Awesome

I agree with everything you said!! When I went to school prices were reasonable, and even then I racked up $60k in student debt. The funny thing was I kept trying to pay extra on the loan principal and they kept putting it on future interest. It made no sense to me that I was not able to pay down my loan early. The only way out was I had "purchased" a condo and had enough equity to refinance and roll my student loans into my mortgage. I felt like the system intentionally screwed me over. It is criminal what the system is doing to young people these days. After a career as a newspaper graphic artist was cut short, I now find myself teaching at a pair of junior colleges and freelance. And I have been trying to get one of the school to have a class or even a workshop on teaching students how to make a living as an artist. I feel so passionate about that because I know what it felt like to be "out in the cold" and have no clue how to work as a freelancer.

All American universities are rushing towards financial failure. Their model is to attract students with the same features an all-inclusive vacation resort has... places like Sandals. This raises their costs and their prices a lot. They're also hiring non-productive support staff that does not contribute at all to academics. Combine with easy student loans and you get massive price increases. You can pay for it with loans and you can study anything you want and get a degree, then you get out and that degree isn't worth anything. Same thing happened in Art schools specifically. The schools will all collapse and afterwards there will be far fewer of them. A lot of folks will suffer. Protect yourself, folks. Learn real skills. Pay off your debts. Become self employed and self-sufficient. It sounds dangerous but is the safest way forward.

Just graduated nursing school, $14,000 total.

Lol, nope artisdt don't need to now finances, everyone does! from what i hear artists have no idea they need to learn about everything. geez, i am a Gen X so all this sounds rather silly for me. back in my day we knew successful artist didn't went to art school. but it's not because they wouldn't have benefited but because they too realize it was dumb expensive or because they had no access to one. but they learn same as you from normal regular jobs how the world turns and that is way more sueful than anything else in creting and selling art.

Money laundering is the sustain of the art world. doi you really think people think a shark in formaldedhyde or a banana pasted to a wall is art? real art is limited so they need to create all this other stuff in order to do their laundering.

There's really a lot wrong with how art school financially functions. The amount of people who went to Cal Arts I've heard speak of how the only pat that made it worth paying for at all was the networking, but even that wasn't worth how much they had to pay to go is astonishing. It's an art school. The dean should not be making more than the dean of MIT when they're sending 99% of students into a field where they will almost never make enough to get out of that debt. Where that tuition money goes doesn't go back to the school in a way that benefits the students at all. I've never seen an art school that didn't cost significantly more than going to any other normal university and that isn't okay. There isn't something there that makes the art school worth so much more. I almost made the mistake of going to SCAD and didn't because it would be $40k a year just in tuition and SCAD is cheaper than most art schools

'work is keeping you out of the studio.'. No professor, I know you're not an econ major but even the average person knows that work is the reason I can even go to school.

if you have to pay to be a part of a gallery space be very clear they do not care about the quality of your art

Art school and most liberal arts, imho are useless degrees.

I lived in a large art community in chicago for 17 years. It was the best experience! Artists need community. And they need cheap space. And they need the audience of other supportive artists. And artist led exhibitions. I wrote a newsletter to keep us connected and I organized exhibitions. Just for the joy of it. Thank you for voicing this so well and connecting us. I left for forMexico many years ago now. No regrets. But I will always miss Pilsen. (400 a month back then)

In an ideal world, less driven by money - art school and all educational schools would be subsidised as are many educational and occupational development institutions world wide, becuase its fairer. Simple. It is true many sadly are not. Until countries and communities are the old model of bias -based on relics of so called capitalism, the problem will never go away. Additionally, art studies will alway be the in the catorgoy of 'most prejeduced against' because when they are seen inaccuratly through the lens of capital vs humanities and culture - their worth is misunderstood at best and resented to the point of extinction at worst. The US economy particually for example, fails in so many ways to share the country's common wealth, escpecially via Federal and State tax collection and annual tax revenues redistribution. I say start to politically move left - not to a communist model (note the right is for supporting the wealthy, not fairly sharing a country's wealth and assets) but at least head toward a healthy and fairer social democracy. Good luck !

Thank you for this video! I don't live in the US but I formerly taught in NZ where not only are the costs high but the sector is substandard. I left because I just couldn't deal with the constant ethical dilemmas I felt with watching kids get into debt, being forced to pass students who'd be better off elsewhere, and watching upper management lie about employment opportunities. Despite the fact we have places like Weta here there's still not enough jobs to accommodate the 500+ students in Auckland alone being pumped out from art and gamedev qualifications. It's highly unfair. I got into the industry being self-taught and I am so grateful for that and to not have to carry debt around - it's literally the only way I've been able to build a life for myself now at 40.

For these reasons I opted not to pursue art school, rather I started working regular jobs and using that to collect professional grade art materials, paints brushes and linen canvas. While along the way studying from books and video on how to paint and draw realism. I haven’t reached commercial success but I’m very happy with my work and the smiles I’ve gotten from others.

Real shit U arts and my school last year Hussian both closed.

Hi I went to Cal Arts (1976-1980) Hunter for one year (1980-1981) Then worked at the Johnson Atelier Technical Institute of Sculpture on and off for 16 years during that time I also worked for Isaac Witkin and Toshiko Takeazu I also taught for one and a half years at The University of Pennsylvania. I worked at Dwight Hacketts "The Art Foundry" for three years then in 2000 I became the sculpture technician at The Santa Fe Community College, I did that for 16 years then returned to grad school at The Vermont College of Fine Art (all Marx all of the time) and since then have been full time head of Sculpture at SFCC. So I think I can say Ive been around the block a few times. Community is important, but art is a very personal thing. It's how you spend your life, quite literally. When I finished at VCFA I decided that I would read The Wealth of Nations and Das Capital, I highly recommend both books, I do not recommend reading commentaries on them. To a great extent what we are seeing is the collapse of a Ponzi scheme. We were warned at Cal Arts that most of us would not end up teaching and the situation back then was nothing compared to today. One last thing, one evening I was working very late with Louise Jimenez (the artist who made the stallion sculpture at Denver airport) and I commented that Art was a funny business and he replied that indeed it was, because it's not a business. That has stayed with me all these years, Louise was killed when a section of the stallion sculpture fell on him , he bled to death, but the sculpture is still there, at least for the moment. Be well.

A+ on your video!

1. To be an artist, a piece of paper is pointless. Artists need mentors, sponsors, and lots of time. Go on the dole for a few years, if you need to. 2. Modern art schools fail to teach metaphors, symbolism, ancient stories, and the real purpose of art. This actively stunts students development. They literally lie to students to keep the discipline and talent under control. 3. Being good at painting or sculpting or whatever is not enough for the creation of art. Thanks to the advent of the internet tools and understandings are there and free and none of it comes from youtubers, critics and the likes - it's up to the student. There's no excuse now other than you may not be suited to the calling. Aim for true understanding, if the talent is there, with time and practice you will evolve, not for a piece of worthless paper that only verifies your slave number.

Bravo, I'm going to send this to my community college students so they realize that they need to think like business people as well as being artists.

One thing I found infuriating was instructors that wouldn't teach their "secrets"/techniques or didn't know what they were doing. Then there's the creeps that are there to meet girlfriends. There's a lot of that in art school too.

I feel like this needs to be required watching for anyone looking into art school. I had heard whispers of all of these issues when I was a senior in high school and I ended up not going to art school, it's just a hobby that sometimes makes me some money. I'm able to support myself since I chose a different path but I always wonder how things could be different. PS I immediately subscribed when you said you're from KC!! I am too

This is such an interesting conversation. I went to SVA in the late 90s and early 2000s for a BFA in illustration, and in general I loved my experience. I learned from a really diverse set of artists, my humanities courses were way more interesting than my non-art school peers, and had a ton of resources. The biggest thing I took away from art school is the art of critique. The discourse I see a lot of these days are people feeling attacked by professors and feeling defensive about their work - I don't doubt this happens and it bums me out because my experience was so different. We were taught how to give and accept feedback and offer suggestions without making it personal, and it led to really good discussions. Though I don't specifically work as an illustrator now, these skills gave me an advantage as a graphic designer and art director, which is what I've been doing in some capacity ever since. The thing I will totally stand by is that I wish that I had done this at...24, instead of 18. The way it feels predatory is that NO 18 year old should be able to take on debt without question, no matter the school. Also, I wasn't emotionally ready, and I didn't know it but I had untreated ADHD and it severely impacted my experience in ways I didn't understand until recently. I got my degree, but I always wonder how different things would have been if I had the emotional tools I have now. I actually went back to get a second cert in graphic design when I was 29 and I finished it in 18 months - this was only successful because I knew myself and had specific goals. All this to say, I wish there was a more equitable way to get this kind of education, like Useful School, which is a pay-what-you-can curriculum for BIPOC creatives. The business of higher education is awful but there's something to be said about learing within a community.

This is a good video. I’ll just say when art schools stop offering training in the various art disciplines ,I see it as more opportunity for working artist to provide for those people who have a desire to learn those skills. I teach pottery classes there are so many people that want to learn and play in clay. It’s great😄

When I hear "I study art." - I'm thinking: "Wow, rich girl/guy! Or is it younger years delusion?" When I thought about a sustainable job after beiing a paper pusher for about 10 years. I thought about learning a craft (leather craft). But then I thought how much money I would make and I can't make a living with that. Sooo, now I have a new hobby with yt teaching me this craft... GREAT! (Sarcasm)

PREACH IT! As someone in a similar journey as you: BFA, MA, and MFA in painting...the dream was to be a professor(currently am after 160 applications over 3 years of applying post MFA graduation...yes 160 is correct)and I was told almost an identical lie in every avenue you described as a student, but I know I am lying to every studio major student to keep the numbers afloat for enrollment. I do try and encourage them to minor in something practical like marketing or graphic design, which most do thankfully. Also, another factor to why our professors who are a couple generations older than us is that the art world functioned much different in the 80s-90s when most of them "made it". Galleries were plentiful, lower tier and mid tier collectors were plentiful and opportunities cost less if nothing at all for gallery representation. We were all lied to.

I’d like to know something. Does the RISD cost include living food transportation rent laundry medical may be a little bit for miscellaneous? That is definitely part of what it costs to get an art school Or university education with or without working.

When I was 19 I just started drawing storyboards for local advertising agencies. I never went to art school and have made a living as an illustrator now for 26 years. I also have been showing and selling paintings in galleries. I don’t even have a CV and nobody has ever asked me for one. It’s pretty sad to see art schools promise careers that are just a fantasy.

Great video, it seems some thing have changed since my time in Art School; I think there's one point you're missing, but first some background: I graduated from The Art Institute of Pittsburgh in 2006, then ran by the Education Management Corporation (EDMC) -- I didn't learn anything about the business side of things in the Fine Art world, but did learn about contracts and proposals for selling design services to clients, but not anything really about how to actually be a freelancer; I was on more of the Career side than the Art side, although I did get a lot of variety in my "Interactive Multimedia/Web Design" program, the teachers often couldn't help me when I had a problem in their class. After graduation I discovered the school was unaccredited and my earned credits wouldn't transfer to other colleges or higher programs because of this, thus ending my experience with academia. Now to the point: Some time in the 2010s EDMC send me an email asking me to send a form letter to my representatives in congress asking them to not pass some law, I don't remember the details but I completely rewrote the letter to ask for this law to be passed with the background information I put in the last paragraph; the law passed, and a few years later all of The Art Institutes closed down. Looking back it seems this law was one of the "Gainful Employment Rules" that essentially said that colleges couldn't use predatory practices to recruit new students like promising 90% job placement rates, or that students would earn a lot of money in a career the school didn't prepare them for. These rules mandated that the colleges had to get accreditation and actually teach students instead of saddling them with debt --- These "Gainful Employment Rules" have been expanded since then, to target predatory for-profit colleges -- and that is another reason why all these schools are closing; they're not cultural institutions or educational institutions, they're for-profit businesses preying on the hopes and dreams of Highschool students who've been told College was the pathway to a Good Future -- community colleges are definitely a better pathway.

The art world is out of touch with reality, it's about money. The art world and schools should be designed after business and business schools, you seldom here people with business degrees in this situation. Please cover the discussion of the wealth and the art world.

its thanks too all u woke hipsters

theY closing because all u woke brats why all characters look like her hair style always adding a gay character to every show now ?? these woke artist gotta go

My comments don't seem to be posting, sorry if they show up doubled up later. I studied graphic design but it was taught by artists who had very little experience in the real world. I totally can relate to this lingering feeling of "am I the crazy one or am I being brainwashed?" I was the one who asked tough questions, I was the troublemaker and I didn't get prestigious offers (however worthless) because of it. I am still working on un-doing all the brainwashing in order to find peace. Luckily my debt was small and I paid it off, but time is money too. I could have been working a real job, saving money, getting experience, and I could have self taught myself much more efficiently with books and online courses.

Went to the art Institute of Boston in the 1980s and it was the same thing back then plus some of the teachers were there to f the students. And they had no interest in supporting and encouraging good students because they didn't want the competition. Which is why they were teachers in the first place, they were failures and bitter. I finished school without any prospects or direction. It embarrassing to tell people you went to art school. It seems everyone knows this was a mistake but wouldn't tell me back then.

The super 8 camera and the venus of willindof candle are great niknaks.

This video makes me miss The City. I moved to rural Vermont nearly fourteen years ago. I'm in touch with two people in the Bay Area and make rare trips back. I'm a serious, dedicated Artist. So, I appreciate how your channel sings about Art. Note: I'm venerable. You know: old! But, if I'd known you forty years ago? I would've hung out with you - all the time. I missed most of the pandemic because - lucky me! - I was hit by a car and spent over a year in bed with a fractured pelvis and a broken foot. I used to think, "Hey, no matter how bad my life is, there's always some tragic person who has it worse." Well, I got to BE that tragic person who has it worse than me. Crazy, huh? Anyway, that was then. I'm back in action. My latest obsession: making my own ink. If you know a chimney sweep, ask him for some soot. That stuff makes a super-black pigment that's been in use for ten of thousands of years. There are more people living in SF than there are in the entire state of Vermont. And yes - I've met Bernie. Four times. Take care of my City by The Bay, okay? Thank you! 😸

By the way, your cat is adorable! :)

children cannot legally take out loans

I have attended 6 different universities and have w-a-a-y too much higher education. I feel that those institutions and their professors did not so much teach me anything as that they took my money and set deadlines - deadlines for reading, producing papers, taking tests, performing in class, etc. Thus, I advise anyone starting out to spend your money wisely on your highest priorities and set your own goals and deadlines. Sometimes, those goals include higher education, but again, choose wisely. Go for personal excellence in whatever path you choose. Commit to goals and deadlines that get you away from the bed and the screens. Be consistent and persistent. Finally, I think of two quotes heard recently from high-performing Olympic athletes: "Embrace the grind." and "The will to win is not as important as the will to prepare to win."

Great video! Excellent points!

Arts like painting and music should be hobbies in the new world. You should get a refund. Ai makes better art than 100 artists put together. There are million dollar music studios going down the toilet. People dont buy art, people dont buy music, they buy food first in a 20 year depression specially in a broken economy with greedy corporations running the world. Love the arts, but an arts degree is useless now.

The rich who buy art, sit on boards, and donate grandly to art schools and museums have a problem: Their kids aka the trustifarians. If sensitive Jordan doesn't want an MD or a JD, there needs to be a prestigious, high-priced institution that will award Jordan an impressive degree in art or filmmaking or acting or music. And then sensitive Jordan needs to be given at least a little cash for doing prestigious work in the chosen field. If you, you sad normie, can't donate enough to get a little honorarium coming out the back end of the beast, too bad for you. Jordan comes first. And second. And third....

Hi, Thanks for posting this. To me it seems that the closing of schools isn't just happening to art schools but to schools that teach the Humanities. I can feel the corporate take over of our nation/world and it feels soulless. I graduated from SAIC (Chicago) in the early 90's and already saw this corporate takeover happening. I wanted to study 2D arts and Art History but I changed my area of focus to one in which I could find a "job." The school was already too expensive for me and looking back I resented the rich kids. I started to view art schools as day care for the wealthy. Back then, there were no courses in marketing and managing a career. I kept telling myself that I didn't need a degree in Fine Arts but I needed to create art. I don't know what the answer is but this video is a wakeup call to our nation. I'm glad to see so many different artists on KZbin and on other online platforms nowadays because in the 90s there weren't any yet and I felt so isolated. Your generation is not alone and you are brilliant. The current and next generation will find the answers but sadly right now, I think Fine Arts degrees are worthless. However, self expression is priceless. Remember this - No one can ever take your education away from you....Keep up the fight. It's worth it

hooo boy it is broken. remember that Student Loan debt cant be forgiven in bankruptcy. so from the side of Loan providers, it's free money that's almost guaranteed, for the school it's also guaranteed money. they dont have to worry about the loans being repaid. If the system is set up for no risk, the costs dont have to justify themselves and can go up because the loans will always be provided. Of course, there's that Classism again. My advice? Stop paying your student loans. Their poor financial decisions should not be your problem.

Damn, As someone who went to an art school in San Francisco, this is real.

Now considered one of the greatest living painters of all time. Van Gogh died with 1500 of his paintings sitting in the loft of his brother the curator who sold impressionist and post impressionists for a living in a gallery. To think that his own brother couldn’t see his worth enough to sell him to the public and most likely changed both of their lives and avoided hardship and early death for both of them… it’s really just sickening, I thank the syphilitic person of the night who passed along the disease that helped Theo join his brother a year later. Then the tragic death, the sad story, 💩 the art world ate that up, nom nom nom!! As artists we are in the business of manufacturing mind magic. Warping reality so that others literally see it differently. Tattooing for 15 years, very few people batted an eye at my bloody trade, but when I had a canvas out with real paint in the shop. People walked over and said “wooooow!” Like I was performing a rare and strange miracle, every time, often many times a day. To think we live in a world where someone actually painting something decent, in public, is worthy of loud exclamation by people waiting to get holes punched in their heads. There must be something there.🎉🎉🎉

Awesome video. So much truth!

Oh man… this video hit hard. I’m 45, have a BFA in Illustration 2000 from MASSART. I have had a successful career as a 3D artist for various companies specializing in disciplines such as robotics, simulation, and forensics. MASSART was a good school. They did prep students in the business side of being an artist. However, they didn’t offer 3D courses back then. I learned that after college on my own. The speaks to an inherent weakness of higher ed: they’re typically 10yrs behind the curve of technological development and the quickly changing landscape of markets in a post-internet age. The tuition back then was 15k/yr. The ROI was positive. As you stated well in this video, positive higher ed ROI are a thing of the past and this includes non-art schools as well. My children are college-aged now and they’re attending community colleges because duh. As for the value of attending art school, I have a few thoughts. Relative artistic skill level remained constant throughout the 4 yr ed process. What I mean by that is the students who were the most skilled day one were the most skilled on graduation day, and the same goes for the least skilled. While everyone’s skills increased, their comparative work remained basically the same. Secondly, I never received better or more opportunities due to having a degree rather it was my strong portfolio that opened doors. It is my opinion that spending $$ on a degree in art is not worth the investment. People/clients/employers really don’t care about your degree - they only care if you can “do the thing” and do it better than most. This means taking a hard look at your ability by comparing your work with the best and honestly assessing whether you believe you can ascend to that level through practice and study. Techniques can be learned for free on KZbin and through paid courses on sites like Udemy at a fraction of a fraction of the cost of university. I agree with your closing - the world has changed and we must all adapt. Young ppl must not be duped by culture, guidance counselors, educators, etc… Student debt is a poison that is shackling future generations and it is senseless. There are many paths to success that don’t involve so much fiscal danger. I could go on and on! Thanks for such a thoughtful reflection on this subject. I wish you the best in your career.

I LOVE YOU! I am a 23-year veteran high school art teacher in the Cleveland area. Currently I am teaching Career Tech Studio Art & Graphic Design courses for juniors and seniors. I am showing my students your video on our first day of school this year. You are amazing - and truthful. Thank you!

if you want to work in the animation industry, getting into CalArts is like an automatic ticket to a job - to get accepted you need to already have a professional level portfolio (they dont teach you anything you cant learn from youtube and standard animation theory books) BUT you can just go for one year ($60k) and spend your entire time networking and looking for a job - you already have that portfolio, and the name CalArts will get you recruited alone. its stupid, but thats the way it is

Incredible video!! Everything you said is spot on, from the convoluted artist statements to the rich treating art like stocks. I went to art school as a painting major and it's embarrassing how little we learned about having sustainable careers in the arts. The expectation was to get gallery representation and that was hammered into our heads since the beginning. When I was a senior doing my painting thesis my professor told me I paint like a kindergartner, which absolutely wrecked my confidence. It's been 10 years since I graduated and I've barely touched painting since, I always thought something was "wrong" with me but to hear others going through the same makes me feel less alone. Thank you for opening my eyes and allowing me to think more critically about my experience. I believe I blocked a lot of it out of my mind because it was soooo expensive and also because I knew I might've made a huge mistake by going to art school in the first place.