$150 Million Games Are Killing The Industry.

[@BellularNews]

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[@DudeSoWin]

Fortnite is a cross industry deviant and publishers pet project born out of a bait and switch. Fortnite has no merit to ever touch standards for any baseline measurement.

[@vortraz2054]

I refer you to Hunt Showdown. Do a bit of homework into that games costs and margins. I think itl make a VERY interesting comparison to AAA

[@HoboG0blin]

The live service bubble is bursting, and it's beautiful.

[@chris9206]

it's not since most of the new ones are "failling". for example Foamstars and the First Descendant have failed before Concord was ever released. at the same time most of the people out there are playing 6+ year old games like Fortnite, Destiny, WoW, LoL, TF2, GTA5, and Overwatch just to name a few.

[@leoultimaupgraded9914]

It was bound to happen sooner or later, hopefully this encourages companies to make better games now if 70 or even 80% of games coming from these companies are average or slightly above average, I’d take that as a win and a step in the right direction

[@FelipeEscobar86]

@@HoboG0blin always loved me a good piñata. 🪅

[@madzaisa]

Service bubble is only a symptome. Production cost is extremely bloated. With each passing year we get more and more tools to make development easier. But game cost more and more, are made more sloppy each time, and actual amount of content that matters is lowering. The whole process need a shakeup, or big studios will just collapse under their own weight. And no, they can't just "make smaller games". With how things currently those would just cost them disproportional amount of money compared to Indie.

[@TrinityCore60]

I’ll be honest, I kinda like live service games, WHEN THEY’RE DONE RIGHT. That said, it’s an unfortunate reality that, with bitter few exceptions, all too many are just not done well at all. That said, it’s great that the gaming industry can heal like this.

[@MakiNoAtorie]

Miyamoto from the most recent Q&A: "Not every product needs to have high development expenses. In gaming, too, it's possible to create fun experiences with a small team and a short development period given today's technology. Maintaining this perspective is crucial." My man slamming the entire AAA industry in 5 min.

[@fumped]

Exactly, there's a reason people still play Tetris like 40 years later.

[@168original7]

@@fumped not to mention mobile games

[@Folutu]

Speaks from experience too considering Nintendo games are among the thriving games in this present market.

[@SimuLord]

There's indie, there's AA, there's AAA... ...and then there's Nintendo, happily chugging along doing Nintendo things since 1985.

[@168original7]

@@SimuLord and there are mobile games making billions like monopoly go, genshin etc

[@paullegend6798]

Same thing happened already with Hollywood movies. Massive production budgets, huge pressure on financial success, kills all creativity and risk taking. Endless chain of super hero movies following same template, until you even kill that golden goose by repetition.

[@BlueBD]

Also those same studios realizing they don't got to be in a expensive place like California and are leaving to cheaper and greener pastures

[@Drogoran]

and no need for any of it since many movies from decades ago are better and used a fraction of the budget

[@dnakatomiuk]

Marvel should have ended at the end of Infinity Wars but they couldn't and released nothing but shite afterwards

[@OhNoTheFace]

It's funny people pretend that people are sick of super heroes. Deadpool/Wolverine says no. People are just sick of a decade of crap writing and direction

[@Austin-sw3mf]

​@@OhNoTheFace Spider-Man 3, Dr. Strange 2, Guardians of the Galaxy vol. 3, and even Venom 3 have made bank, also.

[@anoriolkoyt]

In those 100 mill dollar games, I would love to know what percentage of that is in actual game development (art, music, writing, programing, etc), what percentage is spent on marketing, and what percentage on administrative. Then, compare it to the percentages of the 10 mil games from back in the day.

[@nanoflower1]

Marketing costs are a large part of the budget of these high $$$ cost projects. Both for gaming and movies. It's a sad state of affairs compared to what was being spent in the day.

[@billbillinger2117]

I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to learn that upwards of 80% possibly more is spent on marketing and "consultation".

[@mrzest6356]

@nanoflower1 dat reminds me of the steve jobs opinion abt sales & marketing ppl taking over companies and pushing down product ppl and forget what makes great products in the first place

[@kamurotetsu4860]

You still need to account for dev sizes. Morrowind had a team of 40, Skyrim had 100, Starfield had over 400 (which is laughable) as a quick example. Bloated, absolutely, but it's not difficult to understand why development is more expensive on the basic level than "back in the day."

[@KPX01]

@@kamurotetsu4860 and you get a game that is way worse than something made with 50 people you know the bloat is real

[@ZeroXSEED]

Gaming industry will not die, AAA gaming is however dying, and for every AAA studio falling a new AA studio will replace them. Indies are trucking on their own pace, having separate market from the giants and appealing the customer in different way.

[@jase276]

No kidding. Steam does these Indie events called "Steam Next Fest" and in the one last month I already found 6+ indie games that look and play great like gems made in the golden age of gaming. Some even have great graphics, for those who like to obsess over them, I personally prefer PS1/PS2 graphics

[@SimuLord]

@@jase276 The rise of the plug-and-play engine and stock assets has been both a great thing for indie (graphics and mechanics get better and better) and kind of a double-edged sword (one look at a maple tree and you know a game's made in Unreal with a stock nature texture set, for example, and those games look really dull and boring if you've played more than one or two of them.)

[@xana3961]

Honestly the only AAA games we can expect to be good are coming out of Nintendo and even they had a major flop recently.

[@00yiggdrasill00]

​@@xana3961 I don't trust any major gaming corporation. But at least Nintendo typically provides quality in what they give. Means instead of waiting a year to see how it all plays out I wait a few months before buying.

[@CrimsonBladezz]

This is massive cope gamer don’t care if a game is good or not if it has hype, and if the gwaphics are shiny they will buy it

[@astrobull6413]

The entire entertainment industry is collapsing under itself, and I'm here for every second of it.

[@TKUltra971]

*Stop censoring games. *Stop making all remakes clones of the Last of Us formula that was lighting in a bottle. *Stop censoring Remake games. *Stop removing all traces of Skirts, Dresses or anything above the knee like a 1950s public beach. *Stop forcing developers to dance to your tune when they "buy them out" for exclusivity. *Stop forcing agenda and politics into games. *Stop hiring illiterate baboons to defend you online to the point where they say you _dump_ gold. ...These are just a few things that come to mind.

[@razorback9999able]

*FUCK NEOLIBERALISM!!!!1

[@Chronically_ChiII]

@@razorback9999able More socialism would mean more state funded trash like Dustborn. Sad reality.

[@CrimsonBladezz]

Stop buying them how about that

[@pierregravel-primeau702]

If you want that, say no to the US religious party that is faschist lol. You know the story of chicken voting for colonel sanders? It is the US history...

[@TKUltra971]

@@CrimsonBladezz From Sony? Lightyears ahead of you and beyond good chum. Keep up the "" _good work_ " 😎

[@tommylakindasorta3068]

I've played a few good AAA games lately, but I'd say 90% of games I play are from smaller studios. I'll take original ideas over fancy graphics any day of the week. And they're cheaper to buy, and in the PC space they often run on less powerful hardware, so they're more accessible. Lots of advantages to AA and indie games.

[@MlnscBoo]

The amount of money it takes to make a game hasn't ballooned because of the development of a game. They've ballooned because of the people their hiring to develop them. There have been a bunch of veteran devs who have come out and said things like "people were paid for 3 weeks to rename files, instead of just running a batch script that could have done the job in less than a day." It really does come down to incompetence, from the worker bees all the way up to management.

[@MadsterV]

quota hires

[@kestrel1917]

What you said about younger viewers not experiencing the golden age of AAA gaming media definitely resonated with me. I'm 28 but even I'm old enough for some of my favorite games to have been picked up from the bargain bin. For example Splinter Cell: Conviction was purchased for a 13 y/o me by a friend's dad who took my friend and I to GameStop and I found it on a shelf, heavily discounted. I had endless fun with the campaign and local/online co-op with my older brother and friends and IMO Conviction, despite not being huge with series veterans, definitely laid the groundwork for "John Wick" type gunplay as a desirable thing in games as evidenced by people still uploading in-game action montages to this day. Or for new games, I remember being blown away by the DX: HR 2011 E3 trailer and getting the collector's edition with the art book (still kicking myself not keeping the book when I traded the game in). Or going to my other friend's house every weekend and reading the physical Game Informer magazines with cancelled concepts/games and articles I still think about to this day, watching coverage of games and E3 on the G4 channel (CinemaTech, Attack of the Show, X-Play, and also Cheat! with my childhood crush Kristen Holt lol), experiencing the releases of games like MGS3, Halo 2-3, Resident Evil 4 (watching my older brother play it because I was too scared), etc. in real time was amazing to see. Our 360 games and controllers were kept in an empty wooden clementine box next to that fat ass Sony Trinitron that made our hair stand up when we pressed power. And of course we couldn't forget to change the TV input before sitting down! Good times.

[@jase276]

We truly didnt know how good we had it

[@SuperhotdogZz]

@@jase276we used to believe games would only get better with better technology. When i played Dino Crisis 2, i thought the game would be so amazing if all the gameplay would have pre-rendered CGI level graphics, i think we have gotten there for a long time now, but the game aren’t necessarily more fun to play.

[@kestrel1917]

@@jase276 I agree, we really didn't. I'm sad kids today can't experience that and as an adult I'm even more sad the development of these consoles relies on resource extraction from the Congo and other places. Those kids deserve gaming too (along with the other things that constitute a good life).

[@kestrel1917]

@@SuperhotdogZz Yes 100%. Dino Crisis 2 is slightly before my time because I wasn't allowed to own consoles till a certain age, but stuff like game AI, at least for FPS, basically plateaued with F.E.A.R. and destruction physics from Red Faction Guerrilla have yet to be bested all these years later. The tech is definitely there and I think there's room for genuine innovation in the indie and AA space but broadly industry trends don't point to games actually being more fun as you said.

[@brad1426]

I remember when DX: HR came out, it was glorious.

[@micho510900]

I'm working in AAA, and It's supper inefficient, like you get through 10 people to get your art accepted from begining to the end. I do believe that with proper optimization and risks you could do AAA with a AA budget easy, also I had times when I had to redo one thing 10 times because art director didn't like some detail, at the end of the day noone even noticed it, but it costed like 4k $ of additional budget.

[@Toastcat890]

It's not just gaming It's the entire entertainment industry I miss the variety of the 80s and 90s across the board thank goodness for the indie industry they seem to be picking up the slack in all industries

[@HXRDWIREDGaming]

We're in the Disposable Vape era of gaming. Triple a will realize that investment doesnt equal outcome.

[@ArtificialQT]

Sony shut down their Japan game division, which was responsible for developing and publishing a lot of more unique, niche, but fun games, in favour of consolidating their California HQ’s power. If Sony are feeling the effects of a “blockbuster death spiral”, they have no one to blame but themselves.

[@shauncore808]

They've been letting the Killzone and Resistance IPs sit rotting on a shelf for over a decade, even though they're both established IPs that would be prime candidates for a AA production. It blows me away that they have something so easily usable, but they refuse to touch it because it's story-driven and not live service.

[@mawsometall4692]

Remember the old saying DON'T PUT ALL YOUR EGGS IN ONE BASKET

[@Secret_Takodachi]

Vampire Survivors is proof that you don't need cutting-edge graphics or a 59.99 price tag to make an absolutely massive success story. It was so successful it became the moniker for games that copy its mechanics. It wasn't the first game in its genre, but it was the best & it is CHEAP!

[@stefanradebach2889]

I am shocked, SHOCKED! Well not that shocked.

[@KryyssTV]

And the fact is that the games that have development costs of $200m are no more enjoyable than ones that cost $20m and certanly don't give you ten times the amount of content. This maddness was caused by clueless executives who think that photorealism is what makes a game great but that just bloats development costs instead.

[@Morpheus-pt3wq]

Fun fact, modern games with their "photorealistic graphics" look mostly the same, as some decade old titles - all the while they require significantly more powerful hardware.

[@empressbulby3761]

Exactly. Almost all the budget is just pumped into making the game look marginally "better" when a great art style will let you just have an amazing looking game with objectively worse graphical fidelity. Take wind wakes for example. That cartoon art style still looks good even today. It certainly shows the age, but unlike a game going for photo realism a few years ago, which usually age terribly, it looks fine.

[@empressbulby3761]

*Wind Waker

[@maiqtheliar789]

If I need the latest and greatest graphics card to enjoy a game which doesn't have better game play than a game I have owned for years then I will just play the game I have owned for years and go about my business. I can't afford to upgrade to the latest and greatest every couple of years just so I can see the individual strands of hair on a character's head. Especially if it is badly optimized. My weak ass graphics card can play Cyberpunk at at least the lowest setting. I don't need more than that to enjoy a game.

[@tasa4904]

@@Morpheus-pt3wq Not so fun when you have to facepalm when you see the end result.

[@jpsuper]

Then their company should not have made a remake of a 9 year old game almost twice as expensice as it originally was, and even more expensive in markets where salaries are lower than in the USA... Studios are killing themselves.

[@GladeRiven]

What I've notice is that a lot of AAA+ game studios have a lot of bloat - people who need to justify their position or department. We don't have as many true software engineers because The Gods got tired of getting hosed and retired. High end game asset creation has never been easier. Good software engineering has never been harder.

[@walczak9862]

These companies need to shrink their teams substantially these games have wayyyy too many people working on them changing things with no collective vision. If i worked at a studio and i proposed an idea for a game that got green lit id be devastated if i poured my soul into it and it got butchered by all the other people at the company because in large companies you cant have any real constructive criticism if theres 1000 cooks in the kitchen. You need smaller teams with strong leaders

[@TheArtistInTheDark]

I'm pretty sure in huge productions they avoid having those strong leaders on purpose these days. Suits don't want their success to hinge on one person, a Kojima or Miyazaki since it will collapse once they leave so they can't really force their cynical pay to win shid on them without consequences. Instead just have a big production where no one person is in charge of the vision, you don't need a vision anyway when you're cloning Fortnite

[@taddybear4244]

This year has had some incredible games from indie devs. Witchfire has been my favourite that I can think of immediately. I'm sinking most of my free time into Factorio. The OWSCrafters like Palworld, Enshrouded, Soulmask have all slapped. We've probably all lost hours to Balatro. Gori: Cuddly Carnage is insane fun. If you like roguelikes, NIMRODS dropped days ago. Last Epoch, Worshippers of Cthulhu, Thronefall, fucking heaps of amazing games.

[@Danceofmasks]

Stop putting accountants in charge of game development. Stop hiring lunatics. Well, the lunatics part is likely due to said accountants doing the hiring.

[@Turamwdd]

Naw, it is HR doing the hiring instead of the people that do the work. HR's filtering of resumes in the talent acquisition process has become absurd.

[@Davis_237]

Mass layoffs still ongoing, "Quadruple A" games flopping, and legacy games turning out duds, seems to me like the bubbles already burst.

[@guybrush20X6]

@Davis_237 I think this generation living through the Dot Com bubble and its spectacular collapse gave us a skewed view of what a downfall looks like. Sometimes, it's death by 1000 cuts

[@anthonygranziol7957]

No one asked the industry to triple the cost of development. And only counting the sticker price of a game is laughable. Consider the wide and varying monetization available right now and add in the fact that all physical assets have been converted into electronic media. Unit economics are outdated as are comparisons based upon them.

[@Dajova]

Publishers and CEOs did, because they wanted infinite growth. Now we're reaping the harvest of that.

[@glebvolodin3881]

Would be very cool to look deeper into the financial side of AA - what are those development costs to make a game that's above indie in production value, but not an extravagant splash spending of AAA. How to actually balance it? Even taking Space Marine 2, that you mentioned - how exactly did they balance out the cost in such a way that they can brag about it from a position of success?

[@OlgaReznikova]

I look at your name and I think that you actually know the answer to the Space Marine 2 riddle ;) It's been a very open secret, and I wonder when the Western game bloggers will finally have the courage to admit it.

[@Secret_Takodachi]

Im so glad I went full PC after the PS4 era. Not only am I eating well with older games & indie games, I can play the vast majority of those games on my PC & on my STEAM DECK! ❤

[@CrimsonBladezz]

I heard its a pain in the arse to get old games running on pc

[@AC-ut3nk]

@@CrimsonBladezz it's only happen to the game that is badly port or optimize like Fallout 3

[@extra4542]

I did the same thing this year, stopped buying games for my PS5 and went all in on PC

[@utfigyii5987]

@@CrimsonBladezz Funnily enough, they usually are easier to get running on linux (such as steamos) than on windows

[@guest0000p]

Is steak deck good?

[@techno_otaku]

Why is it hard for people to understand that it's okay to have a series that has a potential to continue if there is a REASON to continue be it story or evolving gameplay of what has come in that series, but also new IPs that have their own unique group of characters with distinct game feel that you might not see anywhere else? Like you said, indie devs are what's propping up newer and older gamers cause those teams were inspired by games that were decades old while expirementing and making their own creations! Art is difficult, yes, but when money ends up being the forefront reason as to why you make your games then you've already lost.

[@arjanzweers6542]

And then there's Nintendo which their offering of big AAA games like Mario, Zelda and Pokemon, and their AA offeringing like...Mario, Zelda and Pokemon, and many more. Not every game from a big IP needs o be a AAA game, you can also make smaller spin off games from those IPs between the big releases. Having a healthy line up that mixes both like how Nintendo has their Kirby and Yoshi games and the top down Zelda games together with their big hitters like 3D Mario and Zelda and Xenoblade, Splatoon and Smash. Big publishers as well as Sony and Microsoft seem to have forgotten this, placing all of their eggs in the AAA (live service) basket

[@urazz7739]

Nintendo certainly isn't perfect and has made some boneheaded mistakes, but compared to Microsoft and Sony, they look good.

[@kamurotetsu4860]

Not everyone wants kids game though, especially Pokemon.

[@arjanzweers6542]

@@kamurotetsu4860 Talk about missing the message

[@scottclements9967]

Games are typically rated E for Everyone it's main market just happens to have children in the demographic

[@saltiney8578]

I've always made the point that game prices did not increase relative to other things at all, when I was a kid they were 50$ I remember when they went up to 60$ and now im 33 and they're 70 sometimes, but thats pretty crazy thats only a 20$ increase for a brand new game over like 20+ years.

[@originaldarkwater]

I think the film industry is currently in the same boat. When DVDs gave way to streaming, the mid-tier market that could explore different concepts and ideas for not too much money went away. There was only streaming, which didn't directly make any money, and blockbusters, which are so expensive you can't afford to do anything more creative than the lowest common denominator. Similarly, if games are going to be revitalized, publishers are going to have to make/finance a lot more AA games that can break new ground without breaking the bank.

[@CurtOntheRadio]

I predicted this situation in 2019. I called it "the end of a golden age". Everyone disputed my prediction but here we are. The situation isn't all bad though and there is a cyclical aspect: the consolidation of developers and reduction of workforce will reduce wages, lowering production costs, and eventually opening the market to new (cheaper) operations.

[@pierregravel-primeau702]

I was there in 2006 with the horse armor DLC... ;P That was the first overpriced cosmetic upgrade! I hope you see many younger generation get scammed!

[@ZetaMoolah]

@@pierregravel-primeau702 the horse armor felt like the beginning of the end of an era.

[@SeraphimKnight]

AAA games development is dying for sure... But I would argue that AA and indie is better than it's ever been right now. Arrowhead with Helldivers 2, Game Science with Black Myth: Wukong, Sabre with Space Marine 2, Atlus with the Persona and SMT series and Metaphor (plus publishing other great games like Vanillaware's Unicorn Overlord)... Plus there's tons of game studios that are pushing out games without the insane budgets of AAAs and still seeing great success like Capcom with the Monster Hunter series, Sucker Punch with Ghosts of Tsushima, Larian Studios, FromSoft's self evident success with the Souls series and Elden Ring yes but also Armored Core being a smash hit. I can honestly keep going. There's tons of games flourishing out there, it's really just the inflated budget AAAs that are really suffering. Mid-budget and indies have been continuously going stronger year on year.

[@jase276]

All of those games you listed are AAA, lol. But, yes, I agree, AA and Indie are in a good place right now

[@Xdgvy]

6:20 That's disregarding the loss that they incur from selling consoles at cost/at a loss.

[@NightDocs]

What id like to see is a model where they fund creative ideas and make a short low budget almost vertical slice of a grander vision that you can buy for $10. Get more ideas out there to see what resonates. Kinda like the original Senua

[@JhebadiaSprunklefunk]

Working in games, I constantly lament the complete lack of understanding from management of how an oversaturated market works. The fortnite quote is 100% accurate in how they think, and it is killing big studios. But on the bright side, the slow death of AAA we're in the middle of experiencing, does indeed give room and attention for indies to thrive, especially with many vets quitting AAA for indie. Ironically your job is now less secure at a big budget studio compared to a low budget indie.

[@zantsmedia]

I feel as if most AAA budgets are massively inflated by some of the same problems that the movie industry suffers from, talented people likely aren't being utilized, and there are likely people getting paid a lot more than they should be I think it would be a lot more productive for the game industry to focus on smaller niches with smaller budgets

[@tornielsen2888]

Its possibly one of the best points of times to be a gamer. The A scene has newer been bigger and more diverse. With indie developers shooting up everywhere like mushrooms. As soon as the big established players die out someone will be ready to move in.

[@stephenmeinhold5452]

i think the bigest problem is the priceing there needs to be a tear system eg £20 - 30 - 40- 50-60 based on the content so more than AAA games get published the PC is still doing that and there are so many games being publised compared to consoles. hopefully the trend of people leaving the big companys and starting there own studio will continue. if the current priceing trend continues, less and less people will be able to afford them. i have seen it before they rise the prices so less people are buying so they raise the prices and eventully the whole thing collapses.

[@marsmotion]

the downside of AA is they usually go out of biz every 3-4 years because of being bad at managing people and money. what that means is employee turnover that ruins your life and forces you to live like a college student the rest of your life. i did this for 20 years. it was very hard. the other thing is when your working for a smaller company you often work longer hours as well and not all paid. hard on your partners or spouses. their is no greener side of these equations. i do think the big forgot the fun and gamifies monetization instead of the games. the pendulum swings forever to and fro. hopefully we learn as we go.

[@Jahus]

Waiting to see a video about Ori's Moon studio CEO talking about creative freedom in the gaming industry. I'm sure you guys have seen his recent takes.

[@PedestrianPony]

"We spent $200 million dollars on an army of developers, designers, animators, etc. and wasted 5 years making this game..." 1 dude makes Stardew Valley using SNES graphics and crushes you.

[@chucknowakowski6676]

One of the origins of the problem is that AAA became synonymous with the gaming industry, it’s not the be all end all, AA, A, indies etc are all part of the industry, and a better part of the industry IMO

[@jiiaga5017]

"Why would you incur the risk of creating something from nothing when you can just exploit an asset that you already have?" As a gamer, I respond: "Why would I incur the risk of testing something from these garbage companies when I could just exploit the huge gaming backlog we already have?" This is why I have bought... 2? New-ish games in the last 2 years. Its way cheaper and safer to invest in games 1-5 years old with reviews, fixes, and quality.

[@chrisgreilich9804]

PlayStation being the biggest contributor to lack of creativity. The single player third person action adventure machine.

[@jase276]

They killed off the only studio they had that made creative, unique games. Japan Studio.

[@victormateescu9856]

It’s amazing how out of touch both of these comments are lol

[@doctorsilva1345]

Rockstar mostly make 3rd person games and everyone loves them. So what’s the issue here ?

[@dragonriderabens9761]

@@victormateescu9856 how so? where's the lie?

[@panzer00]

PlayStation has always made narrative driven games, the 3pp perspective is just better for these studios and they're not RPG. You can not deny that PlayStation has the best 1st party games and studios, which is an objective fact.

[@TotallyToonsTV]

If the AAA bubble does indeed burst I'm already prepped. I've got a whole wall full of games from 1 - 25 years old and the indie gaming space offers a lot of good stuff. We'll find a way

[@SlegiarDryke]

It's almost arguable that, by the time the term "Triple A" started to be used with gaming; it's obviously a term that's been around and used a lot longer, far back as 1946 and beyond for other stuff; but for gaming specifically, i'd almost say as soon as it started being used, gaming started its downward trend. Now yes, there have been rises and falls of the industry, but i view it and refer to it as the sort of, downwards saw-tooth trend that is almost cliche to graphs meant to show how screwed you are over time. Honestly, if i was being nice, i'd give it a small stretch of time between the late 1990's (when the term in gaming picked up) and maybe mid to late 2000's, but after that the greed took over and the degrading rot set in. It's almost laughably pitying to call it "a time when the industry was healthy"

[@NightDocs]

5:00 should I pay more for a movie ticket if they gave it a bigger budget?

[@Malacine]

I think Nintendo is kinda filling that AA space. They have a few games that go over 100 mil in budget but that seems to be reserved for the big Zelda and Mario games. A lot of their other franchises don't have that massive triple digit budget to them from what I understand.

[@NighthunterNyx]

Kena Bridge of Spirits and Stray are two of the best smaller games. Both were Sony supported. Stellar Blade is perhaps a smaller and cheaper super cool AAA game. Also include Cult of the Lamb, Dave the Diver, CatQuest

[@Voltaic_Fire]

The persuit of what is popular to the exclusion of all else is ultimately destructive, we have seen variety from the big studios diminish as they went after live service games. We have only been getting sequels and clones for the most part, and it isn't working, they have milked those cows dry.

[@EastyyBlogspot]

I believe with live service there is a limit to how many there can be as people do not have unlimited free time, the worse part is many live service games at launch do not have anywhere near enough content to keep people going and then relying on a roadmap is then asking for trouble. When it comes to the cost of games I would love to just see a breakdown of some of the 200 million plus games to see where the money is going to just for my own curiosity really

[@Valyn]

It's no different than MMOs. Live services have basically filled that same need. And MMOs had so much difficulty because a generic carbon copy does not sell. There is no reason to quit a game your friends also play. A game you've already invested time and money into. The standard AAA trend chasing just doesn't work when people can continue playing that first game.

[@alyssavanderklift9296]

@@Valyn that has always been my issue with the modern live service scrud, they are (seemingly intentionally) making the mistakes of mmorpg developers of the past again and still wonder why it does not work.

[@jase276]

@@Valyn Live service is very different from MMOs. With MMOs there's a higher sense of community and communities are what keep games alive. Live service games are way too small scale to sustain that model, which is why so many fail.

[@statphantom]

People also seem to forget Wukong is a AA game, not AAA (sure high AA but still AA). and lets not forget hi-fi rush RIP (hopefully only for now)

[@Interference22]

Games should absolutely not cost $150 million to make. Those are insane numbers and they all know damn well it's not sustainable. You went big, now it's time to go home.

[@EliminatorCzech95]

To your ending point, I would we a bit worried there too. Because orient in Indies is going to be and already is super hard, because amount of game releasing is insane and to really look into you you have to spend you whole time to search for right games so to have some good medium might be big thing in future I think it is going to be like that, that studios need to grow on indies, build franchasis over years and than from that they can do a good 3A game. Problem is this is probably going to be way harder way that studios used to have and competition is going to be insane and could get to something like KZbinrs on KZbin, when you need to sacrifice some creativity to make sure your stuff is going to fill some popularity trends. Also there is another aspect and that is Unreal and all stuff around it making making of games so much easier could twist a lot of stuff here too, on both sides and my experiences to get into industry of game development is very bumby ride. So I'm very worried where this all lead, becuase I have no idea where games going to go and I have feeling it might lead to decrease in popularity.

[@NeonSirius]

Oh man. Westwood Studios mentioned. I long to see that wonderful "Proudly presents..." again. EA ruins everything they touch.

[@DragonLover2489]

Larin was imo always good. Divinity original sin 2 was a very underrated game. Before BG3 became a thing divinity was where it was at they really nailed it with original sin 2. Brilliant story, amazing combat, hours upon hours of gameplay. All different secrets, the actual character stories were amazing (especially red prince)

[@Azam-40]

I remember the time I had new games to suggested to my friends Last time I did that was with Knockout City

[@claudeyaz]

It feels like they invest in the West, differently than they invest in their own country, In China domestically, it is very popular if there are 2 restaurants with equal reviews, People will go to the restaurant that has the longer line... And people invest the same way too ! it's why the stock market was never stable there, the property market went crazy/bust..because everyone was buying properties, and same with the different banking scams, people think it's safe to do something whenever one else is doing it... But in the West they diversify their investments it's very interesting

[@wes8382]

We have more games than can be played in a lifetime so we don't need AAA or live service BS. Make good games or go away.

[@MylesDalí]

I've missed Shawn since he left PS. He knew what ge was doing, and was responsible for most of PlayStation's modern successes.

[@hochhaul]

There is a point to be made about how game prices have been stagnant and the negative effects that has had on the industry. DLC's and annual passes came about in a way to increase revenue since game prices haven't changed in decades. I remember new SNES games debuting for $60. Killer Instinct was more than that if I remember right. I for one wish that we had allowed game prices to rise slowly over the decades just so I could get the entire game on day 1 instead of having to deal with developers and publishers that hold back parts of the game to sell as DLC.

[@SloMoMonday]

Its refressing to have high level business and industry talk from someone that worked in the industry and ran a successful business, even if its a bit dated/limited. Every industry has the prestige moment and plays that draw in investors with massive numbers and success. But doing the work means learning that business is really surviving the day to day, week to week, month to month and so on. Cultivating opportunities that can be cashed in on down the road. Only chasing the next big high means you have nothing to pull you through the lows, that goes for both publishers and players.

[@ZeroUm_]

AA games are alive in Helldivers 2, Satisfactory, Valheim, Rust, Tarkov, and many many many Open World Survival, Build Crafters, Extraction Shooters, Deck Builders, Survivors-like, on games for Nintendo Switch. "Premium indie" studios can thrive.

[@teenybopper777]

Is Planet Coaster 2 really a AA title? The "deluxe edition" which is basically the standard because their DLC policy is so exploitative is $65

[@beebomcgroober9316]

The high cost of production is self imposed. Software development can be done anywhere. There's no reason why most game studios have to be in areas with super high costs of living like California.

[@maelstromg8767]

I like your take and am honestly very happy to hear some realistic positivity in the current environment! Creativity is so lacking in AAA I very rarely buy them now. I wade through the masses of indie titles looking for any spark of creativity that catches my eyes and truly miss the days of reasonable risk in big titles.

[@yamilionz]

I just found you. Your videos are amazing. Will probably binge

[@tmbfreak_16]

My backlog is in love with this imminent burst, not gonna lie

[@pawzom2564]

One of the biggest things I think these 3A companies fail to realise is that when you work with something that is fun and you are passionate about where a decent chunk of the work happens in the head through ideas/inspiration etc then you dont really stop working in the same way you do with work you dont enjoy as even when you are at home relaxing or playing a game you get ideas out of nowhere that can then be applied when you go back to work. People that work with things they dont enjoy shut it completely out most of the time. So in one companies get free work out of their employees if they have fun at work while at the other they dont.

[@IHeart16Bit]

AAA (mostly in the West) is such a trash fire, its at the point i don't understand how anyone is funding it (customers wise). Support small publishers, indies, niche Japanese titles. You'll be surprised how fun games still actually are.

[@TrickyJebus]

Can you do a Revival of Payday 3???? Its back to mostly positive on steam on recent reviews. Also its competitor, Crime Boss Rockay City filled the void while Payday 3 was cooking in the oven

[@tiagocosmos]

"triple AAA" doesn't mean what the the "Triple AAA" companies think it does nowadays.

[@gilian2587]

Very few AAA games get made these days. Very many DDD games get made by big companies with big budgets, no vision, a dash of activism, and no spine.

[@overratedcynic9124]

Outside of being stuck in MMOs I only bought indie games for the last 3 years. The only big budget game was Baldur's Gate 3 because every other game felt not worth spending time on. So I totally feel with this sentiment.

[@catcatcatcatcatcatcatcatcatca]

One could also argue that because of better tooling the AA level of technology is now achievable by bigger indie projects. You can do proper physics and good graphical fidelity for much cheaper, while previously this was a wall that forced a project to go for the AA budget. If the game doesn’t have full voice acting there clearly is something very concrete that is missing. If the studio can’t do 3D that is a very big restriction. If the engine can’t handle interacting with objects very well because of poor physics engine that will have a big effect. But if you can’t render hair simulations, skin texture and realistic dynamic lighting you aren’t missing that much. There just isn’t those kind of huge technical limitations that separate indie from double A titles. I actually am not really sure why the big studios keep pushing the AAA envelope in certain categories while releasing games that lack polish and are buggy. I suspect part of it is that progress in rendering, simulations and new features is easy to measure, so internal pressure is build even if the audience no longer is as eager to push those boundaries. So until there is a reason promising concepts absolutely need those aspects to tell the story and be enjoyable, it just isn’t worth the extra investment to make it doube A.

[@Echoside7]

AAA Gaming: You either die a hero or live long enough to become the villain.

[@PipBoy3k]

The expense associated with AAA games is ENTIRELY associated with graphics and voice overs; game systems and mechanics haven't just been stagnant, they're actively degenerating. To be honest, I'm fortunate enough to be able to afford a 4090 and 12th gen i9, and I use it for maybe 2 AAA games a year and mostly indies. The last gaming PC I built? a 1.4ghz Pentium III and a Geforce3 Ti 200 so I can play some Win98 classics.

[@galixeesgrotto5805]

See this is why I want to make a MMO. I can't because I don't have the funds to hire people but I desperately want to make a new MMO with a few of my core ideas that as far as I am aware, no one has ever done before. Yeah yeah I know, yall have heard that before. But to share a portion of the idea, think of a mmo that you start off with the usual base classes. Warrior, Rogue, Mage. But when you start, all you have is the basics of the class. Warriors will have a basic attack and a block. Rogues will have Basic attacks and a form of stealth. Mages will have the typical Magic Arrow and a heal. That's it. Here's part of the idea. Crafting, finding, purchasing, reputation earning, you obtain your other skills via making money and buying them. You can craft your skills if you spend the time and effort in upgrading your crafting. You can randomly FIND skills in... say a library book when you decided to look for lore about the MMO world. You can help out the NPC's and they will eventually reward you with skills. Who knows, maybe the beggar down the street has an apocalypse meteor shower spell, or perfect stealth, or a "type" of a warriors whirlwind that causes bleeding and poison DoTs on the target. Furthermore when you find a skill you really REALLY like then you can use your crafting abilities that you leveled up to up***** whoops that almost revealed the very tip of a second idea to add depth to a character that would make each individual players style and personality their own. We can't be revealing that to the world, oh no. This must be saved for when I can hire people.

[@zainroshaan]

Man I remeber playing price of persia sands of time for first time and then playing the first assassins creed I was so invested in them I didn't know what time of day it was outside I was obsessed.. these kind of nuanced games don't come any more these games were so dramatically diffrent to what I played before that it was awe inspiring but now every games a clone of the previous one

[@kalm12345]

For most AAA games these days (even games that are not live service), that 59.99 price tag is just the entry fee... Prices have gone up, but like everywhere else, they try to be subtle about it. Though there is the balancing that there are a ton of sales these days on Steam and other retailers (except Nintendo, they don't believe in cutting prices). I kind of want to see an honest review of how much games cost these days, including how much they make off initial full price sales vs discount sales vs their additional revenue (dlc, micro-transactions etc.) IE. on average, how much does a person spend on a game?

[@FableTheWolf]

How many more titles like this until it actually bursts? They're just starting to complain now after the years of clear failure and literally everyone else watching the bonfire get bigger from a distance: how many more until they actually get it together?

[@gulli72]

Yet another example of the fact that, if you optimize absolutely everything for revenue, you ultimately end up with zero revenue.

[@Forevergames-vn6gd]

Hi Eric here creator of Penance and supporter, I have to kinda disagree because the creativity is hidden or ignored. In the triple A world of fiction lives the ESG demon. ESG cares nothing for customers nor art. They invest to push a message to the public. Streamers police the walls of their coin fiefdoms. The funny part of this video is a indy can produce through ur and unity triple A quality titles. Yet AAA is a blockade to real artists attempting to create outside the structure of the corporations. It's sad that we think the things presented here are the core of the problem. It is the structure itself and if you do not change the structure it will never produce anything but what it is producing. BGG3 made outside the system the old way dominated them all. If we had a games news media that spotlighted people like me we would see change but I am sorry to say this isnt being found here. People are talking mountains of evil about AI as it approaches. Yet the exact same people trying to maintain control over fans and funding are the same people crying we aren't hiring them. You refused us coverage and gatekeeperd us away from public funding ext. The continued use of propagandis terminology is getting bad. AAA is for investment purposes and these mega studios is one flop after another. They have huge budgets but they have not been triple A in decades. A studio was triple A because it could sell and pay the bills. It's time things change for real and people change whom is being promoted. Streamers and people like Bell have always had the power but simply wont whield it

[@gilian2587]

I'll repeat what I said in an earlier comment chain. Very few AAA games get made these days; a great many DDD games are made with no vision, no creativity, no game loop, and repugnant badly written story.

[@SenkaZver]

What? You're seriously blaming the ARTISTS as the ones trying to maintain control over fans and funding???? Are you mentally insane???

[@Forevergames-vn6gd]

@@gilian2587 Well what else do you think a corp studio will produce following a formula and not a vision?

[@gilian2587]

@@Forevergames-vn6gd Publicly traded companies in particular seem to be insufficient to the task of producing good games.

[@Forevergames-vn6gd]

@@gilian2587 Yes and its designed that way. Boards and department heads ect ect. Can a large design studio work, Yes but it needs to be around a single persons vision or small group. I will continue to say the actual game needs fleshed with lore and life before a single pixel is ever made and thats simply not how its done today in these companies. I have not yet figured how to bridge the game but I know I am right. If not mne maybe some other true artist will be able to jump the gap and fix things....

[@boblionia]

AAA Publishers: more money in mean more money out Indie devs building world-class experiences using an IBM5150 and GameMaker: I spent about $20 and me and my friends are now multimillionaires

[@onizagru]

I've been priced out of AAA gaming for a while now. I haven't played a new title in quite some time. Not only can I not afford a rig to game on due to high graphic demands, I just can't afford the 90$ ask every time something new comes out. I dunno. Doesn't seem like it's worth continuing down that path if the prices just keep going up. Especially after all of that 'digital releases will be cheaper' bullshit they tried to feed us when digital releases were just starting out.

[@couchguy427]

One thing I hate hearing is when people say a specific thing like politics is in EVERY game or why ALL games have live service. My thought is usually "do they only have a few games" or "do they only play COD games?" My son rotated throught the same 3 games for years. YEARS!!!! I bought him new games and he would never play them. Now that he is at university, he rarely plays online due to wifi lag so he is FINALLY playing souls like games and little $4 indie games. And he's loving them. People need to also go out on a limb and try these random games they never thought they would be interested in and support creativity and originality. Still though, I spent hundreds on games he still won't try. I've done the same to friends as well where I gift them games and they get addicted to something they previously thought was not interesting. I own thousands of game across several platforms. I never get addicted to one game. Had a friend lose his job when I got him into WOW. I'm addicted to ALL games.

[@kraosdadafusfus8034]

I have the sensation they're gonna double down on the very things that left them in this situation in the first place, because they'd rather worship themselves than to listen to any criticism.

[@shieldphaser]

The reason AAA big bets were thought to succeed is because, if nothing else, they can always aim for the selling point of being "the biggest" or "the prettiest" or whathaveyou. If you make an A game your gameplay needs to be spot on to stick, but even an AA game can't rely on things that are easy to stuff onto a spreadsheet -- and spreadsheets are the only language the economist CEOs speak.

[@zsoltk4470]

I'm already subscribed.

[@Jonchua1]

Although the price has only increased to 69.99, there is a MUCH larger pool of people buying the games. If the games are good you are making more money. Thats why pricing has not really changed.

[@Eric-ct2ri]

and the games tend to be inundated with microtransactions these days. so even if the retail price hasnt changed much the amount of money they can make per customer per game has gone up drastically.

[@lycanwarrior2137]

That was true for the past few decades. However, audience growth is already stagnating while game development cost still keeps growing. Hate to say it, but prices will either continue to rise, MTX will get worse or the industry will consolidate to just a few companies.

[@Eric-ct2ri]

@@lycanwarrior2137 the audiance is still growing its just that they make games that dont interest people or they have alienated the user base and lost customers forever soo eitherway its their fault.

[@mediamass1404]

so id like to see a conversation take place about thunderbolt and the potential utilization of the Apu as a booster for laptop graphics?

[@nortyfiner]

Game companies wrote their own eulogies when they stopped making games first, and started making cash shops that only accidentally had something resembling a game attached.

[@jamescousins9216]

Funny. That’s what people are saying is the same problem in Hollywood: The B-movie on middling budgets are dead, and it’s because big budget movies are so much more expensive and have so much higher expectations… from the financial department and investors. So where does this guy say the similarities and differences are between industries?

[@stizmac88]

The death of modern gaming doesn't concern me in the least. Indie gaming is thriving and there are enough retro games to entertain me for the rest of my life.

[@arrogantbandit1]

But at the same time: "A big complaint about Spider-Man 1 were the MJ parts and not playing as Peter enough. We know what to do! Let's double down on that!" Also them: "Why did Spider-Man 2 not sell as well... it's a mystery.."

[@tenmamut]

I've been waiting for it to burst for like 5 years already

[@720jlconner]

Wish Shawn could come back to playstation today. Hes was one of the few execs that actually understood what we want in our video games.

[@Lordhakai241]

Stopped listening at 1:59 "There's not much creativity. Fartnite did these numbers, so we expect to do these numbers. Yada yada yada" Tgis literally sounds like a bunch of corporate stooges trying to regurgitate the same unfinished "AAA" games on repeat and then making excuses for why they're not selling anymore. Yall still gon buy the PS Pro 😂😂😂

[@spraykustoms1]

I'm sad to hear about Don't Nod because Banishers Ghost of Eden is my game of the year!!! That game is amazing with a fantastic premise.....loved it!!! Signed Just a picky baby 🍼