the psychology of RAMSAY Bolton | Therapist explains

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The psychology of Ramsay Bolton is more in depth than you'd think. In this character analysis I attempt to pick apart Ramsay Snow's psychology from A Song of Ice and Fire books and the Game of Thrones TV show.
TIMESTAMPS
00:00 Intro
01:43 Neglect
09:43 World Anvil
11:38 Nobility
19:36 Reek
23:39 Dogs
28:12 Reek 2.0
32:55 Identity
41:34 Thejon Greyjeyne
44:33 Downfall
MUSIC (in order)
Merlyn - Jenny of Oldstone
Calme - Ever So Blue
Merlyn - The Night King lofi
Damon Greene - Absinthe Minded
Merlyn - Light of the Seven
Kevin MacLeod - Dreams Become Real
Scott Buckley - The Vision
Scott Buckley - Decoherence
Scott Buckley - Moonlight
Scott Buckley - The Long Dark
Chill Astronaut - Game of Thrones Light of the Seven
Alan Ellis - Sea Terms
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#gameofthrones #asoiaf #psychology

[@mylittlethoughttree]

Use the code TREE for 40% off World Anvil with the link worldanvil.com/?c=mltt Or else try it out for free!! P-p-p-PATREON www.patreon.com/mylittlethoughttree

[@alanarmstrong3186]

Could you do an episode on the psychology of the main character of The Stranger by Albert Camus?

[@robert4123]

Have you not seen the wire? Curious if even with all the hype, I expect it still holds up! You tell me my little thought tree!

[@jodieg6318]

Hot take from an Early Medieval Historian: when people justify somethings in GOT as being set in the Medieval peroid so murder, SA, and ultra-violance were ordinary and normalized... not really. Violence as justice would have been much more normal, but the court, civil, and church records kept from the the 11th to 15th centuries are overflowing with cases of violence but the response from personal, legal, and clerical departments showed that it certainly wasn't a free-for-all and people responded to tramua very much the same way we do in the 21st century becuase we have humans have changed very little over the centuries.

[@mylittlethoughttree]

This is kind of the logic and assumption I went by, so it's nice to have someone who knows more about it kinda confirm that for me. I don't like that argument "violence was normal, therefore its fine" but I try my best to consider it fairly when there are 1000 comments telling me 😆

[@jodieg6318]

@@mylittlethoughttree I could go on for literal ages but I will just sum up how I think this kind of thinking starts: Tales like A Gyst of Robin Hood, Song of Roland, Beowulf, and King Arthur are more violent in the contemporary literature but applying it as a standard of life to the Medieval peroid would be like us applying the rules of a superhero action film to our lives. It's true that legal punishments were more physical than they are today but this was a time before prisons and justice was often local and corporal. It also depended on how offensive the public found your crime; in the stocks there was a case of a bake selling stale bread thusly the crowd lobs the stale loaves at him. Another case was were a man had been found committing crimes against children and the crowd at the stocks literally tore him to pieces. It's safe to say that people responded much the same as we do today.

[@jodieg6318]

One last thing too, prima nocta as portrayed in GOT and Braveheart. Not a thing. It's Ben hotly debated since the 1880s if it was a real law or a trope used in the literature but there is no legal language for a lord having sexual rights to common women (that would be adultery) in contemporary records, there are some about paying a fine for a prima nocta but that was either paid to the church who had forbidden consummation of a marriage on the first night unless a fine be paid and as a monitary payment for a woman leaving the lord's land when she married. Any churl that wanted to leave have to pay this.

[@magiv4205]

THANK YOU! I'm not a historian, just a medieval enthusiast, and it absolutely grinds my gears when I hear these false claims and beliefs. Doesn't help that our school system and even most documentaries do little to fight those stereotypes. More often they perpetuate it.

[@c.w.8200]

Stars are copper coins, he gives her a bag of those instead of higher value coins to not draw attention, people might ask questions if she goes to the market with a stag (silver) or even dragon (gold).

[@mylittlethoughttree]

Ah, thank you!

[@HBpenman]

Wait,stars like seven-pointed stars?

[@bgt2848]

Thank you I was about to search for that conversion cause I remember crowns and dragons and stags but not stars

[@c.w.8200]

@@HBpenman Yeah, I think there's a seven pointed star on them.

[@joe9739]

How many Golden Dragons to get a bar of Gold-pressed Latinum?

[@FrizziExRose]

I have this head canon that his mother didn't seek out moon tea because she was hoping for the chance that the baby was her husband's, so she really loved Ramsey initially, but as he grew older she noticed him looking more and more like Roose and pulled away from him. That rejection would be a lot harder to take, especially when it started morphing into fearfulness. I've heard of men changing completely with one look from their mother. Imagine a period of months where the affection weans off, and she just slowly grows more fearful of him. Devastating to his psyche for certain.

[@sweetpotatofries99]

I don't think so. She brought him to Roose as a baby because she already saw the resemblance. We don't know how she treated Ramsay. We know she had difficulty with him because he's wired wrong. Psychopaths are born that way.

[@annakalakatroni4708]

In the books - if I remember correctly - only highborn ladies could afford moontea since it was made by maesters who served their families.

[@Winter-Alpha-Omega]

Interesting that my idea was that she only kept him alive to cash in on Roose and she abused him from the moment he was born.

[@multimediafan6777]

Ramsey's lack of remorse and sense of humor was a combination that could never end well...

[@_birdie]

he and joffrey were so well acted in the show it's unreal.

[@Raycloud]

Something you didn't mention is that Domeric was the one person offering Ramsay what he wants; belonging in the Bolton family. I know you didn't want to speculate on whether or not he murdered Domeric, but I think that is good evidence that he probably didn't and it's why he gets so angry and Barbrey's accusation. Something rather tragic is that it may be the case if Domeric had lived and eventually become Lord that Ramsay might have been quite content to reside in his household and look after his hounds, hunting (animals) side by side with his brother who accepted him.

[@williamtehan4028]

If that’s the case then who did kill Domeric maybe Bolt-on is true

[@Raycloud]

Reek or Ramsay's mother are the primary suspects in the theory, or else Domeric really did just die of a bad belly. @@williamtehan4028

[@ThDaa-sd3bq]

​@@williamtehan4028 or maybe he did die of sickness like everyone else in that world.

[@dendenne4856]

@@williamtehan4028 the maester said he died of illness, Roose despises his son so it is easy for him to think he poisoned Domeric but if he was poisoned, I think it was Ramsay's mother who did it, 1 Ramsay isn't clever enough to poison someone without leaving proof 2 Poison is a feminine weapon

[@jessjess23brooks89]

​@@dendenne4856 Oberyn Martell has entered the chat. But I totally get what you are saying. Besides the poison master himself, traditional poison was very much a woman's mode of murder.

[@WatashiMachineFullCycle]

I really love that George gives us these characters that are absolutely vile and monstrous but leaves us enough crumbs to understand how they came to be this way. I also don't believe children are born evil, I am very much on the nuture vs nature side of things. I could easily see Ramsay as an example of somebody with antisocial personality disorder but that by itself doesn't necessarily mean that he was fated to turn out the way he did. If he struggled to understand empathy it is all too easy to push that to an extreme via neglect. I think the show really stripped these characters of what made them who they are (I especially found Joff's relationship with king Robert interesting and we got like none of that in the show ugh) so I really love that you pull mostly from the books when you do these.

[@sweetpotatofries99]

I don't think people are born evil either, tho there are definitely wiring defects in the brain that make it very easy for a person to go wrong unless they're given a lot of help. I'm a diagnosed sociopath who manages to stay "pro-social" with a lot of mindfulness and study. I realize I'm abnormal and am trying to do my best. Ramsay's out there just living his best life. I wish I could hunt someone through the woods once. Lucky bastard.

[@blueberryf1nch969]

It's also possible that Ramsey's mother who told him that her "relationship" with Roose was romantic. She might have not wanted him to know what happened to her, or didn't want him to offend his father because of his violent nature.

[@AdoreYouInAshXI]

Ramsay wanting a new Reek (as he does with Theon) plays into your theory about dogs. His old dog died, time to get a new one.

[@gerganakoleva4137]

In the show Ramsay stands out (that is why he could be though of as a "1-D" villain) , there is no one quite like him. It is not so in the books. When you read about the Tickler, Bitter, Vargo Hoat and the other brave companions, the Mountain ... (funny I just noticed they are all in and around Arya, she really sees the worst of humanity), their deeds are as monstrous as anything Ramsey did. So I do not think we should look at Ramsey outside of that environment. When a child grows up in a society where certain thing are accepted for normal he/she cannot see them for what they are in another context. He certainly grew up in better times than the war in the river lands, but still the cruelty of the environment was there, to leave an impression. The influence of those people (or people very much like them) was may be not so obvious before the wars started raging, but they did not spring out of nowhere. They were there and they were accepted and they were listened to and used for different "unpleasant" jobs and never really punished or rejected.

[@keturahspencer1211]

The Vile Eye channel as a hole feels more like summary than analysis to me.

[@mylittlethoughttree]

I think I've watched one of their videos before but I can't remember. The Ramsay one seemed pretty good to me, far more focused on diagnosis than I personally like, and could definitely have gone further but still good points. The only thing I'm not sold on is the dramatically dark way of speaking/atmosphere to the videos. I can see why that'd be appealing to others, it's just not so much my taste

[@keturahspencer1211]

@@mylittlethoughttree fully agreed about the tone on their videos. I'll check out their Ramsey Bolton video though. You got me curious.

[@keturahspencer1211]

@@mylittlethoughttree by the way, I particularly loved this analysis. It got me thinking about someone who I actually know, and maybe a way to give them a bit more empathy.

[@HeatherHolt]

I really “enjoy” the backstory to his … creation … bc it’s as sick as he becomes and is that what he was meant to be or what he was turned into since his mother would have most certainly despised Roose’s actions plus Reek being sent by Roose to help raise Ramsey. An interesting mix of fate, nurture and nature.

[@axbloodtheory7885]

Theon was a hostage, not a guest. He was fostered by the Starks as a way to stop Balon from rebelling again.

[@mylittlethoughttree]

Certainly, but he was also treated more like a son by Eddard than was expected. Not enough for Theon but, to outsiders viewing, it would've looked like taking in another son

[@gerganakoleva4137]

Yes, technically he is a hostage and Theon is very self-conscious of that, but it does not mean he sees clearly. Knowing Ned, I bet he would never harm Theon, whatever his father may or may not do. We saw how he defended a girl he never knew, he gave away his position and the friendship with the king, since he could not accept their plan to kill her. Imagine what he would do if someone asks him to sacrifice Theon for something his father did.

[@eleonorahazel4552]

​@@gerganakoleva4137 Yes, he would. Remember, this is the same Ned Stark who killed his daughter's direwolf (even though she was innocent) because the queen wanted him to do so, and the same Ned Stark who beheaded a fugitive member of the Night's Watch simply because it was the law.

[@kingsleyedge304]

​@eleonorahazel4552 he was willing to kill lady because 1. She's an animal and 2. She was gonna be killed regardless, he felt honorbound to do it himself. I think it's important to remember that Theon wasn't just a hostage he was technically a ward. He trained Theon with the same sword master as his sons, fed him the same food, kept him in good clothes, etc. Theon was arguably treated better than Jon

[@LusiaEyre]

​@kingsleyedge304 I think that Ned would feel bad about executing Theon but he would do it. He would not go to war with his King over Theon. And refusing to carry out the sentence would be an act of Rebellion. Of course, he could try and help him "escape" to Essos or something, but he wouldn't defy Robert. Ned always knew that Theon wasn't his ward, that's why he remained fairly distant as to not form stronger emotional attachment. I can see Robb refusing to kill Theon - if he had inherited the hostage set up from his father - but frankly I don't see Ned being willing to rock the proverbial boat for Jon, his sister's son, so Theon is a reach.

[@dendenne4856]

You should do the psychology of Theon Greyjoy

[@jackleith3502]

Just a quick note on Lord/Lady Hornwood: Roose uses his position as the commander of Robb’s infantry army to kill off Stark hardliners. I’m not sure if it’s the Battle of the Green Fork or a different battle, but Roose puts Lord Hornwood (plus a couple others, Glover and Cerwyn I think) in the vanguard on a suicide mission to kill them off. Thus eliminating hardline Stark loyalists, and creating a power vacuum for his eventual betrayal/coup of Robb/House Stark. It was all win-win for Roose - either his army won against the odds and he claimed all the glory as the commander, or some Lords died who would’ve stood in his way whilst the Bolton men kept the rearguard and remained mostly untouched.

[@andrewward5891]

It’s interesting that two of the most evil characters in GOT, Ramsey and Joffrey, both have Daddy issues. Joffrey is mostly ignored by his supposed father Robert and his real dad Jamie can’t treat him like a son without rousing suspicion. Ramsey has no father figure until he moves to the Dreadfort as a teen. The big difference between them is their relationship with their mothers. Ramsey’s mom is neglectful and possibly abusive towards Ramsey as he reminds her of Roose while Cersi spoils Joffrey’s and Lets him get away with everything. So both with Daddy abandonment issues and one with a neglectful mom and the other an over accommodating mom.

[@EPWillard]

something terrible being accepted as normal in the past is not necessarily a sign that people were not distressed about it, it just means they recognized they had no power to change the state of things and abdicated responsibility for it. when we see terrible things happening in our time we do much the same thing. when you actually think about the nature of what it's like for an individual to be homeless you recognize it as a terrible experience but you file it away as something unfortunate you cannot change.

[@mylittlethoughttree]

Yeah well said. A lot of the time it's not they're somehow immune to traumaz it's probably a part of them dissociating because what the hell else can they do?

[@kingsleyedge304]

I think it wasnt ramsay but reek who killed the trueborn bolton son. It would explain why ramsay was so attached to him and would go further is explaining their dynamic. Reek being a sort of dark teacher to Ramsay makes sense. It would also explain why ramsay let him die, as he killed the pne person who might have accepted Ramsay. It would help with the love hate vibe and why he cant seem to separate the two with reek 2.0 A personal theory of mine is that Reek was a Bolton bastard, maybe one of Rooses uncles or bastard brothers. It would be a twsited joke on Rooses part, get rid of a nuisance he couldnt just kill, and would explain why Reek and Ramsay could be confused for each other, because they're related

[@Some_Guy_87]

Nice summary that makes a lot of sense! I purposefully didn't read too much into Ramsay when reading because the unknown was part of the appeal to me. Similar to how only the results of Theon's torture is shown, rather than the torture itself - the imagination does the rest. How do you think Roose Bolton's treatment towards Theon plays into the relationship? Apart from the obvious part of being nice to him so that he acknowledges the fake Arya, I remember feeling like Roose tried to loosen the leash Ramsay had. Seemed a bit to me like he was scared of Ramsay having the means to overthrow him, and purposefully keeping some form of control in every aspect of his power. Maybe I read too much into it... Regarding your point of "ruthlessness is worth it" being false: This is even more obvious when looking at the Freys rather than the Boltons in my opinion. They are mostly associated with the Red Wedding and while it brought them immense power immediately, you constantly see how slippery it is. They are hunted one by one by their new enemies and untrusted by their new allies, if not openly looked down upon for their lack of honor and loyalty. Being a Frey post red wedding is a position of constantly having to watch your back - it doesn't feel like they won anything. If I remember correctly Roose also said he often times makes "softer decisions" because you can't rule over people who are unhappy.

[@villaslur]

Great video! I remember George once mentioning in an interview, that Ramsey is a misunderstood character because Ramsey had a horrible childhood, but I couldn't really understand what could have happened for him to turn into the monster he became. Still can't really understand it, but I do think that Reek must have had a big role in him turning into this monster. Anyway, what I mean is, according to George, Ramsey wasn't born a monster, unlike Gregor Clegan.

[@villaslur]

​@@blaubeer8039 The headaches theory 🤣 I heard about it, I thought he only had them because of his gigantism, didn't knew he had a head injury. Did George mention when he got the head injury? Like in his childhood? 🤔 because he was a child when he burned Sandor.

[@kingsleyedge304]

​@@villaslurwell headaches are a symptom of Gigantism and as you grow older, you get bigger and the worse they get. Andre the Giants body was 10 types of fucked up from his condition and Cleganes bigger than he was in think. Gregor is described as basically drinking painkillers like water on the daily

[@PhosPhryne]

I could (and will) watch your ASOIAF videos forever.

[@Raycloud]

Ramsay is fascinating and terrifying in the books, but I really don't care for the show version. Ramsay is consistent and makes sense in the books but the show version feels a bit off. He's too handsome and charming when he wants to be which shows he can control himself, which then begs the question as to why he was so nasty to Sansa. Why resent this gorgeous women who is his key to ruling the North after his father? Is he really frightened of an infant when his father is an old man? I think the problem is the plot line the show runners went with in Season 5 which was essentially just repeating Sansa' storyline with Joffrey from Season 2 and 3. Instead they should have had Sansa charm and manipulate Ramsay, who could cast aside Myranda, while also corrupting Sansa by encouraging her to partake in his torture of Theon, whom she thinks murdered her brothers. In the end Sansa discovers the truth but before she escapes she prompts Ramsay to finally murder his father, knowing that he won't be able to rule as effectively.

[@chanceroneill5792]

I acc really like this as a plot line I’ve never considered Ramsay as a challenge to Sansas goodness in such a way, and her overcoming his influence would be such a good mirror of Cersei choosing to give in to her bitterness

[@toriartemis801]

Tbh I don't think Ramsay resented Sansa at all... and even more, as crazy as this might sound, I don't think Ramsay was *trying* to be nasty to Sansa. Like don't get me wrong, what Ramsay does to Sansa is completely vile, no doubt about it. But I don't think Ramsay *sees it that way,* like I think in his mind he's just performing his "husbandly" duties. He simply doesn't consider what he's inflicting on her as S/A at all, he's just "bedding his wife" the way any lord would. As bad as he is with Sansa, it's still *very different* from the grotesque abuse book Ramsay inflicts on poor Jeyne, like he seems to go out of his way just to hurt her, he's very sadistic towards Jeyne. Whereas with Sansa, Ramsay actually *likes* Sansa, he likes how beautiful she is, and her legitimate nobility (as opposed to "fake arya"), and he tells her as much, right before he shows her the flayed old woman. And as awful as that scene is, I think it was less Ramsay setting out to torture Sansa and more of "Hey *I like you,* so don't mess this up by trying to run. *Just don't make me angry* and everything will be peachy between us." Which is similar to how he acts during their "bedding" - like he questions her about Tyrion bc he wants to make sure she's "pure", then tells her to undress, and *only gets annoyed* when she freezes and he has to tell her again - "do I have to repeat myself? *bc I don't like repeating myself."* Making Theon watch seemed more like that was directed towards *Theon* - bc unlike with Sansa, Ramsay clearly sets out to torture and be cruel towards Theon every chance he gets. Even the cruel stunt he pulls on her and Theon by making them confront each other, making Theon apologize for "killing her brothers" and then making Theon give her away at the wedding, to me it just seems like Ramsay's idea of a "joke" - like it's just something he personally finds funny and isn't necessarily an attempt to break/torture Sansa. If anything, I wouldn't be surprised if that was, again, more directed towards *Theon* as another cruel little punishment/trick, considering the scene before he scolds Theon for "keeping secrets from him" and makes a big deal out of deciding to *not* take one of his fingers.

[@lemonadelemon1960]

Book Ramsay never encountered Sansa. It was another poor girl he tortured. Jeyne Poole. Did you read the book?

[@lemonadelemon1960]

@@toriartemis801tell that to Jeyne Poole and Theon. Tell them Ramsay had NO idea what he was doing cause anyone harm.

[@toriartemis801]

@@lemonadelemon1960 ... for one, I can't actually *tell* them anything, as they don't exist lol. Also, it seems you've mistaken my explanation of Ramsay's possible mindset as for, like, an actual *defense* of the guy. To make things more clear for you: *I don't defend any of the heinous shit he does in the series.* He's still rotten for what he does to Sansa, whether he *intentionally* set out to sadistically hurt her or simply *didn't care* about whether he hurt her or not. Two different things, but both are *atrocious.* This isn't the "Ramsay's just a baby who didn't know any better" defense you think it is lmaooo. I... thought I made that pretty damn obvious in my previous comment. The lack of reading comprehension is a serious issue online, like goddamn. 🤦‍♀️

[@fabiolaliano8620]

I feel like another aspect to the dog thing is how they are not only loyal, but will love any human that feeds them and pays attention to them. they kind of unconditionally love human beings regardless of who they actually are as a person, and ramsay will never receive unconditional love from the people who in another life could have loved him unconditionally (his parents, although his mother does not love him unconditionally for very understandable reasons). his dogs love him unconditionally, and as dogs they naturally have a lower standing than him, so I think he might believe that if he tortures those of lower standing than his then maybe they might love him unconditionally, but that is never going to happen because that is not how unconditional love works

[@afrosamourai400]

But even dogs don't love those who torture them right?

[@stephysteph8558]

@@afrosamourai400 Unfortunately dogs can still love owners who abuse them. Which to me is more reason why humans should be kind to animals who have so little agency over where they end up.

[@tombullard123]

I think him posing as reek and making theon reek is his way of easing his guilt. Reek likely was the only person in the world loyal to him almost like family that he wouldnt have had. Making a new reek is trying to get him back in some way. His treatment of theon is so bad because he is desperate to be drastic and mould someone to be utterly loyal like reek was to bring him back from the ultimate betrayal of his one loyal “family” member and have him kind of as a living shrine/homage

[@angrynerdgirl]

I just started the video, but I can't thank you enough for crediting the artists on screen! I wish more KZbinrs did it.

[@JoeNaeem]

Dog analysis is a simple conceptual key that unlocks the whole character to me

[@hector-nu6gl]

I had a understanding for everyone in the show, even geoffrey's actions were the actions of a human. Ramsey on the other hand... He was not a human, he was a pure sadist with zero human qualities. That made him so disturbing and a man who was actually frightening even for a grown up man like me.

[@tgimikey8480]

I Love The Vile Eye! I watched it as soon as it came out! That’s how much I love this character and that channel!

[@cosmicpotato3849]

Excellent video once again! I can’t believe you made me feel sorry for Ramsay Bolton somehow. Not to presume, but if I could possibly suggest another video idea, would you consider Stannis Baratheon? I’d be sure to see what you make of his facets in the show and books, considering how he interacts with the other characters

[@Silversentiment]

Please do a psychology video on Petyr Littlefinger Baelish and Varys.

[@WafaaH]

Poor Jane :(

[@ajae...]

The arguments about projecting current standards onto the past in these fictional stories has gotten so much worse since HOTD with people angry at the ideas that medieval women were cognizant and critical of patriarchy and that multi-ethnic societies have existed for centuries. The irony is that what they're basing their objections comes as much from fiction as GRRM's and HBO's stories. Reading actual history would inform them that Europe and the rest of the world was more complex than they want to believe. Letters, journals, and other records prove women have been displeased with power imbalances and people have traveled and integrated themselves into different societies for a long time. There's also a misunderstanding of how fiction works. It's always from the perspective of its creator and a product of their times. It can recreate a time in history, but it's never going to be able to pretend that all the time between when the story set and when it's being written, with all the societal changes, never happened. There's so much evidence of trauma and loss being recognized further back than the medieval era. Funeral practices, religious myths, laws, and improvements in health and technology all point to valuing and protecting life. Things that would be thought to demean people's lives based on their standards could possibly cause trauma, and people developed ways to try to cope or mitigate them. I often wish that the same people interested in contemporary fiction based on history were interested in actual history. It's just as fascinating in my opinion. On another note, I could barely stand the background music or sounds used in this video. I almost turned it off several times. Personally, I don't think you need background because your writing is so good, and people would still be just as interested without it.

[@mylittlethoughttree]

Oh that's interesting about the music. I might do a poll soon to ask how people feel actually, because I'm never entirely sure

[@ajae...]

It's most likely just a me thing.

[@thing_under_the_stairs]

Great video, and a wonderful attempt to rationally explain one of the most loathsome characters that GRRM has graced his (thank gods) fictional world with. And thank you for acknowledging the theory that his father, Roose, is an ancient, skin-stealing vampire of sorts. The mad fan theories make anything to do with ASOIAF so much more fun.

[@notdeadjustyet8136]

Never thought I'd say that but...poor little Ramsey.

[@karlab95]

This was very interesting to hear. I'm slowly making my way through the books, and this just makes me want to get through them faster. Thank you for the video!

[@jeremyadrian233]

The problem we have at the start of his life is that we don't actually have a clear picture of how he was raised. The glaring part was that Roose did have some relationship raising him or having him close. We hear that he was considered not quite good enough, not quite ready by his father, and claiming and holding Winterfell was his first test. As far as his father goes he had until this point been trying to live up to both the competence and the fearful reputation that Roose expected. We expect that the dread fort was cold and tried to breed the most cruelty possible to hold onto power. But we never knew if his mother abandoned him at the dreadfort, at what age she did, or if she hung around. It's possible that Roose just kept her as a prisoner/ pet and watched her belly grow. But then did she participate in trying to make him cruel or did this happen naturally from her own trauma. But after Winterfell Ramsey was exploring his potential, and was free to explore without criticism from anyone but Roose. He was off the leash. So tell us how much is experience and how much is an act to enhance his reputation. Clearly, he is born psychopathic and unable to feel remorse and it is hinted in the books that he inherited some cruelty, in particular the lords of the dreadfort having cold grey unfeeling eyes, eyes that reflect their reputation. However, Ramsey seems to me to be a combination of training and his own curiosity (which exceeds most at the dreadfort) rather than being an abuser lead by his own personal trauma and stuck in a cyclical (Pavlovian) response. And I think this is what George is exploring.

[@shoople]

Really appreciate you putting the credit for artist's work on the screen! Great analysis as well

[@valx7586]

Im glad you're doing a video, i stopped watch The Vile Eye since he started throwing PDs around stupidly, as someone who works with cluster B PDs its highly irritating seeing mischaracterisations of symptoms

[@zacmccollum7144]

Awesome artwork. I've seen a few of those creepy ass paintings/drawings, but not most of them. Show Ramsey was a monster, but he didn't look near as disturbing as the book Ramsey lol. Jesus Christ...Gods preserve us....

[@mylesrobinson6513]

Fantastic video. It went a really long way for me in providing a possible explanation for Ramsay's behaviour and, in particular, the relationships he forms. A deeper character than many of us appreciate for certain. I would struggle to look past the actions to consider the reasons without your guidance!

[@Orkhevaliet]

I am not sure whether to be happy, or unsettled that we got 2 ramsay snow break downs over the holiday xD

[@efoxkitsune9493]

Yeah, watching this, I don't think I'll ever fully read the books nor watch the show. I know it's good, but. Extended torture scenes are really not something I need right now lol. And I feel like there's just so much of it in the story - torture, SA, brutal violence... just so many absolutely vile, sickening things, so much suffering. At least that's what it seems like from the outside looking in. I love those videos of yours, though. I love hearing about the story and characters without having to actually read or watch TSoIaF/GoT, hehe. Thanks for the video. I always found Ramsay fascinating, based on what I knew about him. Great analysis.

[@mylittlethoughttree]

To be fair to the books, a lot of it you don't see, you're just told about, to spare the gratuitousness, but I also can't say there aren't really uncomfortable moments, because they're definitely are, even if it doesn't glorify it like the show.

[@kingsleyedge304]

Much of the gruesomeness people talk about in regards to the book is implied or offhand mentioned. I'd say the show is alot more graphic bit like....not as much as it's said

[@MrsImogen]

Thank you so much for such a thoughtful analysis. Love your Song of Ice and Fire videos

[@ThDaa-sd3bq]

What a nice video. Well done, sir!

[@AnnabellaCarter]

Would kill for a stannis video 👉👈 but honestly I love everything you put out my guy

[@mylittlethoughttree]

Oh wow, thanks so much!!! A stannis video is most definitely going to happen. I don't know when yet. I have a Sansa video half-made and waiting on a collaborator for it, and I have notes for little finger, but stannis would be a really interesting one to make at some point

[@entheo302]

Great video! Wanna read the books now

[@frankrizzo7746]

Great video brother

[@gustavoadolfomorenoyanes4514]

"what battles has the Bastard of Bolton ever won that I should fear him?"

[@WhitneyAllisonGG]

Ramsey is rumor to murder his half brother and the other son to Roose Bolton. Roose Bolton also believe that and the show kills his step mother Walda Frey and her baby. I don't think it's a stretch that Book Ramsey would do the same. I always felt that Book Ramsey and Show Ramsey are different people. Children are not inherently evil because they are developed into that, but they are not inherently good. I think the rules of the Casual Criminalist applies here into making a serial killer. Ramsey upbringing is abusive and many sexist men out there think women are going welcome an offspring from a sexual assault. The women will not accept the child. If Ramsey wasn't a noble or has some connections to Roose Bolton his mother probably abandon him in the woods to die. It the Middle Ages and childhood mortality is quite high and no one is going notice Ramsey's death. I honestly think if Ramsey was raised the same way as Roose Bolton he wouldn't curb his impulses. The difference in Roose Bolton and Ramsey is education and the noble background. Ramsey may love the dogs but starving an animal is a form abuse. I am fifty/fifty on genetics. To make serial killer you need generally abusive parents, animal cruelty, and complete disregard for Human life. Serial killers existed in the Middle Ages and in Ancient Times because they didn't pop up in Victorian Times. The Victorian Times is when we took notice of Serial Killers.

[@afrosamourai400]

I don't think the btk killer had abusive parents some people are born evil..

[@rogueprince1341]

Dude those Vile Eye videos are AWESOME.

[@NonAnonD]

I burst out laughing at this video concept. Looking forward to seeing what depth might be uncovered in this monster

[@sontaranmc2109]

This isn't entirely related to the video, and more a tangent on a tangent, but man, it makes the medievist in me cry when I see people be so dismissive of history. Particularly, I'm inspired by your remark on how people say "well Game of Thrones is medieval, so psychology doesn't matter" as if wise men, clergy, and medicine women didn't play the role of village therapists as well as they did doctors historically. People have understood trauma before psychology was formalized as a field, so it's not even just "oh, but it's a modern fantasy," the people you're responding to were also just wrong even about the history. That being said, GOT does invoke a lot of common historical misconceptions on its own. Two mentioned just in this video are the "first night" (which has been known to be incorrect since the Victorian era) and the alleged poor hygiene of medieval common folk. So, yeah, it's a mixed bag.

[@mylittlethoughttree]

Thanks for the comment! How good was hygiene? It's now got me curious if I've misunderstood, too

[@sontaranmc2109]

@@mylittlethoughttree I’ll refer you to Bernadette Banner’s recent video on this, bc she goes over it well! kzbin.info/www/bejne/e4uqqaiEp8prjrcsi=DCixOlzaBt2CIW6S If you want a TLDR though, while people couldn’t strictly bathe, they would still *wash*, taking regular sponge baths. They also had less need for things like deodorant, because they wore clothes that were made to absorb the sweat and trap the smell/keep it from oxidizing. They wouldn’t exactly smell like flowers, but they certainly didn’t smell awful either.

[@sontaranmc2109]

Also, just as a side note-I hope I didn’t sound judgmental or overly critical with my mention of the historical misconceptions! There’s a reason they’re taken for granted so often-they were created to facilitate common narratives about history, often with a flair of “look how advanced we are today, not like the barbarians of history.” And with medieval fantasy, a lot of people kind of read it specifically because of those narratives, so there’s nothing wrong with codifying it. It can even be a handy tool for implementing themes, like the hygiene being used as a vehicle for showcasing class divide. My frustration is strictly when people defending the series with claims of Historical Accuracy while ignoring other bits where it doesn’t hold itself to that.

[@SuperARCANGEL0]

Please do a psychology of Robert Baratheon

[@santiagomartin2696]

A video on Euron Greyjoy psicology whould be great

[@mylittlethoughttree]

Oh god, where do I begin? 😂

[@jessie_dreams_]

46:57 aww I have a pair of loud idiots too 🤣🐰💜

[@vincent95671]

FINALLY

[@RobinNicoagain]

I view it as Domeric is son that Roose wishes he had. He was perfect noble and perfect son. However Ramsay is more like Roose himself and shares so many qualities with him. I find it a bit escapist maybe from Roose's side. Maybe he wanted to be perfect noble type himself? Hmmm... Something to theorize.

[@robert4123]

Have you not seen the wire? Curious if even with all the hype I expect it still holds up! You tell me my little thought tree!

[@mylittlethoughttree]

I'm afraid I haven't. Weirdly, I hadn't even heard of it until a few years ago. Everything I've heard suggests it's amazing, so I'd like to try it someday

[@robert4123]

@@mylittlethoughttree well, I truly enjoy your perspective on things you make some very insightful videos so I very much look forward to both: your enjoying the wire and my enjoying your interpretation of it!

[@vonHartstein]

Just a video recommendation regarding your statement at 20:30: kzbin.info/www/bejne/e4uqqaiEp8prjrcsi=dLz4gbfPSUgNTQee I know it's fantasy, it should be - at least in my opinion - relevant nonetheless. Oh, and a happy new year to you, your loved ones (rabbits and otherwise ;) in advance by the way.

[@gracehaven5459]

It's fascinating to me that people argue that so many of these horrible things: SA, institutionalized sexism, child abuse and neglect, child marriage, slavery, torture etc. were "Normal Parts" of medieval Europe and we shouldn't hold them to the same standards as the modern day ... forgetting that this is a FANTASY Series with literal dragons, various gods that are implied to exist, warging, blood magic, necromancy, giving birth to Literal Shadow Monsters. etc. etc. Reality is off the table people! lmao. A story can be rooted in inspiration from a certain setting and time without any historical parallels beyond major events. Example: the Bridgerton series. What's more, I'd like to wager a fair percentage of the people arguing for the "authenticity" don't have much knowledge about historical medieval Europe. Sorry not sorry! lmao. It is one of my biggest pet peeves when people argue pro-authenticity at the expense of character abuse in a clearly fictitious setting. I'm not saying characters should never go through trauma for narrative purposes of course, but what I am saying is if "Alyce" the Miller's wife is being assaulted by a lord and people argue it's "just part of tradition!" That really gets my goat! Especially when there is very minimal historical evidence the practice of the first night actually took place at all.

[@DanielHernandez-sg9sg]

This is a good point. Something I find worth mentioning is that it is entirely possible for everyday life to be traumatic if the conditions are horrible enough. It might be normal but it doesn’t mean it is not incredibly hurtful to people.

[@youngnat]

Not to mention psychological warfare aka inflicting trauma on enemies predates to ancient wars.

[@Some_Guy_87]

I couldn't believe my ears that that's actually a position some people have, even if it's true that something like that is a common occurrence. As if it all of a sudden feels okay to be forcefully taken in front of your husband's corpse because it happens more often in that world...doesn't change a thing about how traumatic it is.

[@gracehaven5459]

​@Some_Guy_87 it's partially because I personally seek out the underbelly of degeneracy in fandoms out of pure morbid curiosity, but yes, you'd be surprised how many people (mostly men tbh) find the grosser elements of the stories appealing.

[@afrosamourai400]

The first night is a myth

[@RikkaP]

I think a thing to be kept in mind is, that Roose will NOT be a reliable narrator here. I think the whole story he tells to Theon serves more then the purpose of getting us exposition. He is putting down Ramsay again and again (using the same taktics as Ramsay himself does with Theon). Frankly, I think it is mostly narcisstic, in both men (okay I might be biased there for personal reasons). That is the reason I think Roose poisoined Domenic himself and pinned that on Ramsay. I think he wants the perfect heir to the Dreadfort: a man like himself. Domenic was not that, because he was "spoiled" by others, maybe his mother, but at least by the people Roose mentions: Lady Dustin and Lord Redford. So Roose did away with him. He was considering Ramsay for a while, I think, even though he did not like him (because the rules of the gods said he could not kill him at a whim and Roose does not like being told). But Ramsay prooved to be wrong into the other way: He was like his father, but brought up wrong: too impulsive, has no education. The speach is made to manipulate Ramsay (whom to Theon will all of this relate). So I think he will be the next to go, but of course Roose is playing cat and mouse with him. He says that Ramsay will inherit but he will be planning on a death by Manderly, he sent all the ones that he's miss least out of the castle to battle Stannis.

[@RikkaP]

Also reek was used to show a person as "internally rotten" before: at Tywins funeral, nobody could bear the stench and Lord Lannister seemed to grin. The truth came out about Tywin. And there is the fact that ASOIAF is an answer to the LOTR and there are interesting parallels there (pretty sure Stannis is a version of Aragorn and I am wondering what a sister to Boromir and Faramir would have been like) and I think Reek is a parallel to Gollum (who is even called Stinker). I think it was not that people kicked out Reek because of the stench, but he was horrible (and did not smell great) and they said afterwards that his stench was a mark of his rotten core (that's why he appeared healthy before- again like with Tywin), like Gollums grandmother had to kick Smeagol out of the family. Ramsay himself might be parallel to the Ring: a part of the great evil (I am wondering what Roose is up to with the library of Harrenhal) and spreading a corrupting influence on everybody (esp. Theon and Reek).

[@maxcasteel2141]

Nothing so classic as a boy and his dog ;P

[@faisalkamal4319]

Roose is kinda of evil who will die of old age in his bed and Ramsey will die like a dog - vile eye

[@stephysteph8558]

I only have a patchwork experience of both the show and books (I did see some scenes with both Ramsay versions), and I didn't read the scene where Theon has to leave Ramsay and go on the mini ques (around 31 minutes in), but out of context it reads like a D/S relationship? In context probably more like something the dom wants to be a D/S relationship but is really wishful thinking. I don't know why the isolated text is giving me "Don't worry Babe; we'll be together again and you can prove how much you're mine" vibes, but it did.

[@saiyamoru]

I would like to point out that 'right of the first night' isn't a fictional conceit - it's based on irl 'droit du seigneur'. This really happened to women on their wedding nights and they just had to put up with it. Horrifying to think about.

[@justsomeoneabittired1273]

It is a myth.

[@Omenweaver]

If it helps, while there's various written references to the right of the first night, there's very little to no reliable evidence of it existing as an actual law, and most historians at this point seem to doubt its veracity, at least as a widely known law in medieval Europe that everyone just had to put up with. If it was as widely practiced and well established a practice as bad history would imply, then there would be more than the scant handful of oblique mentions that we do have. Mel Gibson putting in Braveheart as just a normal thing that happened all the time makes me steam a little. I have no doubt that things of that nature occurred, the powerful abusing their power is nothing new, but it's a far cry from it being a legally recognized and protected right

[@Slibhin]

source

[@saiyamoru]

It existed enough that it had to be legally abolished in at least one country, but sure, if we want to be pedantic about it, I don't think it was more common than the regular type of SA at the time. Wedding nights don't happen every day. But even if the 'right' wasn't invoked, people of lower class during the medieval period weren't in the habit of having SA cases heard or even punished past, *possibly*, a monetary fine. It sounds as though the main question of whether 'the right of the lord' is a myth or not revolves around whether the grapes happened on wedding nights, but I'd still make the case that the 'right' of someone in a higher [social] caste to sexually assault someone in a lower one definitely isn't in question. @@Omenweaver​

[@nivircescrittore8304]

It is a myth. More than that, it is an *old* myth. There are references to this suposed right in the Epic of Gilgamesh which you may notice, predates the Roman Empire, let alone Medieval Europe. And yet whether it's Ancient Mesopotamia or Medieval Europe, there's no evidence it ever happened. It could have hapened, sure, but never seems to have an actual thing, mostly just a widespread fear, like witches.

[@nocontextwhatever]

What if the whole time Ramsey wa actually the son of his mother's husband?? 🤔

[@Some_Guy_87]

In the books Roose has very very specific eyes, absolutely everybody mentions them. So them having the same eyes is pretty much a 100% guarantee.

[@mpalfadel2008]

You haven’t met Euron (not the facsimile in the show, the real one)

[@annamadarova625]

❤❤❤

[@Mj_Jetson]

Thoughts on the weirdness of Roose Bolton, with his miller's wife story? From Jaime I ADwD, we know that lords really value mills as a source of tax revenue, so killing the miller, maiming his brother and putting a teenage widow in charge of the mill hardly seems economically sound. Its sadistic enough to be Roose, but its too... hot-blooded? Impulsive? I feel like Current-Roose would lecture Past-Roose amorally about the economics of messing with the mill the same way he lectures Ramsay about the properties of human skin as a potential boot-leather material. What do we make of this? Is this where some variant of the Roose-is-an-immortal-vampire-and-the-evil-vampire-hivemind-hadn't-taken-over-his-body-yet theory has to come in, or is there a psychological explanation? Roose was a young hot-headed sadist back then, but something - Domeric, one of his wives, Robert's Rebellion, long years of being a lord or something - changed him into the cold, quiet, ruthless man he is today? So when he looks at Ramsay, he sees his own past flaws and failings? (Kinda like Tywin and Tyrion?)

[@mylittlethoughttree]

Personally, I buy it. I don't see why Roose would feel the need to lie ot exaggerate to a broken Theon. I think the fact he talks with faint emotion about Domeric suggests he feels Theon isn't someone he has to worry about when telling him things. In that sense, my next thought is to consider that it's...very interesting... that's as much as I can reasonably say at the moment 😂 I haven't read back lots to pick apart Roose's psychology (although the info we get might be too scarce anyway) so I don't want to jump to anything. That said, it's entirely in keeping for human behaviour to be messy and full of contradictions. George RR Martin has shown an understanding of this already, Tywin criticising Tyrion for whoring before bedding Shae is an overt example. My tentative theory is that Roose is more emotional than he lets on. He is no doubt very cold, but that he also uses it like a myth to add to his fear and intimidation. I imagine there are examples of him being hot blooded throughout his life, only he tries to exert it in contained settings that won't affect anything else. I also wonder if his obsession with leeching suggests a desire to suppress some of his hot bloodedness. Add to that, Roose was younger at the time of the Miller. I think, like many people, he has a philosophy for living. In this instance, the whole "a quiet land" philosophy, but that he is also unaware how often he unconsciously contradicts it when it suits him. I don't know, that's a guess. I'll say it's a hell of a good question, though

[@pandemoniousivy4651]

Pretty sure it has something to do with timetravel in the UK and a girl 😅

[@orchidrose1410]

It seems to me he’s just a typical sociopath, and I know according to the new DSM “sociopath” is no longer used. But he’s strikes me as the BTK killer. I don’t know where Martin got his idea for the character from but I wouldn’t be surprised if he didn’t look at any famous serial killer and just mirrored it.

[@luciestark5294]

I know euphoria doesn’t sound like your cup of tea 😂 but I’d love to see you do a character analysis of Nate or Cassie or Rue

[@gajorg69]

Do the Mannis next. A Stannis deep dive is iust asking for views.

[@chris7263]

Characters like this are why I stopped reading the books; I hear people say how much more well developed Martin's female characters are than Tolkien's and all I can think is "yeah, but Tolkien didn't get off on constantly torturing them." Still, I enjoy everything *you* make and I'm happy to engage with this story through the filter of your analysis!

[@rinmartell2678]

The male characters are getting tortured as well

[@_HisMajestythecat]

Not the point. ​@rinmartell2678

[@_HisMajestythecat]

And that's valid...

[@Jaggededge112]

Ramsey always gave me the creeps. I wish I could’ve skipped his part in the show altogether. I believe he was one of the worst characters in the series tbh. He was just a nasty character that had zero growth and no real redeeming qualities whatsoever. Just a character you love to hate. I think you did a great job analyzing him and I applaud you taking the time and effort and hit to your own mental health to do so. Thank you. I wish you and your family a happy new year.

[@afrosamourai400]

Cersei ,joffrey ,tywin,walder frey, have no redeeming qualities either so what?

[@Jaggededge112]

@@afrosamourai400 you’re right. They all suck. I just think there is something so wrong with Ramsey mutilating and flaying the skin of Theon and removing his genitalia and making him sleep with rabid dogs. I don’t know it just makes me hate his character worse than any one of the others if that makes any sense. He got what he deserved in the end.

[@philipculturespod]

I AM REEK! LOYAL REEK!!!

[@Some_Guy_87]

It rhymes with freak.

[@67skullcandy]

I loved this character; I call people I don't like Reek. 🤣🤣

[@calcifiedinnerbaldur]

Saying people in the middle ages weren't aware of neglect is a very ignorant claim. Maybe understood differently sure, but not aware of it at all? No. Also, all the violent behaviours you mentioned weren't "ordinary" then anymore than it is "ordinary" in any warzone in our era.

[@mylittlethoughttree]

Completely agree, did I make it sound like I thought the opposite? They wouldn't have understood the neurological effects of neglect, but I think it's kinda intuitively understood by most that children need care

[@calcifiedinnerbaldur]

Thank you for the response. Yes, it did sound like the opposite but given the psychology presuppositions you have it makes sense why you worded it the way you did. I tend to view neglect through the lens of Christian teachings so I can see why there might have been a misunderstanding there. I'm curious what the relevance of the neurological effect would be. Do you believe it would be practically necessary for people to understand neglect in a neurological framing to have the better outcome? Again, thanks for the response. @@mylittlethoughttree

[@bennygerow]

I know you don't believe that kids can be born evil, but I've watched so many documentaries on kids who kill that i gotta respectfully disagree.

[@afrosamourai400]

Thank you, these stories are scary..some kids are definitovely born evil..

[@allenwinberg5119]

If you read the books you are wrong.

[@hankbarcelona7314]

he's just misunderstood 😔

[@matejplecko9025]

good, but jou repeat jourself to much!

[@CallMeKes]

Don't much like the title trying to rip off Cinema Therapy but oh well. I'll give you a try.

[@mylittlethoughttree]

Oh, it does? In what way? I just use what I've slowly found works best, and there's a limit to ways you can point out you're a therapist and that it's a video on psychology of someone

[@bold810]

Hey, dude? Who te fuschs is RAMsey? Why should I care? Was he the Town Roger?

[@mylittlethoughttree]

Odd video to click on, if you don't know or care who this is 😆