Abbey Sharp Vs Dr Mike Vs Unnatural Vegan (EVERYTHING IS FATPHOBIC)

[@KateeAngel]

Fun, cause I like all of these youtubers, most of all you and Unnatural vegan

[@ObesetoBeast]

Honestly, I like everyone too, so it was definitely interesting to talk about!

[@xxx0ox0]

I hope unnatural vegan is doing well. I unsubbed awhile ago when i thought she was losing it.

[@mariaelena9369]

@@xxx0ox0 losing it how? (genuinely curious lol I haven't seen her in a while)

[@missscarlet9054]

@@mariaelena9369 She had some pretty.... unpopular takes against BLM and on racism.

[@Undeadharpie]

@@missscarlet9054 That whole mess still leaves a bad taste in my mouth with UV. I used to love her content

[@TovaHolmberger]

Small point but I noticed Dr Mike said "keeping your weight *healthy*..." instead of "low" or "normal" or something and I thought that was a great choice of wording.

[@margaretcorleoneblues]

Abbey got mad about that 😭

[@Aceofwolves]

Yep. Anyone can be unhealthy not just fat people. Someone who is skinny and smoking is unhealthy too

[@alex.profi27]

​@@Aceofwolvesyou mean someone who is doing drugs, especially weed

[@crazee4590]

These videos are starting to feel like Russian nesting dolls of channels

[@ObesetoBeast]

I’ve embraced it

[@TheMagdalenaBB]

Dr. Mike is Russian too. Whoa.

[@prettiep]

I agree lol but I kinda like it, I feel like it's more of a conversation vs like singular videos with singular opinions being unchallanged.

[@katzlevyalon]

Reaction video to reaction video to reaction video....

[@maenad1231]

@@katzlevyalon Reaception

[@vitalyaloves]

i feel like abbey sharp would be better off making videos about/for disordered eating specifically, all the issues in her videos seem to stem from the fact she's applying nutritional advice meant for people with disordered eating to the general population, which just makes it bad and misleading advice for most people

[@marissa1373]

Exactly! She should market her videos towards people with orthorexia. Intuitive eating does not work for people with most other eating disorders either. People with binge eating disorders, bulimia and even sometimes anorexia don’t know when they are hungry and need to work with doctors to decide what and when they should be eating.

[@vitalyaloves]

@@marissa1373 i wanted to put that in my original comment but i couldn't think of the word orthorexia haha

[@rebekahrhodes9512]

I think everybody has a target audience in mind when they are making content on KZbin, and I think that most people do not narrow themselves and say this is just for one category of people. But what Abby does do is put a disclaimer in front of most of her videos saying this is what I'm going to talk about and if you don't think that that will work for you or if it is triggering to you, and you don't need to watch what I promote works for some people and not everyone, everybody is different.

[@vitalyaloves]

@@rebekahrhodes9512 yes but the disclaimer is too non-specific, people don't know whether it applies to them or not. the average person probably doesn't know that the nutritional advice she gives is more relevant for people with orthorexia and may be misinformed by the video. i just think if she said her advice was aimed at people with orthorexia she would immediately end a lot of the criticism her channel gets

[@rebekahrhodes9512]

@@vitalyaloves well, people get to decide what's good for them and what's not, and I think it's ridiculous to blame someone for the way other people take their work, when they are presenting that work in good faith with a disclaimer. I will say in her early days her disclaimer was not as good as it is now. She has learned from some mistakes, but she's never going to be able to please everybody, she should be allowed to put out content and people can decide whether or not it's for them.

[@TestMonkey254]

Dr Mike is still kinda in the dog house for me but the one thing he is NOT is fat phobic. He treats the subject with such sensitivity at all times sometimes a bit too gingerly for my taste but he is a doctor and has to have his obese patients trust him.

[@lauragutierrez3218]

Thank you, he’s still has to do better about partying and stuff, but he is not fatfobic.

[@CasuallyGaming123]

Yes. In general, I think Dr. Mike does well in considering the feelings of others and addressing concerns accordingly. That being said, I'm still not happy with how he handled the yacht. My issue isn't as much about the boat party itself (though it was incredibly irresponsible negligent, and a slap in the face to all the people with covid and those of us trying our best,) it's about the shitty apology video afterward. He puts in his secondary channel and plays victim?!? I found it appalling. He needs to own what he did and not try to claim that others are using this lapse in judgement for nefarious means.

[@ediesongbird3163]

Never Fear Gaming yup killed when he went and put it on his second channel to me it shows he cares more about how people see him and not about actually apologizing

[@CasuallyGaming123]

@@ediesongbird3163 100% agree. Everydamndayfitness said that he wasn't really a doctor on youtube, he's more of a health influencer. After that apology video, I agree with EDDF. I know he's a legitimate doctor, but I think he's gotten to a point where staying in the limelight is more important to him that behaving with the integrity that is expected of a doctor. If he had posted on his MAIN channel a decent apology, something like: "I got caught up in the moment. I wasn't thinking about others, only that I was stressed out and wanted to relax. What I did is not something that anyone should do right now, in the middle of a pandemic. I'm sorry. I need to do better and I hope you all will can see that even doctors have a lapse in judgement sometimes. For those of you using this as an excuse to behave the way I did, please don't. This was not an example anyone should follow. The coronavirus is real and it is dangerous and we must remain vigilant in our actions. I quarantined when I got home and will not make this mistake again." Or something to that effect, I would have had more respect for him. Everyone can have lockdown burnout and make some stupid choices, but how he handled it afterward really showed me the kind of person he is.

[@ediesongbird3163]

Never Fear Gaming yup exactly what I would have wanted to hear very disappointing how he react to the controversy

[@kjaime7030]

The problem with this entire set of reactions is that Abbey and Mike are focused on DIFFERENT PEOPLE. Abbey is more of a diet "therapist." She deal with a lot more people who have eating disorders. Therefore, she's going to be hyper-focused on what helps, and what hurts, people with disorders or with an atypical approach to eating. Mike, on the other hand, is going to ALWAYS be focused on scientific studies that look at statistical averages, combined with HIS personal experiences where disordered or atypical eating is NOT the average patient. So their focus and their words, and what they advise, are going to be WAY different from each other. What works for most people and what works for most people with atypical approaches to eating, are going to be different statistical measures.

[@inshort6831]

This!

[@scfeng6883]

I worry that people who criticize Abbey for giving advice that may lead to weight gain (‘“intuitive eating” doesn’t work for me because my “intuition” is to eat an entire cake’)are not using their critical thinking skills and don’t realize that her advice is not for them!

[@inshort6831]

@@scfeng6883 exactly. And healing hunger cues need to happen to. I used to not be able to stop eating. I now am able to have a bag of chips in my hoise without devouring it in 10 minutes. I never thought that could happen because I always felt hungry

[@booksiswhatilove]

Sure, but Abbey doesn’t make that clear in her videos at all. COVID Partier Mike does make it clear he’s talking to the general population. Her videos are directed to that population too, and if she wants to just speak to a smaller subset of the population, then actually do that.

[@mikanchan322]

I absolutely think you're right, but I do think Abby could make that more explicit - instead of leaving her target audience implied, so it sounds like she's talking to everyone.

[@juliamary1587]

Junk food can be literally addicting and mess with the hormones that affect your hunger and appetite, meaning it can make you feel hungry even when your body doesn't actually need more food. This is a big reason why intuitive eating doesn't always work.

[@pauljohnagustin237]

Then dont eat junk food Problem solved

[@emilydurkee8664]

Exactly Julia! That's how I feel

[@juliamary1587]

​@@pauljohnagustin237 yes, i agree, but abbey sharp says that restricting yourself to healthy foods only is disordered

[@pauljohnagustin237]

@@juliamary1587 shes not totally right but if you have a particular craving for a junk food in that moment then its fine to have a little For the mental aspect, so that your cravings wont affect your regular healthy diet

[@juliamary1587]

@@pauljohnagustin237 duh

[@differentdelana]

I feel like KZbinrs are the epitome of both "don't meet your heros" and "either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain"

[@StephanieP3]

True!!

[@sierrabird3817]

Yes

[@davneetkaur7990]

Was literally thinking this when I came across your comment.

[@differentdelana]

@@davneetkaur7990 I know. They're definitely allowed to make mistakes. No one holds small mistakes against people. But it's the continued behavior that really sells their souls.

[@jake-amirblumenfeldwitz6068]

yes, people expect too much from youtubers, and basically any other kind of person in the public eye. i get it, i struggle to understand that all these people eat, shit, sneeze, trip over their feet, its kinda like they dont actually exist, like theyre just characters in a book. when i had the realisation that they are just normal people it was like woah... now i dont hold these people to such unrealistic standards anymore, literally everybody is human, and ive also never met these people! i know nothing about who they really are! celebrity is such a weird phenomenon

[@oops383]

I come from an overly restrictive ED and intuitive eating doesn't work because I don't have hunger pains at all. I have to loosely count calories to make sure I get enough food. Abbey comes from an orthorexia background (so do most of her viewers) so that's probably why she's so into it. She should probably mention it isn't for everyone more

[@mary-catherineelizabeth7277]

She does... all the time lol

[@mary-catherineelizabeth7277]

Like she has said soooooo many times that you can't dive head into intuitive eating coming from restrictive eating or binge eating lol

[@user-fp8ck8be3n]

as the comments above stated, she says it ALL the time

[@TovaHolmberger]

@@user-fp8ck8be3n the thing is intuitive eating is such a weird diet to promote because most healthy people already technically do it, and the vast majority of overweight or obese people, just like anorexic people etc, can't do it because they don't get hungry or are hungry all the time. It only works for a minority of people and they already do it.

[@rebekahrhodes9512]

@@TovaHolmberger they can't do it intuitively, but the point is it is a healthy way to eat if you can do it, so it is what most Americans should be striving for. People who are obese or anorexic have become disordered in some way, and the goal is to get them back to a place where their eating is ordered lol. I think it's funny because she's so clearly says that all the time, that it's not easy for everyone in fact it's very hard, and you have to be patient with yourself and try your best, because if you come from a disordered background being hard on yourself about food is probably not a good motivator.

[@mx8357]

“She’s trying to get that paper” no... you don’t get to say super foods don’t exist and have a whole career based around denouncing “diet” and “clean eating” culture but then promote a product like that.. that’s honestly so ridiculous. Very shadey and from her usual perspective “taking advantage of vulnerable followers”...

[@mx8357]

Not trying to come for you John, but come on.. Abby has to see the hypocrisy

[@gabriellagulyas3778]

@@mx8357 i agree, as for this sponsorship she seemed full of shit

[@Laura-fv1oe1]

I think John made that "get that paper" comment in jest, I don't think he was actually defending her decision to take that sponsorship

[@Becky0494]

@@mx8357 he talked about it like two seconds after that when unnatural vegan points that out exactly

[@NoCarnations]

Abbey apologized for this particular sponsorship.

[@TheDawnofVanlife]

Thank you for talking about all the judgement on people's reasons for wanting to lose weight. Since I started trying to lose, I get so annoyed when people are like "even if you don't lose weight, you're beautiful". But yeah...maybe I want to be beautiful and healthier. But honestly if *I* don't think I'm attractive at a certain weight, outside people trying to sell me on otherwise doesn't matter.

[@cabinfeverremedy5636]

I know right! It seems crazy when you're trying to improve your life the number of times you have to tell people 'I know you mean well but this is not what I want or need.' Anyway, I wish you all the success possible on your journey!

[@vitalyaloves]

when people say stuff like that it comes across like they value your beauty more than your wellbeing and health. i know they're trying to be nice but it just seems so insulting

[@esmee6308]

My weight-loss literally enabled me to walk, walking enables working out, be in less pain etc. I went from bed-bound to a very active person, yet I have people in my life who've seen that journey think it's all about beauty / vanity... And thus they get very hurt I won't eat like them because I don't want to look like them. I don't care I can undo the damage, my broken body deserves better than that. Because that's all it is to them and then they wonder why they can't adhere to better habits. Worst part is someone who shows interest and then tell me I should gain weight because I look better overweight. "You're telling me to literally be in more pain." "Yeah but look how beautiful your curves were." "Ok, out, delete my number." "What did I do wrong?" *shakes head* Anyhow, good luck on your journey, you won't regret it! I mean yeah you're beautiful, but you're not gonna become any less beautiful, just stronger, healthier, happier etc. But what does that matter right? :'')

[@TheDawnofVanlife]

@@vitalyaloves Exactly! And, quite frankly, if I'm beautiful or not doesn't solve the anxiety of worrying about fitting in normal sized chairs or if I'll need seatbelt extenders or not on airplane. Luckily, at this point I have not had a ton of physical problems, I do not see that as a reason not to try to improve my situation. I see me as lucky that there are no major physical movement barriers (yet) in my way. I mean I can't run a mile, but I can walk it pretty effortlessnessly, lol.

[@TheDawnofVanlife]

@@esmee6308 ❤️❤️❤️

[@harleykelevra515]

“Why is Doctor mike so attractive bro?! Whenever I see him I get little heart eyes” lol same

[@Infinity-dt6gj]

Best😂😂😂

[@dixnbutts287]

Calm down, him being a doctor makes him attractive.

[@m.p.9931]

Ikr? Aaaaand he is good with the doggys ..

[@csengekovacs9013]

Sometimes I have the feeling that Abby disagrees just for the sake of it.

[@gabriellagulyas3778]

Yes, she criticizes everything basically

[@xosecox12]

That's Swayze actually

[@B_27]

@@gabriellagulyas3778 Yep and then contradicts herself in her next video (or sometimes in the same video)! She seems completely brainless to me.

[@gabriellagulyas3778]

@@B_27 agree 100000%!

[@bbtdgfan890]

She's focused on the science and science doesn't always have a clear cut answer, especially with something with as many variables as the human body. She's open to new information, something this content section could stand to do a lot more of.

[@maraw8658]

At the very least, wait 15-20 minutes after eating your portion to determine if you’re still hungry. You can easily overeat before your brain receives the fullness signals it needs

[@redcitadel9123]

👏👏👏👏

[@ValeriiaJ]

It is so hard for me! I always end my full meal in 5-8 minutes 😩😩

[@marcellkovacs5452]

@@ValeriiaJ I think the idea is that you eat your full portion (based on your diet) and if you're still hungry 15 minutes later you probably need to eat another portion

[@elenal.95]

@@ValeriiaJ you should try drinking hot tea or a glass of water 30mins before a meal. Oriental people drink hot tea before there meals and I strongly believe that’s why so many of them are so thin 😆 plus I personally drink hot tea or coffee or water before a meal and it does help

[@EmilyAnnWalshDontJudgeRead]

This here applies to me because being in the military for so long we had to eat really fast because we had short meal times before we had to get back to work (I was in the Navy 🇨🇦, so you had to eat fast so the next person could come in and have your seat to eat; there wasn’t a lot of room). 14 years of that and I really have to be mindful of how fast I’m eating, and make sure that I’m actually full. Because sometimes eating so fast like that, takes a bit your brain to catch up and be like oh I’m full or oh still hungry, so just give it a minute and your body will actually settle out. Also one of things I learned from the military dieticians is, a lot of times when your body seems hungry it could be that you’re thirsty. So I’ve incorporated that into my meals, making sure that I have a big glass of water with me. I’m better at eating now but 14 years of being program to eat fast has done its toll.

[@OpqHMg]

Unnatural Vegan doesn't seem to get how difficult it is to actually stop believing things? Like those are things sitting in your subconscious and if you realize it you still cannot just stop it. You just have to be aware of it and work against it actively...it's a whole process and never really ends

[@JSJSpeaks]

I'll say this 80,000 times in my life: I had a blood cancer that bloodwork did not detect or diagnose. If that cannot be told, then it is not a stretch to assert that labs don't tell the full story of health, either. It is the easiest thing in the world to throw a red herring into a conversation about anything that someone feels badly about, but it doesn't change the material reality of the matter. I'm really enjoying this video, thank you!

[@hiitscourt]

Sorry to hear that! There are tons of types of diseases that aren't detected by blood work. I think a lot of vegans often go to the lab work discussion (i.e.: my lab work was great even though I'm vegan!) which seems kind of elitist and also incorrectly says that if your bloodwork is OK, all is well.

[@CherryJuli]

My liver blood work was bad for a while and the doctor even though I’m an alcoholic. I went to get an ultrasound of my liver and the doctor there was asking me why I’m even there because my liver is perfectly normal. Turns out, I have thyroid issues that were untreated and messed with my liver lab work. Had my thyroid treated and my liver lab work is perfectly normal now. Doctors tend to just look at a very small thing but not see the whole picture. The same for most studies I read. Plus, people interpret correlations as causality which is a major problem.

[@iolandagirleanu9006]

Oh man, the "can't afford it" part.. Abbey is shilling expensive tea but then says about Greg Doucette that he's privileged to be able to eat a bag of spinach a day. 🙄 Lord.

[@gabriellagulyas3778]

yepp this!!! she's a hypocrite!! and btw greg's diet is super affordable, i use his recipes often

[@avawilliams5827]

I literally just bought three large boxes of spinach for under five dollars. A bag of avocados in my state goes for the same price, apples, bananas. Eating healthy isn’t nearly as expensive as eating out at Popeyes everyday, that myth needs to die.

[@katc2040]

@@avawilliams5827 right because you can make a meal with 3 bags of spinach, an avocado and some vegetables. Sure.

[@katc2040]

@@avawilliams5827 not to mention some places are food deserts, or people have no car to carry multiple bags of very perishable foods

[@s.a1233]

@@katc2040 Is this a first world problem or something, or did you invent it? Because my friend lives in a food desert, but still gets most of her groceries under 10 dollars most of the time.

[@missmoxie9188]

Well okay... I like Abbey Sharp but I do disagree with the whole “intuitive eating” thing. UV is right, you MIGHT have a lot of reasons for being hungry besides you need food

[@katerrinah5442]

Yeah as someone with binge eating issues if I eat intuitively I'd binge in junk food til I had to throw up, and then keep eating

[@TheDawnofVanlife]

As a person struggling through this in the present, I disagree...not on your whole point just the wording. You are only hungry when you need food. The problem with Intuitive eating is it assumes everyone knows the difference between hunger and a craving (or the billion other reasons we overeat). And most overweight/obese people's main drive to eat is not hunger and they have no idea what the difference between actual hunger and other drives to eat are. So, no, they can not intuitively eat at the beginning of a weight loss journey.

[@lari13s]

I think intuitive eating is a process. It’s how we are naturally supposed to eat, but due to modern day factors it’s made it difficult for a lot of people especially in “western” countries to eat that way. It’s hard to successfully eat intuitively when you’re surrounded by fast food, don’t get enough exercise, or are dealing with eating or mental disorders.

[@TheDawnofVanlife]

@@lari13s I mean we are suppose to naturally hunt and gather our food as well, lol. Another thing we often ignore is primitive man also use to physically do more and most modern men/women have a lot of mentally, but not physically excruciating jobs. The ancient human didn't have to "exercise", he was moving all day just to eat and survive. And burning a lot of calories. So while we came blame some of it on things like "fast food", that fast food honestly was less of a problem when physically demanding work and more physical home activity, including playing outside for kids, was more common. I'm not blaming video games, plenty of kids play video games and sports. But there are almost as many options now for non-physical kid-play as physical-kid play. Modern human also just has less natural motivation to move. But if your grandfather who worked on a farm ate fatty food and never gained an extreme amount of weight and died of very old age generally healthy for his age. And you were taught that I was the normal volume of food to consume, with no awareness of why it's not in your different lifestyle. Of course you will have a whole different framework of "normal" eating.

[@Richard-jm3um]

She did just call Dr. Mike Fatphobic tho...

[@oogie_11]

It’s interesting the point of going from tracking to an ED, I’ve been a long time watcher of Abbey’s videos. I actually refused to track for a long time thinking it would potentially cause disorderly thinking. I now track for my training, and have no issues. When I feel I don’t want to track I stop. I feel as though the message is communicated so black and white when there’s a lot more to it than that.

[@andreacollins3204]

Opposite for me. It starts my anorexic behaviour within a week and I become obsessed completely. 6 months now again counting every calorie

[@andreacollins3204]

@I-KILLED FIDDY-MEN I can’t cos I watch every calorie so I want at least a deficit of 1200 a day. I’m allowed 1280 I work off about 300 to 500 so I eat about 300. It’s debilitating

[@0MelleJune0]

The opposite of you, tracking what I eat makes me quickly fall into a pattern of complete surveillance of everything and obsession. But eating when I'm hungry allows me to be way more relaxed.

[@CherryJuli]

@I-KILLED FIDDY-MEN don’t take this the wrong way but it just sounds like you shifted you ED to other controlling behaviors.

[@missscarlet9054]

I like Unnatural Vegan. I dont agree with her on everything, but when it comes to nutrition, I think she has done a good job of staying very honest and giving a good analysis of the facts. I also appreciate that she is a vegan that calls out the ridiculousness of some other vegans. She is a FAR better ambassador for veganism then people like Freelee.

[@apostrophe.t]

She's just so down to earth and relatable.

[@CasianaCarmazan]

I agree and I liked her too but I had to unsubscribe because of her position on BLM or simply put racism

[@missscarlet9054]

@@CasianaCarmazan I understand that. That was literally the video I was thinking of when I said "I don't agree with her on everything."

[@amy_ambrosio]

@@CasianaCarmazan that's why I just see her videos when she's talking about food, nutrition, and veganism. Her opinions about other stuff are meaningless to me. Edit: I'm not that excited to see her content anymore tho. 🤷🏻‍♀️

[@rebeccashields9626]

Agreed, and she has good suggestions for how to eat more plant based for people who aren’t vegan but just want to eat more veggies & legumes.

[@A88-p5e]

for a while I forgot Dr Mike was even part of this 😂

[@emilydurkee8664]

He's barely in the video

[@mirkatteworld4969]

One of the problems I have with UV's video is that she felt the need to frame her response as "Dr. Mike is Right, Abbey Sharp is Wrong." If you actually watch Abbey's video, she is very respectful of Dr. Mike and agrees with the majority of what he says. Framing a response as "Dr. Mike is right/Abbey is wrong" is a misrepresentation, at best. And UV herself ends up agreeing with much of what Abbey says. Maybe it's a clickbait title? But on top of that, I have the impression that Abbey can't post any video without UV finding something to pick at. Because somewhere along the line, she decided she's got a bit of a hate-on for her.

[@b3thamphetamine]

If I recall correctly, UV thinks it's borderline unethical for a dietician with a history of disordered behavior around food to be sponsored to nitpick influencers' days' of eating.

[@mirkatteworld4969]

@@b3thamphetamine, if that's the case, I can't agree. It seems to me her credentials and background make her better equipped, and not less so, to respond to such videos. It has struck me as somewhat ironic that UV often begins videos with a disclaimer of "I am not a dietician," but when she responds to Abbey's videos, she doesn't seem to give Abbey much credit for being one. EDIT: And I realize I did not address the "sponsored" issue. I don't know.... I don't LOVE the whole sponsorship thing, but Abbey is not alone there, and not particularly egregious. I mean.... It felt as though UV made WAY too much of a big deal over that tea sponsorship.

[@mehantitler3555]

@@mirkatteworld4969 For the most part, I agree with you. I think you're right that UV downplays her credentials. I think maybe she is just biased to her preferred vegan dieticians, Jack Norris and Ginny Messina. Personally, I don't like that Abbey's Influencer Reviews are sponsored, and I think some of them are done quite poorly. She's misrepresented a few people because of a lack of research. I don't dislike her content, though, if that makes sense. I really miss her more dietitian talk style videos and the Diet Debby series was fun. I wish she would do some more content like that if she's going to continue to keep doing these reviews.

[@mehantitler3555]

@@mirkatteworld4969 I forgot to say that while I think Abbey probably just shouldn't promote the silly superfood tea, she has every right to make some money and I appreciate that she was honest about her take on the brand's claims. I absolutely agree that UV had no reason to go that hard on the sponsorship. Also, my reply to your original comment was just meant to try to help clarify where UV's hate-on (love that, btw) came from. I have a lot of mixed feelings about UV's channel lately.

[@0MelleJune0]

The fact that UV says she's not a dietician but at the same time claim to know better because she read some studies is the reason why I unsub from her. Get some credentials if you're that great...

[@russianroulette715]

Abby confuses me so much she constantly contradicts herself. I cant watch her videos anymore because of the over sensitivity to everyone's feelings. The videos are so long and over explained.

[@inshort6831]

I think it has to do with the fact that she was trained as a dietician and has learned about different weight loss perspectives and will approach each client differently. We can't really generalize specific situations. Ofcourse abbey knows that calories in and out are what makes you lose weight. She just adjusts her messaging to her audience. She doesn't want to promote obsession with calorie counting because a lot of her demographic might struggle with that

[@amy_ambrosio]

I think it's just something different than what u need and that's ok, not everyone are the same. I think the main reason why Abbey is so cautious at times, it's because she knows she has a lot of viewers that had ED or are struggling with diet culture, their bodies in an unhealthy and cruel way, etc. In a lot of her videos there are always people talking about that and how those long videos/sometimes shorter are helping them in their recovery journey or how they find it surprising now that they're not struggling with it anymore. I understand povs like Unnatural Vegan's, Doctor Mike's, etc., but everyone has different needs and need different approachments because of that; maybe there are times when we just need facts, or others when we need something more empathic, etc.

[@victoriamckenzie6352]

She continuously panders and tried to please everybody and it comes off as being disingenuous.

[@marybishop6105]

I agree. This may be small but one time she had her mic on her necklace and it kept messing up her audio. In the description of her video she said “sorry the audio is so bad my audio engineer tried his best but post production messed up” or some bull shit. No girl, your necklace was around your mic which was messing up the mic, BE REAL TELL THE TRUTH.

[@SparklesNJazz]

i agree with you but also kind of get Abbey. i think it’s her personality type. she’s a very nuanced person, which i tend to be myself. people probably think i contradict myself all the time too but it’s bcuz i can understand multiple sides of an issue and drive myself crazy trying to justify and communicate that i understand them all. i think Abbey just wants to help people rather than hurt them but i do agree that she should probably rebrand herself as someone who focuses on disordered eating or more of a therapist type.

[@JennRighter]

Waiting to see Unnatural Vegan react to Obese to Beast reacting to Unnatural Vegan reacting to Abbey Sharp reacting to Doctor Mike. I’m both joking and completely serious 🤣

[@adt4025]

🤣

[@rickwrites2612]

lol nah I want to see a 5th tuber analyse this vid haha

[@lindsaymcdonald58]

Full disclosure, I am a dietitian. I agree with Intuitive Eating, yet I find I agree with things said by both "sides." The reason why dietitians don't typically recommend behaviors considered extreme or unsustainable is because most people (read: not all) eventually become tired of the desired behavior and follow their instincts, which if restricting certain foods or calories can lead to binging. I've seen it play out a million times. I don't know if Unnatural Vegan has read the Intuitive Eating book (I used to watch her videos but had to stop as they got too negative/toxic for me and for my own sanity I took a break) but I feel she has made a bit of a straw man out of Intuitive Eating. It's not intended to mean "yeah go ahead eat all you want or crave or feel like eating all the time." In fact, "gentle nutrition" is one of the main tenants of the intuitive eating framework, and is something that Abbey has spoken about across numerous videos. Practically speaking, gentle nutrition means focusing on incorporating health-promoting, balanced nutrition into your life. Intuitive eating is a BALANCE. And for those without a history of disordered eating, some restriction in the name of "gentle nutrition" for health purposes is totally fine! My husband personally is a fan of meal plans and portion sizes as guidance, but I should also note that prior to meeting me he struggled with his weight and felt he NEEDED portion sizes and meal plans because he had lost the ability to listen to his body's hunger and fullness cues (another thing that intuitive eating promotes, and what I'm assuming Obese to Beast also means by "mindful eating.") I feel there is a lot of nuance here that gets missed in videos like the ones reviewed here.

[@paige2567]

I really like UV but she so obviously hates abbey sharp and it’s kinda frustrating that she treats abbey much tougher than she treats the men reviewed... abbey did a huge disclaimer in the video and comments and UV ignores it

[@Psychwriteify]

Yeah, I don't watch her anymore. I just occasionally check in to see if she's done anything in regards to un-shitting the bed on BLM and she really looks like she's trying to start beef with Abby Sharpe.

[@c.crawford408]

She 100% does. I've stopped watching her at this point, but she seems to come across as really disliking Abbey and also as one of these "I don't have female friends because they are so dramatic" type personalities where she constantly sides with and goes easy on men, but never on women, it seems.

[@MissPinkyLover101]

I think it’s because Abbey’s a nutritionist so people look at her as a qualified person to seek advice from and so when she’s being sketchy and spreading misinformation, she has to be called out. UV initially defended Abbey, I don’t think it’s her gender. Abbey has gotten sketchier and sketchier as her views started to go up and she started making a lot of money.

[@anadavalos3212]

@@c.crawford408 ughhh. Yes, I know. My last straw with her was her video on justifying cheating 🤦🏽‍♀️

[@phatpharm06]

@@anadavalos3212 when I watched it it felt like she was trying to justify something or someone in her life and brining it to the masses. It felt personal to her and explaining her giving someone close to her an excuse for going outside of a committed relationship and the other person being upset. Just my opinion and vibes I got from it.

[@emaliemorelos7235]

As a psychology grad and someone who strives to be in a mental health profession, internal biases are 100% real. Even when it comes to body weight. It’s a natural process of the brain to categorize everything we experience so because we live in a world where a socially desirable body is smaller, your brain will fixate on what is considered abnormal, being someone overweight, and that fact will stick out in your mind.

[@positivelydj]

You are rocking that tank top and that facial hair is on point! Also, I like your view on intuitive eating vs mindful eating. Sweets are definitely a battle I face as well!

[@emilydurkee8664]

I've watched mike's, abbie's and unnatural's videos, and now all of John's video. I need to find a new hobby

[@tbaby3631]

Same

[@elisabethtuuling-askforema1940]

Start making them :D

[@umquaseeu]

Same.. and I'm waiting for the follow up

[@inessimoes9033]

I unconsciously do "intuitive" eating because I grew up with healthy eating habits, healthy portion sizes, etc. I don't count calories but I know that I need to avoid too much sugar, add vegetables to my diet, etc etc. I know that I can't eat fast food and cake every day, and my weight is almost always the same for the past 9 years (between 55 and 57kg - I'm 1,63 m and 23 years old). Not everyone, specially people with bad eating habits, can eat whatever, whenever, just because their body "tells" them to. First develop a healthy relationship with food, explore your body, how your emotions affect your cravings, etc, and them sure, try intuitive eating

[@lindseyvaiciulis1660]

YES !!! As someone who also eats intuitively it is so important to have an education and a healthy realtionship to food to be able to be successful!

[@piau1798]

This sounds exactly like my story, and I’m so so grateful for my parents raising me that way! I think it’s so much easier than having to overcome unhealthy things you’ve learned or adapted growing up, having to actively challenge and restart your relationship with food. I consider it a huge privilege really

[@miaomiaou_]

I stopped watching Unnatural Vegan over her stance on BLM, but I still appreciate her no-nonsense approach when it comes to these matters.

[@Eliz279009]

Same.

[@lc4404]

Same

[@shadowcastprime2100]

What's her view? I don't really watch her

[@angie8110]

That and the cheating vid 😬

[@shadowcastprime2100]

@@angie8110 I'm lost😅

[@scfeng6883]

I feel like a lot of the vitriol against Abbey comes from ignoring that her advice is. It's not for the general public, it’s for people who are especially susceptible to diet culture (typically young women who may develop EDs or diordered eating trying to emulate influencers). And given Dr. Mike’s status as a famous, hot doctor, lots of women prone to disordered eating are watching him and listening to him, so I think it’s fair for Abbey to say, “Hey, his advice is not for you” to the overlap in their audiences. Just feel like being down on Abbey for not being universal is like, using an extreme example, screaming “all lives matter.” Some of us need to understand it’s not always about us.

[@inshort6831]

I wish I saw abbeys videos when I was trying to lose weight when i was 18. I was panicking so much about tracking calories.

[@scfeng6883]

@@inshort6831 right. Her advice is not for losing weight, it’s about being mindful if you’re taking weight loss to an extreme.

[@Isabella-ij7mb]

I was a huge fan of unnatural vegan for a very long time, but her defensiveness around the Black Lives Matter criticism she received was thinly disguised as “intellectual and rational” when in reality it was pretentious and largely motivated by her own biases that she fails to acknowledge. She is smart as hell and seems to have amazing intentions, but it seems like she really struggles to grapple with problems surrounding race and scapegoats random people on the internet’s butchered interpretation of critical race studies to discredit the entire body of work.

[@xoxoxochicago]

Yup completely agree. I miss watching her videos but as a Black woman I cannot support her anymore.

[@ObesetoBeast]

Understandable. I don’t watch most of her content, so I was surprised by the end of her video.

[@Isabella-ij7mb]

Omg hi john you’re my favorite youtuber lol

[@ObesetoBeast]

Lol, hello!

[@christina7454]

Used to support her on patreon and I can't even give her views anymore. :( She speaks very eloquently which makes you think she's well educated on a topic (and I believe that to be the case when it comes to vegan nutrition, effective vegan advocacy etc) but when it comes systemic racism, social justice and other issues she doesn't seem to look beyond her own privilege and biases and claims she follows the science (kind of like when she was raw she wrote a whole book about how raw veganism is supported by science with cherrypicked and misquoted evidence)

[@vulpixelful]

While I respect Unnatural Vegan's position on sponsorships, I do find the holier-than-thou attitude about not taking them a bit of a turn-off. Like good for you, you can afford to not take them? Then again, I also believe in some consumer responsibility to be informed about what is advertised, so I don't believe it's any individual creator's job to protect me from everything 🤷🏾‍♀️

[@fuzzycatbutts]

Abby could also afford not to take sponsorships for brands that go against what she preaches. UV isn't any more privileged. Looking at their stats, Abby makes plenty of money. There's really no excuse for her hypocrisy.

[@benamitchell]

I think I prefer calling them "treat meals" as opposed to "cheat meals." It implies that its something perhaps out of the ordinary in terms of what you usually eat(hence the fact that it is a treat), but it doesn't come with all the other baggage(for lack of a better term) often associated with calling the meal a "cheat" i.e. the fact that you are doing something bad or wrong by enjoying that meal.

[@qualifiedarmchaircritic]

That's a great idea, I think I'll adopt that too! If I'm gonna treat myself I want to be able to enjoy myself not shame myself

[@benamitchell]

@@qualifiedarmchaircritic exactly!

[@melovekittie]

Wait I actually genuinely love this idea! This is so smart

[@Tina06019]

Hey, Unnatural Vegan, please don’t encourage all older doctors to retire! We are understaffed in hospitals right now because of COVID-19. You are right that the generation of doctors before us were more likely to think weight loss was a “simple” thing and some were downright rude (or dismissive) to obese people. But there’s more to medicine than obesity and nutrition, and we still need those older doctors!

[@CasuallyGaming123]

As someone who often over-qualifies statements, I've found the phrase "in general" to be very helpful. In general, peanuts are healthy. Meaning that generally, peanuts are healthy, however, there are specific circumstances where this isn't the case. This qualification is implicit in the phrase "In general, peanuts are healthy." It's not a cure-all for speech and there are some people that will try to nit-pick nonetheless, however as a general-use speech item I find it helpful.

[@Dinomater_]

I agree with most of what unnatural vegan said. But it got kinda uncomfortable to watch when she started bringing up racism, when she didn't want to support blm a while back. Idk, I haven't watched her since then, so I don't know if her views have changed

[@maddies194]

Lol two weeks ago she tweeted that women shouldn't be surprised if their husbands cheat if they aren't providing sexual relief for their men. So... she's still got some shitty hot takes.

[@minchen3171]

@@maddies194 omg... I now way I unsubscribe. She is... just awful in some ways.

[@gabriellagulyas3778]

@@maddies194 lol I scrolled down in her twitter feed to find this, this is a mess lol

[@Psychwriteify]

@@maddies194 That's a take that I did not expect from her...

[@George-bb9kr]

That girl seems based.

[@orangeswild3699]

I lost all respect for him when he partied on a boat last month, with tons of maskless people for his birthday.

[@dontaskdonttell_]

Get a life

[@orangeswild3699]

@@dontaskdonttell_ Follow your own advice 😆

[@dontaskdonttell_]

@@orangeswild3699 I'm not the one with a stick up my ass holding a grudge against someone I dont know😂😂

[@orangeswild3699]

@@dontaskdonttell_ I know you like him and that's why your offended for him. To me though, his hypocrisy just isn't an attractive trait, but for you it must be a big plus.

[@marthecorne9597]

who? mike or obese2b

[@A88-p5e]

I agreed with a lot of what she said but I definitely disagree with her sentiments on internalised racism. Like John said, this can't be equated with fatphobia first of all. But also these biases that are internalised in itself means they are usually unconscious, and they are often present in people of that race itself! One doesn't just go "okay I'm not racist now". It can take years and years to realise your unconscious biases and change your internalised thoughts that you never even realised were inherently racist and oppressive. That's the point of it being "internalised". I'm mixed race asian and for half my life, living in a systematically preferentially white society I had horrible internalised racism. I grew up only wanting to identify with my white side, wishing I had euro-centric features, idolising only white people and thinking that my minority race was ugly because that's what the media and society was telling me. Did I at all think I was racist during that time? No, because it was INTERNALISED. It took me an extremely long time (about 2 years out of high school) to come to terms with the fact that I should be proud to be asian too and that it was in a fact a lack of representation that was making me feel this way, not because it was actually true. It might be easy for a liberal white person to say "I'm not racist now" because that has no effect on their identity - even if they originally had biases, to now not be racist matches up with their beliefs and outlooks on the world. For others, not so much! While the scale is different, I would say this could also apply to fatphobia too. We grow up in a society that condemns "fat" and of which the beauty standard is always "thin" - I would say there are lots of people who might not consciously be aware of their fatphobic thoughts (including "fat" or obese people too) who do have to acknowledge their biases and change their frame of thought. And this too, obviously takes time because all of the information you might've once thought correct must be changed thought by thought. Internalised does not equal overt racism or fatphobia.

[@theshunnedBandersnatch]

Beautifully explained!

[@basshead7171]

I'm glad someone voiced this in the comments - I think it's a major disservice to oversimplify racism in the manner she did. By that logic, losing weight would be "easy" too (just don't eat too much). Dismissing things that are internalized can create blind spots in our own thoughts & actions.

[@booksiswhatilove]

Why can she do the research on weight loss cycles but not internalized racism and unconscious biases??!! Simply saying ‘stop being racist’ is as nonsensical as telling someone who is obese to simply just “stop eating too much.” Like does she know what racism is and how internalized biases work or...? Don’t bring up stuff you haven’t done the research on, or you’re just being straight up hypocritical when you’re criticizing someone else for that same thing in the same video.

[@ga2781]

Thanks for expressing this so eloquently. I find it interesting that UV criticises Abbey Sharp for not learning from the Greg Doucette uproar but on the other hand, there is huge resistance on her side to learn more regarding internalised racism/fat phobia. It annoys me that people keep comparing the two - they are different concepts and experiences. But just to say "stop doing something" is unhelpful and unrealistic, and we can't move forward unless we are willing to examine our own cognitive biases and behaviours

[@thedorkettereads6052]

I stopped watching UV when she put her foot in her mouth over BLM during the George Floyd protests. She basically complained about people asking her to cover BLM on KZbin, and called activists asking white allies to make space for black activists (and telling white allies not to talk over black activists) racist.

[@Bellethiele]

I've dropped 19 kg so far with "intuitive eating". Sadly, most people don't realize they have to fix their mind in order for this to work. You have to find what's making you overeat, work on that and only then, you can trust yourself around food again.

[@martinabaldassi80]

So true

[@JennRighter]

Dr. Mike is so attractive it’s almost irritating, lol. And he’s super tall, like 6’3”. I think the same about many other people, Michelle McDaniel for instance. I love her. But I’m like, how tf are you so damn pretty, lol?!

[@JennRighter]

Also, I’m 5’8” and my boyfriend is 5’11”. I’m not height biased AT ALL. It would just be nice to wear heels and not be taller than most dudes is all.

[@Lee_lee_27_7_27]

Height biased? Are all preferences now biases?

[@raebsen]

@@Lee_lee_27_7_27 yes. Is this is new news to you? I.e. saying you like roses is directly saying you hate all other flowers. Welcome to the internet.

[@JennRighter]

@@raebsen thanks for answering. Everything has to be explained. A lot of men feel women are dismissive of average height or short men. I felt the need to explain myself because of that. Also, I’m tall. A solid 4 inches taller than the average woman. I’m explaining even more, too much. You get it. (Also, my brother is 6’7”, my sister and niece are 5’11”, my sister-in-law is 5’10”-we’re a tall group.)

[@Lee_lee_27_7_27]

@@raebsen I was being sarcastic. It's the stupidest thing I've ever heard, to call preferences, biases. If I am straight, I'm biased? If I'm gay, am I biased? Idiotic, really. And people should spew these dumb, nonsensical ideas

[@comingupdaysy]

One small point - the assertion that you can eat healthy and cheaply and therefore your income does not have to control whether your diet is healthy or not - is not accurate. There are many factors that affect how healthy a person eats for low income individual and families. From the perspective of someone who has worked with low income communities - food deserts, transportation difficulties, lack of time (two jobs and three kids can really cut into your healthy food prep time) and other factors can ABSOLUTELY make it much harder to both eat healthy and feed your family healthy and nutritious foods. When we still have areas in this country where the incomes are so low and the circulation of $$ is hardly present - places that rely on a partial barter economy - there feeding a family healthy meals can be extremely difficult and is absolutely limited by ones income. Junk food or cheap food - bulk starches and carbohydrates and cheap fatty proteins as opposed to fruit and veg - are more easily accessible, cheaper and can be less time-consuming - something important for those working multiple jobs and/or having odd hours. There is a lot more that can be done both by state and local government and federally to help low-income families improve healthcare outcomes including healthier eating - but to put the blame on low income individuals for not eating healthier because is cruel.

[@nhoabrisk1846]

I lost around 40 pounds doing intuitive eating. It wasn't about giving into my cravings whenever they appear, but about learning to listen to my body. After years of restrictions and following diets, this helped me build a better relationship with food and eat when I was actually hungry (surprise, it didn't happen that often!). I will admit that, at a certain point, I had to count macros and exercise hard to keep on losing weight.

[@alassolqueiroz1837]

Why did she bring the BLM into this? Ugh, girl.

[@xoxoxochicago]

Even though I have issues with UV, she was spot on here. Great video as usual John!

[@beachnachos]

Wait, what has UV done?? Have I missed anything big

[@gabriellagulyas3778]

@@beachnachos somebody in the comments said something about her problematic statements of BLM but I'm not too sure what that means exactly

[@felicitychermaine]

@@beachnachos she basicially said that internalized racism doesn’t excist and she made a BLM video ( haven’t seen them ) and people in the comments are saying she doesn’t even want to listen to constructive criticism under that video.

[@mak3960]

@@felicitychermaine IMO she doesn’t listen to most constructive criticism. However I haven’t watched in several years now because I had issue with a video on invasive species where she said there’s nothing wrong with them which is not backed by science at all and many people (myself included) pointed this out and then in her next video she said something along the lines of ‘please be nice to me my dad reads the comments’ and I had to nope out after that

[@fuzzycatbutts]

@@mak3960 The "please be nice" thing wasn't in response to criticism, it was in response to some comments calling her some really vulgar things...

[@Aleera616]

So here is the thing about "Intuitive eating" and why I don't like the term being thrown around so much: Intuitive eating can be fantastic if you know the difference between when you are hungry and when you crave food for another reason. And I think many people can achieve that level of self awareness. BUT there are completely different paths people have to take to get there. Someone who has a restrictive eating disorder needs to take completely different steps than someone with a binge eating disorder. The problem with Abbey Sharp is that she uses a lot of rethoric that is used in therapy for people with anorexia or other restrictive eating disorders and then she applies them to everyone. The "health at every size/body positivity movement" does the same and in an even more extreme way. It's not only stupid to throw terms like that around without context, it's downright dangerous. I see this a lot with these modern social justice "movements" who use A LOT of "big words" like sociological or medical terms just to sound smart. It's downright insulting, stupid and does more harm than good. I think Abbey Sharp knows this by now and has since said some things about how calorie counting etc can be helpful for obese people. I think it's good that she aknowledges her mistakes somewhat but it's still such a big red flag for me to see such complex things as "intuitive eating" being used as a "one size fits all" solution for everyone. EDIT: I also think that intuitive eating shouldn't be the ultimate goal for everyone. Some people will never be able to do it and that's okay too. Health should be the most important thing and informing people on different ways to be the healthiest they can be. Everyone who promotes one single method of achieving health is a scam. The only person who can tell YOU how to be YOUR healthiest self is a doctor. And for some people intuitive eating isn't part of that health journey. For example: I currently need to monitor my food to eat enough and idk if that will ever change because I take meds that surpress my hunger.

[@rebeccashields9626]

THIS. Binge eating disorder and anorexia are two different diseases and are treated differently. I am a binge eater. I can’t “intuitively eat”. I “intuitively eat”. A half a pan of brownies and a bag of Cheetos. I have to count calories in order to maintain a healthy weight.

[@annad.3201]

Exactly, thank you! 🙏🏻 I have nothing to add

[@MissCaraMint]

The thing is though that right now I’m just not getting that hungry feeling, so if I were to intuitively eat I just wouldn’t. As it is I try to work out a scedual so I get the nutrition that I need. The weird thing is I do really like food and cooking.

[@Aleera616]

@@MissCaraMint I know what you mean and that's why I said that only "many people" can achieve intuitive eating and not "all people" because I think that for some people "intuitive eating" isn't even an option ever or only happens after years and years. I'm currently recovering from anorexia and I'm on adhd meds and I also can't intuitively eat so I feel you

[@MissCaraMint]

@@Aleera616 Oh I’m sorry we In Norway have a habbit of sometimes starting asentence with a negative when we actually agree with you and want to support the point you’re making. I forgett English doesn’t do that.

[@JiraiyaSama86]

It brings me joy to know that Obesetobeast is aware of Unnatural Vegan- another YT I'm subbed to. Crossovers are fun.

[@rikketakera]

I watch Abbey because she is the only KZbin dietician I can handle watching as a former bulimic. Her content genuinely helps me so much when I can feel myself slipping. I love unnatural vegans content, but her ability to stay super rational makes me feel awful for being “weak” and in my feelings, lol.

[@dejstoney]

Yes about unnatural vegan, I’m glad I was not the only one who felt this way. Was gonna go crazy until you said the same thing.

[@heyman.9668]

I love how much of a man crush he has on Dr. Mike🤣

[@jasonprevo2161]

One point I have to disagree with. As a person that has switched from a largely processed foods diet to a whole foods diet. Whole foods are more expensive. I eat less but I'm spending the same if not more of my groceries.. straight up.. and I'm getting the cheaper meats.. I couldn't imagine trying to eat ethical meat or chicken not submerged in sodium...

[@taekwoonhakyeon8700]

I really appreciated how you tried to understand each point. I found both Abby and unnatural vegan took points out of context just to disagree or talk about a different point. They were kinda frustrating and this video was refreshing

[@leann7859]

Yes, being **fat phobic** and having **implicit biases** about larger individuals are two different things!! Everyone has implicit biases and they should be identified and acknowledged so we don’t unknowingly act upon them! Implicit biases are natural and inevitable, and they don’t make you a bad person!

[@tiff75]

I'm a type 2 diabetic. A keto lifestyle works for me so I don't have to go on insulin and I've lost 130 lbs as a result. I don't try to preach to other diabetics about it though because I know how hard it can be to keep to this lifestyle.

[@emilydurkee8664]

I've been doing keto for a while, fo you have main meals or easy foods you would recommend?

[@tiff75]

@@emilydurkee8664 I usually have a protein with low carb vegetables in general during the week while I'm working. Something I can just put in the oven. If I'm splurging on the weekends I usually do a pizza with a fathead dough. Its not low calorie so I'll pair it with a salad.

[@tiff75]

@@emilydurkee8664 also I do only eat two meals a day with one snack if im still hungry. It helps with my sugar levels.

[@angeknowsit]

not only that if you have a high fat diet in can be tough for your liver, specially if you are a heavy drinker or have other medical conditions that requires you to take medicine wich is procesed by the liver. Im happy it works for you but I would also be mindful of that.

[@tiff75]

@@angeknowsit I get full bloodwork with an A1c every 6 months. Plus I eat lean meats and use almond milk. I do use whipped cream on my mug cakes lol. I try to stay low calorie as much as possible now that my blood sugar is under control. Its important to look at all aspects.

[@loiracitr]

I find half of what she says wrong for a very simple reason: Abbey Sharp has a specific type of follower. pleople with eating disorders. All her videos are tailored around them... It doesn't seem like a difficult concept to grasp

[@XX-xq2rx]

Abbey's type of follower are deluded people that want an excuse to blame their problems on a million different excuses and not take personal responsibility for their life.

[@loiracitr]

@@XX-xq2rx that is a lovely take on people with eating disorders and eating disorder survivors. Not everyone's problem is obesity

[@anareis8770]

counting macros definitely steered me away from an ED. I would eat as little as possible and as low cal as possible so that I could binge on weekends and late-night takeaway. I even started considering the purging phase. With counting macros, I can fit anything I want and desire into my day without it affecting my weight, while also making sure I get the 5 a day portions and enough protein. It's life-changing.

[@jennah192]

Intuition is built on repetitive behavior. If your diet is really unhealthy it's not just gonna change magically when you decide to start "intuitive eating". When you sustain a generally healthy diet for a long time you eat intuitively pretty healthy.

[@saraht3196]

ugh, i have so many complicated feelings about pretty much everyone in this video. i stopped watching swayze in june (re: blm) and dr. mike recently (re: rona behavior) and i've been considering unsubscribing from abbey bc i'm kind of in the middle of her and john and i just don't connect with it as much anymore. idk it's just kinda a mess imo

[@xosecox12]

@@hiruki8 as a white woman, it’s appalling she would try to act like she could understand the experience of internalized racism.

[@felicitychermaine]

@@hiruki8 she also told Black people who came with their own experiences that they are not smart enough to understand why she is right. And like 2 weeks ago she also said sum bullshit on her Twitter ( wives shouldn’t be surprised that their husband cheats if they don’t provide sexual relief their husband want ) something like that. Her food stances are way better then FreeLee and people like that but I think she should stick to that.. cause I see so many people saying they unsubbed after that

[@Becky0494]

@@felicitychermaine she explains the whole cheating in much more depth in one of her videos. I think people really don’t understand marriage/strong relationships very well if they think ignoring a legitimate need from their partner (male or female) leads to a healthy relationship 🤷‍♀️ at that point it’s about so much more than just desiring sex, but it leads to things like low self esteem and resentment which can lead to someone seeking solace in another person outside of their monogamous relationship... to put it in a nutshell. Communication is key!!!

[@Becky0494]

@@felicitychermaine obviously there are terrible people who don’t care about their partners and demand things in an unfair way, but that’s not every person. I would encourage you to read more about this topic because it’s much more complicated than the general public makes it seem.

[@chelsealiddypivtorak9282]

@@felicitychermaine I totally unsubbed after the BLM nonsense, and the more recent BS you bring up about cheating makes me even happier that I did! Even watching this vid, I was like ok she makes some good points but then at the end she triples down on institutional racism not being real. So nuts! She really reminds me to take folks' advice and thoughts on YT with a grain of salt, considering she doesn't even have any health credentials.

[@SHurd-rc2go]

Someone gave me a homemade loaf of bread. I had to stop myself eating half of it in one day. Still 5' 7"; still 130 lbs; still 85 years old. Best wishes to all for a healthy 2021.

[@rileyallen489]

As someone who is in recovery from an eating disorder and is currently re-learning how to eat (a lot of it is intuitive eating stuff in my case but it's super complicated and no one has the time), it's so weird to hear this stuff talked about like it's a diet. What I've been learning is telling the difference between "I am hungry, I should eat." and "I want cake, I should eat the entire cake." But also in that vein, you have to learn to listen when your body is saying, "HEY I'm hungry, please feed me" because to me, that feels similar to the cake thing.

[@catsdumbbells6902]

One thing Unnatural Vegan got wrong, besides the internalised racism, is eating disorders ARE common. In Australia, it’s estimated that over 16% struggle with eating disorders and disordered eating. In the US, the statistics suggested at least 9% have eating disorders (not including people who don’t get help and those who have disordered eating (rather than eating disorders)). That’s a lot of people. Source: ANAD and NEDC

[@kathryntubridypakenham2743]

Omg 'I don't even agree with everything I say because I'm a dummy' I feel that sentence so hard (not just about health) XD

[@raylinmae297]

I like UV. I can also be objective enough to understand she has a tendency to be overtly Biased and throw in some arrogance to her opinions. This one seemed to be balanced enough. I think UV and Abbey have their faults and their positives. It's kinda awesome it's like they're fallible humans who aren't always right. That being said UV and Mike have crossed the barriers of 'unpopular opinion' to 'harmful actions.' Like going out on a pandemic as a doctor. or some really harmful opinions on BLM.

[@victoriaparsons3684]

Internalized racism is so much different. As an asian american i deal with it in a much different sense. where for me it manifests as thinking im not as good looking as my white ocunterparts due to the racism against asians.

[@miaomiaou_]

Agree. I think Unnatural Vegan probably hasn’t realized her own biases if she thinks it’s that easy to turn it off.

[@JennyCThree]

I would assume dieticians probably have access to behavioural data that helps inform their broader recommendations. Lots of healthcare recs are based on what is sustainable for patients to comply with long term.

[@BellClan37]

Ooo yes, Mindful Eating sounds much much better for me than Intuitive Eating

[@kjaime7030]

As I was saying earlier, the criticism that Abbey needs to recognize that people are responsible for their behavior and are in control of their weight by reducing their caloric surplus--all facts BUT Abbey is focused on the people she sees as her clients, or are more likely to have disorders and have some sort of dysfunctional approach to eating, so it's harder for them than the "average" person to follow normal diet and adopt healthier habits because every time they slip up and binge or obsess about cheat days or what have you, their negative self-talk is going to be much more egregious and downward-spiraling that that of the average person. So Abbey is simply trying to keep the LANGUAGE about eating so that it's as positive as possible. David Goggins is going to say, "NO. Sometimes you have to look at yourself and say, "I'm fucking FAT" and move on. Abbey knows that many of her patients who follow that sort of advice will probably end up a hundred pounds heavier in a year instead of 50 pounds lighter.

[@inshort6831]

Absolutely, i wish I had her videos around 7 years ago when I was struggling with restriction

[@theboringkaren]

I tried intuitive eating at one point, believing what people said about it, and of course it didn't work for me because I'm an emotional binge eater who, at that time, had not addressed this problem and the reasons why I was binge eating. And calorie counting has been great for me. Once upon a time I was obsessive with it, but I had to change my perspective and reasons for tracking calories.

[@UncleMikeDrop]

Non-GMO is a nonsensical concept because the vast majority of so called "organic" food stuffs are in some way, genetically modified. Just because they weren't literally modified in a lab under controlled conditions doesn't mean their genomes weren't modified at some point.

[@talkingturtle2641]

GMO crops are directly linked to cancer

[@JennRighter]

@@talkingturtle2641 show the evidence. You’re wrong.

[@snouty9017]

Any plant breeding is "genetic modification". Have you ever seen teosinte? A bit different from vorn, isn't it? 7000 years of breeding aka as genomic modification.

[@booksiswhatilove]

Damn such a good point. How does Whole Foods deal with this?

[@fridasolberg6127]

@@booksiswhatilove mö

[@leamentzoni1846]

an important thing to keep in mind, all these youtubers have different target audiences. They are all valuable to some but not to all. I actually find myself benefiting from quite a few of them in different ways. So I think that is important to focus on when disagreeing and agreeing with some of them. Sometimes I find these types of videos to lack nuance, not this one specifically but in general. Everyone in this group seems to be quite focused on their subjective point of view, which makes sense, but shouldn't lead them to disregard someone else's subjective point of view. Which normally is just as valid.

[@EllieofAzeroth]

I love Dr. Mike tbh, people aren't perfect. He's bound to do some things now and then that people won't be 100% pleased with

[@saladflambe1747]

Me: I'll just start this video while I get ready for bed & finish it tomorrow. Also Me: *Watches entire video & suddenly it's an hour past my bedtime*

[@ObesetoBeast]

I am here to help

[@alexgattelaro1118]

To be fair tho disordered eating is pretty common, as a lot of disordered eating behaviors are considered to be socially acceptable- it’s only when those disordered behaviors become a diagnosable ED that they become unacceptable, which is a bit odd imo

[@rebeccashields9626]

Binge eating and being overweight is FAR more common though. A thousand times over. 70% of the adult population is overweight. I don’t know what the prevalence of anorexia & bulimia in the US is but it’s not 7/10 people. Being overweight increases your risk of heart disease, diabetes, stroke, cancer, arthritis, the list goes on and on.

[@zixelation9251]

38:00 For Abbey to go from “Behavior change is the answer” to saying “low adherence isn’t fair” is extremely backwards. Because adherence IS behavior change.

[@Aceofwolves]

And she thinks "adherence" means motivation.... No adherence means DOING SOMETHING...aka AN ACTION Many people or motivated to get off drugs but without intervention and rehab... It's not gonna happen

[@xosecox12]

Am I the only ”normal” (aka anti Freelee) vegan who doesn't like Unnatural Vegan at all? I find her so condescending and I can't get through most of her videos. I align with her pro-science views, but she's so rude and has downplayed racism as not being an issue. I don't get why people like her so I would like to know why people do to help my understanding

[@bigmass4792]

You can agree with her on veganism and disagree with her on racism/blm... Nobody is perfect, make your own judgement.

[@TuesdaysArt]

I don't like her either, her takes on autism and capitalism are additional turn offs for me.

[@ghillies4life]

I'm not a vegan, and I disagree with her on a lot of things (agree on some things). But I watch her because she stretches me to think about things in a way I usually wouldn't. And I think that's something people should make a habit of doing: listening to rational, opposing viewpoints on the regular.

[@madimorie]

this!! i can’t stand her at all and tbh at this point i can’t watch most vegan youtubers anymore, they’re just so condescending and rude most of the time. i only watch vegan recipe youtubers now like avantgardevegan or hot for food

[@thebowandbullet]

A lot of people have the attitude that 'X worked for me, therefore it'll work for everyone', or 'If I can do Y, so can anyone', but that's simply not true.

[@emmanilsson2604]

So I lost a bit of weight a while back and I'm struggling to put it back on. At my lowest point I was about 47kgs (I'm 170cm tall) and it was never due to an ED. It was a physical reaction to any meal, halfway through I'd feel like I was going to vomit and I'd be unable to finish the meal. I'm also lazy and sloppy when it comes to making food so I ended up eating once or twice a day and because of that I lost weight. My oldest sister, who's a nurse, says I'm "sick in the head" to to think that my body is "good looking" (which I don't even think, lol. I want to gain weight, it's just hard) and she claims I have an ED..... Which I don't. I spent 28h at work this weekend and I've done nothing but eat lol. But people will jump to conclusions and sometimes won't trust the truth if it means they're wrong.... Stop apologizing for your choices and reasons, it's nobody's business but yours. You know your truth and it doesn't matter what others claim is true.

[@rebeccashields9626]

If you have a physical need to vomit while eating before you have eaten enough you may have a problem with acid reflux, esophageal stenosis, or some other GI issue. I would definitely ask your doc about it. Sometimes they are quick to say it’s an ED but if you are physically feeling nauseated and vomiting it could be a medical issue not a psychological one.

[@angeknowsit]

I agree with Rebecca, it can be a GI problem.

[@emmanilsson2604]

@@rebeccashields9626 I don’t have any issues with eating anymore, I never felt nauseous when this happened (just to clarify). It was just like eating something with a weird texture that you really don’t like and feeling a need to spit it out or gag/vomit. But it’s all gone now and I can eat like a horse 😁 thank you for your comment and I’ll be sure to contact my doctor if it starts happening again!

[@TheMightyOdin]

I’m down 128 pounds since Jan 22nd.

[@lifu._]

Congratulations. Keep working hard

[@Andrea-dv9gl]

I dont even thing she's "going hard" she's being super rational

[@livics610]

You mean condescending and ignorant? 🙄

[@Andrea-dv9gl]

@@livics610 nope, just as I said in my previous comment

[@lizcarr6329]

I struggle a lot with intuitive eating too bc while I reallllyyyyy want to believe that my body knows what it needs... she also likes sweets too much to be trusted to just “eat what feels right”. I’ve watched videos about people who had disordered eating patterns that have done “all in” diets or started “intuitive eating” and they gained weight which is great bc a lot of these people needed to have that freedom to allow themselves to gain the weight their body needed. But I was 225 lbs at my highest weight. And if I ate what I wanted all the time I would be back to 225 in a heartbeat bc that’s what I did when I was 225 lbs. that’s why I don’t like when health professionals market just one type of lifestyle for everyone bc that’s not how it works. I have a degree in health, have taken nutrition courses, and am a vegan lol so I know that not everyone can eat the same or use the same tools to eat healthily. There are a lot of unhealthy diet tropes but it’s laughable to assume that everyone’s metabolism can support them eating whatever they want and however much they want all the time.

[@lizcarr6329]

@SomethingReallyStrange I tried intuitive eating for about 2 years a few years back and all it resulted in for me was major weight gain and feeling bad about myself. I have never been a tiny person I’m nearly 5’9” and was extremely overweight as a child. I am at a healthy weight for my height now and I think it’s okay for me to not want to go back to being overweight. It’s great that this way of eating works for some people but it’s not a be all end all.

[@0MelleJune0]

Intuitive eating is more complicated than "eat when you want what you want" actually, it's a whole process.

[@lizcarr6329]

@@0MelleJune0 doesn’t change that it’s a process that might not work for everyone

[@iamsureiwillforgrt]

One difference between Abby Sharp and Unatural Vegan is that Abby is a medical/allied health professional. She is a licensed practitioner. Of course her food terminology may be different considering the population that she serves under her care. Being on a KZbin platform she has contradicted herself a time of two. But, she has posted follow up videos addressing those issues. She is not all nothing or right about everything. Still to me she at least seems sane, rational, and responsible most of the time.

[@captainkate7240]

I love the baby Yoda in the background nice touch !!!

[@Undeadharpie]

I like that term mindful eating. I don't watch UV anymore, but she made some good criticisms of intuitive eating

[@Lililililili333]

Her source is from 2016... 4 years ago. I’m not saying it’s wrong, because I don’t know, but she tried to prove Abby wrong by reading an *extract* from ONE paper from 2016

[@ashleymoore9138]

It feels like the bulk of Abbey’s content is qualifications. “That’s not to say..” “although...” “yes, but....” and then follows it with a situation that applies to maybe 2% of the population

[@kristinmclaughlin6207]

ObesetoBeast inspires me so much, I only have about 10kgs to lose but I love watching your videos while I cycle (only 20 mins a day but it's my starting point to a more active life). You are such an inspiration in terms of your own storey but also the way you conduct yourself in these videos!

[@LegallyBoopy]

I also find it obnoxious that she goes off on a rant about picking apart what people are saying rather than respecting the over-arching theme of the message when that's...literally all she did to Abbey throughout the ENTIRE video. On Abbey's channel, a lot of her watchers have history with or are currently dealing with disordered eating. She is qualifying the messages of other resources that her audience has asked her about framed in the way that respects the mind of someone with disordered eating. It's not that hard a concept to understand..like at all.

[@gamesaq]

A calorie is not a calorie. Insulin resistance plays a big role in whether you will be able to burn fat or not. If your insulin resistant and drop your calorie intake but keep carbs high, your body will just decrease your BMR to cope even if your at the same weight you started at due to high insulin in the blood. So if your insulin resistant, thing work differently. That's why Keto and fasting work for ppl like that, it corrects insulin resistance

[@sammieq6728]

I just watched ObesetoBeast reacting to Unnatural Vegan reacting to Abbey Sharpe reacting to Dr Mike..... and I loved it

[@LaurenAnne6]

The "Intuitive Eating" discussion reminds me of the conversations I've had with folks about Alcoholics Anonymous. Personally, intuitive eating is helping me not over eat, as does AA help me with my drug addiction and alcoholism (7 years sober), but I have issues with both and do not follow either to a tee. I just take what works and leave the rest.

[@radrose4864]

Another REACTception???!?? What have I done to earn this?

[@AxeKick80]

He’s the dude reacting to the reaction disguised as another reaction 😵

[@zixelation9251]

When I went to a dietician they literally gave me a calorie range and macros. So I get confused where this obsession with intuitive eating is coming from

[@C.L.Hinton]

Y'all are using the term "internalized racism" (and similar terms) incorrectly. Internalized racism occurs when a person of a given race holds negative, racist views regarding *their own race*. And this would also apply to other "internalized" biases, as well. Thus, when an obese person believes that obesity indicates a moral failing, they are suffering from internalized fatphobia. I just think this may help clarify when you run into the terminology in the literature.

[@jAm117799]

I think there’s a huge disconnect of what is meant when we talk obese. There’s ppl who weigh in at a BMI of 30 but that’s not the same as a BMI of 40 or even 35. Weight cycling is unhealthy but when you do get to a certain point you must lose weight in order to actually live but exercise is far more important than focusing solely on weight alone. If you’re within a “healthy BMI” but lazy af you would be at a higher risk of heart disease than someone with an unhealthy BMI, at the lower end, who is physically more fit. There’s been a marked change in obesity studies with many doctors further demarcating obesity into different categories and takes into consideration precomorbility, genetic predispositions etc. So when we talk obese can we at least acknowledge that someone obesity is a pretty broad category?

[@stephaniesalvador9223]

The thing is though that’s the point of intuitive eating is to say no when your body (not your brain) tells you to say no. The point isn’t to keep eating the point is to listen to your body, if you are not hungry but still feel like eating you say no, that is intuitive eating. Unnatural vegan has it wrong here on that point and most people who argue against intuitive eating are also wrong about that point. She is correct in saying abbey shouldn’t have used that sponsor or at least had them change their promo.there are things I disagree with on abbey and some of it on the dr. Mike video but I understand what intuitive eating is and I think applied correctly for the right person it is a good idea. Abbey even says it’s not for everyone funny how all these youtube influencers seem to cut that part out...

[@miduchalan1]

A loose version of intuitive eating is definitely helping me eat less junk food. I've been more aware of if I actually like junk food instead of eating mindlessly because it seems like something I should like, and I've been trying to keep track of how foods make me feel and eat accordingly. For me, restricting does lead to bingeing and giving myself permission to eat whatever I want is making it easier for me to eat less and avoid foods that make me feel bad.

[@drnostalgia1]

She was doing great till the very last part really putting her foot in her mouth talking about racism and racial bias in such simplistic way.

[@idgafcba]

Did anybody notice the body language of the nutritionist in the Abby Sharp vs Amberlynn video? When asked "can people with BED eventually move into intuitive eating?", she said yes whilst emphatically shaking her head NO. Tells me all I needed to know.

[@evanpeterjones]

24:38 "if someone has an eating disorder, they probably shouldn't be watching Dr. Mike" Did she just call him a snack?

[@JWeahkeeFilm]

Oh my gosh. all of you are right to some people some of the time. When I am trying to lose weight and get away from some of my circle’s fear of losing weight, you’ve been what I needed to watch. When I moved into a gentrified neighborhood and couldn’t get meat, I had to watch unnatural vegan. But abbey speaks to me the most overall: I have binge eating disorder and some other under eating habits so finding her videos really helped me to find a balance. Idk it’s like, eat how you want- there’s 7 billion diets out there so just try one that seems doable for you and stock up on the items you like- or don’t, and make the effort to shop every day so you’re excited. Unnatural vegan will say “eggs are unethical” but not that slave labor that sources many plant based foods is unethical, she also apparently doesn’t understand the nuances of racism lol, which is fine, just maybe she should stick to her area of expertise. She’s right a lot of the time but that little bit, “I’m better than that” was pretty revealing on as to how perceives folks she disagrees with. Overall I think Dr. Mike is the winner here 😂 love all of you, happy holidays

[@rvarga7643]

I like the whole conversation about how counting calories isn't going to directly lead to disordered eating. I lost around 35 pounds over quarantine and I did that by tracking the calories and keeping a food journal of what I ate. When I lost my first 5 lbs I told my parents I was counting calories (they have been trying to lose weight and well) and my mom got really upset and starting crying and saying I would have an eating disorder. I think that there should be more content explaining how eating disorders aren't that as common as believed and I think that would make regulating calorie intake seem more acceptable and healthy.