Wiring Blue Points for Frog Polarity Control (150)

[@LarryDickmann]

I model S scale, and I would just like to say that the videos you make are awesome. Your wizardry pertains to essentially all scales.

[@rickycaridi9761]

Approximately 10,700 members all enjoying you very informative videos....keep going. Congrats

[@TheDCCGuy]

Actually within the next 24 hours we should be at 27,000!

[@glennirwin4710]

Pretty slick setup.

[@PendulumStation]

Larry, I'm starting to reference your videos so often I think my layout should say "Built by me in association with Larry Puckett." Thanks for all of your videos.

[@dennisedgar3430]

Larry, I enjoy your videos and am picking up lots of tips.

[@ronduz1281]

Congrats on 10k Another great video,never board watching them. Always learning something new 👍👍👍

[@TheDCCGuy]

We aim to please.

[@nathanpollard7718]

@@TheDCCGuy so it doesn’t matter which one you use, thanks

[@mannyfernandez2921]

Once again nice video!

[@kraigsickels3918]

Larry ...... excellent video!!!! I love the way you teach and explain everything 👍 !!!! I really learned a lot thank you 😊!!!!

[@peterjhillier7659]

What a beautifully easy to understand Presentation, thanks Larry, looking forward to the your other Videos as you work through the Development of this switching Layout. Stay Safe.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I am glad to hear that. I always wonder when I do these technical videos how well I made the point. I have been doing this so long that it is all second nature to me but I know for a lot of folks it can be techno-babble if not presented clearly. Please feel free to let me know one way or the other about these-Larry

[@michaelbran7993]

Great videos Larry look forward each week to see what your doing Mike in the UK

[@elsdp-4560]

THANK YOU...for sharing. Great explanation watched and very much enjoyed it.

[@TheLocutus70]

Congrats on 10,000+subs. You're videos are very interesting. I never get bored watching.

[@jeffbaker2897]

Congrats Larry on the 10,000 th.+ subscribers, 🎇🎆 I really enjoy your vids, they will help me out tremendously when I go to DCC on my future layout. Again thanks for sharing. 😎👍👍👍🛤🚂

[@mandbhomestead]

Larry, congrats on the 10,000 Subs, you have earned them and many more to come. This was a great video on how to use the blue point switch machines. I learned a lot in this video. I am going to looking the blue point machines. I am still learning about DCC and not ready to advance to DCC controlled switches. Thanks sharing and stay safe. Ken

[@nickbishop6784]

Great tutorial Larry

[@ChadwickModelRailway]

Hi Larry, congratulations on such a massive surge in your subscribers. Quality stuff, regards Charlie.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Charlier-thanks, it has been an interesting week. After hitting 10,000 last Tuesday I added an additional 1200 as of this (Thursday) morning. I am kind of hoping to hit 12,000 by the end of the year. Can you feel me nipping at your heels? It may take a while for me to hit 35K like you. Take care and go get your Covid vaccination-Larry

[@genebarfield6688]

In your intro to this video you asked how we think you might improve them. Honestly, after having watched, and learned immensely from well over a hundred of yours the only way I think you could improve them is if you had them catered and invited us all over. I realize that isn't the most useful suggestion. But after haunting YooToob for years learning about model railroading, I think you're pretty much stuck with the fact that you're the tops. One suggestion I have is directed more towards your viewers. After I first found your channel I began choosing which videos to watch based on your titles. I do not criticize how you title them, not at all. But I learned, gratefully, that even those whose title does not seem to appeal directly to my interests are always full of interesting and usually important information. Now I watch them all. I recommend others do likewise. Thank you immensely, and don't stop now. Many thanks and all best wishes!

[@TheDCCGuy]

Assigning titles can be a pitfall or perfection. Some titles bring in viewers and others can turn them off. Then there are clickbait titles that promise more than they give or are just misleading. Plus there is the YouTune algorithm to deal with. I have not found the magic method for coming up with the perfect title

[@clee47ford]

Always enjoy your videos. Really hope you'll show us how to wire the BluePoints up to LEDs. I want switch panels that show direction with red/green LEDs while using the BluePoint switch controllers.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I do ‘t plan such a video but you can do it easily using the SPDT switch built into the unit. Just connect the negative or positive legs of the LEDs together using a black common wire and connect it to the proper power source at the proper voltage the use the SPDT switch to provide power of the opposite polarity to the red or green LED. That when when you move the points the polarity will change and light the designated LED. You’ll probably have to fiddle,with the LEDs and wiring to get it hooked up right and you may need to do some reading on LEDs. I think I did a video on LEDs a couple of years ago that may help-its all becoming a blur now with almost 250 videos on here.

[@Detsteve]

Very logical. Great video. Thanks.

[@jamescraft672]

Very helpful. I'm using SMAILs rather than BluePoints, and I'm using pushbuttons that switch them electrically. But what you demonstrated is applicable. One difference is that I can't turn the bench work on its side. I do as much as I can on the workbench and use solderless connectors when possible. Thanks.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I have the same problem with the Piedmont Southern too big to flip on its side. That is one reason I decided to do these modules, they make it easier to demonstrate a lot of the under the layout topics. BTW, the Smails are essentially a Tortoise with an accessory decoder included. I prefer to use Tortoises and separate accessory decoders since I can pick the type best suited for the installation. And if one component fails I am not stuck with 2 dead ones. Sort of like buying a TV, radio, stereo, DVD player all in one and having the main amplifier components die.

[@centeroftheearthmining4095]

It runs fine going straight when diverting it shorts out when it hits the switch.

[@toddgrx]

perhaps a question or just an interesting observation... @11:16 you showed the list for the frogs and which color bus wire needs to be attached. your list seems to indicated switch 1 is black, 2 is red, 3 is red, four is black, 5 is red (as you demonstrated), and 6 is black but when you daisy-chained switches 2-5 together (switches 1 and 6 not shown) @20:14 they all seemed to have red on top and black on bottom. your list indicated that only 2, 3, and 5 would be red and that 1, 4, and 6 would be black (at least from what I could tell) why are they wired the same in the daisy-chain without regard to polarity on your list?

[@TheDCCGuy]

What you appear to be missing is the fact that the 2 pairs of switch machines face opposite directions and that in effect flips the contacts 180 degrees. That is why they can be daisy chained so easily in this case.

[@1701_FyldeFlyer]

That 90 degree angle on the snake should be fine Larry. People have 90 degree bends in RC aircraft wings with these snakes and they work fine. That's a great tip for determining which wire goes where on the switch machine. Should it work the same on electronic frog juicers?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Because the frog juicers automatically switch polarity when a sort occurs you don’t need to worry about which way to connect wires to them. They don’t care and take care of the job for you.

[@garylewis3815]

Hi Larry another great informative video. The blue switch machines look great and straightforward to wire up to the Peco Electrofrog points and the flexible push/pull tubing very effective. On my portable layout I used seep point motors that have been a bit hit & miss getting the frog polarity to work..!!! The Blue Switch Machines could an alternative solution if I can get them in the UK ?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Try Coastal DCC, NG Trains, and Mech Models. And there is always Micro-Mark or Walthers. Heck I buy from Hatton’s all the time.

[@garylewis3815]

Hi Larry thanks for the reply...I will look at their websites.

[@worldissuesmatter1643]

Hint if you don’t want to solder directly to the BluePoint, the TE 61813-1 disconnects fit right on, they are like $0.26 each from DigiKey as one source.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Thanks for the tip.

[@jeffwardlow4626]

Question does the bus have to run under every track or just one bus wire straight through the middle like yours? Wondering which way is more effective...

[@TheDCCGuy]

Obviously since I did it you can do it. However in some cases with branches or large yards it might be more efficient to branch the bus in a palmate fashion.

[@YardGoat2022]

Hi Larry! I hope you see this question, but I have a WalthersTrack switch that has a little tabs sticking out in the side that connect to the frog. Question is which wire connects to that tab; red or the black? My layout is red wire connects to the rail furthest from me black closest rail. Thanks kindly!

[@TheDCCGuy]

That needs to be connected to the DPDT switch located on the switch machine. I showed how to do that in the video.

[@YardGoat2022]

@@TheDCCGuy So the tab is use only with a switch machine and not connected to my main bus line?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes, it is used to SELECTIVELY provide the correct polarity to the frog.

[@nathanpollard7718]

How do you wire the atlas number 4 turnouts

[@basilschwegmann7395]

i think it would be nice, especially for beginners. if you showed that if you touched the light to rails with the same polarity the bulb does not light up.

[@nathanpollard7718]

The number 4 atlas has two side buttons on the frog so which one do I use

[@TheDCCGuy]

Last I checked they both go to the same place.

[@rogerhuber3133]

Larry, The bell doesn't seem to do anything. I've clicked it on your channel and several others and have never been notified of new videos.

[@TheDCCGuy]

What kind of notification are you expecting? KZbin no longer sends emails so what I get are popup messages on my iPad. You also have to have notifications turned on in your KZbin accunt preferences and your computers and mobile devices. Maybe I should do a video on notifications and how to manage them. Let me look into it.

[@rogerhuber3133]

@@TheDCCGuy I guess I expected an email or something as every YT channel I look at they always say "subscribe and be sure to click on the little bell so you will get notification when a new show is available". I thought I'd get an email or something. I wasn't aware YT doesn't do that any longer. I guess it really doesn't matter as I check all my subscribed channels daily for any new stuff so I don't need any notifications. I just bought a large collection of Blue Points and everything needed from a fellow modeler so now when track gets laid to my small town/yard I'll be ready to install them. Thanks for all the great advice, Larry.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I’ll work up a video explaining how to get notifications on browsers and mobile devices, but let me say if you have the KZbin app installed on our mobile device and have notifications turned on there and in KZbin it will give you popup banners, etc. when a new video is published, I get them all day long. Also, if you use the Chrome browser and have notifications set there you will get notifications when it is open as well. And when you log on to KZbin it should display new videos from your subscriptions in a special block. Finally when using KZbin if you go to your subscriptions page there will be a blue dot next to those with new videos, at least that’s how it works on my iPad and I’ll check on my Mac and Windows machines. The main thing is you have to make sure your preferences are set on KZbin, your device, and in some cases in the app or program for all this to work. I know it seems like a lot of trouble to go to just to get notified but people want to control their privacy settings and these are the consequences. But as you point out the best way is to just go to your subscriptions page on KZbin and they’ll be there.

[@rogerhuber3133]

@@TheDCCGuy Thanks, Larry. I only have my laptop. I use a flip phone as my phone service way out in the sticks is terrible using Verizon plus I make/receive very few phone calls. I'd rather spend my money on train stuff than poor phone service! Appreciate the advice.

[@centeroftheearthmining4095]

Why after connecting the wires to the blue point am I hot on both sides. I put the switch in the straight route determine what wire goes where and end up being hot on both sides?

[@wallysmodelrailroading]

Hi Larry, question. What type & size green wire are you using to power your frogs for the blue point with machine? Thank you

[@TheDCCGuy]

It is 20awg solid copper.

[@wallysmodelrailroading]

@@TheDCCGuy is it still possible to use 16 gauge copper stranded? I ask because I have some laying around.

[@wallysmodelrailroading]

@@TheDCCGuy thank you

[@wallysmodelrailroading]

@@TheDCCGuy hi Larry thanks again, I have some white solid copper 20 gauge I will use. Much appreciated.

[@centeroftheearthmining4095]

Should I cut the wires under the switch connecting the frog?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes, I explained all that in video #142 and showed Peco’s modifications as well as my solution.

[@68Jaguar420G]

I'm starting to like these Blue Point switch machines for their simplicity and seeming ruggedness. But when everything is added up, the machine itself, throw rods, fittings, etc., are they really any saving over a tortoise when bought in bulk? You've presented a good and simple checklist for sorting out which wire goes to each side of the electrical switch component . To my eyes the wiring is getting to be a bit too disorderly but my big concern though is that in daisy chaining the feed wires from one machine to the next you end up with a relatively long "feeder bus" with multiple solder joints which is inviting voltage drop. Maybe limit the daisy chain feeders to 3 machines in close proximity to each other?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes, I should have pointed out the potential voltage drops if the daisy chains go too far. In this case the daisy chains are short enough so no voltage drops. The other Blue Points have individual feeders if they are spread out.

[@jhoodfysh]

Another fine video Larry. I am really enjoying this series of videos. I suggest they be placed in a Playlist, which would make viewing them in correct sequence easier. Right now, I search for the word "Let's" to find them. Finally, I noticed when you were soldering to the Blue Point DPDT you did not appear to use a flux. Was there a reason for that?

[@TheDCCGuy]

If you go to my channel page all the videos are listed in sequence and by topics. Right now I divide my time between day to day life, working on the layout, making and editing these videos and answering comments. If I were to add making up playlists one of the others would have to stop. Most solder now comes with flux in it so additional flux may not be necessary all the time. I mainly use it for settings where a lot of heat is required such as rail joiners and feeders and the flux in the solder may burn off before the job is done.

[@jhoodfysh]

@@TheDCCGuy Thanks for clarifying that Larry, I had not considered that when soldering smaller items.

[@davidluff301]

it would be nice if you told what you used for your cable thows

[@TheDCCGuy]

Maybe you could take the time to watch the other two videos 144 & 149 on these and you’ll have your answer, plus there are links in the description to video 149 for these.

[@richardhaan6944]

What do you connect the green wire to?

[@TheDCCGuy]

The frog.

[@MarkInLA]

7:18. Why not change the angle via its hole in frame to be less acute by a few degrees, now, if it worries you ? Split the diff with the opposite side machine so total red snake forms more a circle than two 90deg-ers... I wouldn't use the Xuron Rail Nippers for doing wiring work..Eventually they'll cut rails poorly.. Capeesh ? Your RR looks terrific, as does your carpentry and all !!!...I too am a happy owner of the NCE PowerCab !! M, Los Angeles

[@TheDCCGuy]

I considered that but doing so changes the other angles and creates a sharper one in at least one other location.

[@JSGregg]

Thanks Larry, excellent demonstration. If you can't tell, I'm binge-watching your videos haha. Last comment/question: Would this method work using the continuity mode on the meter instead (if the meter has one)? It might be nice to have an audible indication.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I do usually use the continuity buzzer approach myself as it makes it easier to listen for the connection than to watch the meter and what you are doing.

[@JSGregg]

Ok, I wasn't sure if there'd be too much resistance for the buzzer to work. That's good to know!

[@billbarnes8192]

Larry, do you use a separate buss for your switches?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Yes and no. I do not use DCC commands to control my accessory decoders so they are not connected to the DCC power bus. However I do use a separate 12VDC power bus for my accessory decoders and other DC power needs such as lights. On my list of future video topics I do plan one on using a separate power bus for accessory decoders.

[@centeroftheearthmining4095]

Where do you connect the green wire to the switch?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Do you mean the switch on the Blue Point or the turnout?

[@centeroftheearthmining4095]

Where did you soldier the wire to the switch. I really like this method. Peco supplies the wire from the frog so is that where you soldier it

[@TheDCCGuy]

It sound like you mea on where on the turnout did I solder the green wire that is connected to the switch on the Blu Point. On a Peco turnout it should be connected to the wire the provide tor electrifying the frog. On other types of turnouts this will differ and on some I have had to solder the wire to the side of the frog itself. As I remember the Peco instructions cover this.

[@larryschmitt2513]

Where does the green wire attach?

[@TheDCCGuy]

In this video at 8:56 I said the green wires go to the frogs. These were connected to all the frogs in the previous video I did on installing turnouts. You need to watch the whole series.

[@MrMelston1777]

@@TheDCCGuy That's interesting. I had the same question. I watched the previous video on Blue Points and don't remember that, either. In any case, this is my new favorite channel on KZbin!

[@40093jjmia]

To save yourself time but risk just get a disc grinder and cut a very tiny small cut through the polarity of the two rails where it meets at an arrow saved me money and time. Literally not kidding. It is a risk bc u could completely ruin the switch but hey if they could just do that to begin with It would be very easier to setup. I get some railroaders want to press a button and have the switch automatically go but I feel more realism if u manually operate the switch.

[@parmadj]

Where is the green wire connected to?

[@TheDCCGuy]

It goes to the frog.

[@parmadj]

@@TheDCCGuy Can you tell me exactly where on the frog?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Depends on the turnout. Some have attached wires, some have solder spots, some have no provisions and you must solder to the side of the rail.

[@centeroftheearthmining4095]

Never mind I wired to the track to the blue point. I did it backwards ugh!!!!

[@centeroftheearthmining4095]

No joy! Still shorts out! I’m at a loss!

[@deanpurcell7771]

Shouldn't be a problem finding a choke cable from a '51 Chevy 😂😂

[@TheDCCGuy]

My first car.