The Post-War Legacy of the FG42

utreon.com/c/forgottenweapons/
/ forgottenweapons
www.floatplane.com/channel/For...
Cool Forgotten Weapons merch! shop.forgottenweapons.com
If the FG-42 was such a great gun, then why didn't it get used after the war? Well, two answers...
1) It was crazy expensive to make and there weren't very many lying around for people to use in quantity after the war.
2) It was used; there was at least three post-war development projects based directly on the FG-42. One was the British EM1 Korsac Light Automatic Gun, one was the Swiss WF Bern competitor to the SIG Stgw 57, and one was the American M60 GPMG. So let's have a look at all three, and what they did or didn't take from the FG!
Contact:
Forgotten Weapons
6281 N. Oracle 36270
Tucson, AZ 85740

[@R2debo_]

The FG42 is fascinating to me for a number of reasons, but I think the most impressive one is the fact it may be the only time in gun development history where a bunch of nigh-impossible specifications were given...and then basically met entirely. That just doesn't happen.

[@johnnymcneil1574]

Exactly goring rlly came to the gun manufacturers and was like hey so I need a heavy sub machine gun with the range and accuracy of a standard bolt action rifle and it also needs to be lightweight enough for paratroopers.they must have looked at him like he was on meth prolly cuz he was but yk

[@IceWolfLoki]

@@johnnymcneil1574 maybe he also added "and I don't care how much it costs" (again because he was drugged up and had been stealing expensive things from all across Europe and only needed them for essentially his special forces and not to equip the whole Wehrmacht )

[@JohnHughesChampigny]

The only minor problem being that the specifications were silly. Oh, wait, that reminds me, there was another time when German weapon designers managed to successfully design a gun that met silly specifications -- original CETME development chambered in the 7.92x41mm CETME Cartridge. See: kzbin.info/www/bejne/rXSmpGRvqMx5gtk

[@AshleyPomeroy]

It's also fascinating how many attempts were made to copy and improve it that ended up making it worse.

[@JohnHughesChampigny]

@@AshleyPomeroy The problem with the FG42 was that it exceeds in cool. But as a military weapon it's pretty much crap. Too expensive, too fragile and just the wrong idea. The MP43/STG44 broke new ground in what kind of weapon the infantry should be carrying, the FG42, not really.

[@SamuraiPie8111]

Being a gunsmith in the post WW2 years must have been so fun, just making weird experimental firearms and seeing what works

[@holdinmcgroin8639]

Bane?

[@TheMylittletony]

It seems like a huge crapshoot, I get nervous just thinking of it. So many 'paths' to choose, doctrines, different calibers, so much but at the same time so little info to go on.

[@christineshotton824]

The most fun part would have been focusing on design and experimentation without having to worry about the ATF mamluks kicking in the doors of your workshop.

[@amogusenjoyer]

Gunsmiths at the time must have been big guys

[@grayharker6271]

In the 70s my unit sponsored a nato FTX in Honesfelt Germany. It was to try and consolidate all the different nato equipment and find the best, eliminate the worst. I ran an M-60 range where all the different members shot the pig. One interesting thing was all the Bundeswher officers that were used to shooting the German MG had such good trigger control they could shoot the M60 single shot! But the best thing was at the end of each day I got to shoot up all the leftover ammo! I got really good at shooting from the hip with a sling! It was like the ultimate weed eater!

[@AshleyPomeroy]

Cue the "hold it down, it's a machine gun!" video.

[@BorisZech]

That single-shot shooting was part of Bundeswehr’s training on the MG 3, even for conscripts.

[@chemistryofquestionablequa6252]

​@@BorisZechwhich is even more impressive than doing it with an M60.

[@BorisZech]

@@chemistryofquestionablequa6252 It was not funny. ;-)

[@timhusk2913]

The pig is easy to squeeze one shot at a time

[@Eric-vs2he]

One the thing i love about this is gun is that instead of a normal selector switch that switches between semi and auto, they gave it a switch that switches between open bolt and closed bolt

[@1lovesoni]

The early CETME rifle prototypes did that, too.

[@alijankhan3330]

That was one of the requirements, to fire semi in closed bolt and fire full auto in open bolt.

[@johnnymcneil1574]

this and the stg 44 have always been my favorite

[@4T3hM4kr0n]

Whenever Ian talks about the FG-42 it's an instant fav

[@geodkyt]

Ah, the White patent gas system of the M60 and M14. But as Army Ordnance officers were writing publicly as early as at least January 1945, it's a system whose core idea is about as based in reality as the Blish lock. Because, as they found when measuring operating sequences with super high speed photography and pressure sensors, by the time the gas piston has moved far enough to cut off the gas, the bullet has already left the barrel and the port pressure has dropped to nearly ambient anyway - which means that before the "gas cutoff" even gets to go into effect, the reciprocating bits have already received all the input energy they're going to get, so it's about as "self regulating" as the AK and it's holes in the gas tube or has block (depending on model). Just as a Blish equipped Thompson is basically nothing but unlocked blowback with extra (and unnecessary) fiddly bits, the M14 and M60 are bog standard long stroke gas pistons with some unnecessary holes drilled in the gas system. The M14 hapoens to be appropriately gassed, while kost versions of the M60 are skightly undergassed.

[@Tallus_ap_Mordren]

Have you ever actually disassembled an M14? I own 3, It is most definitely not a long-stroke gas piston system. It has a tappet, just like an M1 Carbine. You might be thinking of the Garand.

[@spaghettiandmeatballs6471]

Do you have a link to these studies? They sound interesting.

[@DonMeaker]

Interesting that the Kalashnikov was also a long stroke gas with rotating bolt, but dropped the bullpup aspect.

[@andrewfoglesong4831]

I think @geodkyt is correct. If you lookup videos on M14 cycle of operations, the illustrated gas system looks VERY similar to what Ian is describing. My thoughts immediately went to the M14 when Ian started describing the expansion chamber/self regulating system.

[@andrewfoglesong4831]

@@Tallus_ap_Mordren I think he's referring to the self-regulating expansion chamber aspect of the operation rather than long vs short stroke

[@giucas100cassabellis2]

17:01 Actually, I don't know exactly why, just a thought, I believe there is some Russian who tried to implement FG 42 design on his firearms and I am talking about the genius German Aleksandrovič Korobov, who made really interesting and original firearms and I always hoped so badly you could review some of them for us, like his TKB line with bullpup AK-like rifles and even a three barrel LMG. Too bad his guns are little known

[@alexeyeliseev6322]

They are little known and also, AFAIK, mostly exist as prototypes so it's incredibly hard to get a hold on one. It's essentially like owning original Pancor Jackhammer prototype.

[@MartinMizner]

Brandon Herrera made video about him

[@bencampbell5468]

01:56 Ah yes, the good old WW2 era firearms safety. Bulky gloved finger in trigger guard, magazine in rifle, pointing it at two other soldiers.

[@razeel2000]

Yes, that had me raise an eyebrow too.

[@RandallFrequentFlyerFlagg]

Yeah, but good trigger discipline would interfere with his pipe smoking.

[@jeremypnet]

It looks like Montgomery with the gun. Patton is probably just out of frame on the right. And it’s at 1:56

[@bencampbell5468]

Weird, looks like the video got edited and some stuff moved around. it was at 03:17@@jeremypnet

[@abitofapickle6255]

My dad was a M60 gunner for the National Gaurd back in the 80's. He said as long as you kept it clean, it ran like a champ. He also said the slow rate of fire made it VERY controllable. Crazy how that thing is our attempt to copy the FG42.

[@Dominic1962]

It was like we started off with the FG42 to get the tactical equivalent of the MG42. 🤷🏼‍♂️

[@DB-yj3qc]

Well I was a M60 gunner in 89-92 on A.D. as 11B during my time with M60 3 different ones in 3 different units. I found it to be a reliable piece of equipment, yes it does have a few areas that could be better and was with updates M60e3. I personally didn't have any problems with them as long as someone who didn't know squat left "my gun" alone. I had more than one unit armor screw with it and install piston backwards then lace it up or to install lacing wire backwards so plug end would loosen up when fired. I actually got so much practice re doing it with a Leatherman and lacing wire that I would have to do most of the units M60s .

[@abitofapickle6255]

@DB-yj3qc When I was in (Which was 3 years ago) we had the M240 for the M1a2. Great machine gun, but they had to be ran DRIPPING WET. Reason being is everything was so dusty on the Tanks. Makes you wonder if the Military would have made an effort to get the quirks out of the M60 from Day one, we would of had it instead of the M240.

[@muchosgracias3764]

whats with all these weird ass comments in every new video

[@gawkthimm6030]

that M60 connection is interesting, Denmark finally discontinued using the MG3 for frontline infantry troops and adopted the modern M60E4 in 2014.. -So us here In Denmark have still got some German legacy in our machine-guns even when its american...

[@petervandyk7173]

Yes, only it's the M60E6 we bought. I just hope we learned from the US mistakes post-Vietnam, and will know when to replace these MGs, instead of keeping them in service long after they were worn out. A US Army gunsmith/armourer put it this way: "think tissues, not handkerchiefs."

[@gawkthimm6030]

@@petervandyk7173ah ok, sorry messed up that it had been replaced/upgraded

[@petervandyk7173]

@King.Leonidas yes. The MG/62 (Danish MG3) are too worn, too heavy, too hungry, too long to work as infantry guns. Especially our experiences in Afghanistan made it very clear we needed a new infantry MG. And all the field tests were very clearly in favour of the M60E6. And it looks like US Ord has fixed most or all of the problems with the old Hog. Remember: the M60 was a popular MG in Vietnam, most of the bad reputation came when worn out guns were kept in service throughout the late 70ies and even 80ies.

[@petervandyk7173]

@King.Leonidas but the MG/62s are still in service as vehicle MGs, so the frrrrrrt from 1000-1200 rpms can still be heard for years to come 😁

[@BobSmith-dk8nw]

Thanks Ian. Yes - I had no idea. I thought the M-60 was pretty much just developed from the MG-42. Fascinating as usual. .

[@acrienteangelic1862]

Lewis Gun did the rotating bolt and firing pin fixed to the op rod first, Germans copied that into the FG-42 but added the open/closed bolt mechanism. Overall, very impressive design.

[@davidpolityko2628]

Really interesting! One remark - one should take a look at Czech after ww2 developments, there were some machine gun designs, which may have been somewhat of influenced by FG42... just my 5 cents

[@madpackrips]

As a seller of original German WW2 photos for over 20 years, the one weapon I've never seen in an original photo is the FG42 and I've had thousands of photos from Fallschirmjager soldiers.

[@DJJAW11]

... Any idea why 🤔?. I have heard alot of photos where not kept/lost,got rid off etc 😔

[@madpackrips]

@@DJJAW11 I think it was just that rare of a weapon and with around 7000 made it could be that the big money collectors over the years got to cherry pick photo collections before they were sold off to everyone else. I don't even recall seeing an FG42 in press photos or postcards. An original private FG42 photo would easily bring $500 or more dollars. I've sold zf41 and 98b sniper rifle photos for $300 over the years, STG44 for good money as well. Maybe one day I'll finally stumble across an FG42 photo...

[@DJJAW11]

​@@madpackripsfascinating. I have a book ... Fallschirmjager Thomas McGuirl and Uwe Feist Published by Ryton Publications, 1993!. I got it years ago with my dad at a military show,here in the UK.

[@evanl8656]

Probably because the Krauts could never build enough of literally anything to adequately supply their troops and barely built like 8,000 FGs or whatever. That's not too far off the amount of Federovs that were built and those are hens teeth.

[@edwinsmith-jones6205]

Considering how German propaganda machine loved showing off their technical prowess it's surprising there's not many pictures or film of the FG42 in action.

[@ReviveHF]

Also, the MG42 and the Browning Automatic Rifle formed the basis of the development of the Belgian FN MAG. The Belgian designers came up with the idea to flip the BAR action upside down and mate it with the proven MG 42 belt-feeding mechanism. You can say the FN MAG is very much like the AK-47, it was developed using WW1 and WW2 era technology.

[@terrywarner8657]

For all the cleverness and advances of the FG42, there are probably many Allied soldiers and airmen who were quite pleased the Luftwaffe diverted that intellectual talent to that project. Better to make 7,000 very complicated rifles for one branch of the ground forces than 7,000 better aircraft landing gear, propeller reduction gears or aircraft cannons.

[@jdl9679]

Same can be said for all the me 262 and komet recourses that were put into those jets. Yeah awesome but here comes a whole fleet of mustangs at the ready being shipped as fast as they can make them. Same thing goes for the tanks Sherman’s we’re not some big advanced tank but it did what it had to do and did it good enough in mass production

[@peoplehavetherights]

How about the continuing lack of petroleum in aircraft?

[@donaldhysa4836]

They are not that complicated. Thats why allies kept developing them after the war

[@gameragodzilla]

I always found it kinda funny that the European FG-42 influenced the American M60 while the American BAR influenced the European FN MAG.

[@azimisyauqieabdulwahab9401]

Stoner 63

[@khairulhelmihashim2510]

because BAR inventor had briefly worked for FN, influencing some FN designers.

[@JohnHughesChampigny]

@@khairulhelmihashim2510 Briefly? (To be clear, Browning started working with FN in 1897 and was still working with them in 1926, nearly thirty years later, when he died and his legacy was to some extent taken over by his disciple, Dieudonné Saive -- aka "Gift of God Saive").

[@JohnHughesChampigny]

You do know that the company that made the largest number of different versions of the BAR*, including arguably the best versions was FN?

[@matermacej3579]

@@khairulhelmihashim2510 "BAR inventor" is almost an insult to John Moses Browning! He also didn't work briefly with FN, but for almost 30 years until his death.

[@ximthedespot4673]

Just realized something. One of the blaster rifles in the Star Wars the Old Republic MMO has a blaster rifle that is based off the FG42. The barrel is different, no side mounted clip and there's a rifle scope but the stock, pistol grip and front grip are the same.

[@Meyer-gp7nq]

Aktually it’s a magazine 🤓

[@ximthedespot4673]

@@Meyer-gp7nq Whatever potato pataha

[@harolde.lochleitnerjr.8006]

Star Wars has been the legacy of WWII tech with ball turrets on top the list and still popular today.

[@Alex-eu7lz]

Just so happens my drive to work is 19 minutes and 23 seconds, thanks Ian!

[@sionsoschwalts2762]

Ooh! More FG42 coverage! We are super lucky!

[@jagrench62]

The German are so innovative. The fact that they jumped from a bolt action ,that was copied world wide , to some of their later designs is remarkable. As a former German and British technician I can tell you Mercedes had many issues but BMW up till 2008 was a great car. And the VW rabbit/golf was ahead of it time.

[@SpecialEDy]

German cars are terrible in my opinion, I'm an Industrial Mechanic and not an automotive mechanic though. All European cars I've worked on have the same problems as German. The Engineers are too busy wondering if they could, they never stop and wonder if they should. They add a lot of unnecessary or poorly executed features and solutions. As an example, I imagine that an American vehicle would have room to access a particular part and replace it without taking too many things apart, a Japanese vehicle would have a thoughtful access hole to swap that same part, and a European vehicle would require disassembling half of the vehicle to access that part.

[@jagrench62]

@@SpecialEDy yeah did you notice what I said up to 2008 , It seems that after that they just seemed to suck. That is when BMW started putting turbos on their engines and V8s under the hood. They had major problems with their later V engines. They had big problems with chains stretching.

[@jagrench62]

......and oil leaks were horrendous, big money makers though.

[@maineiacman]

All German cars were built badly after the late '90s. To this day they are cruising on reputation alone.

[@richardelliott9511]

Your evaluation of the VW Rabbit is overstated. The Austin Mini and Austin America were ahead of their time, the Rabbit mearly road the wave. In the US, it pretty well wiped out due to mechanical problems and was withdrawn from the US for a few years before coming back as the Golf, with its problems straightened out.

[@michaelblacktree]

I carried an M60 in the US Army. Pardon the pun, but it was good enough for government work. I remember being told I had to use the M60 right-handed, even though I'm a lefty. I wonder if the T44 had something to do with that?

[@Theblackfinale]

Just found your channel from searching up about the FG42, I think it’s a great weapon that is very rarely mentioned in this topic of conversation and glad to see it get some representation.

[@1439241]

A bloody awesome definitive lecture as always 👏🏻👏🏻

[@jessicasimp4459]

The gun that’s on the far right of the video thumbnail looks a lot like the very obscure Rodman XM235. This rarity of a gun is one of the obscure competitors to the FN Minimi, and it’s originally chambered in the proposed 6 mm SAW cartridge. Because of this, it can be a little teaser for my highly requested FN Minimi history episode.

[@davidgoodnow269]

Yes! I've seen the 6×47 cartridges and even surplus bullets, but never found what was supposed to shoot it!

[@larryfontenot9018]

It's ironic that you have your hypothetical Russians saying "we're never doing one of those with bolt-action rifles again", since they _are_ pulling Mosin-Nagants from mothballs and issuing them to some of their troops fighting in Ukraine.

[@SharkHustler]

Good show, Ian - thanks for sharing!

[@roninsct7017]

..I think it's because there where never more than 3-6k FG-42 in circulation and by the end of the war surviving examples were probably in less a couple of hundreds at best and no spare parts vs more than 600k and general availability in spares and mags for the Stg-44..

[@bobhill3941]

Very interesting, I thoroughly enjoyed learning about the FG42 after the war and it's relation to the Browning M2 and the other countries looking at it.

[@jeromethiel4323]

Another shout out to SMG. Very professional, never had a lick of problems, but you are going to wait. I don't even remember, but i think it was close to a year after i put down my deposit till my rifle was ready. But it is absolutely gorgeous. The man does good work. At least on mine! ^-^

[@glennpettersson9002]

It would be interesting to me to have a similar video on weapon ergonomics post WW2. It appears to me alot of designers come up with a concept and then think how someone is supposed to run it.

[@SAS1122334455]

love such historic videos pls do more!

[@4dosmohos]

I love playing Enlisted, I got the paratrooper fg42 with grenade launcher squad during the normandy landing event this past June. I'm super happy to have it digitally since I will never own one in real life

[@alexxu3004]

try easy red 2

[@billyraydavis3400]

Love the video is thanking for all the hard work.

[@theblindsniper9130]

I think their legacy really revolves around pop culture such as Hollywood media and video games. I learned about it from Call of Duty growing up, and it became a fascination of mine. Combine that with it's rarity and I would love to add it to my collection today.

[@stanfordwillis4841]

Those pictures at 3.11 are just amazing.

[@jasonvoisey976]

Great information Ian. Sadly bet I can’t get it shipped to UK if I win it. More in-depth video’s and development please.

[@user-db5qd3wd6z]

You would get your name all over the papers and the morning TV talk shows. It would give the self-appointed guardians of the public morals an awful lot to rant on about. You know, the usual 'ban this lethal weapon, car, vegetable etc' type headlines, that then results in poorly thought out legislation that solves nothing. 😢

[@colonelbeanbagsfishing1488]

Awesome video Ian, it would cool for a post war legacy of the STG 44 video.

[@PitFriend1]

The US was really studying the German’s notes when making the M60. Besides using the FG42 system the feed tray cover is basically a straight copy of the one from an MG42.

[@kantenklaus9753]

I'm late to the party, but the FG 42 hype is still there.

[@hairydogstail]

The Stgw 57 did not use the extreme case blow forward design, but did use a similar concept with a ring expansion to decrease felt recoil that worked very well..

[@DaletheStgwDude]

AFAIK not true, the reduction in the chamber is to cushion the bolt head to reduce bolt bounce, by deforming the cartridge case. It does not make sense to delay movement of the case if there are already flutes to ease its movement.

[@hairydogstail]

Fire the G3 and then the STGW-57 and you will understand..The G3 has a very violent recoil impulse compared to the STGW-57..Bolt velocity is also effected by the case ring expansion in the chamber..The delayed blow back roller lock is not a locked breach and extraction occurs before the chamber pressure has completely dissipated, which is why the flutes were necessary in the first place.The ring chamber with the chamber flutes in the STGW 57 is a more refined way of delaying extraction, softening recoil impulse..@@DaletheStgwDude

[@hairydogstail]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/j2iWi5adbs6WgMUsi=YnUq0qKMhTpuu9x8&t=937@@DaletheStgwDude

[@DaletheStgwDude]

@@hairydogstail The felt recoil of the Stgw. 57 is indeed lower than the G3's, but it is mostly related to the higher weight (1.8kg more), built-in muzzle brake, and a 20% lower bolt mass at equivalent full auto cyclic rate of fire. For that specific feature, I suggest you check SIG patents GB861718A and CH354368A on Google Patents (sadly can't post links here). "The object of the present invention is to minimise the aforesaid disadvantage by arranging for the cartridge chamber to deform a cartridge case therein upon the last part of the forward movement of the closure head or breech block, this deformation taking place against the forward action of the breech block so that a part of the kinetic energy of the latter is used and the impact of the breech block against the confronting end face of the breech is damped and rearward displacement of the cartridge case is either prevented or greatly minimised." Can also send excerpts of SIG trials report 4 501 002 on bolt bounce which clearly states "Durch den Absatz im Patronenlager muss die Hülse gestaucht werden. Dadurch wird der Aufprall des Verschlusskopfes gedämpft."

[@hairydogstail]

By the way, I really enjoy your channel..kzbin.info/www/bejne/gJevfJeKg7ZlsMU@@DaletheStgwDude

[@sinisterisrandom8537]

An iconic rifle. Personally prefer the earlier variants than its later ones.

[@shanebutler5787]

@@Elatenla milled receiver will always be stronger & last longer than a stamped reciever

[@commoncriminal923]

Earlier fg looks so much more useful on full auto, I've handled both patterns deactivated unfortunately, the 1st pattern grip to me is much comfier than the 2nd.

[@Drownedinblood]

That rifle grip don't look comfy...

[@commoncriminal923]

@@Drownedinblood it certainly was, the second pattern is like a handle of a revolver. Feels too front heavy personally.

[@chrais78]

Judging from how much Ian loves this weapon, I guess it makes sense why this was my favorite gun on Brothers in Arms. It kicked ass in the virtual world too.

[@MsJoao101]

I love when Ian gets all nerdy with this German thing...

[@danbendix1398]

Exxcellent description of FG42 operating system.

[@n990]

@n990 0 seconds ago In 1997 or 98 a very good friend of mine, a small arms designer and amazing artist (Ian, I believe you’ve met him at the Shot Show but I’ll not give his name here) travelled to the Aberdeen Proving Grounds Army Ordinance Museum and photographed a selection of the German ‘assault’ weapons in the collection. MKB 42 - MP 44 - STG 44, the early and late FG 42s and one Hungarian AK all in the museums vault and under the supervision of curator, W. Atwater We made life-size light boxes of the images and mounted an exhibition at a gallery in Manhattan’s east village… (before the hipsters) Atwater said, ‘every year this Japanese collector offers us $30k for the early FG… we think he’s crazy’. Thank you, Ian this is exactly how my collaborator n chief described the progenies of the FG 42.

[@ogregolabo]

Most fascinating weapon !

[@TheAustinWoolShow]

I think the main reason it died with WW2 is that it's very much a specialty rifle, meant for paradrops. And by the 1960s there were already rifles that were compact enough to fit the role of paratrooper rifle. The M16 and AKM specifically.

[@bloodhound50]

I would love this thing so much, I’d use it to re enact at the American heritage museums battle for the airfield. Would also look great in my Second World War collection. Thanks for the informative videos as always have a great day

[@davidshaddick3822]

Did you ever talk about how the FG 42 compared to the Johnston?

[@JohnHughesChampigny]

I assume you mean the Johnson LMG? Major difference from the FG42 is that the Johnson is recoil operated, not long stroke gas.

[@exuberance3973]

Good God Ian your truly doing the most detail than anyone else on this weapons platform. great job we love your work 👍

[@maxcelcat]

Sadly I'd be in all sorts of legal trouble if I won that gun. In fact, it wouldn't make it through customs here in Australia!

[@stephanbaumeister4507]

and compared to Germany you're living in unregulated gun heaven

[@sharpe67]

Sorry about your dumb laws.

[@JoshuaC923]

Same here in Singapore....

[@alancranford3398]

Funny off-topic is that more MP-44/StG44 were made during WW2 than US M1918A2 Automatic Rifles (BAR)--about two to one. There were other BARs--100,000 for World War 1, several other nations had different editions of the BARs, but only about 200,000 M1918A2 Automatic Rifles were made during WW2. There were some 400,000 MP-44/StG 44 made--and Ian talks about how few FG-42 were made.

[@JohnHughesChampigny]

Well, of course. The BAR was anearly attempt at what would later be considered am LMG, nobody* would ever arm a squad with more than two BARs, but the idea of the STG44 was that everyone got one. (* yes some idiot probably tried).

[@alancranford3398]

@@JohnHughesChampignyI can name one idiot who put three BARs in a ten-Marine squad: BGen Carlson. His Raiders squads were armed with 3 or 4 M1 Rifles, 3 BARs and 3 Thompson submachine guns. Adding a fourth Marine to each fire team and replacing the Thompsons with M1 Rifles became the 1944 Marine Corps rifle squad that lasted to the present. Once upon a time the Marine rifle squad had three 40mm grenade launchers plus three belt-fed machine guns. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evans_Carlson If my research on the BAR is valid, the prototype BAR fired from a closed bolt and John M. Browning intended the BAR to be an individual select-fire weapon that would be substituted for one or more BARs in the rifle company. At the time (1910) Browning began his prototype, the concept of a crew-served squad automatic weapon didn't exist--the French developed that rifle squad in 1915 and their "machine rifle" team formed half of a radical new rifle squad. The rifle team contained rifle and hand grenades and riflemen. When the US Army got its hands on the BAR, it was used as a crew-served weapon and mandated that it be optimized for full-auto fire; Browning redesigned it to fire from an open bolt and beefed up the weapon to withstand sustained use of the powerful .30 caliber (.30-06 Springfield) cartridge. The FG-42 was designed to do the same thing that John M. Browning designed the BAR for--use as an individual weapon. The BAR existed in prototype form before the concept of the pistol-caliber submachine gun existed, so the BAR was only supposed to replace a service rifle one-for-one, and on a temporary basis. The FG-42 was supposed to replace the submachine gun, light machine gun, and service rifle and be an individual weapon. The MP-44 was also an individual weapon--and for a while the German rifle squad was supposed to be armed ONLY with MP-44-type rifles. The FG-42 was similar in concept to the MP-44 with significantly different execution. Note that the AK-47 was designed to replace the PPSh-41 submachine gun--the SKS was to replace the Mosin-Nagant service rifle and the RPD was the replacement for the DP light machine gun. Eventually the Red Army figured out that their AK-47 could replace every squad weapon. The FG-42 was an interesting weapon but was inferior to the MP-44 as a combat weapon despite having the more powerful cartridge and remaining controllable in full-auto fire. You do have an excellent point--the USA produced 300,000 BARs as crew-served support weapons and Germany produced 400,000 MP-44's as individual baseline weapons issued to every soldier. The FG-42 was a special-purpose arm that was supposed to arm every German paratrooper and gilder-borne infantry soldier. The FG-42 failed on two counts--first, after the Crete operation, parachute operations were a no-no in the German air force (another victory like Crete and we will lose the war!) and the FG-42 was to expensive to issue to every German air force infantry soldier. As a light machine gun, the FG-42 was inferior to most LMGs of the Second World War. As a self-loading rifle, it was too expensive--Germany issued as many semiautomatic and select fire rifles as it could manufacture or steal from the Russians (Polish BARs, while they lasted, were appreciated by the Waffen SS). As a submachine gun it was almost top-notch, except for cost and small magazine capacity--but worked well enough in that role; submachine guns with folding stocks were not universal (see PPSh-41, Thompson, STEN and Beretta submachine guns for reference). Cost and a vanished mission doomed the FG-42.

[@tostie3110]

There is alot of legend attached to the STG44 in media, with movies and video games featuring them a little. Because they were expensive and sought after, and still are. But in ww2 all of those numbers appeared to soldiers only in the last 2 years. There were entire sturmgewehr companies where every soldier had one. Not to mention the postwar production and the small countries that outfitted their army with the combined production and surplus

[@jakubr3831]

an iconic gun in RTCW :)

[@crankygunreviews]

great history as usual

[@jensenwilliam5434]

Thank you for your videos.

[@comiketiger]

This is a fascinating video! So interesting and full of information. Well done brother. God bless all here.

[@ShellshockedRadio]

Thank you for the History lesson!

[@willeatpants7691]

I watched this before going to bed. I'm going to have nightmares about the fg42/mg42 hybrid thing...

[@AlphonsoFrett-xz6pi]

Thanks for sharing 😅

[@rickrooks5060]

Really enjoying these "Ian in a chair" deep dives. Please keep making more!

[@robertkubrick3738]

FG42 was not really full power in my opinion. The ammo was full power but after fire forming, the velocity achieved with standard 8X57 was low. For lack of correct ammo (Norma was $1 per round in 1980 dollars), we used to fire 7.62X51 Nato) in a 7.65X55 1891 Mauser and someone once told me in an aghast tone that the Nato round was far too high pressure. Not after blowing the shoulder forward. It was very mild and I'd estimate it at around 45,000-48,000 and accuracy was better than I would have expected. The resulting fire formed cases were reloadable with about 6mm neck, so reduce powder charges accordingly.

[@coopandcarter]

I have one of the replicas in 8mm mauser. I bought it many years ago, very nice weapon, although the charging handle comes out of its slot quite frequently. Magazines are hard to get and pricey.

[@tombakabones274]

I would love to see you do an expansive video of that Frankenstein fg42 that led to the M60

[@rattlestormrepublic4874]

US Specialist: So we have this really fast full auto german rifle with minimal recoil and a full power cartridge, should we use the recoil buffer on our new service rifle? US General: Nah, just retro fit our old rifle to use a 20 round mag. Specialist: What about the german rifle? General: IDK, make a belt fed machinegun with the same magwell placement or something.

[@randyhavard6084]

The shape of the bitt stock is definitely similar

[@rts3763]

Can anyone make or are there any detailed breakdowns of the operating mechanism of the FG-42? Specifically with respect to being both closed and open bolt depending on the firing mode. For example, after changing firing modes if the gun is ready to fire and the bolt is closed, will you have to pull the bolt back to start firing from an open bolt, or will the first shot fire from a closed bolt?

[@michaelnolan6054]

The Galactic Empire issued them to troops in the Outer Rim.

[@ericbergfield6451]

Enjoyable lineage of the FG42 Ian This is a welcome video, because not a lot of people give credit where credit is due - simply because your average Joe doesn't research this stuff on his own.

[@brandonking9780]

There’s apparently a few of the Bern guns transferable in the US which I’ve always thought was really neat

[@jamefishin3333]

Easily the most fascinating rifle of ww2 (and my favorite in video games)

[@maxo.9928]

The T44 would be amazing to see on film!

[@CamoGuy76239]

I've always loved the look and ideology of the FG-42. So much capability in such a small, yet good looking gun. In short: they're cool! 😎

[@monolith4653]

I never realized that M60 was based on the FG42

[@Love_rainy_days]

Erin, 🕵‍♂Can you compare the Johnson LMG to the German FG-42? Which one would you take into combat? Love the channel, I always learn something new. Cheers 🥃🥃👨‍✈

[@kirkstinson7316]

But isnt the FG42 (other then the semi bullpup) a descendant of the Lewis gun? I know you mention it at the beginning but that means all desendant firearms are from the Lewis gun, not really the FG42

[@shitbag_soldier]

Throw an FG at garand thumb or Brandon Herrera, I'd love a collab with all of you over it. 8mm Mauser hits like a truck and there's nothing else on the market like an FG besides the HCAR now. That being said long time fan of both you and them. Keep up the phenomenal videos

[@jankusthegreat9233]

I heard from John Ferguson that there is a fg42 type weapon that was made in the 50s

[@jackmatthews939]

The Lewis gun is under appreciated.

[@sliceofcheese3890]

I think the buffer in the stock, in-line stock/action with raised sights seemed to be a good idea moving forward

[@davidturcotte5677]

The buffer reminds me of the G3.

[@GardenFootCreature]

Good morning Ian!!!

[@digimurtal]

Ian has a very european understanding of things, -I've noticed in later years. He's a specialist of sorts but then again, you need to understand indepth circumstances, he shines in his analyses like no other. What a sharp instrument he is, still!

[@pazzocane]

hey Ian, i would like you to talk about two pistols that seem forgotten: H&K P2000 and the Beretta PX4 Storm.

[@packratnz]

I have a hand made movie prop FG42 second model that was designed to fire blanks. I think it was made in the UK. Unfortunately it did not have a magazine and I have not found one to fit it. It may be that it used the ZB30 magazines.

[@stardog62]

In his book about machine guns and submachine guns, Ian Hogg mentioned a post World War 2 project by the US Army that failed because a draftsman incorrectly wrote some of the measurements on the blueprint leading to too close tolerances that caused the weapon to seize up after just a few rounds were fired. Ultimately the project was cancelled, but I don't think Ian Hogg identified the weapon by its assigned name.

[@forcea1454]

T24 Machine Gun.

[@stardog62]

thanks @@forcea1454

[@JoshuaC923]

That felt like five mins, great video

[@jpmangen]

Wow FG-42 and M60. Makes sense now.

[@williamzk9083]

I tend to think that had both the FG42 and MKB42 (forerunner of StG44) been authorised for mid rate production in 1942 that a German 14 man squad with two FG42 and 12 StG44 would have been very formidable and well placed to conduct ambushes with panzerfaust and Panzershrek .

[@charlesnewby3449]

Throw in a MG-42 and you’d have the exact make up of the current US platoon

[@charlesnewby3449]

Especially if they had made a belt fed variant of the FG-42 chambered in 7.92K

[@JohnHughesChampigny]

What would be the advantage of replacing the high capacity MG42 by the more fragile 20 round FG42?

[@williamzk9083]

@@JohnHughesChampigny The German Army wanted to arm their squads exclusively with StG44 assault rifles. No MG42, no K98 and no Gewehr 43. The MG42 would be kicked up to brigade level. Such orders were issued. I figure the decision had to be made in 1942 and both the MKB42 and FG42 were well enough developed to start medium rate production. I figure the FG42 would allow the squad some ability at long ranges and sniping on the rare occasions it was needed. The G43 wasn’t ready yet.

[@JohnHughesChampigny]

@@williamzk9083 Well, if their idea was no MG42 I, in my infinite wisdom and massive military experience proclaim them stupid. :)

[@ramungopnek8333]

What about the TRW Low Maintenance Rifle? It certainly looks like it took inspiration from the FG42

[@Yoopee-ld1xo]

The HOG"''' one of my favorites

[@Magikarp-yk7io]

I've not watched the video yet but I assure you that ya left out Stoners relationship with the FG42 or the "German machine gun" as he put it

[@adam3651]

Do a similar video on the stg44

[@markjordan348]

As I remember there were certain parts of the M60 that had to be safety wired to keep the thing from disassembling itself.

[@danwilliams5867]

One thing you forgot to mention was after WW2 the US Army was demobbed so fast that the budget was cut to almost nothing. Development for small arms basically stopped other than some stuff with T44. If not for Korean war the small arms would have died. It wasn't until 1958, 13 years after WW2 , that the M14 was adopted.

[@UWOTM8ification]

very informative video, extremely fantastic shirt

[@messmeister92]

Those previous winners look like they were picked straight from “Ian’s Sweet ‘Stache Society.”

[@penttagone]

Ahh yes, the Fiji-42… gotta love it.

[@grandimehu]

"...I've handled the T44 prototype at Springfield Armoury..." talk about teasing us

[@Johnnyboy633]

Ian is my spirit animal 😅