As a Bok supporter I think we shouldn’t get carried away just yet! As Rassie himself has alluded to there are teams that have seriously embarrassed us, when we put 50 points and bagel the All Blacks and beat Ireland on a regular basis then we can be called the GOATS until then we are the best around and genuinely pushing for greatness, in my opinion!!

Of course! 4 RWC wins, champions in 2019 and 2023. Nkosi Sikelel' iAfrika 🇿🇦.

From the outset let me make it clear, I recognise the upward trajectory under Rassie. Hats off to those who bought into his vision and supported his strategy, from the outside- the morale in the camp looks good. Rassie has earned the envious position to experiment with a number of aspects from coaching staff (like Brown) to players (to rotate 50 players in a season is unprecedented). It’s good to see the camradarie amongst the players while completing for jerseys. 2024 was better than 2023 but I still don’t believe we’re better than the ABs with Carter at 10. If we maintain the momentum then I believe we’ll surpass the 2015 ABs. At least one win in New Zealand is a must. Also, a grand slam should be on offer in 2026 to seal the deal or will we peak too soon. As Bok supporters we must enjoy it while it lasts, we have a giant target on our backs. Any self respecting team will celebrate a win against the current Boks. We’re under the spot light like never before. Stay strong, remember; Rassie is in their heads, he’s in their heads 🎼🎼🎼🎼 It’s ok if you sang that last bit

Mate this question can't be asked til like 2050 you watch after Australia they are going to go through yhe same shit as the all blacks the springbok old boys will be gone just like what happened to the all blacks

Has anything changed 🤔

If South African players were not playing for overseas clubs so much, the core of our players will dominate more consistantly.

No. The Boks can do it with the squad and momentum they have now but they have to win a LOT to surpass the ABs. Includes beating the ABs more times than the ABs have beaten the them.

Win/Loss ratio end of discussion

From a South African. In a word, no they are not. They could become. But not there yet.

Also, 2020 happened. But heres the funny thing: while I blame COVID for the Boks not looking great after that, I think COVID mifht have been the catalyst that streamlined our selections and experimentations and might be a contributing factor to us winning the Big One in 2023.

Unquestionably the two greatest sides of the professional era and it is no mystery why they are being compared with each other. How about we start with what is pretty much undisputed in the debate: - The All Blacks has the superior win record, not just during their period of domination, but during the entire professional era. - Hansen got the ABs when they were at a much better place than when Rassie took reigns of the Boks - The Bok side of the last few years will probably go down as the most innovative side since the game turned professional. Now, the hard stuff: Yes, the All Blacks were more dominant between world cups then, but as counterpoint, the standard of rugby has gone up in the last ten years. Does the latter offset the former? Who can decide that? Then we get to the other massive spanner in the works: COVID. South Africa wins the 2019 world cup, set themselves up for an attempted dominant run and then the world shuts down. While there was still a Six Nations and a tournament between Australia, New Zealand and Argentina that took place (all behind close doors) the waves of infections just caught South Africa very badly and the result was a team that went almost 20 months without so much as a single training session together! When the Boks took the field again, they were incredibly rusty and its only because of an ultra simple (and yes, boring) game plan that saw them win the series against the BI Lions. If a direct comparison was already incredibly hard, COVID makes it downright impossible. As a Saffa I'll back these Boks against anyone, but I'm well aware of how Carter and Co came to SA and committed Geneva violations.

All Blacks win record between world cups at the time of their dominance, was just unbelievable. South Africa hasn't achieved such dominance yet.

The 2015 Allblacks had genuine GOAT players in their team.

New Zealand is the total rugby package with multiple WC sevens, schoolboys, men's and women's for sure. There is no competition for that no sorry.

You could have argued that all the nominated world players of the year should have been South African

I think the most wonderful thing about Springbok rugby is the fact that EVERY South African no matter what the skin colour, religion, creed, age groups, whatever...LOVE them unquestionably!! Rugby has done more for unification of our people than any bit of politics ever has!!

The game has changed incredibly in the past 10 years. The clock management and slowing down of the game, the increase in rewards for kicking, and of course the perfection of rush defence, NZ tactics have been exposed on an int'l level. For 100+ years, rugby was essentially a kick chase, set piece battle that nz excelled at breaking up with counter attacking. That counter has become less relevant over the past 2 decades and since refs have been stopping clocks at scrums and lineouts, fatigued forward are less of a liability. There are three instances where nz have showed how they tried to counter the way the game is shaping now, and failed. One, at rwc 2019, NZ didn't select Owen Franks for the squad because he wasn't mobile enough. Now, i doubt selecting franks would've got them past England in that SF, but it shows they were willing to give up scrum parity/dominance for play round the field. Got that wrong for 3 years and finally selecting our best props again. Two, in their first ever loss to the pumas in 2020, NZ seemed to purposely slow the game down at scrums and lineouts, then attempt high risk high reward set plays from practically every set piece outside their own 22. Instead of constructing phase play, they tried to turn the game into NFL. That imo was a disaster. And the third has been the failure of defence. NZ defence got shakier and shakier and finally came right in 2023. It's noticeable from the ABs to SR to NPC level. That wasn't cos no one wants to tackle. It's cos they concentrated on ball tracking drift d instead of marking up. Felix Jones would give a better explanation (and probably disagree with me), but upshot was NZ failed to coach defence for the revolutionised game This all said, i personally think the nzru have cooked their own goose. NZ played 14 tests in 2024. 5 of those were in NZ. It'll be similar in 2025 and beyond. Not selecting from players overseas, the old boys network that run coaching and selections, the players union having too much say (eg the players meeting to back fozzie in SA) and ultimately just the poor standard of refereeing in nz rugby. I'm a former ref (very amateur) so i know it's a horrible job, but i always knew the pro's were far better than me. Today, many seem to be doing a disservice to our players Fwiw, imo nz 2010-2017 team is the greatest ever with the 2013 as the peak (will never forget the Joburg tests in 2013/14). The Boks did not much between world cups, so they've got a fair amount to do to surpass that ABs, team, but they're a great team for sure. If we go year by year, the greatest team i ever saw was the 1996 ABs. The internet's not too interested in them tho

SA rugby is on the rise, no doubt about it!

biggest point the all blacks 2015 had it easier games, only boks and aussies were good at rugby ,maybe england the rest of the world teams were very easy to win, 2024 world rugby has changed ,its more difficult and competitive than 2015 so this bok team is better

gatlands idiotic rule about players not elegible to play if outside wales was as stupid. in 1970's only 2 players played in wales, the rest played for london welsh. NO GRAND SLAMS OR ANYTHING ELSE FOR 10 YEARS. SOUND FAMILIER??????????????????????????????

You got to look at your sound, sounds like you talking in a box.. go bokke!!!

We are the best rugby nation in the world with 4 world cups. Don't need to prove that we are the best team.

In between their 2 World Cups,the All Blacks went undefeated in 2013, don't know if the Springboks have had an undefeated year

lekker video ... hard to say and who really cares ...2 wonderful eras .I Love the fact that The Springboks won 2 world cups in different continents and a lions series in between with very limited prep ( lions tour ) which was insane . It will never get better for the Springboks in terms of a 4 year cycle with the two biggest trophies. NZ team back then were next level !!!

Who cares about womens rugby? Do men play netball?

i am a Bok and my answer is no cause AB dominated for lots of years they could beat any team easy scoring tries for fun home and away SA only on top few years still but they can work on scoring more tries AB whole team was excellent in attack from anywhere on the field and All the players had that great attacking ability.

It's sad. Bad management seems to have left little incentive for Welsh youth to hold on to and to strive to emulate the Heroes. No star-dust. Lights out in the Valleys just now.

It’s hard to say who is the best as the Boo team is still playing and not reached their full potential while in the past the All Blacks are seen as the GOAT. Same as Dan Carter and Antoine DuPont. We can’t call DuPont the GOAT as he is still only 27 that’s why I say Carter is the best player of all time but I do think DuPont will taken over that reign

As a South African this has become a bit silly.We won 2 World Cups and were the no1 team in 2024 but not so flash between them. We've got to at least match the ABs record and beat them at least 6/10 till the next RWC.

You Saffa's are taking the Piss rite... Like every other Rugby Nation you on a Roll as did the Poms in the early 2003s and the Dominant Ozzy's in the 90s to early 2000s, both Great teams in their ERAs... But The All Blacks, They have a LEGACY that literally wont be Eclipsed by any One nor Team, Period.

Kolisi is greater than mcaw. He won two world cups (away) won lions series stacked with Irish players at the peak of their game

I think it’s a fair question, the 2015 ABs are the best AB team they ever produced and this current Bok side is the best SA have produced. It’s natural to ask which is better. Nostalgia biases me towards the ABs as they just never seemed to lose, the roster is a list of all time world greats. But we’re looking at them in the past, this current Bok side is still going and has the opportunity to improve on their record. We can have a definite answer when this Bok golden age ends. If it includes 3 world cups then the answer is clear.

I think the boks need an epic winning streak or a few years like 2024 with an over 80% win rate .

As a South African I will say not yet. If the current team dominate until 2027 and win another world cup then we can probably say they are the GOAT team.

You can never compare the two....THE ALL BLACKS have won the rugby championship a whopping 20 times. Springboks have 4. It took the Springboks 10 years to win back the freedom cup. That's a formidable record the all blacks have in south africa let alone New Zealand. I can't understand why this must be a debate

Kiwis are hasbeens. Sa won last two world cup wake up not even a valid question.kiwis are finished all hot air and crap coming from aotearoa land or kiwi land.😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

Ricardo Goss is a ball playing keeper that Chiefs can sign

As a Bok fan, theres no way we have the seperation in levels like the 2011-2015 ABs created. As it stands, rugby is SA is in a purple patch from Juniors to the top. Maybe only France has the same strength

This is recency bias. Great sides don’t lose at home or to Argentina. All Blacks lost at home in 2009 and didn’t lose another home test untill the 2017 lions tour. One of the great sides yes. But they’re not the greatest. Heck the last RWC cycle they came out with a 70% win loss record. The same as Ian Foster. Recent success against the All Blacks yes. But have only played 1 game in NZ since after the 2019 RWC compared to the 4 tests NZ have played in South Africa.

Looking at the stats, no they haven’t and not by a noticeable amount. This a quality Boks side though but I do feel some of their most influential players are getting bit old and won’t have the same impact in 27.

Yes SA have the aura of champs. AB seem to be grasping at excuses all the time. 😢

ALWAYS BOKKE ....until I die 💚💛🇿🇦

Under Nic Mallet the Boks went 17 tests undefeated. Nobody ever mentions that.

This year? Only 2 days left.

Boks won wc 4 times, AB 3 times.

No, no, they haven't. Still too much of individual egos and ill discipline.

I am not convinced the boks are that much better than any of the others. They win, and they have an edge, but hey are not decimating good teams. Unlike that 2015 ABs team.

How deluded can you all be? They played against 14 men for the majority of the game and won by 1 point, unable to even score a try. How about winning a convincing World Cup first.

This is rubbish .. AB will probably beat us 2x this year

2015 ABs was virtually unplayable. You don't get that feeling with the current Springboks.