A Guide to Training in Super Shoes | Runner's Science

[@dorins3787]

Wow. Probably the best material I saw lately on running topic. Congrats on combining medicine, sports and very good know how on running. Thank you very much for the information!

[@JeremyGiese]

I’m a PTA and I like seeing/hearing the PT side of running and mechanics of gait. 🤓 I would like more informative videos similar to this one! It gets old having shoe break downs of just stats from the manufacture and discuss looks/materials/fit.

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Jeremy there will be more coming! -Matt

[@DeeGee69]

48y old boomer here.. 1200km in Prime X since mostly March 2022 (from 6:30/km to 4 something)... not a single rolled ankle.... got a balanced board beforehand. I alternate between one pair of Adios Pro 2 (I ran 2 marathons in them in 2022) and Noosa Tri 14 for track workouts. Shift 3 (4mm drop) and Nimbus Lite 2 (12mm drop) for recovery runs. Boston 9 for treadmill.

[@DoctorsofRunning]

You prepared well and that is a fantastic rotation! The variety is important!

[@RUN-SC]

I really appreciate the longer discussion on this topic. Sometimes going over 2 is warranted.

[@DoctorsofRunning]

I have been hearing this frequently so will do some longer discussions. Also moving to sub3! -Matt

[@bnpuff]

This type of video is why I love this channel! Great insight.

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Bnpuff thank you for watching and listening!

[@goutfromfriedokra]

@@DoctorsofRunning What is your top shoe for walking?

[@jungtao]

This is exactly what distinguishes your channel vs others. U guys really address the cool trends with actual bio mechanics and how it all relates. This is Great content!

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Thank you!

[@seanwise7464]

I spent this summer exploring different super foams, high stacks, and plates and created all sorts of weird issues for myself. Spent the last few weeks in my old “boring” firm (in comparison) shoes and seemed to finally rectify the issues along with extra stretching routines tossed in. Today I dug out my pair of endorphin pros and thought why not, I’ll be careful and hold back pace as needed - and instantly took off like a big dumb animal with no thought about pace as I just wanted to fly ….the circle continues 😊

[@DoctorsofRunning]

That is super common! Controlling pace in these can be difficult!

[@dickiesanddgank8335]

Really helpful, I am worried of buying that one because i think i am not proper enough especially only for training

[@jasonh6910]

This is exactly the video I am looking for! As a new runner, running for the last 2 weeks. I been told I can’t be training in my super shoe, I only have 2 pairs right now. Endorphins pro 4 and invisible run 3. I prefer the pro4 so much more and been using it 80% of the time for my all my runs

[@Murphy2043]

I regularly incorporate bent and straight leg calf raises on wedges at the gym. That and the fact that I've acclimated to zero-drop shoes well are likely keeping my achilles strong.

[@scurvychef2]

Great topic. I keep my super shoes on the shelf unless for races but I do pull them out for sprints every now and again just to keep them familiar. I’ve noticed there’s a particular cadence and stride length where these shoes “feed” your step, but get out of sync and I feel like a car bouncing around pot holes with bad struts.

[@kubasuchorowski]

The best substantive video so far 🙂 A lot of specific knowledge and this leaf on your head 😄 Greatings from Poland 🇵🇱

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Kuba! Thank you for watching and listening! Also yes, did not know that was on my head until later! -Matt

[@hiddetenberg893]

This is a suberb subject for a review! Especially from your scientific background

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Thank you!!!

[@zackwinters555]

Just bought my first super trainers and strained my hamstring after my second run. Thanks so much for putting all of this great info out there! Time to ease them into the rotation slower and get back to strength training!

[@MattSwain1]

We obsess about carbon plates in running shoes and about how they might affect us but MOST people will spend less than 90 (or even 60) minutes in them per day… we should consider our footwear (or lack of) for the other 20-odd hours more carefully, maybe spending more time out of shoes. I absolutely agree about single leg balances although many people won’t need any foam, just do it in bare feet. Try brushing your teeth stood on one leg and switch legs at half way! I’ve recently switched to super-stacked Adidas Prime X shoes but have had very few e problems with stability as I think all of the yoga I’ve done (including balances) has really prepared me for the shoes

[@Eirikkinserdal]

We should spend less time in shoes. Can't believe that some (americans) use shoes inside their own home. Or is this just a tv-show myth? 😅

[@flatfootedrunner]

Fantastic video, Matt. Some really fascinating insights into an unexplored area.

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Tristan thank you for watching!

[@keithisaacs6092]

Brilliant advice from the Matt probably one of the few channels that give you expert advice. The one shoe that caused me injury problems ( medial knee) was the Asics Nova Blast 1. Fasinating review luved it.

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Keith! I had Achilles issues from the Novablast 1 due to the instability! -Matt

[@zoomerrunner]

Developing PF adds another complicated layer to this because most supershoes' rocker designs helps with this, and shoes like AP3 and Superblast almost seem designed to prevent injury. Plus as you said so many daily trainers are so SOFT now, taking inspiration from supershoe tech which makes a really challenging environment. This Makes shoes like Brooks Hyperion Tempo or Adios 8 interesting to me as they're the few minimal, firm shoes still out there.

[@carlosangalang]

I concur with the fear of getting spoiled by superfoam shoes. It took me about a year to "step-down" from PowerrunPB in the Endorphin Speed to a more traditional trainer like the Asics Novablast 2

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Yes! It takes time for our bodies to re-adapt!

[@johnnylineham59]

Great advice and tips here, appreciated your channel... I watched the last 4mins on my dusty, neglected balance pad 😂

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Awesome!!!

[@ddrombo]

Great info and points. Was using the Hoka Mach 5 as my daily and then picked up the NB SC Trainer for the last part of my marathon training. I love the Mach 5 but honestly putting it back on after using the SC Trainer...it just felt dull.

[@DoctorsofRunning]

That has been my concern. Ruining “normal” shoes. I think having a variety in your shoe rotation is important for that reason!

[@ddrombo]

@@DoctorsofRunning I'd like to know if you guys have done an in depth look at injuries and super shoes as well? Going from a Mach 5 or NB Rebel 2 on most days to running some tempo/race paces in the NB rc elitev2/nike vaporfly 2 really aggravated some posterior tibialis and achilles tendon problems for me.

[@theghostofpcs2391]

Very interesting! I have a few shoes that I don't use anymore (like the nike invincible run and zoom fly 4), because they give me different kinds of issues. Watching this video has given me hope that I might be able to use them again at some point, so thank you!

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Use them! I think the key (like anything) is moderation!

[@atalk143]

Many thanks for this video. This is A+++++ content!

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Thank you! -Matt

[@davidbarclay7606]

Great info,I'm a trail runner and I recently put on a pair of Flyknit 4% and I did a 8 mile tempo run on the streets where I live,oh my god my calf's where so sore it took about a week till they came good ,I guess I need to start strengthen my calf's with some raises 👍

[@DoctorsofRunning]

David you bring you a great point. These shoes seem to facilitate motion, but it doesn’t mean we have the strength to control it! So working on that is key!

[@michaelroberts9427]

This is a superb video! I'm glad I discovered Doctors of Running from your appearance on this week's TriDot podcast.

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Thanks for watching, and welcome!!

[@hoxfrey9093]

i'm a relatively new runner and started on more traditional shoes. i got a rockered supertrainer (puma DN2) last month and agree that strength training is needed. parts of my foot/leg that i don't usually use feel fatigued at the end of runs. thank you for raising this point!

[@conquering1n360]

having had at least 4 calf strains in my life i appreciated all the info. Am i entered? 😎

[@nikkifahey]

Such a helpful overview

[@BenMayMusic]

Hi Matt, thanks so much for the video, I learned so much! I was wondering how often you'd recommend the strength exercises? Is it a 2-3x or daily goal? If it's 2-3x, should I do them on my recovery or workout days?

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Ben! 2-3 times per week is the most you need if you are actually working hard enough

[@cakej1]

I try to do most of my runs in non super shoes. I used to run marathons in shoes like Nike LT, so these super shoes feel ridiculous. But ridiculously fast too. I raced one marathon in supershoes and legs felt like I had run a half marathon.

[@DoctorsofRunning]

The streak LT was a great shoe. I still occasionally look for those on eBay. Have you tried the Streakfly?

[@cakej1]

@@DoctorsofRunning yes, love the streakfly. I've run 2:22:22 in LT type shoe, streakfly I couldn't imagine what I'd run much less vaporfly

[@runevee]

First of all thanks for great content I really enjoys all your content. I have a question. You mention that new runners should be aware of running in carbonated super shoes due to effecting running form and technique (can't remember if it is this video or in the podcast - sorry). It really sounds reasonable, my question is when should a runner consider owning a pair of carbon shoes? When do I know when I'm ready for these shoes? Again thanks for great content.

[@TheCyclingCardio]

I used to run all my run in Adios boost 2, from recovery, speed session, long run, and even finish my first full marathon in it 9 years ago..now that I coming back into running in the last 2-3 months..i trued Novablast 3 amd Endorphine speed 3, my right foot landing become inconsistent, wobbly, mostly all over the place..I never had this problem in the past…makes me kinda skeptical with the higher stack of current running shoe…

[@gazareth]

Hello - I just ran in a pair of Endorphin Pro 3s yesterday (12K), for my first run in carbon plates. Last week I ran a 10K PB in Endorphin Speed 3s, and found that I developed some soreness in the ball of my left foot, and a little in the toes. The run in the Pros definitely aggravated that. Any pointers on what to address? My assumption is that the relative rigidity of these shoes means that my feet have to work harder, and I’ve got a strength or mobility deficit somewhere.

[@ryanmiskin8925]

Yep, I've gotten to the point where I just cannot do daily trainers anymore. I've been doing the vast majority of my miles in the Endorphin Pro 1 and 2, racing in the 3. I'll hit the track with the Rebel v3, but that's about it. Running in plated shoes has ruined my other ones for me, I just don't enjoy my More v4, Novablast 3, Zoom Fly 5, etc. anymore...they're just too heavy feeling, too squishy.

[@elzuzo]

It´s time to have this discussion. "Supershoes" are not for wearing like other kind of running shoe. Thank you very much.

[@DoctorsofRunning]

I see a large number of new runners not understanding this and doing all their miles in alphaflys…..

[@andreasmaher8749]

I always did my easy/everyday runs in some iteration of the Adidas Solar Glide and my speed work in the Bostons. I started using the Prime X for everyday and the Adios 3 for speedwork. I tried switching back to the others and now I cant imagine how I could have run in them. LOL They are bricks in comparison.

[@NikoSaario]

Great content 👍

[@suryopras]

Doesn't every daily trainer shoe also change our biomechanics? For example like Pegasus, Novablast, 1080 then the way we run will adapts to them due to differences in geometry, midsole foam, heel to toe drop and even upper fit.

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Yes! That is completely true! At the moment, these new shoes are so drastically different from the “norm” that there will be different responses in them. However, even those shoes are moving toward these new technologies so eventually it won’t matter. The contrast between them though requires some caution as abrupt changes can be problematic from an injury perspective

[@ericletasse5129]

Very good stuff. I noticed at mile 18 of the marathon my legs feel wrecked from super shoes whereas in the old escalante racers my legs are fine. While I have been doing hip exercises and single leg deads, I have been skipping pistol squats. What kettlebell exercises do you recommend? What power exercises do you recommend? Looking to get faster.

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Eric! Keep it simple! I am a huge fan of heavy kettlebell single leg deadlifts and single leg squats. The newest addition has been single leg squats with multidirectional reaching (reaching the non squatting foot forward, posterior lateral and posterior medial, basically doing a Y balance test) to further challenge stability

[@tazpengra]

I'm wondering about the rigidity of plated shoes and the long-term effects. Personally, my legs feel less beat-up with more flexible shoes, but my power levels are lower. But, do I really need to "win the workout"?

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Great question that no one has really addressed. Do we save the super shoes only for racing? Or do we use them during workouts to get used to them so you don’t increase your injury risk on race day introducing something completely new? Worth a discussion! Will probably do a video on this! -Matt

[@tazpengra]

@@DoctorsofRunning probably the same old technique that's been used for decades; race shoes for race-simulation type workouts and races, and training shoes for everything else. The "supertrainers" are now a thing, like Prime-X, SC Trainer, Superblast, etc. but of that group so far only the Superblast is plate-less.

[@m.ch4rmaland3r10]

I use too much alphafly during my marathon training and had too much issues. I use carbon shoes 1-2 per week. I don't have issues with non carbon shoe and regular trainers

[@DoctorsofRunning]

They are tools that need to be used appropriately!

[@hazzatrazza]

Key point at 18:52 !!

[@TolunayOrkun]

What do you think of calf extension machines in the gym? Do you think they are helpful in strengthening the calves for running purposes? I do 6 sets of 8 with relatively heavy weight and have been gradually increasing the weight over time.

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Tolunay I think those are great! Any type of strengthening is great! That set range is also great for strength as well!

[@TolunayOrkun]

@@DoctorsofRunning Thank you so much for the reply.

[@kit7579]

Minimalist shoes are over and maximalist shoes are in. So is having minimalist shoes in your rotation a good training plan for your running?

[@kylestephens9593]

I can understand people not liking minimalist shoes (i don't like them either), but going all the way from wearing barely anything at all to now freaking clownshoes - seems silly to me. 20mm to 30mm stack is ideal to me for most situations. Am I crazy? :D

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Kit, that variation I think would be good just for contrast! Just ease your way between them!

[@gerrylee5405]

Excellent 👏

[@asphethl]

Molly Seidel said she trained full time in her carbon plated trainers. Could that have contributed to her fracture/injury?

[@OSUCarol]

Honestly, and I love Molly, she's admitted to working through disordered eating issues, and she implied in one of her reels that she believes that derailed her year of racing. My money is on high mileage + not fueling enough for the demand.

[@DoctorsofRunning]

Not sure given that we don’t know all the other contributing factors that OSUcarol mentioned! But there may have been an influence! Whether it was a primary factor, we won’t know!

[@CM-lz1cm]

I trained in a carbon shoe for 6 consecutive weeks. Weakened my feet and legs to such an extent that it took me 2 hours to run 8 miles when I used my no fills running shoes. Be afraid..be very afraid. The human muscles need to be exercised or they will atrophy.

[@DoctorsofRunning]

That’s exactly why variety and variation is key!