Winchester Experimental Mag-Fed Garands

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Even during World War Two, it was clear that the United States was interested in improving on the M1 Garand rifle. A company that could develop and update to the Garand to make it selective-fire and feed from a box magazine would be in a great position to sell the government a ton of rifles, and everyone knew it. These two rifles illustrate some of the Winchester company's efforts in that realm.
Thanks to the Cody Firearms Museum for allowing me access to film these! Check them out here: centerofthewest.org/explore/f...

[@pikasome2585]

Me: *googles magazine fed garand Google: M14. Take it or leave it

[@Joshua_N-A]

BM59 has enter the chat.

[@e711x4]

BM59 mk III open the mic

[@bluespy4050]

Google: hey buddy, just what you see

[@olliegoria]

@@bluespy4050 im looking for a phased plasma rifle in the 40 watt range

[@GeorgiaBoy1961]

If it looks like a magazine-fed Garand, but isn't - then it is either an M-14 or a BM-59. The Italian vision for modernization of the Garand is similar to the American M-14 project in some respects, but rather different in others. The BM-59 was/is a fascinating answer to the question of how to replace/update the M-1 service rifle.

[@muhammadihramnp8663]

Vanguard devs:we can make a game based around this

[@americankid7782]

And they fucking did

[@xaniel6639]

what

[@sibidinakaran4757]

i was about to comment this

[@themanformerlyknownascomme777]

except far more cursed

[@coyle477]

Treyarch be like "make it 3 round burst"

[@warrenc9329]

950 rds/min in 30-06 from a shoulder fired weapon - sounds like a wonderful anti-aircraft weapon

[@JohnnyGuiltyMan]

950 rpm?! Jesus Christ that's one hell of a bullethose woth freaking 30-06!

[@Foreskin-Forest]

Unneccassarily sadistic, like the pm-63 scaled up, a weapon designed to ALSO hurt the user

[@JohnnyGuiltyMan]

@@Foreskin-Forest Just to make sure because I haven't found out yet, which is stronger, 30-06 or 308? Because a full auto Garand in 30-06 can't be far away from the uncontrollable horror that is M14 in 308

[@Foreskin-Forest]

@@JohnnyGuiltyMan 30-06 has a longer shell which means it can hold a bit more powder, but when it comes down to .308 vs 30-06, you're dead on in that they would both feel like you were getting liu-kang dragon kicked right in the shoulder over and over.

[@olliegoria]

@@Foreskin-Forest “why didn’t you guys just use a bipod” -the people designing these abominations in the 1940s and 1950s

[@Dr_Martex]

US Ord. Dept.: "We want to replace EVERYTHING" Soldier: "Even the Thompson?" US Ord. Dept.: "ESPECIALLY THE THOMPSON"

[@SwyvCrux]

Together a full auto rifle caliber is more effective than pistol. Only major issue is more recoil and getting as compact as a Thompson. The AK and M16/M4 made the Thompson outdated

[@imgvillasrc1608]

I thought the good idea fairy was ridiculous but after learning about the 7.92 CETMEs existence, it can be possible and kinda practical if made right. Just take the BM-59, chamber it to 7.92 CETME, and then shorten the barrel to 18" for a 42" rifle (has the same length as an M16). There, you got a .32 caliber straight grip select-fire rifle controllable in full auto. The rifle that the Ordance Department wanted and would be appreciated by the old guard.

[@DiscothecaImperialis]

Actually Gen. John Thompson intended his invention to be Assault Rifle from the beginning. I'm not sure if he even invented the term 'Assault Rifle'.. Too bad his invention is too heavy and having too short range to do what Assault Rifles of 40s could. and M1 Carbine was something as close as assault rifle. though .30 Carbine formed a cornerstone of American Assault Rifle rounds :P

[@marcoslaureano5562]

@@DiscothecaImperialis No actually the term he invented was "submachine gun" not "assault rifle". And I agree the M1 Carbine/M1A1 could pretty much be considered "assault rifles".

[@Rolomanplays]

@@imgvillasrc1608 converting a bar mag was fairly simple it was difficult getting them to work

[@atadbitnefarious1387]

US military and firearms designers before the war: "alright we want a semi automatic rifle to get a technological edge on the battlefield, but... we don't want detachable magazines." "wait, why no detachable magazines, you could hold so much more ammo and reload so much fas-" "We like change but not too much change." "Oook buddy, leme see what I can do..." *creates the en block clip* After the war: "Alright enblock clips were a stupid idea, someone give us a gun where you can take the magazine out." "Awesome, finnaly. While we are at it, we could make a few design changes to really get the most out of-" "We also want full auto capabilities, but don't want an entirely new rifle, so figure out a way to retrofit existing rifles. We like change but not too much change" "For fucks sakes dude." Cold war era: "So looks like all the cool kids are adopting Assault Rifles and want a common NATO caliber, how should we respond?" "Adopt the M14" "But every one already has FALs and-" "And make it .308." "But full power rifle cartridges used in a traditionally designed rifle defeat the purpose of having Assault Rif-" "This is america. We like change, but not too much change."

[@R281]

FlyDangerous lol

[@atadbitnefarious1387]

***** m14 fits a niche (and i love them too) but it's too archaic for us to keep using. The only thing it's got going for it is that it shoots a big ol 7.62. There are plenty of modern weapon systems that could do that. Shit, the FAL and G3 were already doing that and excelling it it. The army just had to be political and keep an M1'ish weapon around. Imagine if we adopted an ar10 derivative instead of the ar15 as our primary rifle. People would forget all about m14. Our switch to .223/5.56 was VERY political as well.

[@R281]

Brian Zimmerman could the 7.62 punch through walls in Afghanistan?

[@R281]

Brian Zimmerman Crazy

[@MEGABUMSTENCH]

lol that sun baked mud/cow shit mix. so strong.

[@JohnSmith-pm2vq]

"Now this rifle doesn't want to come out of it's stock very easily, so I'm not going to force it." That's very nice of you, Ian.

[@MrKilroy51]

fully auto shoulder fired 30-06? and no bipod?? im all set you shoot first lol

[@dontmindme333]

It would be an honor to shoot first

[@MrGreghome]

Greedo shot first. Han solo 2nd

[@codemiesterbeats]

IKR... I shot a auto 308... first full auto I had shot and not a stranger to guns and I think it would be quite difficult to use it effectively.

[@AM-hf9kk]

You forgot 900 RPM. Your shoulder would be hamburger.

[@MarvelousSeven]

Well, it was made in the days of wooden rifles and iron men.

[@Ashfielder]

What's the point of having an M1 Garand if it doesn't go *ping*?

[@hungerofsylar7842]

This M1 Garand was for those who didn't want to let any nearby enemies know it was reload time.

[@heinzxzxzxzxzx]

Hunger of Sylar you'd never hear that ping in a firefight

[@ToastyMozart]

Nah, you just throw an empty en-bloc on the ground and pop them when they stuck their head out. (IIRC that actually happened a few times)

[@keithmoore7390]

the hell with the ping if you have 20rds.!!!!! Garand or FG42, give me the 42!!!! hell give me a Johnson, at least you can top off the magazine if you only fire 1or 2 rds.!!!!!

[@dirtyski1114]

You can absolutely top off and en bloc clip.

[@Jo-un6es]

Son: Mom? Can I have an M14? Mom: No sweetie, we have one at home. At home:

[@dickeydanger6156]

Your mom's Hot.

[@brianstabile165]

Jo Nice profile pic you got it from marines?

[@Jo-un6es]

@@brianstabile165 Yeah. It just looks absolutely wack, a Marine drinking from a mug while staring at you.

[@u.h.forum.]

Jo honestly the marines are gay, my soldier drinking from his canteen while giving you a smile doesn’t give the “I want to eat crayons out of your ass” look

[@Joshua_N-A]

M14 at home: Beretta BM59 made with Garand tooling.

[@jakthesmack]

950+ rpm in .30-06, holy shit that would be a handful. Awesome video as always.

[@disturbedlife5691]

CO Jones didn't Dr Atwater say that on 'tales of the gun'?

[@evilassaultweaponeer]

delinquentJACK our own FG-42 lol

[@leifvejby8023]

I had an M1 when in the army, a worn one, and because of a worn pawl it would occasionally fire the whole clip like brrrrrrrriiiing - 950 rpm is FAST and quite scary the first few times it happens. Couldn't be aimed or anything, just interesting.

[@sammoon2906]

Leif Vejby Would you feel worse knowing that, with the way that works, it's possible for the gun to detonate the cartridge out of battery, which could hurt quite a bit?

[@aleramone23]

I bet the last three rounds you fire them from a sitting position

[@rahbaralhaq]

"...at the same time, Winchester was also working on its G-30 rifle, which was its version of a magazine fed semi auto rifle which we will look at in a later video. They were also working on the WAR, the Winchester Automatic Rifle which was their idea for an improvement on the BAR, the Browning Automatic Rifle. We'll take a look at that, in a later video as well..." It is confirmed, Ian is a Time Lord. That is the only explanation for his time traveling videos and his extensive knowledge about forgotten firearms.

[@Ted4321]

@TheVisigoth can you recommend the book to me, I'm interested

[@InvestmentJoy]

I think they just gave him access to an armory full of cool stuff and he knows what's there :D

[@tamahawkins2815]

my dad says 'Your the man and you know your shit'

[@teufeldritch]

Of course he does! He's Gun Jesus.

[@tamahawkins2815]

Player Review that's probably a quotation error on my part as I was paraphrasing

[@novaman3509]

Jobby Bones Good thing you can't remember him then.

[@PostalPatriot556]

Gun Jesus knows all

[@donttakemeseriouslystudios4660]

955 rounds of 30-06 per minute, for when you want to do more damage to your shoulder than the target you just missed 20 times.

[@kevinoliver3083]

Might only have missed nineteen times. In 1939 the British converted a Garand we had for trials to full auto. They found that the first shot in a burst was reasonably accurate. It was the rest that were scattered over the backstop (mostly towards the ceiling).

[@nicolaandria522]

@@kevinoliver3083 So if only the first shot is going where you want the burst is absolutely pointless...

[@jayfelsberg1931]

I just watched Ian trying to shoot an M14 on full auto in .308. I can't even imagine shooting 30.06 rifle in full auto.

[@calebnation6155]

Modern .30-06 is more powerful than the military version of that time. That’s why on a garand, you either need surplus ammo or an adjustable gas system installed aftermarket so it can be tuned safely for modern ammo

[@SynchronizorVideos]

The .308 was developed to replicate the ballistics of the standard military .30-06 loadings, so recoil would have been pretty comparable. We think of the.30-06 as more powerful due to modern hunting loads using the larger case volume to push performance higher (although even there the two are still pretty similar).

[@thegoldencaulk2742]

Wow! A rare variant of the Garand: The assault Garand. You can tell it's meant for fully-automatic fire from it's clipazine because it has the shoulder thing that goes up!

[@jmdenn3000]

TheGoldenCaulk don't forget it has more thrust per squeeze

[@Prowbar]

TheGoldenCaulk 30 caliber magazine clips in half a second! Truly a ghost gun

[@leonardotavaresdardenne9955]

I read it with a Mike Stoklasa voice :D

[@thegoldencaulk2742]

wood1155 That's right, wood1155! I once laid my AK-47 on a couch and it leapt out and killed 10 people and a puppy or something!

[@arcane9860]

frugalgunsmith are you?

[@themightypen1530]

**Holding my rifle up so it can see the screen** "There's your Grandpa!"

[@ianfinrir8724]

I don't know. This is more like the weird uncle we don't talk about

[@imgvillasrc1608]

@@ianfinrir8724 This was grandpa during his phase.

[@CherryBlossomOhka]

LMFAO 😂😆

[@forcebewithyou7746]

Where would it’s eyes be?

[@dylanslater4836]

I find it interesting that this 1 weapon platform filling every role mindset actually has occurred to a degree with the AR platform. The mk18 has filled the role of a smg, the m110, and mk12 have filled sniper and dmr applications, and the m27 has filled a saw role to an extent, along with the m4 and m16 being standard service rifles and carbines

[@alexunfiltered5756]

its something i already thought about. The m16 did what the M14 was designed to do but couldn't.

[@johnderouen1038]

​@Daniel Cordero Much though I hate to be "that guy", the SVD (which I am assuming is what 'long ak' is referring to) operates using a combination of the AK's rotating bolt and a *short* stroke gas piston more similar to that of the SKS, whereas the AK's gas piston is more of an extension of the bolt carrier and travels the full length of the recoil stroke and is hence referred to as a long-stroke gas piston. The rest is pretty well correct. 'Big AK' could mean either the RPK or the PK, both of which are still the Kalashnikov action (though the PK is upside-down and feeds from a belt). An easily-customizable 'Modern AK' sounds like the AK-12 to me, and 'Smol AK' sounds like the AKS-74U.

[@muhammadnursyahmi9440]

@@johnderouen1038 you forget about Romanian PSL, which is a scaled up AK for DMR use

[@IncredibleMD]

The IAR is basically an AR version of an RPK, except it can also function as a DMR.

[@michaelthompson7217]

@Daniel Cordero smol ak :3

[@marcoscosta2318]

You talked about the BAR magazines being use in this project , over here in brazil the army tried something similar in the 50s , they made a copy of the g43 chambered in 30.06 and using BAR magazines , needless to say that it didn't work very well .

[@Grybhaal_Daublebach]

30-06 at 950RPM? Fuck that.

[@therideneverends1697]

I heard dislocated shoulders feel lovely

[@fredrickmillstead2804]

Ya think?

[@ChaosPootato]

I didn't give two craps about firearms before I stumbled upon your channel. You make it that much more interesting, thanks :D

[@ForgottenWeapons]

Awesome! :)

[@Toolness1]

Buy one if it's legal where you live and you don't already own one. I guarantee you'll love it! Watching them is one thing....But once you shoot one, you're hooked.

[@rednecksniper4715]

im not 100 but im fairly sure the WAR had its own mag and if so perhaps the mag in that second garand could be a WAR mag

[@jasondoe2596]

ChaosPotato... Same here!

[@JonatasAdoM]

He shows how amazing feats of technological engineering they are

[@TugboatMatt]

My dad use to have a select fire m1 garand. It took the standard clips though, not a removable magazine. My grandfather bought it for my dad in a surplus store long time ago, the rifle was handed over for destruction in the 90’s when the Canadian gov came out with the long gun registration and stuff.

[@ArcturusOTE]

Are you related to the Cooey family that made guns in Canada?

[@dallasmckim4370]

Holy fuck dude, that's unfathomably lame. God, this country sucks noodles.

[@antonindufournaud6572]

Yay vanguard is technically kinda accurate about this

[@madkoala2130]

But what use would have fricking DRUM MAG for semiauto rifle?

[@nicjuls7382]

@@madkoala2130 *casull 290 has entered the chat* 300 rounds of .22 in drum form for a semi auto only version of the lewis machine gun

[@DeathDealer_1021]

@@nicjuls7382 wut

[@zect556]

That ping sound make it cursed

[@HashMaster1776]

@@madkoala2130 well if you watched the video you’d know it has a FULL AUTO conversion.

[@andyrihn1]

God the ordinance department sucks. They're either unfairly giving good designs the go around, making unreasonable demands for new projects, or refusing to see how future trends are going

[@diablojd52]

The officers and bureaucrats you mean.

[@selonianth]

Welcome to the opinions of basically every single soldier in the entire US Military BuOrd sucks.

[@holdmybleach2651]

Search for Bradley Fighting Vehicle

[@donjones4719]

That's what makes the M1 Carbine so awesome. The army came up with a concept of what they wanted, a personal defense weapon. Weight was a top priority. A company came up with an excellent cartridge and weapon. When select-fire was found to be problematic early in development, it was dropped, no fuss. No one was allowed to pile on more capabilities, or say the cartridge should be a little more powerful, and then a little more powerful, etc. A concept was followed through, cleanly. It's almost incomprehensible.

[@GeorgiaBoy1961]

Cronyism is a reality, including in the military. It's just the way it is. Private sector firms are not immune, either, as events since the 1970s have proven.

[@Granite]

Thanks gun jesus.

[@brooksh.6028]

Granite It's his brother Craig Christ.

[@fuzzydunlop7928]

@@brooksh.6028 I'M FUCKIN' CRAIG CRAIG CHRIST-UH!

[@travisthompson4098]

@@fuzzydunlop7928 ooooo

[@travisthompson4098]

@@fuzzydunlop7928 ho

[@travisthompson4098]

@@fuzzydunlop7928 oooooo

[@CommonSkill]

The addition of that detachable magazine makes the Garand look a whole lot cooler

[@leosarmiento2484]

Next video: belt fed Rhodesian Garands

[@seanfernandolopez9139]

after that: belt fed, collapsing stock Ottoman Garand, with underbarrel webley revolver, with ping on every shot

[@XIPHIASCDXX]

There was a company [McCann Industries] that modified Garand chambers to shoot .458, very hard rifles to find these days. They did a few different calibers, and fit them with drop-clips.

[@jwdickinson643]

I seem to recall watching a WWII movie several years ago in which one of the actors/extras was using a full auto M1….and it struck me as odd since I had always thought the M1 was semi-auto only….must have been an “artistic license” kind of thing….

[@TacDyne]

"They wanted it magazine fed, select fire, mount a scope..." So basically they wanted a Mini14.

[@markt4110]

The Garand, the M14 and the L1A1 are things of beauty.

[@ek8710]

Idk why but folding feed lips are really pleasing.

[@flynn88MN]

Using the recoil spring for the magazine release lever is quite brilliant, props to whoever efficiently thought of that.

[@marxman-wb2yt]

I knew these existed, everyone thought I was crazy or didn't know what I was talking about, I WAS RIGHT

[@PARAMOUNTPHLOPYNATOR]

I always thought these didn't exist.... I'm so happy Magfed m1 garands... My god...it actually happened

[@marcusborderlands6177]

You can own a mag fed garand if you find a bm59 for sale.

[@PARAMOUNTPHLOPYNATOR]

@@marcusborderlands6177 true.

[@kennebecsmitty]

I remember a guy up in Maine,over 20 years ago,that had a semi auto M-1, it used BAR magazines,pretty cool rifle to say the least!

[@Shane-Singleton]

Pretty cool experimental versions. And I get the idea behind it. And then everybody figured out that a handheld full auto weapon in a .30 caliber full power rifle cartridge wasn't the best idea. And then enter the AR15/M16 rifles. I love my surplus firearms and most of them are pretty great in their own way. And I find it even more interesting to see these evolutionary experiments and what did and did not make it into the hands of the soldier by the time it was all said and done.

[@IonoTheFanatics]

This is also a great showcase to use when ppl ask, 'why don't they just stick a magazine into X rifle' one would not believe how naive ppl thought weapon designs are in general, or most engineered designs are for that matter... it seems most ppl thought one just fit things to another and hammer it till it fit in engineering field

[@harryjoe860]

Iono Sama but, that's how it works though

[@douglaspierce8480]

I read that the initial version of the grand was submitted to the Army had a box magazine, but the Lt. Col. in charge of procurement rejected it because he though that the troops would "Waste" ammunition using it.

[@mitchellsmith4690]

There were also objections that it would interfere with marching at shoulder arms...

[@GuardianLords]

950 rpm? More like a 5 round burst.

[@olliegoria]

More like “perfectly tenderized shoulder”

[@butchkaminsky9470]

The Italian did make the jump basically using a our rife into a full auto beast. I look forward to seeing a video on that rifle in action. 👀

[@Tmeister44]

I hate lugging around the weight of my Garand let alone a Garand with a full box magazine.

[@222foont]

Sell it to me!

[@brandonsimons543]

very cool video Ian, m1 garand has always been my favorite rifle ever and its cool to see all the experimental things it could have became in all you videos you post very cool!

[@scottrider8445]

You're the man Ian. I've been watching your videos for a week straight now. Not only informative, but extremely interesting. You've definitely got the X-Factor man!

[@haroldhenderson2824]

The lens of Hindsight (imperfect as it is); .30-06 in full auto (but not 900 rnds/min.!) Lighter ammo (but not 85gr., it won't penetrate tropical grass) Box magazines (but don't stick out of the stock much) Shorter barrels (but still have the muzzle velocity and long range accuracy of 26 inch) Use cheap (and dirty) powder, but don't issue any cleaning tools! Are the Bureaucrats on OUR side or THEIRS?

[@CascadianPatriotII]

Bureaucrats are a side unto themselves, my friend.

[@DingoAteMeBaby]

Ian: "Idea straight out of fantasy land" Stoner:

[@davehood2667]

Is still in fantasy land. At least the Army is finally getting rid of his silly ideas.

[@baneofbanes]

Dave Hood I think he’s referring to the AR10 Anyway the military ain’t going to get rid of the AR platform for a long time.

[@georgewhitworth9742]

Hunter Smith I think this man was refering to the Stoner 63...

[@ianfinrir8724]

The man's name was "Stoner", are we really surprised?

[@gerrycarmichael1391]

I've read a couple of stories about GI's in WWII doing battlefield modifications to the sear on their Garrands to convert them to full auto. One of the first references to this practice came from Major Dick Winters of Band of Brothers fame.

[@WhiskeyTactical]

those feed lips are definitely the most unique ive ever seen thus far

[@JerryEricsson]

Thanks for the informative videos, when I check your channel and find another firearm it makes my day!

[@Toad_Hugger]

3:00 And here I was, wondering why the Garand closest to the camera had its magazine so far away from the action... Turns out it was just the magazine of the Garand behind it... Darn optical illusions! Great video Ian!

[@flyingninja1234]

A precursor to the M14, very cool. Makes one wonder how the war would have gone, had these been in production from the start.

[@Goldchaingarcia]

I could only imagine the axis armies would of been blown away and a culture shock, if the US had detachable magazine, select fire Garands as the standard issue rifle.

[@jmjedi923]

The soldiers probably would have ignored the full auto setting tbh I don't see that being too useful as a shoulder weapon

[@fernandoalegria4240]

When I got to Nam in 68 Tet as a Marine 0311, my rifle, a M16 with a fork type flash suppressor, had a serial number that started with. XM. It was covered in mud, and I always wondered how the previous owner gave it up.

[@gregfair1749]

I love seeing videos of little to unknown variants of my all-time favorite rifle!!!!

[@Callsign-Cobra]

Vanguard be Like

[@hekkenschutz]

@ 1:55 I think you're describing the AR15 it can be a multi cal SBR subgun, light weight, with a scope, beta mag and even belt fed, accurate and effective... just not a long 30 cal...

[@hekkenschutz]

and while not a true sniper rifle, the MK110 setup or 6.5 Grendel can make it pretty effective DMR

[@xXxNECROMONGERxXx]

An AR-10 is not an AR-15. You cannot chamber an AR-15 in 7.62x51mm. The lower receiver simply cannot fit the cartridge. The M110 from KAC is an AR-10 variant.

[@phileas007]

Well, technically the AVT that was available for a few years before all of these developments already fulfilled all the new requirements :)

[@hekkenschutz]

akavich19 I meant the 57mm Bofors mk3 clearly

[@luisparga5707]

Jon H

[@JackOSUrulz]

Harry Seifried went on to design and build the High Standard .22 revolvers that were sold from the 50s to the 70s. He also went to work for Ruger and helped designed some guns for Bill Ruger, IIRC he helped with the 10/22.

[@lhmmhl1]

Using the main spring for tension on the magazine catch is sooooooo cool.

[@trentmerrell686]

Me and my brother were talking about if this exists and now it's in my recommend, KZbin scares me...

[@miscbrah3508]

yes nothing like a fresh ian video to start my morning

[@rmshorty11]

You have such an awesome channel and I am very jealous you get to handle all this amazing history.

[@M21L35]

Bravo, Sir!....you're the first individual I've heard (on U-Tube, or ANYWHERE) who CORRECTLY pronounces the name of the inventor of these weapons!

[@tostimir]

Ian truly is a prophet.

[@CountSpartula]

All i ever wanted in my Garand is a magazine and a god damn oprod cover. Still waiting on the oprod cover.

[@Ross665]

That was quite an interesting video. Shows a evolutionary step between the M1 and the M14.

[@chillglobe]

This video was on my recommendations because of vanguard, they also added this feature on garand

[@Women_Rock]

Man what I wouldn’t give to hear the ping after a Garand fires 900rpm

[@The_Mimewar]

Having never suffered “Garand thumb” but having seen it, this would have saved a lot of thumbs!

[@FriendChicken]

Here in the Philippines our armed forces back then used m1 garands rechambered fo 5.56x45mm and modified to accept m16 magazines. You can google it.

[@tigerattacker4]

man it would've been cool to see these rifles fire or any old weapons you review but I understand why you can't. Awesome piece of history!

[@yoboikamil525]

Vanguard seems to have been right

[@nicholsliwilson]

Ian, with regard to the feed lips on the 2nd magazine, the M1 was clip fed in part because of some influential people's fears about detachable magazine feed lips getting damaged when dropped. Is it possible the feed lips on that magazine where spring-loaded to prevent damage and mitigate those fears? :/

[@ForgottenWeapons]

That is possible...

[@QuellicheilMarza]

I have a different theory. Think about the Madsen, but with a different "problem" to solve. Could it be that the tabs folds totally in when putting the mag in or when the bolt cycles, totally "removing" the lips and the friction?

[@nicholsliwilson]

Nintendiano With the magazine full the lips are highly unlikely to fold in that far and would form an obstruction once folded in surely?

[@richardbell7678]

Another possible reason for the odd arrangement for the feed lips is that this particular magazine is one of the experimental magazines fabricated when they still were not sure what the feed lip contour should have been, so the magazine was designed to allow for different sets of feed lips to have been evaluated without making a new magazine for each feed lip contour tested. The pins locate the feed lips on the magazine and the springs help keep the feed lips in position. It may be that somewhere between all of the way up and all of the way down there is a slot that allows the feed lip to be removed from the magazine and replaced.

[@mslynn531]

I might be reaching here, but the second weapon's mag was awful long for a 20 rd, and seemed overly 'squared off' on the back (especially compared to the first mag); is it possible that it was actually a 24 rd mag, and the spring loaded feed lips were to allow 3 existing 8 rd 'en bloc' clips to be loaded like stripper clips?

[@waldo865sti]

Love what you do! Very educational and you never sound annoying :)

[@chethaynes5802]

Outstanding Info Presentation !

[@Ranenkim]

Mag Fed Garand Do You Mean: The M14?

[@davehood2667]

Apparently no, because it was Springfield's modified Garand that became the M14, not Winchester's.

[@baneofbanes]

No

[@Joshua_N-A]

Proto BM59?

[@seanfernandolopez9139]

funny enough, the "do you mean M14?" response is pretty common to average gun people. they'd even say it in a sarcastic way

[@legodude666]

But is it a truly an M1 Garand if it lacks the "ping" though?

[@MYNAMEISFROWNER]

N O

[@Joshua_N-A]

Some Italians converted the Garands into something better than M14.

[@ericbutler6881]

I've seen one done before I think it was a m 14 mag it was for national match shooting. It was 308 I think it was a some what popular conversation when the m 1 was more popular for match shoot. I knew a gun dealer that had one on his shelf. I think Derik Martin in AZ messed around with doing the modification.

[@oldmountaindawg4593]

Good vid youngster. Keep them rolling

[@ryanperry6563]

Problem: They needed a "miracle" weapon that was lighter and magazine fed. It had to be able to mount a scope and be used similar to a sniper. It also had to be select fire so it could act as a sub machine gun. Solution: M16/M4

[@GeorgiaBoy1961]

The "universal rifle"concept was doomed from the start. As good as the M-16/M-4 turned out to be, they weren't the answer, either, since no one tool can do every job equally well. The assault rifle is a capable weapon, but when push comes to shove, it can't do the job of a battle rifle, just as the battle rifle cannot do the job of an SMG or an assault rifle. It's why different classes of weapons and cartridges exist in the first place.

[@drmaudio]

It would be interesting to contrast the details of these to a M14.

[@sillygoose210_6]

Gun Sense (drmaudio) .30-06 vs .308

[@mysss29]

gas system--see Ian in another top comment thread

[@jadger1871]

Sillygoose219 _ you spelled 7.62x51mm NATO wrong.

[@Turgz]

Gun Sense (drmaudio) These experimental rifles are modifications of already existing M1 rifles, whereas the M14 came from the factory with those features. That is one of the main differences.

[@armynurseboy]

long-stroke gas (M1) vs short stroke gas (M14). longer receiver vs shorter receiver. .30-06 vs 7.62x51mm

[@mtacoustic1]

I understand Garand originally designed the M-1 to be mag fed, the the government arms bureaucracy wanted it to be clip fed.

[@curtisbrayfield7707]

I was told the original design for the M-1 garand was a magazine fed rifle, but the War department didn't want magazines (possibly because they were expensive and required more resources than a stripper clip, and seeing a war coming, wanted to field as many as soon and as cheaply as possible).

[@antipathy162]

Sooo... Vanguard can justify doing the not good stuff to the garand?

[@spoohater6949]

Yeah that game is so cursed

[@damienmaymdien6367]

The *n o t g o o d s t u f f*

[@BasedBelkan8492]

this is one of them, yes but it's not like the other 76% are also excusable, they're just... eugh

[@clueless5803]

Mag fed revolving shotgun 💀💀💀

[@bulletghost3452]

@@clueless5803 Its the "Becker Revolving Shotgun" prototype from the Germans but used in the pacific missions its by the JAPANESE lol.

[@blackviking9375]

*watches vanguard gameplay once* KZbin:

[@drmachinewerke1]

There was a man with a bar mag feed M-1 at Knob Creek bout 18 years ago

[@ronsbeerreviewstools4361]

Great informative Winchester arms video.

[@S0nz94]

So who's here after the release of Vanguard?

[@normalnormansizzle]

wouldn't a mag fed garand just be an m14?

[@brettr6895]

normalnormansizzle 30-06 vs 7.62 x 51

[@Armandtopia]

m14 was also originally automatic, as it was intended to functionally replace the m1 garand as well as the BAR

[@gosonegr]

With a bigger cartridge

[@ForgottenWeapons]

The M14 has a somewhat different gas system.

[@bigmal1690]

Forgotten Weapons i think i heard u say before that it was short piston like an m1 car, or maybe im wrong about that?..........what was the advantages of the m14 over this kind of gas system, as u said it wouldn't have been that difficult to convert M1s to mag feed, in just semi?

[@Jesses001]

I really like the use of existing parts in that first example. They seem to have really tried to use what they already had rather then add a lot of new parts. Even small pieces like the clip release is reused as one of the magazine catches.

[@johncox2865]

Thanks, Ian.

[@jkoeberlein1]

How different is the M14? I was under the impression that it was a modified M1. I've got to say 900 rpm in 30-06 would do its best to remove your arm from your shoulder!

[@stockingsstuffer6302]

John Koeberlein the M14 uses a different caliber, different gas system, and better build quality.s

[@Turgz]

John Koeberlein The M14 isn't a modification of the M1, they were new rifles that were made with those features.

[@vector6977]

.308 is hardly a soft shooting caliber.

[@shaneschartel1593]

John Koeberlein we thought mg34s where scary?

[@EnterTheFenix]

John, Gas system, magazine and some changes to the bolt were the largest mechanical changes..

[@anthonywilliams379]

Now I wonder if post 1980s m1 garand rifles are still capable of accepting that conversion,lol ........they probably could to be fair

[@sillygoose210_6]

Anthony Williams recoil would be insane

[@davidbray4686]

Anthony Williams e

[@FaintRush585]

You are the Bob Ross of weapon breakdowns.

[@gjsilvano]

Very good video, and very informative. I have a 1943 Springfield Armory M1 Garand, and I love it just to way it is. This thing is in great shape, and I wouldn't part with this for anything!!!

[@articz7731]

Its automatically shit because there's no ping

[@hydrix6419]

I guess vanguard wasn't completely wrong about mag fed m1 garands

[@trilby5223]

The Drum mag still makes me feel uncomfortable

[@hydrix6419]

@@trilby5223 it makes me too regardless of it's existence

[@Suikogiru]

Vanguard: I'll take your entire stock

[@davidstegman8147]

Thanks Ian

[@bwhog]

Cool. I was aware of the Japanese clone with the 10 round internal box magazine but was totally unaware of modifications being attempted by domestic manufacturers. I'd always held that one weakness of the M1 was the en bloc system. Interesting to see the challenges presented by the rifle in making a different system operate correctly.

[@TheAngelobarker]

hey gun Jesus how similar is this to the Italian g series magazine garand rifle the italian navy still uses

[@chuckguerin8141]

Very informative, have to give you big props. And Thanks for posting!

[@brucer81]

Always unique and informative. Thanks.