An Introduction to Celtic Spirituality - Esther de Waal speaks at St Paul's Cathedral

Dr Esther de Waal has a worldwide reputation as a writer, speaker and retreat leader, particularly on Celtic and monastic spirituality. Her numerous books include The Celtic Way of Prayer: The Recovery of the Religious Imagination (new edition 2010); Living on the Border: Connecting Inner and Outer Worlds (2011); Seeking God (1984); and Lost in Wonder: Rediscovering the Spiritual Art of Attentiveness (2003).

[@anthonylangford7797]

I go along with the idea that the Desert Fathers of Egypt and Palastine travelled to Ireland and elsewhere as the Celtic and desert spirituality has much in common.

[@anthonylangford7797]

When I was a bus driver a couple of years ago Esther travelled on my bus. I wouldn't have recognised her but she had a name badge on as she had been on a conference. We had a brief chat about some of her books she had written.

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Wesley was one of the first churches I walked into once was enough I liked what I heard

[@motorcop505]

Dr. de Waal is truly one of the great scholars of Celtic Christianity today. In her writing and her lectures she manages to transcend the bland facts surrounding the Celtic heritage and let the beauty of its concepts and message beauty bloom before her audience. Key to this is her use of poetry to explain the uniques aspects of Celtic Christianity.

[@josephperkins4080]

🤔🤔There is nothing bland about the facts of the Celts

[@themaskedman221]

@@josephperkins4080 True, the Celts were 1100 years ahead of their time, engaging with a variety of Christianity very similar to the reformed tradition. St. Patrick was arguably the first evangelical Christian.

[@stephenowen6083]

Yes but it was disappointing that she said that names of Welsh saints are unpronounceable, only to those who don't know the language

[@mageetu]

This was terrific to hear from Esther de Waal. I am hooked!

[@lukemcinerney7458]

Well it's important to remember that the great 'Celtic saints' such as Columbanus and Cummín wrote letters to the pope which have survived and show that they recognised the pope as the head of the western, Latin Rite Church. This is significant in view of the fact that some people (without historical justification) claim that the Celtic church was outside of the western, Roman-centered, church. The other thing to note, from an aesthetic viewpoint, is that while some may marvel over the so-called Cetlic poems, these are quite free translations generally from the Old or Middle Irish. They have multi laden meanings, and sound quote different (obviously!) in their beautiful originals.

[@themaskedman221]

The Irish Church paid no tithes to Rome for nearly 800 years and only became a papal fief after Adrian (the first and only English pope) sanctioned the English invasion of 1169. By the time of the Reformation, the Irish Church had been under Roman control for only 350 years. It's also important to note that Saint Patrick wasn't an agent of Rome, never preached Romish ritual, and stuck to a strict adherence of scripture whilst entirely disregarding Romish tradition. To this day Patrick still hasn't been canonized by the Roman bishop. The argument for Irish Anglicanism at the time of the English Reformation was that the Irish Church was merely being returned to its original state that prevailed for so many centuries after its founding by St. Patrick. Thus one could argue, historically and convincingly, that the modern Church of Ireland is the true Celtic Church as started by Patrick.

[@chrismclaughlin6582]

Luke McInerney - well said.

[@anthonylangford7797]

The council of Whitby and all that.

[@geordiewishart1683]

Luke, what you yourself have conceded, yet have failed to grasp the significance of, is that whilst Patrick recognised the head of papacy, which he was, he was not the head of the Celtic church, nor held any sway over their rites of worship. The Celtic church is older than papacy. So much for papacy being the church that Christ founded.

[@clivejames5058]

At the time you're talking about, Rome was still part of the one, true, catholic and apostolic Church (ie: The Orthodox Church). That all changed in AD 1052 when they rebelled and left the Orthodox Church unfortunately taking Britain with them - due to its geographical position. Due to the many heresies of the Roman Church, many of us Celtic Christians prefer to align ourselves with the Orthodox Church - if only we could have remained with them after the Schism.

[@DavidJamesBaker]

This was so excellent. Thank you!

[@revjgbryant]

Excellent introduction. I really enjoyed it. Thanks for sharing.

[@vesnastihovic7014]

Beautiful 💓💓💓

[@mwdarc]

As I understand it the Celtic spirituality was persecuted as was the Franciscan Spirituals by the Catholic Church for much the same reason as have many Christians who did not conform.

[@pawelsawicki7003]

Interesting ideas

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

I loved Britain

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

I will say a celtic poem my own may I hasten to add and watch the world

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Celtic is a language that is hard to explain! I can say a celtic poem and goodbye to all

[@pamela74h]

What was the name of the little poetry book she read from?

[@artandtheology]

The Carmina Gadelica. It consists of songs, prayers, and blessings from the oral tradition of the western Highlands and islands of Scotland, originally collected by Alexander Carmichael at the end of the 1800s.

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Let alone speak

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

I will say a poem prayer tonight in celtic wait and see what happens truth

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

On about trading places

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Mountain Ash is Rowant tree

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Treorchy is highest point Treorchy tree of the point of valley

[@stephenowen6083]

The names of Welsh saints are not unpronounceable to people who know the Welsh language, so I don't know why the listeners found that funny. In fact believe it for not, English is unpronounceable to those who don't speak the language, so there is no need to ''other'' the Welsh language. It is a language like any other

[@roonilwazlib3089]

Ish

[@elizabethhorstmann290]

Could those 700 hermetic, poetic, Bardic "saints" in Wales who communicated with nature and wildlife have actually been the remains of the Druids? They had to do something, right? Why not live in a cabin in the woods pray and write poetry as they would have any way just under a different spiritual "guise."

[@bryanpaulspencer9748]

They were Christian saints not pagan priests. Their faith was in Jesus not in sacrificing children to demonic elemental spirits. You might want to ask what spirit is in you that you feel the need to belittle devout Christians.

[@craeddock]

You should read about St Cuthbert and the chapel on Iona . Good example of the love they had for the Pagans around them, St Oran is good for showing the sacrifice they would make to spread the good news to the homicidal pagans around them.

[@jboylan6970]

​@@bryanpaulspencer9748 And you know that the druids sacrificed children? The druids were the original monotheists....they believed in one God that was present in everything.

[@josephperkins4080]

@@bryanpaulspencer9748 there is no proof that the Celts commited human sacrifice

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Abbeys every week in the abbey in peace

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

While business people traded from the city

[@sheepbelow6327]

Learn more about Celtic Christianity kzbin.info/www/bejne/raWXkmN_hNeKrrM

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Church of England etc etc

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Tredegar tree of the cave

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Methodist Church pentecostal church in the 70s brave eh?

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

He needs to retake Britain and it's values back to its heritage

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Caerdigan

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Not in any book anywhere

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Business is in the lions den

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Catholic Church protestant brave enough?

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

I told animal lovers jesus loves the animals they said thank you today

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Poor people lived in villages now the rich live there! Funny how the rich jumped on the village people

[@earthwaterairspiritfireleb5482]

the story of the brown praying mantis.. there was once a brown praying mantis and everyone thought he was a small leprachaun with dark skin.. and they saw his arms as always being in a fighting position, like those pins of the fighting irish and so they stayed away from him.. this made him sad... but he gained a little bit of green from his jealousy, one day the forest was in trouble.. and the brown praying mantis one of the last praying mantises, rose as a hero to the challenge. He surrounded log cutters with mushrooms that caused them to think he was larger than the sky and he prayed with his arms that looked like they were ready for battle no matter how he felt though he was a peaceful soul. The would be logcutters then ran away thinking they saw a tree monster (barky with a bit of green). But as they were running, and they never looked back, one of them stepped on a stick that flew backwards and struck the mantises arms... bending them downward.. they did not see him but he was in pain.. the humans had spread a story in their town of the haunting and no one could cut trees anymore.. instead they saw they had to plant trees because they had taken too many, God is displeased said the priests. When mr. Mantis healed his arms were then bent down always as if in meditation.. though he could use them less.. he was happy to be more friendly looking finally.. and other insects and fairies told stories of the hero mantis who saved the forest from humans many times his size alone.. though there were not many other mantises left. Many insects were attracted and mated forming new kinds of bugs in the forest today and they were the most meditative spiritual bugs.. meditating mantises though their form was many and they were all colors.. so they said they came descendant from the land of wanti.. and to honor their origin they worshipped pronouncing YOMO instead of YHWH, Because it represented their fathers arms being moved downward by fate into meditation after many years of only prayer, they later found these were the yamas - wanti jewish folktale גְמָל שְׁלֹמֹה Chickasaw trail of smiles

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Devil is the Prince of darkness

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Living in the home counties was for the poor

[@earthwaterairspiritfireleb5482]

Ostara; There will not be Nazism or slavery again, even if karma is bad.. jews/the myriad cultures of spiritualist and original souls and peoples of the world thrive together. There is more love in the world than ever.. everyone can shapeshift.. everyone is a part of everything.. enjoy.. no evil is really possible. Heaven is here now. every day is a holiday. easy mode.. there will be no bombs, but there will be a lot more fun, for everyone, of all kinds, a lot more good books. because people live together, there is no ghetto and because people are actually trees, there will be trees everywhere, aloha/loving kindness! ive made violence impossible... and increased the love capacity in all beings.. enjoy, and be free, no seriously, do whatever you want, one love to all, I don't judge! there is no sin! spiritually clean! - God *Shabbat*

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Celtic is hard to decipher

[@joycedupuy8751]

Aww really wanted to listen to this, but she's comes across so pretentious.. 😴

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Not litteraly

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

If you understand celtic then Barry means spear! Research please! To do with the face! This is why I don't look at faces bowed head

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Kings Charles will be a good King and I don't say that lightly

[@roonilwazlib3089]

I hold opposing opinions

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

@@roonilwazlib3089 roonilwazib! You can hold opposing opinions like a true brit

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

They want village life while the poor live in run down suburbs made by the rich

[@thingamejignobodyknows4346]

Devil is a reality he is nasty for real! I have nothing to gain by lying about this

[@JudithMatta]

Francis of Assisi was mentally unstable, calling himself "Jesus" at the very end of his life. This is a sign - very usual - of one who has no boundary between the "divine" as he imagines it (not revealed by Holy Scriptures nor Holy Tradition) and himself whom he views obviously as a saint! The Celtic Orthodox had prayer and Divine Liturgy as well as the Psalms to guide them into God's presence with their Love of Christ "fired" by the baptism of the Holy Spirit. The confusion here comes from viewing externals and not listening to the words of (ie St Cuthbert) Christians who magnify Christ and love Him and nature around them, and one who has no center in Christ but is himself the source of his imaginings about God. This is common the RC by the way, who exist to see "visions" and cannot live the Truth of Christianity since Scriptures are unknown to them. (I was trained as a novice-nun by Jesuits and know the RC philosophy very well.)

[@kenf3897]

Jesuits are the catholic churches hit men (women) .... lo

[@sevenswords8781]

what a lot of old rubbish...

[@aidanrileyaugustinebickel6552]

Utter bullshit. To say that Catholics are ignorant of Scripture (to take the least of your lies) is nonsensical, we read it multiple times in our Daily Prayers and several times during our chief worship service (Mass). Most of us recieve a Bible (traditionally, though not mandatory) on our First Communion, and many of us study ours daily, whether we got them then or later. I, for example, am presently training as a lay reader (lector) for my parish church, to read the Scripture during Mass. Also, the Jesuits are an exclusively male order, there are no Jesuit nuns. Many branches of female orders (particularly the Sisters of Charity, if I recall, although I may be thinking of a similarly named group of sisters) have a close working relationship with Jesuits, but none have an official connection. Also, there is no official "RC philosophy", although Thomism is the most common variant. Such philosophy is greatly varied and is quite a lovely tapestry. And your comment about St. Francis is an outrageous falsehood and a slander against a truly great man. Kindly pardon the cursing at the beginning, but such nonsense makes me angry.

[@oceanecastelnau9821]

@@aidanrileyaugustinebickel6552 Thank you brother. Nice to know you exist. 👊🏆

[@soft9240]

Do you make reference to Francis experience in La Verna mountain? Were did you read, in is authentic biographers, that he calls himself Jesus??

[@HChartierKJV]

1 Corinthians 14:34-35 King James Version 34 Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law. 35 And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

[@siriusalien2977]

This is a cultural point of teaching and does not speak to salvation or the teachings that make Christianity unique. Even today, in synagogues, the women, in a separate room, aren't worshipping, but chatting/talking. Very distracting. Paul, since Christianity is a teaching tradition, was asking the women of that culture to be quiet and learn. TIMES HAVE CHANGED

[@kilowhiskeyalpha6078]

Seems quite harsh to me, I doubt very much that the verse would be endorsed by Yeshua. The Magdalene was a Priestess who w as favoured by Yeshua above all others.

[@candyclews4047]

Well, I'm a woman and I want to learn. Better to imprint on your heart, SafariSamUSA, Galatians 3:28 - "there is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free; there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus".

[@oceanecastelnau9821]

Thanks. Now take your 3 angry letters and sit down.

[@geordiewishart1683]

So Candy, are you saying Christians have no gender now?