Wings of the Luftwaffe: Me-262 "Schwalbe"

[@37Dionysos]

Thanks for this. My Dad was a US 15th AAF B-24 nose-gunner 1944-45 and said (as here) his turret couldn't track these jets strafing and streaking past their formations. The 262s shot past the P51 fighter escorts and to the Germans they appeared to be "hanging in the air like balloons." On one mission a level flight of 4 jets came straight at theB-24s with all their cannons winking and down went six B-24 Liberators, in one pass. How the man survived we'll never know.

[@kickassandchewbubblegum639]

if germany had 1000s of these us and uk would have had to stopped bombing indefinitely...this would have given germany untolds about of unhindered production and supply logisitics to italy and russia and reinforcing french coast for d day...imagine 100 262s during kursk

[@PORRRIDGE_GUN]

​@@kickassandchewbubblegum639 The USAAF did consider stopping daylight bombing and began to prepare for night bombing after the Schweinfurt raid where they lost 99 aircraft in one raid. There was also a pause on daylight bombing when losses exceeded 5% per sortie, a level which sounds bearable, but day after day it is not sustainable as you run out of crews faster than aircraft. Even crews that survive go home after 30-35 missions Lets imagine a bombardment group of 100 planes and they lose 5% per mission (I have rounded up or down to the nearest whole number 100 95 91 87 83 79 76 73 70 67 64 61 58 55 52 49 47 45 43 41 39 37 35 33 32 30 29 28 27 26 25 - 30th mission, first surviving crews stood down or 24 23 22 21 20 - 35th mission, So once a Bombardment group is reduced to 25 or 20 airframes, it is probably withdrawn. I would expect it would have been withdrawn sooner than that. Another factor to consider is the enemy. Less of you means less targets for them. As numbers of bombers deplete more fighters and flak are concentrated on those remaining. Enemy gains experience, including flak defences could raise the loss rate well above 5%. And the enemy's loss rate may decline too.

[@jean-francoisaubry]

Gardens angels were there

[@danielmocsny5066]

@@kickassandchewbubblegum639 - Germany could have delayed defeat with enough jet fighters but probably could not have changed the ultimate outcome. The western Allies were developing their own jets too - both sides were copying each other's weapons throughout the war (the Germans for example developed the Panzerfaust after capturing an American Bazooka). The USAAF (with British help) had its Lockheed P-80 Shooting Star operational by 1945, but had no need to rush it into action by that point with the Luftwaffe largely destroyed. With America's massive advantage in production and logistics, the Germans could not have compensated for very long with a quality advantage. Besides, the USA had the atomic bomb in the works. Germany's best and perhaps only chance to win came in 1939-40 when there was an opportunity to starve the UK out of the war by sinking its merchant ships, but the Kriegsmarine did not build enough U-boats early to exploit its temporary advantage. By the time German U-boat production ramped up, the western Allies were also ramping up the quality and quantity of their anti-submarine warfare.

[@danielmocsny5066]

@@PORRRIDGE_GUN - You can also use the "rule of 72" to quickly estimate the doubling time for 5% growth (equal to the halving time for 5% loss). 72/5=14.4, so it takes about 14 to 15 missions to lose half your starting number with a 5% loss rate per mission - which agrees with your table of numbers. By around 28 to 30 missions you halve the survivors again, leaving just 25 of the starting 100, again agreeing with your numbers. Attrition worked both ways. The Western Allies had deeper resources to absorb losses of both men and equipment. Replacement aircraft and crews constantly ferried across the Atlantic. In the months it would take a bomb group to fly 25 missions, the USAAF could put several new groups in England. The USAAF could afford to rotate out its crews, sending experienced pilots back home to provide valuable training for new recruits. In contrast, Luftwaffe pilots flew combat missions until they died or were too badly injured to fly, which is why some of them accumulated vast numbers of aerial victories. But this also deprived their training pipeline of experience. The quality of new Luftwaffe pilots gradually deteriorated, while the quality of new American pilots gradually improved. Another problem later in the war was the lack of safe airspace for German pilots to train, with Allied fighter-bombers roaming all over Germany. And the bombers weren't the only airplanes getting shot down - even without fighter escorts, a formation of Allied bombers carried hundreds of defensive machine guns. Getting through all that metal wasn't easy for Luftwaffe air-superiority fighters, which is why the Luftwaffe relied on heavy fighters (Zerstörer) with cannons that out-ranged the machine guns. (The Zerstörer in turn became easy prey for USAAF P-51 Mustangs when they became available.) While trading bombers for enemy fighters is not ideal (bombers are much more expensive), the Luftwaffe was still losing fighters. And even apart from combat losses, all air forces experience non-combat losses. Flying high-performance aircraft is inherently dangerous. Of course as we recall from reading history, the USAAF reversed its catastrophic bomber losses from 1943 going into 1944 with increasing numbers of escort fighters with the range to accompany bombers all the way to their targets and back, and with General Doolittle's tactical innovation of sending waves of fighters far ahead of the bombers to attack the Luftwaffe fighters while they were still climbing to altitude and trying to form up.

[@wlkilmer]

Excellent documentary! Thank you.

[@taketimeout2share]

Funny that so many of the best American history programmes are really British. I guess they commissioned them so we should be thankful for that.

[@davemacnicol8404]

public broadcasting is a british seed so it makes sense. ken burns makes one about ww1 the American legacy that distinctly shows the American side of things and from our perspective, its pretty honest, considering we were only there for a bit. Its how I learned about joyce Kilmer!

[@gregmacdonald7710]

Totally agree 👍

[@Camcolito]

14:56 - You can't park there Dave.

[@honeybear8485]

I'm a big fan of mustang P-51 now .. I must add the Me-262 definitely years in advanced... I for sure would have liked to tap that throttle!!👍👍👍👍👍 Thanks you guys always do a superb job on your . documentary s

[@IrishCarney]

It wasn't that fun to use the 262 throttle since it you had to be super patient and move it slowly - if you just slammed it the engines would flame out. EVENTUALLY the plane would get to a super high speed, but it would take its time getting there

[@danielmocsny5066]

The Me-262 was slower than the Lockheed P-80 Shooting Star, which was in production by 1945, and already in theater when the war ended. The USAAF was already transitioning to jets, having flown its first jet aircraft way back in 1942 - thanks to some technical assistance from the UK. As the Me-262 never had reliable engines, we can debate whether it was "years" advanced. Of course it was superior (when it worked) to all piston-engined fighters, but every air force in the world understood jets were the future and was working in that direction.

[@SquillyMon]

I had NO IDEA there was a 2 stroke starter motor in the intake cone of the 262... I learn something every single day.

[@Setebos]

Really distinctive sounding engines.

[@Tazjet100]

The Soviets in 1947 manufactured their own copy as the Sukhoi Su-9 / Su-11

[@kickassandchewbubblegum639]

they did that so quickly because they were at the skoda works in the czech well before americans ever got their hands on the jet tech...us got the know how from operation paperclip scientists and von braun...soviets had the blue prints and prototypes all intact....patton really wanted to head to skoda works but was told to help bastogne...he wrote about it in his book and said he also saw flying saucers going toward the skoda works...he said russia would invade us in the coming years with 40k flying saucers then he died mysteriously in a car accident after he wrote that book...he was going to run for president

[@davidrobert1229]

Love this series as a kid on hsistory channel

[@BrettonFerguson]

They always say Hitler wanting the 262 redesigned to be a fighter bomber delayed production. If they hadn't done that it would have been ready years earlier and they could have won the war. Yeah the plane would have been ready, but the engines still weren't ready until 1944. They could have put it into production earlier and had a thousand 262s parked without engines. Even when it was finally put into production, the engines were rushed and still had problems, and they never had enough engines for all the plane they had built.

[@PORRRIDGE_GUN]

They produced approx 3100 airframes. Only 440 were ever completed and flown. The statement that Hitler insisted it be used as a strike bomber is a misunderstanding and probably as a result of mistranslation. Hitler merely asked if it could be used as a bomber, as per an ReichsLuftsMinisterieii (RLM) directive of early 1943, that stipulated that all new aircraft types must be multirole. Apart from pylons (which could also carry papier-mache drop tanks) the Me262 was never fitted with a bomb sight. However the aircraft could be quite an effective bomber, but the reduction in speed and manoeuvrability, and the fact that the Me262A was a day fighter made it a sitting duck to allied piston-engined fighters when carrying bombs. Remember at that time, Me109s and FW190s were also fitted to carry bombs and fulfil the role of the obsolete Ju87 Stuka dive bombers. They also were not fitted with even rudimentary bomb sights. The standard Revi 04 sight was used and pilots were trained to approach at a certain speed and dive angle and release when the target was in the 6 o'clock position on the reticle. It was accurate enough. The Me262 method was the same, and if the target was approached correctly, using the advantage of higher speeds and forward momentum, results could be pretty effective. The LW already had a very fast jet bomber in the form of the Arado 234. It's only drawback being that it used the same engines as the Me262, Junkers Jumo 004s. The LW wanted an aircraft to take on the B17s and B24s of the USAAF that were trashing German cities and war production plants, hence an armament of 4x 30mm Mk108s and R4M rockets. 2 or 3 30mm rounds could destroy a bomber and just one R4M could put a big hole in a B17. This need also saw production being prioritised to the Me262. Arado could have built more Ar234 bombers but they were denied the powerplants in favour of the fighter Me262.

[@LaurenceLDN]

Could have won the war? Because of this one plane? Hmm. I really don't think that'll stand up to too much analysis.

[@pauldavidson6321]

They didn't have the special high temperature alloys to make them durable and long lasting ,the engines had to be carefully nursed during flight making the 262 vulnerable at takeoffs and landing .

[@johnweerasinghe4139]

You don't fight a total war to the death with unproven technology.....that was the Nazi situation after their defeat at Kursk. The Soviets also flew jet and rocket planes. They flew a rocket plane in 1933!!! But shelved the program because of technical problems. The Soviets understood after WW1 ( which no other country did) was the day of decisive single battles was over. The Nazi fascination with technology was due to the mistaken belief that these weapons would produce a decisive turning point in a single battle???? The Nazis were intelligent but the Soviets had insight....which won them the war.

[@codaalive5076]

@@johnweerasinghe4139 Me262 was well proven and effective machine, even V2 hits got precise enough without too many lost. German pilots who knew the situation claimed He280 or Me262 could turn tide of the war if used as intended, if Hitler's didn't interfere with drug fueled nonsense. They had time to develop at least He280, it was probably too late for Me262 because of time lost when waiting to start using it as a fighter. Being techinican myself i don't see 3rd Reich being too fixated on non functioning technology.

[@Irish_For_Life1842]

I used to think wow a P-51 sot down a jet. That all changed years ago. Don't misunderstand me as the P-51 was the best piston engine aircraft in WWII IMO. The Mosquito, the latest Spitfire and the P-38 were all excellent aircraft. All of them were completely outclassed by the ME-262. Almost all victories against the 262 were on the ground, taking off or landing. That was the best strategy at that point in the war for The Allies. The Allies knew where the 262 bases were and they ruled the skies. The Germans tried to have FW 190s to protect the jets while landing/taking off but there were way way too many allied aircraft. The Germans were very successful helping The US and The Soviets greatly in their jet programs and their space programs.

[@dankucker5973]

Best episode.

[@julienlanes8462]

the me 262 my favorite jet fighter

[@Netanya-q4b]

I fly them in War Thunder and they are sluggers with those 30mm canons. I especially like the rocket boosted versions.

[@NWSaint]

@@Netanya-q4b : i'm still working with the PT Boats (my fav), but can't wait to get to the ME-262.. something tells me that's going to be a special craft to fly around, especially with those 30mm cannons!

[@R.Lennartz]

@@Netanya-q4b A shame about its current battle rating, too high in my opinion

[@bogdanradulescu870]

First video ever that give the right credit to Henri Coanda from the beginning...

[@privacyadvocate6697]

Henri Coanda, who the fuck is that?

[@robertsessoms121]

Incredible technology for that time.

[@boltimuss]

Oddly enough, the Allies' greatest ally was Hitler himself...

[@DRAGONSLAYER1220]

As a matter of fact, an Allied plan to assassinate Hitler in 1943 was scrapped for that very reason: Hitler's lunatic ineptitude was actually helping the Allies & the risk of a competent successor capable of reversing German fortunes was considered too great.

[@kelleybrown1666]

Imagine if Versailles was fair to Germany, of if Congress approved Wilson's League of Nations. Ww2 could have been avoided.

[@myassizitchy]

Imagine if germany never started ww1 there wouldn't have been a Versailles treaty. So either way it's their fault. Ww1 and ww2. They deserved everything they got.

[@donneale7555]

So the engine is fragile as a hemophiliac baby but you can change one out in 10 minutes and you are the fastest thing in the sky....seems like a reasonable trade actually.

[@PORRRIDGE_GUN]

The engines got better. From as little as 4 hours to 100 hours endurance. But there were never enough of them, nor much fuel to power them

[@donneale7555]

@@PORRRIDGE_GUN I understood that, I'm saying it's worth it to have to be extra careful and swapping out worn out engines often but quickly, in order to be that fast.

[@arkhie9883]

Outstanding, Me 262.

[@patcebulla6019]

Good thing dolf baby didn't listen to Willy Messerschmitt or I would be writing this in German and we would be speaking German. Dolf baby thought he knew best and wanted the ME262 to be developed as a bomber. If the fighter version was developed first and into production like Willy wanted and a good number off the asembly line as late as early 44 the ME262 would have wiped out the entire US and British airforce's in short order. My Dad's buddy was a tail gunner in a B17 and said he poop'd himself when he saw the ME262 for the first time coming from above out of the sky. The B17 armaments were useless against the ME262 because you could not lead the guns and move them fast enough to shoot one down. I think it is a beautiful design that sitting still looks fast? Its sleak with beautiful lines and the aerodynamics makes it look like and fly like a hot knife going thru butter. The ME262 made piston engine fighters obsolete overnight.

[@realistic.optimist]

The Allies biggest advantage, among many advantages, was quantity. I hate to quote Stalin but; "Quantity has a quality all its own."

[@carsonmccorkle4936]

If you go on to watch the entire video and do even a modicum of side research you will find the Nazis had a one in a million chance of winning world war 2. The nazis were always going to invade the USSR and that was game over. Adolf’s stupidity aside this plane likely couldn’t have entered service much earlier than it did, and the video says as much later on. One new “wunderwaffe” wouldn’t have changed anything. Alternate history makes for good HOI4 games but often fails to take into account reality. Germany COULD NEVER win WW2.

[@larrytownley2231]

If Hitler had backed off of excuteing EASTERN European jews,and accepedthem with open arms, they could have went through Russia like a hot knife through butter !!!

[@carsonmccorkle4936]

Hahahahaha! Oh my god!?! You really think hitler would have even entertained such a notion? Your point requires the motivations behind the Nazi party to change, but if we change that we are now talking about a fantasy story, not alternate history. Also, the Eastern Legion that you claim as this war winning idea did exist. I point to the tens of thousands of “HIWIS” (poles, Ukrainians, Etc.). Even if another half a million conscripts could be raised they would need to be trained and equipped by the Germans, who were not in a position to do so. The whole of the Ukraine isn’t under formal German administration (because they need time to set that up) until early 1942. Assuming you need 1 year to train and arm 500,000 men, which is VERY optimistic, those troops still aren’t available until early 1943. AFTER Stalingrad and Moscow and Rzehv have eaten up the cream of the Wehrmacht and the war in the East is already lost. Side note: Where the heck is German going to get the fuel for the motor transport and armor these guys will need too? The claim is “if nazis weren’t nazis they would have won”, but if nazis weren’t nazis why would they even invade Russia, or Poland, or France, or (insert nation)? Alternate history makes for fun HOI4 games but often has little basis in reality.

[@Netanya-q4b]

I don't think it would have changed the outcome of the war but it would have definitely prolonged it and cost thousands more airmen's lives. The allies had jet designs but they were delayed in favor of mass producing existing piston planes and keep the material advantage. If the Me262 and Me163 and He162 were produced in mass numbers (not possible, but anyway) allies would have quickly changed that strategy and we'd have been sending P59's and F80's rather than mustangs and F84s instead of P47s, B57 instead of B29, etc.

[@Yora21]

13:50 Like an early Gopro.

[@Mybitterreality]

Half a century later and the German military remains the poshest, most inteligent, most feared and above all most accomplished in human history. Long live Germany🇩🇪💪. Much love from Iraq

[@robertkrause4861]

Sounds kinda like the little joe motor to charge up the batteries in the M-48A1 main battle tank

[@JoeOvercoat]

16:00 The irony being that their logistics systems were ineffective and that’s why the allies found so many aircraft abandoned at airfields at the end of the war - they just weren’t getting them fixed.

[@drbichat5229]

JoeOvercoat germans didn’t have fuel to fly them

[@PORRRIDGE_GUN]

@@drbichat5229 To save fuel German aircraft were towed by horses to the runway threshold. Taxiing was verboten

[@larrylandei65]

You make a great report - thank you! As a German, I ... often find used phrases and often repeated untruths in Anglo-Saxon documentation - also about "our" history!? Do you also observe the younger generation? A "bright example" I think is: Lost Battlefields w Tino Struckmann.

[@DavidHuber63]

Thank God for the meddling

[@johntriplett3188]

One thing that isn’t said, there wasn’t enough Jumo engines. Doesn’t matter how good the Me-262 was if they only have 4 engines for every 1000 air frames.

[@megamonkeyblaster3627]

The 262 that was at Chino is no longer there. I think it was sold to Paul Allen?

[@Camcolito]

'The Third Reitssch'

[@ulna28]

what is the start music??

[@hyronov]

wagners flight of the valkyrie

[@boomerhgt]

Waqar Ahmad Wagner was Hitler's favourite composer

[@rodzor]

Perhaps declaring war on the USA without a flinch was a slight blunder too? Telling entire armies to stand firm and not retreat? Allowing them to be encircled and destroyed...another small blunder 🤏

[@kurtjones8207]

if germany had these earlier then germany's industry, fuel production and luftwaffe would not have be pounded into oblivion by the USAF and RAF. Germany may not have won, but if the full luftwaffe and all those 88 flak guns had been deployed in the east, Russia would have had a much tougher time gettting to berlin. All of those Sturmoviks that decimated german armor would have been blasted out of the sky and those 88's would have wreaked havoc on russian armor.

[@AdamosDad]

The Lockheed L-133 was an exotic design started in 1939 which was proposed to be the first jet fighter of the United States Army Air Forces (USAAF) during World War II. The radical design was to be powered by two axial-flow turbojets with an unusual blended wing-body canard design capable of 612 mph (985 km/h) in level flight. The USAAF rejected the 1942 proposal, but the effort speeded the development of the USAAF's first successful operational jet fighter, the P-80 Shooting Star which did see limited service near the end of war. The P-80 was a less radical design with a single British-based Allison J33 engine, with a conventional tail, but it retained a wing which was the same shape as the outer wing sections of the P-38 Lightning. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_L-133#:~:text=The%20Lockheed%20aviation%20company%20was%20the%20first%20in,Johnson,%20Willis%20M.%20Hawkins%20and%20Hall%20L.%20Hibbard.

[@OldEastGermany]

At that time, Germany was technically superior and better.

[@AdamosDad]

@@OldEastGermany The fact is that Germany put the theories into practice sooner than anyone else true but that doesn't change the fact that American or British engineers also had great ideas, and fact is Germany still lost Hitler's war.

[@OldEastGermany]

@@AdamosDad Fact is the American P-80 Shooting Star was a cheap English copy and a total flop for America, fact is up until 1945 America wasn't nearly as good.

[@stevewheatley243]

Bottom line,Hitler started the war too early.

[@TheMongex]

0:53 Pucará!!!!

[@ZERO4A1]

TheMongex where??

[@donfrandsen7778]

Great video Love these series!!! Still got thier asses handed to them by P-51D . Grear video .....love these secret type fighters

[@OldEastGermany]

I'd turn it around, the americans got also their asses get full. The americans lost 38,418 planes against Germany.

[@Voidwalker093]

Both are the craziest war machines going, i would never think it to be one sided if its america vs germany.

[@Bruno-Guitarist]

They could have mentioned the He 178.

[@Wonderboywonderings]

They did

[@Dan_1941R]

It’d at 3:57

[@hammmodjabeer7278]

Terrifying

[@ironwarmonger]

Among production fighter is was the fastest, but the U.S. flap jack was actually faster, and has piston engines. But Jet development caused it to be regulated to the dust bin of history.

[@ronaldschultenover8137]

Too bad we did not have it earlier we could have easily finished the Brits, but we could have done that at Dunkirk if Hitler had listened to his generals

[@phillyleighton86]

But your power mad county didn't win and for that I play my dam busters ringtone everytime I'm at hockenhiem racetrack just to piss yous off that little bit more infact come to think of it we won twice so you can't be blaming Hitler

[@PORRRIDGE_GUN]

@@phillyleighton86 And a World Cup

[@phillyleighton86]

@@PORRRIDGE_GUN ohhhh shit and the world cup haha cheers Topman

[@Margarinetaylorgrease]

31:30 31:35

[@marcallen7233]

The 262 was a awesome fighter but it was not invincible and would not have changed the outcome of the war. I have heard of at least one American pilot in a P-51 shooting one down, and once America entered the war Hitler was doomed.”

[@kickassandchewbubblegum639]

the best plane america had could shoot it down but only during a very rare thing and positioning...12 262s blew up hundreds of bombers in less than a few hours...think about that...imagine if they had 100 always flying with rotations now imagine 1000s

[@OldEastGermany]

I'd turn it around, the americans got also their asses get full. The americans lost 38,418 planes against Germany.

[@carlosvarelafunes9319]

El primero.en el mundo. Y.nacional. socialista aunque. No les.guste

[@Thomas-lk9ok]

hahah the whittle!!! SO many modern jets are powered by this engine!,....oh no! wait! comparing the whittle engine to modern German inspired axial flow jet engines is like comparing stone tools to iron!!!

[@granskare]

Heinkel had a jet in 1941 but luckily he was ignored by Hitler (the Austrian draft dodger)

[@Safeprogress]

Interesting video. It would be excellent if it wasn't for the music.