£120,000 is the WORST Salary in the UK

[@johnholkham2420]

What we all miss is it’s the mega rich like Rishi who paid tax at a rate of Just 23% on his total income.

[@davidcooks2379]

Exactly, that's the unfair part

[@geegee1014]

Need to tax wealth, not income. The richest people don't need to work so can avoid most tax.

[@adrianflower3230]

Yes, and that's just what he declared based on disposing of an asset. His family, wife & farther in law, are bringing in £30m a week, his personal fortune is in excess of £500m according to the Sunday Times Rich list. Just staggering

[@manpreetbrar838]

If that

[@Forsthman64]

Almost everyone in the US pays net tax far less than this! I live in the UK and believe me, I wish we had as progressive a tax system as you lot!

[@Chris-yr8qo]

Good video, but I actually think you've been to kind on the UKs tax, you've forgotten to add national insurance, council tax, insurance premium tax, duty on fuel, stamp duty land tax, stamp duty when you buy shares, tax on dividends, capital gains etc etc.

[@knowledgeseeker5499]

@@Chris-yr8qo altogether almost 70% goes into taxes directly or indirect stealthily taxes

[@DamZFXBeats]

Doesn't America have it a lot worse?

[@specularverzide9972]

​@@DamZFXBeatsYeah in America they're taxed at 101%.

[@asdreww]

UK overall tax take is honestly ridiculously high, especially considering the state of basic services like seeing a GP, attending A&E, or driving on smooth roads, and makes UK a really unattractive proposition to high earners.

[@sirrobinofloxley7156]

I'm pretty sure there's tons of hidden taxes too, flight tickets are taxed extortionately, as are cigs and beers. Then, just general shopping and road taxes.

[@robocombo]

As somebody running a small tech agency the level of tax that the big corporations pay compared to us is infuriating.

[@TheAkbar23]

That's a big issue!

[@keithianlocke]

Just shows what a rip off Britain has become. When I first started work back in 1992 at 19yrs of age, my starting wage (before minimum wage was introduced) was the same as my father's wage. He owned a 3 bed detached house, a car outright, and two holidays away each year. I'm stuck in social housing, car on finance, and haven't had a holiday for over 10yrs.

[@tancreddehauteville764]

Don't compare the 1970s to the modern day. It's a different world.

[@keithianlocke]

@@tancreddehauteville764 Dont I know it... I grew up in the 70s in what is now considered a part of South London.

[@jakelister5152]

If you have always been working, the reason you have not been on holiday in 10 years is because your ideal holiday is just too expensive, bartenders can afford a week long holiday in Spain or its just not your priority, simple

[@keithianlocke]

@@jakelister5152 wife and kids mate. Cost of living has outstripped wages since the introduction of minimum wage and mass migration. That's Labour for you.

[@therosen9923]

@@keithianlocke Government you mean, both parties are just different cheeks of the same arse really. But yeah wages haven't increased while prices, taxes and bills have. If I remember correctly from a comment saw a week ago, that wages are similar to 2002 era wages for similar jobs, with some or few jobs having actual improvements. Not surprising why most people want to leave really. Taxed to oblivion.

[@Yahraas]

As a father of four children I used to earn £50k a year. I then got a job paying £60k a year. It was then that I learnt that I had to repay the child benefit my wife received. The child benefit was £300 a month, or £3,600 a year. I was being taxed at 78% on my pay increase (40% tax + 2% NI + 36%). What was the point of the £10k pay rise when I saw just £55 a week uplift..?

[@Longlostpuss]

The issue is the 4 x children, you were never earning enough to support a family that size.

[@centerfield6339]

You're no longer taking from other people. That's the upside.

[@Al_Does_Stuff]

So you got a 2.8k annual pay rise sucks compared to the 10k you were told but still substantial (5.6% over 20%)

[@black1blade74]

I wish I had an extra 55 quid a week!

[@501isa]

​@@black1blade74 that depends on the change in job, a shit load of extra stress from a job where if you have even more responsibility and potentially less free time as you may need to be called upon out of hours is probably not even worth it. I am a contractor and if I work a Saturday I get around £130 in take home, same for 2 Saturdays a month. If I work a 3rd it makes them days worth £110 and a whole month of Saturdays brings that down to around £100 a Saturday. It becomes a disincentive to work especially when you have to sort your cost to employ and you your company is shelling out in the region of £4800 for you to not get much more than £3k and have no free time to do something you actually care about or spend time with the people you care about, from personal experience it just makes you shut down and can lead you to a dark place in life.

[@komnishura]

This is the cost of high taxes. It is beyond me that if you are a high earner and high tax payer you actually loose the free child care? What kind of feeling do you get when you pay the most tax and dont get any benefits from it? Really bad policy in my head...

[@therealrobertbirchall]

The benefits are social, that you don't live in a country where people need food banks and schools and health care are free to everyone. A healthy educated population will help to grow the economy so we all benefit. But you go back to reading the Torygraph and blame the poor for being poor, after all they are untermench are they not?

[@GoodVibes51]

​@@therealrobertbirchallin theory this is true, but in practice it doesn't work. Many people choose not to climb the social ladder precisely due to the current tax brackets. More work, more responsibility, more taxes. The fact that anything above 40k is taxed at 40% is totally ridiculous

[@therealrobertbirchall]

@@GoodVibes51 I feel so sorry for you victims. I can assure you that most people on minimum wage work harder and for longer hours than anyone in the 40% tax bracket. It's the people who actually make things, repair things, and care for others who are the engine of the economy. Not the management class or the so called 'investors' who are just parasites on the rest of society.

[@jjjones2244]

You're joking if you think most minimum wage workers are 'hard workers' 😂​@@therealrobertbirchall

[@chrishaughian8048]

​@therealrobertbirchall all earners drive the economy. Without the service industry UK GDP is lower which impacts how much can be spent on healthcare and welfare. Tories and labour have sparked the earnings war to get votes. Unfortunately aiming at high earners can drive them away which will make the country poorer. Lower earners will then need increases on taxes to maintain the same benefits we enjoy today.

[@chumabanjwa4662]

People generally confuse a good salary for wealth.

[@hugoclarke3284]

It helps...

[@divx1001]

​@@hugoclarke3284 irrelevant to the topic

[@davidmoore8857]

I never understood how the British government could install the tax regime in Hong Kong where everyone roughly pays 15%, whilst they tax you up to your eyeballs domestically and still do.

[@tancreddehauteville764]

Hong Kong is China, not the UK.

[@AshWeststar]

​@@tancreddehauteville764 I think David was referring to what the British government did in Hong Kong after 1840 and before 1998?

[@ilikethiskindatube]

The tax havens are where the British elite keep their wealth while the rest of us are kept down by taxation

[@andrewkingdon2000]

@@AshWeststar correct. Some people just like to be "clever" even if it shows they are the exact opposite.

[@aleksei5172]

Hong Kong was autonomous even under British rule. British government had nothing to do with Hong Kong taxes

[@danielgospodinow]

I'm a Bulgarian that's currently working as a software engineer in the UK (in London). Sadly, I cannot wait to leave the UK. The taxing here is just driving me crazy. (I'm exactly around this highly taxed range.)

[@cezar3977]

Брат, јас сум од Македонија и имам иста професија како тебе. Моментално имам 80 илјади годишно, но живеам во Шкотска и плаќам малку повисока даночна стапка отколку во Англија. Потекнувам од обично работничко семејство и дојдов до оваа позиција денес со многу вложен труд, но многу луѓе тоа не го гледаат и завидуваат. Тешко е да се избориш за покачување на платата, и многу е мачно кога ќе видиш колку малку ти останува од тоа.

[@danielgospodinow]

@@cezar3977 Разбирам те, брате. Разбирам те.

[@danielgospodinow]

@@cezar3977 Разбирам те, брате. Разбирам те.

[@epic1053]

Problem with the UK economy is once you hit the 40% tax bracket there is no incentive to push any further. I make 50k, any additional pay rises I will see less then 40% of. 40% tax, 6% national insurance, 9% student finance, 6% pension. = 64% effective tax. People get to this point then don't care about going any further and do the bare minimum to stay in a job. No one wants to be promoted because the additional responsibilities and stress is not worth the extra pay. for example becoming a team lead is a 5 grad a year pay rise, but you only see 2-2.6k of it. The way we do things does not encourage people to aim for success, it encorages people to get to a point they are ok and then leave it there. It's not going to be ideal for productivity.

[@NyeDaniel]

Then contribute to your pension

[@epic1053]

@@NyeDaniel i am 27 , I could live another 27 years and still not see a peny of my pension.

[@JackBremer]

9% student finance is paying back a loan though, not paying for other students, right? So it's not a tax

[@Nukeguy909]

It's only 2% national insurance above 50k, so 51% marginal rate

[@Helensburghdrives]

Your pension isn't a tax. It's an investment in your future after you stop working. It's entirely your choice to pay that. You could simply claim the state pension instead. Choice isn't a tax.

[@thepurplecat5975]

My base salary is £113,000 before dividends and I hate when people say it’s privileged. No it’s earned. I sacrificed my early 20’s and having fun and socialising to specialise into a niche field that pays me consummately with my skills and qualifications. How is that privileged? My mum is an office cleaner and dad a warehouseman, I paid my own way through my entire life and took myself to University. How is that privileged? I earned what I make today. I hate how people can’t applaud others success but instead seeks to pull them back down.

[@batman1980]

Same. I earn 200 after all investments and self made paying own tuition working summers etc. Lived with parents into my 30s. Hope to retire in my 50s. Would not say I was really a hard worker but not a dosser that's for sure.

[@leosedf]

I have to say well done to you i am proud of you. People are easy to judge but they don't know how much shit you had to go through to reach that stage.

[@meeshker]

😭😭😭

[@matthewrichard9626]

Calling someone privileged isn't putting them down. You've worked hard for your privilege but you are still privileged.

[@therosen9923]

You've earned the privilege, yet it is still one and you are still privileged. However the vast majority of people are still 'plebs' since you would need to earn close to 725K+ to be considered in the elites of the country. No ill will to what you have obtained, it's just phrasing it as a right is incorrect. Hard work doesn't entitle you anything more than sitting on your arse. It's just that it can get you things, (luck, charisma, social intelligence and connections are far superior in every regard.) Really the average person, should be banging on for lower taxes and higher wages, but as you said would rather drag people like you down to their level. At least you can say you got your wages through genuine work. Most at that level I doubt can say the same.

[@Abdul_Rahman86]

I see her point. I’m better off on 48k than I was on 52k. (I work in finance) I opted for shares and pension contributions. I take home more or less the same net. And here’s the icing on the cake, I am qualified as nurse and I can’t do agency work as a nurse because I’ll end up paying 40% on what I earn. I only take home 2.8k

[@chrispalmer24]

I don't blame you! Doesn't seem right somehow. It's similar with VAT for self employed - it's like you are encouraged to avoid the limit

[@stewartmacdonald601]

Can't is a bit misleading. You may not want to, but still better to have the remaining 58% than not.

[@chrispalmer24]

@@stewartmacdonald601 Being able benefit from 40% tax relief is huge too I think.

[@stewartmacdonald601]

@@chrispalmer24Yes it is. But here is somewhere I think you got it wrong in the video. The video suggests that anything at 40% should be put into a pension. This might be ok for a relatively small amount. But £52k (£42k here in Scotland or something) is really not that large a salary. And I think it’s unlikely that anyone on £70k would be putting £20k into a pension just to avoid paying the tax. Sure, you put a decent chunk in there. But houses are expensive. Cars are expensive. Holidays are expensive. Kids are expensive. And £70k goes surprisingly little distance when you need a family sized house and reliable family sized car. With that said, I probably do put close to that amount into my pension. But that is because I am trying to keep out the 60% band (67% or something here in Scotland). But even here in semi-rural Scotland, the house is expensive enough, and two cars are required (actually an easy case can be made for 3 cars due to my work). But I certainly don’t have enough left over to avoid the 45% tax bracket here. On that point, I get all you UK finance KZbinrs are England based, and that is no doubt a huge part of your viewership. But you all seem to just ignore that we do have it worse / different here in Scotland. And some recognition of the extra taxes we pay / could save, would be useful for us.

[@madma11]

agency workers can earn £50-£80 an hour for nurses.... its incredible salary if you do full time. i would suspect that more than justifies paying the additional 40%. My wife is one of them lol

[@kidkal7825]

I earn 120k on sole income and I am much much worse off than people earning 60k each on dual income!

[@majordelays4909]

Shit isn’t it.

[@clarkeysam]

You could say that about any income.

[@88doonyboy88]

You won’t lose half your wealth when she divorces you so there is that.

[@evelbsstudio]

Take a pay cut till you earn 99,000 to avoid the extra tax, you will be better off, put more in your pension via your company is another way.

[@LawrenceTimme]

Doubt. If you earn £60k and your wife earns £60k when you get divorce you now are homeless, and she get £90k. If you earn £120k then you earn £120k. Its clearly more than £30k

[@MV8]

Nice video! I’d add that these thresholds haven’t moved in years while inflation and salaries grew quite a lot, so effectively tax rates went up!

[@ultravaluetech24]

I stopped working more once I reached around 55k/year, there's not much point to work more...especially when you consider the VAT limit. Now I work for about 7months a year and take the rest slow months free to do whatever/travel around.

[@NegativeAccelerate]

Damn what job do you have that does that?

[@ThomasSmith-tv7gp]

Any tax system that penalises and makes you poorer for the more you earn is absurd. How this level of stupidity exists in modern government explains why we are where we are

[@tancreddehauteville764]

It doesn't make you poorer, but if you earn more you need to pay more. Simple maths.

[@ThomasSmith-tv7gp]

@@tancreddehauteville764 2:36 watch the video from here 👍

[@specularverzide9972]

​@@tancreddehauteville764If you earn more you already pay more even in flat tax system. Your 10% of 1000 is nothing compared to 10% of 1 million. Now answer why someone that earns more needs to pay more as a % too.

[@GoodVibes51]

​@@tancreddehauteville764It makes sense to a point, but at a certain point it's punishment for trying hard and being successful.

[@riansillett2771]

​if you earn more you pay more tax at the same percentage no matter what. If you earn 1k a week or 10 k if you earn 10k you are paying way more tax even at the same percentage. So there shouldn't be higher tax for higher earners thats ridiculous. Higher earners will pay way more tax then lower earners anyway

[@Forsthman64]

If one person puts in an hour's work and takes home £20.00 but someone else puts in two hours of the same work, but takes home only £30.00 it is not just to claim 'Oh, poor you, you're only earning £30.00, it must be so hard!' The dude earning £20.00 is clearly getting the higher return on investment.

[@northwestcoast]

Everyone gets the “£20” tax free because that goes some way to covering very basic living expenses. The current tax free level is around £240 a week which doesn’t cover the basic expenses of mortgage and bills. I think that should be the measure of the tax free allowance. It’s probably around £500 a week now. £240 is kind of insane

[@Forsthman64]

@@northwestcoast That's an improvement anyway.

[@Forsthman64]

@@northwestcoast In the US, their highest federal tax rates doesn't even get as high as our 40% band and it kicks in at about $550,000 a year!!! Ours is higher and kicks in at about $75,000!!!

[@therealrobertbirchall]

​@@Forsthman64and how much do you spend on health insurance in the USA?

[@Forsthman64]

@@therealrobertbirchall Enough to cover my healthcare needs, not the needs of several towns.

[@Sam_Stanton]

I’m glad you mentioned the VAT threshold & how it affects businesses It’s very much a massive way to de incentivise business growth

[@kirkster501]

I am dropping my hours so that I do not breach the allowances. Work does NOT pay in the UK when you have these extreme marginal tax rates. The Tories, to their shame, introduced them and did NOTHING to remove them.

[@funkyfrank8826]

Don't forget anyone with a large balance on their Plan 2 student loan, which means they'll be paying a marginal rate of 69% with little hope of paying off the full amount. If these thresholds aren't changed there'll be a growing cohort of high-earning graduates with little to no incentive to increase their salary beyond this amount other than to increase their pension contributions. Seems like a ridiculous feature of the tax system.

[@kytowrld]

the issue with flat tax is people on the lower scale would stuggle more, that 6k is more noticeable at 30k than 20k is at 100k

[@chrispalmer24]

I think flat over a basic threshold would be better, maybe keep or extend the personal allowance first

[@The-bashing-zone]

I think it should be flat but still with the tax free allowance on about 12k which is now. So from the 20k a year would pay 20% tax from the 8k which would be £1600. For the person with salary 100k would be 20% of 88k=17.6k tax and so on

[@MbisonBalrog]

Depends on COL of local area.

[@TomCollings-j5u]

@chrispalmer24 Flat tax is nuts, are you sure you mean that? m.kzbin.info/www/bejne/bpiunquZrJh7jK8

[@alexgriffin3959]

I live in Scotland and the effective rate is 70% (rather than 60%). Absolutely Ridiculous.

[@third7715]

No mention of the 2% cap on national insurance which they’ll have though, arguably £50270 is the worst salary to earn in the UK because of this

[@chrispalmer24]

I think it may change soon too! We’ll see 👀

[@larsondesouza2497]

It possibly will....

[@simonworsley8631]

Not really because at that point you go from 20% to 40% income tax so a couple both on this amount is ideal, especially with child benefit clawed back after this amount

[@RyanTaylorNaturalRemedies]

Great video, one point i would like to mention. Adsense for ads on KZbin videos revenue does mot fall within the scope of VAT in the UK. It also doesn't apply for the £90,000 VAT threshold for registering. 👍

[@ricequackers]

The real problem is if you're on ~£120k, you're likely living in or near London. It's still impossible to be a first-time house buyer in this region on this income unless you either a) have A LOT of cash or b) buying as a couple with a partner on a similar income. We bought our very modest house in Hertfordshire for £550k five years ago, which was fortunate as today it's shot up to £800k. Even on a combined income of £200k we'd struggle to afford buying it today. Same house 20 years ago would have been valued at £300k at most.

[@Jay-xr3sb]

QE, devaluation of the currency and your debt. It will continue

[@curryandapint]

When I got married I was on £60k and very happy, my wife worked too. 20 years later, 3 children and my wife's a full-time Mum. I'm now on £160k but comparitively worse off (i.e. less disposable income and much larger expenses) - so it's really just your situation in life. Sure, when I got to £120k it actually made us worse off but you need to push through it. Background: Came from a relatively poor family, not educated the expensive way. Left home at 18 and 'couch sufed', living in an over-crowded house to help split the rent. Earned my way. Did a degree later doing Engineering and much later an MBA. Currently work in IT in London as a Senior Technical Architect. I'd like to move into Senior Management in the next few years and after that - I can't wait to retire asap and do something I actually enjoy!

[@andyonions7864]

Permitting large companies to pay low taxes in the UK does create jobs which are then taxed excessively. You said it yourself, those companies could go to Dubai and pay low taxes instead. So the question becomes do we want companies to create jobs in the UK? If so you have to have sensible (low) tax levels on companies. That means VAT and corporation taxes.

[@Yangking-z9d]

We should have different cooperation tax for each region in the UK and keep cooperation tax high in London so businesses move everywhere else.

[@andyonions7864]

@@Yangking-z9d I always considered 'London weighting' as counterproductive.

[@Yangking-z9d]

@@andyonions7864 yh as a Londoner I'm getting tired of this as well rent prices are up,less productivity everywhere else and it would solve housing issues if there more houses demanded elsewhere we need to decentralise from the capital.

[@clarkeysam]

When it was said that highest earners lose their personal allowance I never realised that it literally disappeared, I assumed that it went from 0% to 20%.

[@northwestcoast]

It does go from 0% to 20% The £12570 that was previously tax free, becomes taxable at 20%

[@clarkeysam]

@@northwestcoast that's what I thought, but it doesn't. It just disappears.

[@Forsthman64]

I earn £30,000 working two jobs. My father used to earn £150,000 salary for a while before he retired last year (he's 70). I pay far less tax as a percentage, whereas my father was taxed so highly that our total incomes, including his private and state pensions, are now about the same and I'm living with him (and mum) because I can't afford an house. `I saw how hard he worked, 80 hrs/week at least and the sacrifices he made for his family and to what did it amount? At the end of the day, he has a paid off house, which he still has to share with me, and everything else is average. I feel like I get a much better deal with my low salary but much less tax. Less of my life is stolen by the government! The UK tax system is like a boot on the heads of the salaried, pushing them down so that they can't rise, while those truly wealthy get to keep rising. It's the high income taxes causing the large inequalities in this country, not lack of tax. If you want proof, look at Sweden's post-tax income inequality (incredibly equal) then look at its wealth inequality (one of highest in world!).

[@kos15280]

Thank you, I feel the same.. Tax system is designed to make it incredibly difficult for Mr nobody to "make it".

[@Forsthman64]

@@kos15280 I once hard someone say that economies under both capitalism and socialism have rich and poor, but only under capitalism do people become rich.

[@iandennis7836]

​@@kos15280okay, please define "making it". Making what.....and why that figure? I'll put the kettle on....

[@GlasgowCelticBhoy]

@@iandennis7836 I think they meant "make it" to a financial goal. Not "make" a specific amount. It was just some poor word choices - especially the "Mr Nobody" part, but semantics aside, I think I get what point is trying to be made.

[@neso3559]

Oh. Forbid .. should your father need care in old age the government will steal his home to recover their exhorbitant care costs . You then will not inherit his home 😢

[@RimzoSky]

I sacrifice everything above £100k into my pension. So it's not being spent in the economy and it lowers productivity as I cba to move to a higher paying role.

[@Arghans]

What doesn't seem to have dropped with the Government is how this impacts the productivity of the nation. People shirking overtime, avoiding promotions going part-time or buying more annual leave. Yes you can put the extra into your pensions but many want a benefit now.

[@chrispalmer24]

Just for extra clarification: In no way do I think £120k is a bad salary and it's a privileged position to be in. I do think however it's an interesting talking point - should we be in a position where people are actively trying to keep their salary under £100k to avoid this trap? It all seems a bit backwards to me!

[@kidkal7825]

Yes I agree that it should be a bigger talking point than just mock pity on the "poor privileged class"! It is a great inequality, nowhere else in the world does the tax free allowance disappear to produce marginal tax rate of 60%! I don't know why UK people don't complain about this more!

[@Ianjdgale]

There should be a flat rate of tax paid by everyone.

[@davidcooks2379]

Just pu 20K into pension

[@jimbo573]

Your summary is correct in my opinion. Those kinds of earnings take the pressure off across the board. You get better homes, cars, holidays. But you're not buying holiday homes or taking private jets. And this is after training to be among the best in your chosen career. Given that 10% of UK workers pay 60% of the income tax I don't think it's unreasonable to ask for things to be simplified. For instance stop removing basic allowances that make tax traps and break PAYE.

[@neosgaming1]

I’d personally prefer we scrap council tax and have a flat uk tax of 20% as you said and from there incentives to encourage businesses to employ people in the uk and encourage greater living standards.

[@adrianflower3230]

Don't forget. No matter what the salary currency value, inflation has hammered the purchasing power while tax rates have been frozen

[@RadmanTheWise]

Very few people in the comments are saying this. No way that "high earners" are at 50k. The cost of everything has gone up maybe 50% in 4 years and I had to commit to a 5.5% mortgage, which effectively doubled my repayments. 4 years ago I was on 39k and I had more spending power.

[@tap-money]

Thank you for finally saying this! I'm fortunate and privileged to have a high income but like you said, I have dwindling motivation to work any harder and considering dropping my hours because of the 60% tax trap. And imagine the families that have a single high earner and a full time parent living in London. The UK is not positioned for growth as it stands.

[@j0rzeh]

I'm on abit more then that but I get taxed to death and I have to pay £320,000 off training over 20 years as a Helicopter pilot so once the Tax gets me and I pay that I have £32k a year to spend until my working life ends at 60 as a Pilot, I get now help for kids or anything, I was better off when I was a motorcycle mechanic because of the benefits like it said but add the big £320k debt into the mix and it's not so good. Oh and my wife a Dentist so we get double fucked, We want to move away because seeing more then 50% of our wages taken and we get no benefits, Even the medical care we have to pay private because NHS is useless and as a Pilot I need a class 1 medical so.. maybe I'm in a unique problem but all the cards are stacked against us.

[@chrispalmer24]

Definitely shouldn't be the case! Wow that training cost is staggering. Is it similar to student debt where you could "not pay it off"?

[@j0rzeh]

@@chrispalmer24 no you have to get a personal loan there’s no help with it at all, it’s £120k for the ATPL then living costs for 2 years near the airport then £120k ish for the ME/IR rating then £60k for the type rating on a S92.. and you may not even be hired at the end. Hence the lack of helicopter pilots.

[@tancreddehauteville764]

Sorry mate. You're still a lot better off than most people, despite your loan.

[@dboynette]

⁠​⁠@@tancreddehauteville764 he is saying he was better off when working as a mechanic i.e a normal job and salary.

[@karyndickinson3544]

​@tancreddehauteville764 if we want to retain our doctors etc they need better incentives or they will leave .

[@bonditltd5346]

I pay ridiculous tax rates and have worked extremely hard and sacrificed a lot to get to where I am - running 4 companies . This tax situation is one I’m familiar with and like many others, I’m looking to close or move companies, reduce the tax burden and just stop living and contributing to the U.K. I wish there was a flat tax rate, but there’s no conversation to be had with lower earners where they agree or understand the situation. I’d be surprised if Labour make and changes to growth and I’m expecting a decline so much I’ve reviewed leases , stock takes etc in preparation.

[@InBulgarian]

Look into Bulgaria. I believe it has more favourable tax rates.

[@bonditltd5346]

@@InBulgarian thanks. For me the problem would be the language barrier. Lovely country though

[@andrewkingdon2000]

I see the point fully. Our tax system rewards low earners and punishes people who work hard. How is that ever going to make the economy more efficient?

[@ADSINI1972]

So are you saying low earners don't work as hard as you?

[@morrofv]

@@ADSINI1972in fact low owners work harder

[@greenwendal5056]

FFS wake up. THEY WANT YOU POOR!!!

[@andrewkingdon2000]

@@ADSINI1972 yes.

[@jommydavi2197]

​@@ADSINI1972 Yes

[@cooliocrib4409]

I earn 65k. I feel i pay so much and get nothing in return. Im thinking of dropping my hours down so i pay less tax work less and have more leasure time.

[@elslopez]

I notice that TAX is used to disincentivise doing a thing… sugar TAX, Tobacco TAX, Alcohol TAX, then we wonder why no one wants to work anymore! Tell me this… if I work 80 hours a week (which I frequently have done) how about I’m allowed to simply have the equivalent TAX allowance of two full time people? Sounds fair to me and I am doing the work of two people!

[@clarkeysam]

Terrible and unworkable idea.

[@madma11]

@@clarkeysam be quiet mate. It would be very easy to only tax 1 job and not the second / third job. Its an absolute piss take that disincentivises work. Absolute BS. It needs changing.

[@wrightdante3609]

Agreed

[@Paterleano]

@@madma11 100% Agree, there needs to be a limit how much one is expected to contribute, it should be only from a 1st full time income, after that one has already contributed his or her fair share, overtime shouldnt be taxed! They are just driving everyone away to Dubai. I know 4 people who have moved there. Tax wealth not work.

[@davem.4003]

@@elslopez Maybe you're right... and tax is designed to disincetivise working excessive hours, which is generally regarded as being unhealthy, so the extra tax you are paying now is helping to pay for your future health support? There is another perspective though - that you are taking someone else's job and can you imagine what they and their family are going through, unemployed and depending on state benefits (which your taxes are contributing to)?

[@tankplank69]

As someone who's obsessing over living and breathing my career to reach that salary and higher I'm definitely leaving the UK now. I understand why my dentist left the UK.

[@Dragon-up6rb]

How can this be fair ? you get reward if you don’t work, you get penalty when you work extremely hard, crazy system 😅

[@madma11]

Yep it is absolute BS. I was hoping to get a second job but at 40% it does not make anything worth my time. Might as well get my wife to work more bless her. She hates work - I don't actually mind it / prefer it. I dont mind being the donkey, but not if the gov takes 40%. So yeah... lose/lose for my family lol

[@markblance8492]

Yep. And is set to get worse under a socialist government

[@VinoVeritas_]

Because the person that makes your coffee, serves your lunch, works in the train station, cleans the office, etc is never going to be in a position to earn £120K per year. Unless you're prepared to pay much much more for those services?

[@davidcooks2379]

@VinoVeritas_ I'd prefer those people earn more rather than me paying for them through taxes. It's a question of choice

[@VinoVeritas_]

@@davidcooks2379 You obviously don't understand basic economics.

[@GhostWriter_Music]

If I was on 120k per year. I would put half of it in a sipp. because you get that 20% bonus. so then I would be taxed on the last 60k.

[@mathewgallimore1484]

You'd get more than 20%, as you can also claim the higher tax back through self-assessment

[@GhostWriter_Music]

@@mathewgallimore1484 yeah, but you get that back directly from the tax man, so effectively you are on 60k for tax purpose. do that for 4 years then leave it to grow and go part time. have the easier life.

[@AB-zv6dz]

Its ridiculous and its the reason why the UK, by far, is seeing the greatest loss of wealthy individuals. The UK has the second largest net loss of millionaires in the world. Second only to China. And chinas population is 20x bigger. We are losing more millionaires a year than Russia for goodness sake. The facts dont lie. So an income of 160k makes 3x an income of 30k. Yet an income of 160k has to work infinitely harder, make vastly more sacrifices, requires significantly more education. Its ridiculous. Anyone in the UK today, who has the talent to make 160k a year also has the talent to find a way to leave this country and they should do so. And we live in this pervasive culture, which this video is a good example of, of hatred against the wealthy and succesful - mockery and no sympathy for them. Honestly, get out as soon as you can. The UK is in terminal decline and talented people have no reason to go down with the ship.

[@northwestcoast]

@@AB-zv6dz you’re getting wealth and income mixed up.

[@gerrardcorner6199]

Good. You can go too. Whiner. Go look at tax rates in EU.

[@AB-zv6dz]

@@gerrardcorner6199 'whiner' haha - why am I a whiner exactly? I genuinely want to know

[@jakelister5152]

What makes you think someone on 160k definitely works harder than the one on 30k or makes more sacrifices ? It's not as simplistic as that

[@RJA]

Tax rates in some other EU countries are even worse. Difference is their public services are way better run. Being on 30k is way harder to live on, might not be as skilled a job but that doesn't make it easy.

[@caparn100]

3:42 This is not what Salary Sacrifice is. Salary Sacrifice is a way of an employer and employee avoiding some NI contributions, not a way of avoiding income tax. Any payment of up to the lower of someone salary or £60k into a pension will avoid income tax.

[@northwestcoast]

@@caparn100 it’s a way of reducing your income tax. I take my car with salary sacrifice. My employer takes the car payment from my gross income, thereby reducing my taxable income. The car costs £500 a month so reduces the tax I pay by £200 a month

[@caparn100]

@@northwestcoast I understand what Salary Sacrifice (SS) is. *It's not a method to reduce income tax* but rather a way to lower National Insurance (NI) contributions for both employers and employees. I was commenting on the video mentioning that someone earning £120k could contribute to their pension through SS. However, many employers don't offer salary sacrifice, and when they do, you can only use it to pay into your pension fund from your salary. You can't use SS for Benefits in Kind, like a car allowance, unless there's a document that adds the car allowance to your salary. This could also entitle the employee to additional benefits, such as increased redundancy payments. Additionally, you can't contribute an amount that would bring your salary below the national minimum wage (NMW), which is £11.44 per hour. For example, if you work 2000 hours per year, your NMW would be £22,880. Therefore, if your salary is £30,000, you can't make SS payments into your pension exceeding £7,120 per year.

[@caparn100]

@@northwestcoast I get what Salary Sacrifice (SS) is. It's not about cutting income tax, but about lowering National Insurance (NI) contributions for both employers and employees. I was commenting on a video that mentioned someone earning £120k could use SS to contribute to their pension. However, many employers don't offer SS, and when they do, it can only be used to pay into your pension fund from your salary. You can't use SS for Benefits in Kind, like a car allowance, unless there's a document adding the car allowance to your salary. This could also mean the employee gets additional benefits, like higher redundancy payments. Plus, you can't contribute an amount that would drop your salary below the national minimum wage (NMW), which is £11.44 per hour. So, if you work 2000 hours per year, your NMW would be £22,880. If your salary is £30,000, you can't make SS payments into your pension over £7,120 per year.

[@bluedeskfan2754]

It's very easy for people to hate on those who've managed against the odds to succeed. We should be encouraging people who can command those salaries to be here and thrive. There's a good chance some of them are doing important and useful work!

[@maalikserebryakov]

bootlicking rich people not my style/ im a benefits Chad 😎

[@lukesilvamusic]

Great video! Only thing I would say is, (as far as my accountant advised me) you do not pay VAT on Adsense revenue or in general on foreign sourced income. Maybe check with your accountant. My one is specialised on Online Businesses and was very helpful!

[@just_jen]

Can you share their name pls? I need an accountant like that.

[@MayorSom]

That's only the case if you're non-Dom; which itself will be scrapped next tax year.

[@IAMMARTICUS1470]

Good video. Flat tax is a bold suggestion, but perhaps is a sledgehammer. The problem is these ridiculous tax traps. Taxation needs to be vastly simplified and completely scalable, so that growth is never discouraged.

[@PotatoSalad11]

The 30 hours childcare is my biggest frustration with the UK system. The fact that it literally goes from 30 hours a week to 0 when you earn £100k is just insane. Everything should taper off so that you always benefit by earning more. My son's nursery will be about £15k if I tip over the threshold (which I'm carefully managing pension payments to avoid).

[@peterjordan5947]

I earn £138k a year and have no inheritance coming my way. The only way i can save to get a deposit for a house is to take the salary as cash with minimal pension contributions. But when i have children I'm completely screwed as I'll lose my child care allowance. Im left with a choice, pay into my pension and claim child care hours by reducing my taxable income to £99k or take the full amount as cash and continue to save for a house but try and WFH and look after my children. I do believe that social interactions for children is really important. Im 40 and it's the sole reason i dont have children. It's crazy to think that a tax rule is preventing me from becoming a father.

[@firstlast-wg2on]

I’m sorry but what? Get yourself a broker, put down a 15% deposit which somebody earning that much can afford to save and you will get a home. You’re just being unrealistic.

[@peterjordan5947]

​@@firstlast-wg2onI work and currently have to come into the office in Central London. Let's assume I live outside London but able to commute in. That's going to be around £600k for a home capable of being a family home. That's a £90k deposit. That's still incredibly hard to save. But my point was mostly on the loss of child support. I lose all child care hours even as a single parent because I earn over £100k. You could have a couple earning £95k each and still get it.

[@nton8057]

Anyone find it weird how despite all these brutal taxes and spending cuts uk nrver seems to stop being in an economic crisis

[@Randomukperson]

A slight, clarification. Lifetime allowance is not the total amount you can put into your pension, it is the total value your pension can reach. This is based on contributions that you put in and growth of the pension value from what it's invested in

[@chrispalmer24]

Thanks! My bad.

[@nothandmade9686]

For 5 days a week nursery fees are about on £1100pcm. That is based on me living in Birmingham with a kid at nursery in Moseley.

[@larsondesouza2497]

Really nice video. And a very balanced take on income. Wish everyone thought like that.

[@chrispalmer24]

Thanks mate!

[@AndyPerry1972]

The whole point of a percentage based tax system is that the more you earn the more you pay. That in itself should be enough. If I earn twice as much as Joe Bloggs, I pay twice as much tax as Joe Bloggs. In fact with the personal allowance staying the same, even if the rate was 20% for everyone, someone earning £80k per year would still pay more than double in tax than someone earning £40k. The problem is that when thresholds remain the same, what was once a "comfortable" salary is no longer as slowly things eat in to that salary. Take for example the premium on road tax where back in 2017, a car costing £40,000 was considered a lot. These days you can't get a decent estate for that and the more the government push for electric, soon every car is going to cost more than £40k

[@hugoclarke3284]

Here's an alchemist who turns unrefined tik tok into gold

[@boasa]

The suggested flat 20% tax is an incredibly radical solution to the problem.

[@MarcOwenBanks]

Let's also consider the total tax and NI paid on £160k which comes out at £63,413 - Yeah, £63,000, compared to £3,444 for a 25k salary, just 18x the tax and NI paid against 6x the salary - not to mention, the fact that any interest on savings is charged at 45% for higher earners with no allowance before the tax kicks in.

[@stevoone342]

How we tax people is messed up and doesn’t incentivise growth or self betterment especially as a trades person. Thing is London might as well be a foreign country compared to the rest of the uk. Problem is governments do not care about the average Jo or small business bar how can they tax you more.

[@MrBizteck]

Im in the 120k ish salary. Im going part time in a few months. As Ive realised a 18% pay cut is only about a 7% income reduction! Im going to gain about an extra 65 days off a year for a 7% income reduction.

[@MrBizteck]

Tax assets not Income.

[@Philosoph8]

What work do you do if you don’t mind me asking?

[@IAMMARTICUS1470]

It's ludicrous isn't it. There is no point making more than 100k until you make 145k. Meaning everyone in that bracket will work fewer hours to drop below it, HMRC gets less income tax and productivity drops.

[@chrispalmer24]

Can't blame you at all. It's a broken system!

[@MrBizteck]

Airline pilot.

[@EpicScotsman]

12:40 don't forget VAT returns are quarterly so lots more work and admin eating up your time and it will increase your accountancy costs significantly due to this too.

[@markblance8492]

The U.K. tax system disincentivises doing well. As we progress with a socialist government the situation will only get worse. People who have got to earning over 120k have worked damned hard to earn this. University, long hours and extreme pressure and stress. Privileged ??? Earned defiantly, it’s all about life choices.

[@Petersworld77]

It’s nothing to do with having a socialist government, it’s the system that people have voted for continuously since the Second World War. Totally agree that anyone on £120k has worked very hard and has had to have the talent to do it too. Many people work very hard who don’t have the talent on much less income. Conversely, there are other talentless people who are work shy and have a privileged life for a variety of reasons. All in all, society is a mixed bag of all sorts so no one system is going to work for everyone.

[@archvaldor]

"As we progress with a socialist government the situation will only get worse." The Starmer administration is about as socialist as Barclays bank."Earned defiantly" No. Income is weakly correlated with effort/intelligence.

[@markblance8492]

@@archvaldor Let’s see…. I hazard a guess 2025 budget will start the usual Labour tax penalties on middle England. Starmer will flex with what ever policy or backing keeps him in office

[@menow7903]

Sorry, no. People who have got to earning over 120k haven't necessarily worked harder than anyone else. My mother was a nurse for nearly 50 years. Her work was back breaking, she's paying the price now for all those years with her ill health. I had no idea until I did care work for a few months. Never worked so hard in all my life. I now work in IT and earn over £120k. I wouldn't insult people by claiming to work any harder than they do.

[@markblance8492]

@@menow7903 You misunderstand the point. However working IT I’m not surprised.

[@evilzzzability]

If you're on that sort of number and not putting anything into a pension they you got serious problems. £110,270 is the optimum income if you sacrifice the full 60k into your pension, you have an effective tax rate of just 11.5% on all your income.

[@johnathankain8033]

The UK tax system is crushing. It is completely stands opposed to increasing living standards. The flat rate of tax absolutely is the solution. People also forget that corporation tax is really just also paid by individuals too as companies add it to their prices.

[@ashm4938]

Then people who have never had to pay these absurd rates in their life are like "wHy dO tHeY waNT tO aVOiD tAXeS"

[@greenwendal5056]

Hello? the cUcK tax system is meant to keep you poor.

[@jacobwhite1360]

Yes i totally agree, as someone who is currently putting put 15 / 20 job applications a week i agree and this is incredbily importsnt to talk about and not just he dismissed by the media as out of touch. These people are facing hardship, they are being robbed blind and are being silence through guilt over poverty and thats why the government has taken more and more. The reason this is so bad is not because they're living a worse quality of life than i am today, but it gives me absolutely no inspiration to work my ass off at the bottom and make it all the way up to that 1% of top earners and it is absolutely essential for society to have everyone working hard. The working class are seeing less and less point in playing your games because the sustem works for faceless corporations and aristocrats alike. They never planned to let us in, they never wanted the poorer folk of this country to be happier and liberated they only wanted us to play into their well oiled machine. Keir Starmer has about 6 months to fix the country i reckon otherwise its all gonna come down in riots and striking, and quite fucking right might i add.

[@Dinadino994]

I’m a full time carer , my income is £12,000 a year After deductions i have to run the home on £400 a month . That includes fuel , food , water rates & council tax .

[@london_biker6177]

If you are over 21 and working full time you should be paid at least £20,000 per year, that is the minimum wage. Are you just referring to carer's allowance or something?

[@Dinadino994]

@@london_biker6177 yes , carers allowance According to basic income id be better off . The person I care for is 24/7 ( vulnerable adult)

[@tudvalstone]

What you miss is that someone who earns that salary is also probably working a lot harder and did work a lot harder to get there. So, yeah, you feel you are not rewarded for all that effort, whereas one can make much less with an easy job or no job at all and feel happier.

[@kingcastro-s1p]

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[@waldenharvey1278]

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[@waldenharvey1278]

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[@tammystut]

please tell me more ?

[@waldenharvey1278]

I’ve been working with a financial coach because I don't have the expertise or confidence to navigate the ups and downs of the market.But recently, during a market downturn which showed me that there's a lot more to investing than I thought, my finance grew

[@waldenharvey1278]

Ovr £500,000

[@jakkuwolfinsomnia8058]

Indeed, most people don’t know this. One of the best salaries is around £50k

[@christines5430]

Really good video, with some valid points that the government should consider if they are really committed to growth.

[@chrispalmer24]

I agree - the VAT Threshold is so low for small businesses, seems counter productive!

[@ap4702]

Social mobility is suppressed. And the wide level of inequality means even the people in government are completely out of touch.

[@BluesHound100]

Flat tax rate is the way to go... look at what it did for Hong Kong under British rule ... everyone paid it as If was deemed fair and less costly to pay the rate than to try and find inventive ways to avoid paying it

[@tancreddehauteville764]

It would never work, and low paid people would have to pay 40% tax. Madness.

[@MbisonBalrog]

When UK wants to encourage entrepreneurship, I do not think social media is what they had in mind.

[@Scottweeier846]

I really appreciate the dedication in each video you post. Building a steady income is quite difficult for newbies. Thanks to Natalie Rose Strayer for improving my portfolio. keep up with the good videos.

[@Rodriguezpaul-9]

I'm surprised that you just mentioned Natalie Strayer here also Didn’t know she has been good to so many people too this is wonderful, i'm in my fifth trade with her and it has been super.

[@carolynvo7802]

The very first time we tried, we invested $2000 and after a week, we received $9500. That really helped us a lot to pay up our bills.

[@DaveCulbertson]

I'm new at this, please how can I reach her?

[@Nguyenvictory83]

After I raised up to 125k trading with her I bought a new House and a car here in the states also paid for my son's surgery Glory to God shalom.

[@Scottweeier846]

She's always active on Whats~App...

[@monkayjim999]

This is so true, when you get close to 50k there is basically no point working harder to get more pay as for me I would pay 42% tax then 9% student loan, plus start losing the monthly child payments of around £100 per month. If anything I have been buying holiday (pre tax) and upping my pension contributions to keep my taxable earning under the 40% tax threshold. I've even stopped working overtime (double time) as even at 2x pay its not really worth doing most the time.

[@MalavitaOfBB]

Having a flat rate if tax is what I would describe everyone paying their " fair share" .... But in that case how can they keep the mildly successful people from getting out of the rat race... everyone needs to be in the rat race for the system to work..

[@AdamBrowne-eg1eb]

Exactly, the tax trap is purposeful.

[@Da_Big_G]

The question is not whether or not we favour growth. The question ultimately from this video is whether or not we can design our tax systems to avoid cliff edges.

[@farzadjahanfard]

I know an HSBC manager who is making 160k. His account is somewhere on an island of shore, and he pays 0 tax. Tax is for poor people and people know no one . Rich barely pay tax .

[@maalikserebryakov]

Ah, the method of Offshore accounting. You do realise anyone can use this tactic lol? But the trick is. You need to be a foreign business owner for it to work. HSBC is also famous for corruption and fraud btw. What they donis they pay their salaries into off shore *corporate* accounts where income tax is nil. The employees pretend they are actually corporations from a foreign country. So government cant do anything even if it gets flagged

[@DavidAlexx]

Love this Chris - You really painted the picture! Absolutely crazy

[@chrispalmer24]

Thanks David!

[@kenville1429]

Truth is, £100k is not a high gross salary for a family in 2024z yes you can afford a home and bills but it’s not a life of leisure and luxury. £100k is the new £50k. £50k is the new £25k.

[@Osindileyo]

Affording a house and bills is more than what the vast majority can do. Complaining about having a stress free life when most can’t make ends meet is unbelievably pathetic

[@silvafox7719]

If they're doing better than 97% of the population I struggle to sympathise. The millions at the bottom are struggling to heat their homes and eat. Their monthly take home wage after tax allows a great lifestyle and an opportunity to save or invest.

[@ElemuntDesign]

The thing is 100k a year was pretty much just the old Middle class, this was a pretty common class the average person could get into just from some experience in the work market. It's night impossible now, the Middle class squeeze has just created a super rich class and a poverty class, with no reward for trying to climb higher.

[@silvafox7719]

@@ElemuntDesign Are you insane? 100K a year? Only 4% of people in the UK earn 100k or more a year, and that's based on figures from 2023. The average UK wage is £35K

[@dissonantiacognitiva7438]

Fair and I don't need it? What I don't need is to pay for other people who contribute nothing to my life Progressive tax is just sheer robbery, ans the middle class has been squeezed and squeezed for over a decade I remember hitting 45k several years ago, i didn't have kids, but my colleagues did, the government lowered the bracket, captured more people on 40% tax and stripped the benefits that they had So as the envious chant cry me a river, i chant improve yourself, improve your skills, don't be a parasite on someone elses labour

[@xristinarose2409]

In Europe its kinda the same. The more you earn, the more you get punished. Not even the taxes getting higher and higher, its also at the same time the benefits getting lower and lower until you get nothing but own more then half

[@adamloveless3576]

The system would be better with flat for all..

[@chrispalmer24]

I agree

[@FamilyManPhil]

If you have already accessed your pension then your option to put 60k into it has gone and is reduced to 10k pa. As a result your ability to avoid higher tax rates is reduced.

[@GillerHeston]

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[@rogerwheelers4322]

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[@FabioOdelega876]

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[@rogerwheelers4322]

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[@FabioOdelega876]

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[@AnonAtry]

Unfortunately we live in a country that loves the idea of more taxes and a nanny state from cradle to coffin so nothing will change and those that are able to climb the ladder and have the right skills and knowledge will continue to flee the country. We are already in a competency crisis, with things set to get much worse. If you earn close to or more than 6 figures then I'm sure you are already assessing your options to migrate elsewhere.

[@majorpentatonic2310]

Totally agree. But, there is no chance of Labour doing this.

[@ZeusScoon]

3:28 - For Info, full time Childcare in South is between £1,700- £1,900/Mo. I know this, because I currently have to pay it!

[@davidcooks2379]

The worst is to earn 360K, as you don't have the pension allowance anymore

[@lordprotector3367]

I doubt you'd need it!

[@thehammer9599]

@@lordprotector3367exactly the sort of attitude that got the Uk into the socialist mess in the first place.

[@lordprotector3367]

@@thehammer9599 LOL

[@halfbakedproductions7887]

@davidcooks2379 tax-free pension contributions are capped at £60k p.a. anyway. Granted that's a high ceiling and very few people get anywhere near...

[@4dra]

​@@thehammer9599 the UK isn't socialist lmao

[@anabelengaonabizzotto3573]

I live with my partner in the Netherlands and even tho we have good income, let's say high according to the government. We have a strict budget to follow because we are left out of any government help and childcare is really very expensive.

[@infour44]

Fiscal drag, political intent. A real disincentive to many. In Trigger’s famous words ‘why ask’ 👍

[@hjl3058]

it was 'why ask'

[@manichelearning]

Very true. And it is not just the salary. Even a high performing bonus is worse . It is better to perform low and get the same bonus as the high performers.

[@simonebruschi9793]

Just a beautiful video. Agree 100% with what you said

[@chrispalmer24]

Thankyou!

[@Alex-df4lt]

I make more than that in the UK and I'm about to leave soon. One of the reasons are taxes. Labour will not help me for sure.

[@tancreddehauteville764]

Bye bye!

[@jons9721]

One general issue with our tax system is there aren't actually enough tax brackets. A jump from 0 to 20 to 40% is silly. Could easily be additional 10% and 30% brackets which would be tax neutral. All for progressive taxing but it should an increasing slope not sharp jumps

[@seanm1430]

Google, Amazon, Vodaphone etc... they pay the least amount of corporation tax they can. Estimates by tax experts reckon they pay 3%. If they paid their fair share everyone's tax rate would be lower. UK's national debt is 2.3 trillion. Meanwhile ordinary people and small businesses get hammered. The cost of living in the UK is nuts, just makes it worse.

[@lucasedmund3600]

NO; Then you'd get nothing cos they'll move somewhere else.

[@garycroft8213]

No £120k is about the most tax efficient for high earners if you can put £60k into pension then this now keeps you under the child benefit charge too. You will pay higher taxes between £50-60k and lowe £500 of the savers allowance at £50k but this isn't a big issue if ISA's are used. Now if you earn £160k plus even with pension salary sacrifice, this could cause childcare to be withdrawn fir any early years children which couldbe a significant tax trap.

[@chrispalmer24]

It's definitely a great salary to build an amazing pension on. I was surprised how little you end up with on a £160k salary post pension, it's pretty shocking.

[@davem.4003]

​@@chrispalmer24What's really shocking is that you can put £60k into a pension tax-free and then you consider that as lost income rather than saving.

[@garycroft8213]

@@davem.4003 considered it deferred income and when you draw it, with the 25% tax free cash and hopefully income taken from drawdown as lower rate income tax st 20%, this works out at 15% effective tax rate, and potentially lower if also using personal allowance!

[@pfteve]

As someone who's on a 70k+ salary, i look at my upward trajectory and frequently look to other countries as i simply don't want to be extorted for tax. I think the UK has a real issue with keeping talent due to such terrible tax policy. Maybe i am biased, but i don't bee incentivised to stay, let alone thrive.

[@BatsAndBadgers]

the majority of people in the Uk are on 30k a year you are better off if you earn 120k...that means you are rich btw disgusting for people who complain when they have no idea what its like on 30k in the cost of living

[@Ianjdgale]

@@BatsAndBadgers get better and more marketable skills, if you have a low skill job you can only expect low wages

[@inbb510]

I don't think the problem is whether you are 'rich' or 'not rich' at 120k. The problem we have at the moment is as soon as people earn something like £120k as a salary, they emigrate to places where they will pay less tax (e.g. Luxembourg, Monaco, UAE, Thailand). Would you stay in the UK if you earnt £120k? I wouldn't as I am loyal to this country but many people aren't. If you ask many working-class people whether they would move if they earnt £120k I would assure you many people will say 'YES'. That's the problem. It isn't the rich-per-se or the tax-system per se that is the problem. It is just human nature for most people to pay as less tax as possible.

[@AnonAtry]

sounds like a you problem

[@piratesilver2786]

Flat rate all round is the only rational option. No gaming, no bad incentives just common sense.