You May Have Already Agreed to Arbitrate Your Claim With LG

[@EvilGrin]

There already have been cases where manufacturers started begging customers to join a class action because they were drowning in arbitrations.

[@Nickle314]

Exactly. The I'm Spartacus approach to litigation

[@EwanMarshall]

and a load of employment/contracting cases too, ride sharing app companies found out the hard way.

[@TheGayestAspen]

Always remember- if you have a problem- other people probably have the same problem! Find them, and either convince them to do the same, or just collect evidence from them

[@JohnDoe-qz1ql]

You get next to nothing in class actions, so they still win

[@michaelmoorrees3585]

@@JohnDoe-qz1ql - You get a coupon, for a discount, on the thing you don't want anymore !

[@Voltaic_Fire]

I hate those "by using this product" things, such agreements really should demand a signature.

[@ehsnils]

So hypothetically if my wife uses the product but I don't then I have a free option to bring them to court?

[@banditone7896]

I don't understand how a contract (the agreement to arbitration) can be enforced without positive affirmation of agreement. With software, you have to actively check a box or click a button. If I slip a note in a stack of papers that I just hand you, that shouldn't mean that you agree to whatever I wrote on that note.

[@Adam_Boots]

It's not the worst I've heard of. The worst was one which you got the documentation in a sealed pack and had a sticker saying that if you opened the pack you agreed to be bound by the terms in the documents. You obviously were unable to read the terms due to being sealed.

[@ehsnils]

@@Adam_Boots That would have invalidated the terms whete I live.

[@tyree9055]

@Bandit One78 Wait until all of the products have computer software installed with bluetooth and waiver forms pre-installed that you have to check off before using it (but after purchasing it). You can either give up your rights, or pay to return it... 🤔

[@disenfranchisedrealist4433]

I remember long ago being told that a "use of our product is consent" agreements never held up in court. It sounds like those days are over in our insane world today.

[@1Outis1]

It sounds like they're not notifying the buyers before they buy the product, so wouldn't this be something like a bait and switch?

[@dontdoxmebro]

@@1Outis1 I doubt it. You don’t agree to google or apples terms of use you can’t use their phone, and I doubt most vendors will allow you to return an electronic once open

[@1Outis1]

@@dontdoxmebro That's my point though, if you buy the product and then they spring terms of service on you, there should be a law against that. I'm saying that they should present you with the terms of service before you buy the product. That way you can decide whether or not to buy the product based on the terms of service.

[@sabinrawr]

"Usage implies consent" works in digital media, mostly because you have to affirmatively indicate that you understand the terms and agree to them. What LGE is doing here is equivalent to a sign saying, "by entering this building, you agree..." But the sign is posted inside the building, with writing so small that it is indistinguishable from decorative wall paper. Most people won't ever know that purchasing a large appliance means giving up one of the most treasured fundamental rights we enjoy in this country: the right to file grievance and seek relief when we are wronged by another. The whole idea of "final and binding arbitration" flies in the face of that. I wonder if arbitrators and/or their organizations can be sued if they are derelict in their duties (such as the case Steve described where the arbitrator came back with a decision that was outside of the allowed bounds). I'll bet that part of the process of starting an arbitration includes a clause that says they can't be sued, but you may seek final and binding arbitration...

[@diggernash1]

​@@1Outis1 Are their terms not available prior to purchase by contacting the manufacturer? I think the sophistication and effort of consumers is rapidly declining, as they abdicate their personal protection to others

[@rgnestle]

That's like the Simpsons Episode where Marge is reading a letter she has been given and it says, "By reading this letter out loud, you have waived any legal responsibility on our part in perpetuity throughout the universe." I am not sure FORCED COMPLIANCE AFTER THE FACT is enforceable. Wow! 😅

[@melissabrown8878]

Exactly.

[@hifiandrew]

our SCOTUS is so corrupt they have zero common sense, it's all about protecting big business. By the way, the Arbitration Act passed by congress was never intended to apply to consumers. Thank the court for perverting that law.

[@TheLukemcdaniel]

@@momirregardless8648 I wonder what hand Seth had in Star Trek... And don't forget South Park

[@CoreyRaines]

I agree but the response from LG will be that notice was posted on the machine and even though you didn't see until it was unboxed they will say you could have returned it thus you agreed to waive your right. They know most people will not bother to use the opt out clause.

[@jasonmurdoch9936]

@@momirregardless8648 Yeah you don't think there's some elites out there controlling this you gotta be nuts not to with all the evidence we see on in daily bases

[@txhookey5608]

Wouldn't LG have to prove receipt of the arbitration notice? It is highly likely they could be removed in transportation and the distribution process. The first question in a lawsuit would be asking them to provide a signed agreement for arbitration.

[@LoneTiger]

So if I put a sign on my house door that reads "By entering this home, you waive all your rights to legal action against the homeowner, this supersedes any and all previous rights in perpetuity and thereof." and that is binding if they step inside?

[@alanmcentee9457]

You would think, but they include the rider that the "use" of the product implies your acceptance of the agreement. I would think that if the retailer is included in the lawsuit would take the arbitrator out of the picture. That may not be fair to the retailer, but they are responsible for the useability of the product. The retailer could then include the manufacturer as a third party.

[@mytech6779]

There may also be fine print on the payment page.

[@goldenhate6649]

​@TOOUTOO I mean, using facebook is just asking to havr your information sold to the highest bidder. Then again, Meta is just another branch of the US government at this point.

[@JohnDoe-qz1ql]

@@goldenhate6649 They may be in cahoots, but it is definitely not a branch of the govt...

[@DonDegidio]

Hi Steve, I will never go to binding arbitration and I will tell you why. It was for a personal injury arbitration and both attorneys agreed the limits would be between $30,000 and $80,000. My mistake, at the time of arbitration, was to have my attorney suggest we split the difference. What happened was the arbitrator decided a week later to award me an amount of $13,000 and change by using some kind of formula. My attorney was livid when he was informed of the decision, but there was nothing that could be done. He had asked the arbitrator if he had read the court record about the limits and he did not. He asked the arbitrator if he would amend the decision, now that he was aware of the limits, and he refused. Case closed.

[@Unsensitive]

Sue your lawyer for malpractice, failure to provide legal services that meet the minimum legal standard of "reading the documents"

[@claws61821]

@@Unsensitive It wasn't his lawyer that didn't read them, it was the arbitrator standing in place for a judge.

[@jonathanb1949]

This sounds illegal to me. If I had a claim against LG I'd ask the judge to wave the arbitration. You should be allowed to opt out whenever you find out about the arbitration.

[@petnaby]

I'd love to see this upheld in court. They get their item and then see that if they don't agree with the arbitration they have to return the product which they may have to pay out of their own pocket for return shipping and are still out of the washing machine. It's obviously not "blackmail" but I struggle to find a more apt word for this situation.

[@angrydragonslayer]

@@petnaby if i got one of these with a product, i'd tell the retailer to take it back at their cost and return my money

[@garyschoolcraft587]

@@petnaby The word you are looking for is extortion or coercion.

[@darrinrebagliati5365]

That's why they put it on the sticker on the product that you have to remove to use the product. Also why you should read the warranty before you use or maybe even buy the product.

[@seeigecannon]

What would be really fun is to watch a judge find out about the arbitration clause when their fancy new appliance breaks a month and a day after purchase.

[@D-B-Cooper]

In the 1950s the owner’s manual of a car told you how to adjust the valves, today they tell you not to drink the contents of the battery.

[@CosRacecar]

Yes. Because back in the 50s someone drank the contents of the battery. Those notices didn't appear overnight. They stem from things idiots did in the past.

[@nunyabidness3075]

@@CosRacecar Yes, and the reason people post that fact is that the solution we adopted has seemingly resulted in more lawyers, more idiots, and more costs due to disagreements. And yet, we still have people thinking the solution is not personal responsibility, but more and more legal costs.

[@Elucidus4]

@@CosRacecar Let's not forget that they often say third-party repair is dangerous and a violation of their IP rights. Appliances used to last more than a generation, now you are lucky to get 5 years.

[@REALBanannaman]

Demographics explains why

[@nunyabidness3075]

@@REALBanannaman I don’t believe it does. What do you mean?

[@alanmcentee9457]

Whenever a dispute is settled behind a curtain, rest assured, the justice was owned by the bigger guy.

[@TexasScout]

So, let me get this straight. LG is paying for the arbitration. The company that is arbitrating has a pretty good incentive to decide things and LG favor if they wanna keep on getting money from LG, correct? Attaching that disclaimer directly to the appliance tells a lot about the quality of LG products

[@marcfruchtman9473]

Wouldn't arbitration have to be paid for ... before the arbitration case was settled ? LG has to pay regardless of whether or not it was decided in their favor. So, I would say, the fact that LG is paying is actually quite a benefit to the individual customer. The purpose seems to be to prevent large multi-million dollar class action law suits.

[@ztmackin]

@@marcfruchtman9473 if enough people go to arbitration, they also have to pay for EACH case, which can bankrupt a company more than a classaction

[@EwanMarshall]

until there is a major problem that needs a few hundred or thousand arbitrations.... Then LG will learn why class actions in ordinary court actually benefits them. Class action attorneys have walked into arbitrators and filed a whole stack of these arbitrations against corporations a few times now. Lyft and Uber have both been forced to pay for thousands of worker arbitration cases, both asked the court to let them out and appealed, and the courts said, you wanted individual arbitration, sucks to be you.

[@TexasScout]

@@marcfruchtman9473 You missed the point. LG contracts with the arbitration corp, if LG starts losing, how long before the contract is NOT renewed?

[@marcfruchtman9473]

@@TexasScout Let's assume that both parties want Arbitration. What then would be a better option for the customer instead of having the company pay for it? Perhaps the right to choose the arbitrator? Contracts with arbitration clauses also often have the accusing party front the bill, so I think it is better for the customer when a big business foots the bill. But, if you are implying that the arbitration is "a scam"... then there would be a legal recourse for that.

[@JonathanMandrake]

I can't believe they even can do this. I would have thought that such a contract would require a signature to take effect. Even if the arbitrators were unbiased, it should be illegal to simply evade the court of law by making up your own cort system

[@lcarliner]

Unfortunately, the highly right-wing Supreme Court has rules fully in favor of the corporations! The Republicans have continually block attempts by Congress to pass a "Fairness in Arbitration Act!" This proposed law would have put in measures to profvide for true fairness in Arbitration procedures that are not corrupted by special interests.

[@ajobdunwell2585]

@@lcarliner how long has the supreme court been right wing again? Also when was the last time whoever was championing said act had a majority in the house and senate? If you think right wingers have stopped all the good things, you are just drinking the cool aid. All of the establishment is in corporate pockets.

[@Garth2011]

Class action awards are the reason why they do this...most of the time, those awards are out of sight high.

[@jsteifel]

@@Garth2011 And the only one that benefits is the one that brought the suit and the lawyer, everyone else gets the shaft. Like a coupon for your next purchase. My repair cost me way more than the coupon for $50 off the next purchase. I found it hard to believe that I had to buy another POS to get any resolution. I was out a lot of money.

[@Garth2011]

@@jsteifel True that. The ones who brought the suit don't really get that much more than a class member does...just enough extra to make them feel better but its not much more...maybe $1,000 depending onn the settlement. Class winners are always the lawfirms...all expenses paid plus those hefty hourly fees.

[@greedtheron8362]

As much as I've heard bad stuff about companies forcing arbitration, I think the real injustice is the idea that it's binding and can't reasonable be appealed except in the most extreme cases. Meanwhile in the real court system, stuff gets overturned and thrown out for some of the most frivolous reasons you can think of.

[@hansethetooly5421]

this reminds me of 'limited run games' and their refusal to give refunds to anyone. former customers are having to chargeback their cards since they arent even responding to refund requests.

[@MikeBrown-ii3pt]

I can see this becoming more common as time goes on. The fact that companies literally "don't build em like they used to" actually encourages the manufacturers to use arbitration for warranty claims.

[@jcavenagh]

I agree. The common law has developed over centuries. That history is a self correcting mechanism because each case generally moves the law toward a common sense result. And in the courts of most western democracies appeal is available to litigating parties. The main reason I have always counseled my clients against binding arbitration is the fact that there is no appeal mechanism available to address mistakes in the process.

[@johnpublic6582]

"Binding Arbitration" and "HOA"s are the same in that they are an artificial additional layer of government that abuses contract law to screw people. Both should be explicitly banned under legislative action and/or judicial precedent. The Constitution doesn't provide for such additional levels of government.

[@additudeobx]

The "Lay of the Law" is anything that they can make you believe is true.

[@matt45540]

There's an arbitration agreement on just about everything you signed. I've been using arbitration lately to resolve my issues with companies as I find it much easier than dealing with customer service. Not to mention entering arbitration typically implies a threat of future legal action if they fail to arbitrate the issue. Most of them have a time limit associated with how long to resolve the issue before you can continue legal action.

[@Bobs-Wrigles5555]

Ben doing a sneaky peek from the side of the Thai plate, Behind Steve's left ear.

[@realtijuana5998]

At least the Thai plate returned from behind the Hong Kong plate.

[@Bobs-Wrigles5555]

@@realtijuana5998 If you notice the plates on his right are rotating each video as well.

[@GeorgeWMays]

Every family MUST now have an attorney (mom, dad, son, daughter, or unspecified) in order to participate in modern commerce. God, I really love my daughter.... :-) Thanks Steve.

[@machintelligence]

If it has to be in force at time of purchase it has to be disclosed at that time. If it is disclosed prior to use it may be enough to put a sticker you wouldn't see until the product was installed. I suppose you could send the product back because you were not notified of this "agreement" at the time of sale.

[@MonkeyJedi99]

"By selling me a consumer grade product, the manufacturer waives all rights to binding arbitration except at the sole discretion of the purchaser at my sole discretion."

[@Unsensitive]

I would laugh if you got a million people to mail such a letter to them prior to buying their product. By their standards, that would be sufficient, and they need to reply to everyone or else it's binding.

[@DarkPesco]

Is it any wonder given their product quality? After two purchases, equally large in cost AND disappointment, we've decided to avoid the company entirely.

[@warchild1673]

Sounds like I'm never buying products again. When they do things like this tells me they are either starting to take shortcuts or have just settled a suit and are trying to cover there butts. Plus this is some shady crap by anouther big company.

[@voodoorecon8070]

I learn more from these casual videos than I do in an entire day of lecture

[@calebfielding6352]

It would be pretty funny if someone saw that when they opened up the box and decided to sue LG for their money back.

[@claws61821]

And damages for their time. And the ever popular "misleading practices".

[@schrodingerscat3741]

I really don't think these sorts of agreements should be legal unless you receive notice of the agreement BEFORE you purchase the item.

[@hifiandrew]

the corrupt courts don't care. they're find with the whole shrink wrap agreement. remember software companies used to put agreements in the box, when you bought the software? If you didn't are you could return it to the store. it's just gotten so much more insane since then.

[@claws61821]

Considering the wording of the Federal Arbitration Act, they shouldn't be legal at all

[@kenbrown2808]

well, that really makes me feel a lot of confidence in their products.

[@fadingfrost2617]

I applied for a cashier job online yesterday, and discovered that I had to agree to the arbitration terms before I would be considered for employment. This has become common in several venues. I have seen various versions on all the employment applications, as well as with every pre-paid debit card I looked into. One stated that IF I were to win in arbitration, the maximum I would be awarded was $50! (Not to mention having to travel across the US to even get started.) Every new cell phone that friends have had me set up in the last few years. Most, but not all, of these offer an opt-out. Which is a pain & never confirmed. Employment terms certainly do not allow an opt-out. These are a massive offense against consumers, or just the general public, in my opinion.

[@michaelmoorrees3585]

I have an LG Tromm washing machine. It broke a couple of years ago. It may have still been under warranty, but I forgot all about it. Bought a 3rd party pump, online, and fixed it myself. Its sometimes less of hassle to forget the paperwork, and get out the screwdriver.

[@awesomeferret]

You realize you're trying to argue that doing almost nothing is more of a hassle than "getting out a screwdriver", right? The hardest part about a warranty repair is waiting. Are you really that impatient that you can't deal without a washing machine for a week? If you enjoy fixing things that's different, obviously.

[@Vienticus]

If I remember correctly, I think a large case was decided within the past year that said a person cannot be bound to an agreement that is revealed post-purchase.

[@claws61821]

I remember that too

[@thebigdawg61]

Until a few months back I sold appliances and have seen the LG arbitration agreement attached to products. The question I have always had is what happens when the product is delivered. Our delivery agent sets up the machines and removes all the packing materials, installation instructions, stickers / decals, etc. In a few instances I've even been notified by customers that the delivery agent did not leave the user's manual and want to know how to get one. I've always wondered if this allowed the customer to dispute the arbitration requirement since they never actually had the opportunity to decline the agreement and purchase a competing product. There are even some manufacturers that no longer provide a user's manual, if you want one you go online and print it yourself.

[@pan9715]

What happens if the device is bought by someone else (contractor or else) and you were never informed of this clause? Or if you rented a place that had one of these devices in it?

[@graygrumbler4253]

Interesting. Warranty comes with the object & notice of arbitration clause. I recently bought a new fridge and paid on Day 1 and scheduled delivery on Day 12. Day 12: fridge people come and cannot deliver since water tap was defective from old fridge and I needed a plumber to remove old water tap. Day 18 plumber comes and does his work. Reschedule delivery for Day 32. But this is over 30 days from day of purchase and never had access to know about the arbitration clause. So I am stuck with arbitration due to length of time to make delivery? Doesn't seem right!

[@agalerex]

This is what i was thinking and wondering!

[@75Froggie]

My wife and I bought an LG range on 12/23/2022. I saw this video and looked in the Owner's Manual. The warranty terms are on pages 71-78. The arbitration "Opt Out" provision is on page 77. Thanks to this video, I have sent my opt out email to LG within the 30-day window. I have serious doubts about the validity of sales terms not provided until after payment for and delivery of the product, but I suspect that the warranty terms or a link to them were in some fine print or a link somewhere in the stuff run past me for assent at the time of purchase.

[@VaradMahashabde]

My mother's new phone came with the same arbitration clause with opt-out, which required an email to be sent to their office. I patiently await their confirmation notice 2 years late.

[@patriot9455]

You buy an LG through a rent to own shop, do you own it when it is delivered, or when the item is paid off and you are the actual owner. Between delivery and pay off date, is it owned by the rent to own shop or by the person who signed the rental contract. Yep, opt out as soon as it is delivered, that eliminates the surprises.

[@awesomeferret]

The horrible thing is it wouldn't actually be unreasonable for them to not allow any arbitration opt out for rent to own products. Suing someone for being unhappy with a product you don't own is really what would be going on there; think about it.

[@patriot9455]

@@awesomeferret So many ways it could go, all of them could be wrong.

[@awesomeferret]

@@patriot9455 I don't disagree with you there.

[@johnpatrick1588]

LG used to say the motto Life is Good or something. Experiences with LG plasma TV, top load washer, and frontload washer I declare LG stands for Life's Garbage. Never again.

[@johniwan1]

When I'm told how disputes will be settled at the time of purchase, that says to me that the mfr already knows it's product is a cheap POS. That there is also a likelihood of it breaking down and an even greater chance that I will be disappointed. So as a good consumer we need to do our pre-purchase homework and when needed just walk away. The only way any of this changes is if people just say no.

[@doommmmmmm]

only problem is there is no alternative these corpos are working together against their consumers.

[@mjmeans7983]

You must opt out right away... so that the manufacturer can know who the troublemakers are AND SHARE THAT INFORMATION and sell lists of troublemakers. I bet there are no clauses that require the manufacturer to keep that information private. These shrink-wrap limits on a private person's rights by an artificial entity (corporation, llc, etc.) should be illegal.

[@abrsvc5735]

What about the cases where the item is "purchased" on day 1 and it is on backorder until it is received on day 60 say. According to the opt out statement, you have to opt out before you actually receive the item. In this case too, you have no way to complete the opt out form since you won't have the serial number until you receive it. What happens now? Dan

[@afre3398]

This reminds of Dilbert comic strip named "Dogberts tech support" It was published Friday February 12, 1999 if you want to search for it. I can not post a link as the post will be deleted, But the text goes as follows Dogbert(Tech support person): I'll need your serial number, which is conveniently located inside the unit Customer: The sticker tell me warranty will be void if I open the case Dogbert(Tech support person): Well, call me if anything changes

[@buning_sensations5437]

Owned a LG (Goldstar) VCR in the late '80s, it would randomly set recording over tapes one month after warranty ended. Never bought anything from them ever again. Until my now ex got LG appliances; should have taken that as a sign.

[@hhholsteiners]

I strongly suggest both email and phone call to ensure they get the opt out and don't conveniently lose you.

[@cmorris9494]

Save the email.

[@ehsnils]

Certified mail might be the way to go.

[@alanmcentee9457]

@@ehsnils They don't accept snail mail. Although, I don't believe that would be persuasive as a way to deny warranty coverage.

[@ehsnils]

@@alanmcentee9457 I think that a court would see some issues wirh that.

[@byronwatkins2565]

I strongly suggest keep doing both until you receive a suitable acknowledgement from each. Then, save that email response to several safe places.

[@happykill123]

"on an individual basis" time to make LG go bankrupt with their own policy.

[@franciscampagna2711]

Love how companies can customize the law to their advantage.

[@AeroGuy07]

I just had a 65 inch LG TV delivered. I don't know if it's got an arbitration notice in the box, but you can be sure I'll be looking this afternoon. And opting out if it does.

[@lcarliner]

Most companies generally have a procedure f0r opting out, but the request has to be done as soon as possible as sone as purchase just have been done! It is almost always done in writing following precisely specific rules.

[@dand3953]

As Arbitration is usually performed as a private corporate function, the law should reflect that consumers may only opt in to an arbitration agreement, and never be required to opt out to qualify for legal Constitutional protections.

[@lcarliner]

@@dand3953 The blocked Fairness in Arbitration Act would provide precisely this projection.l Another provision I would like to see would be that arbitration shopping be prohibited, just as judge shopping in the courts is not allowed!

[@mechati]

why is it legal that they bind you and put you automatically into this agreement? shouldn't that be on opt in?

[@rgnestle]

I wonder if failure to respond to contractually agreed upon arbitration is grounds to dismiss the arbitration clause and sue the company. That's what I'm going through now with Amazon Flex. They refused arbitration 5 times by NOT responding (and some of these demands were made MONTHS ago). Okay! Here goes the court route!

[@dand3953]

(Presumptive) arbitration should automatically become a moot and unenforceable detail if the demand to impose arbitration unilaterally occurs AFTER the contract has been already been signed.

[@Wyld1one]

ki d of makes ya wonder if they pull tricks like to lock you into arbitration, becaue they know the product is gonna have lots of problems. so... what if said product causes a fire, burns the house down along with priceless art and your pets or loved ones? not saying it will. this kind of legal wrangling should be done in court and not by pre-exclusions

[@davidtanner665]

It would be interesting to find out how this would play, if an appliance was a cause of a fire, and the insurance company for the property sued to cover the claim.

[@AlexandarHullRichter]

The insurance company did not use the washing machine in question. 😀😀😀

[@davidtanner665]

@@AlexandarHullRichter If their insured customer did, and they cover the lose, they have grounds to recover the payout for the insured.

[@AlexandarHullRichter]

@@davidtanner665 obviously, but are they bound by the arbitration agreement?

[@davidtanner665]

@@AlexandarHullRichter That would be a question for the courts to decide. The insurance company has an argument that they didn't have an option of opting out of arbitration.

[@Dryloch]

They recently asked hundreds of appliances repairmen which brand makes the best refrigerator. The winner was none of the above they are all junk. My biggest takeaway was that French Door models with ice in the door are the worst ones. The icemaker is in the refrigerator portion so it is prone to causing problems. So glad I went with a side by side.

[@shaun2938]

I doubt this would be legal in Australia. It's similar to those warranty void if removed stickers they place on products to prevent you from opening them. They're not legal because they can't void a warranty you are legally entitled to and they cant impose new terms and conditions on a contract that has already occurred. in most cases this would be when the sale actually occurred.

[@XetXetable]

Those stickers are not legal/enforceable in the US either. Arbitration requirements in terms of services and warranties are not necessarily enforceable. Just because it's in a contract doesn't mean you sign away your rights. If someone decided to sue LG anyway for something like a personal injury, courts may not consider the arbitration clause or class action wavers enforceable. See the ongoing Logan Paul/Cryptozoo lawsuit where a class action waver exists but a class action suit is being made anyway.

[@RajaniIsa]

I think the “use” bit is (also) so if someone buys it and see it upon delivery for the first time, they can refuse it. Like software licensing being made available outside the shrink wrap.

[@happykill123]

"Hang on delivery man, let me read the terms and service before I accept this package."

[@RajaniIsa]

@@happykill123 some people are fast readers. Others will read all that stuff before using, and by doing so they would not have to worry about opting out, and could set up a return.

[@RajaniIsa]

Also would be good for getting it more than 30 days after purchase.

[@nbrown5907]

I love my LG nanoscreen TV but my brother warned me NEVER to buy an LG washer or dryer lol. They tend to break down was what I was told so I bought Amana.

[@markcollins457]

My only question is is this statement available to you or presented to you before you actually purchase this product or after its been delivered and you unpacked the product?

[@erikwilliams3033]

I can’t imagine any manufacturer including a forced arbitration notice on the packaging. They might as well label it “the contents are utter sh*t and our support after sale complete rubbish unfit for purpose!” They’d be better served getting Tommy Boy to take a dump in the box before it’s sealed and shipped. He did say he has the time, after all! ;)

[@stephanreiken9912]

Law needs to be made where Arbitration is straight up unenforceable. You should be incapable of signing away your right to a jury trial prior to legal proceedings. Or at a minimum require that all Arbitration agreements must be submitted to a court and recieve approval before being enforceable.

[@karenstein8261]

I would argue that as the Constitution specifies you may settle disputes in the courts according to common law that any attempt to “default” out would not be recognized by the courts.

[@kristensorensen2219]

#1.2k👍🤣🤔Corporate coersion into arbitration. This is your government screwing the citizens for corporate special treatment. This stuff is abuse by dictatorial means!! The Fed Arbitration Act is exactly what?!

[@nigelcox1451]

Like everyone else, my first thoughts were that LG were trying to wriggle out of something. But further thought brought, perhaps they are just trying to avoid the silly verdicts that juries sometimes throw up. In the UK, personal injury awards are calculated to cover the actual costs of any disablement, loss of earnings, etc, plus a reasonable amount of compensation for pain and suffering. In the US, such awards tend, at times, to be fanciful stratospheric numbers. That I guess will usually result in extended times as appeals are processed.

[@tzeneth]

Nah, it’s purely to avoid class actions and the reasons listed by the vid. If there’s a class action waiver, you can screw your customers over $10 without any worries because the arbitration will be more expensive than anything they’d gain from it. That $10 spread over 10 million customers is $100 million dollars. As for Jury awards, juries get it right more than you would think (lawyer who has talked to other lawyers about juries). Juries generally follow the rules given to them.

[@jeffreyhowll1392]

The courts stood the law on it's head by first allowing arbitration and then enforcing it. It used to be that you couldn't contract out of a right...

[@skaterlover1999]

Great video!! Always keep and read the warranty as soon as possible! I love the lifetime warranty on products lol. Yes, if claims are being paid by the manufacturer, of course there's a possibility for them to be bias.

[@Patriot513]

Can the warranty paperwork be considered fair notice? How do they know you received it? Maybe it was missing from your package or maybe they didn't even have the arbitration rule when you purchased your product and are now claiming they did.

[@someperson8151]

LG makes terrible appliances. I found out the hard way with a $1800 refrigerator. The refrigerant leaked after a year. The condenser coils were covered in foam so you couldn't find where the leak was.

[@artagain8977]

Yup, got that notification on my new LG dishwasher too.

[@jcbtiller]

How does this work if you buy from third party such as a garage sale or marketplace? Do you still have 30 days to opt put? How can they prove the date of purchase? Or does this only apply to the original purchaser? Does this apply to the bulk purchaser of the product who sells them in a store? Like if all the batteries in one of their devices exploded in a store would the store only be able to Arbitrate it?

[@michman2]

As the years go by, little by little, we are on our own.

[@spencersobczak4235]

Glad I saw this video today. I was going to get a 58-in LG TV this weekend.I'm not buying anything LG now or ever again. Good way to lose customers though

[@kenscott9656]

their product i do not buy anymore after the $3000.00 tv i bought had to be fixed in 10 month and then after the fix 10 month later it happened again and LG said sorry not our problem. Burn out is what happened!!!! only after 10 month both times.

[@tayzonday]

This is so if the LG dryer is installed in a $500 million office building - a cloud camera catches a fire starting in it and the whole building burns down - LG can’t be sued for $500 million by the insurance.

[@jamesodell3064]

If someone else owns the building that burned they are not a party to the arbitration agreement so they could file a lawsuit.

[@tayzonday]

@@jamesodell3064 They may have purchased an unrelated LG appliance for their home, and the agreement’s language may be so broad that its literal meaning poison-pills any effort to litigate against LG in any area of your life.

[@patriot9455]

I can see opting out upon receipt of the new appliance or tool made by them. The other option is to refuse to buy an LG product.

[@albertstephen2426]

For this to stand up in court that information MUST be made readily available to the customer before the purchase of any LG product.

[@souljaboy2384]

In theory, what if you bought one of these products for future use way down the line (building a house or something)? In this case I could reason you might not even actually look at the machine for 30 days after purchase, much less the warranty documentation. Could this still hold then? In my amateur opinion, this feels like one of those things where the company is supposed to have to make sure you check a box or something in order to accept terms.

[@CoreyRaines]

It is worded that way because the notice is attached to the machine and you would not see it before buying the machine. But by using the machine with notice posted on the machine you then waive your rights to court.

[@marcusjames6425]

It's a whole lot cheaper to pay off the AAA to guarantee your judgment than a class action lawsuit. What's wrong with that.....

[@nelskrogh3238]

Now that you have had fun bashing LG, let me add that I had an LG washer that was recalled and I found LG was an absolute delight to work with. One of the best companies I have ever worked with on a product issue.

[@1linkbelt]

I did buy an LG washer and found it to be a good machine. I did actually read the arbitration clause when I got the machine and did send the email.

[@thegreatmrp]

We had a defective product delivered from Raymore and Flannigan and Steve is right. If we didnt have a problem day 1 we wouldnt have known the same thing. You have only 30 days to opt out of their arbitration. They were refusing a return cause we accepted delivery (which took no more than a legit 15 mins) and we didnt find the problem till several hours later but still day 1 and we called. It took almost the full 30 dayss and we got no where to the point where a store manager said we were stuck. We made all the phone calls to corporate etc. We sent the opt out for the forced arbitration certified mail. THE NEXT AFTERNOON they gave us everything we wanted and came and took the product back.

[@LindaG858]

I would send it back. You should be required at time of purchasing to read & sign that agreement.

[@erikwilliams3033]

And be given an option to opt out definitively straightaway. I’ve pissed off a couple of car dealers by striking the arbitration language, initialing it, and dared them to bin the deal that we’d made before they tried parachuting the forced arbitration clause. I suspect that’s why the last two cars I’ve been involved in purchases now have these electronic desktops in finance where you sign a virtual paper and you can’t strike objectionable boilerplate so they get to dictate all the terms.

[@lynchkid003]

Can they legally force this if you're unaware of the binding arbitration clause before purchase of your produce?

[@ateamfan42]

It is not just manufacturers of products that are sneaking these arbitration clauses into the fine print. I have now had both a credit card company and a mobile phone provider attempt to quietly slide these binding arbitration clauses into service agreements. They also make you have to jump through a number of annoying hoops to opt-out.

[@dand3953]

It should never be a private-corporately presumed fact that any product purchasing customer in America has -- without lawfully acknowledged documentation before the fact -- opted out of government judicial review.

[@ateamfan42]

@@dand3953 Agreed, yet here we are, with corporations playing shady legal games to keep their disputes out of the public courts

[@jrc1064]

Just curious since they have a broad arbitration notice. Can you pre opt out ahead of all products?

[@daversj]

Maybe we should just dissolve our federal and state legislators and let private companies write laws going forward. 🤦‍♂️. Capitalism at its finest.

[@keithe2150]

I am blind. What if I did not see this attached or what if I go to somebody’s house and I don’t know this is policy by the manufacturer?

[@kenyattaclay7666]

To answer your first question, the exact same way you receive any terms of service agreements for anything else you buy. To answer your other question, it doesn't matter if you don't know the policy and you will be notified that you need to go to arbitration.

[@keithe2150]

In answer to the first question, I go to the hospital and they had me constant force the song they never try to explain it to me. There’s 100 people standing behind me in line and they just demand I sign sometimes three different places. They won’t give me a copy of it to take home also I’m not asking them to read it. Also asking for a copy is it my responsibility or should I refuse the song? A friend of mine wine simply breaks down I did not read this Back to them all look at the signature and they just keep moving on. I wonder what the story on that would be :-) I appreciate your input and I’m always wondering about this. Have a great day.

[@cmorris9494]

I'm sure LG has "hand picked" arbitrators. It's probably like an independent doctor that the insurance company hires when you sue the idiot that causes an accident. The insurance companies usually pay those doctors 1000s a year.

[@groermaik]

Hundo, unfolded, behind the Thai plate, on the right side of the first shelf of the main cabinet. 506.

[@AMERICANPATRIOT1945]

Steve, since when does any private entity ever have the right to force its own private justice system and rules upon any private citizen? Since when did we grant an exception to the Federal Wiretapping Act to allow big corporate to listen into our communications on the new telephone which is our computers and cell phones? Since when is merely opening a box or using a product tantamount to signing a contract in front of reliable witnesses that states that a person agrees to give up their right to a jury trial? It seems only logical that any judge could put an end to these abuses of totally unelected and therefore nonexistent, unearned, illegitimate, and undeserved power by giant business entities. The US Constitution recognizes a right to sue and have full jury due process for any case worth more than twenty dollars. Perhaps one of these forced arbitration cases would make a great case for the SCOTUS to overturn and eliminate all forced arbitration clauses or clauses that mandate trials in a state other than the customer's state of residence. While business are often inundated with nuisance and frivolous lawsuits which can be ruinous, it does not justify a seizure of power by business entities to make and enforce their own law. We The People must literally ram the supremacy of our duly elected government right down the throats of the rich and big corporate or we will be in for a very rough ride in the not too distant future.

[@nightbest2308]

Some companies delay the start of arbitration and also drag out the process. They are people that have been stuck in arbitration for years with little to no progress.

[@borgranta61103]

A judge might be able to overturn a ruling from LG's arbritator due to corruption.

[@earlwheelock7844]

Sounds to me like looking for another brand ( I have heard horror tails of LG products quality issues). A good freind of mine who goes to your house to repair appliances , and has done this for years tell me NEVER to buy an LG product as it is almost impossible to find parts they will even string you along untile your warranty runs out then tell you sorry no warranty!. Since they are made in China there is nothing you can do!!!.

[@waltstrait5807]

Would they need a SIGNED contract for that to be valid ?

[@hifiandrew]

Nope. the corrupt courts recognized those 'shrink wrap' agreements that software used to include. you open the box, you're "agreeing" to it. All you need for a binding contract is an offer, acceptance, & consideration (money). These days just sneezing on a product or paper constitutes acceptance of a binding contract. Started with Pro CD v. Zeidenberg

[@kepamurray1845]

Lucky Goldstar. Enough said. I had one of their POS washing machines that had more than twenty repairs before it was put out of it's misery. Never again will I willingly purchase LG.

[@kencabanaw4165]

Based on the LG appliances I've owned, (a TV and a refrigerator) I can see why they'd try this. Neither was made "...Like they used to".

[@awesomeferret]

Did you have an OLED TVs? LG OLEDS are amazing until you get them home and realize you can't use them as a regular TV without breaking the warranty. Don't let yourself be gaslit. OLED still has burn in limitations.

[@michigangeezer3950]

Because THEY say so do I have to play along? I can't imagine them refusing a subpoena because it's not in their rules. "Because I said so" usually doesn't work. How would YOU handle wanting to get them in front of a judge rather than battling them on their terms?

[@AlexandarHullRichter]

I have a question, based on what I would expect to happen if there was a major problem. Suppose you buy an LG appliance. It suffers a short-circuit and burns part of your house down (or stuffers a leak, causing water damage, whatever). You file a claim with your homeowners insurance, not with LG, because that's how you would normally recover damages to your house. Your insurance pays you for the damage and recovery costs, as in their contractual obligation to you. Your insurance has determined the new appliance was the cause of a fire. They turn around and sue LG to recover the damages they were obligated to pay you. Your insurance company has never used the washing machine. They have never seen or been bound by the arbitration agreement. What happens then?

[@AzraelThanatos]

The USE part might be a thing tied to how a lot of the packed in EULA's for things were invalidated with just purchases. The real fun is when it's someone other than the owner dealing with this because they made zero agreements there

[@kaynithdarkwater6194]

Sounds like LG is trying to circumvent the law, but counting on people to not know or read the warranties until it is too late.

[@Draksyl]

So glad I live in the EU where statutory consumer rights are an actual thing....

[@randystegemann9990]

A product that needs this sort of statement in the warranty should have a huge warning sign on it like on a pack of cigarettes.

[@muggins9389]

Why would Anyone want to be a plaintiff in a class action??? you get Nothing, and the lawyers get everything...

[@Elucidus4]

I am not surprised, we bought an LG dishwasher in 2020 it didn't last 11 months, they wouldn't respond, and now they say it is out of warranty, we have already replaced it. LG has become a garbage company for appliances. We had actually moved internationally and bought all new appliances, based on our past experience we bought all LG appliances, but after this experience we have already started replacing their garbage product.

[@ImTheDaveman]

I suggest sending LG (upon purchase and yet to use LG product) a registered mail reading as follows; "By opening this mail you acknowledge that you LG drop all claims to Arbitration on my use of (name of product) made and or sold by LG. If I find a cause for legal action, LG will be responsible for all my attorney and court costs regardless of the outcome of legal action. Also by opening this mail you acknowledge that you recognize this as legally binding and will adhere to the laws of my state regarding legal action claims. Thank you and have a very good day. Just pray your product does not cause injury or death or personal or other damages.". Of course, I doubt any court would take this seriously but it would be no different than their Arbitration notice of use of their product AFTER you buy it. It's like getting a loaded gun with a potential hair trigger. I'd demand a refund UNLESS the notice is on the store packaging and/or showroom model.