Apex Predators: AIP Submarines Explained by Covert Shores (Air Independent Propulsion)

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H I Sutton

H I Sutton

Күн бұрын

Пікірлер: 396
@suspiciousperson5324
@suspiciousperson5324 3 жыл бұрын
Your 'free' style of speaking is more akin to a uni lecture and a very easy on the ears.
@scottstewart5784
@scottstewart5784 3 жыл бұрын
If you didn't mention the lack of a script, we wouldn't have even thought about it. Plus, you know so much about the subjects, your organic presentation is, for me anyway, easier to process because it's conversational.
@Wolvieonepunch
@Wolvieonepunch 9 ай бұрын
speak for your self
@ralphfeatherstone7813
@ralphfeatherstone7813 3 жыл бұрын
It is wonderful to have a factual source of information from a recognized authority on the subject of underwater technology. Thank you. Please keep up the great work.
@kelinrkp
@kelinrkp 3 жыл бұрын
Would be even better if we were told what AIP is, not what the letters stand for, but what it is.
@Tomartyr
@Tomartyr 3 жыл бұрын
​@@kelinrkp Wikipedia describes several types of AIP but is fairly bare of references, which makes sense as I'd expect everybody to be keeping their own special blend a secret.
@Brettmlyons
@Brettmlyons 3 жыл бұрын
I feel exactly the same way. A true educator.
@rushymoto
@rushymoto 3 жыл бұрын
@@kelinrkp Clue is in the name. It is propulsion and power without surface air and also not being nuclear powered as that would render it obsolete. And given that the batteries dont last as long as one would like without recharging, that would need surface air.
@maquettemusic1623
@maquettemusic1623 3 жыл бұрын
@@kelinrkp Did you just not watch the video. 6:28
@bryantcurtis2665
@bryantcurtis2665 2 жыл бұрын
My father, Jesse J. Bryant, chief electrician, submarines Atlantic 1946-67(U.S.S. Skipjack etc.) would have liked this channel.
@philsalvatore3902
@philsalvatore3902 Жыл бұрын
Not mentioned are radioisotope power systems. The General Purpose Heat Source module, or GPHS, is the essential building block for the radioisotope generators used by NASA. These modules contain and protect the plutonium-238 (or Pu-238) fuel that gives off heat for producing electricity. The fuel is fabricated into ceramic pellets of plutonium-238 oxide (238PuO2) and encapsulated in a protective casing of iridium, forming a fueled clad. Fueled clads are encased within nested layers of carbon-based material and placed within an aeroshell housing to comprise the complete GPHS module. There are proposals out there to use these as an AIP power source. The GPHS modules would have to be carried outside of the pressure hull where seawater becomes their radiation shield just as seawater was used to shield the reactor on the NR-1 nuclear mini-sub.
3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the comprehensive presentation
@DOUGLAS55ish
@DOUGLAS55ish 3 жыл бұрын
When I was on the USS PUFFER SSN 652, we sank the USS KITTY HAWK CV 63 three times during exercises in 1975.
@grahamstrouse1165
@grahamstrouse1165 Жыл бұрын
There are submarines…and there are targets.
@6507bankston
@6507bankston 3 жыл бұрын
I liked the expertise, the calm lack of hype, especially there was no anxious sound track music
@theeddorian
@theeddorian 3 жыл бұрын
The original "AIP" submarine was the Ictineo II built by a Spanish engineer around the time of the American Civil War. The Ictineo's power system was based on s chemical process that produced oxygen as a by-product providing air for the crew as well. The vessel was also the first double hull dsesign, amazingly built of wood, and capable of powered operation to a depth 90 feet.
@Thadude701
@Thadude701 3 жыл бұрын
I do not remember that sub in submarine school,but there it is.
@theeddorian
@theeddorian 3 жыл бұрын
@@Thadude701 When I first read about the Ictineo II I came to suspect that Jules Verne might have modeled his _Nautilus_ on it. The Ictineo II actually had two propulsion systems - one, air breathing for the surface and a chemical, oxygen emitting power system for submerged activity.
@hypervious8878
@hypervious8878 2 жыл бұрын
Wow
@stupitdog9686
@stupitdog9686 2 жыл бұрын
I think there is a copy of it on shore near the cruise ship harbour in Barcalonia. Can't believe it's not more important!
@udp1073
@udp1073 3 жыл бұрын
I took part in the construction of the first two U212 for the Italian Navy (classe Todaro).. according to what peeps told me those subs are virtually impossible to find when running on fuel cell, they did some testing and they found out they are quieter than nuclear powered subs.. sure, they are smaller and the amount of machinery is reduced, with amount in total noise reduction.. but they really are confident to be able to do their business and sneak away uncaught... thanks for the amazing video
@wolf310ii
@wolf310ii 3 жыл бұрын
It not really hard to be quieter than a nuclear sub, a nuclear sub can switch from steam turbine to e-motor, but it cant just turn of the reactor. A U-boat like the Typ 212 can shut off everything
@elijahrobinson2362
@elijahrobinson2362 Жыл бұрын
Battery power has no reactor or pump noise for the cooling circuit. A modern diesel boat is quieter, mechanically speaking, than a nuclear powered vessel…but the type of hull and coating may be noisier for a diesel boat.
@teeanahera8949
@teeanahera8949 Жыл бұрын
@@wolf310iiI think you mean turn *off not turn of.
@grahamstrouse1165
@grahamstrouse1165 Жыл бұрын
AIP subs are the kings of the shallows. You don’t want to mess with them in them in the littorals.
@TheESS1
@TheESS1 2 жыл бұрын
H I Sutton is a true legend. Like all your content.
@Veldtian1
@Veldtian1 3 жыл бұрын
That jolly gentleman from The Sub Brief sent me, great work Mr Sutton.
@neues3691
@neues3691 3 жыл бұрын
The German Type212A traversed from Germany to Spain submerged for 14 days straight without surfacing or snorkeling. Given what you said about the need to ventilate the boat, I wonder whether that was just clever wording (as in we didn't snorkel to recharge the batteries) or whether they have a work around.
@davidmurphy8190
@davidmurphy8190 3 жыл бұрын
I can see why the Walter turbine powered submarines appeared to be such a radical leap forward for submarines.
@sergarlantyrell7847
@sergarlantyrell7847 3 жыл бұрын
They could burn oxygen candles to extend their duration, though it's not exactly a permanent solution. There are only 27 people on board a Type 212 sub too, so there aren't that many to use up the oxygen.
@paladin0654
@paladin0654 3 жыл бұрын
212As carry LOX.
@SA-xf1eb
@SA-xf1eb 3 жыл бұрын
LOX and CO2 scrubbers.
@RealOlawo
@RealOlawo 3 жыл бұрын
the 212 doesn't need to ventilate. It has CO2 cleaner and the refresh the air with oxigen from the fuel cell system.
@davidatticus5179
@davidatticus5179 3 жыл бұрын
I really like the ‘unscripted’ nature of your presentations because you retain a fact-filled, cogent, and coherent narrative that does not wander aimlessly and yet retains a conversational tone, very listenable and easily ‘digested’. Please do not slick the channel up with scripting. Its not needed. Your graphics and cutaways are great, and are the only ‘icing’ this rewarding cake of a channel needed to be a satisfying treat at every offering. Bravo sir, well done! I have learned a lot here and it has kindled a renewed interest in a subject i thought i had learned enough about. I am happy to to say that i was mistaken! 👍🏼
@Corsair8X
@Corsair8X 3 жыл бұрын
I want to echo Joel’s comments. Thought I knew a fair amount and realize how little I knew. That was very informative.
@cmonkey63
@cmonkey63 3 жыл бұрын
A lot of good information here, calmly presented. I'm a submarine nerd, so there. A tip for recording audio, for recording training videos I use a mid-range gaming headset with a boom mic. Not too expensive, and it eliminates the room echo which helps people who have English as a second language. Looking forward to more videos!
@ElevendyWOT
@ElevendyWOT 3 жыл бұрын
Your cut-aways are beautiful by the way. Thank you for adding them in your talks.
@joeljacobchandy3838
@joeljacobchandy3838 3 жыл бұрын
Knew about AIP but never really understood it till I saw this video so thanks Mr Sutton looking forward to more both on ur website and this channel
@peterblake4837
@peterblake4837 Жыл бұрын
It's Dr Sutton
@allborn6782
@allborn6782 3 жыл бұрын
Finally somebody who can explain a topic ... Thank you we are NoT engineers... Thank you again
@haroldb1856
@haroldb1856 3 жыл бұрын
In the late 80s, I read about research into Stirling engines for powering submarines. It took a while, but it's fun to see it finally taking off.
@Veltronamus
@Veltronamus 2 жыл бұрын
When one is as knowledgeable and passionate about their content, such as yourself. Writing a script would take away from your enthusiasm and passion, explaining things you love! Thank you for sharing your passion with us!!
@sailor5026
@sailor5026 3 жыл бұрын
Very good. Very organized. Concise. Comprehensive. Thank you.
@Mute_Nostril_Agony
@Mute_Nostril_Agony 3 жыл бұрын
Love this content! Keep it coming. Great to have good content like this from such a knowledgeable source. Seen lots of reports on your stuff from Sub Brief. I never knew about the hydrogen peroxide step and the energy density of lithium batteries
@southwestnomad7495
@southwestnomad7495 3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for making this. A suggestion: Please move the mic closer to your mouth, as when it is not close, the room acoustics quickly muddy your voice, and it becomes necessary for some of us to turn on subtitles. Thanks again.
@chriscunnane1512
@chriscunnane1512 3 жыл бұрын
Your videos are like a great movie: I need to see them a few times and then I'm rewinding to catch what I missed the first time. The fact that You're "winging it" is remarkable. Thanks
@alanfenick1103
@alanfenick1103 3 жыл бұрын
Thank you for explaining AIP pros and cons in an understandable manner!
@YouTubeareCunts
@YouTubeareCunts 7 ай бұрын
It's refreshing to have a real person do it & not cold, & often things are said wrong AI .. Thumbs up from me..
@aditj
@aditj 3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the explanation on how the modern AIP is used! It makes a lot more sense now.
@leosam7097
@leosam7097 3 жыл бұрын
Greece actually build 3 AIP subs (Type 214) with german AIP like others and troubleshoot and modify/repaired the first one of the class build in kiel. (it had ballast balance problems because of an inadequate pumps) also retrofitted a 209 with the german AIP. (Skaramanga Shipyard at athens) As far as i currently know the shipyard at skaramanga, athens still has the capability for building/service/repair/modify them (209s,212s,214s) but not the management, clients or funds.
@Raj-nh3fc
@Raj-nh3fc 3 ай бұрын
Your depiction of Stirling AIP in Gotland or Halland class is very accurate. It is very close to the door as you enter and is a rather boxy cuboard/ small wardrobe sized thingy in rows. I actually asked the sailor what is inside these, hoping that he would say clothes or food but he said "stirling engine" to my total surprise because for us lay men engine means pipes, bulky metal contraption with cooling and a fuel tank and certainly not a cupboard with doors, all neat and clean. Unfortunately he did not open the cupboard to show me the engine inside. On Navy day in Sweden they do have these u boats and other naval vessels and even the construction hangars or whatever they are called on display. Worth visiting and surprising, that they are so open about them.
@beefgoat80
@beefgoat80 3 жыл бұрын
I dig your videos. They're informative and not over the top. Really works for me.
@tamasmihaly1
@tamasmihaly1 3 жыл бұрын
You are a very good speaker and educator, Mr Sutton. Thank you.
@RealOlawo
@RealOlawo 3 жыл бұрын
It is exactly the other way round. The AIP system is not used to power the motor directly. In case of the fuel cell system you need to power the batteri. Specialy because the output of the fuell cell can not be changed. You need to run it on the same output to have full efficency. So you couldn't adjust the power output to the demand of the motor. That is why you use the battteri as a buffer.
@stefanratkiewicz
@stefanratkiewicz 3 жыл бұрын
This is Good Stuff . The Jive Turkey brought me here . Hope you don't mind.
@kimkeam2094
@kimkeam2094 3 жыл бұрын
Very impressive! I had no real concept how AIP worked. I really appreciate the information. Thanks
@dennisfox8673
@dennisfox8673 3 жыл бұрын
I’ve watched one video of yours and have subscribed, this was a very good presentation. Speaking as someone who does a fair amount of public speaking, I like your “semi-scripted” approach. Granted it’s how I usually do it, so perhaps I am not fully impartial! Whenever speaking on a topic that you have a solid command of (like you do here) making an outline to organize, and if necessary remind you of your key points, helps keep a relaxed and conversational tone. For instance, I was very engaged the entire and the video felt much shorter than 23 minutes. Of course, everyone is different, and if you would feel more comfortable scripting it all out, I’d say go for it. Cheers!
@rath6599
@rath6599 3 жыл бұрын
Hello Mr Sutton, please do keep them coming. There's definitely an audience for this!
@johnh8615
@johnh8615 3 жыл бұрын
The best style and content version of any military hardware videos on utube. Wish we had more of this . Keep it up I’m so sure you will be top of your group.
@willemkaret1568
@willemkaret1568 9 ай бұрын
Very clear explanations and still relevant in 2024. Thank you for this presentation.
@edjoecdn
@edjoecdn 3 жыл бұрын
Very much enjoyed the video. Might I suggest some sound dampening on the walls / hard surfaces for that wee echo, and those page turns. Everything else was perfect! Great presentation.
@danko6582
@danko6582 9 ай бұрын
Ms Paint?! You have to be the best Ms Paint artist I've seen.
@mrmabyr
@mrmabyr Жыл бұрын
Very good work sir! I think you are one of the very few wonk/geek influencers that doesn’t require a script. I’m so influenced I’m going to start using MS Paint and get my high end art career going!
@jobybhatt
@jobybhatt 3 жыл бұрын
Very nicely explained with accuracy.
@Iamthelolrus
@Iamthelolrus 3 жыл бұрын
Thank you for the video. I loved the narco sub vid as well. Any strange or lesser know sub or sub type would be my suggestion but I think I'll watch anything you make.
@philkipnis740
@philkipnis740 3 жыл бұрын
I love your expertise as well as how you present your material. I've learned a lot from you and your biggest fan, Aaron. Please, please keep up your videos, they are very informative
@pushkarranade
@pushkarranade 3 жыл бұрын
Very well narrated
@iantaylor230
@iantaylor230 3 жыл бұрын
Enjoyable and informative video. Thanks Mr Sutton.
@maxt9657
@maxt9657 3 жыл бұрын
Nice video, I love your website as well!
@ardeladimwit
@ardeladimwit 3 жыл бұрын
he's always interesting
@patrickchase5614
@patrickchase5614 3 жыл бұрын
This is the first public "AIP explainers" I've heard that accurately outlines the considerations around using AIP to charge batteries: It's an inefficient way to operate at low speed and therefore not often done, but may be necessary in a pinch if the batteries are depleted and the sub commander recognizes a need to go fast before they have an opportunity to snorkel again. So for example if a sub ran its batteries down while disengaging at high speed after an attack, but wanted to be able to reengage in the future (again at high speed) without first giving its position away by snorkeling, then it might make tactical sense to charge the batteries from AIP in the interim.
@berthamoen4488
@berthamoen4488 3 жыл бұрын
In its newest submarines Japan stopped using AIP because the modern batteries have a lot more endurance so AIP wasn't needed anymore.
@ancienthistorytube1921
@ancienthistorytube1921 2 жыл бұрын
Thank you for this video. Nicely done. One small correction on users: Turkey is a future, not current user. They'll put their 1st boat in the water probably in 2023 or 24. And some trivia: Greece operates 4xType214s and 1 upgraded 209 all with German fuel cells. The 209 was cut in half and the AIP compartment was added. Delivery of the 1st 214 was delayed four years as Greece, the 1st country to order the type, would not accept delivery. The 1st boat demonstrated problems during sea trials. Some of which concerned the AIP. By now all fixed and the type is doing well in export sales.
@donaldbarden6294
@donaldbarden6294 3 жыл бұрын
My dream was to be a submariner. However, I’m 6’5”. To tall. Went army. Still love the technology and like channels like this that clearly explain it.
@scottn7cy
@scottn7cy 3 жыл бұрын
I'm 6' 3". I bumped my head several times but I survived.
@DOUGLAS55ish
@DOUGLAS55ish 3 жыл бұрын
We had a 6' 8" Torpedo man on the USS PUFFER SSN 652. Naturally, his nick name was Tiny. You would have fit into a submarine with no problem.
@camiemengineer
@camiemengineer 3 жыл бұрын
Very good effort for a non-scripted effort. Also not rattling off ten to the dozen, (fast speech) is a very good and viewer-appreciated choice. You should consider monetising your videos if you want more exposure by KZbin. Just have one advert and KZbin might simply just match it. I think you qualify for monetisation with your viewers count. All the best and good luck .. again good video .. although needs more meat to fully satisfy Engineers!
@alcibiade7705
@alcibiade7705 3 жыл бұрын
Great video! Informative and well done.
@tylerjohn4607
@tylerjohn4607 3 жыл бұрын
I also thought I knew more! Thanks for all the info!
@006bloody
@006bloody 2 жыл бұрын
Great information, great graphics, easy to understand. Thank you sir
@jacklav1
@jacklav1 Жыл бұрын
Fantastic presentation. The stirling engine is an external heat engine, am I right in thinking that to make the heat, the diesel fuel is burned with oxygen from the lox tank and the resulting Co2 and other hydrocarbons are wasted out of the vessel?
@walterwalker8578
@walterwalker8578 4 ай бұрын
very concise and an excellent primer.
@stevecummins324
@stevecummins324 8 ай бұрын
There's a very old tech called a tromp. Originally used to generate compressed air for use in early blast furnaces... Column of water flowing down a vertical pipe at sufficent speed that water bubbles are pulled down the water column. As the bubbles descend they are compressed to the pressure of water at that depth. Somewhat akin to cavitation, but the bubbles don't collapse, only shrink.. If the pipe then goes horizontal, or into a separator tank, the air wants to rise to be at top of tank/pipe. I'm thinking a snorkel through which a mix of water and air bubbles was sucked down to a submerged sub, would work as an air compressor. The compressed air could be fed to an oxygen concentrator and then into compressed gas tanks.
@BrightBlueJim
@BrightBlueJim 3 жыл бұрын
Very nice presentation. I hope to see more about uncrewed submarines soon.
@kl0wnkiller912
@kl0wnkiller912 3 жыл бұрын
Just a bit of trivia I have read: The peroxide (Walther) power plants were really good but as you said they tended to explode when mixed with seawater. They also had issues with range as they use a lot of Peroxide and the Peroxide was rather corrosive and tended to eat through the tanks (return to the first sentence). The German Type 21 was the most advanced submarine in the world at the end of WW2 and was originally designed to run on Walther engines but the design was converted to diesel electric due to the delays in developing the Walther units. Even so, the Type 21 was so good that for years after the war, foreign powers were going around salvaging scuttled 21s and reconditioning them for use or evaluation. Most immediate post-war submarine designs were based on the Type 21 German design. Had it not been for the delays in developing the Walther units the Type 21 may have entered the war much earlier and that would have been really bad for the Allies. BTW: If China can steal the technology they you can bet they are 'working on it'.
@wolf310ii
@wolf310ii 3 жыл бұрын
It would had change almost nothing, they converted the plans for the Typ XVIII to the Typ XXI in less than 3 month and when they start to build the Typ XXI the both Typ XVIII prototyps wherer still not finish, so even without the delay, the serial constuction of the Typ XVIII would have started at around the same time the construction of the Typ XXI started. Also the peroxide should be stored in large rubber bags between the inner and outer hull, so corrosion of the tanks would be a problem.
@leoncioco3305
@leoncioco3305 3 жыл бұрын
Very interesting topic. Thanks.
@IBHunter
@IBHunter 2 жыл бұрын
About 20 years ago we started using small unmanned submarines for sea floor mapping these submarines neede to go much deeper than military submarines are capable of going. We used aluminum fuel cells with KOH and HP. This fuel cell did require a pressure housing because it ran at ambient pressure and temperature. As soon as lithium battery technology advanced enough to have a reasonable power density and safety factor, we switched from fuel cells. A huge factor in the power density was the fact that these lithium batteries did not require a pressure housing either. They also functioned at the near freezing temperatures 4.5Km below the ocean.
@Nathan-ng1jt
@Nathan-ng1jt 3 жыл бұрын
Sub Brief brought me here. Thank you for the fascinating content.
@mikehoshall6150
@mikehoshall6150 3 жыл бұрын
Great info, I really enjoy your coverage of the material
@kptlt.phillipthomsen5973
@kptlt.phillipthomsen5973 2 жыл бұрын
Hervorragende deutsche Ingenieurskunst
@ritchiewhaitmore455
@ritchiewhaitmore455 3 жыл бұрын
Greets from Scandinavia! Nice!
@SeraphimSiN
@SeraphimSiN 3 жыл бұрын
I appreciate your videos very much. Thank you.
@cernsttx
@cernsttx 3 жыл бұрын
Loving the content! Keep em' coming. Consider investing in a more quality microphone as well. Will make it easier to listen. Thanks
@Karl-Benny
@Karl-Benny 3 жыл бұрын
was thinking the same
@964cuplove
@964cuplove 3 жыл бұрын
The chapter list you incorporate is really a great feature !!!
@rooseveltbrentwood9654
@rooseveltbrentwood9654 3 жыл бұрын
Hi, I wondered over here from Sub Brief. Keep it up, I’m enjoying your content.
@davidmurphy8190
@davidmurphy8190 3 жыл бұрын
Ditto here! Sub Brief and other sources.
@raybans4980
@raybans4980 3 жыл бұрын
Really well done.
@thlimtherm6702
@thlimtherm6702 3 жыл бұрын
Love this stuff man keep it up!
@skydive1424
@skydive1424 2 жыл бұрын
Just subscribed; the amount of technical information in your video’s is both impressive and captivating
@saksham_agarwal
@saksham_agarwal 3 жыл бұрын
So, basically, use your batteries as less as possible to conserve battery power, so that if high speed maneuvers, chasing warships is reqd, batteries are there. Meanwhile you lurk around the region with AIP because AIP provides just enough power to loiter around. As soon as you require power, switch to batteries.
@welshpete12
@welshpete12 3 жыл бұрын
Very informative and interesting , thank you for posting !
@canusakommando9692
@canusakommando9692 3 жыл бұрын
A low powered glider mode has always interested me. By moving a cylinder in the bow forward and back requires little power. By taking in water then push it out allows the sub to accend and dive . The sub would be silent as it rises and dives . By doing this the sub would move forward through the water. Rise over run . I made a glider sub model in school that would stop and charge it's batteries by solar energy. It may not be practical in a military environment but one could travel the world in a diy personal sub. I have always wondered why no one has ever done this? Just a thought.
@311jbknight
@311jbknight 3 жыл бұрын
With all the heat generated around the boats from electronics and atmosphere controls (CO-H2 burners, CO2 scrubbers O2 generators, heaters for ventilation) it would seem putting small sterling engines around the boat would be effecient. The O2 generators currently discharge hydrogen overboard but could be stored in external tanks to use. Lots of possibilities for different AIP on subs. Good video, thanks for making.
@raditya5663
@raditya5663 3 жыл бұрын
More videos please.... likely this chabbel is old but not frequent upload
@MattttG3
@MattttG3 Жыл бұрын
Do you have an awesome amount of knowledge on the subject concerning submarines and all that you do on here. Really is awesome to learn about , I generally am not as informed of the navy aspects . Thank you for all bro , I am on i think the 4th or 5th of yours in a row now ! cheers from USA Edit; if you don’t mind answering, may I ask how old you are currently? I just ask only because I am 30 and I feel like you sound between my age and slightly younger perhaps ? Lol I just like to know if others my age are doing this and learning about what they didn’t know prior to clicking your thumbnail 😎
@philsalvatore3902
@philsalvatore3902 Жыл бұрын
The apex predator is a nuclear attack sub. They have unlimited mobility, vastly higher underwater speeds and more power for much more powerful sensors. An AIP sub is more of an ambush predator. It is great for barrier ops where it can hang out silently on AIP for an extended period of time waiting for the prey to come to them but they lack the speed and range to chase fast surface forces in blue water.
@vladshlepchencko9988
@vladshlepchencko9988 3 жыл бұрын
Good review, thanks!
@geoffreywallington2930
@geoffreywallington2930 Жыл бұрын
Canada's recent Canadian Patrol Submarine Project (CPSP) is expected to have an AIP requirement with fisrt 'off-the-shelf" or MOTS submarine to be delivered around 2035.
@herohero-fw1vc
@herohero-fw1vc 3 жыл бұрын
Thank you very much for making this video. I value your videos & website very much.
@JeKramxel
@JeKramxel 3 жыл бұрын
Very interesting and informative, as expected. Actually learned lots of new things, appreciate it!
@justjohn9067
@justjohn9067 3 жыл бұрын
Great video. Appreciated.
@hsolorza
@hsolorza Жыл бұрын
Excellent analysis.
@brodieboy3
@brodieboy3 3 жыл бұрын
can you discuss the differences between Stirling engines and fuel cells as far as power, cost, efficiency, et.. How much power is generated by each. Have there been advances in the AIP systems such that they are becoming smaller & more efficient and more powerful to the extent where they can recharge the batteries. Lithium ion batteries can be recharged more quickly. Does that mean they could possibly be recharged by the AIP system? How long can Japan's lithium ion batteries go without being recharged?
@unglaubichuberlieber8048
@unglaubichuberlieber8048 3 жыл бұрын
this is what i have read...without any periodic charging...6 months the battery is ...like charles dicken describe it: DEAD AS A DOOR NAIL
@RealOlawo
@RealOlawo 3 жыл бұрын
Stirling has an disadvantage as it is using combustion and thous producing CO2. The Fuel Cell has less signatures, as it is only producing water and heat up to 80 degree Celsius. Dimentiions of the fuel cell system is also more flexible. A fuelcell has either 34 kW or 12o kW each, and they are smaller than the stirling engine. Advantage of the stirling, they use methanol and oxigen. The fuellcell needs difficult to store H2 and Oxigen. Eficency is quite equal as both have about 60%.
@wolf310ii
@wolf310ii 3 жыл бұрын
@@RealOlawo A Stirling engine is not a combustion motor, it only needs heat to run, were the heat comes from or how its created doesnt matter. The Stirling produces only CO2 if you choose a heat source that creates CO2, so instead burning of diesel or methanol and oxygen you can also burn hydrogen and oxygen or use the 80°C from a fuel cell.
@RealOlawo
@RealOlawo 3 жыл бұрын
@@wolf310ii That is theory, in reality the Gothenborg Class is heating the Sterling with Diese. Waste heat from fuel Cell would be nice but temperature level is to low for good efficency.
@wolf310ii
@wolf310ii 3 жыл бұрын
@@RealOlawo The Göteborg class has 3x diesel motors and is a korvette. The Gotland class uses diesel for the Stirling because it has also diesel motors. As for the temperatur level, thats only a matter of size of the cylinders, stirling motors can run on way lower temperatur levels than 80°C.
@sergarlantyrell7847
@sergarlantyrell7847 3 жыл бұрын
Is stealth, not just speed a reason to use the AIP plant to recharge the batteries. eg if the sub was intelligence gathering while sitting on the bottom, wouldn't it be preferable to recharge (even slowly) off the AIP, rather than having to go to snorkelling depth to run the diesels.
@HISuttonCovertShores
@HISuttonCovertShores 3 жыл бұрын
If you are going to run the AIP, it is more efficient to use it to directly power whatever you need power for
@sergarlantyrell7847
@sergarlantyrell7847 3 жыл бұрын
@@HISuttonCovertShores But they're also never going to be as quiet as running on batteries alone. While charging inefficiencies used to be a big deal when using lead acid, lithium ion only tends to lose, what, a couple percent to heat while charging if done properly (at least it does with small batteries & I'm assuming it scales) and same again when discharging. Compared to the generation losses... 60% within a sterling engine, then another 25% for generator losses to get electricity (if not for propulsion then for the hotel load)... about 4% of what's left isn't that much. Not sure how fuel cells compare efficiency wise, but you wouldn't be able to directly drive the prime mover, so you'd have to have a motor with losses etc too.
@blurry_craft
@blurry_craft 3 жыл бұрын
okay which one is more worth the overall value is it aip or lithium ion?...... usinx both would be excellent
@NotThatBob
@NotThatBob 3 жыл бұрын
WOW really interesting. Thank you so much.
@foximacentauri7891
@foximacentauri7891 Жыл бұрын
Good video, but what’s missing is the technical aspect. Where does the energy actually come from? Is this just a tank of fuel and oxidizer (i.e. rocket fuel) that you fill before going to sea? Or can it be refilled by the diesel engines? What is the fuel? Hydrogen?
@NorthForkFisherman
@NorthForkFisherman Жыл бұрын
Depends on the tech. Some use hydrogen fuel cells. Some use the Stirling cycle. I know the Type 215 the Koreans use carries LOX and LH in tanks. It gets expended and gets turned into water. They can then use the diesel if they're in safe waters to reverse that process and turn that water back into stored reactants.
@bellator11
@bellator11 3 жыл бұрын
The Type 212A repeated the feat during RIMPAC in 2013, incl. sneaking past Virginia class subs, completing the attack, and sneaking back out unnoticed.
@philsalvatore3902
@philsalvatore3902 Жыл бұрын
And how do you know this? Exercise outcomes are always highly classified. You have to have the required clearance and a need to know to be allowed access to exercise outcomes. So either you are repeating a sea story ( a lot like a fish story ) or you are violating the terms of your clearance and repeating classified information on an open source. What is it?
@askallois
@askallois Жыл бұрын
@philsalvatore3902 It was 23 July 2008 during Operation CONUS the Italian U 212 A submarine "Sciriè" crossed the entire US fleet and from the periscope took a picture of the aircraft carrier Roosevelt from a distance of 8000 yds.
@mhamma6560
@mhamma6560 3 жыл бұрын
"air" trips some people up -- atmospheric independent power is a better fit.
@bryanoflynn5938
@bryanoflynn5938 3 жыл бұрын
Great videos, thank you.
@thomaszhang3101
@thomaszhang3101 3 жыл бұрын
I have a question regarding stirling AIP submarines: if they are powered by oxygen and diesel fuel, won’t it still generate co2 waste, which will be expelled from the submarine and expose its location? Why can stirling subs be powered by oxygen and hydrogen, which forms water after reacting?
@humphreybumblecuck5151
@humphreybumblecuck5151 3 жыл бұрын
CO2 is a constant issue on subs because of exhalation. They use chemical sinks to absorb the CO2 from the air. Also surfacing to ventilate is pretty much expressly for the purpose of purging CO2
@humphreybumblecuck5151
@humphreybumblecuck5151 3 жыл бұрын
In US subs one method is these curtains. The wheel out some curtains and they react with the CO2 and get heavier over time.
@AdmiralLj
@AdmiralLj 3 жыл бұрын
Energy densety, Hydrigen take up more space then deisel.
@Wallyworld30
@Wallyworld30 3 жыл бұрын
I didn't know we countries were using Stirling Engines for AIP Subs. Stirling Engines have always fascinated me. I had no idea they produced enough work to be useful to run electrics in a Submarine.
@julian-sark
@julian-sark Жыл бұрын
I once knew a guy who "pixeled" together images by zooming in all the way on a white canvas in mspaint, then placing all individual pixels for a photo-realistic result (for 1998 ...). Your mspaint skills, Sir, are at least on par :D
@TheESS1
@TheESS1 2 жыл бұрын
Love the video format by the way!👌
@robertscheinost179
@robertscheinost179 3 жыл бұрын
Excellent video on "Sea Monsters" . From a former member of Subron 12 and Subgru 2. Loved it! No way would I want to be on an AIP when the LOX and Hydrogen mix together in an accident. That would make one hell of a hole in the ocean!
@SonsOfLorgar
@SonsOfLorgar 3 жыл бұрын
Since the combustion product of H²+O² is water, it wouldn't be as much of a hole as a hump, all be it a very temporary one ;)
@robertscheinost179
@robertscheinost179 3 жыл бұрын
@@SonsOfLorgar Correct. No way would I want to be aboard. BBOOOOMMMMM!!!
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