ANTIHEROES - Terrible Writing Advice

[@TerribleWritingAdvice]

For the record, Berserk is my favorite story and I think that Guts is an amazing protagonist and antihero. I love his design which I referenced when making the character for the antihero in the video along with drawing inspiration from Image comics and 80s action films. Unfortunately, success spawns imitators who often fail to imitate the deeper themes and elements that make Berserk such a great character driven story. So no, this video is not a dig at Berserk or Guts. Instead, the video proposes what such a character might be like if a less skilled author read Berserk and decided to try to write an antihero by essentially copying the surface elements and ignoring the deeper themes of the story and more subtle nuances of characterization Guts receives throughout the story.

[@DrArthurCGarp]

Terrible Writing Advice What do you think of Kratos? He's an anti hero that a lot of people hate

[@mkultraenjoyer]

actually pretty ironic because i was gonna mention guts as an amazing antihero

[@horricule451]

Needs more likes, it's a good explanation.

[@drakeunderscoremason]

I saw the thumbnail and thought to myself, oh boy he's gonna rag on my boi Gattsu isn't he.

[@benevolentworldexploder5395]

Honestly as much as I love Berserk and think Guts has some pretty deep character; it isn't something that needs justification even if you were to rag on it. Particularly since I was certain that your video wasn't about Guts, but about how antihero writing has become this trend that people follow without possessing the knowledge to understand how an antihero should work as an authentic part of their story. I have some news though, brace yourselves everyone, Guts isn't the only "antihero" worth discussing.

[@agitodragoon3736]

"I'm morally ambiguous." *"You just killed hundreds of innocent people."* "You don't understand me."

[@DonVigaDeFierro]

You can still make it morally ambiguous: - By killing them, he saved MILLIONS of innocent people. - He was forced to do it by the bad guy. - It's part of a plan to destroy the bad guy that does worse things all the time. - The world is so garbage that mass murder is just considered a misdemeanor. - He did it on his past when he was an idiot, and he now must carry the weight of the dead in his conscience. - He was convinced they were not innocent at all. - He practices a religion that makes human sacrifices a regular part of life, but is a good guy in everything else. - The situation was so desperate that "collateral damage" was acceptable. - He did it to spare them a fate worse than death. - Uhhh... It really was an accident he caused, but he's convinced it was the bad guy's fault... - Uhhh...He literally can't tell apart good from evil and if he ever does good is because he's blindly following orders from the actual heroes... - Uhhh... He knows that is wrong, but he has been sentenced to summary execution for a crime he didn't commit, and after years of being on the run he no longer cares following the law... And the bad guy is worse. I don't know... Effort, amirite?

[@Scout-164]

Sounds like The Punisher.

[@wisemankugelmemicus1701]

@@DonVigaDeFierro I got one, unbeknownst to most people those thousands of innocents were possessed by malevolent spirits and he's so broken from his past trauma that he simply could do what had to be done

[@criticalthinkingconcubus]

That’s why I like Guts from Berserk. He is by no means a hero, but he’s not a completely terrible person.

[@ametsunami4070]

Odin sphere in a nutshell

[@thekaticorn99]

Antihero: *kills everyone* Comic relief character: *Z A P P E R S*

[@randyrichmondiii3415]

@Marc buck and fuck

[@andrewveeable]

“My name is Buck, and I came here to party” 😉

[@Lapeno456]

z o o w e e m a m a

[@NexusKirin]

*W O W Z E R S*

[@l_rob420]

Red Hood and Robin basically

[@LordSusaga]

You missed the most important part of the anti-hero! Once he slaughters his way up to the villain with more corpses than have been used to show the villain as a monster, he proves he is NOT evil by refusing to kill said villain, showing everyone how much he has developed in the 5 seconds since his last kill! Bonus points if the love interest gives a quick speech about becoming "just like him" to make the situation appear more complex.

[@Underworlder5]

standard mook, who was probably blackmailed into helping the main antagonist or is just trying to make a living: butcher him main antagonist, who is responsible for everything and wants to commit mass murder: spare, otherwise you are just as bad hero logic

[@KingEndymionrose]

BCPowerhouse I absolutely love your comment It so true I hate that cliche too.

[@Underworlder5]

+Veronique van Dijk selective justice

[@raulrojas9253]

that sounds like vegeta in majin buu saga

[@wolfmatic399]

Susaga I might have done a slight subversion on that. I hope it's subverted enough.

[@ShrimpOfDeath]

"Slashfic writers would ship him with the main hero anyway" - if your books have reached a point when there's fan fiction based on them you already are a successful writer.

[@brianaguilar8283]

Lies

[@princessdee-6580]

The standards of a slashfic writer are much lower than you think. They can and will write about anything. Even the most obscure novel/comic isn't spared or shown mercy.

[@kompatybilijny9348]

@zipit flygirl you are writing a sequel to Don Kichot then?

[@kompatybilijny9348]

@zipit flygirl Will this book of yours be dEeP?

[@aikotitilai3820]

@zipit flygirl that's mean that you're a successful writer I guess

[@aninjathtpwndu]

Anti heroes can be some of the best well written protagonist in any medium but also are some of the easiest to fuck up

[@PainXIII12]

Joebroe

[@aninjathtpwndu]

Guts yes?

[@tudorciubotaru3497]

Kratos?

[@brandonontama2415]

Tudor Ciubotaru Kratos is the antihero that they screwed up.

[@calemr]

Travis Touchdown (No more heroes) manages to avoid so much of this video, and he's one of my favourite antiheroes.

[@highdefinitionapollo2189]

I'm gonna write a story about a young chosen one called Mary Sue fighting a war to save the world from an evil empire alongside an elf who went to a magic school with her and a brooding antihero who is also a werewolf set in a post apocalyptic dystopian world while battling slashers that just won't die and aliens that have laser guns but die from pollen allergy all while spreading the message of environmentalism. The story would of course, be resolved through a love triangle.

[@Q_Tura]

Someone already made that book... How uncreative...

[@blueflare7687]

High Definition Apollo *Perfusely vomits*

[@rucealexander2848]

High Definition Apollo i would read that ironically

[@crazyinsane500]

Replace werewolf with kangarooman and you've got Tank Girl.

[@1992jkwj]

*visible fear*

[@colbaltmind5696]

There’s nothing more of a turnoff than a man becoming a better person, amirite ladies?

[@iliveinsideyourhouse3943]

Character development be likes

[@sh0tgunsh1pping]

_The only character development you need is becoming _*_more_*_ edgy!_

[@GeneralTantzu]

"I can fix him dad!"

[@brianaguilar8283]

It’s only hot if they fix him themselves

[@davidemura4444]

gives you nothing to work with :((

[@DinsRune]

My favorite part of Final Fantasy 7 is how Cloud acts exactly like this and everyone makes fun of him for it. What's more, it isn't even his real personality: he's literally just trying to act cool in front of everyone, and the whole party can tell.

[@sodaftpm185]

The original or the remake?

[@pedroaugusto-fw2yt]

@@sodaftpm185 both, but in the remake is more obvious

[@pkbutter]

I find it also really funny how Tifa notices that Cloud's acting weird and basically decides not to kick him out because she thinks he's mentally ill

[@nenmaster5218]

@@pkbutter Have you seen Critical Drinkers Video-Series "Why modern movies suckkk"?

[@TupocalypseShakur]

@@nenmaster5218 isn't that just most of Critical Drinker's content? "So and so bad"

[@amethyst_dawn]

TWA: Anti-Heroes becoming full heroes would mean he loses his appeal to women Zuko: Allow me to introduce myself

[@docrofreborn7497]

Zuko, look, yer honor! *points somewhere*

[@mahogania5536]

I think he actually became *more* popular when he started to become better

[@zhalosupercell2486]

Docrof Reborn she escaped! But how?

[@DonVigaDeFierro]

Ye, but this is _terrible_ writing advice.

[@MT-zu2uq]

@@mahogania5536 The hair helped 😂

[@asterluke]

The best part of an antihero is they can get an anti-love triangle!

[@Jasonwolf1495]

asterluke you mean the hate triangle where they hate a character who wont hate them back and thus have to deal with their anger because if the other person hated them back they could be enemies and just fight.

[@gregorhodson3741]

Nah, they usually just get a regular love triangle. Changing the formula is far too much work.

[@Destroyahx2]

Gregor Hodson But that doesn't fit with the anti in anti hero. We need not a love triangle, because as you said, can't change the formula. But an innocent, sheltered, and ignorant woman who is an heir to be a space empress, and is the most beautiful in the galaxy fall for him. This is obviously called the bad boy trope, and in no way needs any other explanation to why she manages to break through his tough exterior, and what actually made them meet. You only need to see the anti-hero's past and feel for him, which only makes that woman fall even more for him. Edit: I wrote that before the part where he says the love triangle part

[@hayleybartek8643]

Anti-live quadrangles are better. Please refer to "Midsummer Night's Dream" for details.

[@HonestMagpie]

@Jeffrey Wasn't that the plot of Lego Batman?

[@MagicalMaster]

You know... a good Anti-Hero idea would be one who looks like this guy you've described at first. But then you slowly develop him as simply socially inept so he compensates by trying to scare people off. He's actually painfully lonely but is so afraid of screwing it up that he's more afraid to stop. A painful self cycle that keeps him as the Anti-Hero that we know and loathe.

[@teleportsaroundyou4629]

That's... that's Guts my guy

[@mephilisthedarkelijahramat182]

So shadow?

[@mcp7158]

@@teleportsaroundyou4629 yup

[@brianaguilar8283]

That’s literally every antihero

[@roberte.o.speedwagon5811]

You LITERALLY just described Guts from Berserk

[@ThePa1riot]

6:09 After re-watching it, you realize that Zuko has this exact story arc. He does learn to open up and does become a true hero. Still just as popular, Hell his most iconic line is a post-redemption consoling of a friend. “. . . That’s rough buddy.”

[@lemonstarofficial]

lol

[@BasedZoomer]

@Crimson Outdoors Co. I rewatch it every two or three years

[@kimifw58]

That line is only "iconic" because it's weird and awkward. It shows that he tries to help but doesn't know how because he's new at it.

[@yaqubebased1961]

Zuko is the actual MC of Avatar

[@manospondylus]

The best anti-hero is still Wario

[@retrogamelover2012]

What about Deadpool?

[@cloudyskies2]

No Ratchet from Ratchet and Clank

[@Ditidos]

It is Kirby.

[@idkwayta1722]

lem0n Cheif is a war hero, he is really sacrifice himself selflessly countless time

[@bobjones4162]

Wario isn't an anti-hero, he doesn't really care about morals.

[@Meirstein]

Now do one on an antivillain. Remember to make his backstory sufficiently sad that we feel sorry for them, and make their goals and motivation so understandable and relatable that we start rooting for them over the hero. Of course, we need the hero to win out in the end, so the antivillain needs to die in some fitting way. When you are going to kill off your antivillain, make sure to have them switch to the good guy's side a week earlier, because heaven forbid that the opposite side have characters that are idealists in their own right that we think maybe didn't deserve to die.

[@hakuyowane4505]

Meirstein *_Did you mean:_*_ Mapleshade_

[@manictiger]

So kind of like Magneto? (He dies fighting Sentinels before the time travel thing.) Alright, got it. A long time ago, in Auschwitz, a boy wanted his mother...

[@randysavage2585]

Meirstein No such thing as anti villains. Only Heroes, anti heroes, and villains

[@randysavage2585]

Naseeb Dhaliwal Doesn’t matter. Villains are villains. How well the author writes them determines how relatable they are

[@randysavage2585]

Naseeb Dhaliwal Not quite

[@toasturhztoastbunz896]

"Anti-heroes should be edgy!!" Shadow the hedgehog *cough cough*

[@lonelywolf5659]

You know he was never like that in Sonic Adventure 2 right they just turned him into that in Shadow the Hedgehog. Why he was not like that and o-6 but after that ya

[@incrediblehobson8479]

Did you mean "Ow the edge"?

[@ped3752]

@@lonelywolf5659 Sega tends to fuck up some characters as time goes on, I'm sure this may end soon though.

[@marianovelardez3771]

"Shadow" best name ever xd

[@matthewginman8397]

Edgy the Hedgy.

[@SuperBatSpider]

What if the antihero was played straight until he got revenge? Then a problem occurs. If he got his revenge, what is he going to do now? He didn’t make any plans and getting revenge brought nobody back. He doesn’t even feel better. The story keeps going.

[@zapperil]

There's some people who can turn these into find something that can bring someone back Or have him not moving on and preferred to stay alone ( if it's loved one )

[@5Rogi]

Leaving him with trauma/PTSD/loneliness. Or his adrenaline needs to be satisfied during the battles and his lust for the blood forced him to find a new excuses to kick some ass. Like the Punisher.

[@ChaosRayZero]

Or what if he decided at the last moment that revenge wasn't what he wanted after all and he performs a heroic sacrifice to atone for his sins and stop his own revenge plot before it's too late. After his supposed death, it turns out _he actually survived after all,_ except *now he has amnesia* and one of the only things he actually remembers is the death of his loved one, so if he eventually remembers who she was and how upset he was over her death he runs the risk of going on a roaring rampage of revenge all over again! 😜

[@gfilmer7150]

@@5Rogi Comic Punisher or Netflix Punisher?

[@5Rogi]

@@gfilmer7150 Comic. If I remember correctly he has a plot, that deep inside him is the need to fight. Before he lost his family he even changed his surname in order to go to another war.

[@jaiyapapaya]

If I buy your book, will you release my family from your dungeon? Please? It's been a year...

[@Q_Tura]

Sorry but I called dips on them.

[@jaiyapapaya]

ÈRPÉKA oh fuck. Just don't put them in a love triangle, ok?

[@Q_Tura]

Jaiya Papaya Too late... I already shipped your parents together... And you won't know who the third one is... I am the embodiment of evil! *twirls a fake pair of mustaches*

[@jaiyapapaya]

ÈRPÉKA NOT THE CLICHESSSS

[@MrTohawk]

The book? You mean Aeon Legion: Labyrinth?

[@JstaFriskyHusky]

My god he covers every book stereotype there is and I love it

[@abandonator]

"..Hmm.." - Geralt of Rivia , Netflix adaptation

[@clankymocha]

He's just like that in the games too ! That's just how geralt is

[@rayanemabrouki3524]

@@clankymocha but not like the books tho. In the first book he is speaking for hours to a mute priestess, and even interpreting her reactions, to make up responses to his own storytelling. And in the games too you can have good dialogues and interactions. The Netflix show is despicable, it just presents an edgy and stupid Geralt.

[@5Rogi]

Well, he is an interesting type. Deep down Geralt is a traditional hero, but because he is a mutant he wear a mask of the sociopatic profesionalist as a shield. He's also had the sarcastic view of the world, caused by learning and witnessing of cruel and dumb bahaviors of ,,intelligent" creatures. I don't blame him.

[@johntimothyvalenzuela8146]

@@rayanemabrouki3524 yeah, they definitely made geralt too edgy on netflix, cavill is definitely good enough though, only character whose adaptation im satisfied with.

[@chance79th77]

Don’t forget “Fuck”

[@Spineless-Lobster]

“Antiheroes speak a special language consisting only of grunts and short sarcastic quips.” Geralt Of Rivia: * Nervous sweating *

[@Karak-_-]

Gervant oscilates between short sarcastic quips and long monologes.

[@Aredel]

“Sure, what do I know? I’m only a Witcher.”

[@FayeSomething]

The read any 90s comic book line is the truest statement I've ever heard all year

[@kybercat7]

I just recalled that chaos comics purgatory series was a thing, it was so cheesy but it was soooooo good, best cheese 1000/10

[@Mailed-Knight]

Man 90's anti-heroe comics, my favorite will always be Deathstroke the Terminator!

[@ProxyDoug]

It was still better than what Marvel is doing today.

[@CidGuerreiro1234]

Western culture in general was trying way too hard to be cool during the 90's. Music, cartoons, comics... everything.

[@goodjobeli]

Douglas Rosa Do you mean with comics? Then I agree 100% (even though I quite like secret empire whoops)

[@t850terminator]

CRAWLING IN MY SKIN

[@ENCHANTMEN_]

heh, nothing personnel, kid

[@yuriwheeler8633]

*I'VE BECOME SO NUMB I CAN'T FEEL YOU THERE!!*

[@CreeketsCreek]

ENCHANTMEN pffft

[@heliodor7679]

t850terminator CRAWLING IN MY CRRRRAAAAAWLLLLL

[@account8158]

THESE CRAWLS THEY WILL NOT CRAWL

[@robbiebay8868]

Just remember: 'Griffith did everything wrong'

[@valance10]

Robbie Bay shut the fuck up

[@sandromain]

You deserve Donovan

[@ashuranero5721]

no

[@DonVigaDeFierro]

He did nothing wong. He put his grasses on.

[@rango962]

Sir you slaughter all your friends to become a super demon and then brought chaos upon a world just to have some few life in peace while the rest of the world gets ravaged by monsters. What do you have to say to your defense? I did nothing wrong

[@Your_LocalWizard]

He slaughters minions with realative ease Makes crushing empires seem such a breeze He may lack motive he can't fly But this hero's one *HELL* of a guy

[@thesnatcher3616]

Edgy Kong is Dead!

[@williamdrum9899]

HUH!

[@doorto6152]

Dare you spend an entire episode on the dreaded love triangle?!

[@doorto6152]

Though seriously, I think you should save the inevitable love triangle episode for your one-year anniversary, or a huge subscriber milestone, like a million.

[@scottmantooth8785]

the BERMUDA LOVE TRIANGLE™ (or BLT)...NOTHING ESCAPES its influence or devious grasp on FOOLISH HEARTS and DYSFUNCTIONAL/IRRATIONAL EMOTIONS!!...NO ONE!!!!!

[@mixedbagmixesmusic1967]

Of course you can give him a motive! His mortal enemy killed his father!

[@brianaguilar8283]

I’ve never heard that one before

[@skyfeather5096]

MixingTheArts vegeta .

[@ChaosRayZero]

*@MixingTheArts* Or a SWAT-like team shot and killed his only friend while they were trying to abduct him. _Take your pick._ =^p

[@stevenhiggins3055]

Not his father. His wife. It's always the wife.

[@ChaosRayZero]

@@stevenhiggins3055 I don't think Shadow The Hedgehog and Maria Robotnik were married. Heck, I don't think Maria was even old enough for that.

[@0mnicorn]

Anti-hero? More like anti-social

[@monsouranda2822]

Ahh Guts. The anti-hero done right.

[@jtktomb8598]

so goddamn right

[@raulrojas9253]

except his fan are fucking retarded. Griffith is bad guy not guts bla bla bla.....is like they dont even read berserk There isnt a BAD GUY ON BERSERK is a Super GRAY STORY in FANTASY and Gore.

[@locastmincer]

ever heard of the PUNISHER?

[@ghostlobster6631]

was thinking of him too~

[@youdontknowme2913]

Raul Rojas agreed, I don't know why Griffith is considered so evil . I found it irrelevance. What he did was in human but come on he is human too... And one of the best character writing ever .

[@tuxyben7059]

I think that after 18 chapters we are advanced enough to move to the next level of love triangle, there's not enough depth, I think we need to bring back the love The dodecahedron

[@ExplosiveBrohoof]

The love rhombicosidodecahedron.

[@mik21ak55]

At thot point, I think it's just an orgy

[@blankblank1284]

@@mik21ak55 Yup.

[@cresentcube5898]

I want someone to write a book with all the advises from this channel used. oh, wait. let me check. The Twilight saga? what's that?

[@Invisiblelad]

Moonlightpetal Cherry Thank you for the edit! I was really invested in the uncliche story.

[@ZanathKariashi]

...how that's VERY CLOSE to the Birth of Democracy propaganda story in Centaur's Worries.

[@turquoisesnowflake4613]

You mean YA novels in general

[@leephillips4402]

Twillight has antihero's you just don't realise their antihero's cause their so uncool basically the exact opposite of this video

[@aggressivepie6860]

There's even a Love Triangle! :D

[@pappanalab]

anti-hero = Brody +Edge lord + asshole+ speaks only in grunts + lives for revenge + tragic backstory = Sasuke

[@DonVigaDeFierro]

*"SAUCE GAAAAAY!!!"*

[@saffi_taffi]

Lol omg yes. There were so many overused tropes in Naruto. The helplessly in love female side character who gives nothing to the plot, the oldest and wisest mentor character for the hero’s, the main character being a shone protagonist that wants to become the best because?.... they want to become the best! There, now just make him super annoying and dumb, btu only when the plot needs him to be. At other times he’ll be smart enough to formulate a useful strategy despite having 0 brain cells shown beforehand. And even through all of this, EVERYONE respects him and says how good he is at making friends even though none of that would ever work in real life.

[@pappanalab]

@@saffi_taffi Actually I think the protagonist thing wasn’t that common when Naruto first came out. Otherwise, yeah, so many tropes.

[@maramsagheer3399]

@@saffi_taffi I personally think tropes aren't necessarily bad, they just get a bad rep because some writers completely rely on them and don't develop the characters. Like casca from berserk is a tsundere but she's a fleshed out character

[@saffi_taffi]

@Supreme Ace lol are you kidding me? Sasuke is literally the king of edge lords.

[@TheRhetoricGamer]

So, Sasuke Uchida? 1. Dark and brooding with no other character traits? Check. 2. Has no motivation beyond revenge? Check. 3. Part of a love triangle he didn't want to be a part of? Check. 4. Begins with no superpowers compared to other characters until he becomes the focus of the story, where he gains incredibly overpowered abilities (coughSharringanEyecough)? Check.

[@Supermateo97]

lmao

[@littleblueclovers]

cyrad I agree. But for the revenge part, I'm glad that the characters called it out early on. I remember Kakashi going up to him and asking "what are you planning on doing after your revenge plan?" And Sasuke didn't say anything.

[@TheRhetoricGamer]

Aye, but putting a lampshade on it doesn't make Sasuke an interesting character. He's boring and cliche.

[@Boss_Isaac]

+cyrad Sasuke most definitely isn't dark and broody. He was only eight years old when he returned home to find his clansmen slaughtered with his beloved older brother being responsible. Its not like he was a 12 year old child who knew who was responsible for the act and (understandably) desired to take action against them in order to gain justice for the deaths of his clansmen and move on from that part of his life.

[@TheRhetoricGamer]

Boss Isaac So what's your argument that Sasuke isn't dark and brooding?

[@jordanhamann9123]

Could you do a video about breaking the 4th wall? I feel it's use is too common, or at least used enough to warrant some fun being poked at it.

[@sweetpotatobestpotato9893]

Yes!!

[@oof-rr5nf]

Jordan Hamann You're so right. When it's done with thought, it's hilarious but when written into the story lazily it's like nails on chalkboard for me. Ugkhh.

[@shenotski]

GRIFFITH!!!!

[@wyattcamp6762]

shenotski Guts is the best antihero

[@irishcream9004]

shenotski humans are weak and we die easily, but no matter how weak we are, no matter how much we are tortured or trampled upon, no matter how much pain we feel, we still want to live.

[@irishcream9004]

lutin grognon then live long enough to swing back with double the force

[@partydean17]

Wait isn't guts the anti hero here?

[@renel8964]

CASCA!!!! 😠😱

[@dbsommers1]

I'm proud to say I once had the hero defeat a villain by startling him at dinner and he choked to death on a chickenbone. His anti hero partner was not happy about being one upped like that

[@milicadiy]

Where can I find this?

[@tsm688]

but it remained a mystery

[@bulletkin_etg]

probably dnd or something

[@rizzoforgo865]

Late to the party but I think this is an interesting way to beat a villain. Hell, you don't have to fight on the field of battle, or dogfight in planes or mechs like Ace Combat or Gundam, or fight in a lightsaber duel in Star Wars. You just simply trick him into going into the wrong room or kill him over dinner. After all, dead is dead, no matter how you do it.

[@Kaliko-hey]

​​​@@rizzoforgo865 True, but it would still need to be done right. I mean, seemingly building up to some big climactic ending only for the villain to die because he choked while having dinner is, pretty clearly, anticlimactic. Ofc that doesn't mean it can't be done right, I believe that basically any trope (for lack of a better word) can be done right. This idea just seems like it would be extremely difficult to do right. You are correct that it is a very interesting way to beat a villain.

[@doctordoom85]

Yeah, that's why writers who elevate Batman and Wolverine too highly annoy me. Wolverine was supposed to be more of an underdog but then they made his regeneration absurdly powerful (and while he does take the focus of the majority of the movies, at least they always have Magneto swat him around). And then some writers don't want to write Batman, they want to write BatGOD who can effortlessly take down virtually every superpowered character and has plans for every contingency even if specific situations are too vast to completely predict, because you know, a "normal" dude who got to inherit a massive fortune at a young age and managed before the age of 30 to become the world's greatest detective, one of the best martial artists outside of a few specific characters, well versed in most fields of science, and how to successfully run a company and be a playboy while not getting a wink of sleep during nighttime, clearly that's not pushing Mary Sue levels as it is.......

[@banon9573]

With you 100%! I never understood the appeal of either Wolverine or Batman.

[@whathell6t]

B Anon Be glad that the writers did made Wolverines and Batman as a rape victims like Guts the Black Swordsman. That will be going to far here in mainstream media.

[@manictiger]

That's why I've always liked Marvel more. Marvel has Magneto, which imo, is the real essence of the 'dark side'. It's not just his mother in Auschwitz, but he has everything taken away time and time again, always persecuted by the same people Xavier keeps telling him to open up to. His motives make a lot of sense, even if it is the genocide of the human species. Compare that to: Anakin gets dumped and then kills of a bunch of kids. Really, George? As for Batman-- my sister loves it and I don't have a clue why. Where'd the money come from? Does he resell bat droppings as Herbalife, or something? Where's his misery coming from? His parents? Millions of kids grow up fine after having lost their parents at a young age and they don't have a castle full of stolen Stark Industries toys. I enjoyed most of the Batman stuff (movies, cartoons, etc.), but the fundamental story is pretty crap. The best Batman films just straight up ignore his backstory, just like the best Starwars films just straight up ignore Darth Vader's backstory. No story is better than bad story.

[@aileenzhao7951]

I've always liked how they made Batman and the crew have to hype up on super pills and do weird shit in order to gain a chance at defeating Superman in Gods Among Us. Because Batman cannot headbutt Superman into outer space, contrary to popular belief

[@sertorrhenclegane]

Well, Batman is normal by comparison of the company he keeps. Outside of that, yes, he's pretty much extraordinary by human standards. But, one must also recall that's a world where men can fly, magic lassos can force you to tell the truth and a ring can help you build giant constructs through sheer force of will.

[@FlamraFire]

The anti-hero you portray looks just like Guts, but that can't be right, Guts is great.

[@yourmom9931]

Flamra Fire Guts is just a very typical looking antihero even though he's a very well written one.

[@FlamraFire]

Yeah, Guts even hits a lot of the marks in this video, too. Always wins battles, is out for revenge, wins the love triangle, etc. I guess it just comes down to execution. Guts is more justified in his brooding than most anti-heroes, but he can warm up to people. It's not like he wants to be a mopy brood, the world of Berserk just fucking hates him.

[@holycowitsdave]

Basically what you're saying is there's a fine line between a well written Antihero (read; Guts), and a poorly written Edgelord (read; Kirito)

[@FlamraFire]

Kirito's too bland to classify even as the worst anti-hero.

[@ApocalypticBlades]

Bret Ginn The black trenchcoat and dual wielded longswords disagree

[@corvidaeic]

A video about anti-heros By an anti-hero

[@rawovunlapin8201]

Whatever...

[@BlueZeroThree]

I guess that makes it more sense they know what it's like

[@kaziislam2785]

Arriaah Ara yeah, by this antihero is one that the writing community (mostly Wattpad) needs, but not one it really deserves.

[@TheMojaveLamp]

Kazi Islam Truer words were never spoken

[@corvidaeic]

Kazi Islam preach

[@lunariousmoon]

Anti-heroes: *Exist* Fangirls: Allow us to write Ourselves with you

[@Xehanort10]

Pure evil villains: Exist. Fangirls: Let us write stories about how you're a poor victim and all the terrible things you've done are everyone else's fault.

[@barrytheflashallen3941]

Anti-Villains: *Exist* Fangirls: Let us write how much of a loser you are.

[@walterthemighty7549]

One of my favorite tropes is when the antihero disappears early on, only to ultimately become an antagonist.

[@Left4Cake]

"Where is that damn 4th chaos emerald" -Shadow the Hedghog.

[@ChaosRayZero]

*“ 'Bring hope to humanity,' huh? Kinda touching...”* *“There's no need to repeat past tragedies! Nobody else ever needs to go through the things that I have!”* *“It's all right. I... I will always be with Maria.”* *“[That chaos emerald,] I no longer need it. I have Maria in my heart.”* -all lines Edgy The Hedgie has canonically said in Sonic Battle, but nobody ever quotes for some reason.

[@johnsalchichon777]

Do you have diabetes.

[@sergiorubens8475]

Renember when shadow was wll writen? I do

[@ElvenRaptor]

Fiction needs more Han Solos. Not out for revenge, just a guy trying to get by in the world who gets swept up other people's baggage, but proves to be an asset through his grit, cunning, and pragmaticism.

[@CD-Gaming]

I'm almost tempted to write an antihero parody now, where he has huge swords but beats everyone with little more than the power of his scowls, his withering glare the most powerful weapon in his rather substantial arsenal which he only has to keep his trousers from falling down and his shirt from flying off in the wind and I am gradually growing more and more tempted with each word...

[@PelinalWhitestrake36]

SHIT IS THAT A MOTHERFUCKING BERSERK REFERANCE?!!! *CLANG INTENSIFIES *

[@sernoddicusthegallant6986]

but your grasses on everything went wong

[@sailoritaly]

I'd like to see your "advice" on the Five Man Band trope

[@echo5entertainment169]

Sailor Italy Look up Trope talk

[@CidGuerreiro1234]

TV Tropes has a really good intake on that. It's basically the Leader, the Lancer (guy who constantly challenges the rule of the leader), the Heart (the girl to whom everyone softens up), the Smart Guy and the Big (and usualy dumb) Guy.

[@TheWampam]

That is exactly how a five Man Band should look like, otherwise it wouldn't be one ;)

[@wakkaseta8351]

+lutin grognon *"words, words, and more words"* You forgot the love triangle! And the guy who joins up later, but was really a spy/traitor. But more importantly, the Love Triangle!

[@sockclad9066]

So basically JoJo part 3

[@MrKago1]

Pssshh, why stop with one brooding, emotionally broken antihero? why stop at a team of them? lets make it, an ENTIRE UNIVERSE OF ANTIHEROES. of course, throw in the occassional mary sue with perfect morals and uncompromising goodness as contrast. hey, we're on to something. we have to name it something. war gets people's attention. War-something. i know, since we're beating people in the face with edginess and nihlism lets use "hammer". Warhammer. akmost, but not big enough. Warhammer 40,000. PERFECT.

[@MrKago1]

A R-R I know. Like the Iron Fists and Iron Warriors track record of avoiding collateral damage. And the BlackTemplars strict adherence to the Codex Astartes. And the Cacaradon's brotherly love. especially towards fellow spess mahreens that undergo minor mutations. I think I've listened to too much Terrible Writting Advice.

[@manictiger]

Let's be honest, no one really cares about the writing. We just want to fuck shit up with spiky tanks and spiky machine gunners being shot out of spiky tanks so that spiky airships can suicide crash into the spiky tanks after getting shot down by spiky mechs. And also, meltaguns, because meltaguns.

[@MrKago1]

manictiger yes, but even if you want to twirl about as a space pixie killing people with glitter, we've got you you covered. if you like tossin back a few with the boyz while driving monster trukks recklessly, we've got you covered. hell we even have something for ICP fans. every possible iteration of bad writing advice in one setting. like love triangles? Slaanesh is the place, Slaaneshmas is the time. Like shitty emo poetry and wearing all black? You'll be right at home among the Raven Guard. We've got something for everybody at Big Emp's Cliche Emporium. Imperium. What ever. Something for everyone so come on down. Except Mccree, fuck that guy.

[@WTFisTingispingis]

To be fair, Warhammer was originally a gag. That said nerds took it so seriously that they got jobs writing for GW and took it UBER SERIOUS.

[@MrKago1]

AtticWarrior1994 was wondering where all the heresy was coming from. seems out of place in high scifi. "c'mon dude, its just a game." "HERESY! BURN THE HERETIC IN FIRE!" *proceeds t pelt people with dice*

[@serialkillerassistant4251]

"WHERE'S THAT DAMN FOURTH CHAOS EMERALD!?" - Edge 10/10

[@InfiniteDeckhand]

Because swearing automatically makes you edgy. Sure.

[@aakarshasoka6335]

With Obama.

[@Greyscal3Rainbow]

Subscribing because it was a stab at Berserk imitators that didn't hold up rather than being a hit piece on Berserk that had no grounds. :P

[@xzenitramx666]

john chad john whisper in your ear* KIRITO

[@abluetale1016]

xzenitramx666 never mention that god for sakes name again.EVER.

[@N3t0L1n]

goblin slayer manga, that "wannabe" Berserk crap

[@vincecatubuan7689]

@@N3t0L1n Goblinslayer isn't an antihero. Have you even read it?

[@quincy8093]

Cough solo leveling cough

[@ToriHiragana]

I think Zuko is a perfect example of the anti-hero done right. Anyone else agree?

[@midnight8341]

toriloveSubarukun agreed

[@Carewolf]

I think he is more of a reformed villian. A well written one, but he wasn't introduced as a hero, so not really an anti-hero

[@rgrimund2468]

Carewolf, his conflict that caused him to go rogue very early was already there. He rarely followed orders to the "T" choosing his own path. I can't really say he is a reformed villain, but more of a vilified antihero. It's kind of like how Deadpool came to be. His reason was never conquest, it was money as a mercenary that drove him to do everything he did. He aided both sides of the conflict at different times. Not villain worthy material and not hero worthy either. Zuko has redemption that pushed him, not conquest. He was literally a pawn to the villain. Zuko chose a path that was neither good or evil instead. He played major roles in both sides making him more antihero in my book than anything.

[@OSleeperTactical]

toriloveSubarukun I think he was always heroic but on the wrong side. Maybe I'm off base

[@balabanasireti]

toriloveSubarukun He always cared for his crew and uncle and only wanted the Avatar. So I don't consider him an anti-hero.

[@greppim911]

Deus Ex Machina - Terrible Writing Advice

[@spencercox7931]

YES!!

[@asiabrown99]

That's what I recommended!

[@josey_8204]

Thats a grand idea.

[@nightmarishcompositions4536]

I love how you used Guts haha, he's one of the greatest examples of a dark hero/anti-hero ever. There's a lot of mental and emotional trauma, betrayal, abuse of sorts that make his actions and behaviors understandable and in some cases, even worthy of sympathy. He changes a lot over the course of the story, and now he's become almost like a father figure to a group of young folks. He realized the error of his ways without completely changing and losing what made him interesting and strong.

[@VeryScaryGhosts]

I see a lot of people bringing up Berserk already but I find that 1. The anti-hero character in this video to look more like an homage to image comics. and 2. While Guts fits some of these stereotypes, he completely contradicts others (vague backstory, lack of character development, lack of consequences to his behaviour)

[@WTFisTingispingis]

Internet Ghost Guts also isn't entirely glorified either. His life SUCKS and he's kind of a shitty dude even to his friends sometimes.

[@ranieldale4842]

Id love to right a story where the anti heroes ' motivation is something uncommon like a dog or someone stole his sandwich. He would be the grown up equivalent of 12 year old edge lords who think they're tough, brooding and cool but freak out if you sneeze round them. The other characters would call him out on his bullshit and the only woman whose interested in him is his mum trying to get him to move out.

[@OctopusGrift]

John Wick's motive is nominally to avenge his dog.

[@yarpen26]

Better yet: the villain's dog ate the anti-hero's sandwich. Now that's a quest for revenge I would sign up for.

[@tejasvenugopal5183]

Rest in peace Shigechi

[@loke5052]

you talking about doom guy from doom 2 xd(his reason for going on a demon slaughter was that they killed his pet bunny)

[@calamaria3161]

I'd actually love that

[@bobjimbobjim]

dem berserk references.

[@poego6045]

I'll admit, they get better as the manga goes along , but damn, yeah, for sure.

[@muschkaelsergey4204]

*Bosporus interresperence!11!

[@bobjimbobjim]

Muschkael Sergey Jojo referendums*

[@Kaijuwolf137]

To be fair, Berserk actually uses the strategies he mentions in this video. Guts does open up to others, he has failed, his goal is revenge, and he actually has a personality.

[@bobjimbobjim]

Oh, I didn't mean references to the writing (well, mostly). But how he drew in this ep. I'm well aware Berserk is written splendidly and that it does uses the (opposite) advice in this vid.

[@couragew6260]

1:45 I love how the plan is to get the empire into bankruptcy, which is such a power move that is almost never used.

[@CCLOSPINA]

Except Rick in Rick and Morty.

[@couragew6260]

Cristian Lopez Of course he’s the exception😂 But seriously, you don’t see anything that involves politics or economy which I get can be sometimes be boring but can be effective if properly illustrated

[@FreshZCORD]

Hella smart

[@warmike]

Littlefinger in ASOIAF used that

[@TupocalypseShakur]

This was a strategy the Hulk of all people considered using to defeat the Minotaur in the Immortal Hulk

[@DarkThunderism]

But... Guts is a good antihero... I mean... he's pretty stereotypical, but that's because he started the stereotype back in 1989.

[@loreofmetal5604]

True berserk is the OG edgy black swordsman

[@bloodmachine6049]

He is not stereotypical. He is kinda at the start, but it all starts making sense as it goes on.

[@raulrojas9253]

jotaro is EDGY AS FUCK and A BAD ANTI HERO XD

[@youdontknowme2913]

Raul Rojas can't agree now though lol , we all know why his actions were too edgy at the beginning . It makes all sense now

[@DarkThunderism]

Raul Rojas Yare yare daze. You have a bad taste for Joestars.

[@blueflare7687]

Just give them a dark and tragic past and then proceed to mess with their character to the point where it is unrecognizable to the original character. *COUGH* SHADOW *COUGH*

[@voltscreamratty]

HOW DO YOU WORK?!?!!?

[@InkMossDragon]

But Shadow's story was already--oooh you are talking about Shadow the Hedgehog. Eh, just pretend the True Route only exists and forget the other crap. I still love him tho.

[@horricule451]

KING FREAKING CRIMSON. Remember when Shadow was edgy in a FUN way? Man I miss those days

[@blueflare7687]

Horricule Nowadays he's just a throwaway boss battle. Lets hope Sonic Forces fixes that.

[@InkMossDragon]

KING FREAKING CRIMSON I really hope he's just brainwashed in Forces. I can't think of any foreseeable reason why he would be going against Sonic.

[@awobbie.3140]

Terrible Writing Advice: KZbin Comments Write "first" if you get the first comment.

[@SmileytheSmile]

Other options: "Notification squad where u at?" "Nobody cares that you're first." "Something sexual involving daddys."

[@lydiarand4786]

"Overused meme that no-one liked in the first place"

[@jeremiaas15]

Remember to randomly blame a politician!

[@JC-om7nr]

FURST

[@leontrotsky7816]

For music videos, "I was brought here by "X"", where "X" is whatever film/TV show the song was most recently in.

[@cristhianramirez6939]

Don´t forget that the antiheroes in his infinite brooding still has weakness for kids and will do anything to protect them because they remind them of his own children they lost,ex: Frank Castle with Amy, Kratos with Pandora and Joel with Ellie

[@sodaftpm185]

Shadow the Hedgehog and Maria, Seto Kaiba with Mokuba, Wolverine and X-23, Bruce Wayne and Damian Wayne, etc.

[@Blitzethetic]

But that's actually kind of adorable.

[@risottopasty4921]

I just noticed that all his character's have no scleras (Whites around the pupils and iris), he and the guy from "Amazing writing advice" does, maybe it's some kind of metaphor for all his characters being one sided and non-multidimensional. And the polar opposite version of himself is just and extension of him. Even the people around him don't have scleras. Maybe it's supposed to be an analogy for narcissism, or him only valuing himself. That or I just think too much.

[@yourfriendlyneighborhoodbi6207]

His personal avatar's a reference to a meme from like 100 years ago lol. That's why it looks the way it does.

[@stevenhiggins3055]

Or maybe it's just because the characters are represented of fictional characters and the writer avatar is a representation of a real person.

[@stevenstice6683]

A true anti-hero would have the inverse of having only pupils - they would have Youngblood's Disease, where you only have blank white orbs for eyes. Other symptoms include highly exaggerated muscles, constant gritting of teeth, and feeling the need to spout off one-liners that wouldn't be out of place in a Steven Seagal movie.

[@jessicamartin1160]

I don't think it's that deep

[@nanchoparty]

I want some terrible writing advice on philosophy in fiction. Maybe talk about how it's the easiest way to be seen as super deep and pragmatic without understanding a subject at all.

[@frankdelgrosso8297]

I love the ending. Anti- heo grows, love intrest say "meh I only like bad boys" Priceless.

[@ChaosRayZero]

Love interest? I thought that was a fangirl- probably off to go write some fanfiction set "before he became good and dumb" or something.

[@5Rogi]

And sad. But it's a Mary Sue. Shallow heroines longs for a shallow traits.

[@annalisasauter7935]

...and then someone worthy of his affection comes into the fray, and they help one another become the best version of themselves.

[@astrolinn]

I love how the guy that made the german subtitles translated edgyness with coolness

[@absolutecorrupt9983]

Nah dude you defintely didn't wear your grasses on nothin will be wong wouldn't it

[@flynn659]

I don't understand could you please *Tell me why?*

[@ness6099]

I wanted to have a convo about Berserk, but since this comment was made 11 months ago... *It’s too late, it’s too late!!*

[@_sargentocoelho_4441]

You can see just how depressing berserk is when our only fanbase meme is about an opening with broken english

[@flynn659]

@@_sargentocoelho_4441 What about Griffith did nothing wrong.

[@_sargentocoelho_4441]

@@flynn659 Yea that is the ultimate joke

[@MarMarital]

Talk about killing characters and resurecting them!

[@ashem05]

Sorry, you misspelled "the comics industry"

[@Intothevoid-NIB]

The only example of a character dying and then coming back in comics is (from what I can remember) The Death and Return of Superman and Knightfall (he may as well have died).

[@Intothevoid-NIB]

Red Hood's death actually meant something, though, so I'm mot really going to count it. Green Lantern, no. When Lantern's die, they give their ring to a new Lantern. Lantern's do stay dead (if they're not revived as a Black Lantern).

[@Intothevoid-NIB]

He didn't really die, though. He fused with the spectre and came back as Green Lantern later

[@meavor]

On the one hand: Resurrecting can make the threat of death meaningless, and will make any drama based on death from then on moot; On the other hand: In a character driven story, killing off a character that could still have interesting stories done with them limits the situations you can put characters in.

[@space_bunny]

06:18 had me bursting out loud because it's so true. Srsly, your videos are amazing. I needed that healthy amount of sass in my life

[@garycoleman115]

To put it in a nutshell CORPORATIONS MAKE EDGY ANTY HEROS BECAUSE IT TAKES MINIMAL EFFORT AND THEIR EASLY MARKETABLE AND EASLY BECOME FAN FAVORITES BECAUSE FANS CAN “ IDENTIFY WITH THEIR NO CARE ATTITUDE”

[@a_naotenhonome780]

Kids always like edgy things

[@mekingtiger9095]

@@a_naotenhonome780 Ah, olá pt/br randômico.

[@megaalex6720]

Well my anti hero wasn't easy nor minimal effort to make, it took quite sometime to fully create a good enough character to have redemption and reasoning.

[@mekingtiger9095]

@@megaalex6720 One (kinda obvious though) hint to make a good "edgy" anithero is to make them go through a lot of shit to justify their broken personality. The most obvious example of this is Guts. But of course, give them a human side too.cDon't make your entihero edgy for the sake of being edgy like Shadow.

[@TupocalypseShakur]

Corporations won't lean to far into the character's negative aspects because they still want to make them marketable

[@grinnylein]

Anti-hero is just the name most mal Mary-Sues have... I'm pretty sure they tick of every box if you take any gender specific things out. -Dark mysterious past -good looks, despite some unusual optical features (scars ect.) -for unknown reasons everybody likes them -they are just the best -they bend the reality around them to make sure they end up on top -get the love interest even Did I forget anything?

[@roberthasudungan1546]

Do your research before typing bullshit.

[@Draber2b]

That's exaggerated/flawed but valid criticism. Do your's as well.

[@jeskler]

Who else would like an anti-hero like that, but he’s self aware and questions why everything is going his way, then goes insane cause of it

[@phulai4250]

You were described Mary sue not anti hero.

[@AstroLizard]

For anyone looking to study a great antihero, personally I would recommend Mr. White from Breaking Bad. One of the best examples from a TV series, in my opinion.

[@leephillips4402]

Isn't he more of an antagonist in a story with no protagonists

[@husseinbabakrt218]

Closest thing to a protagonist is Jessie.

[@leephillips4402]

Hussein Babakrt he's just slightly more anti-villain

[@leephillips4402]

Maybe he should do a video on anti villains

[@Cernunnnos]

He's not an anti hero. The story is the birth of a viallain with a minor act of last act redemption.

[@xomanowar3988]

You should do a collab with Overlysarcastic productions

[@paxonite-7bd5]

starnova42 but can he keep up with red?

[@oof-rr5nf]

starnova42 Oh my LORD. Yes. Best idea ever.

[@TheMamaluigi300]

sagar chowdhary Yes. But can she keep up with him?

[@TheMojaveLamp]

The sarcasm of such a collab would create sarcasm so thick and dense, it would cause a singularity

[@Fluffkitscripts]

To quote emperor Palpatine: Do it!

[@theunreadyone]

Everyone knows that in fiction there are absolutely no consequences to smoking

[@logopolizer7602]

Unless you're in the original Metal Gear, where it kills you.

[@johntumahab323]

If it makes you feel any better, I did write a story once where a character who was a chain smoker eventually died of lung cancer.

[@TupocalypseShakur]

Reminds of the fact that most Marvel characters who smoked were people who wouldn't die from it (Mr Fantastic, The Thing, Nick Fury Sr, The Hulk and Wolverine) with the few exceptions being Mary Jane and JJJ

[@pastlingsmiley]

​@@logopolizer7602 or if you're in Madness Combat

[@Batkenpre]

Unless you're the question

[@grimmonarch521]

Don't forget to give your anti-hero a badass name or moniker that highlights how badass he is. Like Guts, or shadow.

[@ichide7]

Guts is just a name adaptation, he's called Gatsu in his original portray.

[@PrekiFromPoland]

Or Snake.

[@Justsomegutswithamustache]

Blaster Magician guts is confirmed canon

[@randysavage2585]

Grim Monarch Hey, lay off on Berserk.

[@LondonLock]

Blaster Magican Gatsu is a common Japanese mispronunciation of guts the mangaka confirmed it to be guts himself

[@dylanwight5764]

A few years ago, before I'd ever heard of Breaking Bad (because really, the story of my anti-hero is quite similar), I decided that for a friend's super-serious DMing experience, I wanted to throw a curveball into his campaign by roleplaying as a kind-hearted alchemist trying to make enough to support himself and his daughter after his wife died in a goblin raid on his village. To do so, he turned to producing illegal substances on the side without regrets. After all, it was well within his skillset and there was an established market for it in our DM's intricately crafted world. He was most definitely the anti-hero of the group, and I was always attempting to derail the party from their mission to either look at some interesting plants or strike up trade arrangements with the bandits we were supposed to be taking care of. Things came to a head when my dude established a goblin slave market in the capital as a way of getting back at the feral creatures that had slaughtered his wife years earlier. This didn't go down well with the rest of the party, and my alchemist found himself left behind one night while the rest of the party went out to complete their mission as ordered. When they returned months later, my alchemist had managed to climb to the top of the criminal underground and had begun to create a drug empire, all within the full knowledge of the city guard whom he had in his pocket with the profits from his venture. To compound the issue and to piss off the party even more, he was also getting into the clinical business to treat the addictions his own substances were causing. Eventually, he nominated a successor to his empire and dedicated the remainder of his days to helping the victims of his own ambitious criminal establishment from his clinic, content in the knowledge that he'd seen to his daughter's well-being. And that's my anti-hero. A kind old man who put his talents to use in the best way he knew how, unshackled by common morality, in order to both provide for his daughter and to see his wife's killers brought to harsh justice. Anti-heroes aren't always who you expect them to be. Sometimes they can be the kind old man who runs the corner store, secretly operating a criminal empire to support a noble cause. Sometimes they can be the captain of the watch, corrupted by personal greed but stuck with an undying romantic notion of honour that saw them begin their career in the first place. But all anti-heroes share one common trait: A willingness to forgo common morality in order to achieve their goals. They don't need to be brooding or enigmatic, but they *must* be pragmatists who will seriously consider all available options without the restraint of society's often arbitrary moral stance.

[@gabrielpadro5589]

That was pretty cool. I agree that anti-heroes are far more flexible than many people think and that we need more varieties of anti-heroes than just the "Brooding, black wearing badass with a tragic pass" archetype.

[@dylanwight5764]

Personally, I feel that the greatest anti-heroes are the type you can't help but want to be around; the charismatic bastards who, despite you knowing that they lead a life that brings gleeful ruination onto those worse than them, are genuinely cheerful and funny characters. Those are the anti-heroes that need more of the limelight.

[@MidlifeCrisisJoe]

Hmmm. Yeah, the problem is that "anti-hero" and "byronic hero" are usually used interchangably and they're really actually fairly distinct and need not appear in the same character whatsoever. The marks of the Byronic hero are the brooding and the cynicism with maybe a heart of gold under it all. The anti-hero is not necessarily any of that, just a type of hero who tends to reject heroic notions and motivations. A good example that the video gets wrong here is Batman. Batman is very much a byronic hero. He's not really an anti-hero. He definitely has heroic motivations, he's just super brooding about it. Like, pretty much ALL Westerns are about anti-heroes because the protagonists are usually in it for pretty selfish reasons. Whether it's just getting a payday on a bounty or finding the buried gold or personal revenge, they're after the villain (or not even after them, just competing with them or confronted by them) not for the sake of a heroic notion like saving the village or because it's about justice being done. If those things happen to occur at the same time, then fine, whatever. No skin off their back. They just wanted the money or that guy wronged them in the past so they needed to die. But Walter White wasn't really an anti-hero. More a Villain Protagonist. He goes well beyond the moral event horizons that separate the two and kicks many dogs and cats and kids to let us know that he is not only just morally flexible, but morally irredeemable by the end of Breaking Bad. This video also confuses "Anti-hero" with "Lancer" which is also a kind of different archetype in its own right though there is often a lot of overlap. Technically, a lancer (which is the archetype of the guy who is usually the second in command/prominance on a team story, like, if Superman is the leader of the Justice League, the Lancer is Batman on that team, or Wolverine is the Lancer to Cyclops on the X-Men) is just the second in command who has flaws that contrast with the team leader that make them not fit to lead the team even if they constantly talk shit about how they'd be the better leader or have a better idea of how to resolve situations (Wolverine did this CONSTANTLY in X-Men). This tends to fit Anti-heroes well, which is why it's done a lot. But there are Anti-Heroes (like, say Conan the Barbarian) who become fine leaders and have their own lancers, and lancers who aren't anti-heroes at all really (like, oh, say Wheeler on Captain Planet or whoever is second fiddle and in conflict with Cap on the Avengers at any given time - usually Hawkeye or Iron Man).

[@dylanwight5764]

Great point about Walter White. While he begins with a respectable goal (pay his way through his therapy) with a morally flexible method (use his skills to produce contraband and sell it for more than a few pennies), he slides into the role of a villain protagonist and the audience sees this downfall yet still roots for him despite being repulsed by his actions.

[@Stynkrat]

I had an idea for an anti-hero where he suffers from Emotional Detachment Disorder, so he’s quiet, dark, and brooding because he is mentally unable to be anything but.

[@FreshZCORD]

Interesting

[@skullcrusade3436]

I see morbidly crude drawing of Guts, I click faster than the speed of photons

[@JustSomeDinosaurPerson]

I ended up preferring anti-heroes as I became adult largely because of how much more relatable they are, especially when you break out of the sheltered [but coveted] view of childhood innocence. The world is a fucked up place and the anti-heroes are generally the ones to explore that more than the heroes. Or, if the heroes do, it hardly ever seems to affect their unwavering judgement and they become less something to aspire to and more something to be perplexed about or irritated by.

[@gfilmer7150]

Agreed, I'm writing a series where the main character is a vigilante anti-hero and guess what, I have him surrounded with people. When he's in a bar, he's hanging out with friends (old friends from his time in the Special Forces). When he's on a mission (taking on organized crime), he's sometimes working with people so he has someone to either coordinate him or watch his back. Just because he's morally grey, doesn't mean he's a total loner.

[@Manglet762]

You make a good point, but your name is REALLY not helping you.

[@DonVigaDeFierro]

Nah. Optimism is a more difficult choice. Cynicism is an easy escape for the weak: The weak take refuge in cynicism, because if the world is a horrible shitty place, they are allowed to be horrible shitty people, right? And cynicism sanctions their greed, dishonesty, entitlement... Is merely an excuse to not be held to the same standards as heroes with pure morals. "I can't be Superman because I didn't grow up in a comic book! This is the real world! You can't judge me or what I do!" Because when they see a true hero with pure morals, they don't see an ideal to aspire to, but a standard they fall short of. People have really missed the point on what a "hero" is supposed to be and represent.

[@ButterflyScarlet]

@@DonVigaDeFierro This exactly. It's fine for people to like anti-heroes, there is something appealing about someone willing to shatter the bureaucracy and get shit done. However people act as though being a cynical asshole who is cruel to others because the world hurt them is something to aspire to. Being kind is not perplexing, being optimistic is not childish, and being helpful is not naive. A sad upbringing is not an excuse to be an asshole, and I think too many writers and readers conveniently forget that in favour of acting as though being a cynical pessimist is something to aspire to. Antiheroes are first and foremost very unhappy people, but they do good things. They aren't always good people, but they try to make the world around them a little better. They aren't just cynical for the sake of being cool and edgy.

[@ChaosRayZero]

@@ButterflyScarlet "They aren't just cynical for the sake of being cool and edgy." *Or at least the **_interesting, well-written ones_** aren't.*

[@yehuda8589]

Neku from The World Ends with You is one of my favorite anti-heroes, mainly because no one really likes him specifically BECAUSE of how obnoxiously standoffish and just plain edgy he is. It also helps that Neku doesn't have any tragic backstory or anything like that, he's just a very realistic portrayal of an edgy teenager who think's that he's smarter and more enlightened than everyone else and that other people are just simple-minded sheep.

[@sodaftpm185]

Neku is legit a compelling anti-hero. I also like how he isn't a try hard unlike Shadow the Hedgehog or Akame. He's just kinda a little shit.

[@applesandgrapesfordinner4626]

Dear God! I know a teenage coworker at work who is literally like this

[@yoshisarethebomb]

I like how he changes And that one time where **SPOILERS** He perceives one of the characters as simple minded, but when he finds out it’s actually his favorite artist Cat, it starts a development

[@Jcecil1035]

This perfectly describes the punisher when being written incorrectly

[@brodiecrain13]

Remember that christmas comic where goes out his way to be a dick to a bunch of orphans after killing their sole benefactor right in front of them all because he was a former mobster? Seriously wtf!

[@draconianwarking]

Brodie Crain and that time he literally became a Frankenstein monster

[@Carewolf]

The punisher is POV villian

[@GigaChadh976]

Or that time he was in archie

[@imbreadth11r5]

Remember how Joss Whedon portrayed him in Runaways?

[@Dunmerdog]

An antihero that I find to be entirely overlooked outside of the fandom to which he belongs is Amos Burton from the Leviathan Wakes series/The Expanse. He’s such a brilliantly characterised character for whom people can’t help but feel sympathy anf affection despite his emotionless, violent, and blunt approaches to things.

[@alexpierce9319]

Now that you've done the all muscle no personality type, how about you do the all brains no personality type. I think it's more common in eastern media but the "keikaku" type that is just overwhelmingly more intelligent then everyone around him.

[@filipferencak2717]

cough *Death Note* cough

[@joseagustincuesta]

You mean like a Byronic Hero? Someone like Lelouch?

[@miguelpereira9859]

The generic tech wizard guy.

[@TheMamaluigi300]

Alex Pierce T E C H N O B A B B L E

[@Tyler-Kearney]

Why not have both, like Kirito. He's better than anyone else in the game without ever joining a guild, apparently is physically strong enough after effectively having been in a coma for 2 years to overpower Sughou without having had much time to fully recover, was able to use his mad hacking skills to save Yui despite being a teenager and having no knowledge of the source code, and I could go on.

[@MrAlepedroza]

5:25 Haha, the only thing that dialogue globe missed was a "cuz you're my friend...DATTEBAYO". You nailed it.

[@benbotka8010]

GRIIIIIFFIIITH

[@Weeaboololislayer]

Did nothing wrong

[@d_wang9836]

Ben Botka Looks like a girl

[@druffner]

Ben Botka guts get characterized it's ok

[@miguelrueda1291]

Griffith did noting wrong

[@mason8467]

Ben Botka ha! But for real...f*ck Griffith

[@Noras_Ark]

“I love how you just sit in the corner and Brood™️”

[@SegaChamber]

It's kind of ironic that your anti-hero representation looks like Guts from berserk....an anti-hero that's pretty much the opposite of generic

[@CCLOSPINA]

In fact Guts can be considered an example of "tropes are not bad". Guts can be considered a "cliche" antihero, but he is very well written.

[@DxBlackDevilxD]

found the 13-year old. You know you could have told your opinion without being a dick about it. Even the dude, who made this video wrote, that berserk is one of his favourite storys. Eventhough your arguments are remarkably well written i gotta disagree with you on that one.

[@kyodarkness9243]

To be honest, I think Guts is the original anti-hero

[@venor2612]

@@Locksley108 nu

[@sokkvabekkr5973]

@@Locksley108 have you ever looked at a single page of the manga

[@GoingSwimmingly]

That moment when I realized that my writing is wonderful just because everyone gets a personality.

[@benayakeenanhutagalung9798]

Publish

[@FionaA17]

Yup

[@GoingSwimmingly]

*I’m too much of a perfectionist but I’ll give it a try.*

[@lau_taro0037]

It's been three years post the damn link

[@GoingSwimmingly]

@@lau_taro0037 Sir I appreciate your dedication but unfortunately I gave up about a year ago-

[@blamblam7578]

Lol your channel has grown a lot since a few months ago. Great job!

[@a.dennis4835]

I noticed a common problem with antiheroes is that the writer think that the reader will automatically root for the antihero if the antagonist is worse. This usually just results in a story where you can't root anyone.

[@wunclerlaufenbumcorneliusu7047]

Make sure your anti hero has some hobby or secret quality that is juxtaposing to their overall character.

[@redkingrauri3769]

Wuncler Laufenbum Cornelius Ulysses Albrecht LVX He's a loner. He's a mercenary. He's out for revenge and he will cut down anyone who gets in his way. He also knits. He's quite good at knitting.

[@Deity1]

VauschthePuca Lol, that Demolition Man reference, you almost can't take Stallone's character seriously after that.

[@redkingrauri3769]

If that was a reference, that was completely unintentional. I've never seen Demolition Man.

[@sodaftpm185]

So out of character bullshit?

[@bitingbison9793]

I'm still waiting for the cyberpunk technological future type video so I can say I never asked for this. But seriously, all of these videos are great.

[@hakuyowane4505]

Biting Bison Your wish has been granted!

[@bitingbison9793]

Ivypool of ThunderClan Yes!

[@ng-lr4nl]

Is that Guts in the thumbnail?

[@Gamefreak2998]

Neil Gallardo no, but resembles him slightly

[@Fluffkitscripts]

By the dictionary definition, spider-man is an antihero. Or, he was. See, at the time, the standard for “hero” was the hypermasculine superman, and other super-confident brightly clothed bodybuilders. (No subtext here, folks!). Spider-man, being a nerdy young adult with confidence issues was a lot more subversive than it seems today. He may in fact be credited with the importance secret identities hold in comic books today, and the much-improved character establishment, development and inner struggle also present in modern comics.

[@mekingtiger9095]

The problem with "antiheroes" is that, much like DnD morality charts, its definition is too spread out and subjective.

[@Fluffkitscripts]

@Gaming Miser I suppose I didn’t define the original hero archetype well enough. The gold-age comic hero was definitely more Superman than batman. They didn’t struggle with morality, they had no trouble balancing their double lives, they rarely ever had to deal with day-to-day issues like poverty, school or bullying, and they mostly existed to punch whatever hot-button issue the creator thought needed punching. They were more paragons than they were characters. It’s also important to establish that what we associate with “hero” changes over time. Got that? Good. Spider-man was a serious departure from hero tropes of the time, and as such was considered an anti-hero. Nowadays his secret identity struggles are practically the template for comic heroism, but that wasn’t always the case.

[@Fluffkitscripts]

@Gaming Miser antihero =\= not hero. Did you watch the video? You might want to watch the video.

[@Fluffkitscripts]

@Gaming Miser why are you still hung up on the muscle thing? Did you not read any of my other points? And I referenced the video because I thought she made it clear that it’s less about the textbook definition of hero and more about the qualities any given time or place associated with “normal protagonist”. Your observational skills are highly questionable.

[@Fluffkitscripts]

@Gaming Miser OHHH sorry, this is the wrong comment section. For a more informative take I suggest you try overly sarcastic productions’ video. Protagonists follow trends over time like anything else. I’d argue that an antihero isn’t someone who lacks heroic qualities, but who lacks the qualities we ASSOCIATE with heroism. Wolverine’s pretty squarely considered anti-heroic, but he shares the core motives of his fellow x-men and will almost invariably stand up for what he believes is right. The mandalorian is a pretty anti-heroic figure, but he’s shown a drive to care for the child and for others throughout his adventures. It’s not about lacking the qualities that make a hero, it’s about expressing them differently. I think TWA made it clear that an anti-hero isn’t just “protagonist who isn’t a hero”. Anyone can be that. That’s not an anti-hero, that’s just someone who isn’t a hero. It’s about the qualities we ASSOCIATE with heroes. Wolverine falls into the category because he’s gruff, antisocial, not generally an inspiring figure, and has no qualms about violence or killing- all things that didn’t show up in your average x-men era hero, but became rather commonplace in later eras- see the 90s, when everything was named blood. This style change made wolverine that much less of a contradictory figure. Bearing in mind that antiheroes rely on the trappings of their era to distinguish them, and those trappings change with time, I hope you can see where I’m going. Anyway, let me spell it out as clearly as I possibly can. These are the points I am making, if you miss or misinterpret important info one more time I will lose my mind. 1. I believe the dictionary definition does not adequately represent what we as a public do and don’t refer to as antiheroes. 2. Antihero as we colloquially use it seems to be defined by how something compares to the trappings of heroism while still maintaining certain integral qualities that define heroism. 3. These trappings, not being central to the definition of a hero, change over time as society’s heroes change for different eras. 4. Since antiheroism is defined in opposition to these trappings, it too changes over time.

[@thewhitewolf58]

Reminds me of those loose cannon police that act like ill tempered childern and have fits whenever you try to tell them they arent god and that there are rules to follow

[@DavidLLambertmobile]

This is why I dislike Lee Child's Jack Reacher character. I served in the US Army MPs 👮🏻‍♂️, 4yr enlisted. A Reacher type would be cut or RIFed in the 1990s. The US Army has the CIDC or 🕵🏼‍♂️ but they are mostly Sgts, Warrant Officers & a few commissioned officers who are NOT bitter, angry, conflicted. Most want to get promoted or be E-9s, Cols.

[@scottmantooth8785]

you mean like the anime Mad Bull 34?

[@brianaguilar8283]

What are you? A BLM activist?

[@firetarrasque4667]

@@brianaguilar8283 Mate, cops follow a pretty strict hierarchy. Like, all criticisms of the police aside, the rules are not lax, and you cannae just go around shooting people.

[@brianaguilar8283]

Fire Tarrasque tell that to the gangs that commit crimes in their own communities

[@intergalactichumanempire9759]

This book is awful. There's barley any connection between chapters and it's all just insulting other books. 1/10.

[@blueflare7687]

Intergalactic Human Empire ... I'm gonna choose to think this is a joke.

[@d_wang9836]

KING FREAKING CRIMSON. Why the fuck are you here?

[@CompletelyNewguy]

It is, notice in the beginning of the video it says: Chapter 18?

[@blueflare7687]

[Yoshikage_Kira] I'm everywhere.

[@d_wang9836]

KING FREAKING CRIMSON. Same brotha

[@Effluvial_Grime]

Guts is one of my favorite anti heroes, nothing like a loud CLANG to get your point across.

[@elainetaylor-lewis5417]

What about Kanji Tatsumi from Persona 4? He could have easily been an generic angsty, edgy, angry teen, but he actually has depth to him, and is into cute feminine hobbies that leads him to get bullied by teen girls, hence having trust issues at first, but later on in the game sees the main character as his best friend, and even a hero 😭 He is one of my favorite characters not only in videogames, but in any media. They also do a lot of funny scenes with Kanji, and are not afraid to poke fun at him 😂 but he still is tough and shouldn't be messed with when there are serious scenes. Guts is a close second. He has a lot of depth, and goes through hell throughout his life, but he also keeps going, and is able to fall in love, have friends etc Heck, I am warming up to Cloud Strife as a character. The bond he has with Aerith and Tifa is just.... amazing ❤ I wish all the other generic edgy characters had humanity to them, and are not just boring, miserable, hateful and grouchy all the time, because it "looks cool". Like would it hurt them to enjoy life once in a while, have a laugh, a giggle? Have a hobby? An interest? An interesting personality outside of all the angst and gloom? Shadow, Sasuke, Levi, etc I am looking at you.

[@sasproject9519]

I am glad Kanji Tatsumi is brought up! He is one of my favorite characters too! The poor guy gets teased for being gay, or seen as a weirdo or a creep by girls 😭 all because he is into sewing. Talk about double standards. I do agree that Kanji's character is more three dimentional than any poorly written generic edgy character combined. Underneath the tough and 'manly' attitude, he is just so cute and adorable 😂 and also really funny 😂

[@futurestoryteller]

Hah! This is my new favorite. I was talking to someone about how "anti-hero" doesn't mean "badass rogue" just the other day. I realized after watching your video that the quintessential "bad" incarnation of the anti-hero is Jack Bauer, and the best possible good version might be Zuko from Airbender!

[@dreamingblue3939]

I was also thinking about Zuko. Probably my favorite anti-hero in fiction tbh.

[@sodaftpm185]

@@dreamingblue3939 Guts from Beserk exists...

[@dreamingblue3939]

@@sodaftpm185 I haven't seen Berserk. I've been wanting to check it out though, so thanks for the reminder

[@biggiecheese726]

Oddly enough, one of my favorite Anti-heros is Boone from New Vegas. Brooding, badass, and relatable

[@KestrelDC]

I love anti heroes. When done well, they can be super interesting. But it can be really annoying when it’s done poorly. This would probably be my favorite of your videos so far.

[@papajhonsreal]

0:15 I cry with joy whenever I see someone make that reference. Seriously, The Critic was cancelled FAR too soon.