The old NEW Leica M6 - The Good, The Bad and The Bottom Line

[@FredRanger]

What is your take on the launch of that new old friend? Will you buy one? Interested in knowingwhat y'all think!

[@lindanorman2589]

Very pleased with the launch I have the older M6TTL and glad there will be parts available to keep it running.

[@FredRanger]

My thinking also !

[@Photojouralist123]

I've been a Leica user for years, M6, M10, M11 etc and loved chatting with my other Leica buddies. But the company has changed to a more luxury life style brand. Therefore the new M6 is just that at $5300. Getting into the M lens is another matter all together. I've been into Leica stores where the staff have no clue in the Leica products. The M3 was the best M ever made

[@weisserth]

This new "M6" is essentially a MP with a M6 top plate. Otherwise it's more or less the same camera - that's why it costs more or less the same.

[@lovewant]

I’ve been shooting M’s since 1988 - and Leica M’s have always been this expensive. Contax was expensive too, sometimes even more expensive. The build quality and continuous line of repairs back to the barnacks, which has made them luxury items, otherwise you could shoot a Konica rangefinder for a fraction of the cost. But try getting a digital SLR from 15 years ago, its impossible. Perhaps they were more expensive back in the day, if you consider the dollar value back then. I think a lot of people got used to cheap film cameras from 2005 - 2015’ish - Pre-KZbinr hype and social media influencers. Leica have never made cheap cameras and that’s why they are brilliant icons. The guys at my local store are brilliant and very knowledgeable, outside of that there are a lot of specialised re-sellers too you can source too😊

[@shadowblack1987]

What? Iv never seen a Leica store without the staff being extremely knowledgeable. Also a used M6 is 2500-3500 with no history.

[@FredRanger]

Same for me, the Leica Boutique store in Montréal has some of the most knowledgeable Leica specialists I know!

[@StuartWeir]

Fred, my take is this: In Canada, used M6’s are basically selling for $5k now. At that rate, if I could somehow scrounge the additional cash, I’d rather buy a new M6. In fact, it’s why I bought an MP instead (2022 M6 hadn’t been announced or rumoured). As for the cost itself: I’m not really sure what people were expecting. In that Three Blind Men and an Elephant interview mentioned in this video, Andreas openly states that if they wanted to make profit, they wouldn’t have chosen remaking the M6. Look at all the stories of these famous photographers and how they got their Leicas: they bought used, or they bought on a payment plan, or they bought knowing that it was 2-3 months salary. The cost hasn’t ever really changed for these cameras, because they’re all handmade. I sold literally all my other gear minus a Fuji X-E4 (used to scan the film) to buy my MP. Would I buy one of these? Probably at some point, honestly. But first, I’m saving for that jewel of a lens, the re-issued 35mm Summilux SR!

[@FredRanger]

That new 35 looks fantastic! The reduction of minimum close focussing distance is welcomed!

[@TheWutangclan1995]

Seeing this camera come back has been intriguing to say the least. Leica is the first to make a 35mm camera that’s sold to the public. Now it’s coming back full circle to where Leica is the leader in producing film cameras. I love my old m6 since I first got it off eBay and it’s funny because lately I thought of wanting to own a new M one day from the store, with the full unboxing experience after taking it out of the shopping bag, instead of 5 layers of bubble wrap and newspaper in a box outside my front door.

[@FredRanger]

Leica is pretty good at packaging too :)

[@Narsuitus]

Thanks for the video. It is good to hear that the Leica M6 is back in production. I shoot Leica M6 film and Leica M10 digital cameras with 21mm f/1.4, 35mm f/1.4, and 90mm f/2 lenses. Great cameras and great lenses. If I did not already own a classic titanium M6, I would buy a new M6 or a new MP.

[@yasha8951]

I always found Leica's PR department a bit strange, this camera is kind of being shown as if Leica did not have any other analog camera in production or as if the scarcity of analog new Ms was solve with this release, I was definitely not expecting a cheap camera from these guys but having it priced at the same floor as the MP its a confusing move if you follow the message they are sending on the promo videos, price wise I don't see the old models going down the difference is still around 2K, I wish other manufacturers come with their own offerings that will definitely make a bigger impact to film production future, and you cab always thank Leica for the inspiration :)

[@FredRanger]

If Nikon, Fujifilm or others (re)enter the market, it could indeed fill that gap of “affordable” options.

[@weisserth]

Fred, I am not going to watch the whole video, I got to 6:25 where you completely f***ed up in citing Leica marketing from the Three Blind Men and an Elephant interview. Watch it again - and listen closely. Here's the deal: This new Leica M6 is essentially the Leica MP with a newly designed top plate. Leica took the MP, slapped a new top plate with M6 design language, the red dot and the M6 engraving. It's manufactured in the same "factory" by hand as the MP, using the same machines and being assembled by the same technicians doing the MP working the same shifts. It's not a new product - it's a variation of the existing products, the MP and MA. It's not just the viewfinder that's shared with the MP. It's the meter, the rangefinder, the film transport mechanism, the shutter, the shutter curtain and so on. You will not get any kind of overlap in servicing or parts for the Leica M6 classic out of this. The pricing for this new M6 is basically identical to the MP - because this is a Leica MP with an M6 skin. The only noteworthy talking points on this "M6 release" are: 1. The Leica MP just got a ~$500 cheaper variant being made available if you can stomach an MP with a red dot and M6 engraving. 2. If you like the red dot and M6 design language, you can now get a brand new, 3 year warranty Leica MP with an M6 skin. I've been shooting Leica M since around 2009-ish with an M3, I bought a factory new MP in 2020. I think it's cool that Leica provides more cosmetic options for the MP, but their marketing is misleading on purpose and almost everyone buys into their hyperbole, drawing the same wrong conclusions. Joe Greer advertising for Leica, "This changes everything" - that's utter BS. It changes nothing. The MP is $500 cheaper in 2022 - so drops back to the price level it was when I bought it with the more elegant MP design in 2020. It's still an MP, it's still being produced in homeopathic amounts at glacial speeds by Leica, it will still have a wait list of months or more than a year. And it still costs a kidney to buy one. It's not even a water drop on a hot stone in terms of doing anything to the film photography market other than serve Leica's brand marketing. And that's the purpose. Sad that so many people do not understand this.

[@baladino]

Great quality comment. I have a MA and feel the same way. Mi think every person seems to have a different expectation of Leica

[@FredRanger]

I can feel your “passion” towards Leica and people sharing their thoughts around new product releases T.W. You also seem to be very knowledgeable. Thanks for being part of this community and sharing. Cheers!

[@markkeohane9850]

Interesting insight TW, thanks. I don't shoot Leica because I don't have a spare kidney (I still have two but don't regard either as 'spare') so I'm not that close to Leica world and it's interesting to read a more informed story. I do shoot film but mostly with used, eBayed Nikon bodies and glass. I've contemplated a film Leica, and have eyed up used M6s, but I have so much fun with the gear I already own I don't see how I could possible squeeze another several thousand of £s of pleasure out of having one.

[@lemon58421]

I have the mp allready a few years !!! And I love this camera way better than the mp! And same price than the new m6

[@mjsworkshop]

@carlos vega The new M6 is fully mechanical. The only electronics on the camera is the light meter-which the M-A omits.

[@BernardBrunet]

Hahaha 😆 nice one Fred, just got my x-h2s good timing, but yes this video is about the M6. Did own one back In the day and should of kept it for the value, couldn't afford it now. Thanks

[@LWRC]

Now we will wait for Leica to bring back the 'new' M7!!!

[@perrymckenna2261]

I believe the launch of the new M6 is all around good news. Your negative comment about price is unwarranted. As you said, it's made in Germany, so the price is in line with the current Leica world. Regarding prices on an used M6, I think so far they are going up or staying stable. The hype has peaked my curiosity about film. I purchased a used Minolta XG1 to play with film. If I decide to take the plunge I will probably go for a used M6. Thanks for your video.

[@FredRanger]

Thanks for your comment! If you find a good deal on a used M6, you should definitely take the plunge. There isn't anything like it. Happy shooting!

[@flymrjones]

I’m not a Leica shooter/owner but I think it’s a great idea. I do wish it were more accessible but Leica is known to be the Luxury brand of the camera industry so unless I come up with 10 grand for the Camera and a lens I’m ok shooting Fujifilm although owning an M6 is a bucket list item.

[@FredRanger]

Indeed 2 very different shooting experience. One isn’t better than the other; just different. Happy shooting!

[@buskman3286]

IMO, Leica has no "role" in making film accessible; their role is to maintain a profitable business. They saw all the buying interest in "retro" gear that seems to affect everything from audio equipment to motorcycles AND all the internet articles raving about the Leica M6 as a great film camera and figured out, "There's money to be made here!" In any case I think it's great that Leica is "reviving" the M6 since my 1985 M6 was (is) my favorite film camera of all the many film cameras I have owned and is the only film camera I still own (and use). Would I buy a new one? IF my M6 gives up the ghost, yes!

[@FredRanger]

Great point! Yup, Leica still needs to be a EBITA positive business and they will make moves to capitalise on market opportunities. It is still an interesting move to be launching another variation of a film camera when all the other manufacturers don’t see a market there.

[@haomaaax]

thanks for the great video Fred! Would like to own my first Leica M6!

[@FredRanger]

It’s a very unique camera, I hope you get the chance to shoot with one at some point!

[@erichung9043]

I have the M6 classic in silver. This is actually good news to me because Leica would have parts to repair my M6. I might also be able to upgrade the rangefinder glass too for the coated anti-flare one. That said, if I buy another Leica film camera, I would buy the MP black paint for its relatively rarity. I 've missed a chance to buy it from Germany. And now its price has already gone up. I'm not sure how the brassing would look on the new M6. Time will tell. I also wish Nikon did the same thing and released its FM2N or FM3A. There are some incredibly good F mount glass out there including those from Zeiss and Voigtlander. A used FM2N is about US$300-500. It 's an incredible camera for its value and would make film more accessible than Leica. BTW, I also wish Fuji re-released its X-Pan!

[@FredRanger]

Agree on the fact that this is good for current M6 owners. Also Nikon & Fuji could indeed make way more affordable options in the market. Time will tell!

[@esfahan1961]

After over 12 years finally found my Billingham bag with its pricy content: classic M6 body, Summicron f2.0 35mm, 50mm & 90mm. Getting it serviced to shoot on something else than an iPhone again 😍😘👍🏼

[@enigmaticreverieproduction5169]

Proof or it didn’t happen haha

[@d30gaijin]

Personally I am pleased to see Leica ring back the M6, not that I will buy one. My M6 is 1st year of production (1984) and after years and years of use I finally had to send it in for a CLA and now it is as good as new. But I am happy for those who might buy the new M6 and know the joy of such a fine camera.

[@FredRanger]

I agree that once you shoot Leica Rangefinder, it’s hard to go back to anything else. It isn’t for everybody for sure, but when you like it and you invest in one, it’s pretty much for life!

[@epstar83]

Interesting chat. The MP and new M6 are more similar than different, which makes the close pricing of the two models even more confusing. I think if Leica had added an aperture priority model similar to the M7 that would have differentiated them, or alternatively offered the M6 at a lower price point to separate the MP from it a little bit. The lower price point approach is probably difficult as the cost of making these cameras is what it is. Even if they had moved production to Portugal the investment in new tooling would probably have offset the advantage of a less expensive production location. The positive side is this underlines Leica’s commitment to film and as you say, perhaps that will inspire Nikon, Pentax, Canon or Fuji to bring another film camera to market.

[@FredRanger]

Yup, that’s my thinking also.

[@MB-or8js]

Good summary in the video! But let's be realistic that the new M6 is fitting the luxury brand incentive of Leica with a limited number of 500 made in the first run. This ensures that prices are kept high per unit sold. With this very limited amount of new M6 cameras made, the value of older M6 versions won't be affected - it might actually rise a bit due to more hype created now for the M6. Similar to you, I have a M6 from the mid 90s which I bought for $1K used six years ago. I have no intention to upgrade to the new M6.

[@wheezzy101]

I would go for the MP only because I prefer silver cameras. So far I am happy with my M3 though sometimes a light meter would be nice.

[@FredRanger]

I agree the silver Leica cameras look so nice. Love my Silver M6 TTL, and its light meter :)

[@ShadowBoxer]

I think it’s very interesting that Leica is pushing film (!) : ) A new M6 is not for me. I already had a brand new M6. I got it brand new back in 1998 or so. I think it cost around $1850. It was some kind of deal. A demo or something. It’s a classic M6 with the High Magnification .85 viewfinder (original small dial). I used it back then for taking pix of bands in clubs when I was trying to use only available light. Some of those clubs barely had ANY light! That camera has been dropped, pushed, kicked, punched and banged around and had the sun burn holes in the curtains, with either one of my only two lenses back then. A 35mm f/1/4 Summilux (I think from the 1970s) and a 85mm 1.5 Summarex (maybe 1950s). Used those for years. Still use my now “used” M6 and still have both lenses. I’ve had it repaired under warranty and CLA’d through the years. Seems to work fine. I can’t think of a reason to get a 2022 M6. Maybe I should make a video of my little kit? Cheers from Los Angeles.

[@FredRanger]

Definitely an interesting move from Leica. I love those stories about how the 1990’s M6 are still alive and kicking. So well built and fun to shoot. You should definitely make a video about that kit, I’m sure a lot of people, myself included, would like to see the character of those lenses! Cheers!

[@baladino]

It’s the same price since it has the same improvements as the newer film bodies. There isn’t anything to question or talk about here.

[@karmatopden3417]

Launch of M6, make me want to buy MP 🤣

[@FredRanger]

Haha probably not a bad choice ;)

[@markkeohane9850]

Great to see a film camera going back into production but the availability of a US$5k (nearer $10k when you add a lens or two) camera is not going to do anything to entice new film shooters or make much difference to what's already happening in the world of film shooting. I use a 41 year-old Pentax ME Super I've had from new, two Nikon F3s and an FE2 and I bought three f/1.4 lenses (35/50/85) for the Nikons. That lot in total cost me about US$1500 (equivalent; I'm in the UK) and it's gear like that that's more likely to open the door to new film shooters. And if one of those cameras breaks beyond repair I can just mourn quietly for an hour then bury it in a box in the garden and eBuy another one for a few hundred quid. But it would be great to see more manufacturers resurrecting film SLRs - at a sensible price point! - and perhaps Leica's move will prompt this. I realise there may be a 'Leica feel' to be had (though I've shot a mate's M10 and it didn't do a lot for me) but wow, does it come at a price. Leica is far from the only show in town if you're looking for celluloid-based 'tography pleasure. (I have mooted a film Leica and the M6 would be my choice. But I'd likely make do with a used original and used glass if I did go Leica.) By the way, offered as friendly, constructive criticism, suggest getting your points and messages across more succinctly (about half the time or less) for more stickability and FFS ditch the music - or at least choose something without the distracting, crashing cymbals that practically drowned out a lot of what you were saying.

[@theblackandwhitefilmproject]

I traded my M6 a few month's ago for an MP. I was having problems with the M6( rewind lever locking after about 20 frames; light meter rapidly draining batteries) and having a new MP with a warranty was too good to resist. I agree that the old M6's will drop in resale value.I have found the MP to be better than the old M6- shutter sound, build feel. I don't like the MP soft black paint which marks easily but the new M6 and MP seem to be just a red dot away from being identical. Cheers!

[@FredRanger]

Very good point. Feels like an MP inside with the M6 body on the outside.

[@kevangogh]

Regarding the battery drain issue, I switched to a single lithium 1/3N and what do you know, the battery life went from 2 weeks to 8 months.

[@theblackandwhitefilmproject]

@@kevangogh I tried the 1/3N for my M6 but can only buy the FDK brand in NZ and it didn't last. My MP came with the Varta brand which has lasted ages.

[@HiddenFiles]

I’ll stick with Fuji for now

[@FredRanger]

Would be interesting to see Fujifilm releasing a film camera also!

[@Narsuitus]

@@FredRanger I wish that Fuji had released a full-frame digital rangefinder like the Leica M10.

[@Anthony-fz9ye]

The background music is kinda loud

[@FredRanger]

I agree, the mix cam out a little loud on the BG music. Will have to fix that for the next one.

[@marlon.iraheta]

Great video Fred ! Honestly I think Leica went wrong in not making it cheaper for the film community. They could off made it in Portugal or Canada, but than again its like a Louis Vuitton bag....we are paying for the brand. Nice work Fred ✌

[@FredRanger]

Thanks man. Yup I agree. Leave the MP and MA as the high end ones and give the film community an “affordable” option so they can have a taste of how it feels to shoot with these cameras. I’m with you on the Portugal factory option. It would have bring the cost down (just look at the lenses). Anyway, I’m happily continue to shoot my OG M6 and let the market decide for the new one… cheers!

[@BryanElliott_]

YES PLEASE DO A REVIEW ON THE H2S

[@FredRanger]

Working on one, stay tuned 🤘🏻

[@Leicam10]

Wish they would have released M7 instead or even a Minilux that would have closed a gap. Analog M with light meter and MP view finder that costs 5000$ well that sounds like a MP to me 🤔

[@FredRanger]

That would’ve been really nice indeed!

[@slr7075]

The ugly truth is the original Leica M6 will immediately see an increase in price due to the association with the new reissued M6. Used market sellers will now try to "price match" the old M6 with the new M6 because Leica officially acknowledge and revealed their evaluation and worth of this entire analog photography resurgence. Perhaps this will further increase all used analog Leica gear too (which is already priced and steadily increasing already enough). One good thing though, at least Leica is not always plastering their name on Chinese smartphones.

[@otravov]

It’s hypocritical the way they say they care about film, but in reality they care about a market niche. How are they reaching a wider audience with that price tag? The only good thing about this is a the conversation around a new film film camera…

[@FredRanger]

I agree with you. that’s why I didn’t say “more accessible” it isn’t. especially not at that price tag. It does target a wider audience with having people like Joe Greer and Stockeasy promoting this release though. It’s no longer just the masters from the past. Time will tell it that strategy worked.

[@GamachePhoto]

Fred, the new M6 is not for me, I have my M10-R and very happy with it, if I want to shoot film I’ll use my Hasselblad. But the (future) SL3 might be worth upgrading to.

[@FredRanger]

Yup, that’s the beauty of film cameras. There’s no real need to “upgrade”. Just personal preferences :)

[@The_Essential_Light]

You are wasting your breath by being critical of the price. Leica’s are what they are. Expensive cameras.

[@FredRanger]

Yup, that’s the niche they are strategically positioned in.

[@LensEthics]

I know I’ll own an MP at some point, I hope sooner than later, but the experience of getting one is terrible. All I want is a simple, well made camera that I don’t have to upgrade every 3-4 years, one I can use (not collect) for my documentary work, with little distractions. Only servicing and not contributing to more digital waste. Does anyone know how Leica can launch a new film camera when the supply and demand issues for the, always on back order, MP and the MA are so severe? Some people don’t want to collect, they want to use it as a tool for their work. 😔

[@FredRanger]

Amen!

[@blende5.693]

nice video, I believe Leica miss a big chance to make a M6.2 , with a shutter speed up to 1/2000 sec, with optionally laminating frame lines with led, with a battery box in the camera for a better optics, … Just a remake is not ok for me, it’s just a bad way to make money with the crowd of Leica-hipsters. I miss the old philosophy of just making pictures.

[@FredRanger]

I hear you!

[@AlexOnStreets]

Agreed!

[@pilarpsp127]

Leica or nor lecia ... being excited about film camera that expensive in 2022 is like waiting for a new walkman from sony because ...back in the days it was just better

[@FredRanger]

Haha that’s quite the analogy!

[@Nerdzombiedisco]

Yeah, it's priced high. The fact is that the same finite group of handmade builders work to bring this camera to market. The improved specs are welcomed. M6s were undervalued for 2 1/2 decades (Albeit, this is an MP in a new suit). Deal with it people.

[@FredRanger]

True that!

[@map3384]

$5000 for a new M6? I think I’ll stick with my mint FM2n and maybe buy a like new FM3a for $800.

[@silvestersze9968]

@@map3384 You’re comparing a Mercedes Benz and a Toyota or a Seiko watch and a Rolex my friend. Leica cameras are not for everyone. The craftsmanship and the glass manufacturing are totally incomparable in terms of quality. Period.

[@map3384]

@@silvestersze9968 Toyota vehicles have better reliability records. Mercedes vehicles are money pits. Nikon glass is pretty damn good for the professionals who use them. In fact Nikon and Canon bodies were the professionals choice. Why is that?

[@silvestersze9968]

@@map3384

[@silvestersze9968]

@@map3384 You are comparing two different things. State-of-the art machines don’t have to be used by professionals. Vice versa, daily horses and shooters don’t have to be the finest equipment the world can offer. You don’t wear Swiss-made Bally dress shoes on the concrete street because leather soles are for red carpet; they’re delicate. Leica and Rolleiflex cameras are hand made in batches, like Rolls-Royce (they can be robust and at the same time fine craftsmanship) and See's Candies. Also, rangefinder cameras are TLR hasn’t been used by professional photographers and reporters for decades because of the practicality of the SLRs like Nikon and Canon etc (the rise of the SLR cameras in the 50’s in Japan).

[@silvestersze9968]

@@map3384 Yes, Nikkor and Canon fluoride glass are good, but Leitz and Carl Zesis lenses are even better and superb. Have you ever tried comparing them between images and technical charts? Well, I have seen the difference either in real life or magazine articles and images.

[@rudigerschwartz4265]

terrible noises in the background

[@FredRanger]

Yup, I’m aware. Will be fixed in next one. How about the the content though?

[@rudigerschwartz4265]

@@FredRanger couldn't keep listening

[@FredRanger]

Okidookie!

[@FredRanger]

See you next time, then.

[@nickcr3919]

Mp

[@carlosmcse]

No. If I buy a film camera, and have to deal with film, it’ll have to be a forever camera so I’ll have to research. If I want it new it’ll be an M-A. Fully mechanical. This “new” M6 sounds like you know. Typical Leica marketing machine.

[@FredRanger]

Yup, that’s why I think it makes no sense they priced it the same as the MP/MA…

[@carlosmcse]

@@FredRanger I understand the other ones have a huge waiting period and the M6’s (like yours) ran out of circuit boards so they can’t be fixed now. So maybe that has something to do with it? If your circuit board dies maybe now they can replace it with the new one? Not sure.

[@FredRanger]

@@carlosmcse thanks my thinking also. I will have to check with Leica directly.

[@RichardPilon]

@@FredRanger I have a 1997 M6 so am also interested to know if Leica can fixed failed electronics. Please let us know what you find out from Leica.

[@FredRanger]

Will do!