Will human civilization destroy itself? | Dan Carlin and Lex Fridman

[@RustinChole]

Dan is so great at backing up every assertion with some relevant historical precedent.

[@repetemyname842]

Jesus, thank you Dan, someone finally brings up the simple aspect of trash. It saddens me to see the changes in America in the past 50 years, used to be it was just the big cities that had trash blowing around or laying around. Now the city of 65K that I live in has plenty of trash in its streets. People worried about climate change go have a rally then leave hundreds of pounds of trash- you cannot make this shit up.

[@NoticerOfficial]

Those closer you get to the Mexico border the more trash that appears on the sides of the roads. The culture in the region openly throws trash out their vehicle windows

[@perillivolcomha]

Check out India and China

[@dumbcat]

trash handling was much worse 40 years ago. people threw trash out their car windows. that was like an accepted thing. or left trash from picnics in the park and it blew all over the place. totally normal back then. there just weren't as many people

[@gtasaints]

@@perillivolcomha where do you think we ship our trash 😉

[@firingallcylinders2949]

I actually never understood that. I can honestly say I have never once in my life had a bag or item in my hand of trash and considered throwing it on the ground. I'll carry my trash until I find a can or bin. I do not understand the people who just throw trash all over.

[@mikaylam.5957]

Lex always asks the questions I want Joe Rogan to ask.

[@steratorefriends6596]

Lex also talks much more slowly and really allows himself the space to get into deeper ideas/questions.. I don't get the vibe from Lex that he likes to hear himself talk.. which is more than I can say for most folks who have their own podcast.. refreshing to say the least

[@tobiaskao1]

We need alex Jones and lex lol that would be epic

[@aliqatishat3790]

@@tobiaskao1 😂😂 that would be something else

[@neftaliveliz9024]

Lex is plenty smarter than Joe so yeah

[@chrisdieudonne5674]

They are different people. Joe is more relatable to the layman.

[@szebike]

The problem about "good" and "evil" and being "kind" is that even a person like Hitler was probably pretty convinced he is doing the "right" thing and is doing "good" and he was actually kind to some people like his mother when she got cancer. Once you realize that its pretty hard to say kindness will always emerge victirious because one mans kindness can mean your demise or vice versa and even if you want to do "good" in our todays standarts be aware that "the road to hell is paved with good intentions". I think the current lockdown situations fit into that pretty well sure it could lead to some vulnerable people surviving for a few more years but many people get into deep debts/loose their lifework without their fault that could lead to worldwide giant turmoil and people voting for "evil" people with the seemingly right answers that kills way more of those vulnerable persons than a virus ever could.

[@pedrogudino1133]

Dummy

[@eljefe8149]

Economic collapse, people starving, war for resources. The strong taking from the weak. That's how I see this going down.

[@dannyhernandez631]

So business as usual for the human species

[@flatcircle4456]

This is the inevitability. People like to think that we're more civilized than our progenitors, but we're still the same beastly humans that committed all the atrocities throughout history. The only difference being is that we live in a time of plentiful resources and high technology where even our poor live better than most humans ever have. Just look at this election. People are using it as a thinly veiled means of expressing the darker parts of their nature under the guise of righteousness and patriotism. Soon we will wake from the dream of 20th century, and mankind will take its true shape.

[@eljefe8149]

We'll basically go back to the dark ages or something slightly better.

[@marcdellorusso180]

@@Dlahusen1 Evolution doesn't normally select destructive behaviour.

[@TheRealDebussyFarts]

Sounds like you described the 19th and 20th centuries.

[@victoriancu7358]

We were doomed the second we became self aware.

[@erikdvm8029]

We were doomed when i farted.

[@JRettMTX]

You were doomed the second you were squeezed into this reality. Everything dies.

[@lavigner328]

remember you have money in the mix that's a big issue

[@EdelhartIndustries]

The self interest topic really nails this discussion. Smart guy

[@ajsharma8869]

I think Lex is wrong about the human evolution part, we evolved to work well in groups of TRIBES, a very small level compared to the whole species. To see that point, I think u simply have to look to the inevitable collapse of all large civilizations. Roman Empire, China, Mongolian Empire, Byzantine, all of them.

[@mikewiz1054]

The important point of this interview is to understand that not studying and understanding history is 90% of our problem as a species. We have no politicians that are scientists or historians. We have evidence of why thousands of civilizations went extinct…yet we continue to make the exact same mistakes. Power, greed, corruption and failure to work cooperatively. It’s all right there in the history books but we somehow think we are different because we are just smarter than our ancestors. I mean, conservatives are still using trickle down economics despite the fact that it has bankrupted every state that has enacted it and destroyed the national economy in the 1980’s. We would rather believe a politician than actually look at history and conclude this is a terrible economic policy that has never worked.

[@daffidavit]

I was ten years old during the Cuban Missile Crisis. We lived in the suburbs of NYC about 20 miles west in N.J. I remember my ten year old brain telling me while looking east toward the great city that as soon as I see the flash of light, I'll grab my parents and my five year old little brother and bring them into the basement where we could all duck and cover. Little did I know what a 5MT nuclear hydrogen warhead could do. According to the book, Command and Control, the Soviet general in charge in Cuba was given sole discretion to launch an attack on the U.S. if he reasonably believed that Moscow was destroyed. You all have no idea how close we came to complete nuclear inhalation in October of 1962.

[@Hapistudios]

The world would go on without america .... You have to if america dies the world and life will go on

[@austinridley7605]

@@Hapistudios if America is nuked by Russia or China and we nuke each other then the world would most likely die of radiation poisoning so no their is no life after that just a dead world with simple life forms barley able to live we’d look like Mars but with small oceans.

[@Hapistudios]

@@austinridley7605 some countries will die of radiation poisoning but come wont and think about it britain a country smaller then newzealand took over half the world in roughly 200 to 300 years so the world goes on and the land will recover

[@sammysam2615]

Dan: "We're gonna have a whole dead planet in 3 generations if we don't start working it out now" Average person today: "Ah fuck em"

[@native82]

That's bullshit anyway. Not going to happen. That's just another Al Gore, Aoc comment. Idiots in the 70s also predicted an ice age by 1990. Somehow he got duped into their fear mongering. Yeah there's a trash problem. Not denying that. But to say in 3 generations that we're gone because of climate change is absolutely ridiculous.

[@jacobdavis1768]

Dan is amazing, can't get enough of him! Lex, keep up the good work and loving heart/kind heart!

[@steenrasmussen5280]

On the table in this video: A soft drink can and two plastic bottles of water! Guys, it starts there!! Think big, but act small.

[@chachimcflex]

There will be the occasional person that comes along and inspires the masses with a message of "love," but the only thing you can really count on is people responding to incentives and their own self interests. Everything else is pie in the sky.

[@chrisgadsby5700]

When the big catastrophe is recognised / imminent and that could just be enough food, the spiralling chaos at scale means the basic survival instinct takes over everywhere. The ruthless competition will dominate at both the individual and collective (groups and national) level. Sorry to be so cheerful

[@AkkarisFox]

if we had it in our self interest to understand others more I think we would have a better chance at thinking collectively.

[@ManicMindTrick]

A lot of people reject collectivism completely

[@carpo719]

We shall surely try. ... we can do it people!

[@affenjunge6287]

Yes thank you!

[@JayJay-ii5un]

Nope

[@jacoblesperance2115]

I'm glad Rogan told you to do a podcast Quickly has become my fav

[@josephbertrand5558]

Tremendous effort

[@billyhughes9776]

"It is in your nature to destroy yourselves." - Uncle Bob

[@Menaceblue3]

Uncle Bob? You the guy that tagged along with Sarah and John Connor in the Mexican desert?

[@Juice_boxtv]

i wonder if i was as naive and optimistic as lex i would be happy. this faith in a "leader" is frightening to me

[@oscargutierrez7117]

You’re so right

[@christopherbarber5283]

Lex sounds strangely naive in this clip. Have more history guys on, my guy. Morality is wayyyyy more complex at such a large scale

[@MichaelJonn]

this clip? you clearly have not been paying attention to his others. this guy is naivety personified. people like him are usually in the 1st wave of victims in a revolution.

[@Hapistudios]

He's young he gets to be naive I'm just glad he has the ability to ask questions and willing to think about the answers in a respectful and considerate manner most people are happy to discuss things untill they become hostile to a view they refuse to consider

[@trevorsimpson7660]

History covers it self up pretty quickly, especially since there is no hard evidence of anything over about 5000 years ago, the way of life for human-like creatures before the Sumerians I believe will never be known. We have a few hundred thousand dinosaur bones, human bones and artifacts with pictures / language carved into them. No disrespect, I love stories on history but I don't believe we will never know enough facts to make history a relevant topic. Would be sweet to see a couple podcasts hosted by Lex on the topic though because he is great to watch.

[@bjrmagic1]

Respect and admire him, but he is naive beyond belief...give him a few years.

[@ManicMindTrick]

I dont think a few years will matter. This goes too deep. You cant change how you are that easily. Its a personaly trait.

[@whodoyouthinkiam8675]

I like your guys thoughts. Very insightful.

[@sethmiletich]

Lex seems to be talking about Zeitgeist, a leader embodies a destructive trend in our collective consciousness and it gives a outlet for that destructiveness

[@timothymusson5040]

Ok Lex. We can all name multiple evil leaders in history. Name me a single wonderful leader that had half the impact of any evil one. Who has rallied millions of people to work hard for decades to improve this world? The best you’ll come up with are reactions to fight evil. People just aren’t what you think they are.

[@wheelmanjosh1982]

Russians love the Cult of Personality. Lex is looking for the charismatic leader to save us all.

[@stuartturner2124]

It is a foregone conclusion. Man destroys everything he touches.

[@jozefkucera8402]

u saying man should stop touching himself?

[@Hapistudios]

Man destroys man that's more accurate

[@michaelgerbasi1025]

We break things down to build them up, to create. Often times we are ignorant as to what to build and the destruction remains.

[@Hapistudios]

@@michaelgerbasi1025 well said our ability to create is amazing and yet we are so ignorant because we cannot even create a fly one of a zillion creations we are yet to scratch the surface of what has created us

[@Hapistudios]

@PARK nazi germany is nothing like the situation USA has today pre Nazi era the enemies of germany forced germany into suffering USA suffering exists because the american dream is to be wealthy instead of creating a sustainable economy it is driven by greed USA will never be able to rise to power as fast as the Nazis did because there is only one way down when you're the top dog already

[@darthsensei3838]

It is very different this time. Before when people didn’t get along - they would go find a new comer of the planet. Now we have no places left to go but other planets orrrr yea we are in trouble. I think self interest is a really realistic way of looking at it though. Good talk

[@bazzuz]

I bet that's been said so many times before. The reality is that if we destroy ourselves, survival would be the top priority. It will devolve into warlords fighting for resources.

[@darthsensei3838]

@@bazzuz I dunno man. We never found anything to suggest we’ve been this far along before. I do agree that it’s probably not the first time we’ve been wiped out though. I have always suspected mankind being a lot older than we think.

[@GL-ys8je]

I'm of the theroy that nature balances the books eventually over time.

[@anthonycarlino4604]

Hella good guest

[@cascy004]

Lex name me one charismatic leader in the past which fits your description? Sounds like a pipe dream.

[@jag5798]

Media and social media is the devil, pitting man against their brother.

[@benkeegan9966]

Absolutely fascinating.

[@darthsebio1726]

Must say... for a intelligent depressed guy...Lex has a stupidly optimistic worldview...

[@brandonlance3601]

Its because he's stupid.. and depressed.

[@keionbradley4254]

I feel like you’re GREATLY underestimating the negativity in the world. Find it a be daunting how in another podcast with dan you could say humans are capable of great violence and in this one that “Love will be the thing to overcome hate”. Is that truly being a realist?

[@pizaliasta8369]

Human kindness triumphs. Look at what happens during natural disasters; the initial response is to band together and help anyone and everyone. Later on, the media gets involved, drops a phrase like “looting” a few times, then people start to panic, and that is when things begin to worsen.

[@birdstrikes]

I come back to this when I remind myself we are totally fucked.

[@richardinacan]

Lex keeps having these large, global issues discussions but seems not to have read a single book on the issues. If he read just a few books on say the global environmental crisis, and maybe a few books on how capitalism really works and causes these crises, then did his own research to confirm all the facts, he'd see it, the scale and hopelessness of the predicament. He just hasn't even tried to see it.

[@dr.samuraisminutelecture7064]

Without respect for our finite natural planet, it is a matter of time that we cross the tipping point that we cannot go back anymore!!

[@jorgec55]

In a capitalist society without any boundaries other than financial gains, the idea to move towards a rational view of development is basically antagonist to its own existence.

[@ExtraordinaryJam]

Yeah no such realities exist as long as we are trapped by such system

[@PaulRamen]

Someone makes a graph of Lex's eye contact time stats through the episodes

[@HXLIASMR]

Leads me to believe he’s definitely on the spectrum

[@jcmeadows1]

Lex's magical thinking about human behavior both surprises and annoys me.

[@andrewt6042]

Charismatic leaders are easily seen before they emerge by AI and are nuetralized to not become a threat to the ruling class.

[@matthewck1370]

Thumbs up. Dan described the situation very well, how we are screwed that is. I don't believe humans will go extinct however. I believe a small number will survive. The survival instinct is very strong, it is possible to live underground. Nor will it be the end of the world, the earth will heal itself in time. The shame of the situation is all of the other species we are taking down with us. Besides nuclear war, my biggest concern is runaway global warming after the artic ice is gone.

[@BryceHomier17]

Every 13,000 years the earth typically has cycles of warm and cold. Ice shelves WILL disappear. Maybe a hundred or 2 hundred years earlier because of humans. Those coastal cities better figure it out.

[@jordan9604]

@@BryceHomier17 We should all try to figure out how to maintain Earth. We are just idiots riding on a rock, flying through space.

[@grider421]

if you believe the global warming bs you need to get out more. the future is cold, and cold kills everything global warming is great for all living things the next ten years will show the future and it’s ice

[@nmoddentity8401]

To tie two of Dan's points together - humans are not likely to collectively come together and make sacrifices now to fix something that won't happen for a generation or longer.

[@marky1846]

YO DAN CARLIN AND JOCKO.... MAKE THAT PODCAST HAPPEN.

[@reaver5]

Human kindness isnt really in politics

[@failfection]

Interesting theory! That good is just better for humans and will naturally prevail in the toughest of times.

[@previous_leon]

same with love as at the end of the day it's love that compels humans and animals to procreate .

[@cameronavon1337]

Jfk literally caused the the missile crisis and then is hailed for stopping it. Has missiles in Turkey, allows the bay of pigs and us nuclear warheads outnumbered Russia at the time by 20,000 to 5000 😂

[@Hapistudios]

The biggest issue is people will choose what is easy more than what is best because of many social and economic reasons the biggest being you want the world to act like a community when they have lost the strength of local community

[@deep9571]

Drugs they alter a person. Not sure which specific could do it, but imagine a Woodstock style scenario that ends catastrophically. Edit: drugs like as a foundation. Like whatever happens after xxx drugs where consumed in xxx time frame some bad event or events occur that doom society.

[@deep9571]

@@hazeofthegreensmoke505 lol yeah so it’s a already fucked

[@truthcerum1222]

Don’t worry, Dr Gate will save us with his marvellous medicine

[@zoop2132]

I think Lex is a good man.

[@brianjoyce9040]

I wish everyday for the winning of love/kindness and feel, as Lex does, it can win

[@jaqatlantic]

Interesting discussion. Militates, not mitigates. I mention that in case they're reading the comments.

[@mark.J6708]

We are at that one of two paths right now.

[@F18Vmfa]

Golden Rule- he who has ( or wants more ) the gold makes the rules

[@zyrrhos]

One tombstone for the mess, I say: humanity, you never had it from the beginning.

[@culbinator]

Love you Lex

[@russv.winkle8764]

Maybe the cult of the Hero is the wrong approach in the age of the internet? The Ubermensch supposedly comes at the cost of many. Not to say we can't have inspired leader's but Global zero sum game theory needs to be recalibrated first.

[@paulgona7665]

Lex is describing the rise of The Anti-Christ perfectly.

[@robertpoen5383]

The Drake Equation shows that our odds of surviving the adolescence of our species are slim to none.

[@DennisNedryisStillAlive]

5:14 Lex unknowingly referring to the anti-Christ

[@Max-px5ym]

Feels like a professor teaching a 10 year old

[@Dan-oi3xt]

How can an intelligent guy like Lex come to such naive conclusions? Charisma has nothing to do with character. Our environment is being ravaged on many fronts continuously and those attempting to warn us are being discredited by special interest spending campaigns while the rest of us either feel completely overwhelmed by it all resulting in collective apathy. The existential cliff is getting closer every minute and we all may draw ourselves even tighter into our own bubbles of self interest, as we slide over that cliff. Ironically, we may end up going from intellectual oblivion to complete oblivion...

[@Gonko100]

By all his intelligence and curiousity, Lex' understanding of history seems in general to be truly lacking.

[@hookssiam]

I'm always surprised by how optimistic he is about the future, but I think it mostly derives from his lack of understanding of human history lol

[@danielsagona4212]

Lex's argument is akin to "god will save us" lol

[@andersongoncalves3387]

Yes

[@Cbart23]

That JFK hat? I bought it at that auction.

[@danieldegracia1690]

I've always felt, "though privately ", that the pandemic, might have saved us from something "worse", "hidden from the collective knowledge.

[@orderdivinewarrior]

Save the world humans

[@Pain-ib7ot]

I think a thanos event needs to happen

[@dalecard9158]

If I had a dollar every time lex said call me naive.

[@thabotshumacomedy]

Lex needs to read some Dune to see what can happen with Charismatic leaders

[@alivincicannava8140]

and you know most of those leaders watch your podcasts. HIGH FAITH

[@donaghb7307]

Lex should have Frans De Vaal on

[@nbaburn3569]

yes

[@AndyWoodall]

If we are relying on a charismatic leader to 'save us' we are even more f*cked than I thought we were. Going to watch Dune Part 2 again to cheer myself up.

[@l.lawliet164]

Short answer: it will not!

[@aramdamanlardz]

I would disagree, many low-socioeconomic level countries suffer from catastrophic corruption and slaughter, so much so that it CAUSES life expectancy to drop immensely Many countries within Africa and the Middle East. It would be naive to say in the span of history our wrong doings have not outweighed the good.

[@pizaliasta8369]

Good has far outweighed the bad. All you need to do is look at literacy rates, life expectancy, and per capita GDP and compare it to 50 years ago. 1970 literacy rate was 50% Today it is closing on 90% Life expectancy has increased about 8% in the last fifty years. From 1990 to today extreme poverty has been reduced by two thirds. Our world is not perfect, but we are on the right trajectory. These things simply cannot happen in a world where bad outweighs the good. Optimism is the only realism, and the only thing that squares with history.

[@ninaromm5491]

​@@pizaliasta8369 . Your stats definitely dont apply to Africa...

[@pizaliasta8369]

I just spent two weeks in Africa. The problem there is there are so many rules, that corruption is the only way to get anything done. For example, it takes two years to get a permit to apply for a business license, so, you bribe whoever will cut the red tape so you can have a shot at making a living. Africa is moving slower than the other continents. largely due to corruption. All you need to do is read about the cause of S. Africa's load shedding, or the son of Equatorial Guinea's president Teodoro Obiang, who also happens to be Vice President, who also lives in a 6 floor penthouse in France, drives supercars, buys 30,000 euro watches, all while the people of his country live on less than $2 a day. Until the people stop accepting that as a way of life, it will never change. Still, Africa is getting wealthier overall, HIV is dropping, literacy is up, child mortality is dropping, etc. The world has a ways to go, but we're continuously making progress. The United Nations data has documented extreme poverty has gone from over 30% in the 1990's to lower than 10% today. We've wiped out 2/3 of extreme poverty in three decades

[@londonghoulchannel6409]

Engineered pandemics........looks at China.

[@omjagdeesh8731]

@@TangoNevada exactly

[@jasonsharpe9963]

Engineered pandemics ? Are you crazy ? Lmao

[@trentlomelino]

Has Lex paid attention to The World Economic Forum and all the countries and Politicians jumping on board? That leader he says will come may be silenced no matter what.

[@marky1846]

i fucking love dan carlin

[@AkkarisFox]

brain computer interfaces may enable telepathy that may allow us to convince each other at much faster rates.

[@tymmibful]

I enjoy the assumption that global climate change is actually happening. That real modern science talk right there. Decide the conclusion then find the science that fit it

[@UnleashthePhury]

You can look at the surface area of the ice caps on satellite photos over decades - they’re shrinking. The ice caps reflect sunlight back into space. If they melt and shrink, they add to the volume of the ocean, which retains heat. Less heat out, more heat retained = a feedback loop.

[@rensc4262]

@Lex, Could a case be made that despite Hitler being "Bad" his actions ultimately resulted in us bing this technologically advanced (you know the war promoted the tech race) Which on the bigger scale might be good? (Basically, a commons strong enemy making the opposition stronger)

[@BryceHomier17]

Okay Lex. Youre naive.

[@sichenghao3747]

100% environmental.

[@Billcornfield]

Love Lex but he chimes in with the charismatic leader. That's what'll distract us from the end goals lad

[@patrickmccabe3256]

Kennedy was a contrarian. I'm a contrarian so I wouldn't have bet against what he would do. There are two main types of the "betting man" Dan. Squares (those in the consensus) and contrarian. Those in the minority. Squares almost always take the favorite. Contrarians usually take the underdog.

[@vikramsatheesh8595]

Dan 'does that make sense' carlin

[@iananderson1901]

Dan Carlin Michael Malice and lex

[@P4r4bo14]

One charismatic leader huh

[@SwampFeet678]

Les is painfully optimistic and naive.

[@Tetarkall]

Since Im here so early, yes. It has already happened many many times, so many we do not remember.

[@Space_Toasty]

?? So valcanoes and asteroids are humans killing themselves?

[@abumusa8223]

1and 2 war ??????? 50 mil ?????

[@mikewiz1054]

The irony of talking about trash and climate change….while having two plastic bottles of water in front of you.

[@SuperMom159]

YES....

[@youngboss5813]

I admire lex's optimism