Anglican Unscripted 895 - RADFEM, Drones & CofE

[@danielhixon8209]

William Abraham, the Methodist evangelical of Blessed memory, was my systematic theology professor in seminary. He used to say “if we keep electing politicians as bishops, that is exactly what we will get. And that will be God‘s judgment upon us.“ He was talking about the United Methodist Church, But the Church of England should heed his warning.

[@royquick-s5n]

How many scrutinize the transcripts of clergy, regardless of denomination, before they are employed within a church, e.g. how many courses have they had in scripture and theology? For years I have suggested the examination of clerical credentials just in choosing a parish. For Anglican clergy, what do their transcripts evince of Anglican history and liturgics? I have run across some dubious credentials in the past. It seems to me those who have impressive credentials have the least to fear and might even welcome it. Sixty or more years ago I remember my father drawing my attention to a Business Week article on an Episcopal diocese trying to find a way to employ more pastorally inclined bishops. I remember a Church of England priest who had come stateside remarking how he thought Anglican clergy were generally better prepared than clergy of other denominations. 🤔

[@brotherathelstan8818]

George was right when he said that Stephen Cottrell is 'cut from a different cloth to Welby' and stronger. I cannot envisage Cottrell resigning at all. He loves the power, the privilege, and lacks all humility. He revealed his true colours when he publicly ridiculed a members speech at General Synod not long ago, and only apologized to him later - in private.

[@torrance409]

In the UK "taking legal advice" is a standard CYA response for doing inappropriate, dodgy, or questionable things. The UK Post Office scandal inquiry heard that response nearly daily. If a lawyer, especially QC or KC. says it is legal then there is no problem, so goes the managerial thinking. The C of E is no different.

[@RaymondCopplestone]

"Clergy must be above reproach." Timothy

[@787Earl]

God bless you, thank you

[@carolleonard5780]

Drone sightings are now in Massachusetts and up to Maine. Merry Christmas to both of you and your family.

[@cdy1952]

A blessed Christmas to both of you and your dear families! Greetings and prayers from Hong Kong! 😊✝️❤️🔥

[@UrsulaPainter]

Is there no Shepherd in the UK who is willing to publicly fall on his/her knees in tears and repentance to the wounded heart of the loving Christ?

[@royquick-s5n]

It would seem from reports that Helen-Ann Hartley would stand up with the Union Jack in hand as Joan of Arc stood with the French flag.

[@royquick-s5n]

Thanks!

[@Magnus359]

Thank you gentleman good show.👍

[@davidmorrison2739]

I was a movie buff in the days of Abbott and Costello. But I have to ask- is it an accident that the programme was about C of E bishops and drones?

[@richardroberts1171]

The Consecration of The Rt Rev'd Darrell Critch, priest from the Anglican Diocese of Canada, formerly ANiC now bishop in Madagascar

[@johnsbox]

Hi bros. Just here because I love the show. No need to comment about my comment! Merry Christmas to you both. John from Poland.

[@marmeemarch7080]

Love your avatar!

[@sandiemarian304]

Also thank you for the reminder. Wishing you both a merry Christmas and a happy New year. Also a good rest and refresh.🎉🎉🎉🎉 God Almighty is an amazing God. Sandie London GB.

[@johnhudghton3535]

What an excellent show. Well done chaps.

[@paulgrayshon1375]

How are you this week George?

[@georgeconger2850]

Busy, busy, busy

[@briankelly5828]

We say "Chew-dor" in Englqnd., as in "chewed or mangled". The Tudor era was pretty chaotic for the Church of England, of course.The only shocking thing about the Tudor story is that he's heterosexual. How did that happen?

[@johnw1743]

Is this Hartley's bid for a big promotion I wonder? Also love the American pronunciation of 'Toodor.' Guess that name doesn't get much outing in the States :)

[@johnhudghton3535]

Even though Helen- Ann Hartley and I are theologically diametrically opposed, I think here, she is being an " honest broker ". I do not see this as a "power play" rather jyst trying to do the right thing. I applaud her and do not suspect an alterior motive. I suspect she has damaged her prospects for preferment by upsetting the establishment. I pray God will give her courage to continue to be prophetic.

[@Matter_C]

@@johnhudghton3535 with all the dealings I’ve had with her she’s come across as wonderful person, brave and of great integrity.

[@marmeemarch7080]

I was wondering about that name. . . 😂

[@josephrankin2248]

Your comments that in the South people will take care of problems bothered me. When I was growing up decades ago, these things didn't happen because we lived in a Christian nation and people respected each other and valued people. Today, as I heard someone say, starting in the 50s the parents wanted to give their children everything they didn't have. They did, but they forgot to give them religion and the morality that comes with it. Each generation it has gotten worse, evil is flourishing. Now we make up our own morality. We can all be what we want and everyone must love us. So wasn't the young woman who murdered those people just doing what society told her she could. Decide who she was, choose her morality are and act on them. Shouldn't the secular world praise her for acting just as they taught her? The only way to prevent these things is not guns but our Lord Jesus Christ. The nation must return to him to have a future.

[@philmorrow2446]

I vote George Conger for Archbishop of Canterbury!!!😉

[@royquick-s5n]

Being an Episcopalian, he might fade in with the run-of-the-mill Church of England clergy, but with the Anglican Network in Europe? There are doctrinal differences in morality with those aligned with GAFCON and the Global South.

[@royquick-s5n]

On a web site that identifies itself as Anglican and "orthodox" a moderator who interacts with bloggers seemed to get irate at the very mention of George Conger's name. I suppose it was an ACNA versus TEC difference. It would seem George Conger, who is an Episcopalian, might blend in well with CofE clergy, but not necessarily with the Anglican Network in Europe and GAFCON.🤔

[@TheDCinSC]

The Air Force opened Project Blue Book in the late 50s and it was closed in 1969, some eight years before Close Encounters of the Third Kind.

[@richardmckinney8179]

Depravity rises to the top, not sure why stating obvious serves any purpose

[@royquick-s5n]

Peter principle? 🙂

[@marmeemarch7080]

Muddying the waters in the church scene in Brazil is the fact that the Roman Catholic church has become very debased by syncretism. Many missionaries have been strongly encouraged to avoid any similarity to that communion, such as having even a (relatively) simple crucifix, or vestments. Perhaps following a liturgy is actually a point of suspicion in this context. So I think this is an example of the general culture contributing some messiness to the situation of the church.

[@royquick-s5n]

A central problem? Should culture transform the Church or the Church transform culture? 🙂

[@marmeemarch7080]

@royquick-s5n well, in this case, it's the culture of and between the churches that's the problem. The Protestants are (over) reacting to the flaws of the Roman Catholics, in an effort to transform the culture, but imho they've now made their own mission more difficult. It's human nature to thirst for a more transcendent experience when encountering the Almighty. To react against witchcraft, which one should rightly do, is good, but one shouldn't go too far and remove all the nonverbal and symbolic and echoes of mystery. But I am not there in the thick of it, so maybe I should not be too critical.

[@Mark_Dyer1]

Hope you're enjoying the great Advent Hymns at this time of the year, Gentlement! Just finished reading 'CONCLAVE', by Robert Harris; having read, and heard, mixed reviews on KZbin (including Gad Saad's excoriating one). The story was begging to be made into a film by Hollywood; because it does - inteed - feature 'gender misalignment'. However, the ending is weak: sure, the candidate may not have been exposed to real male bodies; but what of Classical statuary and the paintings of Old Masters? However, my point is that two arguments are powerfully made in the book: a) that, if you seek for a 'super-saint' among human beings, you are unlikely to find one, and b) there is always a 'Third Person' to witness human events. That should be blindingly obvious to every Christian: but it appears not to be. In your accidental references to "spoiling career chances" (or some such phrase). The C of E badly needs to ask a prominent Theologian, capable of practising 'apologetics', as Archbishop of Canterbury. None of the present bishops is capable of this.

[@marmeemarch7080]

I haven't read this book, but I agree with your two points, a and b, completely!

[@marmeemarch7080]

Advent hymns, yes! I also appreciate the Advent music of Erika Provensano.

[@Mark_Dyer1]

@@marmeemarch7080 I have, yet, to see the film of the book, which has just been released.

[@Mark_Dyer1]

@@marmeemarch7080 Thank you fior the tip!

[@marmeemarch7080]

IMHO, former archbishops of the ACNA need to sit down and keep quiet. They had their turn, and now their turn is over. Let them imitate the humility of Saint Paul the Apostle.

[@royquick-s5n]

Have the issues which divided GAFCON and Global South from the Episcopal Church and the Church of England gone away? The issues are bigger than the bishops. Christian morality is involved. Is it to be trivialized? A week or two ago George and Kevin seemed to be saying it would be an opportune time for the GAFCON and Global South primates to intervene or to assert their leadership. Have they? If anything, they seem to be waiting in the wings. 🤔

[@davidknox5929]

ICM IS V EXTREME!

[@mitchmclean5435]

Merry Christmas. You too are absolute saints

[@patrickbarnes5063]

(Comment for the algorithm.)

[@marmeemarch7080]

​@@royquick-s5n oh dear, please don't jump to conclusions that may be unwarranted. Please?

[@davidknox5929]

CoI don't wear vestments anyway!

[@h-uk7702]

You still can't correctly pronounce the surname of the Abp of York.

[@johnhudghton3535]

The Gospel for the third Sunday of Advent speaks into this situation in the C of E Luke 3:7-18. It feels very Axy this side of the pond. Too many have relied on priviledge and status instead of being penitent and faithful. People look at this and walk away in disgust. No wonder Islam is on the rise here. The lampstand is being removed from the C of E. Unless there is massive change it is "game over".

[@terryhemingway6983]

"Come, friend Ridley, and play the man. Today, we shall light such a candle in England, as by the grace of God, shall never be put out."

[@marcokite]

@@terryhemingway6983 - It's true that the heretic Ridley influenced a lot of gullible people.

[@marcokite]

The lampstand was removed in the reign of Henry VIII, years later Elizabeth I ensured it would not be returned.

[@johnhudghton3535]

​@@marcokite yawn

[@terryhemingway6983]

@marcokite My dear friend in Christ, earthly sovereigns might grieve the Holy Spirit but have no capacity ultimately to overrule the grace of God.

[@kenbeach5021]

The Catholic Church at the time of the reformation was but a faint shadow of the NT church. The protestant churches that broke away from it did not get far enough away from its unbiblical power structures, and carried on with an aristocracy of philosopher kings to whom all should bow and scrape. Lording it over the flock. Priests, bishops, cardinals, archbishops or popes - all men wanting to exercise power, and who do not exist in the NT. Far from being one in Christ there was division into first class clergy and second class laity, with perhaps women being third class. Is that not the problem with the current C of E in that whatever horrible abuse has been carried out over the years protecting a power structure that shouldn't even be there is more important than the victims. Isn't the very idea of being 'promoted' in the church totally foreign to the fellowships based on the NT model? Now there was authority exercised in the NT church but it was for building up and not tearing down. Modern church authority seeks to tear down, in particular to tear down the faith once for all delivered to the saints, to tear down its morals and ethics.

[@royquick-s5n]

Your viewpoint seems to follow a very mainstream Protestant way of looking at Anglicans. It may be said to be stereotypical. However, not all Anglican bishops in the world are carryovers of the lord bishop or lord archbishop but are more conformable to the NT model. A big difference in RC bishops and Anglican bishops is that RC bishops are appointed by a high hierarchical authority and Anglican bishops generally, sans U.K., are chosen with the participation of the grassroots. I agree with your second paragraph. 🙂

[@marcokite]

The Episcopacy, priesthood and diaconate are all Biblical. HOWEVER, the Bible is not an A-Z compendium of how to run the Church - remember that 'Bible alone' is a protestant heresy. Authority existed in the Church since the time of the Apostles.

[@royquick-s5n]

@@marcokite Conceded sola scriptura seems to be another way of saying sola mea interpretatio, but what thinkest thou of the sixth Article of Religion? 🤔

[@kenbeach5021]

@@marcokite The problem with this is once you start taking the church as your authority how do you measure whether it has got things right? What is the canon you use? The authority of the apostles carries on in the modern church via their writings, not a succession of the correct hands being laid on them. Church in the institutional sense is replete with historical examples of how men abuse Christianity to obtain power and make themselves mediators between the believer and God. This needs to be resisted wherever it is found.