10 KEY things you NEED to know - UK CAA Drone Consultation

[@testpilotian3188]

As I’ve said before, absolutely nuts that I will have to place a remote ID module on a 25gram Mobula6 simply because it has a half decent camera on. Won’t be complying, had enough of this. (But thanks for covering this Sean, at least I know I’ll need to find a new hobby in a couple of years).

[@WelshLad.]

That's my hobby over and done with I'm selling up and going over to r/c buggies less stress

[@testpilotian3188]

Don’t let them win, just say no you won’t comply and tell them as such, if enough of us do, they’ll back off because relaxing the rules is better than trying to enforce whackamole style. Just look at piracy, they’ve been trying to stamp it out for years but it’s still as rife as ever, and in the case of the newsgroups, they’ve all but given up trying to enforce anything there.

[@pmcasella]

what about home built drones!!

[@TheM0JEC]

How do you fit remote ID to a sub 250g drone and keep it under 250g?

[@edcbabc]

The remote ID is the killer for me, a showstopper in fact. It may not matter that much for commercial camera drones as they just do what they do, but for FPV race/freestyle flyers, it is huge in every way. Much worse than the US approach, and that was pretty appalling. Worth pointing out that as far as I can see, the wording in the document says the only thing that would be removed for this 50g/100g/whatever limit - if it comes in - is the need to have a flyer ID. I take your point about responding. Yes, one ought to, but what is the point when you know it will have zero real effect? The odd token gesture at best. The thing that occurred to me when reading it, was what are they trying to achieve with camera / no camera, which is a delineator for quite a lot. Eg sub 250 'with camera' needs remote ID. If it's to try to separate camera drones from race / freestyle then they are doing it quite wrong. The fundamental difference is the flying support. A camera drone (from my limited knowledge of them) has a lot of flying assist, it is basically told where to go, and it does, aided by GPS, height management etc. It's job is to provide a camera platform. A race / freestyle craft on the other hand is totally different, it is very hard to fly, a beginner will find it hard to even get off the ground. That flying skill is what it's all about and why we do it, it is much more like a traditional fixed wing craft in that way. What this leads to, unfortunately, is that new camera drone users can very quickly get their drones flying, probably with very little knowledge of what is sensible or safe. This scenario simply does not exist for freestyle/race craft, as by the time one has gained sufficient skill it is very likely one has also absorbed something of what is required in all ways. So I would guess that a large majority of reported incidents are from the camera type of drone, in fact I don't think I've heard of others - though there may be some. This is not to point the finger and say camera drone flyers are feckless, irresponsible and stupid, I'm sure they aren't, it is just that the technology of the craft and the likely use to which it will be put leads far more easily to incidents of the sort that turn up in the press. So, if the CAA are trying to delineate those types of craft, they really need to do it by the level of flying assistance on board, not whether it has a camera or not.

[@testpilotian3188]

The CAA don’t care, they’ve demonstrated that repeatedly. But what I’m starting to see now is a lot more pushback than normal, the vast majority of the comments are essentially saying nope, no more. They read the comments, and hopefully Sean can convey to them exactly how stupid their proposals are.

[@edcbabc]

@@testpilotian3188 yes, I'm sure he will feed that back, but unfortunately they don't care much, because there is nothing we can do that affects them, we have no leverage.

[@JCJW101]

​@@edcbabcJust ignore it, they'll change the rules ten times in the next 2 years anyway.

[@RODPIKERDRONESUK]

Hi Shaun thanks for the information they the CAA will change the goalposts as they go along . My guess they will make it to complicated and confusion around the rules and regulations around flying your drone. They are tying themselves in knots. Keep it simple CAA and easy for everyone to understand. If it’s anything like Brexit they will still be talking years later and making a mess out of it specially, here in Northern Ireland.

[@YellowRoseDrones]

I hit the like button three times, just to help out.

[@Geeksvana]

Thank was the perfect amount, thank you! 😁

[@StickyDroner]

@MrSnowMan btw, a NFZ isn't the official restriction- it's DJIs version. Official ones are FRZs 👍

[@MrSnowMen]

@StickyDroner ThankYou

[@MrSnowMen]

@@Geeksvana Ahhh, Thanks (About 6 miles west of EGLL) Planes are normally overhead at about 2,500 feet by then.

[@ThorTheTitan]

Literally this week I started looking in to getting the mini pro 4 to take hiking as a hobby, it’s a lot of money to me and now after watching this and googling a few things I don’t know if it’s worthwhile getting in to it. Gutted.

[@gimbalair]

Nothing will change for 24month so crack on and buy it

[@504smudge]

I recently got a mini 4 pro for the same reason, no regrets at all.. I’m sure this will all blow over, mountains and molehills…

[@ThorTheTitan]

@@gimbalair you’ve convinced me, just ordered one! Thanks

[@grumpymk1020]

Another excellent and informative video Shaun. My main concern is that there is a group of individuals who ignore the existing rules, if you tighten the rules further then this group will increase. Possibly, newer tighter rules will merely drive more individuals to fly their drones in anyway they see fit without sticking to the rules. People brought sub 250g drones to avoid having to register and get IDs, these people will carry on flying and not bother to register. Does the CAA believe that increasing and tightening the rules will stop the criminal fraternity who currently use drones for illegal flights? I would also like to know if this consultation and proposed changes will impact the model aircraft flyers? Some of those individuals also ignore the current rules, I know because I have seen them doing so with my own eyes.

[@ericwatt1447]

What going to happen to us with older uav to day say ?

[@enriquekramer4590]

What about fixed wing? The same as for multicopters?

[@fredfred2363]

How about scratch built quads?

[@ianfromcorby]

I feel the CAA are making proposals on emotion not hard facts. OK take the test yes fair enough. Geo-fencing not an issue for me, but come on CAA people flying para gliders have less hoops to jump through. This isn't a rant the mind boggles.

[@loc4725]

It's not "emotion"; they've in my mind made it clear that hobbyists aren't welcome. Either fly commercially or get out.

[@ianfromcorby]

@@loc4725 when I said emotion how many drones have actually injured people? Compare that to bad drivers who cause accidents on the roads. Also Gatwick farce a few years ago I firmly don’t believe it was a drone.

[@testpilotian3188]

@@loc4725 someone in government has been convinced by some “advisor” with a vested interest that you and I will be getting our weekly shopping delivered by drone soon and they can monetise that, just like you have to pay a tax on everything. Anybody with half a brain has already worked out this is a fool’s errand and will never happen, but because MPs think in terms of toddlers and tell their advisors to treat them that way, so the advisors just treat them like mushrooms, aka toddlers. As long as we all say no we are not complying / accepting this loudly enough, they’ll back off, I don’t like Bruce (Xjet) but totally agree when he says mass civil disobedience is the way to go now and if the CAA keep doing what they’re doing, they’ll just drive the hobby underground.

[@FPV-TV419]

So... if geofencing is a legal requirement... does this mean fpv drones (non dji) wont legally be able to fly under the new rules? Regardless of weight

[@testpilotian3188]

That’s what it indicates yes. Of course, we can, should in fact, just ignore them and use common sense, they can’t put everybody in jail.

[@smokeysmokerson2032]

brand new to the hobby and this is crazy! from watching what you have covered Sean, my first thought is that if I have to gain a flyer ID and use remote ID then why would I even build a sub 250g drone in the future, I may as well go balls to the wall and go crazy with power which would increase the risk surely! I just don't understand why they can't separate recreational hobby flyng further, there is a big difference if I'm in a massive open field to being within a city? again I'm new to the hobby so prob a lot I'm missing but can't help but think it's down to these stupid auditors skating on the fine line and using current laws to antagonize police and commercial businesses.

[@loc4725]

I'm afraid you've joined the hobby too late - it's finished. The CAA has made it clear that commercial interests are all that matter, even if thst's the detriment of the public and country at large. And that 2600 response says that most of the experienced flyers just don't give a shi... My suggestion: save your money and find another interest, preferably one with a community which actually fights for their rights.

[@smokeysmokerson2032]

@@loc4725 I get what your saying but none of it really bothers me, fpv freestyle flying for 30 mins max, out of the way they won't catch me

[@loc4725]

@@smokeysmokerson2032 Unless you're flying over some farmer's fields in the middle of nowhere, good luck with that! And let's just hope the price of quads, drones, batteries, cameras and props doesn't get too high when sales volumes fall drastically.

[@smokeysmokerson2032]

@@loc4725 I would imagine it comes down to the type of drones, china will continue knocking stuff out but yeah it can't be great for UK businesses and I can imagine they will struggle. loop holes are always found tho.

[@WAR-22]

Cheers mate i will be awsernig the document 👍

[@gmivisualsjason3729]

Another nail in the coffin of the hobby........ Sean out and quite possibly Jason out......

[@fredfred2363]

I do hope that CAA includes the comments in these few "consultation" videos.

[@gingermattb]

Slightly surprised that you did not pick up on the fact that the remote ID requirement they are proposing (a hybrid of both network and broadcast remote ID) is far more complex and costly than is being implemented in the US or Europe. My suspicion is that they are doing this so they can "fall back" to broadcast only, and present that like a concession to show they "listened" to us, but tbh I am no longer of the opinion that responding to these consultations is really worthwhile - just review the RID section from page 22 to see how little heed they have placed on respondents views. No, I personally think the best chance now is for the various national associations to band together and mount legal challenges of these ridiculous, non-evidenced proposals and tie them in knots in the courts, but that will take them going to their memberships to ask for funds, and I just can't see them doing that sadly.

[@karlstamper9243]

You know it!

[@garyd2448]

What will replace the A2C of C qualification and how much is that going to cost?

[@jasonlee4267]

I'm sure it will just be rebranded and cost about the same, most of the rules are basically what we set out for the EU and then never adopted them, we are now simply running back to those rules for the most part, so there will be some additions but the core of the course will remain the same but with a new name. Current prices vary from £59-£99 depending on where you purchase it from, I would speculate that in a few times the price will be higher but not by much maybe £79-£129

[@fredfred2363]

No one is talking about how this will be policed... Just like smoking in your car (also not legal), but impossible to enforce.

[@4WingView]

Hi im a US drone group moderator with EU members. Can you suggest any quick refrence regulation charts? Possibly study material that woukd benifit me. Thank you for your time.

[@scuttsproductions]

I can't say that I am a big fan of remote ID, as it feels like Big Brother is constantly watching us keeping us in check in line. Also, what about the A2 C of C. Is it worth taking the A2 C of C course if you can therefore fly over or near people with bigger drones like the Air 3 and the Mavic 3.

[@troutdoors1996]

Im purchasing the mavic enterprise 3 thermal and looking at doing the a2 for my property inspection business but worried it will be a waste of time and money. What happens after 2026? its bad enough ill only get a year or 2 from the a2 cert before it becomes a useless tool i cant take off. Any help appreciated 😢

[@MrSnowMen]

QUESTION: How do officials detect drones in the air when Drone Pilot is flying in a No Fly Zone eg Near a Large Airport EGLL or EGKK

[@Geeksvana]

Most sensitive location like airports will have fairly sophisticated detection systems in place. They tend to run on traffic light systems for where the incursion is and what risk it might pose.

[@testpilotian3188]

Most airports have a DJI Aeroscope and they rely on that, we know that because some guys I know used to fly rc planes very close to one of the major airports on a weekly basis (with permission), over time that transitioned to drones, but they were FPV, not DJI. All was well for about a year then one of the guys bough his Mavic in, it took them two hours to find where we flew, but the club got the shock of its life when armed response turned up. They showed the documents etc. and the Police politely explained they had no clue there was a flying club so close by and had been operating for so long until dumbo turned on his Mavic and it lit the Aeroscope up like an Xmas tree, in their panic thry didn’t bother to check with the drone team to see if it was authorised and just went out and drive round for two hours trying to pinpoint the location.

[@lindsayheyes925]

I keep putting off buying a new drone because of all this faffing about. I can't justify spending on something that won't have a life as long as a goldfish. SWMBO will give me earache for months.

[@danthedroneman5771]

Well, that's me not selling my Mavic 3 now that I've got the Mavic 3 Pro. C1 let's goooooo.

[@johncarold]

Hi Sean, So what about my toy quads I built. I don't have DJI camera drones, I fly FPV quads. 90% of them are under the 250gm weight regulation. The others are never flown when people are around.

[@Treberon]

You need to be registered as an operator. You need to have your OP ID now. Chances are soon, after the review, you'll also have to have a Flyer ID. You might call them toys, but it's unlikely they'll be considered toys. Not been tested in court yet, well I don't think so. The guidelines are if bought in a toyshop, packaging attractive to children/to imply child use, advertised to be use by children. Etc. I'm guessing you're an adult. So a self built drone with a camera needs to be registered. So any 'where/how' flying restrictions and separation distances will be the same a the DJI Mavic Mini for example. If you fly them outside then the CAA regs apply.

[@testpilotian3188]

@@Treberon under the proposed regulations OP will need to have flyer ID, op ID and remote Id module on all of them. “Complex camera” is not defined so as it’s written, the rules will cover everything from a 25gram Tinywhoop 65mm up to a 6 foot 15kg Matrice class drone,

[@loc4725]

As a traditional model flyer the future is now clear: operate commercially or get out. Painting this as anything other than bad news is either intentionally ignorant or spoken from the position of a vested interest. The CAA has now made it perfectly clear that they have taken a side, one that is in opposition to the public interest and with only ~2600 people bothering to even respond it looks like most of the drone and model flyers in this country don't really care either. Well it was good while it lasted.

[@testpilotian3188]

Or just ignore them and carry on as normal.

[@EnchantedLifePath]

Shaun, what is happening to our Air 2s drone?

[@Micky6strings62]

How would these rules and regs affect me as a flyer. I fly my Gopro Karma, which weighs 1,958 grams. Which class does that belong to. It does not have any built in geo fencing/awareness, or remote I'd.

[@rockbyter2011]

Just so hard to understand all this. Thinking of upgrading my Mini3 pro but think air 3 is a better option than the Mini 4 pro. So hard to find a definitive description of what is/ will be needed to be able to fly as I now fly the mini 3. Do I just need A2COC qualification or is there more?

[@SmallScaleSteam]

If I'm understanding the proposal correctly you need remote ID fitted to things like a Mobula 6 even if you only intend to fly it indoors (where remote ID is not required) just in case you take the thing outside. Since the smallest current remote ID module Flitetest EZ ID) won't physically fit on a Mobula 6 (or similar Whoop) and would add 39% to the weight so it would not fly the proposed ruling is idiotic.

[@davekelly8168]

When I purchased my Mavic pro in 2017 I was called crazy on FB for saying they would bring in legislation to basically make it that much of a ball ache it would kill the hobby..

[@504smudge]

What is remote ID? I’m very new to drone flying, recently got a Mini 4 Pro, getting in a spin over all the rules. I have a operator ID and Flyer ID, not heard of a remote ID

[@craigwilloughby6]

I too would like this information

[@g7rta40]

Remote ID is basically a module on your drone ( it’s already built in to DJI mini drones, although not yet enabled) it will broadcast exactly where your drone is.. speed it’s doing..altitude..etc and will also tell the world where the operator is! (Home point) In America anyone with an app (not just law enforcement) can track you & your drone! I’m not sure if it’ll be just law enforcement over here in the UK.. but either way, the whole thing sucks.

[@craigwilloughby6]

@g7rta40 perfect, thanks. I honestly have literally no issue with that, I carry a mobile phone at all times which does exactly that...I fly my drone recreationally in a safe and legal manner at all times, if the police want to run a spot check on me then I have nothing to fear because of how I know I operate my drone.

[@loc4725]

It's an £150 module (although currently the price keeps on rising) which will eventually if not immediately need to be unique and permanently attached to each and every model you fly. If you're happy to jump through the loops, pay your hard earned money to some company who's boss is a drinking buddy of some senior CAA bureaucrat all whilst Stop Oil et al continue to break the law and get away with it then this is frankly excellent news. On the other hand if you think that rules and regulations should be appropriate, justified and proportionate then this is pretty catastrophic.

[@g7rta40]

@@craigwilloughby6 Thieves, Karen’s & general trouble makers can’t track your phone and your location though. I’m often carrying several thousands of pounds worth of gear when I go out… mini 4 pro… several batteries… camera.. lenses..etc. Now anyone can see where I’m standing by simply looking on an app…. Doesn’t bare thinking about.

[@PaulTurley81]

i see the (Get Licensed - Security Insider) are now doing the Introducing Our New Security Drone Pilot Training Course £125 I'm trying to working out what this means?

[@loc4725]

It's a window to the future. In a few years the only way you'll be able to legally fly a drone regardless of weight will be commercially, once you've taken an approved course run by or under the auspices of -a mate of the CAA- a selected CAA partner.

[@harbourwoodlandvisitor2445]

it seems they want hardly anyone to own a drone for there own private use. not even kids can fly toy drones without some kind of stupid law being enforced onto kids. I'm glad i flew my drone when they first came out some years back. i wouldn't want to fly a drone today. to many busy bodies and Karren's around if you know what i mean.

[@loc4725]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who can see the writing on the wall. It's now clear that the CAA's end-game is for people to either fly commercially or get out. Public interest be dammed!

[@testpilotian3188]

@@loc4725 just say no. Plenty of places to continue flying undisturbed even now.

[@loc4725]

@@testpilotian3188 *"Plenty of places to continue flying undisturbed even now.* Yes, I think that'll be the future of what will be left of the 'hobby' - flying foam board models over farmer's fields.

[@garylinnane917]

DJE MEDIA / AUDITS stopped by police and nearly having his drone seized due to no VLOS.

[@h-dawg969]

I’m so worried that they will take the piss with the geofencing instead of purely using it for stadiums, police stations and airports etc. if they just decide to implement it all over the place, in SSIs and other places it’s guna ruin so much. Everyone will have to return to analog fpv.

[@cottysreef3704]

Drone Hobby is coming to an end.

[@A.ShogunNamedDave]

fantastic news

[@andrewmaudsley7692]

All I fly is sub250 and most of my FPV are about 150 grams, not a chance I will be able to install remote ID on them it is just not possible and bet they are going to want the Remote ID to prevent take off until it checks it can fly in that area, again not a chance we find it hard to fit in what we do now, CAA are clearly have no idea what FPV is, and just making a list of things that people will not be able to follow, might email them asking how are people who make something that is say 60 grand home made and has a camera, how is someone meant to follow with there rules, if they come back about it being on the drone app then there is no app lol more so with analog or most digital systems, Ever way just going to fly the way I have for years and be safe

[@testpilotian3188]

They think FPV is what you do when you fly a Mavic Mini. Just say no, not complying, I’m fed up of this interference, not one person has died as a result of a recreational multi rotor FPV flying worldwide yet we are being portrayed as the devil reincarnated, makes you wonder what they’re using us as a distraction for….

[@bigstoozeradventures]

Whats this A2C of bloody C thing? I already have an operator and flyer ID. I fly a Mavic 3 classic which is over 500g. BUT I am an avid mountain biker and only fly it in wide open countryside well away from people or in active track mode. So do I have to pay 79 quid for this new A2CofC thing? I dont fly in built up areas where there are a lot of people because it is more grief than it is worth. This is all getting very confusing and a bit of a 'ball ache'. Cars etc kill people every day. I have yet to see news coverage of a drone seriously injuring or killing anyone. The authorities should spend their time investigating real crimes rather than harassing respondible camera enthusiasts. Thats why I have one. My hobby is exploring and photography. I rarely get confronted in the Scottish Highlands. I am a level headed calm man but I am 6'5" tall, well built and I can look after myself. The only confrontation I have ever had is when a Gamekeeper accosted me last summer, in the middle of nowhere, and spouted off a load of bollocks about drone rules ordering me to stop flying or he would get me arrested and fined. So I told him he was talking bollocks. He became very aggresive got out of his landrover and grabbed my arm. What followed was self defence, I forced him back into his landrover and told him to do his job properly and find some ------- poachers. All I do is film in the open countryside and post videos on my mountain biking channel. I dont bother anyone so why should I have to pay 79 'smacker roonies' for this new A2C thing. If I have to then I will to make sure I am fully compliant. But I would rather not pay it...

[@nanlynch8312]

So unsure about buying a up grade now . Talk about spoiling someone’s fun time . ( KAREN )

[@Geeksvana]

Do remember we have a good two years before any of this comes in, if they don't change course again!

[@Wallettography]

So the legislation is getting tighter and I fly a 1.3kg Phantom 4 Pro but I'm not worried. Unless I've missed something, I can still fly in a lot of places (article16 rules) and get great photos and videos for my photography pages. You didn't need a driving licence for a car until 1935. Then we've seen multiple restrictions come into effect since then - speed limits, no drink driving, no smoking with kids in car, theory tests, etc etc etc. There are still 29,000,000 cars on the road in the UK. Yes, so flying drones will become a little more complicated, so what? I'll never stop flying them and I'm definitely not spitting my dummy out. Or may be I've missed something.

[@Treberon]

Great comment. Lots of negative comments here which aren't justified. There are some genuine concerns, but there's more of the type whereby people are being very defeatist.

[@MrSupergumpi]

Question to all.. who is behind this?? time for some finger pointing

[@ffinybryn]

Drones have killed the model flying hobby. No-one is going to put a £100 RID unit on all of their park-flyers. Why is it called a "consultation" if it is a done deal already? This is not safety related, but an excuse to clear the air for Amazon.

[@fredfred2363]

The reality is, that what's going on Ukraine is the reason for all these new regs. But everyone is scared to talk about it. Prove me wrong.

[@grantc8353]

Or someone like Dj audits comes to mind

[@davebell46]

Meanwhile the criminals using drones for criminal purposes will continue, all legislation does is make it harder for the ones that fly safely, I’m getting to the point where I think I’ll just fly my mavic 3 pro where safe to do so and minimise risk where possible

[@daveandersonangry]

The hobby is doomed we’re loosing control bit by bit

[@testpilotian3188]

Not if we refuse to comply and tell them that.

[@6666madmick]

All part of the plan to stop the people from having a life...the elite don't want anyone sticking their nose in to their private property

[@martinriley106]

And we all thought this government was about deregulation not more of it?

[@jasonlee4267]

When did anyone in this country ever think of such a thing? not in my lifetime no such thing as deregulation in the UK

[@MrStreetboy80]

This is ridiculous! This will Kill the fpv home build community. Think il put off building any new drones.

[@karlstamper9243]

And it'll never stop any of the criminals that use drones

[@TheMrRatzz]

Love your work, but man your videos (and stills) are terribly under-exposed! Increase something! 😊

[@Geeksvana]

Annoying isnt it. I dod think it was foxed. I think something changed on the camera. It kept switching off during the live stream last night and I think it might have reset 😂.