5 Incredible New Bicycle Gearbox Drivetrains for 2023 // Revolute Hub1, 3X3 Nine Hub, Intradrive

We are in the golden age of bicycle gearbox drivetrains! Let's discuss the latest offerings. 📘 The Bikepacking Bike Buyer's Guide: www.cyclingabout.com/bikepack...
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📍 Missing image credit at 3:30: Aaron Goss (Rat City Bikes)
0:00 - Intro
1:21 - 3X3 Nine Hub
4:39 - Revolute Hub1
7:54 - Pinion Smart Shift Gearbox
9:20 - Intradrive 8-Speed Powertrain
11:18 - Classified Powershift Hub
13:03 - Summary

[@Cyclingabout]

Will you be switching to a gearbox or internal gear hub on your next bike? 🤔

[@bobqzzi]

Love your videos and it is great they are coming out with these new options. I have considered a geared hub for my old Softride daily commuter, but concluded it's easier to just use 7 speed derailleurs/cassettes/chains which are dirt cheap and I can replace every year. If I was building a custom touring bike, I would definitely consider a geared hub, but not sure that will ever happen

[@g1nk0]

I have one! I'm also considering building an ebike with one. I like belt drives as I live in a place with some funky weather, and I generally just like the look. But as I'd be stuck with a single speed otherwise, I do like IGH's

[@SxWerks]

I am considering the Classified hub for my next road bike.

[@RemcoBloemen]

I just got a Pinion C1.12 and it's perfect for terrain with >20% hills and heavy load (San Francisco). I regularly use the lowest and highest gears. If anything, I want more than 600% gear range. Maybe I should add a Rohloff hub. :)

[@etherealicer]

Yes... I really want a Pinion gearbox.

[@marcbossemeyer8719]

About 40 years ago, I owned a hub similar to the classified hub, produced by Sachs in Germany. (Sachs Orbit HT)It was a perfect fit at the time for my touring bike, because it combined 2 hub gears with 6 derailer gears and a drum break. This combination worked way better than rim break bikes at the time. Durability was realy impressive and maintenance cost very low. Only the shifters aged rather quickly. Unfotunately it was not percieved well enough to continue production. Over all, one of my favorite bikes, used as a daily driver for many years. I wish classified more luck.

[@nikveldkamp8630]

Great overview! And nice to see the leap in innovations, esp. for simpler everyday e-bike drivesystems (or MTB/downhill, as shown in the clips) The electronic automation of Pinion is awesome!

[@philipdavis7521]

Amazing depth of information here. I'm really excted for the future of bikes - light EV bikes with hub gears makes cycling far more excessible. I was recently bike touring in France and it was inspiring to see so many older, clearly unfit people enjoying long trips on e-bikes. It was also obvious that couples were using them to 'even up' their cycling ability so a weaker rider could keep up with her partner without a problem.

[@garymitchell5899]

The major issue with e bike touring is recharging. It can't be done simply in most cases.

[@parasharkchari]

The Classified hub does sound super interesting because it sounds like it would get past so many issues and also open up compatibility with many quite affordable groupsets. The catch is that it is so prohibitively expensive. It's obscene how much it costs, and a lot of that could have been remedied through making a mechanical/hydraulic shifting version, and using otherwise standard layouts that don't require you to buy very specific wheelsets.

[@pmcmpc]

It's also way too heavy for its target market - road / gravel race bikes (it's definitely not intended for adventure / bikepacking / e-bikes). Too much weight on the rear wheel. Plus the thru axle battery / electronics / antenna are just begging to get smashed.

[@pratikpramanik7782]

Hopefully it comes down in price… there is huge potential savings in cassette price and selection ($30 USD for an 11-28 vs $120 for a 11-50) and also not having to spec a long cage derailleur with capacity for those large cogs.

[@bengt_axle]

@@pratikpramanik7782 No. You have to use their special cassette, which has a big cut out for the mechanism at the axle. The cassettes are quite a bit more expensive than standard ones, as they have to be machined from a solid piece of metal (no individual cogs). I think this is one reason why the system is so expensive, not only to acquire, but also to use.

[@dodecahedron1]

sram dualdrive and sturmey-archer CS-RF3

[@letsif]

Thank you for your excellent reviews. I love learning about these new gearbox technology refinements.

[@Cyclingabout]

Thanks - it's fun sharing this information!

[@MrMartinSchou]

9:53 - One thing that motor manufacturers really need to do is get standardized shapes and sizes, as that will make manufacturing cheaper. But that's not nearly as important as standardizing batteries shapes, sizes and interfaces!

[@BillOweninOttawa]

I bought a Rize MD (mid drive) 6 weeks ago and now the rear cassette is damaged. I tried to buy a new one locally, but guess what, the rear hub is unique in the world and no standard cassette will fit it. I contacted Rize and they want a video to show the "problem" and pictures to show the damage. It's a huge issue.

[@andrzejfabianski4948]

Standarisation to make sometching cheaper? No my friend, it works like "they are paying so it's not too expencive..."

[@MrMartinSchou]

@@andrzejfabianski4948 I never said it'd be cheaper for the consumer, though I'd argue the standardization of things like AA, AAA etc. batteries and the charge plug on cell phones made those cheap commodities for consumers. Cheaper frame manufacturing is a competitive advantage for the OEMs that end up taking advantage of it, because they can increase their profit margin.

[@Biking360]

Great round-up. The Classified Powershift Hub looks very interesting.

[@AustinPrest]

I've got a touring/bikepacking bike built around the c1.12 pinion and love it. I'm definitely a convert to internal gearing. I'm now really tempted to go through the work to convert my commuter to a cheap Shimano Alfine. I'm happy to see more companies developing new gear hub options. The ebike market space seems like a perfect place to explore their potential and get more gearboxes on the road

[@buckroger6456]

I want to put a Rolhoff on mine

[@maddox0110]

I would stay away from the Alfine. Nexus 8 does the same job, with better reliability , less maintenance and cost.

[@AustinPrest]

@@maddox0110 thank you for your recommendation! I havent made any moves yet but will definitely consider the nexus for my dream commuter bike

[@AustinPrest]

@Shep Raynham going internal gear hub or pinion does add weight for sure. I have never ridden any of the gear hubs, so I can't speak directly to your experience. The pinion weighs 1.5lbs more then nx eagle, however I'm not as concerned for touring/bikepacking. I am much happier to have greater gear range and more peace of mind, and I'm going to be putting on ~15-20lbs of stuff on the bike anyway. I have ridden the bike on gravel group rides and for that I'm a little slower but I'm more apt to blame my fatter tires or lack of fitness as bigger factors. The pinion does have a really slow engagement which could be annoying, so I bought a fast engagement hub to try to offset that some.

[@EnterTheOrb]

MTB's will go internal gears. It just makes sense, no more broken derailleurs.

[@islandaerial3414]

Gear boxes and eMTBs will be a massive improvement over current drivetrains. Looking forward to them

[@cannoning]

I have both hubs. And they are game changers. Every bike I bought with these hubs have hydraulic brakes for a reason

[@SxWerks]

Great gearbox coverage. Keep up the good work.

[@mroso1142]

OSO 👍

[@liamredmill9134]

That was timely, and in depth with expert terminology,thanks

[@ExteelPaprika]

Love your vids. And how passionate and informed you are about bikes and cool new ways to make them.

[@Cyclingabout]

It's always fun for me to research and present information about interesting bike things. Glad you like them!

[@pbandjosh]

One to mention is Schlumpfdrive - seems more popular in the recumbent world, at least every time I see mention of them it's in reference to a recumbent. But they look to be another slick / well engineered 2 speed front mech replacer, though the shifting is pretty different. I actually think it looks really cool for a crankset for a single speed that then becomes a stealthy two speed with no extra cables.

[@achimbruckner8334]

Great summary! Thank you for all your well researched videos!

[@Cyclingabout]

My pleasure!

[@michaelguerin56]

Thank you. Great update on available gearbox technology.

[@danceufo9256]

I once had a freewheel hub for my roadbike that was perfectly silent when coasting. Having a tough time finding that now, but these new advances are worth looking into as well

[@TheGolfdaily]

Great research. Thanks for sharing!

[@sunesnigel]

Awesome video as always. It's about time they're starting this race!

[@AydinProductionsLtd]

Always good updates! Thx!!

[@sharkmentality9717]

My solution is a 1000w 48v front hub motor, Schlumpf mtn drive and a Rohloff. Nice to see all that will be integrated to one system.

[@FightFilms]

Excellent video! Thank you!

[@bobpoor6348]

I have been using Schlumpf bb drives for years for dingle speed and cassettes. I now use them on my front hub drop bar 700c/40+c bikes that don't use PAS just a throttle controlled infinitely variable cruise function. My Speed Drive @ 1.65 to 1 with a 27t chainring will pedal effectively up to 40kmh with an 11t rear cog. My High Speed Drive will pedal effectively up to 55kmh with its 2.25 to 1 ratio also used with a Direct Drive front hub motor. My friend the other day on his Class 1 Giant eMTB accused me of riding a motorcycle granted I don't have any speed cutoff like his does.

[@hemaccabe4292]

This was very informative. Thank-you very much.

[@dahnparker8014]

That was excellent thank You just the insight I needed :)

[@mikegrok]

The 3x3 and the hub1 are interesting to me because my wife is disabled and I have been designing an off-road wheelchair for her, and those hubs operate in reverse. I had resigned to building something with some massive motors as that is the only way to achieve enough torque to handle a 30% incline and achieve more than 4 mph. These allow me to use more reasonably sized components. Ie I don’t have to use motors designed for cars anymore to get my desired torque. The motors I was considering were qsmotor 8kw hub motors. Now I can use mid drive style motors. Thank you.

[@stevengagnon4777]

Been working on the Shimano Hubs for along time and have got around that grease thing by replacing the Shimano grease that doesn't hold up to water and especially salt water with a mixture of Lucas Red n Tacky and a good mineral oil based automatic transmission fluid. About 1/3 grease that helps keep the fluid in the hub and it holds up to salt water better. I vote ever thing in it and squirt some extra into the hub shell before closing it up that way the extra stuff is continuously bathing the internal gears inside this lasts a long time several years even with heavy use still should be overhaul 3 to 5 thousand miles depending on riding conditions use the last overhaul to gauge it. It's a lot easier to clean up at the next overhaul and doesn't mess with the shifting and stays stable at low temperatures. The only problem with this is it with void the warranty but the hub will stay in service for decades. ATF is good stuff automatic transmissions last for decades if that fluid is changed on schedule BMW even used it in their manual transmissions for a long time because it's good stuff. Just clean up what leaks out during your routine mantainance and cleaning (a little bike wash or diluted dish soap to clean it up and leamon pledge to repel dust and make it shine just keep it off the braking surface 95% alcohol with clean that surface when you're done pretty well anyway. The bargon polish doesn't work as well... from experience but a clean bike is a happy bike and happy mechanic too so clean it before taking it to one and you will get better service

[@EveryTongue]

Very nice coverage! Thank you

[@peterbense5650]

Awesome overview, this is timely considering I am contemplating building a mid-drive e-bike from one of the bikes in my fleet...

[@andrewowens5653]

Thank you for another excellent analysis. Cheers!

[@Cyclingabout]

Thanks for watching!

[@leemedd8189]

Great advice as always, thank you

[@michaelbeiyt]

Awesome overview!

[@lihtan]

Revonte is a system based out of Finland that combines an ebike mid-drive motor with an integrated automatic transmission. All-to is a small Korean startup which is focusing on making an inexpensive gearbox system for pedal bikes, that can be mass manufactured at low cost.

[@HifiCentret]

That is the exact reason why I chose an old school hub motor (but direct drive) for my electric bike. Not to put more strain on the drive chain than necessary as pedal forces and motor forces are transferred completely independent to the wheels. The issue with crank motors are that they put a lot of strain on the chain and gearbox - and I think I change chain on my regular bike enough already. And I chose with closed chain box too. That really has helped - only lubed the chain on the ebike so far. Perhaps if there's nice low loss low maintenance crank gearboxes which are build sturdier and using larger sprockets (to lessen strain on chain and perhaps a tooth belt instead of chain) then it might be worth considering. The current option with regular Shimano 7 speed gearbox and crank motors I'm not a fan of. For a start I don't think the Shimano 7 speed boxes are as robust or low loss as the old Sram (3 speed) boxes which really could take a beating.

[@XaviarCraig]

I've been running 2 Rohloff hubs for close to 10 years for mountain biking only. I am actually interested most in the 3x3 hub since I usually want larger gear drops. 90% of the time I find myself dropping or gaining 2 to 5 gears at time with my Rohloff hub. I rarely only increase or decrease by 1 gear. The range increase also is a bit welcome. I may consider it for my next bike but I want to know the efficiency across all of it's gears.

[@keacoq]

I have a Pinion c1.9 gearbox. 9 speeds over 568% I find perfectly sufficient. I suspect that small gear steps is a tradition inherited from early derailleurs where big steps were difficult and from racing where optimum cadence was important. Also small steps make gearboxes more expensive and so more profitable. It makes a good city bike. But for touring I've drifted back to my lighter more efficient 44/32/22 11/34 derailleur bike. Partly because I find the twist grip difficult with thumb joint pain. Partly because the Pinion bike is heavy.

[@panchoxbrr301]

Always awesome. I'm not on board with the E bikes yet but am saving for the P1.18 titanium box.

[@andrelloyd4010]

Great content as always 🙏

[@Crowiferous]

Very excited for the future!

[@6rimR3ap3r]

I'm really looking forward to the Revolute Hub 1. Shifting under load makes up for a significant difference hubs suffered from until now. The other product I'm curious about is the Revonte One, as it's basically the same layout as Toyota's hybrid Synergy drive.

[@bertb3731]

great summary and analysis!

[@opabarnhoorn5445]

My fully automatic Nuvici continuous gear has worked perfectly for over a year. Although it requires electric power and therefore can be used on electric bikes only, it makes cycling so much easier that I have usually the motor switched off.

[@tonysustak9395]

Short extensions can be added to drop bars to mount a mechanical twist shifter. In using a gear hub on a drop bar bike, this worked for me as most of my riding was city, utility and in the drops for best braking control. Commuting in a city/urban environment is a sprint being stops or big slowdowns. Even on the trails, one has to contend with peds, peds with dogs, kids and clueless other riders in the bike lanes. The "sprint between stops" has got better on some routes where the traffic lights are timed to a speed bicyclists can maintain without having to be super fit. The options available now with electric shifting seem to offer a big savings in difficulty in set up (Rohloff), vulnerability (Alfine which shares some of the deraileur vulnerabilities to drive side crashes), lower maintanance (adjusting, cleaning, replacing cables and housings and lubing cable systems) and prefered shifter styles, quick fire button styles or drop bar brake/shifer combos).

[@ssenssel]

Still very prohibitive money wise here in Brazil. I'll stick with cassettes and derailleurs.

[@sgfahhdhsdhd]

Not just Brazil, they are very expensive, period. I agree about cassettes and derailleurs

[@Cyclingabout]

Check out whether the Alfine 8 suits your needs! I'm a big fan of that $199 hub: kzbin.info/www/bejne/p5ecpXmAe72Ja9E

[@chadkline4268]

I like the front derailleurs removed from bikes, and I like the trend to 11 gear (or whatever) rear derailleurs. I don't see much need for gearboxes on the general use bicycle. Though, if they became superior in most of the critical ways, and cheap enough, they will probably take over.

[@zieluk]

Metoo#

[@injuredtabletennisplayer1474]

In the US I find them expensive also. I’m starting to save for a set up. Will take about 3 years. By that time the market will stabilize and I’ll have a shop to install it.

[@grantandre79]

I’ve got a Rholoff on my recumbent touring trike where the unsprung weight isn’t a concern and the ability to shift while stopped is critical… it’s awesome! I seem to recall that Nicolai had been working on a MTB design (the G-Boxx?) that was going to mount a Rholoff as a mid-drive almost 20 years ago now. Wonder what ever came of that?

[@2scoops624]

Any day a cyclingabout video comes out is a good day. I want more gearboxes for MTB. I tire of cleaning gears after every ride. I just had to spend $120 to replace 4 chains across my fleet and I'll need a couple of new cassettes at my next chain replacement. A Zerode Kaitipo is my dream bike.

[@patrickherzog6520]

nice choice

[@dariuslankarian3282]

I press like before watching cyclingabout videos.

[@Cyclingabout]

Thanks - it really helps to recommend my videos to others!

[@md.moinulislam9467]

Very good bicycle products video.....!

[@HKommers]

the trouble with the Classified hub IMO is that MTBs are often now designed for ~32t chainrings. One of those with say a 36t would give a broader range in both directions. This is a gripe with frame designers mind, not the hubs. Also these days large cassettes can be quite light, my chinese 11-46 is like 370g (sure a low end sram is over double that...) Gearbox development sure is interesting though, I look forward to when they're comparable in efficiency as they sure seem a better system than derailleurs

[@215alessio]

Very exciting. Finally a gearhub for e bikes. For now I have my spare derailleurs but I will run out of them

[@RichSera2-qm5rl]

So fantastic these new inventions, but I still love the sounds of my i9 hydra hub.

[@StanEby1]

Brilliantly done, as always. I love IGH's but only for human powered bicycles.

[@jacksonbaker353]

Why is that?

[@sagichdirdochnicht4653]

I'd love to know, too! I'm currently thinking about buying a nice bike, not even sure if battery or leg only powered though lol. Only certain that I want a drive belt, so derailours won't be an option.

[@au1317]

​@@jacksonbaker353 One word: charging. Pushing your foot down is incredibly simple, and this simplicity is often the reason why I go for a ride at all.

[@frafra224]

@@au1317 Charging the battery is too complicated you mean?

[@au1317]

@@frafra224 Not too complicated but seriously inconvenient

[@felixcat9318]

Excellent video presentation.

[@ehounshell]

That last hub sounds awesome

[@sgfahhdhsdhd]

I will stick to my front derailleur, for a small fraction of the cost

[@RobinCapper]

Great overview of a fast evolving segment. Seeing drive belts made wonder if anyone has ever tried to develop a breakable belt? If worked would greatly expand the gearbox frame combo options

[@Cyclingabout]

Yes, the Veer belts are breakable. But you should ideally have a belt-specific frame anyway, which ensures the rear triangle is stiff enough to keep the belt running nicely.

[@EleanorPeterson]

Harrumph! 🙂 So slick and neat and clean... This is fantasy biking. I'm skint and live in the north of England; sold my car a decade ago, can't afford buses, taxis or trains, so cycling is my only way of getting around besides walking. My bike is 15 years old and worth about £25 [twenty-five]. It's a sad old donkey with add-on racks and panniers and weighs about 50 lbs [23 kg] unladen. It can carry another 50 lbs of 'stuff'. I built a 2-wheeled trailer from salvaged scrap (total cost £8 [eight]) big enough to carry 6 bags of groceries. I ride 70 essential miles a week. I gave up riding for fun years ago. Any fancy bike left unattended around here - chained up and padlocked outside a supermarket, for instance - will be gone in 60 seconds. I'm not kidding. Lads in vans have mates on foot who tour the streets and car parks, looking for 'tasty' gear. (This includes motorbikes; the vans have hoists and winches in the back.) Mobile phones, GPS and Google street maps (or whatever) make things ridiculously easy. Once alerted by their scouts, the lads in vans descend like vultures in hi-vis jackets, armed with bolt-cutters and angle-grinders. A £5,000 regular bike or e-bike (or a £20,000 motorbike) would be nicked in no more than a minute. If it's got a tracker unit fitted - maybe built permanently into the frame - the bike will be stripped of components whilst still in the back of the van; the expensive shiny bits will be for sale on eBay within the hour, and the tracker-unit/frame will be swimming with the fishes in the nearest canal before the cops have finished their doughnuts. Posh bikes look great in the adverts, but they're always being ridden, aren't they. Surrounded by gorgeous people. Shiny teeth. Lycra. There's always someone in the saddle. You don't see them outside Sainsbury's with a dog peeing on the rear hub or some jealous Stella-swilling duck-wit sticking nails into the tyres out of spite. I'd be scared even to stop at traffic lights on a nice bike; people are mugged for their cash, their shoes, their watches, and their phones, so riding a bike worth more than £100 [one-hundred] is asking for trouble. Fortunately, like e-bikes, this new tech is so ludicrously expensive that I'll never be able to afford it. Heck, I couldn't even afford to insure it - the annual premium would be 10x the value of my current setup. Yay for poverty! 😁

[@djedUVprojector]

With the classified dual mode hub, you could use it in combination with 2 chain ring up front that you flick the chain onto by hand for when you add an electric motor or not. I think it's gonna be a useful & cool tech

[@rkstreeter]

That's what I thought Just switch the chain or chain ring

[@sdilizio]

Great to see innovation flourishing in the e-bike world. But like you, Alee, I'm most excited by the Classified MTB hub. It could genuinely shake up the 1x12 hegemony.

[@nebulous962]

finally some good stuff! been wanting igh with high gear range and and relatively low amount of gears for long time. i really hate when igh has too many too similar gears.

[@alessandrorossi2164]

awesome we need it this improve!

[@dreamerx23]

thanks for sharing! it's really sad that so few channels are sharing more on these technologies.

[@deanrobbins8102]

I was looking to upgrade my recumbent trike drivetrain this coming January. That last one from Classified would solve so many issues with machines that have THREE chain lengths worth of chain. No front derailleur is a huge deal but with three chain lengths, the cross-chaining is pretty harsh. Having a smaller cog set in back with the internal granny gear(s) would be a God-send. I might wait a while longer now that I know these are coming!

[@grantandre79]

I’ve got the Rholoff on my Catrike Speed recumbent trike and highly recommend it. The ability to shift while stopped, shift under load and run a nearly fixed chain (I’m using the Rholoff tensioner) are nice on any bike but are massive improvements on a trike. Expensive, yes. However, the long-tested reliability and well-established parts availability are major benefits when compared to some of the newer offerings, iMHO. Enjoy your project!

[@deanrobbins8102]

@@grantandre79 I know. My trike is going on its fifth season of 2,500 miles. So, things are getting worn out. I'm also getting older and those Bosche motors are looking tasty too! Patience seems to be the best bet for now. Just getting the Dumont tuned up for the season. Maybe I can make the third derailleur last through the year (not likely but I can always hope). The Rholoff hub is a great drivetrain component. To do that, I need a new rolling frame though which means a new custom build from ground up. That's likely my path forward but I'll probably just get the kit with the motor and be done with upgrades for another five years.

[@CYCLELIFESERVICES]

Wow nice your video 💜

[@rotcivlovosin9414]

My favorite wheel in the winter is a coaster single speed. It handles the winter well, but I do have to service it at the beginning, mid and late winter in order for it to function well. I have always ridden all winter. Everyday and every winter. I am excited about this gearbox,but I wonder

[@user-uo8xk8ud6b]

Здорово! Молодцы! Очень рад видеть.

[@khunlongpete]

Classified boost 148, 28 -40, 11-40 cassette on our Ep8 driven Mtb tandem would be the solution on long offroad climbs(2000 altimeter and more) with transalp luggage. Hope the hub can handle the torque. As always you deliver down to earth hard info, so haerd to find on you tube. Most of the times watching you tube is a loss of time. (eg GMBN)

[@sifi7950]

Great video; I look forward to trying some of these one day. For now, I'm loving my Enviolo CVT hub, despite not having an e-bike. I guess you don't know how much efficiency you're losing until you try something more efficient?!

[@tuunaes]

Correct. Most human senses are very bad as absolute "measuring instruments" and can do only comparison/relative measurements against something else. So if all you've ever had is Enviolo hub bike, your senses literally can't know the difference. Myself bought Yamaha PW motor Haibike in end of 2018 and that was clearly more than little draggy when motor isn't assisting (compared to normal bikes) and reaching 30 km/h on flat ground was hard. Now with new Bosch CX Gen4 motor bike I'm back to reaching 35 km/h speeds with freewheel decoupling cranks completely from motor.

[@Ed.R]

I've had enviolo (NuVinci) hubs for over a decade now. The efficiency is a very complex thing, it tends to drop the further you go from the middle 1:1 ratio. Also drops with increased torque or power. Near 1:1 ratio and at sensible power output it can be quite efficient, the sort of conditions you likely spend most time riding at.

[@md.moinulislam9467]

MASHAALLAH khub valo product video review.....!

[@chrisfournier6144]

I’m doing my best to hold out for this technology before I buy another MTB! Thanks for the information and well produced video.

[@b.w.1386]

Me too! but I want it nOW!

[@raitshots]

😎👍💯easy variant drive travel.

[@aphexdruqks7751]

Automatic gearbox on a bike. I never thought about it but now I want it.

[@olafschermann1592]

i love the idea classified came up with.

[@tompaah7503]

I'd love to see Bosch ebike motors paired with Pinion gearboxes, as an integrated unit like the Intradrive.

[@tuunaes]

Would be very big and chunky. Continuously variable transmission using planetary gear integrates more easily with ebike's motor.

[@kwhatten]

Valeo!

[@yurymleh]

Hey, thanks for the video. Just want to add some more info: As for pinion, they had their Pinion E1.8 drive system slated for 2012 debut with Nicolai Ion20 E-boxx. It never came to the market for the unknown reasons. Also you had shots of Valeo Effigear Cyclee but no specific mentions of it? It's coming out by the end of this year. Also there's a finnish "Revonte one" with not one but two motors + integrated CVT. Also there's a FEV motor + integrated 9 speed gearbox.

[@vorradelnraumfurfahrradkul6986]

Great overview! Any experience with the valeo drive train? only seen it on prototypes so far.

[@CT37BN]

Kudos with the comprehensive review and all superb internal hub gears there. I just feel more frustrated than ever that I won't be able to afford these sort of drivetrains and that bike manufacturers are aiming these for use with e-bicycles. So very little to choose an affordable internal hub gear bicycle here in Australia. The least expensive you can get will have a Nexus 8 + Gates carbon belt but the climbing gear is really lacking with this set-up unless with the help of an electric motor ( which I do not prefer because of added costs/weight ). An Alfine 11 set-up is even harder to find than a Rohloff.

[@petesmitt]

I've gone the other way; used Shimano IGH for decades but now only use derailleur and single speed.

[@SternLX]

I hadn't seen that 3x3 Nine Hub yet. I've been slowly putting together a list for a new Electric Fixie style bike based around the Bafang M315 motor(100nm torque max output) using a Gates belt drive. Think I might reconsider the Nexus-5E I had on my list for that 3x3 Nine instead.

[@CharlesNewkirk-lb6uh]

Hot stuff!

[@marktroup2978]

To me, any gearbox requiring a specific frame modification is a non-starter. 3x3 Nine is the one I’ll be watching, mainly for its ability to handle very high torque from screamer mid-drives like the CYC X1 Pro Gen 2.

[@jacobclark89]

I think it makes sense to put the gearbox inside the hub motor , even a two speed would be very nice .

[@JohnSmith-qf1jn]

I have autism and I envisioned this a few months ago. This technology can power motorcycles style bicycles eventually.

[@KeithAVass]

I know that Recumbent Trikes are not your favorite ride, but I guess the principle is the same. I recently added a Bafang 500w mid drive motor to my HPV Scorpion trike and am very happy with the power of this motor. However, my 9 year old derailleur is making a lot of noise and struggling to keep up with the new acceleration imposed on it. Can you recommend a CTV internal hub gear which will be compatible or even work with the Bafang?

[@nickd698]

Been waiting for a decent ebike with gearbox for years, looks like the time is coming soon to buy an E enduro bike that won't break!

[@johnnyk6906]

I am all about hub gears with 500% gear range combined with mid e-motor with 100+ mile range (real-life miles with mid power setting). I love the hub with carbon belt but "drag" on drive train is really annoying on longer rides.

[@alafenetre81]

Do you know what e-bike makers will integrate the 3x3 in their range? Thank you.

[@nickwf70]

All very nice apart from the cost and weight of these things, essentially ebikes are turning into lightweight motor bikes where as derailleurs are lightweight, efficient and cheap.

[@stefanhansen5882]

Great! Would an internal gear work well on a touring bike? Thanks.

[@user-dz8jl1xp3o]

>Until recently, Rohloff was the only gear hub option that you needed to know about. I lol'd so hard. Probably will share that wise thought with my commuter friends riding shimano nexuses and alfines for year all year long including snowy winters so that they could have a good laugh too. And yeah, zero problems with even okayish grease in temperatures up to -25C. Doesn't get a lot colder than that in here. Also most, if not all problems with grease lubrication come from the hygroscopic shimano bentonite (pet litterbox filling) grease which can suck moisture even from air, not to mention riding it in wet conditions. Just swap it out for some actual grease and you'll be a-ok. >more common oil lubrication system In the price range of over 1000$ maybe. A real minority compared to 3-4-5-7-8-9-11 shimano/sram/sturmey-archer gear hubs which all run on grease. All this stuff for people who can throw around tens of thousands at a whim is kinda cool (how you can make a quite mediocre thing, slap FOR EBIKES!!! on it and get away with pricing it three times higher), but it's really sad to not see any development in the non-sporty direction. Commuters are also people and they need simple and cheap gear hubs, not a ten thousand buck e-bike that can dish out 300Nm of torque. Though nobody thinks about them. Kinda sad.

[@johnhricko8212]

I've been hoping someone would do a continuously-variable gb (for ebikes). But these sound great!

[@singer3188]

Can't wait to start a custom electric velo project with one of these

[@samsske]

Which hub would you recommend for a trike powered by a bbs02 bafang motor? Trike will be used predominantly for touring. Thanks, Sam

[@christill]

It’s exciting to see the bike industry finally showing signs of going in the direction that I’ve always been wanting to see. It feels like it’s been stuck in a rut for decades.

[@ravebrave8866]

good joke...🤣🤣😅

[@argonaut6386]

For my needs I'm happy in the rut tbh. I can understand some top sportsman may want this but I wouldn't want to be forced into over complicated technology that takes away from enjoyment of the simplicity of a more traditional bike.

[@christill]

@@argonaut6386 Sport cycling is very much entrenched in the stagnant bike industry and nothing to do with these gear systems.

[@svr5423]

@@argonaut6386 derailleur drivetrains are incredibly fragile and require a lot of maintenance, especially if you do all-weather riding. Most hubs lack the range to do the 10 to 15% uphill climb as well as the 45kph cruise with tailwind. Anything modern that actually works will bring more people back to using bicycles in my opinion.

[@marsudibu]

amazing

[@buckroger6456]

This is a lot off cool gearbox tech but it all seems to be geared towards the ever growing Ebikes. I'm still waiting to see more of a push for non-Ebike gearboxes. I plan on putting a Rolhoff on one of my bikes next year, either my do it all bike that I use for everything, or my hardtail Mtb.

[@Johninsactown]

Do you think Pinion will allow the c-line to have electronic shifting in non-e-bikes?

[@jasonbannan4024]

Thanks for the science and engineering in your videos. I always wondered about the resistance the oil filled gear cases pose. Is gear oil completely Newtonian? Can one feel any viscosity change when more pedaling stress is transferred to the fluid?

[@tuttebelleke]

The oil filled gears all need to have an "oiltight" seal on both sides of the hub. Imo these play larger role in efficiency losses by friction than the very fluid oil? If that seal would not be there, the oil would leak out when you lay your bicycle flat down. Greased hubs do have frictionless dust caps, but rolling the grease around eats for sure from the efficiency. But no idea on how modern greases cope with this? When in the eighties I filled up my Sachs 3 speed (= most efficient hub ever made up to date!) COMPLETELY with grease - by thinking doing good - I could experience the huge friction from this. And this was even more dramatic in winter at -10°C.

[@dpskiff2998]

Something I've not heard about in years are the benefits of the elliptical drivetrains. There were 2 types, elliptical chainrings and an experimental internal drive at the bottom bracket called a select-a-cam. Are these practical at all for standard bicycles, ebikes or bikes with newer style gearboxes on the rear, such as the Pinion drive? I'm thinking Pinion drive on the rear and select -a-cam in the bottom bracket. Has this even been considered? I used to have elliptical chainrings on an old Iron horse bike I had from the early 1990's. I felt they gave an advantage in the pedal stroke. Thanks, Dave

[@X41N3]

I always wanted an IGH for my MTB, maybe it will actually happen within the next 10 years