, will probably also happen to Golf Ball in TPOT Look, if you don't like my suggestion that's fine, and if you don't think eliminations are a problem in tpot, I can handle it, I can't change your opinion after all, I get that everyone has their own opinion on characters, so if I wear to plan out the elimination order, you know what? Sure, I could make Golf Ball or Pen go into the final 3, because I can see they are popular characters, although they don't deserve to win, they at the very least deserve to go far, now let's say TPOT switches to contestant vote and eliminates the fan favorites like Golf Ball, Pen, Tennis Ball, Black Hole & Fanny straight away, now that's bad, I have nothing against the writers taking inspiration on how liked a certain character is by the community and having the elimination order effected because of that, so long as the community can at least tolerate the elimination order and they feel Jacknjellify takes notes from what the fans want, fans will probably think the elimination order would be so much better than the original crap elimination order if TPOT stays as a VTS, But in a good elimination order, it's probably a good idea to have the first Contestant Vote Boot be someone who is considered Average by the community, not loved but also not hated, a character who does not recieve a lot of attention from the community would be the good opportunity to eliminate them first as less viewers will probably care, if TPOT switches to contestant vote I'd rather not Jacknjellify just write the episodes and plan the elimination order however they want, that is contestant vote done wrong, the whole reason why TPOT should change to contestant vote is to have better executed eliminations, in other words fix TPOT's Biggest Problem, but Jacknjellify should consider that eliminations should not be random, writings should not be bad, and then we will have a better TPOT second half elimination order, of course you are probably going to disagree with me but we all have different mindsets, it's not like I'm going up to Michael or Cary and lecturing them on why they need to fix there shows the way I tell them because I'm just full of myself (although you could argue that I said in the video if one of the crew members are watching, "I would take notes" was just a plain request) I won't have a go at the creators of the show if they do not switch to contestant vote and I will especially not have a go at other people who have different options than I do, but having TPOT switch to contestant vote may not make everyone happy but it would make some people including myself happy, I'm just interested in sharing my thoughts to this community and interestingly, it has proven I ironically think differently to most people in the osc lmao, so yeah, I hope that clears up everything

[@BFAMSERIESOfficial]

Removing vote to save is a great idea but removing viewer voting is a horrible idea, i think what they should do is basically what III did in earlier episodes, contestant voting but the viewers can choose who should be immune from contestant voting, like each episode would have a google form of the teams that were UFE, and the viewers have to choose 2 contestants to be immune, and then in the next episode, it would reveal who's immune from contestant voting and then it would show the contestant voting, and it would go on until the final 3

[@rtmkr1523]

I understand where you are coming from, my problem with this idea is that characters like Golf Ball, Black Hole, Grassy & Tennis Ball would consistently win immunity as they are just too popular, Golf Ball would be the biggest one though, in this scenario I would see her become the Yin-Yang of TPOT contestant vote, and III proved that contestant vote shows with viewer voting don't always work, as you have one character who is just impossible to eliminate because viewers would always vote same character to be safe, and getting rid of viewer voting mid season was the right thing to do in my opinion

[@BFAMSERIESOfficial]

@rtmkr1523 well, what if Jacknjellify did something different, like, vote who should be immune AND who doesn't deserve to immune, so in that way, Jacknjellify can subtract the immune and not immune votes and whoever gets the highest amount of all of the subtracted votes gets to be immune, maybe this could somehow make grassy and other overrated characters not immune all of the time since there's probably more grassy haters than grassy likers, so, even if grassy gets a bunch of immune votes, he would definitely get a LOT of no immune votes from several people, same goes to TV and marker, not sure about tennis ball pen and golf ball though

[@rtmkr1523]

@@BFAMSERIESOfficial Maybe that could work, but characters like Tennis Ball & Pen barely have any haters, yet they have a lot of fans, so this could favour them a little bit, Golf Ball is more interesting because she way too many fans, yet she also receives a fair amount of hate, I guess it would just depend if the Golfball Hatebase can match Golfball's fanbase, but I'd say this idea is more balanced and other characters that are not as popular have at least a slim chance of winning immunity, but this is better than viewers just voting for someone they like, but maybe Jacknjellify can give each character a limit on how often they can win immunity in a contestant vote, I think that could work quite well

[@jhimycleyson8671]

Yk whats funny that Idea was used in inanimate insanity of the immunity one

[@CharlieSteak-b7w]

I agree, but another problem is that viewer voting is the main reason people enjoy BFDI. But I do really agree. Even if I do like TV and Grassy.

[@EpicJabubOSC]

Honestly, I'm not the biggest fan of Vote To Save, because it makes more shitty characters (like Grassy or TV) survive over underrated characters (Like Bell, Foldy) and fan favorites (Like Fries, Needle, and Eraser)

[@Ribbital]

HP voting and video voting work really well, I think tpot could potentially switch to that and it wouldn’t be a big shift. Also this could bring back prizes!

[@rtmkr1523]

Maybe it could work, but I'd prefer that than VTS honestly

[@Epic_Luigi]

FINALLY SOMEONE SAID 🥳

[@flyingburger3990]

I can see where you are coming from but Honestly viewer voting has been one of the identifying aspects bfdi for so long and suddenly changing to contestant vote would get rid of that aspect.

[@ScarlettJett34]

AIB and II switched from viewer voting to contestant vote, and they're one of my favorite shows. I don't get the appeal of viewer voting, because it always alienates a lot of viewers whose favorite character isn't popular in the fandom or even in the production crew. BFDI and other competition shows by nature are inherently character-driven. If the characters get poor treatment, it affects the show's quality as a whole. It's evident that TPOT is not benefiting from the voting format at all and instead, is being dragged down by it and should be switched.

[@FestiveIdroc]

Contestants vote on tpot is not a great idea, what if it ended like that one yin yang (ii) contestant vote, where one person in a team decides who to eliminate?

[@Oilk08]

For Pen, I think it's mainly due to bfb

[@rtmkr1523]

@@Oilk08 I don't buy it, but that's something I guess

[@Oilk08]

@rtmkr1523 alright

[@EmojiMarbles]

I think in my opinion TPOT should switch to a vote to eliminate the classic one so that way once Bagged loses:) I can vote Liy out:)

[@rtmkr1523]

@EmojiMarbles Disagreed with Liy, but opinion tolerated

[@EmojiMarbles]

@ good glad you understand unlike many other disparate Liy fans.

[@DefinitelyNotALivingMistake]

Didn't FusionAnimates switch back to viewer vote, due to him for some reason regretting the fact he changed it to contestant vote?

[@DefinitelyNotALivingMistake]

Btw, I honestly think Pen in BFDI was his best season, and should have been the one who won the season instead of Firey, who had pretty much done nothing but be somewhat nice or just be a complete asshole to most people, in the whole season

[@rtmkr1523]

For FusionAnimates, that's true, I guess that's the main reason I did not include Object Invasion on the Contestant Vote list despite the old show having contestant vote, as for Pen I respect your opinion, but nowadays I do think there are better BFDI winners than Firey

[@blueheracross]

Yes but i like viewer voting cuz the writing don't have control over the story and have to be creative

[@NumberOneMikeFan]

I agree. I was so mad TV survived twice over good characters

[@rtmkr1523]

Actually survived 4 times which is even god damn worse, and next time he will probably find a way to be safe, nothing can convince me TV is a good character, he does nothing, and people praise him because of it, that makes me chuckle

[@NumberOneMikeFan]

@ I agree with that. Like I don’t get it. There’s nothing to him. And ngl the fact he survived again over RF and Basketball made me so mad that TV might be my least fav BFDI or Object Show character in general now.

[@rtmkr1523]

@NumberOneMikeFan The worst part is a lot of my favs Puffball, Needle & Basketball have fallen victim to TV's votes, TV is a waste of a cast spot to me, and TV should have gotten out in TPOT 6 back when AYO first lost, and people still appreciate TV to this day, fuck TV honestly

[@NumberOneMikeFan]

@ agree. I was so mad when Puffball and Needle was out. Same with Basketball that’s what draw the line to me so yeah I agree with you.

[@rtmkr1523]

​@@NumberOneMikeFan Exactly, the fact TV could make the merge is scary

[@diaryofanasdkid9752]

I disagree but maybe Cary and Michael should rig it so that TV is eliminated Boom fair vote rigging

[@AwSeriouslyJr]

How would it be rigged? It would just have to be the teammates opinions, which yes. TV doesn’t do insanely much. Aside from scanning the past recently.

[@diaryofanasdkid9752]

@ Making TV unable to be voted for because he has too much fans

[@Pixelmations706]

You’re saying he should get eliminated because people like him??

[@diaryofanasdkid9752]

@ yes.

[@Pixelmations706]

@ that would be the most unfair scenario ever