58 Pattern waterbottle and cooksets - Evolution in action

The humble British Armed forces waterbottle; how a whole range of cooksets used outdoors have developed to what we see today. From hexi burners to Crusader cooksets 1 and 2, and the use of BCB and Flexistoves for the modern trooper or camper

[@sauceymistersausages]

I was in the army 87/90 and the metal mugs you had to buy yourself they weren't issued. You got waterbottle plastic mug a hexi stove and 2 aluminium mess tins and you boiled you water in them and some times drank your brew out of them, you also ate out of your mess tins and you washed and shaved in them. The hexi stove matches and wash kit were stored in your mess tins. Puri tabs were kept in the lid of the 58 pattern pouch inside the lid. Racing spoon kept on a bit of string in your top pocket. Great video mate, nice to see. 😁👍🇬🇧

[@justgoingout6824]

Thanks Kieran. You've served and done it for real, so credit is due. I only used the mess tins as a cadet, and through my D of E to gold. And for a few years independantly until I could afford and start my addiction to all things camping. I tried to sing its praises in one of my videos, but sadly not too many views. We sound the same age, and its only in the last decade that my work with the green lids has given me an insight to out modern armed forces. Cheers bud

[@thomasmusso1147]

👍👍👍 Nice .. and interesting to boot. My intake in the SADF (South African Defence Force) in 1968, we were issued with the Esbit Folding Stove w Hexi Tabs, a set of Rectangular Aluminium Mess Tins ('Dixies'). Some guys got saddled with the older Mess Tin variant .. the nickle-plated ones, many of which by then, were nearing the end of their service life with associated rust spots and such. AND .. an absolutely horrible Water Bottle / Mug Set. The bottle was Aluminium with a Plastic Top Cover which then nested into a Plastic Mug (we called them 'Fire Buckets'). Horrible they were. One could not boil water in them and they retained the smell of everything that one ever put inside which no amount of washing could remove. To boil water for for a quick brew, one had to haul out a Dixie. Only later, in the 70's were these replaced with the USA GI-type Plastic Bottle and Stainless Steel Mug .. much to our joy. Very practical kit there on display. I'll be visiting my Son and Family coming March in the UK and will be taking a squizz around some of your Mil Surplus Stores to see what I can pick up. Thanls for sharing .. Take care ..

[@justgoingout6824]

Thanks Thomas, hope you stocked up whilst you were here in March.

[@thomasmusso1147]

@@justgoingout6824 👍

[@normancallaghan1750]

Easy way to tell if the "Osprey" water bottle is "Mickey Mouse", the "A" in "HEAT" is larger than the other letters, also the bloody cap leaks!. Probably Chinese copies, never had a problem with the BCB bottle when used in the past. Enjoyable video, keep it up.

[@lesdavidson9594]

Its nice to see the lids that i make being used...thank you...

[@stevenconnor4221]

Bcb 2 for me it covers all bases and trangia compatable 👍 i have one of those old blackened steel hex stove given to me in erm early 80's still have and it still works.

[@justgoingout6824]

Bombproof Steven. Need to dig mine out again.

[@johndoogan3712]

Hi, I thoroughly enjoyed your presentation video. My personal 58 pattern kit stopped at BCB # 1. My plastic 58 pattern water bottle is dated 1962, it is green and slightly larger at 2 pints. I have never seen any green plastic 58 mugs. My mug is a black alloy non stick item from Survival Aids with removable lip protector on top of my green 1962 water bottle. My non stick mess tin lid, also from Survival Aids is stamped MTL 3036, it sits on top of the large mess tin secured by a Trangia strap. I have several stoves, the main one is a vintage Optimus 80. I mention this as it's what was around back in the day.

[@justgoingout6824]

Hello John, nice to meet your aqaintance. The BCB 1 has had a new lease of life, as Ali Express was selling a Boundless Voyage alcohol stove that is a wee bit smaller, and fits under the swing / supporting arm. Ive got a green plastic mug too, but its modern repro, and dosn't fir too well. Thanks for the support.

[@johndoogan3712]

Hi, shortly after posting, I have since found green reproduction 58 pattern water bottles and mugs for sale. These days, any original green water bottles are selling for an arm and a leg and I have yet to see one with its green mug. When I placed mine next to a more modern black 'Osprey' item, it is definitely fatter from front to back, it definitely holds two imperial pints whereas the black Osprey bottles hold one litre. Perhaps someone could post on here about the missing green original 58 pattern water bottle mugs?.

[@ClarkieBoy]

I currently use the Crusader Mk1 set but thanks for showing me the Flexistove which looks like being my next acquisition

[@mickd6942]

I had a 58 pattern water bottle with a cover that had press stud fasteners that wrapped round the sides of the neck of the water bottle never been able to find one like it since .

[@justgoingout6824]

Hi Mick............I think Rifleman Moore could answer your question.............the early prototypes i am sure nearly copied the US version.

[@mickd6942]

@@justgoingout6824 thanks that would explain it as it was exactly like a US cover but sized to fit a 58 pattern bottle.

[@clivedunning4317]

I think you guys are talking about a British "44 Ptn waterbottle canteen pouch. Issued up to the late 1980s , but only to Paras, Marines and SAS. Lots of folk dumped the aluminium "44 waterbottle and stuck a spare "58 Ptn waterbottle into the canteen pouch.

[@mickd6942]

@@clivedunning4317 no , it was very similar but had the metal hooks fitting to attach it to a belt not the straps , it also didn’t have the pocket

[@clivedunning4317]

@@mickd6942 The "44 Ptn bottle carrier was issued (when new) with metal hooks/clips that attached to the three part "44 Ptn belt. The belt had small metal lined eyelets along its bottom side. Most folk chucked the hooks away, the GPMG gunners kept them to attach the "44 Ptn carrier to the ammunition guide when it was used as a "patrol" magazine, holding about 25/30 rounds. There was an internal pocket inside the "44 Ptn carrier that was intended to hold a small tin of water purification tablets. Pity we cant compare photographs !

[@bibbini5893]

Very much enjoyed that, I've always had a soft spot for the Swedish Army Trangia set up. The last foil stove didn't look as robust!

[@peterharris3096]

Very good demonstration.

[@justgoingout6824]

Thanks Peter, the idea was running wild in my little brain for months.

[@BrianRPaterson]

Interesting stuff. My lads and I mostly have the MK1 kit, with the exception of swapping out plastic mugs for metal ones. They're easier to clean (I think), and you can also cook in them. We got one of the MKII cooker bases to see if it was better. It might be, but the folding stoves are smaller, lighter and way cheaper. Cheers

[@tommygun868]

Thanks for the Video comrad, i use very often the the british hex Cocker from the beginning from the Video, but the flexi stove looks really interesting,maybe my next one. Cheers

[@justgoingout6824]

When I first used the Hexi cooker its was the 80's all a time of permed hair, definately not fire retardent tracksuits and perhaps dressing for Miami Beach, and not Weston Super Mare / Usedom beach. Me however was going through Hexi blocks like a "tramp on chips" camping in my local woods........Now i've really got back into usning the old hexi block; and knowing that we stole the idea from the Germans (nothing new there 😉) (Esbit Corp) proves how clever you chaps really are......................................if the tramp on chips translation is a bit bizarre..........imagine a dirty old homeless drunk finding a 20 Euro note and spending it on french fries (Chips).....take care mate.

[@MrPinhead66]

the only water bottle pouch that fastened by press studs was a 44 pattern pouch

[@garenkarapetian709]

Crusader cup holds 750ml. Crusader Mk2 holds 1L - it would be perfect only if its bottom was flat; otherwise I can see food sticking to the bottom and near-impossible to clean off in field conditions. So I'm sticking to my trusty old Crusader. FlexiStove is a good idea, except for the £12 pricetag - easy DIY using foil trays found in any supermarket. The next best thing would be if BCB came up with an affordable aluminium lid for the Crusader and a stainless steel canteen which they can make 1.2L or 1.5L, since no stainless steel canteen fits into the old Crusader.

[@quinntheeskimooutdoors6234]

Good demo, thanks for sharing and take care. Nice to be out.

[@justgoingout6824]

Cheers Quinn.

[@baronedipiemonte3990]

The cooker @ 11:25 is THE one. It's totally stabile (the metal canteen cup on top of it), can use darn near anything as fuel.The US GI version can use a variety of fuel as well, but I don't find it as stabile/secure - the way it was designed. Most of us who were in the field carried Two canteens. In one pouch the canteen and the stainless cup with the butterfly handles. The other pouch, the canteen, and an aluminum cup modified to be a "stove" (squares cut at the base & holes drilled on the sides and bottom {now the top} ). We had the hexi cubes - can't use inside like the Fire Dragon or we burned sticks, cardboard. The squaddies have good kit. I've never used the square mess cans... the Germans/Swedes win it there. The U.S. mess kit dates to WW1 and wasn't even issued in my day ('90-'97). We have the MREs which don't require a tin. Enjoyed your video. Cheers !

[@justgoingout6824]

The British Army square mess tins video I did didnt get too many views, which is a pity. Its a non nonsence bit of kit, and as a youth it was the only thing I could really get my hands on. In the 80's the only other bit of kit was the trangia, which only the rich kids could afford. But the square mess tins are small and compact, not the size of a small washing machine😆. Cheers

[@absmanning9217]

Best video yet. 👍

[@ianbrown6369]

Thanks for a well presented informative video. Cheers, Ian

[@sosteve9113]

Very nice collection you got there,most interesting to see

[@theamazingfreak]

Thank you for a really good video. I have both the MK 1 and MK 2 sets. The original MK 1 was a good concept, though the execution left something to be desired. The cup was brilliant, but the stove was really quite rubbish. The MK 2 stove is brilliant, however, I don't like the cup (because of the ridge, curved part of the base). I have paired the MK 1 cup with the MK 2 stove and the combination is great. When the cup is stored on the stove you can store a Trangia burner in the stove. When I purchased the MK 1 kit it came with the BCB canteen, which too was rubbish. The top lip of the bottle had undulations that made the cap leak like a sieve. I had to spend quite a bit of time flattening out the lip so the cap would seal. At the time I thought that was just the way they came. I am Australian and not really familiar with your British kit. The BCB bottle holds 950ml or 1 US quart. The Osprey bottle holds 1100ml. Here in Australia our defence force went with the US-style canteen and cup set. However, we have your UK-style mess kit (Dixies) and Basha, which we call a Hootchie. Bit of a mixed bag really. We also use the folding Hexamine stove.

[@MrPinhead66]

the black mug with aremovable mouthpiece was the 85 pattern mug still got one

[@t_poutsider]

Nice 1 matey, I purchased the mk1 a few months ago, brilliant kit.

[@justgoingout6824]

The BCB 1 has had a new lease of life, as Ali Express was selling a Boundless Voyage alcohol stove that is a wee bit smaller, and fits under the swing arm. It is yes brilliant...........cheers

[@frogmaster83]

Still use my 58 bottles every weekend. I have most of the sets you have shown, apart from the last/newest one. If it ant broke, why fix it. 👌Regards JB.

[@davidleonard1813]

I understand hexi is issue in the UK now. Any bbq fire lighter block will work well too

[@stealthandysteath1069]

Evening mate, top man. Great kit 👍🔥🇬🇧. Tabs for winter camping. Tc Andy

[@justgoingout6824]

Cheers Andy

[@Mike-vk3mb]

Really enjoyable thank you, great collection, i need to find that last one too. What about the laser cut flat pack cooker that you find in the British army service packs, i've a couple but have t tried it yet.

[@justgoingout6824]

Hello Mike, yep I've seen thoe flat pack foldable stoves. Ive got some in my boxes of stuff, I have opened, tried,trialed ....scoffed a Lithuanian I think MRE andfthey still come as standard in many MREs........will have to trial that😁

[@anthonyjacobs6790]

Nice video, thank you.

[@remy7009]

Hi There , Thank You for the Very Interesting and informative Video , even though I feel even older being of the Hexi stove military era 😃 Please çould you let me know what was the brand of metal lid you placed on the Crusader on the Second to Last Demo with the Esbit Stove , you got it from the seat . Great Work and I'm now one of your subs 👍 Regards Alan

[@justgoingout6824]

Hello Alan, its a Pathfinder lid that nearly fits. Ive been looking at my homemade lids and the logo is so faded that I cant get a match to do a internet search to get others; and believe you me Ive tried. Thanks for your support.

[@remy7009]

That’s Great , Thank You ! . I emptied my. Large-ish Garage recently looking for my Heavy Cover Crusader lid , No luck , I might possibly turn in the future . Regards and Thanks , Alan 👍

[@daveedwards6567]

Make the same video but closer up photography please you seem so far from the camera I think a closer look would make it much better thanks

[@justgoingout6824]

Cheers Dave. Will try to show more close up work.

[@daveedwards6567]

@@justgoingout6824 thanks I think it will be a great video 👍

[@j.juergen1010]

👍 I like it 👍 Very detailed and informative!! Two questions remain for me... the lid you use on the penultimate set at the table... did I see that correctly, that there is a Pathfinder logo to be seen? Does that mean... does the Pathfinder lid fit the Crusader mug? For the last model (Flexi Stove), were or are they used by the army, or are they just prototypes ? With all the best from Germania Jürgen

[@justgoingout6824]

Hello Jurgen, your eyesight is indeed correct in seeing that the Pathfinder muglid does fit; not perfectly, but does work. The flexistove as far as I have been able to discover is not general issue, and the UK armed forces, butthey do have a great deal of allowance in using privatly bought kit. Thanks

[@j.juergen1010]

@@justgoingout6824 Thank you for your quick answer to my question! It seems that the BA is much more generous when it comes to using privately purchased equipment 🤔 In my time in the Bundeswehr unthinkable ... to use other material than the official ones! From what I could find out, the Flexi Stove was probably a participant in a tender by the MOD ... BCB then probably won this tender! Wtb from Germania Jürgen

[@db8314]

I'm from the US... I have a lot of US canteens and cups. My favorite kit is still the BCB MK1! But I need a metal lid... what is that lid in your 3rd kit? BTW Boundless Voyage makes a spirit burner that is shorter than trangia and works in the MK1 stove! Subbed!

[@justgoingout6824]

Hello DB. Ive gone through Ebay, and open sourced the handmade lid. But to no avail, I will have a look on the lid the see if i can decipher the name of the company that made it. The pathfinder lid is probably easier sourced from the States. Will deffo look at the BTW Boundless spirit burner to get into the Crusader 1 set. Give me a bit of time and I will try to search though my mail as well to see if a lid search is helpful. Good talking to you!

[@lesdavidson9594]

Hi...I've just seen this...I make the metal lids on eBay, the lid shown for the crusader 2 is one of mine...

[@db8314]

​​​@@lesdavidson9594 The lid I'm referring to is on the third Kit it's a MK I. It looks like GAK lid (us canteen cup) knock-off. I have tried several US cup lids and none fit well. I keep begging heavy Cover to restart production but their lid is expensive and heavy. Two attributes that do not fare well with modern campers. Not trying to be critical but there is a flaw in your design. Where the lip wraps over the edge of the cup will trap fumes from heximine and will taint your food.

[@lesdavidson9594]

@@db8314 my apologies. I didn't realise that hexi was still in general use...I'll go back to the drawing board and see if I can improve things...

[@db8314]

@lesdavidson9594 No worries! There is also an alcohol stove from boundless voyage that works with mk I stoves. It's like a trangia but short and flat! It's titanium too!

[@AquaTech225]

Definitely enjoyed this one. Any idea where I could find the zippered pouch shown with the first one with a pouch. I have the system but much prefer change out the pouch to the zip up one if it could be found

[@justgoingout6824]

Hello Aqua, i got it years ago, i seem to remember its Dutch, and a shoe shine bag. On that I could be wrong. Ive not seen one like it for a very long time......i will go searching via Mr Google.

[@trytheoutdoors]

Great job. Can you share your views on the last one. Any good?

[@justgoingout6824]

Hello Imran. The flexicooker solves so many problems. It takes no space, weighs nothing and folds flat. its durable and after dozens of uses it does not lose its stiffness, so the construction gets a thumbs up. The fabric loop which allows you to move the stove, and enable the Crusader mug to be removes give you the confidence, even though the heat dissapates incredibly quickly from the metalised fabric. So yep its good👍👍👍

[@stevedunne9131]

My new (2022) Osprey bottle doesn't fit too well inside my BCB Mk1 mug

[@justgoingout6824]

The tinist of devations do make a difference, annoyingly so..........I share your pain with bits of kit that dont quite fit the original.

[@wightoutdoors3738]

You missed an evolution out. Between the first 58 with the plastic cup, and the Crusader mug(self purchase as I remember). There was a black metal mug with a removable plastic lip guard.

[@seasoldier3902]

The 58 Pattern water bottle with the "plug" on the top is to fit the straw from the respirator, so the Pongo/ Matlot/Crab can drink from the water bottle without removing the respirator or water bottle top. Liked the presentation subject matter but you really do need to work on your presentation skills. It would alter your effort from a good to an excellent one. Suggest using a storyboard in conjunction with a script together with loads of rehearsals! It isn't easy to put yourself in front of a camera and produce a presentation.

[@justgoingout6824]

Thanks Sea Soldier, my video journey from bumbling fool to barely competant is an ongoing one. 😁 Slowly its getting there, and i'm trying to get it all together. Confidence in kit, and yourself takes time. As a Sea Soldier, my use of drinking through the straw for over a decade may have been witnessed while I was wearing all black. 43FPGRMSEGMDP. And thats all i'm going to publish on this forum. So again cheers for your views, it all helps👍👍👍

[@nomadmarauder-dw9re]

Flexistove a BCB product?

[@jasperedwards2713]

still got my 58 patten sleeping bag but it needs a new zip most of feathers have gone

[@billburr5881]

tip - don't sit in front of a lighter background.

[@davidlaw233]

Nek minute 5 hours later 😅😅😅

[@jorgebuzzi940]

Excelente video, gracias por compartirlo, muy interesante !!!

[@davidlaw233]

I'll only be minutes 😂😅

[@user-vk8bn2di3f]

히딩크 감독인줄

[@justgoingout6824]

감사