2013 Model S P85 Signature degradation test after 7 years

[@ddeboy002]

I have a 2014s 85 and I still get 253m full charge. Car has 397k miles on it.

[@empedance1933]

That’s insane! I’m looking at a 2013 P85 on my local craigslist for $25k USD that has 250k miles on it, and I was wondering what maintenance you’ve had to do on it?

[@alittlebitmoore]

I am guessing with that distance on it you Supercharged a lot. Is that the original battery ?

[@ddeboy002]

@@alittlebitmoore yes.

[@alittlebitmoore]

@@ddeboy002 Thanks, my 2017 100D is only at 70k, 90% AC charging so hope to keep that a long time :-)

[@Aiphares]

yes and no, i think its still very interesting because a car that is standing still for a long time usually also takes damage and leaving the battery with bascially next ot no interaction for some time might damage it as well. People already proved that lots of driving and high mileage is not much of a problem with Tesla. This shows me that moderate to little use as a daily driver isnt going to cause trouble either^^

[@ElmarBon]

You should also do a degradation test on an old model s with lots of kilometers like 300.000. that would be really interesting!

[@AB-yt4hd]

Yes, 5% in 7 years is good. I am curious to see how it will go with my Ioniq (2.5 years and 92000km only, but driving 45000km/yr now). I don't see any degradation yet, in range or with the OBD2 tools. I don't supercharge it very often and try to charge it most of the time at home at 80-90% max. Last trip : 900km round trip on the motorway with A/C and 13.3kW/100km in average. Still charging at 70kW on the fast chargers. I hope that the battery will degrade very slowly.

[@davidbeppler3032]

@@grandtourerpt There are Several older Teslas with over 300,000 miles on them for Tesloop. Out of 11 cars 6 battery replacements, none because of battery degradation. Almost exclusively supercharged.

[@ElmarBon]

@@davidbeppler3032 Thats actually not that bad, 300.000 miles divided by 250 miles range equals 1200 mostly supercharged cycles. And these batteries are the old (ish) technology, hopefully soon there will be batteries released which will reach much more miles (cycles).

[@davidbeppler3032]

@@grandtourerpt No, that is a lot of batteries that were built quickly and replaced under warranty. Go look it up.

[@davidbeppler3032]

@@ElmarBon Not just old, but quickly and often poorly built. The tech is great, the build quality was poor. That is what most often caused the need for replacement. New company building a new product that nobody had ever built in large numbers quickly before. Was an expected problem.

[@kasmopaya2676]

Outstanding car back then, outstanding car today, outstanding car tomorrow. Model S!

[@leftcoaster67]

Best vehicle Telsa ever has built?

[@kasmopaya2676]

@@leftcoaster67 Till the Y comes out yes. (: In America the Cybertruck could take that crown.

[@szymonsadowski5624]

@@kasmopaya2676 Tesla Model S Plaid

[@kaleidoscopeon]

outstanding price too. /s

[@olireg5696]

my stat: 367km range w/ P85 2013 (21" inches) w/ 220K km on the counter.

[@Dragehest]

My old 2014 P85 with 140k km is still getting 350km range. I drove 280km in one go this summer and had 22% remaining battery at the end. This was from sea level and up to 1000m elevation.

[@DS-pk4eh]

What about charging speed? Is it still like before?

[@iCoolaxe]

As some people have already stated in the comments, it would be interesting to see a range test for a Tesla with high mileage (250,000 km and higher). A car that's done less than 80,000 km SHOULD still obviously be in great shape.

[@federicopittaluga4762]

So the conclusion is: "Just don't by a Tesla from Bjorn" because he destroys the battery at the superchargers :D... Nice and usefull video, like always, you're the best ev reviewer out there!

[@trilodroid3628]

8:45 or so... 6% degradation from lots of supercharging and going to 100% charge it seems after just one year (lots of mileage). But a 7 year old car with rare supercharging and rare 100% charge only had a 5% degradation. And most degradation happens in the first 6 months, then it flattens. Very very nice info.

[@Reason077]

I can't think of a better way to sell a used EV than to get Bjørn to test the battery and tell everyone how good it is. Well played Marcusbil, well played ;)

[@chriswhiteman5817]

This guy is the absolute authority on EVs, the only EV reviewer I can actually sit and watch for an hour. Did you ever do a review on the Ampera? that is what I have but planning a model S in a few years

[@bluecollardisruptor9584]

What an incredible vote of confidence!

[@zes3813]

wrgg

[@CreRay]

I think 7 years on we can truly appreciate what Tesla has delivered. Be it range, efficiency, or the user friendliness and speed of the controls, in can still match or beat most cars which appear in 2020. Amazing. There’s so many ways were Tesla paved the way, the competition just unashemedly copied it.

[@Fortune090]

Hey! Used 2013 85 owner here. Through my own testing, I've also found mine to be around 70-72kWh. They're holding up surprisingly well! Just got the MCU2 upgrade (in the US) and it feels like a brand new car to me.

[@ahmednaim3413]

I have a p85 from 11.2013 had 247000 km. 9% Degradation. Supercharging 25% from the total charging

[@theophiluslamptey47]

Adrian Dębowski how long does it take to supercharge to 80%?

[@ahmednaim3413]

Well i didn't calculate it exactly but i still get 128 kw/h at the peak but ofcourse it is a bit slower than when it was new

[@ewaldwolk2250]

Never underestimate problems because of higher getting inner resistance from the cells. Even when the capacity is 95% after 10 Years, the battery can be useless because of the high voltage drop under load. In conclusions the car will limit the power to half of or less of maximum power from a new car. Older Cells had often problems with aging (Some even leaked and then destroyed themselve). With nowadays cells that is not a problem anymore. Even more I have seen unused cells from 2013 that deliver brand new capacity and resistance!! So aging is not a problem anymore. And changing the battery after 15 years should be no problem then. Also there will be lot of used packs that in contrast to fossil can be monitored and checked perfectly !! You can measure a battery and sell it warranty and be sure that it will work without problems. Hell I LOVE Batteries :D

[@zes3813]

wrg

[@ColinFox]

I have a 2013 P85+, and that + makes it more performant but also more inefficient. I've also driven it over 131,000 kms, and in that time my rough estimate is 10-12% battery degradation.

[@dragospahontu]

Nice

[@TRYtoHELPyou]

Just did 1700 mile trip in our oct 2013 s 85. 3% to 90% showed 63 kwh added charging at 30 amps, some 40 but then it bumped down. Great work man!

[@jongvyn]

Good review as always, you're one of the best reviewers on youtube! (a Model 3 driver)

[@patriceledodo]

Very interesting, it’s really a need this tests of 2nd Hand electric cars on KZbin, good job 👍🏽 The problem with Tesla is, when I gonna buying a 2nd Hand Tesla in foreign, u can not bring it to Tesla in my country to repair, when I have problem with the car I have to go back to Norway 🇳🇴

[@Pupuzor]

It would be very interesting to compare it with the same spec car but with much higher odometer stats and/or with more SC over AC charging.

[@theophiluslamptey47]

Adrian Dębowski good point

[@justinsison3250]

I have a 2014 P85D and it also has trouble breaking that 99% state of charge. If I had to guess, it could be a calibration issue with these early version battery packs (v1 and v2) as they age, however I have not spent much time looking into it as I rarely try to charge to 100%.

[@danielsiffredi8403]

What people say about batteries degrading harsh if the car is hammered a lot. Well ... that happens even worse with ICE cars, transmission goes to shit, gas efficiency goes bad as well. People need to realize that ICE cars are extremely inefficient and if you hammer them , well engine and transmission degradation kicks in really fast. Good work man. Love your channel!

[@Pabla98]

I own a 2014 S p85 and the battery has only degraded 9%, I never supercharge it and never let it get past 30%. On the down side its always needing repairs, thank god I purchased the ESA I would've spent the same amount I saved in gas for repairs

[@Basta147]

Insane results 👌🏽 happy to own a tesla 🍀🌞

[@gwarlow]

I don't know why so many viewers just can't seem to find the "like" icon? Cheers on another great video!

[@JBsC6]

Interesting report and insights. Thank you

[@derGerhart]

In some parts of germany we have our summer break very late. In badenwürtemberg for example we are still in the "summer" break (altough its starting to get cold). Some families use that so they can get vacation with their kids outsite the season where its often less expensive.

[@kacperpawlowski1149]

That's very impressive!! 👍😁

[@pigedehekkan]

Keep up the good work. This proves that el-cars is an excellent alternative to ex-cars.

[@joopvanroy6599]

And THAT is why Tesla limits Supercharging on these old models :)

[@mackster85]

Decent battery capacity and a modern interior thanks to the the up to date software via OTA. And this is their first mass produced model in a early version. E-Tron, Taycan, ... Test in 6 years will be interesting.

[@RubenKelevra]

And you can still upgrade to new MCU 😙🎶

[@Plexipal]

Good news for me i have a 2014 Model S 85.

[@bonda_racing3579]

How often you supercharge?

[@Plexipal]

@@bonda_racing3579 About once a week in winter. Spring/summer i use solar at home.

[@bonda_racing3579]

@@Plexipal really? So your battery degrades faster when using supercharging. So at home DC charging is preferable?

[@P4FElton]

i live in portugal and the electricity cost here is like 13cents to 15 cents a kw depending in alot of factors and so on but in the end... a 85kw batterie recharged at home would cost almost 15 euros... i mean it is cheaper than diesel? yes but it isnt that cheap as people think... plus the incovenience of charging on road takes longuer... charging at home takes a week... i mean they are cool and all but electric cars just starting to breath and not quite there yet... maybe in a few years...

[@bjornnyland]

*85 kWh

[@P4FElton]

@@bjornnyland that... But still you got my idea...

[@tamasstrezi]

I measured exactly the same :D I have a 2013/12 Model S85, measured and reported(by service mode display) is 71.5kWh, after 178 000kms. I can safely run it down to 0% without any drops, but I start to have power limit below 20%.

[@bjornnyland]

You will probably get 70.5-71 kWh after losses.

[@tamasstrezi]

@@bjornnyland Really happy with the car! Good to see your perspective, who drives the more recent (shieeet), ahem cars :D Not too much negatives, except FSH and infotainment. I plant to have the head unit upgraded (if / when possible) to MCU2 with 4G at some point...

[@tlezze91]

Very good tutorial, I’m in Fremont use to work there! Been trying to explain this theory to everyone interested in a Tesla but afraid

[@farukhsharipov]

The reason it still has so much battery because inside is P100 battery limited by software. This was done to reduce production process. There was time that you could unlock the battery with additional charge.

[@autosundspiele1602]

Looking forward to the test of this car in 5 to 10 years! (with original battery pack)

[@nakfan]

Another commenter has a Tesla P85 from 2014 with 396 k miles that can still drive 253 miles (404 km) on a full charge ... Impressive...

[@snoopyfix2]

Great video! My wife and I are looking at purchasing a used Tesla and this helps a lot.

[@pilditajs71]

Super low mileage for this car. Could you do a similar test with an electric car with at least 250,000 km?

[@TheFPSPower]

Yeah, that is more important. An engine could last 20 years but if it has 200k km in 20 years, it's not that impressive.

[@kardy12]

TheFPSPower There are plenty of results out there for higher mileage driving out there. The reality is that most people are not high mileage drivers, so focusing on degradation for high mileage cars is actually not “more important” for most people.

[@TheFPSPower]

@@kardy12 How is it not more important? If the car does well with high mileage it means it does even better with low mileage... It matters for everyone.

[@pilditajs71]

@@kardy12 In the country where I live, a car with a mileage of 200,000+ km is considered a little used car, just run in. Many countries, including mine, mostly drive cars imported from Germany, for example. I am currently driving an Audi from France, the mileage is approaching half a million.

[@kardy12]

TheFPSPower There are plenty of results out there on how much batteries have degraded with higher mileages. By contrast, I have seen far fewer comparisons with relatively lower mileage after a time period like seven years (except Leafs, but their batteries degrade badly on part because unlike Tesla they haven’t bothered including a temperature management system). And even in the US where distances are greater than in Europe, the average commute is 15 miles (24km) each way. So this result is far more relevant to most ordinary people.

[@smaldo19]

Quick estimate, the pack has been cycled about 220-240 times. It should have heaps of life left in it if looked after.

[@aigarius]

Seven years is a meaningless stat. This is exactly the expected battery degradation after about 80 000 km driven with mostly AC charging. The rule of thumb is very clear - first 50 000 km will bring you 5% degradation. Every subsequent 50 000 km will give you 1% degradation. Age is basically irrelevant, unless the car is is sitting with completely full or empty battery for years.

[@bjornnyland]

Incorrect. Age also degrades the battery.

[@aigarius]

@@bjornnyland In theory - yes. In practise this test of yours seems to disprove that idea. From previous cycle testing we already know that Tesla batteries degrade 5% in the first 50k and 1% for each subsequent 50k or distance driven. So for a car with 80k km drive the expected degradation from cycling alone would be between 5% and 6%. You measured 5% degradation. That does not leave *any* space for age based degradation at all.

[@KsiNixNie]

@@aigarius Since the battery supposedly has a 10 kWh buffer, we can safely assume that that buffer has been (partially) consumed. Impossible to tell how much, but age degradation will certainly have occurred.

[@danc2014]

Tesla sales ploy to show better performance of the battery than you actually get. The 85 Kw battery is really higher and is software controlled to show only the 85Kw. When Tesla cars were in a fire disaster in CA, Tesla disabled the power limit and all the battery power was available for people stuck in the traffic jam. The SW was to keep the battery warranty from being invoked . This later became an option, the Model S and Model X owners can upgrade to the Extended Range version via an over-the-air update for $8,000.

[@bjornnyland]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/q4LZn3ippJmgi6M

[@cbromley562]

Incredible. Nice looking car too.

[@nathanhood2415]

Amazing video! Hope it blows up!

[@micl2003]

Bjørn: „This is not the 1000km challenge“ Me: „Well when is it then?“ 😁

[@jestronixhanderson9898]

Mmm exactly where I thought it would be :) my leaf at almost 6 years is at 14% so shows you what battery cooling does and of course management. my concern with any battery even if it’s giving 95% is of course a bad cell group. in my leaf there are 96 cells, if one goes bad it’s game over. 96 points of failure :) Tesla has cell groups but more cells, I’m sure they can manage the a single cell failing in a group and the owner will only see maybe a 2% Change in range and performance ? the packs would just work around the issue ? Either way shows you how well Tesla chose their chemistry

[@DeerKoden]

The equivalent of 32 thousand euros for a car in such condition...i would honestly think about buying it if i was anywhere near Norway.

[@arvin6606]

The difference of using electric and gas is huge. This is only in a single day, imagine if using gas for 7+ years 24/7. Lots of money saved just by doing this. I hope i could buy Model Y in the future :)

[@ovi9610]

Congratulations to Elon's guys for making such a superb car. After seven years none of the competition could get these numbers.... 5% battery degradation after 7 years and 78k kms.

[@tenzinpassang4812]

I'm new to EV, and let's a outlier situation happens and that person has 35% degredation, then if that person wants to buy a new set of batteries, how would one go about doing that and what could be the possible cost? Thank you.

[@boxr_4214]

@@tenzinpassang4812 replacing the battery on an EV is akin to replacing the engine on an ICE car. not many people would bother doing it, but i believe the cost is upwards of $5000. that being said, the warranty on tesla batteries is 8 years or 150k miles with 70% battery retention. meaning, if your battery retention goes under 70% within the first 8 years or 150k miles then you can have it replaced under warranty.

[@tenzinpassang4812]

@@boxr_4214 thank you for the explanation.

[@StarkVandalez]

his degradation is 15%. not 5%

[@EnnTomi1]

The Chinese company now selling car without the battery, instead they rent the battery or lease them as a service. so that your car value won't depreciate with the battery. also it is cheaper to pay the initial price of the car. ofc you will be paying the battery fee, but also that might be good thing too, you might be offered a lot more "different size package battery" depend on your daily usage case. i think this is a good practice. also they offer to swap the battery within 3 min to a fully charged one, and those stations are very small too.

[@DavidDarrow]

I kind of miss the old virtual center cluster. That's the same display I had when I got my p85d, but lost it as soon as the autopilot firmware was released.

[@davidmikhail7617]

Believe it or not - driving in chill on the older model Tesla’s gets you better efficiency (which equals better range).

[@rawbowke]

Haha, greetings from Germany! Just did a massive 8000km roadtrip to the north cape and back in my 2014 S85 over the last two weeks. It has twice the milage - 70.6kWh remaining (checked via OBD). Many of the old 85 packs are in pretty good shape but unfortunately others got limited charging rate. Wonder how it will develop once out of warranty.

[@Jonathantuba]

I like that old dashboard display. On thing is although 7 years old, that model S has only done 78k km - my two year old model X100D has done more than that and probably my battery degradation is very similar.

[@FroddeB]

Very interesting, this is however a car with very few kilometers. If you put this up against a more abused tesla with between 200-300 we would see how much the acceleration and general wear of driving would degrade the battery. Still though 5% over 7 years is good for any battery. The owner took good care of their car.

[@JustinHubertus]

There are not only germans on the road in norway, but also on your channel 😉

[@kelvinham8576]

I hope battery replacement is available for these older models in the future as next-generation batteries are likely to have much longer life.

[@HowToDoitright]

How come I don’t see this type of speedometer in my cluster? Did Tesla got away with the round analog look? This looks pretty cool to me 😎

[@timsonxx]

I thought the P85 had 85KWh battery because of the name not 75. And greetings from Germany. Your car looks “sehr gut”!

[@bjornnyland]

85 kWh is gross capacity. 75 kWh is net (usable) capacity.

[@gkpolo3173]

We dont know how Tesla manage the top buffer of the battery. And to compare with others batteries, the calcul must be 71.5/81.5 (total capacity), so 12% which is a very good level. To compare, i have 26% on Imiev, 8 years. 5% on model 3, 1.5year. Generally, 4 to 5% is the first year degradation, after 1 to 2%/year for the best and 3 to 4%/year for the worst car.

[@bjornnyland]

Nope, incorrect calculation. Tesla has no top buffer.

[@TacEsk8]

Can't wait till the new tesla model s it's time for a refresh.

[@HeikoElectric]

In most of Germany the "long" school summer holiday's are right now....that's why you see so many germans on norwegian roads!

[@sebastianb.1164]

Not true. Only Bayern and BW left. www.schulferien.org/Schulferien_nach_Ferien/Sommerferien/2020/sommerferien_2020.html

[@Fochest0r]

Especially in the south

[@MarksTech]

7 years doesn't mean much .. the car only has 48k miles on it. That's basically new ish

[@bjornnyland]

Age also degrades the battery.

[@HowToDoitright]

Do you have MCu2 in there? The maps loaded very fast

[@dragossabin8265]

5:15 minecraft villager sound

[@criscringle6627]

Also at 5:51

[@carstencroessmann]

@5:10 I totally agree a lot of Germans I was wondering too I watch a swedish vid on swedish roads. And thought you are in Germany 😂🤣 greetings from Germany

[@adilsonlima6440]

In Norway we just don't drive more because of the price of the insurance. I am from a country that we drive as much that we want and that don't affect the insurance price. With the economic power and the freedom to drive cars in Norway would clock hundred thousand km in seven years or less.

[@bjornnyland]

The increased price for insurance is low. I have unlimited km on my Tesla since 2013. No problem at all.

[@adilsonlima6440]

@@bjornnyland congratulations with the KZbin channel. I had a great experience with my insurance company, but ended well. One day if you want I will tell you my adventures with insurance companies in Norway. One more thing. Are you planning on review any of this Chinese electric cars coming to Norway?

[@GerritKleynWinkel]

Seems pretty normal to me that such an expensive car with only 80k km after 7 years, drives as new, at least a regular ICE in this price range would. As cars become older, the availabilitty of service centers and spare parts becomes more important. Wonder how users experience that, how easy and cheap/expensive are the regular repairs, what is elecronics fail, were should one pay attention when buying older tesla's....

[@arinasan247]

Yes, but this Tesla only has about 48,000 miles on it. That means that it has not been driven all that much. What if you had driven it a whole lot more during the seven years? Would it have only 5% battery degradation?

[@bjornnyland]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/rpXEfXaejtWLnpo

[@arinasan247]

So, I guess it comes down to fast charging, yes?

[@robertpeters2256]

The 85 kWh pack supposedly has a gross capacity of 81 kWh, a net capacity of 77 kWh when new. So this particular car has about 7% degradation. Still great for its age. As a S85 owner myself with 177k km and 6 years I measure about 9% degradation. Would be interesting to see the effects of age or mileage on degradation. However, it would be rather difficult as there are many more variables to take into account, such as AC/DC charging or temperature conditions.

[@VipreNZ]

I have a 3 year old Nissan Leaf with 8% degradation. :(

[@bjornnyland]

77.5 kWh was from P85D and later.

[@robertpeters2256]

@@bjornnyland I currently have a 1014114-00-E pack in a S85, so non P/D. According to this "self-proclaimed battery expert" who tore down a 85 pack, it is ~77 kWh: teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/teslas-85-kwh-rating-needs-an-asterisk-up-to-81-kwh-with-up-to-77-kwh-usable.61896/ Supposedly it is a 1014114-00-D according to this post (same author) (pic 2) on TMC: teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/pics-info-inside-the-battery-pack.34934/ You could be right that the -B pack you tested has less capacity, as the earlier -A pack is even weirder (especially DC charging speed).

[@bjornnyland]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/eJ_ZpYOcpNF2rtk

[@robertpeters2256]

@@bjornnyland This one is just as interesting: kzbin.info/www/bejne/rpXEfXaejtWLnpo A fresh would give you 75-76, but depending on heat loss (speed), you would probably get less. Anyway, you are a legend! Fun to go back into the archive and see how far you've come.

[@CXLEBB]

just bought one with 62k miles and i drove it for 3 months and tesla recommended a new battery for 16,000$ 💀

[@onedankind8168]

This is good news. I'm more interesting in high KM degradation though. As I want to get an EV to use for a taxi. Taxi's can do 100k-250k km a year. Those are full-time taxis of course. But I'd be curious about the viability for EV's in this job. Because that's A LOT of fuel used as most taxis use over 10L/100km. Something in the nieghbourhood of 100k$ per three years fuel costs I think. Anyways, thanks for the video.

[@feedrate1]

good video thanks for making it.

[@leonari]

I habe a 2014 P85+ Model S. The car is still fantastic. I habe unlimited supercharging-fo life!! One more reason not to sell it😊

[@FieryToast1]

Anyone else notice the car has only done 78,111 km (roughly 50000 miles) in 7 years?? Seems fairly low, which may be why the degradation is so low. My car has nearly done 45000 miles after 3 years. I have a 50 mile round trip to and from work, so is my use case unusual?? Not sure.

[@marcbungener1877]

maybe due to the big wheels as it is a performance model but very noisy at only 90 km/h

[@TeslaTurkvlog]

My 2017 90D has same capacity after 115,000km and 20% DC charging (always max 70kWDC) Classic 85s are much better than 90s. Tesla still doesn’t accept this.

[@XLStudiosTallinn]

Very good and informative video! I am still enjoying my P85-14 with >160.000km as if it was brand new. May I ask what firmware version the car was on? There is a rumour that the latest version gave back some nerfed capacity to the battery.

[@SlickR12345]

Unfortunately if you don't live in a house where you can charge it overnight, it's still impossible to charge these things on the fly since there are barely any charging stations. The second continuous issue is the charging time, a gasoline car you can fill up fully in like 2 minutes, even with fast charging you still need 30 minutes to fully charge a battery.(from say 7% to 99%) That means charging becomes a chore, you have to plan for it, you have to incorporate it into your plans, etc... it's never a "along the way" thing. You also have to plan your whole vacation around charging stations , if you are driving to a vacation country you have to not only plan your nice vacation, you have to plan your charging route and routine. I don't think range is an issue by itself, range is ONLY an issue because of the long charging times and the planning that goes along with it. I get it that when your car is fully charged you can easily drive 10 days without needing to charge, but with these cars you also don't want to wait to be 10% or lower to charge them, you need to charge them up at about 20%, just in case of emergencies and stuff, so that means you charging your car when its at like 5% to like 100% never happens, its usually 20% to 80%, which even with fast chargers still takes 20+ minutes.

[@Basta147]

I dont have a house or garage and i dont supercharge often. I charge at 11kW in the mall (free ;)) and go shopping or meet friends. I also charge at work (should be free also) or in town at public 11kW stations over night (half or even less the price than diesel or even also FREE). Yes there should be more 11 or 22kW charging stations but „these things“ can easily be charged if you do it right and maybe restructure your live but ppl. find excuses. 🌞 On average people are driving 40km per day, so if you charge „this thing“ once a week for free in a mall or sonewhere else you should be good to go...

[@ryen7512]

@SlickR12345 What are you talking about? Super Charging stations are all over the place. At least every 100 miles/160km in most areas of the US/Europe/China. Charging time is the ONLY downside to EV's compared to DOZENS of downsides to ICE. You just haven't become accustomed to the habit change, like so many other ICE drivers. Cheers.

[@SlickR12345]

@@ryen7512 Maybe like in Britain you have super charging stations every 100km or so, and even then they are concentrated mostly in big cities, so you might have 3 in a range of 50km, and then 0 in a range of 200km. I mean check Spain's map, Belgium's map, Hungary's map, Latvia's map, etc... there is barely any charging stations period! Here in the Balkans there is literally 2 in a region of like 1500km.

[@davidperry4013]

Due to how well the battery holds up. It is a death sentence to the internal combustion engine.

[@Ismalith]

8:33 I thought it has a 85KWh battery, why is it now calculated as a 75KWh battery?

[@bjornnyland]

85 kWh is gross capacity and 75 kWh is net.

[@Ismalith]

@@bjornnyland Oh, did they change that later? Or is it still the same with P100s that they have only about 89KWh net?

[@bjornnyland]

It's always been like that.

[@Ismalith]

@@bjornnyland Hmm, disappointing, but good to know, thank you.

[@bjornnyland]

That's how all EVs work. Not just Tesla. If you could use all the capacity, you could easily destroy the battery by discharging it too deep.

[@InvestBetter.]

I think the battery stops at 99% to protect the battery from overcharging I think its a defense mechanism.

[@bjornnyland]

No, it's not. BMS was probably not calibrated.

[@dankruvand4937]

Would like to see this test run at normal speed of 110 or 120 kph. My guess is that the higher internal resistance of the aged battery would cause a greater range loss at the higher current output. Still impressive results though.

[@Funky_T]

1000km challenge with the P85 and actual (nerfed) Charging Speed would be interessting an nice.

[@joaoantunes5807]

Only has 77k km the car but still super good! 👌🏾

[@paulg8065]

My 85 has 102k miles after 6 years and it is at 7% degradation.

[@pallibj]

Wouldn't it be a worse score for a Model S 2015 driven 177.000, a car that has been supercharged a lot?

[@bjornnyland]

Yes

[@christiankohlhaas6273]

7 years and not even 80.000 km? My 90D from early '17 has 70.000km, ¾ slow AC charging, and has only 1,7% degradation.

[@DanielZajic]

I had virtually no degradation after 6 years owning my Smart ED, maybe it was 1%. Didn't drive a lot, might have been 15000km? Good to know it's not time but usage (mileage and super fast charging) that seems to be the major factor. Sort of like ICE cars, but more reliable because they're simpler.

[@kennethmattfolk1888]

Great to see. But I Wonder with the higher internal resistance you will loose some (more) range I guess? Going in 120km/h or more.

[@mister_jon_jon]

Find a Zoe 40 with high mileage and test that... You can test mine a 2016 with 5780 km today... ☺️

[@apk29]

@bjorn at the beginning you said it has an 85 kWh battery, but when you did the calc to determine battery degradation at the end you use 75 kWh? Can you please explain?

[@bjornnyland]

It's kWh, not kW. Every EV has a gross capacity (in this case 85 kWh) and net capacity (75 kWh). The bottom of the battery (logically, not physically) is reserved as bricking protection. Some cars have a top buffer and many cars have a zero mile buffer (some hidden energy past 0 %).

[@zhangwei2083]

The original buffer capacity has absorbed most of the degradation, you have to take out the battery pack to actually measure the real numbers. BTW, cruising at 90 is way efficient than 110, old battery burns much faster on high amps.

[@RadioactiveSaddam]

Many Germans in Norway is a bad sign 😁 Björn! You should test more old EV:s and test their batteries as well. Maby first generation Leaf, really old Mievs and why not other old Tesla S from 2014-2015 with lots of miles.

[@bjornnyland]

I have already tested several old cars like Ioniq and i3. You find the tests in my channel. Don't forget to subscribe.

[@mik4414]

About all the germans: to my knowledge the summer holidays are at different times in germany based on what region you live in

[@cdman7976]

Is it worth getting a 2012 or 2013 Signature Performance with around 50-60k miles at $24k-$30k now, or next year?

[@ar-2-r]

Bjorn, considering these older model S cars, how can you check what was the nominal kWh value of the pack on a brand new car?

[@Cornflakes691]

Why does your speedo look different? Did it not update with software updates?

[@bjornnyland]

Classic without AP.

[@nico-xd3yb]

In Germany some region's have holidays 🙃

[@MrMarch3w]

But isn't the original battery capacity 85 kWh which would make it about 16,2% degradation from 85 kWh to 71,25kWh?

[@bjornnyland]

No, net capacity is 75 kWh and gross capacity is 85 kWh.