The Identity of Guilty Gear & Design Philosophy of Guilty Gear Strive

[@Mioggle]

People that don't play fighting games don't look at the mechanics. They look at 3 things. Aesthetics Number of characters in the roster Graphical Fidelity That's it. The most important out of the 3 is the number of characters available in the roster.

[@urallnoobs8943]

I think they also look at single player content too, but you right

[@appeljoe4248]

But according to this logic the developer should not focus so much on mechanics right? So more development time into those 3 things and thus less or simpler mechanics. For me personally i have to say, that i git interested in Fighting games by playing street fighter and especially SF 5 and playing simpler games like Fantasy Strike. I played Tekken 7 for some time, but when the other "casuals" dropped it after a month or so i was constantly crushed online and then just stopped. Got some insensitives through indivisualizing my Fighter, butonce i had enough of that it was just way to complex for me. Still i had fun for about 2 or 3 months :-)

[@kanavi2]

yeah everything ok but then, how do you keep them playing? people stop playing this games very quickly, how do you keep them playing after they realized the level of complexity of the game? I want a complex guilty gear since high level matches are amazing, but that wont make me take the game again. If it means I will never buy the game and just watch it im ok with it, but if you you were part of the company what would you do? keep low sales and high dropping rates? What im asking is for alternatives to the problem, not to dumb down the game, but what are we proposing to do it?

[@sheercold26]

You forgot content

[@sheercold26]

@@urallnoobs8943 facts

[@yuurou7927]

I tried so hard to get people into fighting games, everyone of my friends got bothered by me to play fighting games I'm sure. Nothing system related worked, I repeat, NOTHING system related work. Everytime I succeed to pull people into fighting game, it's because story, visual, music, character design, single player content, etc. Those things pull people in, system make them stay. Which is why making a game restrictive and simplistic is NEVER gonna get you big sales, it will only hinder the active crowd.

[@soratheorangejuicemascot5809]

Finally, someone said what I am supposed to say

[@Graestra]

That’s exactly how it went with me. I’ve always been intimidated by fighting games. Then just a few weeks ago my friend showed me the Guilty Gear and KoF characters and I thought they were cool. A few days later they were both on sale on steam and I was debating if I wanted to get one. After watching some of the videos on the steam page, the story, characters, and music convinced me to get Guilty Gear rev 2, which I’ve heard is one of the most complex current fighting games. I’ve had a lot of fun practicing how to do combos and learning how to play the game.

[@Time2GoHam1995]

At my university, I was able to get some people into fighting games. A few people really stuck with it. Everybody who stuck with it had some kind of drive they made them really want to get good at the game. For example, 1 dude who played tekken would always lose against the people who came to play and really didn’t like that. Something has to click and start this.

[@bainbonic]

This guy gets it.

[@simongotborg3866]

The point of making a game approachable is so to avoid scaring away people who like the story/visual/music/character design. It's not like any developer thinks it's a selling point, that's a strawman.

[@ausreir]

FAB is the king of Instant Block, which is why his Potemkin wins almost 80% of his matches. Guilty Gear was to me a rebellious game concerned about giving players as much freedom as possible. This allows skilled and creative players to overcome many shortcomings of their preferred characters and is a massively rewarding experience. Given that Guilty Gear Revelator didn't sale well, it's not surprising that the developers want to go in a different direction. I'm more concerned that we're not seeing a new game, but a watered down iteration of the previous game and that would be a pity, considering how much effort they have put into the graphics and soundtrack.

[@jeako777]

Facts

[@Time2GoHam1995]

I heard that rev did sell well. Well as in it performed up to expectations. In the grand scheme of fighting games/games in general, it’s still pretty niche.

[@valzy2267]

why simplify the core game when Stylish baby mode STILL EXISTS?

[@Terumi.K]

Cross Tag Battle would beg to differ...

[@Rhannmah]

Of course Stylish mode still exists, it's the only mode left!

[@Avataryaya]

BRO I've been searching this channel for the past week for this video lmao.

[@eliezerlevergil]

I can't believe theres almost one year since this video came out

[@alecnoseworthy9787]

I don't mind the direction in general, but why do it with GG when they have Granblue VS for the entry level fighter? Well, hopefully it ends up great.

[@fateful_wanderer228]

The edits and things added for visual reference are nice!

[@Yukari_MAiG]

THIS. This is the kind of video I want, lots of great analysis and insight from Obama, not just rant or hate bashing like some people that I saw. Really good listen/watch. Thank you a lot.

[@voodoochicken8900]

16:28 It really did suprise me seeing chip kill be removed from GG considering Granblue has it and that game is targeted at people who don't even play console games

[@coolfish420]

Well done as always. For me what defines GG is the uniqueness of the characters. Tweets like 310 made where he said Venom wouldn't work in this iteration of 2020 have me worried. A ground-based emphasis can work in theory but I'm wondering where it leaves air focused characters like Bedman or I-No. Like you said, it's still early, but this is definitely worth talking about, and I think you did a great job in breaking down concerns in a clear way.

[@MrSlashstarEXE]

I'm not super deep into fighting games, so it's very interesting to hear it from Obama's view point because there are a lot of small nuances I didn't recognize off the bat.

[@pinkfloyd36123]

im a super casual fighting game fan, and i can confirm that if a dev wants to get someone like me to play their game the difficulty is something i barely consider. make sure its a content rich package, have good audiovisual presentation, make a comprehensive and actually fun training mode, some good and substantial single player content and you got me. there's no need to dumb the systems down and alienate the core base.

[@HyperDogeGaming]

There you go. Simple as that.

[@kanavi2]

how much time do you keep playing the game? as casual as you tell yourself to be how many online matches do you interact with and after playing it some time how long do you keep playing it or how much time after you stopped playing you retake it?

[@Noelle808]

@@kanavi2 The answer is that devs need to find a way to create more diverse online play. Starcraft is a competitive 1v1 game with an execution ceiling that kinda makes fighting games look like they're for babies, but it managed to have an enormous casual playerbase, too. It's part of the reason why people love Smash Bros. You can just just fuck around and do 8 player free-for-alls if you're burnt out from playing on the ladder.

[@kanavi2]

@@Noelle808 the difference is that starcraft is not as niche as fighting games, and even then starcraft is not that popular as a competitive scene as you portray, and smash brothers has freaking mario beating the shit out of pikachu... tehre are people who doesnt even know who samus is

[@GenericSoda]

I don't mind the counterhit thing so much because if you get counterhit by fafnir it should feel like the hitstun makes the planet stop spinning. The anti-air interactions are where I'm the most torn, because a universal air unblockable a la Persona feels like a possible solution but also a choke point for mechanical interaction: it becomes the optimal option for targeting airborne foes, whereas if everything can be blocked like the current build, you get the choice of how you interact with the opponent.

[@Snowyy201]

I think the most frustrating thing about this whole drama is that people keep using "simplicity" and "difficulty" interchangeably. You can make GG EASIER and most people had already suggested tons of QoL changes. Like cutting out all the mashing, having a new gauge for Danger Time instead of being purely random, etc. The issue that I'm having is that they are not only making the game easier, they are also making it SIMPLER, all the while removing 1f throw and oki which Imo are what definie GG. None of the changes from what I've seen can be called interesting take on the game's mechanic. You can only really describe them as dumbing down because that's what they are. Making normal blocking stronger and FD weaker is the least interesting thing I could ever imagine. I feel it's really disingenuous to say shit like "you just don't like it because it's different" when if they had honest to god introduced some NEW actual mechanics instead of dumbing down old ones I would've been down for it.

[@t4d0W]

Once again, you don't really know how it will all come together by next year. Its okay to be a negative impression off the bat. But to be a doomsayer based on that as well with making correlations based on older game engines and how it came together is just foolish. Sure you got a bias on your 1F throws so if it goes away, you gotta hold that. As for OKI it could be a similar principle but different approach kind of thing. If anything that is true is that people definitely don't know what they talk about with simplicity and difficulty. A 'simpler' game doesn't mean it won't have solid amount of depth to it. Especially for its new players who will make GG2020 their first of the series. The only thing is the approach to that simplicity won't be as exciting when translated as a spectator game or in actual play.

[@NYBJan1]

plshalp I think GG needed to be simplified but not easy. GG always gets bloated with subsystems at the end of their lifetime. Ggxx was ridiculous. Subsystems is different from removing options.

[@garretwoeller7669]

Honestly I like most of things with the game but if it was slower like neutral play is easier and unga isn't as much of a crutch then yeah I would be fine I'm not talking super slow no I'm talking like 3rd strike Tekken games that are fast but doesn't over load the screen with shit

[@sladejosephwilson2300]

My issue is combo potential being reduced. I don't mind simpler mechanics if it still always be to do more. Also the wall break is repetitive

[@garretwoeller7669]

@@sladejosephwilson2300 eah wall break should be like if you pull off a really good powerful high dmg combo like 30-50% combos if that was the case it would just help bad players and or unlucky players a way to turn it around

[@yamashgm]

I kept re-writing this comment trying to add something, but you really covered it all man. Great video! I wish more people in the FGC had your mindset.

[@urallnoobs8943]

Well said Obama. You summed up my thoughts perfectly in a well spoken and objective manner. The fact that the new GG takes away mechanics and options without compensation makes the game too homogeneous and boring. It shifts the game away from the series' identity and alienates its fanbase. I still love Guilty Gear and want it to succeed, but this is not the direction I want the game to go in.

[@Time2GoHam1995]

urallnoobs8943 This is essentially how I feel. I want the game to do well but I don’t want to personally support it as it doesn’t seem to be going in a direction that I enjoy.

[@eliezerlevergil]

Develpers must see that a casual, and by casual i mean someone that doesnt play the fighting game genre, will never buy a fighting game because of its mechanics, NEVER. If they get into the fighting game genre through a specific game will be probably because of the way it looks, not because of the way it plays. The person will see the trailer, and be interested by what they are seeing visually, cuz they dont understand the behind the scenes stuff of every move the characters use to beat eachother in the trailer. In any game, of any genre, usually ppl want more options in the gameplay of their game, not less. WHY should fighting game be any different?

[@EnderTitan]

It’s this popular stigma that people throw around “fighting games are too hard” In this modern day where people are so accustomed to instant gratification, fighting games make you work for your satisfaction, and the “casuals” in question are people that don’t like that. They’d rather play something that lets them have fun with minimal effort. It’s a shitty attitude, and it shouldn’t be catered to, because these people never support anything for long. They have low attention spans, and once they’re done playing something for a short while, they’ll just move onto the next thing. Which is why I’m so curious why fighting game developers keep trying to cater to these people. It doesn’t make any sense.

[@freddiewompton]

@@EnderTitan Here. A C&P of one of my comments on this topic. It's a matter of perspective. Generally speaking, MANY people who play games are more into things such as instant gratification. Whether it's from how they were raised to the games they generally play as a whole is up in the air. But it is generally shown to be true, especially considering a good chunk of the games that get popular. Fighting game developers are not simplifying things to get people to show up and compete/lab. They are doing it (More than likely) to simply bolster better sales numbers. The more approachable a game looks. The higher the chance of someone picking it up. There are people who will hear how hard a game is and REFUSE to play it. There is an obvious inverse to this (As Soulsborne style games have shown), but as a whole, people WILL generally avoid harder games. Add this to the aspect of a fighting game being 1v1 as a whole. Not only do you have a TON of stuff to worry about in terms of system mechanics, MUs, combos, etc. You have no one to blame when you lose. This is a BIG thing for a lot of people as well. Who'd have thought, people do not like losing, whether or not they are competitive. It's hard-wired into people to feel that way. And fighting games forces introspection and magnification of your own errors. Moral is, there is a LEGIT reason to simplify games, most people just do not like to admit that. And the reasoning varies and is blatantly subjective, but you get the point. Even than, at the end of the day. I think Strive will more than likely be a rad game. I have faith that ArcSys can make an AMAZING experience out of it. And if they want to simplify it a bit to potentially attract a bigger/different audience. Let 'em. It's their game, their risk to take. It might pay off, it might not. We will see in due time.

[@EnderTitan]

Freddie Wompton Agreed.

[@KaminariHouse]

@@freddiewompton This comment is the only reason anyone should need for the simplification. Makes complete sense, especially since you mentioned the "people don't like being wrong" thing. If you want your game (in this case fighting game) to appeal to the masses, you have to: A. Make the visuals as widely appealing/impressive as possible. and B. Make it somewhere in the "middle" margin of difficulty, in terms of the complexity of the controls/possible moves and techniques. It's sort of like Pop music vs. Black Metal. To most, one is catchy and easy to listen to, while the other sounds like some kind of white noise, rather than music. Or like when FROM SOFTWARE added more Bonfires in DS 2, and made the "Warp to Bonfire" ability accessible from the start of the game.

[@Sheenulus]

Don’t forget brand recognition. Street Fighter will basically always be on top because how recognizable it is, Guilty Gear will almost never rise past it. My argument is mainly to augment yours, just that visuals aren’t limited to superficial visuals, but also recognizable symbols as well.

[@ECLaForce]

Guilty Gear NEEDS nuanced neutral and the pressure game being how it is. The changes to FD regarding air block, chip damage, and dash braking completely alter this, alongside the gatling changes and IB. There isn't a single game out there that you really gotta think about your movement before you do it like GG. I don't know what most FG devs think, but people play GG BECAUSE it is challenging - and in turn, it feels rewarding. Making fighting games "easier" do not make new players stick around. Period.

[@romdog1818]

I was willing to put time into mastering GG, but I really did not like their online package. I'm no local FG player, when my friends come over we don't even touch fighting games at all, so I get all my FG play online. I would be ok with the loss of some mechanical depth if they come out with some next level online support. Now it is all but confirmed that they've kept the same frame delay based netcode, and that really puts me off. Also, online practice mode is a must nowadays. Offline practice mode playback options are nice and all, but nothing replaces playing against another player.

[@nameisbad]

real talk, nor did how it is in xrd keep many people that tried it out, i'd say the majority of them left and it wasn't just new players, it was og's and regulars too. It's easy to throw shade at simplification but most those people gave feedback along the lines of mechanical bloat, lack of clarity, bad online experience, too much work in some aspects. I really feel a lot of guilty gear players half ass the game, but praise it's depth, like i've seen what 4 out of hundreds of gg players i've met at locals/online that actually knew the mechanics well, the rest were just winging it and had no idea about certain basic mechanics.. frankly, alot, although not all, were full of shit.

[@ThePhuNetwork]

When I picked up gg a few years ago, one of the biggest hurdles for me as far as execution was just how the system registered inputs. The length of combos was fine, but getting inputs eaten because the only time to press a button was during hitstop was annoying and a huge obstacle. Most other action games don't have hitstop like gg, but you could queue in actions during the startup/active frames of an attack. If they want the execution to be friendlier to newcomers/casuals, I think QoL changes like that, along with things like increasing untech time while keeping the tech cap the same, or increasing hit stagger by just a little bit can go a longer way towards simpler execution that doesn't take away from the experienced who just want to enjoy the game they love the way they've always remembered it.

[@Theyungcity23]

Most fighting games do have a normal combo system which is what you described from what I understand. What do you mean?

[@ThePhuNetwork]

@@Theyungcity23 I broadened the term to action games in general, not just fighting games like GG or SF. Games like Nier:Automata, Dynasty Warriors, or Senran Kagura don't have that time stop effect on hit like you see in GG, but you can press light attack during the startup/active of your light attack (once), do nothing else, and see the next light attack go in sequence. These games are usually more friendly towards casual players. But in GGXRD, the hitstop system is very strict with how it registers inputs. Let's say you're doing one of Johnny's midscreen bnbs, 5K > c.s > 2D > 236H > dash > c.s > 236H > etc., you have to wait until after your dash ends and Johnny resumes a neutral stance to have your second c.s come out on time. I'm saying that a casual friendly GG would allow people to put in inputs at anytime during an action, except for its recovery frames after hitstop, like normal.

[@LuckySevenSamson]

CINEMATIC COUNTERS Yes to this. This should be the "you fucked up" for everything. Time just STOPS, and you see your character just get SLAMMED, and then the extra frames take effect for your opponent.

[@hugo070992]

You're analysis and point of views on fighting games are really interesting to listen. Ty for the content o/ Hope to see even more in the future o/

[@javongoshay]

My biggest fear as an I-No player is that setplay won't really be as viable as it has been in previous entries. That along with the system changes surrounding P and K starters for combos, both high and low are very worrying. I feel you had the best take on all this, so thanks for your time.

[@krystianlewanczyk1771]

Thank you for defending what i belive makes fighting games great.

[@inkmage4084]

I remember back in 1998 being blown away, when I got the first game. It just continues to surprise me, and I love the music, character designs, and story. Kinda wish KOF would look more like this, with more of Shinkiro's style.

[@ANIMEILLUMINATI]

Hopefully KOFXV graphics are nicer than XIV.

[@MuiltiLightRider]

The deacon speaks truth to power yet again. But I shared a lot of the same sentiments, the design direction is looking to kill a lot of the fun of GG. Certain familiar character archetypes (I'm thinking Zato not being an Oki monster and Millia not being an Oki monster or even having pin because of stage transitions) just can't exist with these new limitations. It would be sad and poetic to see the GG I love and the GG arcade scene sorta fizzle out at the same time though :(

[@coolfish420]

Just you bringing up Arc doing a jojo's game got my heart racing man

[@VillainViran]

I’d like fighting games to look at sports and other games like Dota and good f2p games. Guilty Gear could be as hard/deep as can be, and as long as there’s content/qol to keep you in there even when you’re getting beat down by good players, people will stay. If a fighting game made mentoring newer players easy, had a good training room, a tutorial at least on the level of Under Night, GOOD netcode, random singleplayer content like Smash, customization like T7 but more like f2p games, stylish and consistent UI, events, and good art that would be GOAT if it were lewd that’d be the cherry on top

[@Sonicboom238]

Xrd has a lot of content already. They want a MUCH broader audience in higher volume. Dota is a team game where you can get carried and Smash has the most recognizable characters and accessible gameplay. They are stuck between a rock and a hard place

[@AyaGumede]

The other issue with games having too much focus on just content is that it leads to a more micro transaction and pay to win environment that's killing American video games

[@Zillion3170]

It seems like people forget that when you want something refreshed, you gotta start somewhere.

[@ElasticLove12]

This was really well spoken and edited great video

[@Raiden3651]

Feels like GG2020 is gonna be what Blazblue was when the 09'er FGC revival kicked off, but with 3d visuals and GG character rights intact(also hopefully not as Calamity Trigger like).

[@SleepDirtyJazzySet]

Wow, i didn't think anyone even remembered Hokuto No Ken. Props.

[@qspec2002]

Awesome video. Thanks for doing it! To bring a bit of a different opinion to the comment section. I agree this game doesn't feel like Guilty Gear, but for plenty of +R players, Xrd didn't either. YRC took meaningful risk/reward out of the neutral, and while I love it for its set play and pressure play, I really resent Xrd for its neutral. I, like plenty of other people, was hoping that Xrd was going to be a lot more like +R than it ended up being. And, as someone without a lot of love for Xrd, there seem to be clear parallels between this reaction and the Xrd reaction. Obviously everyone has a difference of opinion about what it means to be a Guilty Gear game. For example, I have never felt like combo length is what made a Guilty Gear game, but I do think oki does. I also think that risk/reward does too. +R, for as bad as I am at it, rewards thoughtful gameplay. If you do the wrong thing at neutral, you get blown the fuck up for it. If you make the risky hard read, you reap tons of rewards. Xrd, and YRC specifically, really helped weaken this. YRC turns "wrong" actions into "right" actions. It turns risky but good reads into mistakes. By way of an example, if Sol is getting predictable with his pressure, you can make a hard read and IAD over gunflame for a big punish. But if he has 25 meter and you don't, the situation is actually in his favor. He can YRC and punish or take his turn back on reaction. Whereas in +R, Sol would also have to make a read about whether or not to RC. It created a much more interesting neutral, and some features of GG2020 seem to be a return to that more interesting neutral. All that to say that I'm definitely nervous. I love long combos, and I love set play (which is why I have found myself playing more UNI than anything these days), and the changes to both make me hesitant to get hype for GG2020, but I am also, perhaps foolishly, optimistic. 2020, for all the ways it deviates from what we think Guilty Gear is, it also tightens up something that I felt were core to the Guilty Gear experience before Xrd.

[@researchbashio]

i think this video has aged really well.

[@MagnaTurban]

To me, the complexity argument doesn’t make sense. Look at games like Dota 2, League of Legends, Starcraft. These are hard games, some more than others but hard nonetheless. Making things easier only alienates people on both sides. Better tutorials, more game modes, I’m not sure what the answer is but something needs to change and we, as a collective, should try and find the common thread.

[@stormcutter59]

Two things. One is I agree with you on your "face yourself" analogy with fighting game philosophy. And this is why I agree with your understanding of fighting games having a better means of helping players UNDERSTAND their game! I dont think their is a way to shortcut the mindset and discipline that's needed to enjoy fighting games. Which Is why I'm hardcore against making games "more accessible" at all. I dont think you can divorce the "face yourself" element from a genre like this. I think the best thing you can do is make your game as fun as possible. I certainly had fun playing MVC2 as a kid in the arcades without EVER knowing anything about the tournament scene. Had I owned that game outside of the arcades and played it all the time I would have stuck it out and learned more about the systems at play. Getting better at something you enjoy playing without money on the line, as a GAME, is the best way to make your game accessible to people. Now for the second point, I disagree with you and everyones over emphasis on empathizing with the developers. This is a problem I've been seeing progressively more and more as time has gone on and it is this excuse that just because their are people who had to put in the effort and work into making something that just means we shouldnt judge the work they present? You arent entirely telling us we should never judge the game but you are sliding the door out just enough to make it seem like the feelings of the developers, people who we have never met before, matter just as much as what WE want out of the products they are selling us. Their was a time where the consumer and producer relationship was respected to be just what it was. You had the producers, grateful for their fans and their fanbase for the quality products they created, hard working, but tempered to deal with criticism that may come their way as recognized by the job they took when creating things people love. Developers should be mindful of what their fans want and what new things they could give them, while recognizing that their will always be those fringe fanatics that they'll have to deal with as well. It is a tricky back and forth and will always stay that way but this is just the reality of day to day life we all recognize. It exists in industry as well. It wont ever be perfect but it is the way it always will be. My case is this: WHY is it so easy for us to criticize movies but whenever we criticize a video game we ALWAYS seem to put the feelings of the developers into question? Why does that matter to anyone when all we are doing is criticizing a game? What rational assumptions could POSSIBLY be made that would lead a developer into thinking this is a personal vendetta against them? And why should it matter? People judge things made by other people everyday and this will always be a fact of life that is undeniable. We should treat this with a grounded reality about what is the reality of the climate of these things so as not to sacrifice the honesty of the consumer for fear of hurting someone's feelings.

[@CC42_]

exactly! Gamers are immature and there is a sheep like quality to is. This trend of being labelled as 'entitled' for criticising a game is backwards. Intelligent gamers are really up against it in todays gaming climate between anti consumer moves, political correctness, and fanboys. Also there is a somewhat of a corrupt system between dev, publisher, reviewer, games media, and youtube.

[@LupinxJigenTTV]

The thing is, ASW already tried to do tutorials and presentation well. It didnt seem to make it as popular as they thought it could be.

[@D3athL1vin]

ArcSys NEEDS to make a new Jojo's fighter, anyone who's played Heritage knows how much justice they could do a game of that style

[@SH4D0WBattousai]

As someone who got into fighting games recently I think everything that could use simplification has already been simplified. You got gattlings that make comboing ez, dramatically improved buffers regarding the old days, systems that correctly interpret your imputs regardless of slight misstimings even the dash button in this latest game. No one likes grinding your links for a few months before you can actually play the game or missing a qcf because you pressed your button 1f before your stick was on 6 and that's history already in fighting games (except that last one for unist still happens to me lul). What they are doing with this trend since SFV is not simplificating things but straight dumbing down the games. I cant help but see this GG going literally in the same direction as SFV with removing OS and light hitconfirms. That only thing makes SFV boring both to play and watch, neutral is just gambling with médiums since light hitconfirms dont exist anymore and literally all the options for pressure after a KD are either meaty, throw bait or "shimmy". Thats not making hard things easier to do its just deleting half your game. And all you get is your player base mass quitting it while nearly no newcomers arrive because its just boring in the end.

[@KaminariHouse]

What you said about Arc being the only devs doing this sort of thing is absolutely correct... but also a big problem. Because they are the only ones able to deliver a product at of this kind and quality, this means there won't be as many made as there should be. I hope more established studios start following in their footsteps, as well as new and up and coming ones. Because this is the future of Fighting Games. And could finally be the thing that makes them relevant again.

[@JustMeAndYou1]

Very insightful video on the topic

[@AyaGumede]

Noticing how every fighting game company is toning down mechanics to suit a more grounded game to me says they know something we don't. These people aren't stupid, plus they're focused on the long run business wise, I'm sure they've noticed something that every company is following the same principles.

[@Densoro]

I'm scrub af, barely getting into fighting games from Woolie, Max, and novril -- I super appreciate how respectful and reasoned this is. Folks can't dismiss you as a hater if there's no hate here. I get hella confused by fighting games, but you're right -- everybody playing the same isn't really gonna fix that for me. I'll probably just be confused why characters who seem so different feel so similar, and I won't be able to figure out the core system changes that changed the game. Maybe this will narrow the skill gap and give me a fighting chance, maybe it won't. Remains to be seen. But I don't really play to win; I play to _discover,_ and it seems like this trend gives folks less to unearth.

[@Caporai]

So Instant Block is like, you gain meter for the purpose of Guard Cancel, pushing opponent back and put them into blow back state, but at the same time opponent can still block while they are in blow back state. So the purpose of it that you can't counter attack, but at least it puts you out of pressure, if you can Roman Cancel out of it?

[@SHAO_L1N]

Everyone wants a JoJo fighting game, but I want a Super Robot wars tag fighter from Arcsys.

[@handyherbcock4497]

I think we would all explode from the awesomeness of an srw tag fighter. My team would be gunbuster, unit 01 and gurren laggan (team gainax)

[@SHAO_L1N]

@@handyherbcock4497 Not a bad team! I be rocking Gunbuster, Grandpa Gundam (rx-78) and GaoGaiGar (maybe white tiger zord). I think a Srw fighter would be the hypest shit ever.

[@Ilyak1986]

I want a League of Legends fighter from ArcSys. Can you *imagine* Irelia, Riven, and Akali in full-on anime with a GGXrd system for their movement? UNFFF.

[@nameputhpong9041]

Someone pin this comment.

[@Sheenulus]

Ilyak1986 Get zoned out by a Kog Maw with Lulu and Malphite on assist. :p

[@trcakira8974]

On paper it feels like there are character concepts that are getting devalued. By gutting hard knockdown scenarios how am I supposed to run oki? Will speed/combo based characters ultimately suffer from this? Why make sweep into OTG do that much damage? Just some stuff Im concerned with because I grew up with accent core.

[@NTBXP1]

That would be a overwork to Arksys. I want to see capcom plagiarize their technique. I do not want to see Arksys becoming the second Telltale games studio.

[@ino579]

The way Majin laid it out, it sounds to me like Arc Sys is solving the problem of forcing the character select screen to shuffle around through nerfs and buffs by giving everyone different bodies but the same engine under the hood. It sounds like its turning into a spectacle. For someone like me who goes to video games to push myself to exceed my limits, I feel alienated by this new system that denies the cool things I can only dream about doing in this game.

[@ino579]

That said, fighting games are inherently a slippery slope with friends because of salt and skill gaps. This GG that lowers the bar immensely is definitely I can show to my friends and I have no doubt we can spend hours on it. But there are other games for that. Guilty Gear deserves better than to be a seasonal competitive party game.

[@guigondi7671]

1:26 "Hey Ark, i want you guys to make a Darkstalkers game" I nutted at that idea!

[@deltacosmic5358]

The gam3 looked so different

[@crazylazytwisteshaka]

Fast fighting games are hard for me but I don't feel like they should change it to a slower fighter just for people like me. Street Fighter Alpha 3 had air blocking and I hated that game for having marvel like mechanics. I might try out the game if it has good net code but other than that I don't care for it.

[@RezidentDamage99]

And as a person, who does play these types of games a lot like GG, I appreciate your comment. It lets the developers know that it is not just the mechanics, other features of a full game are the things that Will make a casual audience stay. Fighting game devs still don't get that, most people who are casually interested in these types of games, care more about features, game modes, and skins. The only studio that has really figured it out is Nether realms

[@zekiel2533]

@@RezidentDamage99 exactly!! The single player and extra content is what casuals like along with a well polished game

[@HyperDogeGaming]

@@RezidentDamage99 except that NRS is a really bad example, because people are leaving it for being too simplistic, rightfully so. A game with too few mechanics leads to less interactivity, which leads to boredom and ultimately a lesser game lifespan. MK11 will be likely played by its community for a fraction of the time the community played MKX. Hence NRS is trying to artificially make it last longer by extending its DLC release schedule over a longer period of time with about the same number of characters.

[@RezidentDamage99]

@@HyperDogeGaming I agree but that goes into what I mean about longevity. too few mechanics kills that longevity. But nrs is good at making a full package game regardless of the the actual fighting mechanics

[@chainsaw1016]

I'm probably going to be lambasted by everyone for this but can someone explain a really simplified version of the issue here? I casually play 3D fighting games like Tekken, Soul Calibur, Dead or Alive, etc, but I've been meaning to get into Guilty Gear because I love the character designs for the series and I'm thinking of starting off with GG2020. I play Smash too, so I don't mind simplicity in the button inputs. Hell, Smash is probably the simplest possible thing you could ever get, outside of crazy Melee stuff like wavedashing (which I find annoying.). I played a tiny bit of GG Rev 2, but stopped because none of my friends play it. I like Dragonball FighterZ. I WOULD like BBtag but for some reason the characters in that game don't really interest me. Aside from like Akihiko and Yuzuriha. As someone who might as well be a brand new player, what exactly should I be taking away from all the outrage? I'm still hyped for it, but I'm getting really confused with all the mechanical jargon when normally all I pay attention to is "This char is Fast but Weak/This is a Slow but Strong/This char is a Grappler/This char is Glass Cannon or Tank/Such and Such Characters have Good Mixups."

[@SoysauceML]

Imagine smash games without tilts because people have a hard time executing it instead of smash attacks, or in Tekken korean backdash looks bad so they remove it, and consolidated left/right attacks to be more like other traditional fighting games so people don't get confused. Both of these examples are simplifications of the game that give newer players an easier time.

[@chainsaw1016]

@@SoysauceML I didnt know what korean backdash was so I looked it up. Aaah I see what you guys are saying. They're taking out some of the hidden depth that people often wouldn't see at first glance, thus there wont be as many moments where they could say "Yo check out this new tech I found!" The equivalent that comes to my mind is actually in Devil May Cry games, where in DMC4 people found something like "Guard flying", which they took out in DMC5. Hopefully with all the feedback they add enough new stuff in to offset the stuff they took away.

[@SoysauceML]

@@chainsaw1016 Guardflying was the least of the problems with the removal of inertia. Basically, in DMC4, you could use inertia to make most of your attacks move horizontally during its animation, which is extremely important for positioning either in a combo, or for movement. This allowed much more dynamic combos instead of Dante just attacking stationary. Also, it's not just about “yo check out this new tech I found", but that a lot more different situations can occur which leads to different possibilities, as well as different interpretations for the said possibilities and often there are no true "right answers". For competitive games which focuses on repetitive matches, how different each match can feel is extremely important, just like any sport. If every match feels the same no one will find it interesting.

[@SoysauceML]

@@chainsaw1016 This is why, if you compare combos in DMC4 and DMC5, DMC4 not only looks a lot more natural (due to inertia actually existing in real life), and more dynamic in DMC5. In DMC5 you'll see a lot of parts where Dante suddenly stops moving in the air to execute something. This is an example of a same combo executed with and without using inertia in DMC4: kzbin.info/www/bejne/sHSWk2R8hbChn5I Even though it's pretty much the exact same moves, with Inertia Dante was traveling all around the enemy, where as without inertia Dante was only moving vertically.

[@aaroncope1833]

My first exposure to Majinobama was hearing his drunken shouting in the background of cooperation cup and now I find out he's actually a really intelligent and well spoken dude. Dang. Anyway I'm ok with a lot of the changes to the new GG and I'm sure it'll be a lot of fun but some of them don't make sense to me. Only gaining meter on IB makes instant block basically worthless because of the difficulty and risk factor and removing chains from lights will probably hurt beginners even more. LightxMediumxHeavyxSpecial is basically the go to easy combo for newbies.

[@soundwave5634]

I plan on using GG: Strive as my Intro to fighting games. I've been interested in the series but never picked up any of them because the system was so threatening. There was so much to learn and adapt to also I can't handle things as fast paced as "True Guilty Gear". So making it more footsie and simplifying most things is everything I could have asked for. I guess what I am getting at is there is a difference between getting people interested in a series and getting people invested in a series. If Strive remains this simplistic (which I highly doubt it will, I think a LOT more will be added and touched on before release) I think it will get the same sales as the others but newer players will not be as threatened and stick around longer. Eventually they'll want to try the other games because they'll desire more. Strive is definitely making itself out to be an entry point into the series.

[@journeyman9454]

I've been waiting for this! 🤤

[@sinshenlong]

send this to arc please

[@artenstien7100]

The only iterations of gg I absolutely love are +R and accent core, and I'm not talking just gameplay...artstyle, soundtrack style, lack of engrish vocals, clearer and more unique metal and Jojo inspired aesthetics, the gothicness of it all. The only thing I like about strive so far is that the art direction is basically closer to xx but 3d which was not as possible in xrd because of UE3 limitations I assume. Gameplay wise I think blazblue is the perfect example of how to make gg easier while still retaining some of the core (match-up system too convoluted but that's about it imo). I'll never stand YRC and danger time, they make the game too reaction time based and less mental play commitment based.

[@theoya]

Thanks Obama, I think you nailed most of the stuff you talked about here. The main thing to me is, "... they sacrifice ideas that seperate and define the series". I got GGXX back in the day because I heard that it was crazy, over-the-top characters in a fast-paced, heavy metal game that encourages you to get on the offensive and gives you a ton of freedom with combos. When I popped it into the PS2, those qualities are what made me instantly fall in love with the game. All of that stuff is what makes it fun and exciting, and there isn't another game that really fills that void. The new demo is scary not because it looks like a terrible game, but because there isn't another franchise to turn to if GG2020 doesn't have the qualities that made the series what it is.

[@HyperDogeGaming]

Exaaaaactly.

[@shinvergil]

Instablock change: It may work better for this game. - bcz of block R cancel. (Can combo out of it) - more focus on tension gain. - fd pushes back further. - game becomes more visually intutive. - players who just defend will still gain tension, look cool and have a chance when 50% is gained. I understand that it was a cool layer of xrd. But i would take more tension gain instead of less recovery frames.

[@zekiel2533]

If you don't make fighters intuitive enough players get bored. If the depth ain't there, then peace out ✌️

[@TheDiamondSkye]

exactly. if you're still doing the same exact oki setup and frame trap setup a year after the beta, your game has 0 depth. Not applicable to all games, but most of these recent games do apply and it's infuriating to want to enjoy a game and not want to recommend it to anyone because of it's lackluster mechanics.

[@v4rr0lot3k6]

Very informative video. I agree on your points since I've made some of them myself. I do feel the game is risking fanbase alienation. Catering to casuals is a slippery slope that can destroy comp play. I don't see that happening with GG2020 but as the game stands currently, the future seems a tad uncertain.

[@lewdtwitch3424]

Happy that you can block without FD while dashing and you can block ground moves while jumping without FD. Removing dead angle is great since its useless for majority of people. No chip kills is great, no stun is great and no danger time is awesome. The stun mechanic fucks up your arcade stick.

[@polecats6922]

man there's so much information to unpack. I will say though a lot of the these changes feel spectator friendly, specially when you watch some of the gameplay with it, They made it hard to miss things. and it's easier to explain mechanics now as well. I'm committed to trying it, but idk how long it'll hold my interest That being said no arcade version feels like such a heavy blow to this game in japan

[@Grozdor]

I'm actually waiting for Obama's take on this topic since that arcsys stream.

[@steeplewiththesnakes]

My problem isn't so much that they're changing up the game, but that the changes seem like it will bring GG closet to like SFV/MKXI or even Granblue. Of course all the games will be distinct in their own way but there's something to be said for a certain style of grounded footsy based games with minimal combo routes becoming oversaturated

[@thatfella8256]

Okay, so almost everytime i see anyone talk about this game, and its gameplay, i only see negatives. Which is weird. The reason everyone says that is because they think its to appeal to casuals. Which it is. But why is that a bad thing? Please note that this is coming from someone who hasn't played a gg game as of yet, and is a very newcomer to fighting games. The first one i really liked was fighterz. Now what i see people saying are the things that attract casual players and they are: 1. Graphics 2. Roster size. Okay, thats a good start but thats surface level stuff. What KEEPS people playing these games. Looking cool. How do you look cool? It starts with doing some specials. Then some combos. So what do people do right away with that? Check the command inputs. If the first thing a casual player sees is a half-circle P, K, H. To do what they'll see as something that looks far to difficult to pull off for the benefit. It turns off players to get better. It does! I refused to play fighting games, because i couldnt do the cool shit! It was too hard! The simplified commands for fighterz allowed me to do cool shit all the time, and i was encouraged to go to training mode and work with making combos that LOOK RAD. Now as a fan of fighting games with that understanding of them to a point, the easier to pick up a game, the longer a casual will play! When i company makes their fighting game simpler, its not to attract a new player, its to keep a new player! Seriously why dont people get that? You are already a fan if you are complaining. Let the newcomers show up to make new fans, stop complaining about games being "too simple" and just play your new fighting game that you will buy regardless of how simple it is.

[@ANIMEILLUMINATI]

It's a vocal minority; majority of people are excited.

[@thatfella8256]

@@ANIMEILLUMINATI yeah i figured, it just feels like at some level people arent understanding what "appealing to casuals" means.

[@ouka6686]

Guilty Gear is the kind of game that always managed to have a ton of experimentation with it, but almost every time the experimental games didn't satisfy anyone. Look for a casual player that says Isuka is their favorite fighting game, or GG2. GG sort of has been backing its self into a corner for a while now in the western FGC being filled with so many systems and crazy interactions, and what the hell is a "dustloop" anyway, etc etc. So pushing a reset button on the game would really do a lot to get more people interested, especially with SFV leaving so many 2D players stranded since Tekken is incredibly hard, and they don't have an interest in Smash. Some gravitated towards SamSho, but that game probably won't live that long competitively since the "SamSho balance" still exists; very few people have the fortitude to sit still for a minute straight to then one hit kill the opponent. But that said, GG is focusing far too much on always resetting neutral. I'm fine if it was slower, you could have a GG with 4-5 hit combos being the most common and it could still be GG as long as they retain the balance of overpowering offense vs stalwart defense (watch Fumo's Elphelt for example, when he's on defense, he is capable of preventing the opponent from getting a single inch). Throws resets neutral, 2D > OTG resets neutral, wall breaks reset neutral, combos that don't end in 2D reset neutral. There's no longer a definitive reward for being aggressive, and now making a comeback from defensive play is just "Hope you do more damage than they done to you when Neutral resets". Imagine Potemkin vs Axl in this environment. I'm certain there will be some changes to how the characters function in the future, like SF5 went from having crazy float combos and OTGs from the first beta reveal, to what we have now. So I'm pretty sure there will be some changes, especially to the wall break mechanic; the demo feels like it could have been more for getting live feedback for how it was implemented, since very few matches I saw people want to do wall combos, most of the time it was get corner then attempt pressure/okizeme Also what they showed gameplay wise had Hammer fall break recover in 25-27-ish frames. In the Pot mirror match they demo'd, one does 2D to hammer fall break, the other gets up and Pot Buster's him before the break's recovery ended. That's something that would be super easy to fix, but the fact it was in the demo leaves me with a bit of worry towards the balance philosophy. But all that said, I know a ton of people who'd be into playing this new GG. Learning an 18 hit combo with Johnny is daunting, learning a 5 hit combo that does same damage and is animated to feel really good landing it; that's casual bait for sure. Bonus points, I don't like the neutral resetting, but it for sure provide a safety net for people who don't normally play fighters. I wonder if it is possible to have wall breaks be an optional thing, though...

[@Xero_Kaiser]

That's how I felt about it. I love GG, but they just kept stacking system on top of system on top of system on top of system. That couldn't continue forever and a back-to-basics approach had to happen sooner or later.

[@fateful_wanderer228]

If nothing else, I got love for Leo Whitefang for the pure fact that fighting him made me learn to IB shit.

[@playing_jazz]

Love hearing you speak bro you are the man

[@tomasbemmert8990]

Imagine if arcsys made an SF game ...

[@Danku]

Im HORRIBLE at FGs (for several reasons, including not enough time investment). I do NOT want a game to be easier just because they think I wont play. It is exactly as you said. Focusing on accessibility through better tools and explanations ingame is a much better approach!

[@niwona_]

I think people should definitely voice their concerns so that it at least keeps devs in check, but I'd also try to look at things from a broader perspective instead of just different = not good. From when Xrd gameplay was revealed til present day I was just never a big fan. It was just a slower, watered down version of old GG (sound familiar?) that also introduced system mechanics that did not mesh with several characters. But still I support and promote the game because I love ArcSys and a lot of people do like the game. Still, I think Xrd was so behind modern fighters in trying to create end round hype. Beyond burst bait, Danger Time was poorly implemented and end of games often seemed inevitable or just drag. I think what they're doing is so interesting. It potentially creates so many more situations where you have to make different choices that go far beyond combo route or continue combo/reset (not that that is everything in Xrd). I really want to explore the corner mechanics, the buff/debuff system, the reframing of resets, and OTG. I see a game incorporating 3S/Alpha neutral, Tekken 7 hype/CH importance, UMVC3 air game, UNIST anime ground game, in a GG aggression system. The game does not look slow to me, but I can see why people think that. In side by side comparisons, moves are moving at the same speed as old GGs, movement is same speed, and I don't think CH and wall breaks will slow things quite like people think, unless you were also of the impression cinematic supers slowed down Xrd from +R too much. That doesn't sound to me like a step back. A step back to me would me an even more watered down version of Xrd. That sounds like an evolution coming for the bag. For me, GG means some sort of rock aesthetic, fast and aggressive gameplay, with "anime movement" and characters that are unique and layered. Beyond the disgusting UI and character select screen, my biggest concern atm would be 1) beyond meter, not enough reasons to play fast and aggressive, 2) too little variance and excitement w/o meter, and similar to Xrd, 3) characters that either don't fit the way the overarching mechanics are or have to be revamped significantly enough that they become very neutered (ie Ram, Baiken). No fighter is marketed by the company as complex, not just the current gen. Look at SSBU. That has more layers of specific mechanics than any 2D fighter ever but not once has Sakurai talked about or even showed that complexity. I would not worry about GG ever getting too simple, unless your idea of complexity is limited to combos and execution, which is the very surface of ways devs can make a fighter complex. I like what Obama was getting at about sandbox combos though. I feel like they need to make sure you have a sense of creativity without meter, and that there are different ways to start into something, even if there will always be an optimal route. No issue with the old PKSHS routes being out though, since that was supposed to be a beginner mechanic anyway. Plus, if anime fighter people were prioritizing long, complex combos, I don't know why they were playing GG over BB.

[@SwordsDanceQwilfish]

great content!

[@audgeirr]

Like many, I am looking forward to the game and learning more about it as new information is released prior to the games release. However, after watching this video, I am concern and nervous about the many changes being implemented. I will keep an open mind and much hope, but at the moment I am skeptical.

[@NiohArcadia]

Simplifying the game make it easier for skilled players to make the new players have a hard time learning anything or feel like the training they put in was worth it

[@Ozzymandiyas]

I'm not a regular GG player, but I did start with XX way back when. I only got play it for real with Xrd and I love the game, as a newb fightan player and all. And seeing where the new GG is going makes me think about one certain thing. BlazBlue. I really can't really say anything with authority, since I'm just starting. But from the little that I have played the two games, BB and GG are very similar, with BB even have being called the spiritual successor to GG at some point. Now with that and how BB and GG are now in their respectives scenes, I wonder if ArcSys are trying to differentiate the two games more so that they don't compete between themselves. This goes along with how people have received Cross Tag Battle.

[@00ChosenOne00]

Happy to hear that interface is a placeholder. I was scared of it. But moving portraits below healthbars... Why? Who needed this?

[@Bboyredmoon]

Thanks for the video ^__^

[@nameisbad]

I'll be real with you, youtube celebrities of the FGC have gone round and round with this topic for years now, nothing has changed. know what's changed? popularity from simplification, people are playing dbfz, people are playing mk11, people are playing that trash that is SFV, people are playing tekken 7, those are all games that have gotten simpler than previous iterations. Devs do a lot wrong, but the real issue is we jump on this topic and talk so much shit about simplification that when new players, casuals, etc come and peek their head into our community and see the shit we talk about online, there's only one thing they get: uncertainty about this genre, and so they pop their head out. wanna know the real enemy of the FGC? the online FGC. the community, we are more and more toxic every year, always arguing about the same shit, never finding solutions. all we've done all these years, is getting really good at continuing this argument about simplification, I'm all for it, it's that or forget casuals, we gonna lose og's too, because fuck it, I'd rather jump into a game and enjoy it for what it is than quit this genre that is going nowhere, xrd? xrd wasn't that popular in fgc. we got tons of people to try it but how many did we keep? exactly. I know casuals still playing dbfz lol

[@cpthurme]

I'm happy with the proposed changes as I wanted simplification and easier combos - I wasn't able to get full damage reward for my character in Xrd. Keen to move on from Xrd.

[@GlacierFox523]

I want Blazblue looking like Strive. That and another BB or english Central Fiction

[@unregisteredaccount6555]

Looks like in anticipation of lower sales, they are reducing development time and cost through said simplification to even out.

[@Yosefhouser]

I definitely agree with most of what Obama says except that complexity doesn’t sell to the layman. I can guarantee you that there’s people like me that would love to get into GG but don’t like stuff like links, setplay, long combos and mechanics bloat. Honestly, even later on, I’d pass up 3S for games with more sensible design like Alpha 2 that didn’t sacrifice stuff like footsies for executional “depth”. This is especially important when as complicated as Xrd was, the scene just went away with a wimper. There’s definitely gotta be some shakeups to find the proper balance of accessibility and depth, much like Tekken 7 to get the scene popping because having another Xrd isn’t going to cut it. I definitely will agree that some of the changes like limiting combos from P and K, no air techs and some others are definitely questionable to me too because they seem to already be at a good baseline by making IAD, combos shorter and less mechanics easier on newcomers

[@zekiel2533]

At the same time tho layman don't always stay layman if they're determined to master a game. Theyre trying to be like tekken 7 and It all depends if they find that balance but this approach ain't it. Nerfing combos down and making air throw weaker is wack.

[@theoya]

Then don't sell it as "complexity". Sell it as a game that gives you options and freedom: the player is allowed to combo from any given move to a lot of other moves. They have the freedom on defense to FD or burst or dead angle to stop their opponent.

[@Yosefhouser]

@@theoya actually, that's a p brilliant point to change the tone to more options, more ways to express yourself in playstyle and freedom of choice in the game, which most people can get excited about.

[@duggyfresh8899]

I would be fine with simplification. But there not even doing that people who are new to this game or fighting games in general are gonna have issues with things that are simple in terms of concept but have a certain level situational that will come pf hard and more confuzing to new players like revolving around counter hit as much as this game does just for 1 example

[@nechavez1921]

Share video please, we need this to be shared.

[@sqwidtheboi]

kengan asura fighter?

[@ChristmasCakeLover_8866]

I think the reason why rev2 didnt sold well is not bc its complicated but bc theres few word of mouth bc the people that should champion it doesn't like it bc its "simplified" and also YRC. They need to cater abit more to the hardcore fans and those fans will spread the word and demonstrate how cool the game is. I mean look at tekken 7. People says its a complicated game bc of the situational stuff and also characters having 100+ moves. It also went back to the "grass root tekken" that even retired players came back to play it and now champions the game. Now those players spreads the word and shows how good tekken is with their hype matches and sick slow mo (that gg rev also has) and thats what made the people buy the game GG can easily one up tekken bc they already have a robust training feature when tekken barely has any.

[@egrassa1480]

Gg didn't sell well cuz marketing sucked big cucumber

[@gorrazin7983]

I feel like some statements could be overblown. Not many people have played the game yet and those that have certainly haven't had sufficient time to truly become acquainted with the new systems let alone master them. As many people have said, the game is very different and I'm sure someone will find a way to make longer/aerial combo strings work somehow. Let's wait for more information before we start slamming our collective keyboards over what might only be perceived problems.

[@supersapphire]

can someone tell me the song at 30:31?

[@ggmasterguiltygear6315]

For me a great truly great fighting game has the same amount of defensive options as offensive ones

[@tzera_rhuon]

Precisely why I like Virtua Fighter so much.

[@hockey1973]

Smash for the Switch is more technical than Smash for the Wii-U and that game sold gangbusters. Once again for the devs in the back, dumbing games down DOES NOT translate to sales! I think last year when GG was in its initial design stages they saw the hype for DBFZ and BBTAG and mistakenly thought "WOW. . . reduced mechanics WORK!!!" and that was the wrong takeaway. . .

[@HyperDogeGaming]

exactly. Smash, but in other genres of massively successful titles, we could cite League of Legends, which is immensely deep and complex, with tons of items, moves, and characters to memorize. To stay in the same genre, the same applies to Tekken 7, which is an extremely complex game both to learn and to master.

[@Xero_Kaiser]

Smash and LoL are super easy to jump into though. Hell, how many times have you heard the, "SSB isn't a real fighting game" routine?

[@garretwoeller7669]

From what I was told that although it's slower it's not a slow Game it's just easier to process the visual over load that Rev and Rev2 has been like I'mma pick it up hell MK11 looked great was easy to play but the punch and crunch of hits feel more limp then Erectile dysfunction

[@russhl125]

i really really hope kofxv will not fall into the same trap

[@sladejosephwilson2300]

Bad example. No where near the same

[@SoysauceML]

I think it's more important to make lower level play fun and look amazing without fully utilizing the more difficult mechanics, than to simply dumb down the said mechanics for these people (which may still be difficult for newcomers at first regardless). That way I think it's possible for new players to get hooked on, then slowly find interst in trying out the more advanced mechanics.

[@dingusdangus1790]

"You have to put your hands on it to find out" Mean like how we all thought SFV would be easy mode trash and we were right?

[@sladejosephwilson2300]

To be fair strive is still in development and won't come out for a while. So it's not going to be like SFV

[@DriedPlank]

These days most big name fighting games are more interested in Esports and the Tournament scene than trying to be a deep, unique, fun, content filled, fighting game. Some look at the current leaders and try to imitate them. So that leaves the question of do you keep imitating until it works or do things your way until you find what blows up. Tekken 7 is the best example of finding it's breakthrough after all these years, while imitation hasn't been working so far. Maybe Guilty Gear 2020 can be that game though, who knows. It's too early to judge, but with a few tweaks it could be something special and possibly the future of Guilty Gear. I'd like to see more types of Roman cancels, more moves in general (May's move list in particular looks stale), Stage transition Oki (going back to neutral breaks the hype and momentum created by knocking your opponents through the invisible wall). There should also be multiple dedicated moves be able to break the wall, not all of them. That change alone would open up so many combo options. I like the layout Guilty Gear 2020 is going for but there are a few questionable big decisions the developers made. Like they're going too far with the simplification. That can change though, for better or worse.

[@kenji3527]

I think fighting games should go with a difficult but not impossible stance.

[@joshuataylor7443]

Darkstalkers made by arcsystemworks SOUND GREAT!!

[@DjReno87]

That dot hack wallpaper of the OS tho. My man.

[@fatal85]

Great video. All im seeing is people saying GG is dead because of simplification. If anything kills GG it will be sales like the last game. The game looks like it could be fun. If it's too easy I can always play Rev 2. Rev 2 still looks good to me.