You don't belong here

Sulyvahn's Beasts are a sign of the Pontiff's insatiable lust for power and also his extraordinary cruelty, forcing even his most loyal servants to become monstrosities. There are some obvious connections to make from their design, and also some slightly less obvious ones, hidden away in the small print.
Song used: Twilight Realm - The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess

[@ZullietheWitch]

Aspects of Dark Souls III's story seem to have changed in ways we still don't really have the full picture of. The model we know as Sulyvahn currently was once the final boss, there's a leaked screenshot of what seems to be a friendly version of the Dancer, and there used to be world-altering ceremonies that may have changed locations in a similar way as Firelink Shrine and Untended Graves. The idea of Sulyvahn's Beasts being inspired by monsters that specifically hunt down time travelers may have implications about where the developers minds were at, which could imply a very different Dark Souls III. Unfortunately though, we can't even be sure how big or small some of the changes were, or if the whole Tindalos comparison was just the fact they teleport in through a cloud of smoke.

[@daruddock]

Sulyvahn not being the final boss despite orchestrating literally every significant event focused on in the game is unforgivable. They got so caught up in wrapping up the Souls universe that they failed to give the singular game itself an identity.

[@Condxttiero]

Sulyvahn definitely has final boss aura, i remember a lot of people even treating him as a "soft" final boss for reasons of being pretty much the hardest boss in the base game at the time. Pretty interesting to see it was a sentiment that wasn't entirely unfounded.

[@jonnyblade3234]

The more I hear about the scrapped ideas for 3, the more I wish we'd gotten that version

[@lazydemon3118]

if you look at all the things you've referenced here in your video, they make a lot of sense given the context of Sulyvahn actually being the final boss in Soul of Cinder's place in the far future. in this context, he's sending his agents back in time to stop you from stopping him - kind of like a dark souls version of The Terminator story.

[@mrwizard5012]

​@@daruddock Right? Instead you fight generic armor guy with every moveset.

[@Bageltheking]

Gotta love mildly threatening notifications from Zullie

[@Vaestus]

Getting texts from LowTierGod himself. "You serve ZERO purpose"

[@syelallouch]

The next video will be like "You serve no purpose" or "Your actions change nothing", and the video will be about how scripted the character's actions are in the Elden Ring DLC.

[@jonathangiese5727]

Nothing will beat “this dog deals 11,640 damage”

[@erikbowers0776]

I was very worried at who suddenly hated me before I saw it was from Zullie 😂

[@jstar3382]

Watch failboat. Nothing quite like seeing RUN or HIDE in your notifications

[@Unleasheddragon]

You know how insane Fromsoft gets with their world building concepts when the possibility that the mutant jumpscare dogs are extra dimensional time travelers in a dark medieval fantasy is just an unimportant footnote hidden in data files.

[@oa793]

😂 hahahahahahahaha

[@ildathet]

or maybe they simply want to had more "cool" concept they found out into the game when they can't take more "inspiration" from berserk

[@lolwtnick4362]

they sound like the monsters in one dimensional space on "Legion" who were inspired by an old song too

[@Blackspidy619]

​@@lolwtnick4362man, those time creatures always got under my skin. I miss Legion. It was such a great show. Criminally underrated, imo

[@zacktheslayer6564]

Are you attempting to say their entire plot is a ripoff of berserk​@@ildathet

[@realkingofantarctica]

"This is not your world. You don't belong here" is a very existential way of asking someone to leave a party.

[@DragonWinter36]

“Thou must returneth whence thou came. This land is peaceful, its inhabitants kind, but thou dost not belong.”

[@greatcoldemptiness]

The word Existentialism has become a buzzword just to describe something that is off-putting and weird and it makes me depressed

[@sodeska66]

@@greatcoldemptiness Thou must bringeth naught but dullness to gatherings of mirth

[@DragonWinter36]

@@greatcoldemptiness existential =/= existentialist

[@bakanur]

when you're too lit to drive home so you simply slide through strange angles of space + time instead

[@kamantariq2513]

Solar mentioned it in ds1. "Heros centuries old fading in and out. There's no telling how long your world and mine will stay in contact." In ds3 we are traveling into the future for the whole game. We are the hero's centuries old, fading in and out.

[@CommentWithnoContent]

DLC aside, DaS1 is more ambiguous about it, since the player observes that at least some of the heroes fading in and out are undead that are seemingly caught in cyclical actions. The world will inherently seem more disjointed when the identity, memory and mortality of those experiencing it is ephemeral.

[@ayatan2147]

​@@CommentWithnoContent that's because the first flame is only fading in ds1. In ds3 it has been put out and reignited multiple times, time got so fucked up that it doesn't even make sense now.

[@theobserver480]

@@ayatan2147 ds2: chilling in painting world of s0me god..

[@ouzelswing4529]

@@theobserver480 I always thought ds2 happens in Vinheim

[@karma10125]

​@@ouzelswing4529That makes so much sense

[@arcticdino1650]

The idea of the whole game being one long invasion is funny to me. Imagine being glowing red the whole game

[@chrismanuel9768]

I mean if you Ember up... you are.

[@fronatomy6280]

Even the bosses are afraid of the Bad Red Man.

[@yewtewbstew547]

@@fronatomy6280 Deacons of the Deep using that evasive summoning strategy.

[@LotusVolt-pf9bt]

"What, still here?"

[@rigorm136]

@@LotusVolt-pf9bt “I thought the invasion would have timed out by now…”

[@Celepito]

Huh, the fact that Untended Graves is directly connected to the main world, and what that means for the Firelink Shrine and everything never occurred to me.

[@kraosdadafusfus8034]

Ingame, the Untended Graves and Firelink Shrine exist in the same physical location, but only one version loads at a time. Apparently, the way to Anor Londo (the original final area) was originally going to be unlocked at the Untended Graves by pulling a lever there.

[@ravioli_826]

Similar to the round table in Elden Ring

[@hearthfire2579]

@@ravioli_826 and the hunter workshop in bloodborn, it seem to be a recuring theme in those game i dont know if there is symbolism to it

[@elikyiael8740]

​@@hearthfire2579legacy of kain 1 did that in a way that i'll never forget, with the uroboros infinity where you confront yourself in the past, in a manner that is so mindblowing that i think fromsoft tried to replicate it in each of their games

[@zackdoom]

@@hearthfire2579theres similar places in time within the cthulu mythos Thus far im surprised the king in yellow has not had a reference I thought sir gideon ofnir was a good but not solid parallel though i havent looked into ds1/2

[@Rick586]

I love it when Fromsoft puts an alternate version of our home base out there in the regular game world for us to stumble across. It's as intriguing as it is unsettling :)

[@mt.crushmore]

I'd say bloodborne's left me the most "unsettled", especially since it happens relatively early and I had no idea yet of what was going on storywise

[@Xan4591]

Finding the old Rountable Hold in the capital was so uncanny. I instantly felt something was wrong the first time I got there, and once I found Fia's room, I instantly knew this was the Hold at one point. It was chilling to see it empty

[@nathanmaxtro1]

@@mt.crushmore It was completely fine with me in Bloodborne because it's literally called the Hunters Dream. It's a non-real dimension that is based on the real Hunters Workshop. It was neat to stumble upon the real workshop. I knew from the very beginning that the Hunters Dream wasn't supposed to be real, heck you are sent there right at the start if the wolf kills you.

[@shadowfire04]

@@Xan4591 i couldn't believe my eyes the first time i ended up in the fortified manor. it felt so deeply unnerving to wander around the empty house that looked like an exact copy of a place i mostly associated with safety. i also didn't know fromsoft did this sort of thing in their games (elden ring is my first 'true' fromsoft game) so i almost refused to believe that it was a genuine copy until i ended up at the sword table where there's normally a site of grace.

[@LoudWaffle]

Never gets old 💯

[@JachymorDota]

In the meantime, Patches not only lives through the entire timespan of Dark Souls 3, but through MULTIVERSES.

[@PeanutGalleryKid]

The bugger's eternal. Heat death of the universe and bloody Patches will be there waiting to kick you into the void.

[@lordish-wp2xc]

just shows a fraction of his tricks to be such a smart mind to over come multi micro cosm of shattered realities just to rob the prized items , i have a hunch that patches is dohmnal him self , the unknown merchant in ds1

[@shelbyguitarmusic]

@@lordish-wp2xc I like to think that Patches is simply The Magic Man. He is Walter O' Dimm, Gaunter O'Dimm, Randall Flagg, Magic Man from Adventure Time. Same character, world hops games, books, shows, stories. Is a trickster, does what he wants.

[@punchthem7913]

@@shelbyguitarmusic HOLY SHIT YOUR RIGHT HE IS MAGIC MAN!! THIS GUYS A GENIUS!

[@fugax_vulpes1797]

The Hounds: "Hey mr ashened one! *You're not supposed to be here* " *lights him on fire*

[@sebastian-xz3tz]

Frog in Eden escenario

[@joshuaxiong8377]

lmao, love that video

[@thexdfacedgamer2306]

If dark souls 1 was considered a "Broken world". then by the time dark souls 3 happens it's just a soup made of ash and dust particles with a pinch of poison swamp mixed into it...

[@grandmagertrude7676]

If ds1 is a “broken world” then ds3 is the “brokener world”

[@AMan-xz7tx]

DS1: The world is broken and its people seek to mend it. DS3: The spacetime continuum just broke, the loss of fire is the least of your concerns. DS3 DLC: Hey loser, grab a paintbrush and a canvas, we're gonna SM64 this shit.

[@TB26]

If Dark Souls 1 is a broken world, then Dark Souls 3 is on its' last leg.

[@snowcloudshinobi]

dark souls 1 is a dying world and dark souls 3 is the aforementioned's mummified husk.

[@lordish-wp2xc]

it actually is if you look enough

[@AdellRedwinters]

Them being time traveling beasts definitely matches up to the cut content where you could change an areas "world state" to various alternate timelines. It would be interesting if the Sulyvahn's Beasts were originally intended to be creatures that would possibly show up in lots of different areas as you flowed through time.

[@apollyon8983]

There is a world state called The Past, maybe they would have appeared there.

[@NightmareBlade10]

Reminds me of the Pursuer. Imagine a pack of these guys following you through the game and ambushing you in places you least expect it! The bridge encounter would've been so much more memorable if you had like three of these guys chasing you down and disappearing once you make it to Irithyll.

[@LuciferonMinecraft]

Honestly, I could see them bringing forward bonfire ascetics, one of the coolest aspects of DS2, and then unleashing the hounds on whoever uses them to try to farm materials.

[@MGrey-qb5xz]

damn dark souls 3 was truly gonna be such a heavily condensed game

[@waltersullivan2727]

Changing world states isn’t exactly how many perceived it. Most of that was just testing by the devs, creating bonfires just let them level up, change stats, and appearances. Which would be implemented in different parts of the game elsewhere. In the Know Video they talk about changing to world and chasing other players or being chased by others. They just didn’t know it meant invasion.

[@zacharysimmons4115]

I feel like I recall from somewhere that there is a theory that the entire game world is the result of, of all people, Ludleth essentially breaking time in order to give the world one more shot at linking the First Flame. The Untended Graves are the original timeline, where Gundyr was corrupted and failed to reach Firelink in time and the world was doomed to fall into darkness, after which Ludleth traveled from the Ringed City (he's a pygmy lord, according to his Japanese dialogue) and somehow forced his way into becoming a Lord of Cinder (possibly something to do with his Soulfeeder ring?) in order to buy more time while sealing away the Untended Graves timeline.

[@wpb5876]

That’s so cool and a great theory! Had never thought of it that way before

[@mcm3adows]

Love it!

[@MGrey-qb5xz]

why would some like gundyr fail though

[@r.s.asangarb5345]

​@@MGrey-qb5xz even yhorm failed

[@ArunBhaskaranEdathody]

@@MGrey-qb5xz iirc some item descriptions linked to Gundyr (maybe his armor?) implied that he was set up for failure. There's some lore guy named Lokey who goes into detail about stuff like that, he has a website.

[@Nomad-bl4yw]

My favorite detail in ds3 is that if u riposte a salyvian beast and it lives..it will stay on its back and start praying

[@monkyfromheckheeheebanana6990]

holy shit, Hounds of Tindalos mentioned in 2024. one of my fav 'weird horror' stories

[@Manigeitora]

One of the lesser known aspects of the Lovecraft mythos that I always love to see pop up elsewhere

[@UCannotDefeatMyShmeat]

God I wish the average reference went deeper than “haha Cthulhu”

[@freshhands9461]

You have great taste in stories, then! Always be careful of those angles, can't trust them...:D

[@jonhy8351]

Sameeeeee

[@dasdasdasdasd5865]

I know them from CDDA, a zombie apocalypse game that's actually cosmic horror in disguise. Hounds of Tindalos appear when you interact with anomalies too much, with eerie fractal text and an insane duplication power. Didn't know they were from the Mythos

[@Mister32]

Why does Twilight Princess have such an exceptionally good soundtrack, even when compared to other Zelda titles?

[@AlInGaP_Diode]

was going for a different mood than other Zelda's

[@maledikt]

Because it's the only one that tried to be different.

[@RynShar]

Personally I'd put it 4th after Majora's/Ocarina and Wind Waker. All have exceptional soundtracks, but I'm a real sucker for Koji Kondo and I like dragon roost isle better than any track from Twilight Princess. They're all very different vibes, too, so it's hard to compare them: Ocarina feels mythic, Majora feels creepy/mysterious, Wind Waker is ultra joyful, and Twilight Princess has a really interesting contrast between warm rustic and really alien discordant for the darkworld stuff.

[@April84012]

​@@maledikt Hard to claim that with BOTW being a thing. It's certainly one of the best Zelda OSTs, though.

[@MidgarMerc]

​@@maledikt Majoras Mask says hi

[@gabbycotto4024]

“They eat time travelers” getting them on a consistent feeding schedule must be a nightmare.

[@LordTyph]

Eh, they always get food when they need it.

[@ghoulishgoober3122]

It happens surprisingly often, or can happen surprisingly easy. I think it might have been a story written by another horror writer but is still considered canon. These two guys take drugs to go on a vision quest basically, and end up catching a Hound's attention. So like even things that don't physically bring you to another timeline can give them a whiff of your scent, I guess the idea is your spiritual body still has a smell the hounds can track. I really like the Hounds

[@LeveledRogue]

Well to be fair, the models do look rather starved

[@RLToughGuy]

I guess it's not just Lordran where the flow of time is convoluted.

[@SeenInMirrors]

My high school was like that, too.

[@tomtlrech1392]

​@@SeenInMirrorsThat may have been the grass

[@YunoStreik]

This is Lordran though

[@cheefqueef6494]

​@@YunoStreikCorrection, it's all the lands converging in on each other 🤓☝️

[@darknessinside9518]

im 85% sure Lothric and Lordran are the same place but in different time periods

[@strcmdrbookwyrm]

I like that connection to Thindarosu not just because of how it hints at time travel, but because it adds a interesting twist to the outrider knights as well. Sulivan might not just be sending them across the world, but across time as well. Which is scary to think about. I also like the potential type of time travel DS3 has. It seems like time itself is worn out and tired, and having a harder time keeping things from slipping through it. Though it seems to me like it's easier to slip forward in time then backward, seeing as things haven't changed too much from Untended Graves to Firelink Shrine, but drastically from firelink to the final area.

[@disastrousdwarf]

As people said both DS2 and DS3 seemed to have at some point have intended to have time travel mechanic, perhaps the Sullivan knights, would have been more present and maybe while you could get around some bosses the knights would effectively be mandatory as they are able to track you through time?

[@duckyduckington9736]

@@disastrousdwarf dark souls 1 also had time travel, infact every souls game has time travel. Dark souls 2 is interesting though since it (and dark souls 3) had been changed from the original story.

[@hairypluton]

Sulyvahn's beasts are actually opossums. I can't unsee it. Time travel hungry opossums.

[@Feasco]

by George you're absolutely right

[@hashimashadoo]

I was fighting some hounds of Tindalos in a pnp roleplaying game last week. I can always tell when they're coming because room descriptions go out of their way to describe the space as perfectly rounded, with no angles, except one small bit of damaged wall or something. There was a magical orrery that allowed us to see a live feed of both the past and the future, and apparently, that was enough for the hounds to come hunt my party, appearing through a crack in the wall.

[@tristancallahan8189]

What game It sounds cool.

[@Gerolanfalan]

This sounds absurd and insane!

[@snkybrki]

Random guess, but was the game Call of Cthulu?

[@hashimashadoo]

@@snkybrki No, it was actually Pathfinder

[@snkybrki]

@@hashimashadoo I was wrong. Pathfinder fixes this.

[@chronix7946]

Man, lovecraftian themes in games have to be some of my favorite content. Eldritch monsters and existential horrors can be such a fun element.

[@capitalism7189]

If you haven’t already you should play bloodborne. It is in my opinion the best souls game and leans heavily into eldritch horror.

[@chronix7946]

@@capitalism7189 oh ya, it's on my top 5 favorite games of all time list. I've done 7 different playthroughs of it. But now that you mentioned it better start another one :^)

[@capitalism7189]

@@chronix7946 it’s also in my top 5 as well. Here’s my list 5. Batman: Arkham city 4. Metal gear solid 3: snake eater 3. The original final fantasy 7 2. Bloodborne 1. Red dead redemption 2. I’m doing a playthrough of Elden ring right now to have a character ready for the dlc but after I’m done I might do another run through bloodborne. If not that then the Witcher 3.

[@DakkaBert]

if you're interested in such things, may i direct you to ninomae ina'nis recent cover of meconopsis Her character is the priestess of the ancient ones, and the song is about her choice between her vow to her patron and her feelings toward her friends. Its very good.

[@chronix7946]

@@DakkaBert don't know the genre name but it reminds me of an artist named Milli.

[@Anthropomorphological]

It makes sense now why Vordt and the Dancer are all hunched over... they're turning into beasts.

[@__-be1gk]

This is the most basic obvious shit in the world that multiple item descriptions will spell out for you the fuck do you mean "it makes sense now"

[@beehivecity]

@@__-be1gk Settle down okay

[@twerpsthree4562]

@@__-be1gk not everyone's a yenius my guy

[@LordDragox412]

@@__-be1gk Ah, I see. You have been graced by the touch of 'Tism, and possess insight beyond that of mere mortals. The inhuman knowledge you see causes your state of frenzy. Truly a fate worse than death, having eyes in your butt. /s

[@boredgamer7841]

@@__-be1gk not everyone reads item descriptions.

[@SkineSky]

I find it interesting that when any of these enemies appear out of the veil of smoke or mist, it's always from behind the player when facing an impassible wall. The Sulvahn Beast at the impassible wall at Irithyll, Vordt at the Throned Door, and the Dancer trapping you in and setting the building on fire around you. They all attempt to close you in to keep you from escaping and then go for the kill.

[@dumbsterdives]

it makes sense with the implication that Sulyvahn was trying to stop any unkindled from completing their duty. He has all these outriders in place to ambush anyone on the way out from lothric, on the way into irithyll, on the way into lothric castle, etc etc. not to mention the minor knights in the road of sacrifices and the castle and archives. just as many obstacles as he could put in front of us at every step. you can really tell he was the original final boss, hes still the main antagonist!

[@SolaScientia]

@@dumbsterdives At least the other 3 Outrider Knights aren't mandatory fights to progress in the game. I fought the ones in the Castle and in the Archives both properly and while it was bad fighting that one in a tiny room in the Castle, the one in the Archives gave me the most trouble. I have no shame in admitting I cheesed the one on the way to the Road of Sacrifices by running past, grabbing the bonfire, and then just staying in the doorway to fight it. I was in no mood to die to gravity because of the elevator shaft being in that same room. I really wish Sulyvahn had been the actual final boss. As it was, he still took me a while to beat. I had the classic experience of nearly killing Sulyvahn on my first attempt, failing, and then spending absolute ages struggling against him. I saw phase 2 just twice as a result because of phase 1 being such a wall.

[@user-tq6tf5wn1x]

Maybe because the eyes turn them into beasts. Most predatory animals use ambush tactics, so it's possible that the outriders think that way. They trap prey and when they have it in the right position they go in.

[@Tankboy-uv3lp]

I really do love how they incorporate time travel aspects into their games

[@pillarmenn1936]

You mean make it the main mechanic? Cause time travel has been sprinkled just about everywhere is the Souls trilogy in some form or manner.

[@capperbuns]

To me the scariest moment in the series was when i was in the irythill dungeon and i saw one of those failed dragons. Like bro, u cannot just make up a being so scary and just let it fester there in silence looking at me. 😢

[@Epsonea_482]

"You're not supposed to be in here..."

[@LordDragox412]

"Trespassing is against the law! Guards! I'm placing you under arrest!"

[@vaelethun]

DS3 really is quite fascinating. I know a lot of things were changed late minute or left on the cutting room floor, but it's still definitely interesting how Miyazaki tackled this sequel, especially as it was clear it was not something he particularly wanted to do. He definitely went all-out on paying homage to his influences, that's for sure!

[@waltersullivan2727]

Idk where people get this idea he didn’t want to work on DS3. "Because of the character of Bloodborne ’s gameplay, its battle style, as well as the role-playing elements, it’s limited compared to the Dark Souls franchise. It doesn’t necessarily mean Bloodborne was bad. However, while working on [it] I realised, I want to [create] something which has a wide range of battle styles, or features magic, or those things which allow players to wear awesome armour. Those elements are what actually made me come [back] to the Dark Souls franchise." - Miyazaki with Gamerant "Personally, the experience of sinking deep into Bloodborne's gothic, cosmic horror made me rediscover the charm of a fantasy setting. I wanted the chance to observe its characteristics from a different perspective. I think that experience could be what makes Dark Souls III feel unique” - Miyazaki DS3 Edge Interview It’s probably because people take his word on sequels out of context and twits it. He doesn’t hate sequels as long as they have substance.

[@Touma134]

@@waltersullivan2727 Everything stems from ds1 being the shit with no flaws and everything else is inferior is honestly where I think this comes from. ds1 fanboys are impressively annoying. I get liking it the most I really see why but so many just have to put both sequels down to get there instead of singing the praises of 1.

[@kori612]

@@Touma134dark souls fans 🤝Pokémon fans Obnoxious genwunners

[@ellisbkennedy652]

I have always loved the idea that Dark Souls III is literally the end of the world, and that means the end of time to, things are melting and warping being pulled together, and we slip thru time as easily as we walk thru fog, and thats why old friends and motifs reappear as well, its not just a callback, but its the very world remembering or summoning forth a corrupted version of the place that really was, or even a memory of the people that were, like how the dragonslayer armor persists, but the man inside, long since lost to a world that is not quite his own, even igniting the fire is a pale memory of the engulfing inferno at the end of the age of Gods, or, whatever we are calling the events of DS1

[@solidmoon8266]

I like to think DK3 was the continuation of the "good ending" from DK1. The world progressed onwards with Anor Londo and the growth of the new kingdom of Lothric and others as a result. The DLC brought more from the past and tied back to DK1 with the presence of Humanity, The Abyss, and the power of Man being kept sealed away by Gwyn with a seal of fire (the "ringed" knights equipment bearing such seals). The Ringed city 100% felt like the culmination and climax to the Dark Souls trilogy, we've found the Dark Soul, and with it, it was used to create a whole new world, which Id like to think is Elden Ring.

[@ellisbkennedy652]

@solidmoon8266 i pretty much agree with you on a whole, any disagreements would just be bickering about the lore i feel, however, i think Dark Souls 1 isnt entirely a direct sequel of 3, 3 is another world, another age of fire, another kingdom, just like DS2 was, and i think that every ending actually piles up ontop of one another, we already know that invaders and sort of, parallel worlds exist, so i sort of think every time you beat the game, you've ended another parallel world, and thats why (i cant remember his name, was it Lothric? The prince of darkness that refused to answer the call of the flame) he is literally just this world's version of us, our protagonist also shunning the flame at the end of the first game, just in this new edition of the world, and i dont think Elden Ring is connected in any way, but i also love love love that at a cosmic level, the very building blocks of every dark souls game is the same, sort of, rebirth after rebirth, thats why stone dragons and certain things remain relatively untouched

[@duckyduckington9736]

@@ellisbkennedy652 dark souls 2 main thing was "no matter how hard you try, your legacy will be forgotten" with even gwyn being nameless and forgotten to time. It was mainly focussed on memories, and also takes place VERY far away from lordran, drangleic wasnt built on top but far away. With the first flame constantly flickering in and out, outside ov their view. Meaning the curse of the undead was beyond their control, and drangleic only had a way to kill undead for good. So it was the only salvation people had, was reaching the throne of want and dieing.

[@ellisbkennedy652]

@@duckyduckington9736 and even that concept is brought back up in DS3, "The world is over, you play in the ashes" ,,, ,,, ,,, id say DS2 is trying a lot harder to get it across tho, DS3 is definitely hitting on some more "its fucking over bro" notes, ,, ,, ,,, ,, ,, , the more i try to type the more im just like "man i wish DS2 was more universally loved", , , its definitely not the best but it felt so high fantasy,, the real beginning of elden ring happened during its development, just the idea that "we need to do this, but bigger" was so obvious in that game

[@Stickweasel91]

It's not a stretch to say the Ashen One is an invader from out of time, because they are a resurrected warrior from the past (possibly one of the black hands) but definitely significant to Prince Lothric in some capacity. Given that every other Lord of Cinder boss character has an Ashen One related to them that you encounter, it's a pretty safe conclusion that you, the PC, are the Ashen One that is responsible for making sure the Prince carries out his duty, willingly or not.

[@eterya2044]

Sorry if I'm being clueless, who are the other Ashen Ones to the bosses? I must've missed that lore.

[@nintilla9973]

​@@eterya2044 Hawkwood for the watchers, Anri/Horace for Aldrich, Siegward for Yhorm. I think that's what OP means

[@mo7074]

this is insane bruh im rolling with this from now on

[@Loop_Kat]

Realizing that this also mirrors how, in Elden Ring, each Empyrean was given a "shadow" by the Greater Will to serve as a loyal servant, but also to enforce their obedience

[@conspiracypanda1200]

I always liked this (very likely) theory because it probably meant in the original version of the game where Sulyvahn was the final boss we, the players, would have beef specifically with him. I mean, as someone who can't parry I _already_ have beef with him...

[@Bones_]

It certainly makes a good amount of sense that Sulyvahn himself may have been aware of potential time travel or warping, as he is the one who instructed Prince Lothric and led to him not linking the flame, as well him originating from the Painted World, which in itself is like another world separated in its own time and space. Perhaps he knew that down the road those passing through time and space would come to usurp him.

[@samanthar.s.2383]

Aldia actually convinced the prince not to, but it would be very in character for Sulyvahn to do that

[@Bones_]

@@samanthar.s.2383 Well there's no concrete evidence that it was either, but I subscribe to the theory that it was Sulyvahn. Sulyvahn is such a big character in DS3 but much of what he does is behind the scenes. His influence is also far reaching as his outrider nights are in every corner of the game, and even from the very beginning he has Vordt and Dancer blocking the two main paths of Lothric castle. I don't remember much hinting at the existence of Aldia in DS3 or his influences there.

[@Solesly]

The Hounds of Tindalos, a concept which might have inspired Sapkowski when he wrote the Witcher books. Specifically talking about the Wild Hunt and their hounds. Super interesting insight.

[@Jarikraider]

"How obscure do you want everything in the game to be?" FromSoftware: "Yes."

[@LargeMetallicFellow]

Makes me wonder if we're actually invaders in Gael's world. Meaning we're actually being called to help him fight Friede and the Demon Prince bosses.

[@MoonlitDesperado]

Actually a very interesting design option for a future boss.

[@gustavorodrigues4899]

​You can fight aldrich as a summon in Anri's quest ​@@MoonlitDesperado

[@RichardHardslab]

Between the theoretical destiny of the world to become an ocean, the implication that the player is in fact a time traveler, and all the themes carried from the older titles, it's both amazing and terrifying just everything that this game could have become and led into

[@Valome_Virtual_Gravedigger]

That's... A menacing title

[@LautrecOfCarim]

Imagine learning that you are in fact a time traveller by suddenly finding yourself transported to some wet basement inhabited by TWO time traveller-devouring giant crocodile things. We can all agree that no one out there deserves to suffer such a cruel and twisted fate, can we not? Right? Heh...

[@enmaranadomusnavacrunatus3788]

I think Lautrec is finally opening up to us...

[@MitridatedCarbon]

Always had a theory that the way the ashen one experiences lothric is not how it' s inhabitants do or how it looks like in real life and we are basically out of phase time-wise so that we can access particular moments in time, explaining why entering certain places from the right angle can bring us to different eras. Physically, the world might look like the box-art and Gael's arena, but to us it changes shapes and form according to our purpose there. The wolves and pontiff's knights might be the only one able to do this. The dreg heap might not be a literal way the world ends, but how the ashen one experiences time and space collapsing from the fire fading

[@duckyduckington9736]

you mean the ashen one?

[@MitridatedCarbon]

@@duckyduckington9736 didn't notice it at the end.

[@PAINBRINGER]

The thought of the untended graves simply being in the present day of lothric where we spend most of the game, and our firelink being in the future is mind blowing.

[@Valdyr_Hrafn]

My interpretation: The firelink shrine the ashen one uses is actually in the past. the firelink shrine you find in the world is what happened because the lords refused to link the flame. you are awoken in the past to drag them into it by force, so it doesn't end up like in the real world.

[@timecage]

I think it's a pocket universe. It came into existence thanks to Ludleth offering his soul to link the flame which obviously didn't work but allowed this small section of the world to exist outside of time so that the fire in the Firelink Shrine still burns - unlike in the actual Lordran where it doesn't because nobody did anything about the fading flame, hence the untended graves. So you drag the lords' souls into this pocket universe, offer them to the (still) burning fire and use it to connect with the "end of time" from the perspective of Lordran.

[@draexian530]

Iudex is the future version of Gundyr. The Champion came first, as did that handmaiden. My theory is that Firelink is a kind of fail safe where ashes will rise from it, and then warp back to the relevant era, until the end of time. I.e. until one succeeds in actually causing the end through the Lord's Cinders and the Ringed City.

[@GuardianOwl]

You are most definitely time traveling at the start of DS3. In the present of Firelink Shrine everything is fine and there is no eclipse. What I can't decide at the end of the game is if you are time traveling far into the future, or if the chaos that results with all the buildings being eschew is you ripping the First Flame *out* of the pocket dimension it is in and into our reality.

[@AlsoMeowskivich]

I love how the game is clear enough to get a grasp that something strange is happening with the world you're in but vague enough to not have it known exactly if what and where you're going to is in relation to what you perceive. The ringed city you teased at in the end, for example, is a good example. It's unclear if the ruins were the real world all this time or by the egg crumbling you managed to unstuck time, or perhaps even be launched far into the future. All you know for sure is that things aren't what they seem, and only few beings last.

[@sodeska66]

Love how you consistently add details to the lore I never even thought of or realized could be a thing! Still amazes me how something even as innocuous as the way a creature spawns in may have been intentionally well-thought out.

[@acuddlyheadcrab]

Holy shit zullie. This is a good one. All the alternate worlds we passed through in DS3.... All the years untold souls, unable to travel via flame-link, lived out their lives, only to be born anew in a different world in a different time. Insane story, if you dig into it. >The whole game is an invasion, if you think about it this breaks me

[@nophion2-electricboogaloo647]

I wouldve never guessed the connection to the Hounds of Tindalos.

[@thisnonsense76]

Turns out that Langoliers/Dark Souls crossover that I've been asking for was here all along.

[@machinaeZER0]

3:18 now you've got me thinking about an Ornstein + Smough-like fight against the Dancer and Vordt - sheesh.

[@aweigh1010]

It's like a full LORE video except in less than 5 minutes and without the monotone hypnosis youtuber voice. Love it.

[@henrikhumle7255]

The way the sky, environment and even the climate changes as you navigate your way through different parts of Dark Souls 3 always suggested to me that we weren't just seeing different places being drawn together by the fading of the fire, but different ages as well. When we skip and hop from place to place, we're not just traversing a warped land, but traversing warped time as well. Dark Souls 1 showed us the first signs of how the artificial extension of the age of fire would impact space and time as heroes and objects from centuries ago (or ahead) occasionally slipped into different moments in time, but Dark Souls 3 takes it much further, showing us a decaying world where physics have long since broken down and different eras collide wildly with one another. People and objects aren't just falling in and out of time, but entire countries are being displaced.

[@Chronoplague]

My favorite visualization of "traveling through corners" comes from Adventure Time of all places. There's a scene where Peppermint Butler attempts to murder a monster hunter and he projects through the corner of the room. It's a really neat looking animation, though probably more of a reference to Dreams in the Witch House than Hounds of Tindalos.

[@pyrowithoutgoggles1610]

That's really mean Zullie..

[@Popeyehere]

My wife left me for my dad, but I got sun bro to balance it out

[@aweigh1010]

Hope that's not true. Very sad if so.

[@MaximillionPegasusJ.Crawford]

Sharing is caring.

[@justsomeguywithahat]

Nah it doesnt balance it. Sun bro is worth like 1000 wives.

[@OQIF87NREU]

Is this a Nice Guys reference?

[@L0rdLexan01]

Given how Miyazaki was previously working on Bloodborne, a game heavily inspired by Eldritch Myths (and which often Bleeds into Dark Souls 3 in other ways, such as faster gameplay and lack of poise), I wouldn't at all be surprised if Sulyvahn's entourage received some influence from those same eldritch myths. Looking into the Sulyvan Spider-Demons, maybe they have some other clues in their AI names?

[@zelda43870]

Do you mean the Deep Accursed? I'm fairly certain those were created by Aldrich, seeing as they drop his rings. But then again, Sulyvahn did allow Aldrich to pass into Anor Londo. Perhaps the enchantment placed on the Black Eye Rings that mutated the outrider knights was copied by Aldrich, with the Ruby and Sapphire rings corrupting their bearers in a similar but distinct way (or Sulyvahn imitated Aldrich).

[@rigorm136]

People who say poise doesn’t exist in DS3 do not understand the mechanics of the game. Poise still exists it just isn’t passive anymore.

[@ListlessWither]

Always loved the Sulyvahn's Beasts design it may feel very "Bloodborne" for DS but for the horrors found in DS3 they actually seem quite cute and amicable in comparison. I'd love to have a small one as a pet which I can't say for any of the other DS3 horrors, lol

[@terra6713]

Zullie casually just, completely shattering and reshaping my understanding of my all time favorite game. Cool. (pretty good video btw, couldn't have figured anything about that out on my own (mainly cuz I do not datamine nor have read Lovecraft's so...))

[@okie7771]

don't take it too seriously, it is a very far-fetched interpretation

[@willybombastic1985]

Cool that they revisited the idea of the Untended Graves in Elden Ring, where the roundtable hold that we warp to seems to exist in a different time or outside of time altogether when compared to its counterpart in Leyndell. Stumbling upon both of these areas was chilling...especially finding poor Hewg's hammer.

[@Acorn_Anomaly]

It's the same thing with the Workshop in the Hunter's Dream in Bloodborne. It's an actual location you can find in Yharnam.

[@patriciapandacoon7162]

I theorize that the Roundtable Hold is a rememberance hewn into the Erdtree after its heyday ended. At the very least, it must be within or part of the Erdtree somehow because when we first set the Erdtree ablaze, nothing else in the world starts burning except Roundtable Hold.

[@willybombastic1985]

@@patriciapandacoon7162 I never even would've thought of that, but that sounds really plausible. From what I remember the intensity of the fire in the Hold reflects the current state of the Erdtree, from when you initially ignite it (where you just see flecks of flame in the upper branches) to touching the Rune of Death (where the whole thing lights on fire). I didn't know that this idea was also present in BB until Acorn pointed it out above. I wonder if these duplicate hub zones would warrant a dedicated video...cool stuff anyway!

[@DanielGarcia-rx3kt]

I'm of the mind that the Untended Graves in DS3 are in the Abyss of DS1. The Abyss is potentially the birthplace of the entire Dark Souls universe as implied by the Archtrees sprouting from within it in Ash Lake. As such one could theorize the Abyss is the primordial waters from which all existence came about. This would include everything from the Age of Ancients due to the cyclical nature of Dark Souls and my interpretation comes from referencing real world influences like alchemy and the occult and some of the creation myths similar to what they tell. As such, time itself would have come from the Abyss. This could be a potential explanation for how the Untended Graves could be in the past based on the Shrine Maiden's dialogue as well as referencing the future when she recognizes you in spite of being in the past. This means the Untended Graves exist in both the past and future at the same time because all of time, past, present, and future, is all pooled within the Abyss, the primordial waters from which everything came. I mean, you even buy Artorias's set from her. Plus, Dark Souls lore makes it very likely canon that time is stagnate and so it isn't flowing in a straight line like it's supposed to but rather pooling up in a sort of temporal puddle thus creating a scatterplot of timelines which is how heroes from centuries past, or future, sometimes appear in your world. This is based on the concept of "kegare" that Miyazaki seems to really like. All speculation of course but it's my canon lol All that to say, the likelihood we are time travelers is very likely lol

[@ericfoltz1979]

The depths of madness one can unravel from these games is borderline insane. Idk if I did it subconsciously or if I'm a dunce, but I didn't think too hard about anything because I was only focused on continuing onward. Defeating the next foe. Unlocking the next door. Finding the next bonfire. Discovering as much loot and paths as possible. Beating the next boss. Ad infinitum. Just playing the hard video game. But that closed mindedness might be what protected me long enough to not go hollow (in lore). Much like how Lovecraft's horrors work. The more you uncover and understand, the worse it gets.

[@BasicallyBaconSandvichIV]

I think time has pooled and stagnated so much due to the linking of the fire that when the fire fades it's nigh inevitable to time travel. Just take a wrong turn when getting some smoked hams from Geralt and you're already three cycles removed, thousands of years of time, real annoying.

[@wahoo2782]

Every time i see those dogs i get flashback to their brothers in the chalice dungeons. Evil, evil creatures

[@astrealbrizbee9815]

Makes me wonder where the Dancer and Vordt were at before we came into their domain. Are they just sitting in their locations in another dimension, or are they teleporting there when their dominion is threatened?

[@ImperialGuardsman2]

I think they're resting in Irythll

[@dumbsterdives]

my interpretation? some kind of dark "pocket dimension" space, probably connected to the Deep since Aldrich does basically the same thing to teleport around his arena

[@chrismanuel9768]

You can see the Dancer through the window outside. She's there waiting the entire time

[@5hyper7form94]

​@@chrismanuel9768 Fucking wot?! I need to see if this is true.

[@ian5766]

Thank you. For the longest time, my head canon was that Firelink Shrine, the Kiln of the First Flame, and Gael’s boss fight were all part of the ‘current’ time and the main game took place far into the past, but I’ve never seen anyone talk about this before.

[@Necrapocalypse]

I haven't thought much about these creatures before but this makes me like them a lot. A lot can be read into the idea that Sulyvahn would create beasts to hunt time travelers, when it's necessary for your quest in DS3 to become one.

[@Solibrae]

Those are some good ideas, I had already heard about the Sulyvahn Beasts being called "Thindarosu" in the files but hadn't thought about any potential extra implications of that detail. Etrian Odyssey II Untold: The Fafnir Knight on 3DS also has a side-quest inspired by this horror story, the incarnation of the Hounds there can be quite scary as well!

[@envoyofrot7046]

Love to see you doing some Dark Souls III content again Zullie. Feels like such a nostalgic throwback

[@WELLbethere]

This reminds me of a bit of text from demons souls, it went something like "the veil of time is warped, with heroes centuries-old phasing in and out".

[@brucebanner52]

"Come along, Vordt" "Are you talking to me?" "No, my son is also named Vordt"

[@colbygarcia8766]

Always appreciate a good Simpsons reference 😂

[@redheads604]

attention, we are out of vordt's set. I repeat, we are sold out of vordt's set!

[@sicksabre]

This video has helped recontextualize DS3 for me in a way I don't think any other video on it really has - I never really considered that the world we're visiting by warping from the firelink shrine might not be literally our own, that by the game's own logic we are the "invaders". Untended Graves never made sense to me in-game until just now.

[@FencingViolinNerd]

Honey wake up! There a Zullie video

[@drebin8477]

i think all of this makes sense why they originally intended sullivan as the final boss before the direction change

[@quickdrawmcgrawww]

Time really do be convoluted.

[@ezzzzyyy]

This makes too much sense, and I haven't even thought about this. It just shows how things can be hidden in plain sight, especially with fromsoftware games.

[@mildlymarvelous]

“Oh, hi Mr. Frog! *You’re not supposed to be here.*”

[@NightmareBlade10]

This video literally changed my perspective about the entire game! I wish you came out with this video before I started a brand new playthrough a couple months back. This would've been mind blowing if I were playing the game concurrently.

[@kamuymamushi5877]

The Hound of Tyndalos reminded of the Dahaka from Prince of Persia the Warrior Within

[@Xanderj89]

That line thing reminds me of the Hellraiser mythos, I wonder if that was lovecraft inspired. Like straight unbroken lines letting dimensional beings appear is a main part of the hellraiser lore

[@neimenovani7256]

I love the video, but is it really time travel in DS3 or is the time and space so destroyed by the constant Kindling of the flame that the concept of time is beginning to fall apart?

[@Mauricio0973]

It's most likely something like that. The fabric of spacetime is so damaged that it leads to all sorts of time crashes, paradoxes, etcetera

[@Shercko]

Dark Souls 3 just continues being awesome to this very day

[@mad127the]

0:01 - "transitory lands" - "Lands Between"? Was it intended, Zullie? Because that did make me chuckle.

[@enelanonimato6704]

what a incredibly nostalgic title for a video, my parents told me that several times, so did the several roommates i've had, sometimes even the teachers back to when i still went to school, brings a lot of memories back, suddenly i feel like playing dark souls 3 one more time

[@outrider8569]

That title roasted me

[@aoneko6813]

Wow...I had no clue that was the type of inspiration behind them phasing out of nowhere. I actually hadn't given it much thought at all. Considering the inspiration, it makes a lot more sense, even if this may not neccessarily mean that's how they work in dark souls.

[@hyp0782]

Elden Ring time travel is more distinct in that. Btw it is quite strange that pontyff not having any time traveling powers but his slave hounds act as the guardian of time.

[@aztecserpent5525]

To be fair, it’s pretty heavily indicated that ol’ Sully hopped into our reality from the painted world, which implies he’s capable of transporting between dimensions. In a sense the DS3 “time travel” may be less about forwards and backwards and more about sideways into overlapping realities

[@hyp0782]

@@aztecserpent5525 that's what also occurred to me but then I reconsidered the facts and decided that time is common to all multiverses otherwise time would have been a plane leading to many problems and solutions of physical paradoxes.

[@aztecserpent5525]

@@hyp0782 I mean…DS2 pretty much exists on the back of paradoxes and the DLC in 3 is literally one massive one so

[@Hedron1027]

“Oh, hey there, Mr. Frog! ……….YOU’RE NOT SUPPOSED TO BE HERE.”

[@Hussman493]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, the Twilight Princess music really works with these videos like butter on toast.

[@losmonosapiens6783]

¿Would a video in a normal Wednesday make me play Dark Souls 3 again for the 20th time? Absolutely yes.

[@ZX-mt2dg]

Zullie, I'm glad you're back. I hope there's been peace in your life, you're a creator, a lore-artist. Never lose sight, hope, or direction, as long as you believe in yourself. Thank you for the 'content' you create, it truly is always a work of visual and literature art. 💜

[@killswitchfate]

i remember the story of the hounds that hunt through warped space! this is the greatest lore uncovering in years!!!

[@draexian530]

Thanks, Zullie. Without you, we would walk in darkness.

[@Vaga-Bard]

Finally I found you !!! Roughly a year ago I came across your video “the agony of immortality” and it was so fkng intriguing I watched it probably 7 times. Then I looked for it again for a whole year and never found it, but i decided to get Elden ring because of your dragon video and always wanted to let you know it was inspirational. I’ve now beat DS 1, 2 and 3 plus Elden ring and bloodborne and sekiro. You’ve made me a fromsoft fan. Soon as i seen this I knew it was you. A simple and distinct editing style. Easy to recognize. Well not I’ve told you. Excellent work. Keep at it. Miyazaki be with you !

[@MadoushiLegion]

I think the rings turning the knights into berserk monsters is a reference to Guts' Berserker armor; even the face of Sullivan's beasts is exactly the same as the berserker helmet

[@AegisAuras]

In The Emerald Tablets Of Thoth, Thoth astral projects to various planets and realities. He eventually approaches a barrier at the edge of the universe that keeps our universe separate from others. As he attempts to pass through the barrier, these entities he calls the hounds of the barrier attack him. Thoth said if the hounds caught him they would’ve held his soul in captivity until our universe expires. The hounds move through reality in “strange angles”. By contract, beings within our universe move through “curves”. As Thoth tried to return to his body to escape the hounds, he noticed that they could still follow him because part of his being was still moving in “angles”. So he quickly fled them by focusing all of his being to move through “curves”, fully entering our universe’s reality again. The hounds disappeared. Thoth warned that only souls that have ascended to extremely high levels of evolution and godliness should attempt to cross the multiversal barrier. It reminds me of something from The Ra Contact. It’s mentioned that our universe is shaped like a sphere that feeds back into itself. Spheres have curves, of course, like what Thoth described. Ra mentioned that souls that have evolved to the highest major evolutionary stage, the 7th “consciousness density”, are able to travel between universes. This also alines with what Thoth mentioned about needing to be of a very high level to pass the barrier. Also, the book Seth Speaks mentions how energy is attracted back into itself, causing a swirling effect. There’s various vibratory speeds throughout such energy clusters because of this swirling. At the outer edges of such systems, a shell or barrier is created that causes the system inside to be separated from other systems, creating a particular dimension or reality. Seth mentions that such barriers are not absolute and can be passed through with a high enough level of spiritual awareness. So maybe the energy in between universes doesn’t flow back in on itself to create these pocket reality systems we call universes. Maybe to a being familiar with a universe system, the flow of such energy feels angular in movement rather than curved. It’s interesting to think that beings not only can travel through this inter-universal space, but some also live there natively.

[@stevesmith9447]

Jeez, "Tindaros" REALLY gives it away - my first thought when I saw the video title was "oh they're like hounds of Tindalos," wasn't expecting them to be exactly that!

[@whatsnewbois9814]

"The flow of time itself is convoluted(Stagnated)" -Solair of Astora

[@spartanonyx7165]

wow. you know it was emilating twilight princess HD that got me to play DS3 for the first time. the art style, the darknuts, the hero of twilight being badass i just had to. and here is a video of DS3 using twilight princess music. i love it

[@KrazyKaiser]

YES!! When the thumbnail said "They eat timetravelers" I was immediately thought of the Hounds of Tindalos, I am vindicated.

[@gnickthegnome1981]

a friend of mine went on about how ds3 was just nostalgia baut, re-skinning ds1. i cant understand that perspective. nice video, great choice w the twilight music

[@grimmSOL]

I always loved how the Dark Souls universe was essentially a time traveling multiverse. In my world, NPC A and B may be alive, but invading or aiding another person's world, they may be all dead. Such a gorgeous and ingenious world.

[@NovaBlueNova]

"As the game does feature elements of time travel in its story" Meanwhile I've played through the whole game and this is the first I heard about this. Thank god for people like you otherwise I'd never actually know the plot of these games.

[@brettrichardson7924]

I can just smell the desperation they had to leave dark souls and go onto better things, I imagine the ds3 rewrite came as a last minute attempt to just be done w it