Doctor Who: Classic 5x5: "The Web of Fear" Parts 1-6 | Reaction!

[@icantthinkofagoodusername4575]

Back in 1968 people used to record the audio when these episodes aired that’s how the audio survived

[@FingonNZ]

Fun fact - the actor playing Professor Travers (Jack Watling) is actually the father of Deborah Watling playing Victoria.

[@ericjohnson9623]

And the reason Professor Travers has a fake beard and old age makeup instead of hiring an older actor man is that the same character and actor appeared earlier in the season in The Abominable Snowmen as a young man.

[@kemmdog4444]

That next episode for Hartnell was Marco Polo and no yeti involved.

[@avodaith]

Also, as far as the stage make-up goes, remember that people were watching grainy, tiny screens. It had to be somewhat caricature or it couldn't be seen. The quality we're watching now is no what would have been seen then.

[@icantthinkofagoodusername4575]

Jack Watling is Deborah Watling father at this point he was 45 and she was 20

[@JohnAShort]

Some quick facts to answer some of your questions: The actor playing Prof Travers, Jack Watling is Debbie (Victoria) Watling s father. We have all the soundtracks of the missing episodes because of fantastic Doctor Who fans who recorded them off their home TVs on reel-to-reel tape recorders (no video recorders in those days). There is a fan animation of Episode 3 which you could have watched (too late now!) No location filming took place in the London Underground because they wanted too much money. Supposedly London Underground were so fooled by the brilliant sets they made, they complained that the BBC had filmed on their property without permission. Will the Intelligence return? SPOILERS!

[@iansmith4023]

Some background info for you: These episodes were indeed recovered in Africa (I think it was Nigeria),on film canisters. The BBC policy in the 60's was to transfer all their videotaped programmes (of which Doctor Who was one one) onto 16mm film,and send it off around the world for international broadcast. The videotapes themselves would be recorded over,because video was an expensive commodity at the time. After each TV station had broadcast the stories,they would send the film canisters on to whichever country wanted them next. Eventually,they were to have ended up back at the BBC again - but many got lost along the way. In this instance,all six episodes were allegedly found; but somewhere along the line,episode 3 was purloined - possibly to be put on the market later for a high price (because of Lethbridge-Stewarts first appearance);although I find this questionable. The reason the audio survives is because of young Dr Who fans recording the programmes 'live' on reel-to-reel audio tape recorders (domestic video recorders were not put onto the UK market until the late 1970s). Later,these fan recordings were handed over to the BBC for historical archiving.

[@iansmith4023]

..and yes,the Watling's were real-life father and daughter.

[@MrPaulMorris]

@Matthew McIntyre Yes, depending on the particular contract, the last network to braodcast the episodes was supposed to either return the film to London for destruction or certify that they had destroyed it. People being human either forgot or just didn't bother in order to save on the shipping costs. As you say, the programmes were seen as having limited commercial value and once colour television started rolling out the older black and white material became worthless practically overnight. It's easy with hindsight to criticise the cavalier attitude towards archiving material but it was all quite reasonable at the time.

[@dylanshadowstar9779]

Funny enough part three wasn't just lost, it was found and then stolen! Which sucks as part three is the very first time we see Lethbridge stewert.

[@julieeverett7442]

I think that was kind of the point, how precious it is!

[@glenmcculla6843]

Everyone needs to see 'Young Frankenstein'.:) Good spot with the 'In the Heat of the Night' poster, too. Re: the old-age makeup, I think the TV picture resolution was a lot different back in the day, and so it won't have been quite as obvious. HD and plasma screens are a lot less forgiving than an old CRT TV.

[@cammybaby01]

"A doctor who episode without the doctor..." mission to the unknown is a single episode story completely void of the doctor.tardis. or any companion

[@julieeverett7442]

some would also argue this was the prequel for masterplan so its a part of a massive 13 part story!

[@jpbitable]

Someone already mentioned this, but if you're interested in why people recorded the sound was because of how new TV was back then kids were used to listening to radio shows, so when Doctor Who came on the kids who listened to radio serial stories something like Captain Midnight or The Shadow. Its interesting to me because if Doctor Who was maybe a few seasons later, those missing episodes would indeed be missing in every way, which would be a shame because I personally think The Myth Makers was possibly Heartnell's best stories 😱

[@MrPaulMorris]

The reconstructions are based on audio recorded off air at the time and still images called 'telesnaps'. These were sets of photographs taken using an automated camera system basically shooting images of the broadcast episodes a couple of times per minute. The system was set up by a private individual (inventor John Cura) who then offered the photographs to the cast and crew for their portfolios. Cura ran his equipment throughout all the hours of transmissions 7 days per week for decades expanding his gear to cover two channels when ITV launched in the mid-fifties. On his death his widow offered the entire archive to the BBC who had no interest so somewhere in the region of half a million photographs ended up being destroyed. Those that we have were the sets sold to various individuals over the years. As others have said, Jack Watling was Deborah's father. At the time of filming Jack would have been 45 while his daughter was 20. In the earlier story, Professor Travers met the Doctor, Jamie and Victoria while hunting for (real) Yeti in the Himalayas. The filming was all on studio sets and, having worked in the London Underground surveying for the installation of mobile phone (ie cell) equipment, I can attest from personal experience that the design was spot on. In fact it was so accurate that London Underground management contacted the BBC threatening legal action for unauthorised filming (the producers having approached them earlier to explore the possibility of location shooting). It's interesting that the soldiers seemed so poorly trained as any of the performers past their mid-twenties would have had military service. Conscription only ended in the UK in 1962/3 (the last call up was at the end of 1960 with soldiers serving for two years). Firing the 7.62mm SLR (the semi-automatic rifle in use then--and still in use a couple of decades later during my own service) from the hip is not to be recommended. Not only would it be less than accurate--although that might not matter much at a range of 10-20 yards--but the recoil can be brutal when held sloppily.

[@wobaguk]

Audio only surviving often came about because fan enthusiasts in the days way before VCR would record the audio off TV onto reel to reel recorders, reels which would then get stashing in the attic for a few decades...

[@tonyscupham-bilton7523]

Here's an unusual connection - this story was co-written by Henry Lincoln, who co-wrote "Holy Blood, Holy Grail", the book on which "The Da Vinci Code " is based. Also, Victoria is played by the real-life daughter of Professor Travers.

[@majkus]

In modern Who they tone down the Scottish accents? Heh heh heh heh heh.

[@ListerDavid]

Jack Watlings beard is because he’s playing an older version of a character he played a few stories before. Fun fact the bbc asked the underground to film and got a big no. So they built a small section. The underground saw the episodes and started criminal charges against he bbc thinking they had snuck in and filmed with out permission. 🤣 Episode 2 was Pats week off, as they was filming pretty much all year round so every now and then the main cast would take times off. A number of fans in the 60s wound set up reel to reel tape machines and connect them to the audio output on their TVs, and the pictures are from people who took photos of the screen as it aired. The Hartnell story Marco Polo is a great historical one.

[@ListerDavid]

The history of the tele snaps is the one part my who knowledge that I’m not great on.

[@GhostPurple69]

Your dad just thinks Professor Travers is trying too hard to imitate him.

[@whobp8]

Nice reaction. Lots to unpack here though. Back before there was such a thing as home video, fans who wanted to relive Doctor Who episodes used to tape record the broadcasts. This is why audio survives of all the missing episodes. Some of those fans whose recordings were of a higher quality allowed the BBC to make copies of their tapes of classic episodes. This is one of the two stories that were rediscovered in Nigeria which your Dad read about. Episode three was also found, but was subsequently stolen, so some douchebag private collector has it somewhere. Coincidentally this story was recovered right around the time of the 50th anniversary. Actor Jack Watling was the father of Deborah Watling (Victoria). For quite a long portion of his life Jack was a youngish looking actor and was frequently cast in parts that were younger than his actual age, so he might look like he's not old enough to be Deborah's father, but he's older than he seems. Director Douglas Camfield asked for permission to film on location in the London Underground, but the London Transport Service refused. Camfield subsequently had sets built. When the story was broadcast the sets looked so convincing London Transport threatened to sue the BBC because they believed they had snuck down into the Underground and filmed without permission. Finally, back in the 60's Doctor Who was broadcast almost year round. Most seasons were forty some episodes long. So occasionally the Doctor or one of the companions is written out for an episode or two so the actor portraying them can have some time off. In this story Troughton was on holiday somewhere for episode two

[@robvanriot]

Six episode stories are always, always hard. It doesn't matter which Doctor is in the lead role, they're always a slog if you do them all in one sitting. I speak as someone who sat through "The Trial of a Timelord" on VHS in a single day. Don't do that when the time comes! :)

[@julieeverett7442]

a six part story is the same length of a modern day three part, its like watching turn left/stolen earth/journeys end back to back! Dont! In the day we watched a chapter a week, since people today seem to have a limited attention span, and an hour of tv seems to be all they can tolerate, try 2 or 3 chapters at a time and do them over a couple of sittings, its that easy!

[@DonnaLang42rockglobally]

Yes, Jack Watling was Debra Watling's father - I guess he started having kids at a young age.

[@josefschiltz2192]

Second Doctor: "Ah, erhmph, you must be . . er . . Alex! Oh good, your dad's with you. Oh dear, I really must sit down for a bit. I have to warn you that you're about to meet some old enemies of mine . . I really must find Victoria and Jamie . . of course, they could be with . . now, Alex; don't be alarmed! Your Dad's there with you and everything's going to be all right . . at least I hope it will be. Oh my word! I think they're catching up with me, I mean us. Well, don't just sit there you two. RUN!

[@richardlemin7840]

Josef: I'm too old to run...

[@josefschiltz2192]

@@richardlemin7840 My dear fellow. All you need to do is get a non-colour-fast T-shirt and go out and stand in the rain! 😥 (Surrealist mind talking out loud)

[@FingonNZ]

This is the 1st Doctor Who story I ever saw as a 5 year old (although it was in New Zealand so a number of years after its UK broadcast). It long lingered in my memory and I was ecstatic when it was (mostly) recovered in 2013. It's long been regarded as a classic (partially I suppose because it was missing) & I guess there has been some revision of that status since we have it back. I personally love it though - well within my personal top 10.

[@d.-_-.b]

46:57 So *that's* where you get your elbow scratching habit from!

[@richardlemin7840]

Kyva Go: Actually, it's more likely a reaction to the leather chair I've been sitting in for more than an hour... But Alex DOES have a lot of other habits he's picked up from me. ~Dad

[@7thHourFilms]

Yet that doesn't include cracking my knuckles. That's all me.

[@darkosprey34]

The Great Intelligence!

[@joshuathompson2404]

Alex: In modern Doctor Who, when someone comes on with a Scottish accent, they tone it down. Me: Bless.

[@7thHourFilms]

Everyone keeps saying that. Am I missing something?

[@joshuathompson2404]

@@7thHourFilms Nah...I don't think it's probably spoilers to say that there are some harder Scottish accents in some future episodes from various characters

[@7thHourFilms]

I just remembered that the accents in The Rebel Flesh were really thick. Had to turn on subs for those eps. I guess I was talking about Amy's accent.

[@joshuathompson2404]

@@7thHourFilms Oh yeah, there were some thicker northern accents in that one if I remember right.

[@Mrazmatmahmood]

@@7thHourFilms You know Peter Capaldi is a future Doctor, right? His Scottish accent will be pretty thick...

[@donaldb1]

7:20 - "Londoners Flee! Menace Spreads" Is it Christmas?

[@rinmixx]

I would very much recommend the 3rd Doctor serial: Inferno. It's a bit long but I think you'll love it.

[@Jamienomore]

FACT: A long time ago in America, with the Printing press, the cost of whatever you wanted Printed cost per letter. Being cheap skates, they would leave out some letters which was never corrected. That is why American spelling of word is so bad while British spelling and pronunciation is correct. By the way, the Actor that plays Jamie is English.

[@7thHourFilms]

Cool...It's still Aluminum.

[@Jamienomore]

Some People say it's Plastic.

[@7thHourFilms]

Some say its Maybelline.

[@icantthinkofagoodusername4575]

The Sonic Screwdriver makes it first appearance in the next story

[@aidanschannel7183]

Oh, A-/B+, probably around what I'd rate this episode too. Hope your Dad keeps up with the ratings, nice to know how you'd both compare serials with each other.

[@oliverbennett8515]

The great Intelligence will return...just not quite were you’d expect

[@BulbasaurRepresent]

SHHHHHHH

[@oliverbennett8515]

No u Shhhhhhhhh

[@bythebreach]

What part of 'no spoilers in the comment section' do people not understand!? Come on people :/

[@iain9757]

Daniel 1023 well we know the doctor survives so that’s a spoiler

[@MalcolmPrice82]

Mars Attacks = Awesome Movie

[@richardlemin7840]

If by awesome, you mean awful, I agree! ~Dad 😉

[@MalcolmPrice82]

@@richardlemin7840 well its not the best of sci-fi, but there are worse haha. Enjoyed the reaction anyway ☺️

[@icantthinkofagoodusername4575]

This entire story was missing but was found in 2013 but sadly somebody stole episode 3

[@Mrazmatmahmood]

Wasn't that like 2011 or 2013? How have they not found episode 3 by now?!

[@aleahaibrahim8362]

Because someone took it, I’m pretty sure (unless I’m confusing it.) episode 3 was sold to a collector who refuses to give it to the BBC in fear of losing its value.

[@stevencassidy6982]

If you are gonna watch 6 episodes at once, watch episodes 1-3, make a cup of tea, then watch 4-6. The London underground was receated in studio and baffled the real LU. Which ones are you watching for Pertwee and Tom Baker

[@Chiggins_]

The Curse of Peladon

[@7thHourFilms]

3rd - The Curse of Peladon 4th - The Deadly Assassin 5th - Earthshock 6th - The Holy Terror (Audio) 7th - Damaged Goods (Audio) 8th - The Chimes of Midnight (Audio) Alternate 9th - Scream of the Shalka (Animated) Actual 9th - Dalek 10th - The Waters of Mars 11th - The Snowmen After those will be every anniversary special.

[@Chiggins_]

@@7thHourFilms Three audios? I thought it'd just be Chimes. Dayumn, okay gurl

[@avodaith]

@@7thHourFilms Deadly Assassin is a cracking one, first one after Sarah-Jane's departure (given you're watching these out of order, don't think that's a spoiler).

[@Mrazmatmahmood]

@@7thHourFilms Oh, changed it to The Snowmen for 11. Hmmm, I do like that episode, but I have to say that it'll probably pale in comparison to Dalek and The Waters of Mars... Also, how are you going to do reactions to the audios? Or will you just do the post ep review and analysis for those?

[@dylanshadowstar9779]

Funny enough I watched this a couple days ago.

[@Mrazmatmahmood]

Very interested to see your reactions to this one! Often considered one of the best classic Who stories, but I found it to be slightly overrated. I've only watched it once, so my opinion might change after rewatching it with you guys today. In any case, this is definitely a good one and I hope you liked it.

[@avodaith]

I always feel like the classic series would work pretty well re-edited into modern episode length for each story. There's so much wasted time in each episode modern editing would just cut out all that guff and make something that was much more watchable. They did a few in the 80s as one-offs so they've already shown it could be done.

[@julieeverett7442]

but the classic era stories were for the most part 4 parts, same as a modern day 2 parter, but yes, sometimes they did ramble, and even the legendary Genesis was 2 chapters too long!

[@avodaith]

@@julieeverett7442 A classic episode of who was about 25 minutes. Remove titles, credits and cliffhanger and we're down to about twenty. So a four-parter is about an hour twenty long. There's got to be at least half an hour of that that could be scrubbed with some judicious editing. These ten minute episode recaps I watch on KZbin have most of the vital plot points, after all!

[@cammybaby01]

Non spoiler: the great intelligence did not return during the classic era

[@bythebreach]

...how on earth is that NOT a spoiler??

[@cammybaby01]

@@bythebreach I have not revealed anything that will happened. Only stopping someone from looking forward to something that never happens.

[@bythebreach]

@@cammybaby01How and why do you think it's right to stop reactors from "looking forward to something that never happens"? Reactors WANT to look forward to things, regardless of whether their ideas turn out to be right or wrong; that's what makes it fun for reactors and audiences alike. I'm sorry, but what you're doing is not helpful.

[@iain9757]

The doctor survives so that’s a spoiler for new who