Buffy the Vampire Slayer Talk || s6e17 "Normal Again"

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[@oceanchaos1]

Joss Whedon has said that a lot of his favorite lines got dropped from this episode, in a scene where "real world" characters try to convince Buffy the demon-hunting world can't be real. "Why is your little sister taller than you?" "What was Adam's plan?" Best of all, Whedon was also writing for an X-Men show where he tried to have Cyclops (aka Scott Summers) mention he had been visiting his cousin in a mental institution where she was confined after becoming convinced she saved the world from vampires.

[@cklambo]

x-men evolution?

[@oceanchaos1]

The comic book series "Astonishing X-Men"; Whedon started writing them in Vol 3

[@ireallyreallyhategoogle]

lol

[@godmagnus]

X-Men comic, not show

[@alicequinn505]

Oh my god, I had no idea Joss had written that!

[@aperson4640]

"That's what life is. That's how s--t happens. You get over your main obstacle but you still have three bozos behind your back trying to make your life a living hell." -Alley Box

[@elizabethm4824]

I’ve always loved that Buffy got a chance to say goodbye to Joyce.

[@lessismore8533]

When?..

[@chetstevensq]

After Once More With Feeling and The Body THIS is the episode to watch reactors brains explode. Fun times.

[@Dunybrook]

Definitely got the impression that the other universe with Buffy in the psychiatric hospital was real too and the demon infection just allowed her consciousness to travel there. Great reaction to this classic episode.

[@jonathannoble7845]

If Giles had been at the wedding, he would have been able to resolve the problem. That's kind of the whole point of season six, it's their first time flying solo without dad there to help them out.

[@lessismore8533]

lol yah Giles is like EVERYONES dad Spoilers ahead Later on when Willow gets too much power, Giles already know her since S1. And as a result he was able to help her by tricking her..

[@DanielOrme]

I was glad to see you focused more on the metaphorical aspect of the episode, how it expresses so much of Buffy's situation this season. So many people get hung up on the genius of the meta mindf**k. What's 'real' isn't the point. I'm also glad that, though you edited past Joyce's final speech, you did cite it later. Everything Joyce tells her is just what Buffy most needs to hear. And since this episode comes exactly one year after Joyce's funeral (which took place in episode 5x17), her "goodbye" seems to me like her finally reconciling herself to her mother's death and possibly the depression she's fought ever since.

[@serenity4eva89]

It's cute that Cordy became the Giles of Angel Investigations (because they spent a lot of time researching demons together back in the Sunnydale High library). And by removing them it allows for the more emotionally traumatized characters (Xander and Wesley, who have all the daddy issues) of the two groups to... stumble. Anyways, yeah... 'Normal Again' is a banger! And the fact that they got Dean Butler (Hank Summers) back just to stand around and look concerned is PERFECTION 😊

[@Kronos74]

Wesley is the Giles of Angel. Ironically Cordy is the Xander of Angel.

[@wolervine]

She just posted a rare public message on Patreon, unfortunately it's a sad family matter. No mention of KZbin, though, just of Patreon schedule.

[@tonygriffin8148]

One of my favorite episodes of the series. Amazing. Spine tingling. Life-changing.

[@treyokelly9662]

It gets way too much unnecessary hate. I love it

[@Itsjandz105]

You’re right SMG is just amazing.

[@lurker1316]

This is another that one that works well through the lens of The Trio as a metaphorical representation of Buffy's depression. They get her to think "it doesn't make sense for me to be like this or for my life to be this way." She questions herself for how she's been coping with her depression and she starts to doubt that even her own strength could be real. The idea of "you fought demons and gods, but now you're losing to pathetic little men" is kind of how it can feel to be depressed, like "what's wrong with me, why can't I just overcome what should be a simple barrier?" And of course it's just as she's about to face them (and as she's been making personal strides, like realizing she doesn't want to die and she wants to stop using Spike) that The Trio (and the depression) fight back harder. Part of confronting the depression means taking stock of how far things have slipped and that awareness can make it feel insurmountable. So Buffy's progress isn't linear, but that's what makes her arc so relatable for me. And tracking the arc through the season, the more personal progress Buffy makes in the season, the more The Trio starts to fall apart. As Buffy starts getting better, depression's three brain cells get a little less able to function as a cohesive unit.

[@lynnevetter]

🎉

[@RobertJazo]

A great episode of Buffy. When I first saw this episode it reminded me a lot of an (also excellent) episode of Star Trek: Deep Space Nine called "Far Beyond the Stars", which had a similar premise and ultimately left the nature of reality somewhat ambiguous.

[@9ansean]

I loved Far Beyond the Stars too. Though my argument about the ending to that episode is kind of on par with what I just wrote about this one. To believe that Deep Space Nine is a dream not only creates too many plot holes, it also undermines the theme. Although in that case it's more the theme of a standalone plot. It leaves the lead character's sanity in question and suggests that others actually were right not to take his ideas seriously. So I don't buy that interpretation.

[@davewolf6256]

You know, I wish we could convince Ally to watch that or other shows. But I just have a feeling she wont watch genres out of her comfort zone. I mean, the closest media to this episode, no, this season of Buffy is Neon Genesis Evangelion. But it’ll take years of us convincing her to watch sci-fi, let alone anime.

[@lynnevetter]

I mentioned that episode too. So good, but these episodes kill me.😅

[@g1xrider13]

Joss whedon once said when he wrote Atonishing X-men, he wanted to include Scott Summers "Cyclops" saying he had a cousin in an asylum in LA who believes she hunts vampires. So maybe Buffy is insane in the Marvel universe.

[@davewolf6256]

See, I like to think that Giles did get an invitation to Xander and Anya's wedding but was actually more bothered by the fact that he kissed Anya than the show tells us. So he didn't go out of shame. There's a lot of details about Giles' character that are kept below the surface. And one of them is that he has an addictive personality. The booze he keeps in his house is always conspicuously displayed--not just featured as it was in "The Dark Age," "Something Blue," and "The Yoko Factor." He also keeps a hidden stash of liquor at The Magic Box in "Checkpoint," a very alcoholism thing to do. And he pulls out a lighter during the cleansing ritual in "I Only Have Eyes For You," the most obvious clue that he hides a smoking habit. The thing is addicts don't abuse substances just because they're an addict, but as a coping mechanism for trauma. And Giles appears to struggle a lot with contextualizing trauma, even going back to Season 1's "Nightmares." So it's totally within character for Giles to be avoiding Xander and Anya further out of guilt or shame that he was improper with Anya.

[@SashaRicky]

I can actually see all of that. Brilliant analysis. ❤❤

[@ethanself2667]

This episode gives me chills.

[@deborahczarnecki6776]

The music… rewatch when Buffy and Spike take down the house. I always think of these as bookends; when Buffy starts to spiral down and when she starts to climb back into herself.

[@peterd9698]

25:50 what kind of insurance do they have that the schizophrenic girl hasn’t been living on the street for the past 7 years? (To quote Giles, s3e2): Americans.

[@ibgvox]

Normal Again was the first freelance episode since David Fury's S3 ones and the very last of the series. It was a pitch by Joss's former assistant Diego Gutierrez. Joss and Diego, according to Marti, did the storybreaking.

[@axelleos2000]

I love this episode! The ending is an alternate reality confirmed 😂

[@Scarygothgirl]

I feel like Buffy having been in an institution when she was younger is a false memory, either from the Dawn memories or from the demon in this episode, as Joyce never treats vampire mentions as concerning in earlier seasons. This is one of my favourite episodes. In some of my darker moments I've seen my friends as obstacles between me and ending my suffering.

[@Buffy8Fan]

It took me only within the last few years to come up with a reason that made sense to the writers saying they didn't want fans knowing which reality was real and which one wasn't. This reason it never made sense to me was because Buffy not being in certain scenes (aka Spike & Xander or The Trio as the best examples) doesn't allow for her to know what would be happening. And while I later realized there can be explanations to that, it still didn't make sense that either reality could be real because with Buffy being depressed, the insane asylum isn't an insane asylum. It is a punishment for herself in her fantasy real world where even the key doesn't exist, thus no Dawn. So since then, the head canon theory I came up with in the past year is that the insane asylum reality is in Buffy's mind, but she brought it into being. The drug in the demon's arm allows Buffy to hallucinate the universe. Combining ideas with the hellmouth can make much of non-reality possible. I believe when Buffy leaves the insane asylum universe and chooses the slayer universe, she brings the universe with her and creates it as an official reality and not just something in her head. How the episode ends is rather sad as while the Slayerverse reality continues to play out with Buffy continuing her life, the insane asylum Buffy is thought of as brain dead by her parents and doctors. I presume that without a depressed Buffy helming the wheel of her emotions and body, perhaps that Buffy could have a chance someday. Or if not, it's an even sadder story as complies with S6 anyway. I also have a theory that Joyce got better on the parenting scale when Dawn showed up because of the monks adding Dawn into Joyce's memories. To me that fits in with with the plot of Joyce and Hank had her committed before the series began, which explains so much about Buffy's fear of her mom finding out and even not wanting to be actively part of slaying in the first episode, as well as why she's so confused about which reality is real and which one she'd rather be in. There is even some moments in Becoming Part 2 supporting this: Buffy: I told you. I'm a Vampire Slayer. Joyce: (haughtily) Well, I just don't accept that! & Joyce: No. This is insane. (takes Buffy by the shoulders) Buffy, you need help. Buffy: (throws off her mom's arms) I'm not crazy! What I need is for you to chill. I have to go! Metaphorically they are referencing Buffy being gay, but since Buffy isn't actually gay, the direct conversation is about Joyce thinking she needs to send her daughter back to said asylum (or get her more help in some other way as the asylum would have been Hank's idea in my mind) because she's still believing it even after she herself saw it and is already trying to block it out, as Giles said people do at the end of The Harvest: "People tend to rationalize what they can and forget what they can't."

[@nathanielbacon2661]

I cant believe you cut out the part where Joyce tells Buffy to believe in herself "You have a world of strength inside you. You just need to find it again". I think that's Buffy's biggest character turning point in the whole season. She hasn't been ok since her mother died. She lost faith in herself. And this whole time, what she really needed was to be reminded, by her Mom. And that gave her the strength to let go of the past.

[@bobapjok4241]

one of my favorite episodes

[@martophrenia]

that fucking ending 🤣🤣

[@visarr]

She hadn't drunk the cure yet.

[@MrSupertallblackman]

What exactly is Xander supposed to do? He has no idea where Anya is. It's the early 2000s he can't just track her cell phone.

[@LeoniaCunha]

Alley forgot about us..... right when we were about to get The episode a can fairly say, most of us were waiting for.... Hope she will remember us one day.

[@williambowman1660]

Excellent reaction and understandable response to a first viewing of this episode. Review this episode much later after you rewatch Restless. Those are the 2 deepest dives into the complex mind of Buffy Summers. For me it puts this episode more into focus and what is real and what is poisoned mind. The final shot is the last part of Buffy’s poison that has altered her view of reality. We have learned in the past on BTVS that demons destroy their foes. By using their mental weakness, emotional fears, and personal history against them. Buffy has been brought back to life and it is hard. Being a popular, pampered 15 year old Valley Girl sounds better than Reality.Buffy has lost all control. She did not ask to be a guardian to a sister, be financially responsible for her Mothers medical debts, and even being alive. Buffy can choose what most do, hide and reinvent herself like Chantrelle, Riley,and even the 3 Bozos .But Buffy makes what I think is her most important choice since killing Angel… choosing reality with all of the hardships and no guarantee. She could stay in the asylum loved by her parents and a patient safely in a hospital the rest of her life. But Giles has it right, she is a hero and despite wishing for ease, she always takes the brutality of the truth.

[@9ansean]

I've said before that a major theme of this season is fear of adulting and Buffy having to decide about wanting to go back to how thing SUPPOSEDLY were is the perfect manifestation of this idea. By trying to undue the life you have know and justifying it as "too crazy to be real" can speak to a feeling so many of us might have had about how we believed our life "should have turned" compared to some place we were before. Admittedly I would have the thought the idea of moving backwards might have been more appealing if that alternate time were not also scary, but instead was just want you always wanted. Say she now has Angel as a boyfriend and somebody else fight vampires. See Perchance to Dream a great episode of Batman: TAS for similar plot to see what I mean, but I guess this vision makes more sense with Buffy's own history and trauma. BTW did anyone else noticed the window Dawn was standing behind in the long shot of her pleading not to let this happen! Coincidence or foreshadowing?

[@DCFCfanatic]

This takes me back to when this show was originally coming out. I used to stay up late on Sunday nights/Monday morning on this Buffy fan site and wait for some guy to put up the satellite feed of the latest episode two days in advance. This feed was sent from Fox to the WB network, later UPN. Then they would air it on Tuesday nights. During season 7 Fox made a mistake and sent UPN the wrong episode. I can't remember what ep it was but let's say it was ep 8 but it was supposed to be 7. Ep 8 was put up for view on the site. because of the mistake Fox sent the correct one on Monday night/Tuesday morning. Which meant UPN had to rush to get the ep prepared for that night's airing. But that morning we had two new eps to watch back to back. which meant going one week without seeing a new ep. The back to back was worth it though. Memories.

[@haroldculp4166]

Huh, I never even thought about the fact that Giles wasn’t at the wedding. Maybe he was invited but was like, “It’s Xander…. So no.” Haha

[@chaoscat82]

Everything ok? It's been a month since this...

[@karazor-el9596]

She's quit due not wanting to have to make excuses for spike and deal with the drama

[@chaoscat82]

@@karazor-el9596 :( this is one of my fave reactors, Spike improves later, it would be ok

[@apixieswhisper]

⁠@@karazor-el9596What…. Makes you think she’s going to make excuses?

[@karazor-el9596]

@@apixieswhisper did you read what I said?

[@apixieswhisper]

@@karazor-el9596Yes and it sounds like you’re assuming she’s going to make any excuses. And she hasn’t quit

[@killianlpc]

Normal Again was a very intense episode in which we see Buffy's PTSD, which has obviously been there from the very start continue to manifest itself again. This time it seems even more severe with the scenes in the Institution very harrowing with Buffy seemingly locked in to a psychotic state. We see her turn on all her friends and place them down in the basement with the Demon. Eventually the Psychiatrist Doctor tells Buffy's parents she was 'gone' and a sinister ending where we see the camera pan away to the window in the door in the hospital similar to an X-Files episode. The Trio have becoming so annoying at this point, we can't wait for the revenge that they deserve. This episode is very much in sync with the tone of the whole Season exploring all kinds of dark avenues, and the Psychological effects on all the characters. The reason I think many fans didn't like this episode in particular was because it seemed to question was the world we have seen Buffy in real at all, or was it fantasy in her mind. It's as it was almost a 'Bobby Ewing Shower Moment' ( older people will get that reference ) but it was brilliantly done in that even though we are still not sure what actually is happening, we are left in a state of flux. This episode is very much similar in story and tone to the incredible movie Identity, starring John Cusack, Ray Liotta and Rebecca De Mornay. Fantastic innovative writing again continuing the 'darkness' of S6

[@fabianknaudt2214]

I think the most obvious explanation is that the real world Buffy is the real Buffy, that why vampires are metaphores of teenagers troubles. She is the Mary Sue in her fantasy. All the Annual Apocalypses happens only in Sunnydale, its clearly an hallucination.

[@Madbandit77]

The doctor's played by Michael Warren, who's best known for playing Officer Bobby Hill (not THAT ONE!) on the Emmy-winning cop drama, "Hill Street Blues". Before he became an actor, he was Kareem Abdul-Jabbar's teammate on UCLA's basketball team, the Bruins. He's also Jessica Alba's father-in-law. What a life!

[@jerrettbarkley456]

This season of Buffy is summoning else

[@rosshall6475]

I hope that you are doing well, wherever you are

[@apixieswhisper]

According to her Patreon (I can’t read the full post because I’m not a member), she’s taking a break. I wish she would let KZbin-only viewers know as well because it really sucks for those that aren’t members. Edit: I’m not hating on Alley, I just think it would be nice for her to update her KZbin viewers as well

[@jmwild1]

Excellent episode but with an ending that I don't find as ambiguous as it lets on. Note that throughout the episode there are scenes that are from POVs that are not Buffy's. And the ending is taking place while Buffy is still under the effect and is about to take (but hasn't yet taken) the antidote. It's a very meta story though, which I like, and is a way for the writers to let the audience know that they are self-aware (especially when it comes to the ineffectual nerds).

[@kojiromusashi13]

I'm following along with another reactor who just finished Season 3, and I'm watching your episodes along with hers... but when I saw this upload, I absolutely HAD to watch it!! Definitely my favourite Buffy episode, and probably my favourite episode of anything ever. I've always loved the whole is-it-supernatural-or-is-it-mental, and with this episode ending the way it does, where literally the entire series could be a schizophrenic delusion, and Buffy (and by proxy, all of us) choose to embrace the fantasy over "reality"... just beautiful ❤

[@visarr]

At the end, she hadn't drunk the cure yet.

[@CoasterTrax]

The best part of this episode is the desicion to let the viewers decide for themselves whats real or not. Whedon said that it was intentional. Such a bastard 😂

[@SmallFaerie]

Yes! I choose to believe that both are real - multiverse ftw :D

[@CoasterTrax]

@@SmallFaerie since the show "angel" exicst, the buffy universe has to be real. It would have been more confusing if they would show this episode only from buffys point of few. So basically every scene with only buffy. No scenes with the trio, or how spike and xander hunting the demon. This way it would be much more unclear which of the two lifes is real. But did u know that this episode was originally planned as mid season finale?

[@xyex]

​@@CoasterTraxThe existence of Angel has no bearing on which universe is real. Nor do the views of things other than Buffy. The ending is the strongest indicator that the Buffyverse is fake. Buffy wasn't reacting, she wasn't present in the institution, and yet we had a scene there.

[@CoasterTrax]

@@xyex it doesnt mean anything. This scene could also be part of her imagination. Like: "how they would react to her, if its real and she would be gone now".

[@samanthas8340]

I started thinking what would Giles really be doing in the last episode? Not coming up with much at first and then my imagination created this whole scenario about how interesting it would be if Giles and Xander's imposter hit it off and we got even more insight and opportunity for Xander's growth and and an opportunity for Giles and xander to really improve their relationship. :( Like I get that they want a mess of a season w/o Giles, but honestly from a character perspective it is more strange than not for him to not be there and I wonder if the 'only' reason was because of ASH schedule. The one thing that drives me crazy in this episode is when Buffy says she was in an institution. For me personally, it's a little too late of a Buffy Summers 'fact,' to have not come up sooner. And feelsike the writers are just trying to twist the knife and make Buffy's life just a little more traumatic just for the sake of selling this episode just a little bit more. Which backfires imo.

[@stpetie7686]

A great episode made even better by a perfect ending. I LOVE that ending.

[@atreides1024]

This whole episode is just an exercise in mind f-ery, especially the ending leaving whether or not Buffy's life is real or not open ended. It's also just more trauma the Trio inflict on her that she didn't need making me dislike them that much more.

[@robertmckenna3994]

😳 WTF! Am I in a K-hole?! I have absolutely no memory of watching this episode when the series first aired.

[@danwiesdamageinc]

36:39 And this didn't happen. I guess Seeing Red broke her.

[@insulaarachnid]

I am so glad you loved this episode. I was looking forward to your reaction to it :-)

[@rue...whenwasthis]

i have now binged every single Angel and Buffy reaction Alley has made, THIS EPISODE OMG i always believed that both Buffy's were real and in separate realities, and that our Buffy got infected and managed to travel between two versions of herself.

[@patrickholt2270]

The Life on Mars episode, except that Life on Mars was filmed years later. I assume the poison gets expelled from her system eventually. But that's a level of psychosis no-one should have to go through, even temporarily.

[@coldservings]

After "Once More with Feeling" where Xander sang about his uncertainties about the upcoming wedding, he had three options: Talk to Anya and work it out before getting married (perhaps getting professional counseling) even if it means postponing the wedding, getting married despite the concerns and planning on working it out, again, perhaps with professional counselling and... Well, Xander chose the absolute worst of the three possibilities: not addressing the issues until the day of the wedding and then leaving Anya at the altar. I'm always having to bite my tongue watching reactions to season 1 and 2 where the reactor wonders why Buffy doesn't just tell Joyce about her being the Vampire Slayer. While the reason is hinted at (Ted: "You'll spend your best dating years behind the walls of a mental institution" and Becoming Part 2: "This is insane. You need help") but here we find out why. She tried and they locked her up for it. I'm kind of surprised that Buffy is still employed after running off with Riley in As You Were. There's a "fan theory" that the psych ward is the "real world" and the whole show is Buffy's delusion. It's a common idea for various shows among some people who think they're being all edgy. Personally I think it's banal and boring, a slight variation of the old "it was all a dream" trope. I'm don't think the The Bozos are the "big bad" of this season. Nor is it [spoiler redacted]. Instead, the "big bad" of this season is internal. It's trauma, depression, and addiction. That's what the characters are fighting more than anything else. The Bozos, as I see them, are just an annoyance evoking those mental and emotional issues.

[@snowsleaves]

I agree with you on most of your points, but hard disagree on the fan theory, mainly because I feel like this show does the trope a lot better than most. But overall just here to say that I assume the reason that Buffy is still employed is found in Double Meat Palace, near the end of the episode. Instead of being given hush money for not talking about what was happening to the employees, Buffy asks the new manager for a job. This would probably also lead to the manager being more lenient on Buffy, as (even though as the audience we know she wouldn't) the manager likely thinks that if she fires Buffy then she'll have no reason to keep quiet anymore. Basically implicitly threatened blackmail, even if Buffy didn't intend for it to come off that way.

[@coldservings]

@snowsleaves What Buffy did here was invert the trope. Instead of the main character being in a mental institution with the fantasy world being a delusion, they have the main character being in the fantasy world with the mental institution being a drug/magic induced delusion. Making that work was actually quite clever. The "fan theory" undoes that and returns to the banal "Buffy is really on a mental institution and all the vampires and stuff is just a delusion."

[@MsKimifer]

SO! Joss went on to write some of the X Men comics. In one, he had Scott (Cyclops) Summers make a reference to his cousin who is in a mental institution in LA because she thinks she fights vampires. !!! That line of dialog was cut out of the comic, but for a while there, Buffy was related to an actual X Man and she existed in the Marvel universe.

[@Dilzik]

Oh thank goodness we are back to buffy

[@lynnevetter]

This episode.. episodes like this hurt my brain. I don't want to think that my favorite worlds could be fake. They did this on Star Trek DS9 too. 😭😭 I cannot take it. 😅

[@melissaisloud7404]

I love how this ends. Even the viewer isn’t really sure what is fantasy and what is reality when in truth it is all fantasy for the viewer.

[@TheNoybusiness]

Speak for yourself. I'm quite sure the asylum is fantasy, for the reasons I gave above.

[@visarr]

She hadn't drunk the cure yet.

[@TheNoybusiness]

@@visarr Which is part of why this viewer *is* sure the asylum is fantasy, among the other reasons in my own comment elsewhere on this video.

[@kabauer24]

OMG I need your next reaction after Buffy be TDV or Lucifer please. Love tour reaccions!

[@darkcosmos88]

It's been 84 years....

[@METerrell]

This is a variation on the Tom Stoppard play - Every Good Boy Deserves Favor, which is about a Russian dissident, Alexander Ivanov who is imprisoned in a Soviet mental institute from which he will not be released until he admits that his statements against the government were caused by a (non-existent) mental disorder. (Wikipedia). Patrick Stewart & a few of his Star Trek the Next Generation co-stars appeared in a production of it in 1992 with Stewart directing. The writers for TNG later wrote an episode (6x21) based on it where Commander Riker finds himself in a mental institute on an alien world where he's "visited & rescued" by his fellow crewmates only to find himself still in the institute. Charmed (original) also did their version in season 4, where Piper is kidnapped by the Source of all Evil (a demon) kidnaps her in order to make her take away hers & her sisters' powers.

[@leesmith9299]

i think in season 2 joyce was thinking i don't remember putting my child in an institution because the writers hadn't thought of it yet.

[@arcisas]

My favorite Buffy episode

[@amurmurmur609]

I choose to believe that Joyce is alive, Hank is not a child-abandoning monster and that Buffy responded well to Geodon when it was approved for use in the US later that year.

[@LisaJenkins-ym3pk]

Love ya girl I love your videos they are the besttttt!💗💗💗

[@ShadowThundercat-u1e]

Totally with you, I also love this episode. For me it's because I love what might have happened episodes. And, well, because this is so fucking well done. But I love the maybe it's hoping on in the institution reality, too. Good by.

[@alanpicard3551]

Joss wrote for X-men and Scott summers says he has cousin in an institution who thinks she fights vampires .

[@saberstrike000]

I'm not pulling out my TPBs to confirm, but I'm pretty sure that Pete David's "Fallen Angel" DID reference the asylum from this episode as an alternate dimension. (Its been years since I read it, but I recall another character being trapped in this asylum and Buffy is seen and referenced in the background.) Fallen Angel explicitly is in the same multiverse as Buffy, as a character from Angel had a limited comic series where they visited the city of Bette Noir.

[@peterd9698]

I think there was a throw away line in some Xman comic, presumably written by Joss Whedon, where Scott Summers mentions a cousin in an insane asylum who believes in vampires.

[@TheNoybusiness]

@@peterd9698 His being skeptical doesn't make much sense, since vampires are real in the Marvel Comics universe and the X-Men themselves have fought Dracula.

[@lessismore8533]

This whole episode is like gaslighting 101. Poor Buffy

[@ShadowDogProduction]

This is my favorite episode

[@Kronos74]

What i dont like about this episode is the storu of buffys stay in the hospital feels shoehorned and incosistent. 100% joyce would have brought that up somehow when she learned the truth in season 3.

[@blimfark875]

Everyone always underestimates The Trio.

[@darrenbent7601]

This probably has one of the most bizarre endings. Is Sunnydale real, or is she imagining the whole thing...?

[@lynnef1988]

I LOVE this episode!

[@warrengday]

Scared thing I've ever seen. So fortunate I watched the movie before watching the TV show. And it helps SMG played pre-Slayer Buffy in s2 flashbacks.

[@shercahn]

I've been waiting to see your response to this given your field of study. And yes, they mess with us with that ending not telling us which ending is the real ending. Being a therapist myself, I lean towards the whole "show" being in Buffy's head. Other fans go the other right. Neither is right or wrong. Working in an ED when MH patients are at their bottom, I got to see a lot of people having psychotic episodes and how real those episodes are to them (and consistent). We had one lady that was marrying Jay Z but having Obama's baby every time she came in. We had another that had the repeat delusions of bugs/dirt being all over him so he was constantly bathing (and flooding areas but at least he was clean which was a nice change). Others who hadn't showered or bathed because of the delusion of people trying to kill him by drowning. So, yes, I lean towards the Buffy series being all one big delusion.

[@reghunt2487]

My favorite episode. Buffy suffering from sever maladaptive daydreaming to a point of psychosis. My head canon remains that this is the real situation.

[@zemoxian]

The way I see it there are 4 interpretations of this episode. There are two realities. Let’s name them Sunnydale and Institution. They can either be real or imaginary. First let’s dispense with the obvious that neither world is real. They’re both imaginary. That only focuses on the idea that this is a work of fiction and is completely boring and worthless of consideration. I’ll stay within the fictional context. Next up if we take Sunnydale to be real and the institution to be a fantasy. That’s probably the conclusion many can accept. The series is as it has presented itself from the beginning. The only thing messing with this conclusion is the ending. Why would there be a scene after her cure where they’re diagnosing her as completely unresponsive. Imaginary worlds don’t typically persist after you stop imagining them. It’s a problem for some people, I think. I’d explain it as she’s turned her back to the fantasy world and that’s why she’s not responding to it. She’s either about to take the potion or already has and it’s taking effect. That scene is the last vestiges of the hallucinations before they completely vanish like a bad memory. OTOH, what if the Institution is real and Sunnydale is false? We’re seeing the world through Buffy’s psychosis and have been for 6 seasons! She could technically even be in our world the whole time. It has been done before. I think the show St. Elsewhere was supposedly in the imagination of a child according to the finale. And another show’s finale had the main actor wake up from a dream on the set and next to his wife from a prior series the actor had starred in. The whole show was apparently a dream of the character on a different show. I think people are too attached to the characters of Sunnydale to have that scenario be a favorable one. One final possibility is that both are real. In one world, Buffy is a slayer in Sunnydale as we have seen her for six years. In the Institution, _another_ Buffy is psychically connected to the Sunnydale Buffy. This is tragic, but definitely interesting and worthy of exploration. What if in a parallel dimension, Buffy was a potential slayer that was never called. Like Kendra in The Wish episode, Buffy hadn’t died so Kendra remained in training with her watcher but never became a slayer. And what if as a potential she happened to tap into the slayer visions somehow and linked to our Buffy. It must have been difficult to distinguish the two lives. Someone already mentioned the X-Men tie in that almost happened. Then Buffy would be a cousin of Scott “Cyclopes” Summers. Maybe instead of a potential slayer, perhaps she’s a Mutant with a rather unfortunate power. That would also imply that the Buffy Multiverse is connected to the Marvel Multiverse!

[@jwmel47]

If Giles was around, Xander would have had someone to talk to about his feelings and I believe Giles was invited but he knew deep down that it was going to be a disaster.

[@helltioeverygames]

Same director or i don´t know but in Smallville happen the same thing,a little fight and Clark was on a mental hospital,i founded both episodes very similar wich makes me think about being conected by the same creator or something,but too much coincidence. Labyrinth i think it´s the name of the Smallville episode.

[@alooncnej4696]

now the season is really gret like last half of seasons 3 and 5. Clearly the best season for character's development

[@stephentully7883]

This episode was great. Made me honestly question the reality of the whole show. Alternate reality made a lot of sense.

[@9ansean]

Most of the hate this season gets I understand even when I don't agree with it, but the ending to this episode has gotten some criticism that leave me rolling my eyes. That by leaving open the possibility that the institution might be the actually reality, we're so now left doubting anything on this show really happens any more. To which I say, WHY would we need to believe this? Of COURSE Sunnydale and here friends are the reality! The entire premise is based on that. To assume otherwise completely undermines the premise. That are seemingly ordinary, somewhat flighty young girl is the defending of the world against dark forces and encourages others to find their own best potential. That really doesn't work if she's just schizophrenic. Even putting that aside, from a sheer plotting stand point this alternate interpretation just brings in too many plot holes. To quote a certain dubbed anime meme "How did you remember the parts where you weren't there?" If Buffy has just dreamed this all up, how did she not already know about all the villain plans established for the audience before hand? How did she not about all the things her friends did behind her back? Why did she imagine Xander and Anya breaking up what she once called a "perfect love!?" And let's not get started on all the stuff that happened on Angel she wasn't even there for, but still builds off her own lore. No, there's no question which part is the dream here.

[@lessismore8533]

I liked S6 but never felt it matched up to season 2 or 3. But THIS ep is so S3 to me

[@9ansean]

Is anyone else having difficulty getting email notifications for this channel? Well anyone I'm glad to have Alley back in the meantime. Because I've missed out on commenting in a while and there's much I've been wanting to say about what's coming. Including this one. So let's get to it.

[@BinaryHedgehog]

I live this episode!

[@eagleblaze4434]

Imagine if she had killed all of them and then Anya just came back to all of them dead in the basement 😬

[@MrLorenzovanmatterho]

Personally I think it would have been a great ending to the series if Buffy woke up in the asylum and told Hank and Joyce she was ready to go home now. And maybe she did?

[@jacquelinedavidson8604]

Buffy and sister 😊😊😊

[@nathanielbacon2661]

Who said Giles wasnt invited? Maybe he just couldn't come...or didn't want to because he never wanted them getting married.

[@Ana-yc5ox]

She's still uploading videos on patreon for other shows. I think she may have quit Buffy and Angel though.

[@apixieswhisper]

She hasn’t. She finished both shows already on Patreon. Would’ve been nice for her to tell the KZbin-only viewers that she was taking a break though

[@Figgy5119]

​@@apixieswhisperyeah, I've been searching everywhere for just a word on what she's doing. Would have been nice to be told.

[@peterkottke2570]

One can't shake the feeling that she decided she doesn't want to rewatch a certain upcoming episode for editing her reaction for youtube.

[@joseoropeza8894]

Who so many months without a post??

[@airawynsummers]

This is a well-done episode, but I really dislike that mental institutions are always presented like this. I know people that are afraid to seek psychiatric help because they're afraid they'll be locked away and involuntarily medicated. On another topic: back in the 90s-2000s, my friends and I lived pretty close together and we'd always walk into each other's houses without knocking. One friend said that if you knocked and made him answer the door and you weren't the pizza guy, you owed him a pizza.

[@yvetterodriguez2550]

I remember seeing this episode when it aired and was left thinking, "What is this episode? Is any of it real? Was this show really about a young girl with a mental breakdown who created her own world to cope with her mental illness?" I had the rug pulled out from under me. I still wonder if this whole time we've been seeing what she's been imagining since the start of the show 🤯. Could you imagine? This was hella trippy and I hated it 😂 And yes, SMG is phenomenal. She really gave us those horror vibes when she just walked around the house like Michael Meyers, almost accepting that demons aren't real and she's looking super creepy lol. Yes! Loved it! ❤

[@visarr]

At the end, she hadn't drunk the cure yet.

[@yvetterodriguez2550]

@@visarr I know. Put that aside for a sec. Imagine if Buffy did lose her mind and the show that we've been seeing is her trying to cope with her mental breakdown by creating this world of monsters. And when we see the other side with the doctor and her mom and dad, that's a brief moment of her getting back to reality. But she never gets well and stays in this mental state of being a "chosen one". There is no such thing as monsters. Imagine that being the reality of the whole show. She's literally in a mental ward locked in her own mind. Knowing that there's a possibility that the entire show could all be in Buffy's head, is chilling to the bone. None of it is real. Like what?? 🤯 That's a scary thought.

[@rpgober3048]

Good yo see ya!

[@LegoGBlok]

is she gonna upload the rest of this seasons episodes to youtube?

[@apixieswhisper]

She is but she’s taking a break

[@TheLORDofTOXICITY]

@Alley- when I tell you how this absolutely SHOOK the fandom back in the day...I cant describe it How different would it have been if it occurred today? Yikes My final analysis is that the asylum world is fake. Otherwise, you cant explain Angel and her s show

[@thestoicsoliloquies4041]

Just a thought, it's not too late- you can just stop watching before those last 4 Buffy's in a row. Just quit the show on a high note. You could start reacting to something else instead. No? Well, don't say I didn't give you the option... whatever happens next in the show is your fault for continuing to watch. 😁

[@kevinlevin9651]

Im still on s4e17

[@menachemsalomon]

In the real world, Hank is a loving father and does his best to take care of his daughter that, _nebach,_ is institutionalized. They brought back the actor, whom we've only seen in a few scenes in Seasons One (where he came to town to bail on Buffy and tell her he doesn't really enjoy their visits) and Two (in the flashbacks in the finale). Personally, I'm okay with the scenes in the institution taking place in our world, and the rest of the show in a world of its own, which we call the Buffyverse. Except that the doctors are rather specific about what's going on in the Buffyverse, and I don't know if a person with that sort of diagnosis (for real) would be able to tell the doctors all that detail. But I'll chalk it down to poorly written red herrings, which are common enough even in _Buffy._

[@4everbuffylover]

I was with you until you said it was on the same level as *Ted*. Normal Again is actually a good episode 😅

[@robertcringle4865]

Welcome to the real world.

[@Nicamon]

02:34 - 02:46 I literally *just* watched Thor/Nick's reaction to"Forever"and when he said"where do we go from here"I commented with 🎶!😂 06:33 - 06:41 🤣🤣🤣🤣We _do_ say hi like that when we have a certain level of closeness.😊💚🤍❤ 07:25 - 07:28 Hey! It was a kiss on the _cheek!_ It's a friendly kiss! 13:16 - 13:20 Ideal reality?The one where she's locked in an insane asylum?🤨Are you for real,Dawn? It's so fascinating the possibility that the asylum AU _is_ the real world and Buffy _is_ actually hallucinating the whole show _and_ the spin-off too!!@.@

[@MrOneILoveALot]

Why did you stop posting Buffy and Angel?

[@tiamod]

She’s taking a break. She told her Patreon a while back. Which I only found out through a KZbin comment of a Patreon subscriber. Not to sound too entitled but I feel as though she could have at the very least left a quick message on KZbin because people worry but perhaps that’s just me.

[@apixieswhisper]

@@tiamodThis I agree with. And if you mean my comment, I’m not a Patreon. I just peeked😅

[@Ana-yc5ox]

@@tiamod She is doing other shows still just not these two. I don't subscribe to her (or anyone's) patreon but you can still see the titles of her recent uploads.

[@apixieswhisper]

@@Ana-yc5oxShe already finished Buffy and Angel on Patreon

[@abbesatty9498]

@@apixieswhisper Based on her Patreon posts (I can only see titles), the most recent Buffy/Angel uploads are the same as what in her KZbin (buffy 6x17). Other series are as recent as couple of weeks. Probably she's taking a break from Buffyverse.

[@seanthomas3091]

Top 1 episode tbh.

[@CvSp22]

My most hated episode, cause of this type of asylum story and especially the end scene. Hate this in all shows, when they questioning the inshow reality. We know it's fiction, so what's the deal to make us to choose between to fictions which is the less fictional one? I decided to take this final scene as an end joke, like in 'Castle', when after a murder case on a scifi con was solved they zoomed out and an alien ship lift of.

[@IndieFilmmaker82]

Anyone know why there hasnt been any uploads in months? Hope everything is okay...

[@apixieswhisper]

Apparently she’s taking a break according to a post from March 9th on her Patreon. She really leaves the KZbin-only viewers in the dark a lot. :/

[@apixieswhisper]

@@abbesatty9498 She finished Buffy on Patreon at least over a year ago. The Buffy reactions she’s posting now are the edited ones from KZbin

[@abbesatty9498]

@@apixieswhisper Got Ya!