Air Traffic Control GND in JFK: Understanding the mess

This is a graphic visualization of what happened in JFK in 2008. Hope it provides you with a better understanding of the events.

[@maxmustermann5082]

"I told you to go where you are?" "Exactly" "I did, ok sir.". Hilarious, and you know what? Not just the controller is a great guy, the pilots noticed how desperatly close to total resignation he was and the did not give him hard times at all :-)

[@JumpStartation]

You state in the beginning of the video "...understanding of the facts that lead a JFK ATC GND controller to retire at age 32." In reality, the controller in question (Arny) was fired from his job at Kennedy (JFK). He went on to work at La Guardia (LGA) and was once again fired. He now works as a local controller at Islip/Long Island Mac Arthur (ISP) changing between tower, ground and clearance usually working weekends. Occasionally, pilots have asked: Aren't you the guy in that video?

[@OutThereIam]

I also write that I'm just kidding because I had no idea what happened to him. Tx for the update nonetheless

[@MarcDufresneosorusrex]

@@OutThereIam amen!!!~

[@Graxster]

The problem arose because the ground controller is trying to move planes around like a finely choreographed ballet. His instructions (prior to this video) were "Delta, follow Corporate" and "Jet Blue 1069, follow Delta". However, JB 1069 spoke to the Delta flight, who explained they were waiting for the Corporate jet, so JB 1069 decided he was going to go ahead and jump from 3rd in line to 1st in line, thereby messing up the whole scheme. This is where the controller says, "You can't just do that".

[@magentaMegi]

This is a ATC trying to maintain both visual and misread locations from the Tower Control, trying to make sense of the mess in one of the busy airports in the world. The pilots is trying just try to navigate so many lazy pilots and taxi them through the runway, and making sense of conflicting info of visual and false info on the map.... BRAVO to him.... listen again.

[@drdream123]

I imagine they are still in the stone age using flight strips and mental memories of the situation on the ground when even video games have very precise visuals of the airport and movement of aircraft.

[@SraTacoMal]

@@magentaMegi Not Bravo, Whiskey to him.

[@EchosTackyTiki]

@@SraTacoMal Bravo Zulu to ground, I'll get him some Whiskey for dealing with those Deltas. Man's an absolute Alpha.

[@jonathanbaird8109]

@@drdream123 JFK has ASDE-X.

[@The_GreenMachine]

i love how there are just so many plane silhouettes that end up just randomly popping up. as well as the guys parked on the runway ;)

[@bombud1]

started getting silly towards the end. last half would not be a graphic representation of anything other than the uploaders imagination.

[@fhuber7507]

bombud1 Yep... that ruined the whole thing

[@CinemaDemocratica]

The video was better before it got too silly to synch up with what was actually happening. I understand the intention there, but I was more involved and more entertained while it was being played straighter.

[@corsetgurl]

"You're unable to do everything with that plane of yours sir." LOL

[@distar97]

Wasn’t it unable to do anything? The controller was annoyed due to the pilot reacting 180 degrees to his directives. It came down to language issues and never saying he couldn’t make sense of his rapid fire NY accent.

[@Jesse-cx4si]

God bless this controller. I’m looking at a coloring book explanation with color coded plane icons and I still have little clue what’s going on. I would have thrown my headset and walked home.

[@N34RT]

This is an excellent graphic representation for these ATC exchanges at JFK. I tip my hat to the creativity and effort put into it. Thanks for posting.

[@chocolatcats]

I can't imagine the stress of that job...hugs to that controller (I wish I could)

[@babysealsareyummy]

I picture this guy looking all disheveled and tired smoking a cigarette down to the filter and an ashtray spilling over.

[@cn9130]

After listening to some of these..im starting to notice a trend..and that trend is that JetBlue tends to screw things up for the NY controllers..lol

[@dusfor72]

Jetblue 179: ".... and we'll meet you at the "Duty Free" hahahahaha and Ground: "You guys should come up here one day. You'd enjoy the show"

[@s2v8377]

Now they have ground radar. You have to give the generation of cotrollers who had to do it this way out of memory!!!

[@Cardi185]

The controller is not fully to blame here. The overall layout and naming of the taxiways and apron entrance/exit points at JFK are a mess. Take an airport like (YYZ) Toronto Pearson (my home airport) for example. Taxiways = X, Runway high speed exits = X1, Apron entrance/exit = XX. In my opinion, I believe that a surface naming system like YYZ and other Canadian airports, are much easier for pilots and on ground personnel to understand and follow.

[@distar97]

JFK is always hilarious. Remember the kid controller? BTW, this guy was not fired, he was moved to a smaller airport, I think Long Island MacArthur. I maintain he'd be great as a radio talk show host.

[@moviemaker2011z]

i wonder why they fired him, anyone that can clear this mess up deserved a rise!

[@joe2bes]

"Jesus Jetblue" haha

[@thespeedypatriot6201]

Every time I say I'm screwed up or something like that I always say "Jesus JetBlue

[@thespeedypatriot6201]

#blamejetblue

[@slimsalmon]

TheSpeedyPatriot #jetbluedidnothingwrong

[@clumsiii]

You guys should come up here one day. classic

[@weebgrinder-AIArtistPro]

Lmao...'you can't just...you can't just do that...See this takes so much energy, guys' *mainlines more caffeine* and this illustrates some of the issues the A380 causes. I've seen the Jepp charts for JFK and lots of them are almost exclusively dedicated to the A380 and where it can and cannot go

[@rogerdotlee]

I've been listening to these guys do their majick on LiveATC for years now, and it never ceases to amaze me.

[@TheEman1298]

This poor guy, I feel bad for him

[@FlightSupreme]

The controller sometimes sounds like Peter Griffin, very funny!

[@TheCarnivalguy]

He sounds so much like Joe Pesci at times. 😂

[@MrNateSPF]

Okay, okay, okay...

[@bigcountrytruckingextraord3548]

This guy is so cool. U always wanted to be an airline pilot and be would make my day.

[@MeishaAthma]

Reminds me of Abbott & Costello's; Who's on first... ...Who's on CharlieAlpha & did I send you there?

[@animal16365]

It's not the same without Kenndy Steve in control

[@mateusgurjao7332]

Peter griffin on ATC \o/

[@zedigan123]

you...you didnt even MOVE then...who who.. who went out of sequence?

[@pianoman78]

The controller sounds like Peter from family guy ;)

[@drmayeda1930]

i think you can see what this guy looks like. he was the controller for US1549 it was on Air Crash Investigations. or something like that.

[@00BillyTorontoBill]

The controller, Patrick Harten, 35 did the Miracle on thehudson with Sully. This was a guy arny .."the controller in question (Arny) was fired from his job at Kennedy (JFK). He went on to work at La Guardia (LGA) and was once again fired. He now works as a local controller at Islip/Long Island Mac Arthur (ISP) changing between tower, ground and clearance usually working weekends. Occasionally, pilots have asked: Aren't you the guy in that video"

[@bigcountrytruckingextraord3548]

I listen to this everyday. The new york accent is cool. I'd love to work with him. That has to be a nerve racking job

[@joepatroni8777]

2:27 OK, that icon made my day....

[@MrMathiasBertelsen]

I'm so glad i fly helicopters and not fixed wings! xD "Request present position departure" - Thank you very much!

[@raindrop264]

It would have been a good video, what's missing is callsign tags next to the planes, and what's with the messing around?

[@2012TheAndromeda]

2:25 The alien with the buzzing killed me Lol!!

[@meltz911]

Am I wrong but is this whole mess caused by the corp jet that cut in line?

[@eesyam91]

wow.. I'm impressed with this guy.. hahah

[@bigcountrytruckingextraord3548]

Ground man is cool as hell

[@titter3648]

Why don't they just all send the GPS position over the transponder so the ATC could have just had a graphic on a screen with the full overview so he don't have to ask for their position all the time?

[@thevickp]

They have an ASDE-X (ground radar) that provides a graphic layout of the planes on the taxiways and runways.

[@wildh0rse1]

Wankel Motor Isn't ADS-B going to do something like that?

[@palbi]

You need to slow down the text at the beginning. Not all of us can read as fast as ATC talks.

[@oubrioko]

@ 6:55 JFK Ground: "Jetblue 144, you an inbound or an outbound?" Jetblue 144: "Inbound to Whiskey" JFK Ground: "I told you to go where you are?" Jetblue 144: "Exactly"

[@clumsiii]

and he shortly thereafter follows with " you guys should come up here one day"

[@hoghed]

Most stressful jobs in Transportation: Air Traffic Controller Railway Dispatcher Railway Yardmaster

[@SidestickPilot]

+A Rare Trump ATC especially ground and approach at major airports are incredibly stressful.

[@BollocksUtwat]

JFK Ground is always a favourite for entertainment.

[@LaurentLaborde]

this guy deserve a free hug :)

[@wizbang68]

Sounded like the one or 2 working Arrivals wasn't keeping the flight strips in order as they were passing off to ground. So flights were just showing up landing and on a moving on a taxiway without coordination, JFK that's a big no no. Then Pilots weren't giving the full info of company flight# where they are what they are doing and where they want to go. IE: Jet Blue 882 on yankee short of alpha for departures on 13L. Then ground and verify who they are where they are and can determine how he can keep everyone moving. Worse, A number of these pilots couldn't speak clearly, were just barely able to speak english or understand the directions being given. Ground sounded like he was ready to "wrap it up". I couldn't for sure but it sounded like Kennedy Steve. Hard to tell because this is from before 2010. But a lot of his responses sound familiar.

[@DiskoSpider]

This is not Steve. I think it's Pat. Also some JB just decided to break sequence, everyone directing did their job well.

[@Rasscasse]

Definitely not Steve. It would never have got that way with Steve

[@cw9533]

Did anyone taxi to take off? Hold all gates, clear mess, get sequence then pull all and GO.

[@22640cal]

lol i love the animations... heard this a dozen times and this is awesome!

[@michaelking3327]

10 minutes? kennedy steve woulda had that sorted out in 4 minutes! good video!

[@sharpfang]

I half-expected "Ground Control to Kennedy Steve! Mayday! Mayday!"

[@dizzyology7514]

Yes Kennedy Steve would have prevented the whole mess from happening. But we have to remember that this epioside dates from (apparently) 2010, well before KS had made a name for himself as the world's dominant ground controller. (And a shout-out to H89SA who helped to make that happen.) There are a few legendary figures (now mostly retired) who could do things nobody else could do. If it's the bottom of the ninth with the score tied, two on and a full count, you need Mariano Rivera. If your plane's engines are both dead and there's no dry landing option available, you need Sully. And if the JFK taxiway system is totally gridlocked, you need Kennedy Steve. Like the others, he's retired. Like the others, he's a freak of nature (to borrow a phrase from Al Haynes.) We're glad he served us as long he could.

[@musicvideo291]

JFK needs a better ground radar...

[@kewkabe]

It was probably out of service because you can hear him sequencing strips around while he figures out the order (the click noises in the background). I'm a controller and this happens sometimes and it takes a lot of transmissions to figure it out but it's not a big deal.

[@micahelroach6744]

It sucks when the RESDE-X gets broken. You gotta do everything visually.

[@b1gbird001]

i take it this guy plays a lot of rubicks cube?

[@RubenKelevra]

Yep I guess we're fine to go for full automated planes, there will be no issues.

[@man4x449]

Nice, very good visualation

[@Brooke52528]

My head is spinning!!!!

[@IRONMANAustralia]

But who was Papa Hotel Oscar November Echo?

[@mingyuejiang1797]

Papa means taxi way P Hotel means taxi way H all the same thing.

[@gobigblue911]

"Your unable to do everything, sir, that plane of yours, sir." haha

[@herbertcarrillo-ramos3772]

I try to stay away from JFK on afternoons

[@juanlozano6765]

LOVED THE UFOS!!!!!

[@oldmanc2]

Ramp and Ground working independently doesn't help

[@dennisfariello4852]

Love the graphics!

[@DC8FD]

This guy should NOT be allowed in an Air Traffic Control Tower!!! He needs to be FIRED!!

[@aaracy3982]

not sure I agree with this statement, but hey, feel free to apply for his job ;) God knows I won't. lol

[@lekoman]

I'm fairly certain this did not demystify the mess this controller detangled... but thanks for trying...

[@ricardokowalski1579]

I'm not even mad, I'm amazed. 😂

[@Henryk516]

I feel for the guy when it is obvious the pilots up front took matters in their own hands. I hope the controller survived this incident and is thriving.

[@darrenhenderson3]

Nope he got transferred to a smaller airport not too long after this and another incident in which he let one of his kids transmit air traffic control transmissions

[@decline2state]

At least he didn't have to deal with any tugs (unless they got edited out).

[@OutThereIam]

As far as I know, intentionally, I didn't cut anything out. The pilots were really sympathetic. Well... they otta be if they were to get out of the tangle. :D

[@thespeedypatriot6201]

Poor controller

[@Blackbelt20101]

I have heard this recording like 4 times and every time it cracks me up!!!!

[@bigcountry5585]

This guy is cool as hell

[@Ruddy761]

I thought he was gunna cry at that point.. :)

[@ATFDFF]

Thanks for the info!

[@MaidenCanada]

I love this controller ,i hope he wasnt fired

[@Pyrotrons]

It's a squadron of Boeings!!! Anyone besides me catch that in the video at 7:49?

[@JumpStartation]

@SavaMarkovicPilot He is a terrible controller. Also, his phraseology is still lagging behind. Rather than using current taxiing instructions (Runway 33L, taxi via.....) he uses the old style (Taxi to runway 33L via...).

[@carlmanu]

This ATC's voice sounds like Bobby Boucher from the waterboy movie🤣

[@Winglet520]

Who's on second?

[@PikalaxALT]

Repeating the same comment over and over again makes you feel smarter for saying it, but the rest of us see it as spam.

[@staddlez]

jetblue..jetblue...who? jetblue jetblue who's infront? jetblue. who's over there? jetblue.

[@stephenmilligan6709]

ATC put three planes going different ways on the same spot, and none could move. This is a massive fuck up.

[@drmayeda1930]

I think he needed a piece of paper to keep track of what is going where.

[@OutThereIam]

because I can lol. More serious stuff can be found on Discovery Channel, here is just for laughs.

[@wfrankwalshiv]

Was the one who retired at age 32 as mentioned in the beginning, the one speaking in the video?

[@ATFDFF]

Now, this is probably just because I have NO idea of how ATC works (so I'm sorry if this is a really stupid comment), but why don't they just implement the use of GPS? It may not help the routing but at least they'd be able to to see where everyone is at any time.

[@TheRaptor3945]

Kennedy taxiways should be equipped with traffic lights xD FAA general managers !! please feel sorry for the kennedy ground controllers !! xD

[@Darryl39345]

heard this guy working at islip macarthur now

[@peterkidera7117]

At least they all speak and understand English.

[@jeremypilot1015]

What fucking mess. SMH

[@phildan89]

Eeek 8:40...incorrect readback again with Delta 929. Could have been a bit more fun down the line!

[@PAFyrefiter]

This was back in 08...BEFORE the change. it says so in the description. The change was last year...

[@DiscoBird]

that guy is a fuckin pro!

[@derekwall200]

it doesn't take that much energy it takes a lot of coordination

[@JumpStartation]

The same controller today: watch?v=ahGsp1J42p0

[@VxMAX]

I figured that was how everyone was placed, I just wasn't sure of the taxiways at JFK..

[@xriz8409]

yes... this is the ONLY reason u are NOT a controller, sure dude :)

[@renlonimo]

ATC sounds like Peter Griffin specialy at 7.00 ! Awesome !

[@arafat88ryu]

A really bad day for an air traffic controller. XP

[@sirimp7]

this is jokes, good thing London heathrow isnt like this :p

[@chavesbra]

Well done. I really had that "LOL" everybody types.

[@SimAlex20000]

the controller *really* sounds like a young al pacino.

[@headz51230]

I'll follow the guy that's following Air Alitalia

[@pushdword]

the ammount of airplanes is TOO DAMM HIGH!

[@likuish]

Just glad he didn't have an air sector that day!

[@Khazar01]

Ah, traffic officers do this every time they stand in the middle of an intersection and try to "clean" the traffic :)

[@radtech21]

I say that at work quite often now.... :-/