Building a Shower Pan with Deck Mud (No Timelapse or Editing)

[@Liberty_DIY]

I don't know if you realize it or not....but you inspire folks to do more DIY than just tile.

[@AutismusPrime69]

Don't simp

[@alexmack956]

@@AutismusPrime69you have issues

[@gssuper1438]

This is the only way I can learn. Just watch you do exactly what you do in real time and i can repeat it! Worked for a contractor for years and learned so much watching all the trades doing their thing

[@jordanwise9354]

I started my own shower renovation because of the confidence you built within us. Please continue the shower build and show each step in detail like you did here. Thanks for being our Tile Coach! 🙌🏿

[@TileCoach]

Awesome!!! your welcome

[@rpetrow220]

Out of curiosity, what type of pan are you going with Jordan? I have been scared of doing my own tilework because of trusting myself to build a waterproof pan. A tile store I visited reccommended a Wedi system...But apparently even they fail. Ugh...what to choose, what to choose....???

[@jordanwise9354]

@@rpetrow220 this is completely brand new to me but research & patience is key. I live in Texas so this is what I did. Our house foundation is a concrete slab and I am doing a 3ftx8ft shower with a 6 1/2 curb (4-5 inch would have been better). 1. Shower curb with basic bricks, covered in mortar. 2. Thinset on the concrete prior to your preslope for your dry pack (they sell preslope plastic kits to help with this). 2. Dry pack like tile coach except my batches were inconsistent so I mixed a bit of mortar mix and concrete to strengthen it. I also sprayed a bit of flex seal to make sure it wouldnt break down. 3. Rubber pan liner (6 inch minimum on all sides) 4. Dry pack slope with some added mortar mix to give it the strength & smoothness I needed (they sell slope plastic forms). 5. Paint 3 coats of Waterproof membrane 6. both of my dry packs had a bit of unevenness so you'll need to make sure it's smooth, or if it's already dry vacuum it up. 7. Patience and critical thinking throughout the process.

[@brandondion6689]

​@jordan wise hey buddy i know you put the waterproofing in ontop of your rubber liner just to be safe but this can lead to issues later due to water not actually draining through the bed and to the weep holes if you're using it everyday. Coach has a few videos of why you shouldnt mix methods. The rubber pan liner uses a clamp style drain usually with weep holes so the water can drain down through the pan over time and make its way to the drain. When you seal the pan like that it counteracts what you're trying to accomplish.

[@dextershutt1716]

Watching a mudbed being installed right is so satisfying

[@dougSUNLOVER]

BEST video on KZbin for making a shower base . I am on my third shower and have watched this video many times. Thank you for the full time video without editing so we can see all the details! I have purchased the drain from Tile coach and this made the pan build so easy!!

[@mathusvaiaoga9787]

This guy makes it look soooo easy. I tore mine up twice before I finally felt ok with it.

[@abarragan951]

I did the same to my shower remodel!

[@bh8595]

That was one of the cleanest pans I've ever seen done. One of these days I'll have to come by your store. I'm in Marysville. Been doing since High School. Watched most of your videos. Very educational no matter any viewers skill level. Great job and keep up the good work.

[@jhscolombianito7598]

Ey broth. I loved two things about this video : 1. Your technic to float the shower . 2 The description of sounds and noises background.

[@brendoncreps365]

Amazing as always. Full length was great. Hope to see more.

[@Smokie1969]

It's always a pleasure watching true tradesmen taking pride in their work👌 Quick Q: I'm putting in a shower in my new workshop/shed.....what's the best method, a mortar base as shown here, or a premanufactured shower base?

[@rogerghiardi7723]

Awesome I've done two huge showers lately with RSS. It's awesome

[@jpatron79]

Great vid! I am saving myself easily,15k, with your help and this FloFX flange and tile in drain. Cant wait to be done! Your videos are awesome!! Thank you!

[@svnnyb33]

Wow, I really appreciate having no timelapse. These videos usually speed through the parts that require the most precision!!

[@mrdolby]

That sure looks like an form of art! Excellent work

[@TileCoach]

Thank you very much!

[@edzaffina9785]

It's a pleasure to watch ! Thank you coach!

[@Joachim.777]

All I got to say is, you’re an absolutely pro Zack. Woow love the fact that you’re very caring with the finishing. Just fantastic… Very well done bud. God Bless you always 🖖🏽❤️🙏🏽

[@johndoyle4984]

Awesome work! I've watched a bunch of your videos now as you explain things well! It was good to see this without a time lapse!! I've seen and done a lot of projects and got my timing mixed up thinking that I'd be done quicker, just like the videos :)

[@vsendyk]

to keep the line around, I put the laser level on the drain, set the elevation 3/4 of the way from the drain and then I always have a line. I use Huepar 503DG. It is good because the horizontal line is low (about 1/4 from the floor)

[@rxcalvosa]

That's fine, as long as the drain is dead level.

[@lucindaspoerner9935]

Thank you for doing this video real time, so helpful!

[@SomeRandomOldGuy]

Thanks Isaac. Love the real time video. So helpful. (I call it "the wiggle tool" or "Mr. Wizzer")

[@jcuhl387]

This video is a huge help! Could you show the waterproofing details for a mud bed like this?

[@clacicle]

This was very satisfying to watch.

[@TileCoach]

Glad you liked it...I will do more!

[@MrLexani420]

Thanks for putting this up. Helped a ton!

[@wolfcat7begay791]

Thanks for showing the whole process

[@conradcoolerfiend]

its cool how the steel trowel really changes the surface texture!

[@beanieweenie9543]

Love that steel trowel asmr!

[@bigbob9702]

I do enjoy real time. Thanks

[@sune3000]

Fun to watch and informative. Thanks!

[@ofiasdfnosdf]

Thanks - that helped a lot!

[@eric4brs]

The way you placed the knee pads was genius.

[@1330ronal]

Deck mud take time and a lot skills good job

[@benjaminwilson869]

When I grow up, I’ll make mud beds as smooth as you, Isaac 🥲

[@beerdrinker2001]

Tile coach is getting yolked 💪

[@spikeklein2196]

From all of us visual learners out here, thank you!

[@PhillyFixed]

Was that a Kirk Giordano reference at 9:54 ? 😉 He's also the man!

[@alexmanns9658]

That auger bit is awesome ! I bought one a few years back probably the same exact one you have there. It makes a perfect consistency and the shovel has been collecting dust ever since.

[@victorgarrido9786]

Very informative video....Any comments about using hardie backer board hydrodefense on the floor inside the shower?

[@NockOn1]

Damn, you make it look so easy 👍

[@daveg3235]

Is the concrete already sloped in the very beginning before adding the deck mud?

[@sw4943]

Another great job, u been hitting the gym aswell buddy by the look of those arms 💪🏾

[@TileCoach]

I have been going to the gym for the first time since college football! Enjoying feeling strong again

[@NoomClara]

THANK YOU FOR NO TIME LAPSE, SO I CAN SIT AND WATCH WITH MY MOUTH AGAPE LIKE AN OG APPRENTICE SHOULD.

[@matthalby1157]

how high above the concrete do yo typically want to set the flo fx drain so that you have a thick enough amount of deck mud at drain

[@larryfeeks6620]

Great video!

[@CDCHI609]

great content as usual! How thick is the deck mud usually at the drain?

[@javierhernandez996]

Is better to use a wood floater or metal floater ? Or basically you can use both

[@phylumofthefree]

any advice for a shower pan that ended up a bit rough? Ive read people using thinset to smooth it over. Thoughts?

[@AJAlbrecht]

Hey Isaac, i see you using a paddle mixer on the job, but on the mock up you mixed it in a 3 mil trash bag. is it better to use the paddle mixer rather than the trash bag? I am going to mix four 55 pound bags to start with and I was thinking the bags would keep it from drying out to fast while i was working the outer edges.

[@omidrezania7824]

So usefull, thanks boss

[@mikehomsley4541]

Appreciate your videos! You have said before regarding deck mud most ratio is 4 to 1, why do you like 5 to 1 ?

[@TileCoach]

Easier to work with and can use more water if needed.

[@SteveGarcia-ye9ji]

How high you lift flange from existing concrete. What if is a regular drain how high you set it from existing concrete.

[@dbeaulieu9730]

I wonder if you could make mention in one of your videos about the importance of not making the slab too thick. I recently took over from another installer who had made his 6 inches thick in an apartment building. I am very concerned about the potential problem in the future apart from the cracking of the slab.

[@bearpaw9204]

Just starting to work on bathroom that had zero waterproofing. My question, at what stage do you waterproof shower wall if you float it? I want to use hardie board, then float, and use Hydro Ban...but I don't know at what stage to add it? Does it go on the hardie board before floating, or on top of the floated wall? Thanks for all your videos, been a HUGE help.

[@tofuroshi]

Isaac, have you tried Go Board? Would love to see a video on it.

[@marcg3191]

Is there a video showing you setting that style shower drain?

[@abarragan951]

Issac. I did my own mud pan using the deck mud bags from home depot. I noticed the bag said if it wasnt tiled over with in 24 hrs then you have to wait 28 days for it to cure? Seems like a lot of time. I did mine firday afternoon and i still have to finsh my sealing before i can tile. Do i really need to wait the 28 days? If any one else has delt with this please let me know. Thank issac. Keep posting vids. I too went with the flofx cuz of yiur videos. Im about to retire from law enforcement in two more Mays and im really contemplating doing bathroom remodles. Its a ton of hard work but very satisfying

[@calvinhobbes6118]

Call the manufacturer, but I believe thats if you dont put a liquid membrane over it. You can also put down a thin layer of thinset over the mudpack, let it dry, then tile over it. Back in the day they would immediately install the tile straight on to the mudpack and be done with it, now we have thinset mortar which is much better.

[@rugerdogg5316]

Can I put the slurry on concrete that has been sealed

[@timothyeliason8844]

Can foam curbs be cut at different angles to install in shower pans that are not square? Do you have a video that explains that?

[@BR-il9vl]

Hey Isaac , which method do you prefer, mud base or pre fab base?

[@Tyler-sv4sw]

That drill is great I use to have it. Better than plug in and cord

[@Ant21toineg]

Can you show a concrete only shower pan with waterproofing and / or a stamped concrete shower pan.

[@deborahnucci2569]

Does it matter if you use modified or unmodified thin set on your flowfx to adhere it to the bed?

[@toddmccormick8363]

Awesome vid Isaac! Please let me know where I can get one of those Flo X levels😂

[@TileCoach]

order a drain and you get the sticker!

[@bigbob9702]

Will you show next step real time as well?? I for one would love to see it. Thx!!

[@TileCoach]

Yes I will

[@JacobRivera-b4k]

Zack wish you were in Florida. I have a shower to be finished

[@larrys5733]

I wish the flo fx drain had a 1\4 slope built into the flange. It is pretty flat and can ever so slightly cause the last bits of water to stay near the drain and not fall in if your using penny or pebble tile. Any tricks to help avoid that?

[@beanieweenie9543]

How long of a work time do you have with deck mud?

[@TileCoach]

Depends on temperature...but usually about an hour or so

[@vby9588]

from my experience best mud is made by Laticrete. I think you should spray some water and cover it with plastic film, that's how i always do it.

[@davidbareither8562]

What's the thickness of the mud bed under the flo fx out of curiosity? I've heard some folks go as thin as 1/2 inch which seemed thin to me but not sure.

[@TileCoach]

I like about an inch...but 3/4" minimum on plywood subfloor (with lath) and 1/2" on slab. Could go lower on slab if needed since its bonded to the slab. But hard to work the mud and get it smooth.

[@frankcatrini4816]

so in a schluter type system is water penetrating shower floor tiles and grout and draining into drain from under surface (between the underside of tile and cloth) or is all the water simply draining on the surface to drain?

[@TileCoach]

The water evaporates back up through the grout

[@conradcoolerfiend]

most of the water drains off the surface of the tiles to the drain. of the small amounts of water that penetrate the grout lines: if it becomes really saturated with water, then some water will drain into drain from under surface (between the underside of tile and cloth). The rest of the minimal moisture that isnt enough to drain, evaporates and dries out from the grout lines.

[@fctazz]

@@conradcoolerfiend i ask because I have never done a bonded drain type shower but find it interesting. In my 40 plus years of full time tiling have only done liner pans here in fl. I dont think at this point I will change, as in the hundreds of showers I have done, I have not had even one call back. What got me curious is I often here setters mixing the 2 systems together , like using liquid membrane over a 3 piece drain system and what I hear most is "dont do it because it causes a moisture sandwich " that got me to think why would it be that in that situation but not if there is cloth underneath and I just can't see why it would be with a liquid membrane underneath compared to a cloth, as they both are stopping water at that area...now if indeed alot is traveling under a cloth system to drain, I can see it escaping into drain unlike the liquid because at that point water basically has no where to go, unless you didn't put liquid in the area around drain and in that case it could possibly drain down to weep holes...anyways thats for the response

[@phildo3668]

We only get Mapei 4:1 deckmud here and no plaster sand anywhere. What's a good sand to cut the Mapei with from a box store?

[@donbritton3629]

Isaac, I am planning on doing a small shower base with your dry pad method and Flo FX drain. A. Do you ship to Canada? Have you had any exposure to Wilsonart’s Wetwall system? I would appreciate any of your thoughts on it.

[@mrscott01]

Where did you get the rubber buckets?

[@ChiChiLeeVT]

HELP! I used this method for building my shower pre-slope, but the surface of the dry-pack was so crumbly when it dried! There was a layer of sandy material over the top that could just be brushed away. What did I do wrong and is there a way to fix it without breaking up the whole pre-slope and starting over? Thanks!

[@homerdoh56]

Hi Isaac, are there any work around a for a shower drain through a concrete slab that isn’t plumb? I got the flofx drain flange from you, but after test fitting, the PVC drain needs to be straightened. Is my only option to knock out the concrete and have it redone? I have about 2” of exposed pipe I can mess with if there are work around. Thanks!

[@andrewbassett709]

I recently built a shower pan with deck mud and a flofx drain just like this shower. I waited for it to cure for 7 days and then I applied henrys feather edge over the top to smooth out the finish and ran it over all of the deck mud to the flow fx drain. I then waited for it to cure and applied three layers of Hyrdo Ban waterproofing all the way from the top of the walls and over the flofx drain up to the square drain hole. Once the waterproofing was dried i did a flood test. During the first several hours of the flood test I lost about an inch of water before it held. I don't know where the water went in those first two hours. The shower pan is 70in x 42in so there was quite a bit of water lost. The p-trap under the shower was dry so my stop wasn't leaking and the there is no visible water in the crawl space or coming out along the walls. Could the lost water have some how soaked through the hydro ban to the cement and been absorbed? Anyone have any idea where I should go from here? The water level where its currently holding is about 3in deep. Looking along the perimeter I don't see any perforations in the waterproofing so I don't know how I could have lost the water. Has anyone else had a similar experience? I need some help troubleshooting this. I'm holding off from tiling until I figure this out obviously. Many Thanks!

[@TileCoach]

Hydro Ban must of leaked. Did you do two good coats? Should have dried about the thickness of a credit card. At this point, I would use RSS sheet membrane on the pan with corners, and band to 2-1/2” up the walls and curb. I sell it on tilecoach.com by the foot.

[@andrewbassett709]

@@TileCoach Thank you so much for the response! I gave it two really good coats in the pan and up about 8 in. Higher up it gets a little thinner. I assumed there is a perforation somewhere right at the level where it's holding. I just need to look it over more closely. I will purchase the rss membrane off your site. Can I install it over hydroban? What should I do about the lost water that I can't find? Thanks again for all you do and for the reply. You're amazing!

[@travisk5589]

Are those tile coach skivvies?

[@Ralphy991]

Please send link for auger bit!

[@akextremerickert]

Hi I'm a tile guy here in Montana. I still use the deck mud system with hydro ban over the top. Do you prefer this method over other methods?

[@SoCalKen]

So what's the next step RSS walls > DeckMud pan > ? Does the pan get Hydro Ban up the walls?

[@klaytee7787]

Is the backer board designed to be in contact with mud? I know backer board is water resistant but not waterproof. Let me know

[@asifiqbal2]

Coach: Just curious why not use the crack resistant concrete mix instead of deck mud which is brittle and can crack, not to mention more porous? I am getting ready to do a shower for the first time and all these videos on YT basically says every system can fail. I loved your video about Kerdi foam pre sloped pan where the hammer drop ruined the foam. I don’t know why anyone would use foam under tile which can crack easily. That’s what got me thinking about concrete.

[@calvinhobbes6118]

Good luck trying to form concrete mix, its so wet and it wants to slump. They use 4:1 or 5:1 mix because the sand in it makes it easier to form, like sandcastles at the beach.

[@michaelbox7285]

You don't need a rubber liner under there?

[@Kornelius1972]

Is deck mud the same as sand topping mix ?

[@leahromay7462]

Hi Isaac, I have watched a bunch of your videos for my DIY shower project. I bought the flow fx drain from you as I watched your video on how to do the easy deck mud slope using the strips around the border and I liked that concept. However, I am not 100% sure of my plan. I have a plywood subfloor. I'm seeing in this video you have a concrete floor and put the thin set and then the deck mud (just as you said to do in that other video). Conversely, it seems like when the floor is wood, that I should do a preslope, then a PVC liner, and then the deck mud? I am wondering how the Flow Fx drain works with the pvc liner, as you put the mud up under it, but with the liner you need to have weep holes. If you could help me, my questions are what are the actual order of layers I should be doing: 1) Plywood, tar paper and mesh, deck mud, hydroban? Or 2) plywood, preslope, pvc liner, deck mud? I also don't understand if the cement board on the walls should be touching the deck mud, i see a lot of comments about leaving a gap, but then how do you tile the gap? Lastly, do I wrap the curb in cement board? Your help is greatly appreciated!!! Thank you so much!

[@TileCoach]

It sounds like you could use a tile coaching session! But you don’t use a pvc liner with a Flofx. You do however use lath on plywood under the dry pack.

[@5firebird]

How much work time do you have with the deck mud?

[@calvinhobbes6118]

About an hour.

[@stephenedwards9872]

Hallo from the uk Why don't people use a plastic shower tray like in the uk

[@joeburly]

Did you do the rest of this work? If so are there videos?

[@TileCoach]

I waterproofed it. That video will be coming up

[@jeffhamann5178]

not saying im any better than anyone, but i was tolled the biggest no no was putting backer behind wet bed. it gives the water a path .

[@davidfigliola7297]

Coach, how were you able to not use a liner between the slab and deck mud? Won’t water absorb through the deck mud to the slab?

[@vby9588]

surface waterproofing. just Google it

[@davidherd3739]

Yup, this is a different system than you’re thinking, David. A bonded sealed system is different than a traditional “water-in-water-out” with weep holes

[@davidfigliola7297]

David, thank you for the explanation. I researched both methods and now fully understand the difference. After watching so many videos of shower installs, pre-slopes, water proofing techniques, etc., nobody has taken the time to call out the name or technically (named) difference between methods. Very clear and easy to understand now.

[@darwinbodero7872]

Hey Isaac. I built my deck mud pan before putting on the durock walls. Should I leave a gap between the pan and the backer board or place it directly on top of the pan? I intend to use hydroban sheet membrane. Any advice would be appreciated.

[@1smhs]

A bit late on advice but the sage advice is that if you put the backer board below the water level it may wick water up the board… I feel like hardi board would probably have a bigger issue due to the amount of cellulose in the board… durock probably less of an issue… the hardi board I left outside last season is covered in black mold

[@darwinbodero7872]

@@1smhs I ended up putting it above the mud pan

[@sampon9328]

i call it a oscillating tool. But to my young helper i call it "the thing that goes verrrrrr" lol great help just doesn't know his tools yet.

[@acemastermatt]

Since the walls are already waterproof, what are you going to waterproof the pan with?

[@conradcoolerfiend]

sheet membrane

[@acemastermatt]

@Conrad Coolerfiend inwas thinking a liquid membrane

[@conradcoolerfiend]

@@acemastermatt I wouldn’t reccomend it cause it’s inconsistent and more prone to variance causing leakage. Sheet membranes are consistent and foolproof

[@TonyVM775]

Don’t mind me. I’m jus watching some guy float a pan like I do once a week for the past 5 years. Lmao

[@MrFishone777]

I’m rebuilding a fail shower on a slab. How thin would be to thin for deck mud?

[@sampon9328]

read the bag of the material you're using. it'll tell you minimum thickness

[@conradcoolerfiend]

1/2" on concrete, 3/4" on plywood with lathe. to be safe and extra strong use 1 inch

[@MrFishone777]

@@conradcoolerfiend thanks that helpful. I have to cut and break out a failed shower pan. Looks like they poured concrete and used mastic instead of thin set. It’s only two years old.

[@conradcoolerfiend]

@@MrFishone777 yikes, mastic is not ok for wet areas!

[@MrFishone777]

@@conradcoolerfiend not only that but the slope was wrong and water was getting outside on the floor.

[@victor-manuel-pr]

HI TILE COACH WHOW I CAN GET THIS TUPE OF DECK MUD IN MARYLAND??

[@daveking4272]

I call it a zinger

[@michaelmaimone13]

I call it a flush cut saw

[@rd7385]

0:54 bro, first edit not even a minute in. Love ya tho

[@TileCoach]

You know what I meant haha. Love you too man.

[@rd7385]

@@TileCoach all love. Just joking you. Great content as always.

[@SiHandyman]

Why a mud job over a slab?

[@conradcoolerfiend]

vs foam? cheaper, stronger, and easier to make fit any space.

[@Astro25man]

Do you really have to lay concrete down first on top of plywood? Can’t you just put down your shower pan vinyl and then your deck mud on top of the vinyl pan?

[@ohokayofficial]

(Tile apprentice 2 years) A lot of showers we’ve come across and tear out - have no mud underneath their vinyl pan It is very wise to do a pre float before your showerpan 💪🏽🙌🏽 learned from a master tile setter