Why We HATE the Cargo-8 Ridgehauler - Necromundown Ep. 9

[@DesignateVoid]

I’ve been diving into Necromunda channels and I like this one the best. The largest seems to be like 5k subscribers so this game is VERY niche (and very awesome!). Keep up the good work!

[@WoodImp]

I think there's a bigger community behind Necromunda than one would think, content creation is hard and its easier to get a channel off the ground if you cater for the wider 40k community. over 200k gangs on Yaktribe now, and a similar size reddit/youtube scene as Bolt Action, the Underhive is growing and I think the future is bright for us Gangers 😎

[@miniaturesrundown]

Thanks for watching, we appreciate it!

[@thecavalrygeneral3453]

As a non Necromunda player I'll happily take all your Cargo 8s for 'Guard conversions

[@tannergee]

I've found the at the ridgehauler makes a much better objective/scenario focus than a gang vehicle. At our table we've reserved ridgehaulers for rolling road scenarios. It's the most fun we've ever had with them. A) it's either hauler vshauler trying to get a shipment somewhere and preventing the other gangs shipment or B) 2 gangs are completing for loot defended by gang #3, the d3 or d6 x10 that the haulers trailers can provide can be stolen/looted by the other gangs. And this is by far the most fun and balanced we've ever had with it.

[@kalfoxx7749]

A really great breakdown, I have a great deal of respect for you guys I am quite envious that you are able to have such fun with the game! I need to get back into it (been playing since it first came out decades ago) and just be the arbitrator for our group. The game needs a firm hand now more so than ever.

[@Dubstyles84]

Just found this channel, good discussions. I have not played Ash Wastes, but it seems like a lot of the problems with it can be solved simply by making people build all vehicles with the custom rules and eliminating the repair cost upcharge for them. I repeat, no names vehicles, people can use their models but they need to use custom vehicle rules to approximate them. For vehicles with special rules, just make those into new upgrades anyone can get (like that claw thing on the squat rig). You could probably keep the trailers for the Cargo 8 as is if the rig was built as a heavy vehicle.

[@miniaturesrundown]

That's a pretty good idea - it feels like the custom vehicles and named vehicles are balanced on two separate planes of existence. I will say that, in our four campaigns with vehicles so far, no one has ever had to pay the repair costs for the customs - it just comes up so rarely. But it's good to plan ahead!

[@janklevaivancic4263]

Nice discussion, keep it up :D First a small correction: The Cargo-8 can't take the Extra armor body upgrade (+1T all around), 'only' the Reinforced armor (+1 Hull point), unless you house ruled to allow all upgrades from the Trading post, rather than just the upgrades on the vehicle list (normally only Custom vehicles can take upgrades that aren't on their starting lists), in which case it is your own fault :P That said, I agree with your general observations on the Cargo-8 compared to other vehicles and how it would homogenise the game-play of range-based gangs, but if you were to use some of the beefy melee focused gangs (in particular Goliath, Ogryn and Corpse grinders), actually trashing the Cargo-8 isn't really that uncommon. My best example would be Khorne corrupted Goliath Natborn Tyrant (Tyrant's own and Prime specimen for +2A and +1W), with Heavy rock cutter, Stimm slug stash or Full servo harness and Frenzon collar = 8A St10 Damage3 when charge-jumping on 2+ from their own vehicle with Boarding ramp: every hit will likely turn into a critical and since its melee, you get to roll 2 location dice and chose. Ogryns (S5 base, Heavy rock cutters, Servo harness and Stim slugs in their starting list) and Corpse grinders (Paired heavy chain cleavers or Heavy rock cutters in their starting list) can do almost the same from gang creation. For melee gangs I tend to go with custom Medium or Heavy vehicles with Transport beds+Boarding ramps, Rockgrinder rams and all available Speed/Handling upgrades, no guns, so crews spend all their actions moving towards the enemy vehicle to deliver the melee maniac on the back (this is literally 'Drive me closer, so I can hit them with my axe!'); if I can deliver one stimmed-up maniac to the Cargo-8, it will either get wrecked in one round of attacks or at least get stalled, crew knocked out and all weapons destroyed. In short, yes if you rely only on guns, the Cargo-8 is rather obnoxious to take out, but if you try some 'heavy' melee weapons it is not such a tough nut to crack :) Anyway, keep up the good work, happy festivities and new year; cheers! :)

[@miniaturesrundown]

That's a good point - our understanding was that any vehicle can take anything from the trading post, similar to a champion. I'll have to doublecheck the wording on that as +1 toughness is pretty big. As to how to kill the Ridgehauler,: shhhhh, don't spoil our next video TOO hard... :)

[@sterlingnorthum3911]

Experiment with reducing the toughness and increasing the number of hits that it can take, that way it doesn't get taken out quickly, but it makes it easier for more weapons to damage it more reliably.

[@brionl4741]

Basically, the problem is that it's way too cheap for all the stuff it has. But like you said, figuring out a "proper" cost is hard. If I was Arbitratorizing a campaign, I would probably start with the "can't buy with starting funds" option and see how that works. Your rental idea sounds good too though. I do have a Ridgehauler, and 2 trailers (one of each) but I haven't built them yet.

[@callsignkit6930]

If anything, I would look at a credit deduction table for the ridgehauler. Ammo checks on hard points, times fighters used the fuel / ammo ability to avoid weapon checks, the number of times the promethium tanks were struck, make it something that can start to throw players into the red if the players decide to only use their ridgehauler to deal and take damage. If the player falls too far into debt you can subject the player to the greatest horror known to man... a tax collector.

[@OtleySurvivalServices]

you have to remember this vehicle was designed to face nomads who will trash vehicle's with ease. all their weapons have shock which auto wounds on a 6. those rapid fire weapons with shock are lethal. also don't forget the ridge hauler comes out of the ash waste allowance of 400 creds which can only be used on vehicle's or mounted equipment.

[@Fukainami17]

@miniaturesrundown Compliments for the great channel! I'm converting from kill team to necromunda as 1) i used to play Mordheim and i miss it... 2) My local group is more narrative than competitive 3) I have tons of terrain from Kill Team Question 1: Do you have a "What to buy " updated video? Since my group likes Esher, Delaque, Orlock and Nomads shall we buy the two starter boxes? Or shall we buy the books separately as those boxes would not have all the rules to play? Queestion 2: For Vehicles why not simply re-cost the official ones using the vehicle building costs? Then the offical models will be limited to their official mods list and have normal repair costs and the jury-rigged ones will have the flexibility but the extra costs to fix... did you check it out? Or too much math? Thank you for the great work! 🙂

[@EmperorsTeeth]

I own two and an Ironcrawler. The Haulers were bought with a fun scenario in mind, but I have run the Ironcrawler in a skirmish battle against Nomads. It ultimately took a rocket and failed a handling check, swerving into a pipe and flipping over... oopsy.

[@AndrBR0]

Grav Weaponry is good against Vehicles with ton of toughness. As rules in new core book are written, your opponent needs to roll higher than toughness of their vehicle(6 always successful) or suffer wound with no armour save allowed, also every grav weapon comes with Concussion trait. Personally, i hone rule that Ridgehauler can be operated by everyone(since in stories from the supplements , they've been operated by gangers and not Guild of coin haulers), reduced movement and toughness by 1, and handling check of 8+, which becomes worse by 1 for each added trailer

[@miniaturesrundown]

Making handling checks worse with additional trailers makes a ton of sense, I really like that! Ask any semi driver if multiple trailers don't make things harder to control...

[@Smithy556]

@@miniaturesrundown my group actually uses the Ash Rig profiile from the Ash Wastes rulebook and give 1HP and -1 handling for each trailer. It's been quite okay but they are still not that fun to play with and play against.

[@DonaldRandall-nv2du]

Ey, you got moxie kid

[@WoodImp]

And now in the new Apocrypha book Delaque can put webguns on them which force handling tests 😅

[@miniaturesrundown]

I think webguns say they don't affect vehicles - or did that change with the new book?

[@WoodImp]

@@miniaturesrundown tactic card in the new book makes them force a handling test 😬

[@squeethemog213]

I'm about to start playing Necromunda and this show has been a great help. Thou the hauler is cool I don't think I'll buy one for our games xD

[@akodotain]

Try giving it a 12" min range "due to difficult gun depression" as a starting point and tweak the numbers as you test it out. I think the balance point is where the vehicle is fun to field, but requires screening from lighter vehicles and mounted gangers.

[@miniaturesrundown]

Gun depression is actually a pretty cool idea - no way would those turrets be able to shoot a ganger right next to it!

[@drewbakka5265]

if its that good it should be "everyone gets one free or no one gets one" Problem solved.

[@madcapmiguel5071]

My suggestion would be to adjust the cost to 405 credits

[@samholmes5552]

It sounds like a whole bunch of cope