Amsterdam Police Carbine: 8mm Mauser for the Carbine/SMG Squad

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In the wake of World War Two, much of Europe was awash in small arms - but there were still organizations looking to purchase new arms rather than use the available surplus. The Gemeentepolitie Amsterdam (Amsterdam Municipal Police), for example, formed a Submachine Gun and Carbine Brigade in 1948 to act as a response unit for situations beyond the scope of a typical police officer. They would use available British Sten guns for the SMG, but the only carbines readily available were leftover German K98ks. The Municipal Police opted instead to place an order for brand new carbines from FN. However, they only wanted 245, and FN was unwilling to make a special order for such a small quantity.
Instead, the Police piggybacked on a 1950 order for 20,000+ carbines by the Dutch East Indies Army. Two hundred additional guns were added for the Police, which differed only in their roll marks. These carbines were chambered for 8mm Mauser, with a "J" crest for Queen Juliana. They retained a bayonet lug, but bayonets were never used by the Police. They also retained the dual sling options form the East Indies pattern, but immediately upon receipt the Police armorers ground off the left-side wrist sling swivel, as it tended to interfere with a good shooting grip and was not necessary for municipal use. Many other Dutch law enforcement agencies also purchased Mausers around this time, but only 200 went to Amsterdam specifically.
Within only a few years, the use of carbines in 8mm Mauser began to be questioned. The recoil and muzzle blast form this cartridge in such a short barrel was punishing, and the municipal police really did not need such a powerful round for patrolling the city of Amsterdam (over penetration was a significant concern!). By 1965, all the police Mauser carbines were replaced with surplus American M1 Carbines, which were really far superior arms for the law enforcement role.
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[@SiloEntertainment]

The "gemeentepolitie Amsterdam" was not very close but I appriciate the effort :)

[@BrassowGaming]

Why did you not disclose that you are trying to sell this? It is disingenuous advertisement for your own gunbroker items.

[@ralr]

Being from Amsterdam and following Forgotten Weapons for many years this makes me a very happy camper. Thanks Ian!

[@epicbanana4317]

'Buying less than what you need because of budget reasons.' Classic Dutch move that we still use alot nowadays.

[@Tidebo1]

You're pronouncing it like a Finn would. You've noticably spent a lot of time there hahaha.

[@genericpersonx333]

I am sure FN was, internally, amused that the Dutch for ordering so many silly carbines in 8mm. I would not be surprised if FN didn't send a few letters gently questioning the customer about their more dubious requirements, so as to avoid the massive inconvenience of having to make changes halfway through production or worse. Lucky for FN, looks like the Dutch were committed to their bad idea, but we get a good historical firearm out of it, so win-win for posterity and FN's bottom-line.

[@gravityskeptic8697]

After WW2 the Indonesian war of independence started. In response, the Dutch government sent 140.000 soldiers to Indonesia. Since the Allies, especially the US, rightfully had doubts about the Dutch refusing the Indonesia their independence, they didn't want to give the Dutch more weapons. The M1 carabine would have been a better option for police use, and the US had millions of those gathering dust in warehouses.

[@theShermanator]

You trying to pronounce "Gemeente Politie Amsterdam" was great, I'd say you had it like ~60% right haha

[@mef736]

Making a video on something you're selling on gun broker???? Well played sir. Thanks for the info anyways!

[@danielwang2956]

Instead of a flashbang, open the door and fire one of these into it

[@buncer]

“They wanted to order 20,000; they ended up ordering 5,000 carbines for budgetary reasons.”

[@motog6436]

I want to hear more about the genius salesman who convinced countries to buy new small arms a year after WW2 surplus flooded the market.

[@vosjetheking]

Great video Ian! I am the proud owner of one of these guns. But i have the Wilhelmina carbine variant. This one was made before 1948 when Juliana took over from Wilhelmina. The contract was for 5000 rifles for the dutch 'rijks politie' (state police) and also made by FN. You can recognize these rifles with the W crown stamp on them. The 5000 rifles were built in 1947 and 1948 and i own serial number 1473. Also in 7.92x57 mm with the same barrel lengt. Shoots huge fireballs and kicks like a mule!

[@marks_sparks1]

04:20

[@barthoving2053]

Wilhelmina abdicated in 1948, she died in 1962

[@hans-joachimtenhoope1744]

Gemeente Amsterdam.

[@ryanjohn8035]

I got very lucky in finding one of these rifles at a gun show 2 years ago. Paid under 400 for it, I have dutch heritage and always wanted a dutch rifle. When I bought the rifle I had no idea what I purchased, the crest had been wiped. However the FN roll mark remained. Thanks for the video Ian! There was little information on these rifles.

[@camthepenguin]

Man I love this channel! Literally the only place you can learn about firearms without someone saying “oh that Gun is from call of duty” or just swearing every five seconds. Keep up the good work man!

[@merlijnwiersma7801]

Queen Wilhelmina didn't die but abdicated in 1948. She died in 1962. Crested W carbines ('Wilhelmina karabijnen") are reasonable common in Dutch shooting clubs.

[@wilsonlaidlaw]

Doumoulin Frères of Milnort near Liege, were building carbines slightly earlier, from 1948, on FN supplied actions. The majority used the heavy square bridge magnum length action, chambered for either 0.275 or 0.375 H&H Magnum. I had a 1948 built carbine, full stocked and originally in 0.275 H&H. When that round became obsolete in the 1960's, It had been returned to Edouard Binet in Brussels, from whom it had been originally purchased (as a wedding present) and was converted to the nearest modern equivalent, 7mm Remington Magnum. With its 18" barrel, the muzzle blast and recoil was definitely on the fierce side. I replaced the original Teil 6 x 30 scope with a Zeiss 6 x 30 with longer eye relief and a rubber eye buffer, after suffering a "Wetherby eyebrow" incident.