Why you don't have FREE WILL (and that's okay) | Sam Harris

[@themacocko6311]

I am a precious angel

[@coreybennettboardman]

lol 👼

[@raymondblaisdell4005]

"A man can do as he wills, but not will as he wills." - Arthur Schopenhauer

[@coreybennettboardman]

Awesome! I just got chills. Thank you Raymond. 🙌 It's great to come back to this quote after doing this video. 🌌

[@stevenk11]

I've been coming back to determinism again and again since being exposed to Sam's hypothesis. Considering my own past and seeing more clearly how my "choices" are so very much determined by things that I do not have control over. Whether that be upbringing, environment, experience. Even down to my genetics and brain chemistry. Where is the control? I feel an immense humility and compassion towards myself and others when I think about determinism but also I often feel frustration and despair at the injustice of it all. The brutal unfairness. It's all so arbitrary! If I can't take credit for my own merits and also can't take on blame or shame for my shortcomings, what exactly am I? I'm finding it difficult to reconcile the truth I feel regarding determinism and the practical experience I have of living in the world (trying to explain a perspective that free will doesn't exist isn't exactly a popular move 😅). With all of the variables I find it difficult to act or influence people one way or the other with any confidence or conviction because what the hell do I know? How do we even judge what positive or negative are when that's all subjective? I'm not even necessarily in control!! 😮‍💨 I heard recently that sincerety is as close as we can get to true virtue and I'm still thinking that through. I will say though that the kernals you are sharing here may be what others are exposed to that allow them to find themselves snowballing down a different path and that's pretty wild. Cudos for speaking about this topic. Really resonated with me.

[@coreybennettboardman]

Thank you Steven! Your thoughtful comment means the world to me. Even if it was determined. 😉 ( I really don't know either way, haha, how could I?!) Definitely not a popular move to discuss this lol, but I'm so glad to have internet conversations with people like you, who are seeking, and trying, and EXPLORING with humility. I like that idea of sincerity overlapping virtue (goodness). I will think about that more too. Something that has helped me with this is the idea of nondualism. Especially in the way that Richard Rohr discusses it. I very much appreciate his contemplations. I'm constantly splitting, or coming back to black and white, because that's what my monkey brain seems to do to shortcut to the best chance of survival. But I wonder if trying to come back to a nondualistic space brings everything together, where an unexplained quantum universal oneness encompasses our separate monkey body experience. Perhaps we are living a version of life where we both choose and fated at the same time?

[@thetruthmindset]

Man, this path to awakening is hard. Its painful man haha but theres no going back.

[@coreybennettboardman]

Haha, yaaaa. Cat's outta the bag!

[@ObaiDotMe]

So we don't choose what choices we've presented .. but we can only choose from these predetermined choices? Comparing us with AI in that way is really interesting! But in that case, won't we have more choices to choose from the more we enlighten ourselves? I loved the song by the way .. and laughed hard at the precious advice at the end "Don't stab your brother" 😂

[@coreybennettboardman]

Hi Obai! Let me preface by saying, I don't know! This is just one way to think about this stuff. At this point, any of this theory is built on smoke, because we can't define what our experience of life is. But yes, with this idea, we can't choose the choices that are presented to us, but we can choose from them. But I do wonder if our present choices, then change the choices that are later presented to us? But this feels like an endless logic problem. Because to be able to make different choices now, you would probably need a different past to set you up for the now? This feels like the "regress to darkness" that Sam is trying to speak to. But again, I don't know. Interesting to bring up enlightenment! I wonder if that's why enlightenment, or awareness, or peace, or heaven, all the different semantics for it are so powerful for different mystics throughout history? Perhaps they see through choice, they are the choice, and they choose? I don't know what that means, it just came out of me typing lol. Thank you for the comment on the song. It means a lot to me, because I'm trying to experiment with different things now. We keep going friend!! 🙌

[@callumrylance]

“I’m still a puppet, a puppet for Jesus” 😂😂 Great video bro 😎

[@coreybennettboardman]

Lol. That Midjourney prompt was "Jesus in the style of NYSNC as puppets" 🙃 Thank you Callum! 🙌

[@themacocko6311]

Ok so, I have been aware of this argument for a number of years now and there are some issues. 1. The main argument basically states that we will take specific actions do to the programing we have exposed to. This programing is a PROBABILITY and NOT a certainty. (For simplicity) If you are offered the choice or the opportunity arose the eat a jelly sandwich or rock, the probability would be the sandwich but the opportunity to eat the rock is 100% available. 2. Having a limited bank of choices is not related to free will, it's a direct result of past choices (that were probabilities) 3. Yes, the body knows knows a movement or choice before we realize it but for the vast majority all choices, once we ARE aware, that choice is reversible. NOTHING stops us from doing complete 180 and doing the exact opposite. The opportunity exists and is 100% there. The PROBABILITY is that we won't. The free will, is there. 4. When you strip away all the shinny new lingo, this is the even much older debate of nature vs nurture. Personally, I think this whole theory came about as a way to make some cash. It twists concepts and distorts them to make them fit.

[@coreybennettboardman]

Thank you for your amazing support and this thoughtful comment. I could be wrong. I see and define the main argument a bit differently. And forgive me if semantics gets in the way. I wonder if the big difference is between Choice and Free Will. With Choice existing within the larger structure of the question of Free Will. To me, it seems that Sam is arguing that there CAN be choice/agency, but the actual choices to execute agency with, are limited, and always regress to a darkness that we don't know and therefore don't have complete conscious control (a free will) over. With this, it would seem that a limited bank of choices is the manifestation of a lack of free will (but we can still choose within that)? I agree, we can make 180s and changes, and it seems that that is more about choice, which we do seem to execute, than free will as a whole? Even the Stoics speak to us being like a dog tied to a cart (fate). The cart is going where it's going, and we can either pull and yelp and bite, or trot along side and smile. Yes, it does seem to overlap with nature vs nuture. Great connection! I wonder with like all of this stuff, because there is no concrete answer, it's silly to try and "know" anyway. Because then we're just missing out on the BEING. Speaking of, I'm gonna go eat some Chipotle... 🙃

[@themacocko6311]

​​​@@coreybennettboardmanBefore I respond to this (I have a few things), in 1 or 2 sentences tell the basic definition/your understanding of free will. The only way to have free will is if we have access to every opportunity in existence?? I'm a little fuzzy on "the darkness" of what you're saying (I can be slow) I also wanted to add this (just sharing). There is a number of great stuff in stoic philosophy but there's some not so great stuff too. According to the Stoic's we should suppress our feelings and not be free to show many of them to the public. Be the strong rock, be unmovable like stone against the crashing of the waves. However, water is the universal solvent. The Taoist philosophy is the opposite and speaks of yielding, going with the flow, being flexible and resistant. The big rocky cliff of Niagara Falls is several miles from where it used to be. The gentle waters did that.

[@coreybennettboardman]

​@@themacocko6311 "The big rocky cliff of Niagara Falls is several miles from where it used to be. The gentle waters did that." LOVE THAT!! Great writing, friend. "Be like water." is awesome. Just awesome. I like "Be like nature." perhaps even better. Although it's really the same haha. The Tao Te Ching has such wonderful writing encompassing this. I agree that the great philosophies and religions of the world tend to have dirty parts, especially the longer they've been around. It seems the more words that get added, the more they get lost in semantics and ego and false impressions. ---- I mean darkness as a space of unknown or unseen. A place that we don't know and can't define. Also, I'm not saying that I am certain that a lack of Free Will exists. I don't know anything. You may be annoyed by my response to trying to define Free Will. I think what we're trying to say is whether or not one, living this experience, could change their future by their independent choice? But are we talking about the choice for the next five minutes, or our overall destiny? What if there's multiple timelines? We can't even define what we are as agents experiencing this experience, so any answers we concoct are merely guesses anyway. (for now 😉)

[@themacocko6311]

@@coreybennettboardman Yeah, I don't think for a second that know the answer either, but I am pointing out what seems to me like holes in the theory (to my understanding) after having some study in it. Thanks for the compliments! I guess the biggest take away is, does it really matter if we have free will or not? Maybe the illusion of free will is all we really need.

[@coreybennettboardman]

@@themacocko6311 It seems like the illusion (if it even is that) is the default anyway haha. We can't help but get caught up in the monkey life over and over. Glad we can discuss friend! 💛

[@themacocko6311]

I thought you had slipped into another dimension.

[@coreybennettboardman]

Who says I haven't... lol

[@lonelyoldfathomelessbum]

i hope i dont have free will so It is not my fault I am the size of ohio . lol :)

[@coreybennettboardman]

Thank you again for another watch and comment. I don't know what to say to this friend! I'm all about humor and I know all about taking the piss out of myself, and at the same time for the same reason, I don't want to pile jokes onto you. I wish you peace, really and truly.

[@themacocko6311]

Here's some tough love. It may or may not be your FAULT, but it IS your responsibility. "Fault" is completely irrelevant. The responsibility to do something about it or not is relevant. Don't use this "free will" debate as an excuse to not deal with this issue. Which is extremely probable that you can (short of some severe thyroid/health condition) do something about.