A Song of Ice and Fire: Ramsay is Not Roose's Son

Roose Bolton has been duped. Ramsay is not his son and he's been going through a lot of trouble with him for nothing.
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Game of Thrones is an American fantasy drama television series created for HBO by David Benioff and D. B. Weiss. Based on the fantasy novel series, A Song of Ice and Fire by George R.R. Martin. A Game of Thrones is one of the most successful television series to ever made and continues to captivate audiences all over the world. The series is set on the fictional continents of Westeros and Essos, and interweaves several plot lines with a large ensemble cast. The first narrative arc follows a civil war among several noble houses for the Iron Throne of the Seven Kingdoms; the second covers the attempts to reclaim the throne by the exiled last scion of the realm's deposed ruling dynasty; the third chronicles the rising threat of the impending winter and the legendary creatures and fierce peoples of the North. Game of Thrones Episode Review. Game of Thrones Season 7. Dance of The Dragons. Stannis Baratheon and Melisandre, Shireen, Lady Stoneheart, Sansa Stark and Daenerys Targaryen, Jon Snow, Olly, Samwell, For The Watch, stream, HBO. reaction. dies hodor hold the door white walkers origins children of the forest

[@stevefyfe1018]

Lord Preston of House Jacobs Words: And We’re Back Commonly confused with: I’m probably wrong about half of this

[@wisdommanari6701]

i love this

[@sweetcindy4564]

it's like Hear me Roar vs always pays they're debts. one is just a motto

[@edoardodicesare2373]

lmao

[@Blazecap]

Flyfer 15 Did the high Septon Annul it?

[@oexnorth]

And We ARE Back. A very small but significant correction, sir.

[@anamericanthinks472]

Preston my friend, having raised two sons myself, I have to say that babies of any age can and do cry for apparently no reason, even if their basic needs have been met. Issues of ocular albinism notwithstanding.

[@danevans6340]

Yeah no prizes for guessing what commotion I was attending to at 1:10 AM (and for most of the hour to follow) before returning to broken sleep and groggily setting off for work this morning. Minor quibble though, I otherwise like the theory.

[@TraciPeteyforlife]

AnAmericanThinks agreed

[@barbarakelly1456]

Colicky babies before the age of mylicon drops were notorious for crying inconsolably.

[@notthemoon]

earth ocean I'm glad I'm not the only that caught abhorrent comment. It's always depressing to hear a talking point like that in the open.

[@anamericanthinks472]

Regarding the rape comment; I don't believe he said that women who are raped "don't get pregnant". He said it was "unlikely". Without getting into the statistics of rape and pregnancy, I merely took this to mean that if you have a miller's wife who is raped once by Roose, and who otherwise presumably has frequent consensual sex with the miller, the baby is more likely conceived by the miller than by the single incident with Roose. Granted, rape is an emotional topic and the treatment here is quite deadpan, and probably should have been addressed more delicately.

[@an4rchy2012]

Me: doing homework Preston Jacobs: Ramsay is not Roose's Son Me: HOLD THE FUCK UP

[@adityaagarwal6640]

I love this theory but the idea that a crying baby is weird or unusual is just hilarious.

[@made-line7627]

Many of the things Preston says *are* weird, unusual and/or hilarious

[@southernsunshine1149]

@@made-line7627 but entertaining

[@mattm345]

That and the “being raped only once wouldn’t produce a baby” Preston’s theories kinda fall flat when it comes to women and reproduction

[@danielbroome5690]

@@mattm345 It certainly isn't impossible, but it IS unlikely. It would rely on neither of them having any health issues that could impact/reduce the odds like fertility issues, you'd have to have it happen at the correct 6 or so days during the month so it's already a 6/30 or 1/5(reduced) odds for ideal conditions and granted that doesn't account for outliers so let's be generous and say 2 in 5 odds of the conditions being possible. So already we are throwing a dart at a board with those odds to even have a shot at it at all, and once you average in that many times it doesn't work on the first try so you reduce the odds again and again for each factor. Is it bulletproof evidence? Hell no. Is it somewhat reasonable? Not in the exact words/phrasing he did because it was too definitive, but in principal yeah it's somewhat unlikely on the first try even with ideal conditions. Obviously in her case she also wouldn't be doing any of the tricks to try to get pregnant after the fact as well and judging on how poor she was we also might need to consider whether she had the correct nutrients to even be getting her periods in the first place. She does seem desperately poor.

[@andymonserud9029]

I think it's perhaps unusual that George would make a point of letting us know. Narrative "unusual" versus reality unusual and all that.

[@bdfgdfghdfhgfitdfyutdtydry]

You don't always look like your parents. Both of my dads are white, but I'm black.

[@benwhitnell]

TeddyLXIX weird man, science is just funny like that some times.

[@gogozeppeli9267]

TeddyLXIX you were adopted.....😞

[@heathenpride7931]

TeddyLXIX Not sure if joking, but if not you’re adopted.

[@benwhitnell]

Well we’ve got two guys who got whiplash when that joke flew right by them.

[@gogozeppeli9267]

benwhitnell oh i understood the joke ;)

[@benwhitnell]

Maury Povich: Roose, the paternity test shows... you are NOT the father! The North: goes crazy.

[@shobhitkaul8076]

Putin is Roose son

[@raygillette7446]

Ramsey's Mother: MAURY I AM 120% SURE HE IS A DADDY, LOOK AT THEM EYES MAURY, ITS THE SAME EYES!

[@shobhitkaul8076]

What have you done to his eyes... Rosemary's child. Ramsey is the one

[@benwhitnell]

Ray Gillette he looks just like him! Just look at him and look at Roose and tell me they’re not related!

[@octagram2955]

I was so hoping for him to cut to a clip, ah, missed oppurtunities

[@mankytoes]

I do think you've missed the point with how spooky people find Roose's eyes. They find his eyes scary because he is scary. Roose is a truly terrifying villain, Ramsay is just an evil brute. That's why you get more poetic description- not because of the eyes, but because of what is behind them.

[@LMcAwesome]

But you can work with Roose, weve all known worse.

[@smitty1647]

@@LMcAwesome he still flays people lol i doubt you've known worse

[@LMcAwesome]

@@smitty1647 that's a line from the book

[@jacquesdeburgo2878]

I don't think it's metaphorical, everyone recognized Baby Ramsay's eyes as being like his father's

[@PuddingAtheist]

@@smitty1647 Naaah I've known worse'n that. Tish tish, to you m'lad

[@yamibegood]

>Preston calls the banners >knees explode everywhere

[@wulozhiro1316]

FOR PRESTEROS!!!

[@mrsputum4082]

*Nimble Dick intensifies*

[@noaccount4]

*Knees bend 360**

[@artificialavocado9652]

The DireCrow nice! Lol

[@Siamzero1994]

Fookin' kneelers..

[@alecatnight1540]

Preston *WENT FULL PRESTON* He hasn't done this in a year!

[@haymaker710]

You never go full Preston.

[@alphasierra.]

Jon Haymaker Correction: only Preston can go full Preston.

[@drfaisalkamal1275]

Preston is always full Preston

[@charleslux3227]

Just when I thought I was out, Preston pulls me back in!

[@lorusb6126]

Puts it back in*

[@jamestaylor4511]

Charles Lux ..il let u ask one question about my business..just this once.prestom preston..is it true

[@Khaled91]

Just more stories... I swear Preston Jacobs will make you imagine every possible scenario and somehow, someway he'll find proof for it in the books

[@idzoavitsi4211]

@james taylor No. Don Corleone. *door closes and credits roll*

[@robcannon493]

You're the Sweetrobin, Preston. You can fly. You can build your ice castle. You will write the Winds of Winter. You are the shrouded lord.

[@jscott7777]

I've also heard that he's the "hooded man in Winterfell"...but ssh, don't tell.

[@sampaellon673]

Rob Cannon More like the "horned lord" from The Black Cauldron.

[@williamkrause5831]

...Preston is Azor Ahai! Born among the salt of the book fans, and the smoke of the burning mess that is Season 7. He is prophesied to saves us from the others, two terrible beings. Known only as D and D, their evil will be stopped! The Shrouded Azor Ahai Lord will save us!

[@Longshanks1690]

“You will write the Winds of Winter” Promises made, promises kept!

[@jessthemess7248]

And then Glidus will eat it

[@sirsplintfastthepungent1373]

Eye-rony.

[@octagram2955]

Aaaaaahhhhhhhhhhh

[@sirsplintfastthepungent1373]

zachary lynn you're welcome.

[@MrEarthling99]

Drink whenever Preston says “pale”.

[@ichabodstrange756]

Preston Jacobs - keeping americas tin mines running

[@henrikgenzink2304]

Fabian Ehlhardt not to mention the tinfoil industry.

[@look4lec]

As long as the tarrifs go through, otherwise we end up importing foreign JustGeek and Yolkboy theories! I actually can't think of many non US tinfoilers. Yolkboy is certainly the biggest. Preston lives overseas so this is why his Aluminum/Aluminium is so cheap? Geopolotics is so difficult now. Have you guys read the novels in Gernman?

[@tarvoc746]

What's so tinfoily about this particular theory?

[@henrikgenzink2304]

Tarvoc this is s variation on a joke found under almost every preston video. It is not about this particular one.

[@TheWoodstock2009]

he brough the jobs back

[@nichoalsmith7712]

Physical traits shared between parents and children is a part of this series. For instance, it was physical features of Cersi's children that made it apparent that Jamie was the father not King Robert. The Starks are described in reference to their parents. Targarens are silver blonde with blue or violet eyes.... the list goes on and on.

[@aliwatfa6951]

Preston Jacobs - the gift that keeps on giving.

[@drfaisalkamal1275]

Like a woman

[@alexstarspeak]

I like how “Woman Roose raped underneath the swinging body of her new husband.” Is turned into a “Random person.” This is a sparsely populated land where everyone knows everyone else’s business, babies don’t just pop out from nowhere. Additionally a 2 - 3 month old infant would still be considered a newborn. Interesting point about the eyes though.

[@SingingSealRiana]

The thing I am caught on is, that just a similar color, does not cause people to think of someone as beeing related. We meet lots of blue eyed children, several stark children are blue eyed, but never make they Ned think of Robert, only when he sees Roberts bastards he instantly recognises them as shareing his eyes. Furthermore, beside color, there are other traits linked to the eyes and those are even in the describtion read at the beginning. Eyeshape, size, placement and even the slightest difference makes a huge impact! We even get an example for children shareing their parents eyes in a scary way, despite not matching in color, with the sandsnakes!!! For Ramseys eyes to match Rooses so closely, that even someone as cautious and selfish as Roose can not doubt it despite nothing else matching would need an absolut freaky amount of coincedances.

[@boass]

@@SingingSealRiana I know this is old, but it could also be poetic. Their eyes are the same because they’re both deranged psychopaths. Roose sees his own awfulness in the eyes of Ramsey.

[@dasaggropop1244]

Yay! A wild theory appears- it seems friendly.

[@JPISME91]

So what about the original reek? Something always rubbed me the wrong way about that story.

[@octagram2955]

Right? That does seem questionable and no one really discusses it

[@chucktownattack]

Jacob Pettey So creepy...

[@temptationofmemories]

yes i agree preston needs to look into this character

[@yggdrasil3]

Yeah, I mean who was that guy?

[@JPISME91]

Yggdrasil he could be Ramsay’s real dad for all we know

[@tereziamarkova2822]

I am pretty sure Roose doesn't have ocular albinism, because that condition is accompanied by other symptoms, which neither he nor Ramsay have. Eye pigment is important for their proper function and loosing it would obviously influence that. Rather, his eyes have an unusually light grey or blue colour, which isn't completely unconvincing, especially if dates line up. Also, if Roose learned he was duped, his vengeance would be horrifying; I am not sure a woman who already experienced what a monster he could be would risk it.

[@gandalfgrey91]

Some babies cry a lot, for years. This is some pretty flimsy reasoning.

[@made-line7627]

1:47: They actually did quite a good job with Roose's casting. The actor *does* have few wrinkles for a man "well past forty"; he *does* have an ordinary, in-between face; his face *is* quite emotionless, and; his lips *do* tend to become so thin when he presses them together that he almost loses them. They did a *poor* job with casting Ramsay, as Iwan Rheon was the hottest f*cking guy on the show during his time playing the character (look-wise, anyhow; his acting was brilliant) 💦 And Preston, it just takes *one* time to get pregnant. It doesn't matter whether he only "slept with" (raped) the mother once; she could still very, very easily get pregnant from this one encounter. As to the eyes, perhaps no one mentions Ramsay's as much because they're so used to Roose's (whose are slightly more pale, in any case), and/or they're so preoccupied with his fat lips and shocking persona that they're glossed over when one appraises him.

[@josephmatthews7698]

Yay! I look like Ramsay. I never viewed him as particularly handsome but I thought he killed it as Ramsay and can't imagine anyone else playing him. I didn't read the books until after I watched the show though. Roose's actor could have also played Stannis very well. I wonder if they were considered for the role.

[@boass]

I know this is old, but let’s also not forget the fact that women who are raped don’t tend to sleep with many other men. In all likelihood she would have refrained from being around men and as such it would be very unlikely that Ramsay is not the bastard of Roose. Who knows if George thought about the psychology of that but yeah, when you’re husband is killed and you’re raped by the killer you wouldn’t exactly start looking for other men…

[@childofpersia1213]

Since you can't prove or point to evidence that Roose indeed does have albinoism of the eyes, it's still possible he just has light eyes and it was passed down to Ramsey

[@PrestonJacobstheSweetrobin]

Child of Persia sure, or that Ramsay just also has light eyes and is unrelated

[@jorgizoran4340]

This is kinda fitting with Varys's quote about power residing where men believe it lies, a shadow on a wall.

[@SpydeTJ]

Isn't it weird that Roose and Mandon Moore are the only people who's eyes are described as so pale as to be described as corpse like

[@kasbi1991]

Boltons are GRRM's version of ghouls.

[@troperhghar9898]

"How will this affect the story... It doesn't" That's how I feel about R +L=J

[@yggdrasil3]

Troper H'ghar Well, as long as he is still a bastard at least it doesn't affect his character arc, *cough show *cough

[@angrashadow2958]

He's most certainly not going to remain a bastard lol, there are a lot of hints that he's not just the son of Rhaegar and Lyanna, but also the legitimate son, though I believe that their marriage won't be like in the Show, cause Annulment is stupid and doesn't make any sense.

[@SophiaLilithUwU]

+Uchiha Shadow There are actually 0 hints for that in the book. There aren't even hints that Jon is Lyannas and Rhaegars child. Also, honestly Jon not being a bastard would severly diminish his arc as a character. He had to fight with prejudice due to being a bastard his whole life and much and more of his development is based around this. Taking that away and rendering it moot by saying "Guess he wasn't a Bastard all along" is as cheap as the bloody annulment!

[@akrybion]

Troper H'ghar The High Septon just annulled the impact.

[@yggdrasil3]

Uchiha Shadow What kind of hints? I'm not sure I know what you mean

[@grasakfairy8969]

Damn it Preston! Now I have to stop everything I’m doing and watch. That title is so interesting.

[@ser_ryon_vine6392]

Seriously tho

[@colbyhenderson7742]

Sonya D Totally had to stop what I was doing.. smh

[@Landis963]

Keep in mind that a good measure of the trouble that Roose is having with his heirs is directly tied to Ramsay killing them to secure his position. A position that, if this analysis bears fruit, he never should have had in the first place. This might be getting too ironic, even for GRRM, but I haven't done the deep dives.

[@dirrdevil]

Ser Maury of House Povich Words: "Our lie detector determined that was a lie!" Sigil: A flipped chair and a crying woman on a grey field

[@darkblood626]

Let me guess. He's a Targaryen. Because everyone's a secret Targaryen.

[@alecatnight1540]

Are you new? He's obviously arguing Ramsay is the son of Ashara Dayne

[@rickysimmons4220]

Should watch the video before you say stuff🤦🏿‍♂️

[@alexhopps1826]

Clearly not a preston jacobs regular

[@jbtechcon7434]

Mocking the idea of 'secret Targaryens' is exactly what a secret Targaryen would do.

[@SophiaLilithUwU]

This is not reddit, we have sensible theories here.

[@jessi4894]

ASOIAF: Ramsay is Roose's bastard, the way he knows is because of the eyes, they're exactly the same. PJ: No he's not.

[@rockybalboa6433]

A lot of babies have really deep blue eyes when they're newborns, and their eyes slowly change to their permanent color as they grow. I think this is more prevalent in people with lighter eyes. So maybe it was a year before the miller's wife was kicked out, because Ramsey's eyes started out a deeper blue like I mentioned, and didn't change to reflect Roose's eyes until then. Probably not a detail the author considered, but it does fit the scenario.

[@SolaGratia.]

I think Roose doesn't care much about anything either way once he's gone. And if nothing else, he would see the sense in letting his strongest heir keep the lordship. Roose seems to have no parental love or interest in children aside from having an heir. And I think he supports this one whether he's legitimately his or not because this one will overpower any others.

[@riolidansnarfledang7833]

He seemed to have a decent affection for Domeric before he was murdered. Granted he hasn't avenged him by killing Ramsay yet, he still spoke of him fondly.

[@gerganakoleva4137]

@@riolidansnarfledang7833 I agree, he did think about him with affection and seemed sorry that he could not stop him in his resolve to contact his half-border. I think he did not avenge him, since he did not have any other heirs and he is above all pragmatic. Also if he did not believe Ramsey is his biological son, he would have killed him long ago. He may be or not, but on thing is for sure - Roose firmly believes it.

[@VNitla]

New Borns don’t cry as much as toddlers? Spoken like someone who hasn’t had more than one kid. The amount of crying depends on the actual kid. But everything else is all good.

[@debodatta7398]

True my first born was as quiet as a mouse but second and third were constant screamers

[@TaurionMartell]

Yup me and my little Brother where so quiet my mom suspected there was something wrong with us. While my sisters where insanely loud

[@VNitla]

earth ocean I’m going to have to ask for citing on this assertion. Also at the danger of devolving this discussion... Wut!?

[@kerrybrennan7099]

Vinod Nitla thank you for saving me the trouble of pointing this out...

[@VNitla]

earth ocean it’s been about 2 days since I made my request for citation. I and all others that read your comment should and will consider it facile.

[@theM4R4T]

I always thought that the reason why Ramsay is so unlike Roose and twisted and savage, is because he is a punishment for Roose's crimes. Roose is concerned about Ramsay being their doom. That's what he talks about with Theon. "As you sow, so you shall reap."

[@seafoxx777]

“Raping a women once is unlikely to result in pregnancy”...ohhh Preston :(

[@benjaminsloniker3423]

What if Roose contributed an X and a Y and Ramsay has Klinefelter Syndrome?

[@kanpaisou]

Benjamin Sloniker I can't even express how much I love this idea XD

[@hugodiazroa]

+

[@SophiaLilithUwU]

"Sometimes, symptoms are more prominent and may include weaker muscles, greater height, poor coordination, less body hair, breast growth, and less interest in sex." Got that from Wikipedia. Apparently Ramsay would be really lucky to have avoided most of the symptoms of the syndrom. The only things that fit the bill, would be greater height and *maybe* poor coordiantion and less body hair.

[@benjaminsloniker3423]

Abraxas makes a good point...

[@eyorsmarisnorrason8794]

Don't know much about genetics but... isn't it still a recessive gene? So the Klinefelter Syndrome shouldn't matter. Unless, of course, the mother was a carrier as well...

[@saskiaviking9447]

Ser Preston always delivers.

[@charlieteneyck6797]

I love this theory, the irony of it all and another little fact is baby eye color can be lighter at or near birth because the eyes sometimes don't produce much -- if any -- melanin while the baby is in the womb), but after birth, light stimulates the production of melanin, which is why the eye color may darken so near birth Ramsey eye color was probably closer to Roose’s own eye color.

[@DrewzViewz]

Reek III is one my favorite chapters in the whole series. Nothing major happens but I think its some of GRRM's best writing

[@SarmonOflynn]

Just made my day, my dude. Staring down the barrel of a 15 hour work day. This is the correct way to start it.

[@ronan3168]

I took it as GRRM using poetic licence, relating Ramsey's personality/appearance to the horror in which in he was conceived

[@DanO-ot5wv]

If this true which I completely believe that it is, then it is very likely that Reek (as in the first Reek) was the one who corrupted Ramsay and not Ramsay who corrupted Reek, after all Ramsay didn't begin his 'hobbies' until after Reek had been sent to him.

[@shobhitkaul8076]

Soft voice. Pale eyes. Pale skin. Leeches. Hmm this Roose sounds like the father of putin

[@Altrantis]

He really does. Not to mention the proclivity for assassinations and political maneuvers, the complete lack of expressiveness, and abuse of power. If not for the hair color you'd think they're the same person.

[@BloodyDollarsGang]

Why was the newborn crying? Ever hear of colic babies?

[@itszaza5937]

Bourgeoisie propaganda

[@kevintoman9791]

Preston=Kadet confirmed

[@TheWoodstock2009]

Kerensky Jacobs

[@darthlazurus4382]

Ramsey's love of flaying might not be genetic, but rather because he thinks himself a Bolton and wanted to prove that he was one. And it just so happened he enjoyed the power it gave him.

[@XellossBoi]

Oh boy! I've been waiting all week for one of your videos! Thank you for posting.

[@afjkarey5366]

babies open their eyes as late as 2 months old in some cases and the eye changes color after a while.

[@afjkarey5366]

earth ocean never had a baby in your family?

[@Altrantis]

Generally babies are born blue eyed. Well, at least white people's babies, couldn't say for sure for peoples with naturally more melanin their eyes.

[@afjkarey5366]

Altrantis im my family babies born with light green eyes then after a year it turns brown.

[@lisaalvarez9742]

Exactly! Babies generally are not born with the eye color they will have the rest of their life. For instance, my first son and my daughter were both born with blue eyes, their eyes are brown. My second son was born with murky blue eyes and are a vibrant blue now. So, timing would be spot on if it was a year later.

[@energeticwave5437]

And we are back for some more good stuff

[@ggyagoda]

Wait, so part of your theory hinges on Roose Bolton not being needlessly cruel and then also includes a description of him raping a woman underneath her hanged husband's swaying body? What was the strategic or tactical gains that Roose Bolton hoped to achieve with that bit of cold, logical, cunning behavior?

[@eds1942]

a) We don’t know what Ramsey’s suspected grandparents looked like. b) Things like mannerisms, personalities, intelligence, adaptability and skill sets aren’t fully predictable via genetics. Other factors need to be considered. c) 4/5 of Ned and Catelyn’s children have Tully traits, 1/5 have Stark ones. d) Yet, House traits seem to be passed down over centuries through the father with little to no change over the centuries. e) Baratheon blue eyes (a recessive trait) seems to win out over that of other colors. This goes with all of the phenotypes for Robert’s children, regardless of the traits of the mother. GRRM has a simplified version of genetics for the world of asoiaf, which is not necessarily consistent throughout.

[@AhavaMath]

I was just wondering why there was no new Preston video. THANK YOU!

[@robadamson1]

Ramsey is obviously Roose's son and grandson.

[@williamgunderson7365]

Great video dude!

[@nacivelaz]

A surprise video is just what I need this week goddamn Preston you spoil us

[@giancarlolagiusa2641]

Preston help me out on this. Let's assume Roose took on Ramsay because he is son and values him as family. Shouldn't he have killed Roose for poisoning Domeric? Roose believes Ramsay probably killed Domeric, which was definitely Roose's true born son. So for Roose to keep Ramsay because he is his son, but not punish him for killing his trueborn son, doesn't really makes sense?

[@PrestonJacobstheSweetrobin]

Yeah, a whole series needs to be done on figuring out Roose's game. Its weird.

[@katherinederoet4114]

Preston Jacobs please get to that after you finish the ten-part series on Mormont’s raven

[@pwnzer33]

Preston Jacobs still waiting on the deepest dorne...

[@simonholmes841]

Without an heir, Roose's would be the only heartbeat between an ambitious would-be assassin and the Dreadfort. I think Roose doesn't value Ramsay as family, rather he's stuck with him. Ramsay is strong and healthy, ambitious and heartless, all more so than Domeric ever was. Maybe Roose values those attributes and plans to groom Ramsay for rule; maybe he wanted more sons and baby Ramsay seemed like a promising freebie; maybe Roose just needed someone with similar eyes to his, so he could wear his skin and go on ruling the Dreadfort in a younger face, who knows? I personally think Roose shrewdly saw Ramsay as insurance for his rule, but ironically Ramsay turned out to be a massive liability.

[@LMcAwesome]

Massive liability is questionable. If you have a millennial conflict with the Starks in which yours family has come off worse more often then not, isnt it your dream to have your son take Winterfell, torture the Starks and massively expand your rule? Its only a problem if Ramsay gets the comeuppance he deserves. And we all know the words of House RR Martin "No Comeuppance!"

[@-V-_-V-]

7:18 those eyes are very clearly blue and would be described as such in our story, not grey.

[@reeflarkin1919]

many of them are also wide-set fitting with waardenburg syndrome, ocular albinism creates blindness (because the retina aka light sensitive part of the eye has no pigment) not the eyes described of either roose or ramsey.

[@-V-_-V-]

Alex Wood agreed

[@hamcrazy96]

Preston, you're spoiling me with all these theory videos.

[@jessthemess7248]

Fun fact: babies' eyes are lighter when they're born, and darken once they're around 6 months to a year old. Just something to think about when Roose thinks baby Ramsey has his eyes, even though it's said Roose's eyes are paler than adult Ramsey's.

[@Hurdle11C]

Woot! Title got me.

[@Zharath]

This is probably your most dissapointing video ever. You only have two basic arguments: a time gap between Ramsey's birth and his mother showing up at the Dreadfort, and the fact that Roose and Ramsey do not look or act alike. Considering the looks/personality: children do not necessarily look like or act like their parents. Furthermore, we know hardly any specifics about the supposed mom's looks. Also, this argument is only possible if you dismiss the eyes, but your argument on that point requires the random coincidence that the woman Roose happens to stumble upon and rape manages to somehow obtain a baby with ocular albinism (giving birth to it or otherwise). Considering the time gap: a three month delay between Ramsey's birth and his mother arriving at the Dreadfort is not really a significant time period. Maybe Ramsey was born a week late, his mom had to recover from giving birth, and was hesitant about going to the Dreadfort because she expected that Roose might not be amused, and only did so when she no longer saw any other option. Maybe Roose wasn't there when she arrived and she had to wait. Also, do we know the distance between this particular mill and the Dreadfort? Furthermore, as someone else said already, some kids cry a lot, some don't. This all assuming that we have to take "a year later" literal. You're really reaching here. Especially given the complete lack of relevance to the story even if it were true. I'm still waiting patiently for the next part about Craster. I really liked that one and it appears to be way more relevant.

[@DanielHAkerman]

I think you under estimate the importance of family resemblance in the series. It's a major plot point throughout, e.g. Ned figuring out Jaime and Cercei's incest because all Baratheon-Lannister children in history having dark hair; Renly looking strikingly similar to the young Robert; the Stark children either being similar to Ned or Cat; Young Griff looking like Rhaegar etc. Making the fact that they look nothing alike very important. Character descriptions in general are of paramount importance to determine identity, such as the Alchemist in AFfC prologue having the same as Jaqen H'ghar; the Jane Westerling Jaime meets in AFfC having a very different one from the one Cat meets in ASoS; the man Arya overhears Varys talking to in the dragon skull room in AGoT having the same as Magister Illyrio etc. You also misunderstood his point about Ramsay's eyes. He probably doesn't have ocular albininsm, as his eyes are only described as pale, which is true for many characters in the books, whereas Roose's eyes are described in a unique and poetic way. Meaning that Ramsay was just a baby with pale eyes.

[@Zharath]

Well, Ned only figures out the incest because ALL Baratheons in history had dark hair. This suggest that even in universe, the mere fact that a child is dissimilar to one of its parents does not mean that the parent is not thre real parent. It only becomes a convincing argument once you include the enitre family history and notice that the child in question is a unique exception. And again, since we know hardly anything about the specific looks of Ramsey´s mom, maybe the male version of some of her characteristics turn out to be ugly rather than pretty in a "common way". Sansa does not look like Ned (because she resembles Cat), but that does not mean that Ned is not her father. I get that the point is that pale eyes are not extremely rare. But actually, in one of the quote's in this video (1:37), Ramsey's eyes are also described as "queerly" (queer =strange or odd) pale by Theon, who also seems to believe that Roose and Ramsey have the same eyes. If pale eyes are indeed common enough that Ramsey's mom could easily find a baby with pale eyes, Roose probably wouldn't have taken it as sign of parantage in the first place.

[@derfelkardan]

Zharath also, pregnancies are counted in weeks since conception by doctors and usually last for about 40 weeks: +- 10 months

[@reeflarkin1919]

not to mention that ocular albinism causes blindness- not eerily, milk-pale eyes. I'm disappointed too :(

[@Cissablack708]

Zharath couldn't agree more!

[@idontwantachannel7542]

Thank you!! You make it much easier waiting for Winds of Winter.

[@coachmcguirk6297]

Excellent work, Preston.

[@brendanfechter4889]

So is Roose playing a deeper game? He doesn't appear to be the type u can trick with such a ploy if a ploy this was

[@juliada8121]

Brendan Fechter exactly what I was wondering too

[@davidjones272]

Or Ramsey is his son, and inherits many of his physical traits from his mother's side of the family. Christ its far more likely that Roose simply likes big boned women than Ramsey not being his son. He married fat walda for God's sake.

[@robertsmith8734]

@@davidjones272 Because of the silver.

[@robertsmith8734]

@John Trevolter Perhaps, but what are the odds?

[@CrunchyNorbert]

Roose's story is tragic; when he takes Theon to Moat Cailin he explains that he leeches himself to control his emotions, he specifically says they help with the rage and the pain, we also know he was married twice before he married Walda Frey and yet only had one legitimate son live to adulthood, Domeric. Even if Roose is sociopathic and cruel losing two wives and your only heir after multiple dead infants would break anybody; in a World of Ice and Fire its hinted that Aerys's madness was made far more severe by his wife having multiple miscarriages and more than one case of cot death; we don't get to see Roose as a young man but he was probably very different. I think that his machiavellian tendencies coupled with westerosi custom have led to Roose actively orchestrating or at least wishing for Ramsay's painful and humiliating death.

[@user-ig3cy4uf3s]

Bro talking about chromosomes like George is a scientist lmao.

[@wulozhiro1316]

rollin down the street, banner rais-in, goin full pres-ton... ..layed back.. with my mind on wolves n robins, wolves n robins on my mind.

[@lsabellathehousekeeper3280]

Thank you

[@sebastiankocz7925]

"The rape victim's story is a bit off." Stop blaming the victim Preston!

[@olskoolsm10]

Haven’t watched yet but THANK YOU PRESTON!

[@o-wolf]

"It's steabge that a woman wouldn't be able to stop her child from crying" "Rape is unlikely to end in a child" bro wtf are u even talking about? 🤨

[@newpgaston6891]

Now I want a part 2 about theories on who his real father is...

[@conradoccaminha]

So, since we are onto this paternity test, let me talk about one of my own that may interest you: Jeoffrey is (or might be) Robert's son. The short explanation is: I don't think we hear anywhere what's the colour of Roberts mothers hair and eyes. Everybody assumes Jeoffrey is a bastard based on his hair, because black hair is dominant, but that is not a 100% thing. Robert could have the recessive genes to allow Cersey a kid with the same green eyes and blonde hair. Sure, Cersei thinks Jeoffrey is Jaime's son, but she also remembers Robert Raping her just because he was drunk, so their sex wasn't something planned. It is very likely that she persuaded herself that the child was Jaime's son because she couldn't stand the thought of Jeoffrey being Robert's. Besides, Robert is described as a MASSIVE man, huge in size and in fat, while Jeoffrey is clearly an oversized boy in the books. Jon describes Jeoffrey as being as tall or taller than he is on the feast in winterfell, and Jon is much older. Now, that doesn't make 100% sure the kid is Robert's, but we also can't be sure that he isn't. Remember: Ned Stark doesn't count the woman in the Baratheon family when he makes his studies. I think it make's sense, and contributes to the story: The fact that Jeoffrey is Robert's son, or could be, despite being called a bastard by everyone, implies that a war is being thought for facts nobody really understands and for political reasons that have nothing to do with: Who would be the best ruler.

[@realdaggerman105]

Conrado C The issue is, Cersei had 3 incredibly Lannister-looking children, yet all 16 of Robert’s bastards expressed Baratheon black hair, highly suggesting he is double-dominant for the gene.

[@conradoccaminha]

@@realdaggerman105 i mean, yes, It sugests that, but its no promise. Thats the thing with probability. Also: Im not claiming all of cersey's children are Roberts. She even says with time he went to her less and less. The point os: nobody can say for sure if Jeoffrey is a bastard. Só maybe the question shouldn't be: who's Robert's son, but who would be the best ruler.

[@hi_austin]

Yay! A new pbj vid!!

[@TheGravija]

FINNALY ANOTHER ONE OF THEEEEEEEEEEESE

[@Peanutjoepap24]

As interesting as this is, and really it is interesting, George Martin might not know enough about genetics or ocular albinism to weave this fact into the story. I didn't before watching this video, and while I'm sure GRRM is more knowledgeable than I on a great many things, this is still a rather obscure fact. I think their differences in appearance were mearly created to highlight their differing personalities. Ramsay is brash, cruel, and arguably dim witted, so he is large, boney and ugly. Roose is cold, calm, calculating, so he is slight and plain. But despite their contrasting personalities, beneath that they both carry the same malicious sociopathy; just as beneath their contrasting physical traits, they both share those haunting inhuman eyes. though that bit about Roose's eyes being paler, yeah idk. he's polly a vampire

[@reeflarkin1919]

i didn't know the genetics stuff but I know ocular albinism doesn't look like as described (as pics show, and a few of those were waardenburg syndrome), plus it makes you blind because it effects light sensitivity in the retina. Roose and Ramsey do not have ocular albinism.

[@mitchellanderson3960]

@@reeflarkin1919 quick read states it does not deteriorate vision over time but instead the deficiencies are at birth. You did list some common symptoms, but those are not universal. It is possible for the Boltonals to have it and have relatively normal vision just it would be a lucky draw. rarediseases.org/rare-diseases/ocular-albinism/

[@reeflarkin1919]

@@mitchellanderson3960 I realise I'm replying to a reply on 3 year old comment but anyway. I'm not even sure you're responding not me because I didn't state that it deteriorates over time. It's true that it doesn't always equal blindness but it would be near impossible for it to not affect vision in some way because that's basically the definition of ocular albinism- for it to only effect pigment in the iris (and not the retina) would make it debateable that it was even ocular albinism. This also doesn't account for the fact that it doesn't have the visual effect on the eyes that is described in the books- their eyes would be blue or red. So even iris-only ocular albinism (which I'm not even sure exists) doesn't fit the theory.

[@torben22.16]

i always put the extreme paleness of Roose to the leeches he enjoys so much...

[@christianadams211]

Great one I never thought of this!!!

[@M45S1VE1999]

That moment of happiness when papa Preston drops a spicy theory video on your birthday!

[@MrFirextinguisher]

Cheese and rice. It’s the first of his name Ser Jacobs of Prestonfield with another banger on BBC1Xtra

[@Mast3rKen121]

Conception can happen from having sex once. Temperament and personality are unlikely to pass to a child, more so one raised drastically different from the parents. Ramsey’s weight can be attributed to the over abundance of food, which Roose has been supplying Ramsey his whole life. This theory is a huge stretch.

[@PrestonJacobstheSweetrobin]

Personalities are also partially genetic. For example "Targaryen taint."

[@Altrantis]

I don't think it's a stretch, but I think it overestimates how much GRRM knows about genetics, that is specific genes and how they're transmitted and what are their characteristics. ASOIAF is chock full of genetic improbabilities and impossibilities. You'd have to assume the Lannisters are not genetically modern humans to begin with. Edit: I would go ahead and say that humans from ASOIAF have a completely different genetic makeup than earth humans, so while the way genetics work are the same, the genes themselves are different altogether. The gene that causes, say, red hair would be a different gene than in earth, and it may as well actually be dominant.

[@brianhourigan]

I got an ad when I clicked on this video narrated by Michael McElhatton who plays Roose. Very cool coincidence

[@szymonitaherrero9737]

OMG OMG heart attack can't breathe PRESTON IN HIS PRESTONEST back to the roots

[@cockycookie1]

I don't think Grr Martin had recessive and dominant heredity in mind when writing them.

[@corbinskywalker]

PJ IS BACK!!!

[@danevans6340]

We all are.

[@polyemphis]

Thoroughly enjoyed this production

[@thomask7441]

best asoiaf youtuber at it again, keep it up

[@jamespinto1884]

Ramsay is Euron Greyjoy's son. His smiling eye is blue as the sky of Summer. Ramsay was torturing his own cousin without knowing. It's true because I said it's true.

[@duncangraham6219]

My biggest question with theories like this is always whether George R Martin knows this stuff. Obviously he talks about genetic engineering in his other works, but has he ever displayed knowledge of genetics in this level of detail? My assumption is probably not given he seemed to think that because black hair was a trait on the male side of the Baratheon line, a Baratheon could never have blonde hair. This despite the fact that Robert had Targaryen blood and we don't know his mothers hair color (as far as I remember).

[@tarvoc746]

+Duncan Graham What makes you think GRRM actually thinks that? Ned thought that, but Ned was wrong about a lot of things. As a matter of fact, most other people in King's Landing don't seem to be overly concerned with Cersei's children being blonde, at least not before Stannis and others start to spread rumors about Cersei's and Jaime's affair.

[@Altrantis]

As I've been posting through this comment section, Cercei and Jaime are male and female identical sibling, which is impossible with RL genetics. GRRM doesn't put that much thought into it. He puts a lot of thought on the family inheriting the traits, but not on the actual IRL genes that cause those traits.

[@tarvoc746]

+Altrantis Your proof of Cersei and Jaime being genetically identical? I'm very certain that wasn't in the books.

[@Altrantis]

Answered in the other thread but in case someone reads, they'e able to pull a stunt of switching clothes and the servants and family members who see them every day wouldn't be able to tell that they had switched. Non-identical twins are just as alike as any other set of siblings, and even among actual identical twins, being able to fool people who see you every day is rare. They're so identical it's basically impossible they're not identical twins.

[@duncangraham6219]

Both Jon Arryn and Ned come to the same conclusion about the hair color, and other characters such as Cersei, Pycelle, Stannis and little finger act as though it's a revelation that would prove Cersies infidelity. Granted it's a medieval-esque setting, so I don't expect them to have a super firm grasp on genetics, but surely they would be aware that even two people with dark hair can sometimes have a light haired child. No one ever mentions the possibility that three children taking more after their mother that their father could just be a coincidence. Not even Cersie when she's confronted by Ned. when every character is wrong in the exact same way without even lip-service paid to the idea they might be wrong, it makes me think that it's the author rather than the characters that are the common factor. Maybe he was aware but chose to ignore it for the sake of the story, but then that doesn't bode well for the theory in the video having any relevance to the plot even if GRRM did do it deliberately. Regarding the opposite gender identical twins, it's possible they just happened to look very similar pre-puberty. But I've seen enough works with adult opposite gender identical twins used as a plot point that at least a few creators must actually believe its possible, so it wouldn't surprise me if GRRM did.

[@antonblascak581]

great one

[@ThePooper3000]

This has got to be the most direct title you've ever made.

[@SHARKVADERS]

Back are we and!!!

[@emiliocamachoerice6380]

I am my father´s son and we have different conducts in a lot of circumstances and I don't physically look much like my mother. preston I love you but mendelian genetics doesn´t always work that way just like with the baratheons look transmited in every generation which would be impossible

[@PrestonJacobstheSweetrobin]

Mendelian genetics does work with ocular albinism, though.

[@emiliocamachoerice6380]

Preston Jacobs yeah but our author, and how he apples genetics is a bit flaky though it's really possible that he's following it this time unlike with the baratheons

[@emiliocamachoerice6380]

Preston Jacobs I have a theory that the looks of the houses and races came from castes of the empire of the dawn

[@nikhiliyengar1510]

*Mother can't control her bawling baby* Preston: yEs ThIs CaNt bE rIgjT!

[@stevenwhite774]

Welcome back Preston.

[@lilrhodap]

I really enjoy theory videos (or essays or casts) like this one of yours - really delving into a topic for its own sake, putting the research in, etc. The little theories and topics that may never catch hold but you love. Great video. Comment/Question: Is it possible Roose knew, but needed a 2nd son so anyappropriate baby would do? Especially since there were recent babies brought....and smashed.

[@PrestonJacobstheSweetrobin]

I do wonder if Roose actually knows Ramsay is not his son and thinks he is disposable. Roose is very mysterious and needs his own series really.

[@mennobosch7311]

Hey Pres, long time fan here, I I must admit you make me believe everything you say. I just chunk it down like a junky, So I was wondering if you wanna do a video on how you make your videos, Im a history student and I have to write a lot of essays and all I want is to be as convincing and logic like you are. Honestly when I do my homework I ask myself, what would preston say..

[@laningsmith9163]

"At times i wonder if you are even my son. My forebears were many things but never stupid." Roose bolton to ramsay ADWD

[@SingingSealRiana]

Still, while this video compleatly focuses on eyecolor, that is not in the slightest the only factor when it comes to eyes and funnely enough, the quote he read even points out, how not only the color matches. Eyeshape, size, if they are set wide or narrow . . . It all matches and grrm does that intentionaly. The sandsnakes are called out to all share Oberyns eyes. Despite haveing different eyecolors, the similarity is unnerving to the one, who noticed it!

[@joacovo1]

there was a bug with youtube, and for a moment I was so excited, cause it showed that this video was an hour long

[@TheInfamousThey305]

"There's no crackpot theory worse than N +A = J or Mance is Rhaegar." Preston: Hold my wine

[@malekiththeeternityking5433]

elevatedmind N+A=J And Walder Frey and Cat =Robb

[@ravenstrategist1325]

except that N+A= J is correct.

[@tammymartinez7488]

Emperor of Mankind the worst by far is Robb is secretly edmure Tully’s incest bastard with Catelyn. This comes from a crazed Quora woman who when you try to tell her anything against that theory she bites your head off